I would worry about the app being discontinued or just plain breaking inside of 5 or 10 years. This device is far too expensive to rely entirely on a mobile app.
When things like this get to enough popularity and distribution the guys over at XDA typically reverse engineer them to provide an alternative. This might not gain enough following for that though, but one can always buy a unit and agree to send it to a guru over there, they're always looking for something to hack.
I suppose there is no reason why it would stop working entirely. The online aspect might not be available forever but I'm pretty sure the calculations when playing against a bot are performed on the phone itself. Edit: And since it's connecting via Wifi, someone might reverse engineer the protocol and provide an alternative app when the official one stops working (assuming this thing becomes popular enough for some kind of community to form around it).
Yeah, it's a very irritating trend in consumer electronics to be tied to an app which will break when there's a binary compatibility breaking change to Android. Which happens pretty regularly.
As someone who played some chess when I was younger, I would love a physical board that could just automatically play AI vs AI games all day without interruption that could just be left on a coffee table or such. I would enjoy being able to watch two computer players compete and learn techniques by osmosis whenever the board distracts me with its gameplay.
@@daviddavidson2357That's not necessarily the point is it, a lot of people just want a finished product that they can purchase and that does exactly what it is they want it to do. I mean I can cobble a bunch of motorcycle parts together and make something that's kind of like a Harley, but at the end of the day it's not going to be a Harley, you see what I mean
I think they missed a trick with the taken pieces. Assuming it's an electro-magnet that moves the pieces, then for taken pieces they should reverse the polarity, send about 100amps through the magnet for a few milliseconds and that would shoot the taken pieces off the board completely. Effective and fun.
Agreed Matt, the device relying on an app makes it much more difficult to trust. It feels like a short term novelty rather than a long term investment.
The first Kickstarter was popular enough that Square Off had enough money to make a revised model should be enough of a hint that something like this is a long term investment.
As cool as the tech is, it kind of defeats the object of a calm game of chess away from your bloody phone when you need the phone screen right there in front of you. But i guess that's the horrible future we live in where you need a phone to do basic day to day tasks like paying, using a train ticket, amusement park ticket etc Made me remember battle chess on the pc haha
But you don't need your phone during the game. What are you talking about? Just start the game and put your phone away. (edit: forgot that you also need the phone for promotion)
I can relate. I've posed myself the task recently of creating AI programs to play board games with me. Like Settlers of Catan. I know they have computer versions with AI, but my programming skills are weak and I figure this would be a great way to improve them.
I'm sure if it cost twice as much you would enjoy whining that much more. Because if it didn't require an app it would cost twice as much. Because then it would need to be built with a computer/screen, like the Chessnut Evo, which, surprise, costs about twice as much.
I know $300 for this thing is probably the cheapest they could've made it, cutting tons of corners, but I feel like a ghost chess machine is by necessity a luxury item. So it's insane to me that it comes with a sharp piezo speaker that beeps like an old microwave. I have a toaster oven that sounds more pleasant than this thing.
True, it sounds like my rice cooker. And how generous that the app allows customising the sound, I expected he could change the sound itself there but no, it’s just when it’s heard or when it’s disabled entirely.
One advantage of having a companion app is that they could actually implement your idea about the different kind of sounds instead of just beeps. They can (and should) update the app with an option to play sound effects from the app instead of the onboard beeper. Not just for clarity with different sound effects or TTS, but also because the board doesn't have earphone support.
a companion app makes a ton of sense for this, since it needs to connect to the various internet chess servers anyway. It'd be nice if it had a basic AI built into the board, but thats not a huge problem.
I worry about it being discontinued turning your expensive thing into a regular chess board. Would be great if you can host a match locally in the phone without internet conection.
It could be totally optional. You could have basic functionality without the app, and the rest of the options (playing with other people, etc.) if you use the app.
for those curious about the robot arm and happen to be reading the comments: it's like a corexy 3d printer mechanism, belt driven with motors in the corners. making your own with a glass bed & grbl is a neat idea, practically doable!
@@keith_5584 I want to play Global Thermonuclear Warfare. Heheh. I rewatched that film only yesterday Also. Keeping humans alive for morbid fun, that gets us into the territory of I have No Mouth And I Must Scream.
Imagine going to the park with this thing and when people who are not really into tech stuff notice pieces move by themselves telling them "Oh, I am just playing chess with my father's ghost."
As a bit of feedback, for app connected device reviews, it would be worth documenting if the product works with internet disabled on your device and to what extent. You can backup an app, but if a company fails and the server goes down it can be game over.
This thing reminds me of those "This is what the future will be like" books from the '70s and '80s except it isn't a massive robot arm (connected to a phone line for "international play" obviously) moving the pieces around
The 70s era book `Usbourne book of the future` had a remarkably similar device that used radio waves to play against remote players. That book was actually pretty spot on with a lot of its predictions including mmo`s, mobile phones and giant flatscreen tellys. There was a section in it that predicted the 2 ways the future could turn out depending on how we treated the environment, one was a clean utopia and the other a polluted dystopia. Guess which one was more accurate?.........
@@meetoo594 I think I remember owning that book as a kid (in the 90s). I remember the picture predicting electric cars, showing them lined up to get a whole new battery on a conveyor belt.
I agree with you, everything that relies on an app is relying on something variable. In my opinion these kind of devices should have a mandatory open source driver ready, not necessarily at launch but at least to be published if ever the company stops supporting the device, so at least it could be used with other programs, a pc or whatever and the customer doesn't just end up with a glorified piece of plastic.
While I agree, unfortunately the reality is that you cannot demand someone releases their intellectual property. In order for that to change and be passed into law, it would also be required to make it illegal to make throw-away products, and until mankind grows up, that is never going to happen
@@thesteelrodent1796 Recently, I read a commentary about software in the era before it was routinely sold as a commercial product separate from hardware, and it was apparently normal for people acquiring software to insist that the vendor put the source code in escrow in case the vendor disappeared or was not willing to maintain the software. So, longstanding mechanisms already exist to protect the interests of both the customer and the vendor. As for the sacred "intellectual property" of the vendor, the customer is paying for its development, and these days much of the software content will have been distributed under Free Software licences, allowing the vendor to take it into use. So, one would hope that the vendor respects any obligations associated with those licences, too.
Letting you customize the sounds would be awesome! Replace the "put down" with an actual wood-on-wood tap sound, a robotic f-bomb from your AI opponent on a win, a chiding "no" on an error... It could have been awesome. My guess is they used a fixed-frequency piezo beeper so they didn't have to fiddle about with sound processing at all, but they could have easily made the app capable of being the sound emitter.
Needing the app is a deal breaker for me. It's less the fear of the app going obsolete and more the annoyance of needing to get my phone to play chess. If I'm sitting down to a physical board to play chess, it's to get away from my phone/computer, not bring it along for a playdate.
You just need the phone to start the game. Seriously, how is that a problem for you? Are you one of those people who can't not look at their phone if it's in the same room as them?
@@Jehty_ Quite the opposite. I don't carry my phone with me every second of every day. I never carry it around my house. I get home, I put it on the table with my keys and don't pick it back up until I go somewhere.
@@Jehty_ no, the robot uses the phone (or rather the app on the phone) to calculate its moves. Without it, this is just an ordinary chess board. It can't do anything on its own
@@thesteelrodent1796 sorry if I wasn't clear enough. Of course the board needs your phone. But *you* don't need to look at your phone. You can just put your phone next to the board and don't look at it.
It's pretty cool, I'd probably prefer a wood version over a plastic version, but as you mentioned relying on a phone app is a deal breaker. They should try make a deal with the big online chess sites to be able to use this board as an interface.
The wood wouldn't work with the lights and would have to be pretty thin for the magnets to do their job. I've seen glass chess boards though and I could imagine that working.
@@Houshalter That's not true at all, I just tried a couple of tiny neodymium disc magnets (10mm diameter, 2mm thickness) on each side of a 15 mm thick board and no problem moving the magnet on top by moving the magnet on the bottom, they were strong enough that the bottom one is held in place and wouldn't fall off. You could even add an LED in the chess pieces themselves and use inductors to transfer a current to light them up, kind of like how you wirelessly charge your toothbrush, phone, watch etc. Cheers, Jake
Back in the 1990s there was a chess system called the Tasc Smartboard. Although it did not move the pieces, it was a standalone system, or it could be hooked up to a PC to operate with other chess programs. It was stunningly beautiful, with the board and chess pieces made out of wood. The board had LED lights embedded in it, at each grid corner, to indicate the moves. The chess pieces had capacitive coils in them (pre-RFID), so that the board could identify what each piece was. It was a cool system, and a lot of fun. I still have my Tasc Smartboard, although it has not seen the light of day for many years. I really should take it out of storage, and see if it still works. Thanks for sharing this video!
That's more what I'd be interested in. Pitiful that it can't tell which piece of which, and requires an app and internet connection. This thing is a glorified smartphone accessory, unfortunately.
@@technoman9000 Unfortunately, I do not have a good dedicated space where I can set up, and leave out, my Tasc chessboard. So it stays in storage most of the time, rather than collecting dust in some corner of my room. Incidentally, the Dutch company that made the Tasc Smartboard was, more-or-less, sued out of business because of patent infringement involving their chess piece identification system. This perhaps explains why their products are only rarely seen nowadays.
think it was Atari (could be wrong on the make) that made a magnetic chess board - in the 80s or 90s - that had LEDs to tell you what to move where. It did everything internally and had different skill levels, but it was not a challenge for anyone who actually knew how to play chess, so it was more like a gimmick for kids than a proper chess game
@@thesteelrodent1796 The first computerized chessboards were pretty basic. I had a Fidelity Chess Challenger portable game, back in the 80s - and I could beat it as long as I was paying close attention. But I don't think I ever beat the Tasc Smartboard. Maybe once or twice. But I'm not a rated player, and the Tasc Smartboard is tough. The thing I discovered about computer chess programs is that they cannot be freaked-out by a provocative move. Whereas a human opponent might make a mistake after I make a dramatic and unexpected move, that simply does not happen with a chess program. So the elements of surprise and psychology are not present when playing a machine. Turns out that playing against a human is just more fun because of the unexpected things that can happen.
Great to see a followup to the original chess with a ghost - probably my favourite techmoan video. It is a shame the smaller set can't stream games, even though I'm not particularly interested in watching other people play chess, I feel like it would be a great way to use the set as background decoration when you're not actively using it.
Thank you for this great video. And, also thank you for all the video's this year so far. They are much appreciated by myself (and many others). Take care.👍
@@goeland4585 retro means it's a style imitating something old or vintage. for example: That '70s Show is retro. so in case of electronics retro would be all these cheap record players you can buy today.
I bought a Swap (or whichever the one you don't have) specifically because of that video you made on the original board. Once I saw they were making cheaper, smaller boards that could also play other games I was sold! It took a few years to get here but mine finally arrived in March. I unfortunately haven't had the chance to use it too much but so far I've enjoyed it!
I remember _Chessmaster 2000_ for MS-DOS. You could play with beeps, silent, or music (PC speaker) which plays a short melody for every particular action. I quite liked that latter option. The people who made your Square-Off should have added that as an option.
From what've seen in the video, the company doesn't seem as interested in making a product as in making money. The board is just a plastic box with a primary movement mechanism and circuitry to recognize piece positions, nothing too expensive I imagine. At that price, they could've at least used some nicer pieces and a wood veneer for the board itself instead of paper, or just gone with injection-moulded plastic (one easy and cheap way to make the wooden part would be to take a light wood veneer, laser-etch the black onto it and then cover it with clear varnish for protection). Many visible corners were cut. The paid subscription also doesn't make them look any better. It would be a fun project to make one of these yourself.
A great way to describe the times we live in: 'I'm happy with it (what I bought), but I'm now wondering if wouldn't been happier with something else'. ♥
I gave up playing chess in my teens when I realised that my playing level would never be higher than incompetent but my dislike of losing was at a very high level.
I feel that. Once my uncle who introduced me to the game pwned me with a 'fool's mate' that was about it for my interest in Chess. I hate losing far too much. I was better off PKing people in EverQuest's PVP servers. 🙂
Sounds like my life in a nutshell... If I have expectations I'll be disappointed so I should not have expectations, but then I just don't want to play it altogether. Doesn't apply to only chess either...
another addition that might be nice: add a set of Magnet so you have your own figures. Shure, you could source your own magnets but it's nicer and enocouraging if there are some in the Box
I got suckered into the kickstarter from your previous video, but ordered the Swap because my hope is that I can have it stream games endlessly completely unattended as a decorative ornament! Ideally someone reverse engineers the bluetooth protocol and makes a third party chess server to run on a raspberry pi or something so it doesn't have to be tethered to a phone.
@@plapbandit overcharging the battery? That's not a thing. Smartphones have protection against that. (Of course it's still not healthy for the battery, but that doesn't matter with an old phone.)
Great video Matt......4 years, where did the time go!!.. Other is still going strong and comes out often. Friends are always stunned playing a game, esp the ending when all the pieces return to their respective starts. But like you state, the old version does require a large room to leave set up. And yes, the phone stand is useless with new style phones esp with cases. Square off regularly send updates through. Highly recommended to any budding chess player.
Back in the late-1970s I had the Chess Challenger by Fidelity Electronics. It was extremely slow making moves in the intermediate and advanced levels, and it tended to move "ghost" pieces; I was always very careful not to move a pieces in the wrong square.
They've certainly come a long way since my first and only computerized chess board in the late 80s! Can't remember much about it, other than picking it up from Service Merchandise as a kid, and you had to firmly press down on each piece and again on the square you moved it to.
In a perfect world, the EU or someone else with a big stick would mandate that all products which rely on an app must open source said product's app either as soon as the product goes out of production or 3 years since its introduction to the market, whichever occurs first. Even though it'd be better to not rely on an app at all, at least it can be kept alive by one or more keen volunteers after the original developers wash their hands of it and move onto other things.
Agreed, but it does conflict with the intellectual properly laws, so you need change a few paragraphs to make that fly. They did however go after Apple for artificually bricking phones through software updates when they tried to force people to buy new models, so there is some precedence
Those laws need to be changed anyway. We just need the critical mass of public support, sustained for long enough for politicians to stop seeing those paragraphs as sacrosanct and beyond criticism. @@thesteelrodent1796
After reading a bunch about these boards and *almost* ordering the "NEO Z" I decided to back the chessnut evo. It's not as "cool" because the pieces don't move by themselves but it seems to me that chessnut has a better reputation than square off (when it comes to delivering) + the eco doesn't require a separate app. I really wanted to like the square off boards & I'll be keeping an eye on their self-moving stuff in the future.
"...the internals were, really quite obvious- and very easy to predict" me, for the 3rd time this video: "theres a little man inside which moves the pieces OBVIOUSLY."
I had a similar chess board in 2004, each space had a button you would press when moving pieces, the pieces all had magnets in them, and the chess board would move its own pieces. It was completely offline. I never did win against that board.
I genuinely look forward to each new video you put out. The effort and quality to explaining each item makes it more enjoyable than any tv show! Keep up the amazing content
The beeps are pretty cheap and obnoxious sounding, they should put a better speaker in it and have pleasent and more meaningful sounds, that would improve the feeling of quality 100% for a relatively small upgrade.
I agree with you. Relying on an app is a downside. One of the pleasures of chess is to escape and forcing you to use your phone alongside it, feels a bit clunky. The tech is there to make a completely automated, stand alone automatic chess board.
Surely a built-in microcontroller in the chess board could run the game by itself, no phone app needed. Nowadays there are plenty of these uC at low price with power and memory to spare, and could even connect to wifi, bluetooth or what have you
"nowadays" I've got a chesscomputer-board as a gift in the early 2000. So even back then that functionality was cheap. (to be fair I guess that computer probably wasn't the best chess player)
Im so pleased you're enjoying it, i really, really do prefer the original model so much more, especially visually. Its.such a shame, they seem to have gone backwards.
Did you look at the swap? That's the sequel to the old version he showed. This one is an upgrade of their cheaper chess computers and isn't even in the same line as the old one. Except for company name they're unrelated.
@@medes5597 I am aware I still prefer the other aesthetics and I'm not the only one. Your talking to someone who owns the original. It was just an opinion, hey I'm pleased he loves his new one and is enjoying using it.. Plus it great to get as many folk hooked on chess..!!
I agree about the dependency on an app. I think it would have made more sense to have a built in web server for it that has a webpage with all of the options present in the app. Maybe that would have cost too much to implement with a competitive computer, but I doubt it.
The pieces being accidentally knocked over looked hilariously aggressive. They should make it a feature for when the computer captures a piece. Like wizard chess.
Don't ever feel guilty about promoting or advertising anything on here Matt, you've got a living to make and we appreciate and support what you do here.
definitely something I would have wanted but the moment I see "app" is the moment I cease wanting it. too many horror stories of devices being bricked because a company either decides that they want to sell the next product or they just go under completely
2:30 - It's really interesting, but the fact it requires a mobile app is an immediate deal-breaker. Too many opportunities for planned obsolescence; no guarantee I could still use the game as intended 5 years out.
Really like this. Love your comment about chess having a physical board. Recently bought electronic set I had as a kid, I really trained up on that. Hope you learn and love it. 👍
It is very easy to get the original apart without damaging it. I had to repair mine. There are some screws hidden under the green felt on the base. You can feel them if you run your finger around close to the edge. Push a screw driver through the felt at each screw and remove it. It only needs a very small hole. There are screws further from the edge but do not remove those or the innards will fall apart. When all screws round the edge have been removed the top and bottom can be separated. Assembly is a reversal and the felt will close over the screw holes with hardly any visible sign left. No need to destroy it.
Would be cool, if it would work without a smartphone app and connection to the internet, so it would still work in 5 years. You could just put it in your house as decoration and as soon as a visitor would move one of the pieces the pieces of the opposite color would start moving on their own.
If something's got to be dependent on an app, then at least what's necessary for basic offline functioning should be open-sourced (or at least something to give the enthusiasts as bone) so people can keep it running if they wish. There's nothing quite as infuriating as working hardware bricked by external internet/software negligence.
As always thanks for another excellent video. FWLIW: I share you thoughts, suggestions, and concerns - above all that this device relies on an app. The added logic to drive a chess machine would cost a couple of quid on a mass-produced machine, could be flash-upgradeable, and then the app would be a bonus rather than a concern. Maybe if the pieces had NFC tags in them along with a reader in the 'movement head' that would allow greater flexibility and error correcting.
Assume it's that the RFID reader would have to scan every piece at the beginning, and it couldn't go on the same arm as the magnet. So probably would add a lot of complexity they didn't think was worth the R&D
@@rumsfeld99 I don't believe it's RFID in the more expensive version. You put the pieces in the allocated spots along side the board and it then moves them into position using that
It is like everything these days --- get an app, but if our company fails our servers die, you are left with and expensive paperweight --- oh and you need a smart phone and connect to the internet so there are $$$$ on top of the product costs --- GREAT AN EXPENSIVE PRINTER!
The quality of these videos is amazing. Being an obsessed anglophile since 1984 when I found the Beatles. Then Monty Python. And years later finding Techmoan keeping up with the standards of the aforementioned. The pace and the clarity of information is immensively and immersively soothing to my sore ears and eyes. Thank you.
I really hope they'll make a standalone version of it, without an app. Even if it would be even bulkier than the original board, that'd be a huge improvement - not a fan of apps.
@@DeAthWaGer I was thinking more of an imbedded "phone" with similar app that would receive updates and you'd select challenges and such. So once board would go offline you'd still have what you downloaded before. Putting AI presets into the board itself by default is already enough for many people, but while servers are still up you could play with others.
@@DeAthWaGer Any device that relies on an app to even function is extremely vulnerable, which means you’re essentially gambling (hahaha…) on the developer to not only stay in business, but to keep throwing money at updates for new OS versions etc. for as long as you want to keep using the product. The moment the updates stop, the device becomes a completely nonfunctional waste of space and money, which is something any purchaser needs to consider. Even supposing it would only have “3 AI presets” (and I don’t see why the choice would necessarily be so limited), the device would at least still work if the app updates stopped.
For the vast majority of people, chest software that was more than good enough to at least be a real challenge came out in the 1970's. And required a few kilobytes of memory.
Yeah I don't buy the "Powered by AI" bollocks. It's chess, my 486 was able to play a respectable game back in the day. It should be able to play a basic game, self-contained, with no Internet or bluetooth connection.
but it requires a proper processor (not super fast or modern, just an actual processor) to calculate the moves, which means they have to add more electronics to the thing, beyond the obviously very basic motor controller. I'm just guessing the people who made this board decided it was too much effort, or they just don't know how, to add a chess computer into the board. Not trying to defend their decision, because I really don't care for products that rely on apps, but when they have to do everything else on the app anyway, you can see why they didn't see a need to make the board work without. It is very cheap to develop an app, and you can find the chess algorithms online, you don't even have to come up with them yourself.
The Tech Collection has a video on the insides of the Square Neo chess board. Very simple X Y plotter mechanisms as you say Matt with an electric magnet. A long cylindrical Li-Ion battery pack and a very small PCB.
I definitely want to see the other board. I feel the same. I played as kid and always imagined a board where the pieces would magically move. As always grate video
Question: Is the 'thinking' done in the app, or by the mothership server via the Internet? Observation: I'm in Canada, and the Neo doesn't show up as an option at the bottom of the web page. If I identify as being in the UK, it does.
This is actually a really cool product. I’m not necessarily a chess player myself either but the way this works is pretty cool. I love that you can play bots or a friend online. I totally agree that playing a digital game just isn’t the same. The bot is great for someone who just wants to practice and being able to play with a physical board and see your friends moves physically happen on your board is much more satisfying. Would be a much more engaging experience than just playing on a computer screen.
Hi, Techmoan..., Remember..., the White Queen goes on its color, the White Queen goes on the white or light color square and or White Queen wears white shoes. * As for the Black Queen.., the Black Queen goes on the black or dark square and the Black Queen wears black shoes... * Excellent video and very informative, and thank you for sharing the video... "Semper Fi" Mike in historic Uptown Butte, Montana, USA... P.S.: Excellent choice of using your cellphone holder... :)
Something mechanical like that being put together in a way that makes it impossible to open it without destroying it should be a crime. Only a matter of time before it needs maintenance or repair.
Well with the app being needed, which looks like it also needs internet access, it’s likely to be unsupported in a few years and thus the mechanical side of it will be useless anyway
The circle on the base makes me think the moving parts are polar-coordinate based, likely with some kind of extension to get into the corners rather than the X-Y style of the older board.
So we have a none chess player who normally opens up all kinds of devices, now playing chess, not opening up the device. Still nice to watch this review.
He states exactly what is in it and tells you there is another video with a teardown. He doesn't want to destroy his own personal unit so respect that's his choice. If you feel like shelling out $300 to just tear apart a product for a video, voiding the warrant and rendering it useless, go right ahead.
No I won’t make that video , since there is already a video like that as you mentioned. I just found the points I mentioned funny and I do respect his choices, never said I don’t.
6:20 those stands are supposed to hold the phone in horizontal position. If the app is in portrait, then that doesn't make sense; but that stand is a standard little chinese thing, not made specially for this device, so it might be an oversight.
Matt, if they knew who you are maybe they would be so happy that you were reviewing it that they would send you the other one for free pending a review or at a significant discount. I know you don’t do things for that reason, but I thought just the same that I would mention it. You have one of the best channels on TH-cam. Thank you.
At 14:54 I was surprised the computer didn't use the king to take your 'promoted' queen. Don't think it would be moving into check to do that. Or maybe there are rules to chess I don't remember, since it has also been _years_ since I have played it.
I would worry about the app being discontinued or just plain breaking inside of 5 or 10 years. This device is far too expensive to rely entirely on a mobile app.
Even if the apocalypse starts, you can still play MANUALLY. YMMV
When things like this get to enough popularity and distribution the guys over at XDA typically reverse engineer them to provide an alternative. This might not gain enough following for that though, but one can always buy a unit and agree to send it to a guru over there, they're always looking for something to hack.
I suppose there is no reason why it would stop working entirely. The online aspect might not be available forever but I'm pretty sure the calculations when playing against a bot are performed on the phone itself.
Edit: And since it's connecting via Wifi, someone might reverse engineer the protocol and provide an alternative app when the official one stops working (assuming this thing becomes popular enough for some kind of community to form around it).
As long as the app doesn't require Internet that's not really an issue. Personally, I'd just dedicate an old phone to this device
Yeah, it's a very irritating trend in consumer electronics to be tied to an app which will break when there's a binary compatibility breaking change to Android. Which happens pretty regularly.
Only Techmoan could point out that he might get some money from sales of this product, and then promptly publicize a competitor! Good on you, mate!
This is why he has such a massive following, he's a genuine North West lad
As someone who played some chess when I was younger, I would love a physical board that could just automatically play AI vs AI games all day without interruption that could just be left on a coffee table or such. I would enjoy being able to watch two computer players compete and learn techniques by osmosis whenever the board distracts me with its gameplay.
Now this is the killer update they need.
@@daviddavidson2357That's not necessarily the point is it, a lot of people just want a finished product that they can purchase and that does exactly what it is they want it to do. I mean I can cobble a bunch of motorcycle parts together and make something that's kind of like a Harley, but at the end of the day it's not going to be a Harley, you see what I mean
I think they missed a trick with the taken pieces. Assuming it's an electro-magnet that moves the pieces, then for taken pieces they should reverse the polarity, send about 100amps through the magnet for a few milliseconds and that would shoot the taken pieces off the board completely. Effective and fun.
Dude , yes. That would be hilarious
Except you would be made to wear safety glasses because of litigation.
I don't think it's an electromagnet, just a standard magnet moved up and down.
@@Mattsavage69 Engaging Safety Squints™
Do it to all the game pieces at once so the AI can do the equivalent of flipping the board in frustration.
Agreed Matt, the device relying on an app makes it much more difficult to trust.
It feels like a short term novelty rather than a long term investment.
The first Kickstarter was popular enough that Square Off had enough money to make a revised model should be enough of a hint that something like this is a long term investment.
As cool as the tech is, it kind of defeats the object of a calm game of chess away from your bloody phone when you need the phone screen right there in front of you. But i guess that's the horrible future we live in where you need a phone to do basic day to day tasks like paying, using a train ticket, amusement park ticket etc Made me remember battle chess on the pc haha
But you don't need your phone during the game. What are you talking about?
Just start the game and put your phone away.
(edit: forgot that you also need the phone for promotion)
"I could challenge friends...if I had any friends." Love that line.
Bit sad though, hope it's not actually true.
know your audience, eh?
I can relate. I've posed myself the task recently of creating AI programs to play board games with me. Like Settlers of Catan. I know they have computer versions with AI, but my programming skills are weak and I figure this would be a great way to improve them.
Relatable...
**sad piano** 😢
Insane that such an expensive device requires the use of an app AND needs a monthly subscription to unlock all the features.
Just an instant NO THANKS on this device.
I'm sure if it cost twice as much you would enjoy whining that much more. Because if it didn't require an app it would cost
twice as much. Because then it would need to be built with a computer/screen, like the Chessnut Evo, which, surprise, costs about twice as much.
@@mark100net1a literal raspberry pi zero could run this device dude. That's a 5 dollar ACTUAL computer.
@@marcusborderlands6177 What does that have to do with it? Did you read the OP? With a raspberry pi an app would still be required.
I know $300 for this thing is probably the cheapest they could've made it, cutting tons of corners, but I feel like a ghost chess machine is by necessity a luxury item. So it's insane to me that it comes with a sharp piezo speaker that beeps like an old microwave. I have a toaster oven that sounds more pleasant than this thing.
True, it sounds like my rice cooker. And how generous that the app allows customising the sound, I expected he could change the sound itself there but no, it’s just when it’s heard or when it’s disabled entirely.
With plastic pieces and paper board too!!! I like the idea but this is completely a luxury item as you say, make it nice!
One advantage of having a companion app is that they could actually implement your idea about the different kind of sounds instead of just beeps. They can (and should) update the app with an option to play sound effects from the app instead of the onboard beeper. Not just for clarity with different sound effects or TTS, but also because the board doesn't have earphone support.
the microwave noises are honestly a turnoff
a companion app makes a ton of sense for this, since it needs to connect to the various internet chess servers anyway. It'd be nice if it had a basic AI built into the board, but thats not a huge problem.
I worry about it being discontinued turning your expensive thing into a regular chess board. Would be great if you can host a match locally in the phone without internet conection.
Those beeps are unbelievably awful in a product from the 2020s.
It could be totally optional. You could have basic functionality without the app, and the rest of the options (playing with other people, etc.) if you use the app.
"Want to play chess?"
"It's going to be a few minutes the board has an update"
What a time to be alive
Well, I wanted to light up the bedroom and nothing happend because the lightbulb did an online upgrade
for those curious about the robot arm and happen to be reading the comments: it's like a corexy 3d printer mechanism, belt driven with motors in the corners. making your own with a glass bed & grbl is a neat idea, practically doable!
And here I was expecting an etch-a-sketch style mechanism ;)
Is that definitely this one or the old one? I was thinking the circle on the base might indicate something polar-coordinate based.
@@0LoneTech It is, basically, Etch-a-Sketch, but with stepper motors.
Yeah I noticed that too and got me wondering about the mech.@@chaos.corner
@@0LoneTech im pretty sure the etch-a-sketch does use a corexy mechanism too
One minute you're playing chess against a robot, the next you're fighting Skynet
😃
Remember that according to the first Tron, MCP started out as a chess program. :)
@@keith_5584
I want to play Global Thermonuclear Warfare.
Heheh. I rewatched that film only yesterday
Also. Keeping humans alive for morbid fun, that gets us into the territory of I have No Mouth And I Must Scream.
And if you lose, it's the end of mankind
You're talking about the Turk.
Imagine going to the park with this thing and when people who are not really into tech stuff notice pieces move by themselves telling them "Oh, I am just playing chess with my father's ghost."
Even better, bring it into a retirement community and say you're playing with ex-occupants.
or at the funeral one last game before the burial.
Who you gonna call?
@loboptlu I know who you not gonna call: 1 800 ghostmolesters
@@loboptlu Ghostbusters 😁
As a bit of feedback, for app connected device reviews, it would be worth documenting if the product works with internet disabled on your device and to what extent. You can backup an app, but if a company fails and the server goes down it can be game over.
This thing reminds me of those "This is what the future will be like" books from the '70s and '80s except it isn't a massive robot arm (connected to a phone line for "international play" obviously) moving the pieces around
I think that would be so much cooler...
Right ! Had also a book in the 70"s called "Future" ...
Better watching "Demolition Man", it's more realistic ...
The 70s era book `Usbourne book of the future` had a remarkably similar device that used radio waves to play against remote players. That book was actually pretty spot on with a lot of its predictions including mmo`s, mobile phones and giant flatscreen tellys. There was a section in it that predicted the 2 ways the future could turn out depending on how we treated the environment, one was a clean utopia and the other a polluted dystopia. Guess which one was more accurate?.........
It's all good until the robot gets salty and tries to snap your arm. Or as has happened already, a 7 year old childs finger
@@meetoo594 I think I remember owning that book as a kid (in the 90s). I remember the picture predicting electric cars, showing them lined up to get a whole new battery on a conveyor belt.
I agree with you, everything that relies on an app is relying on something variable. In my opinion these kind of devices should have a mandatory open source driver ready, not necessarily at launch but at least to be published if ever the company stops supporting the device, so at least it could be used with other programs, a pc or whatever and the customer doesn't just end up with a glorified piece of plastic.
I’d replace the word ‘variable’ with ‘temporary’.
While I agree, unfortunately the reality is that you cannot demand someone releases their intellectual property. In order for that to change and be passed into law, it would also be required to make it illegal to make throw-away products, and until mankind grows up, that is never going to happen
@@thesteelrodent1796 Recently, I read a commentary about software in the era before it was routinely sold as a commercial product separate from hardware, and it was apparently normal for people acquiring software to insist that the vendor put the source code in escrow in case the vendor disappeared or was not willing to maintain the software. So, longstanding mechanisms already exist to protect the interests of both the customer and the vendor.
As for the sacred "intellectual property" of the vendor, the customer is paying for its development, and these days much of the software content will have been distributed under Free Software licences, allowing the vendor to take it into use. So, one would hope that the vendor respects any obligations associated with those licences, too.
It's something we've got to fight for until we get it, then. @@thesteelrodent1796
Laws only change to follow overwhelming public demand.
I made one with plexiglass sides on my prototyping course in university last year. A lovely project to work on and to see it working.
Letting you customize the sounds would be awesome! Replace the "put down" with an actual wood-on-wood tap sound, a robotic f-bomb from your AI opponent on a win, a chiding "no" on an error... It could have been awesome. My guess is they used a fixed-frequency piezo beeper so they didn't have to fiddle about with sound processing at all, but they could have easily made the app capable of being the sound emitter.
Congrats on winning your first game. Glad you enjoyed it.
Needing the app is a deal breaker for me. It's less the fear of the app going obsolete and more the annoyance of needing to get my phone to play chess. If I'm sitting down to a physical board to play chess, it's to get away from my phone/computer, not bring it along for a playdate.
You just need the phone to start the game.
Seriously, how is that a problem for you? Are you one of those people who can't not look at their phone if it's in the same room as them?
I'm curious how you thought you were going to go online and match make without some sort of screen.
@@Jehty_ Quite the opposite. I don't carry my phone with me every second of every day. I never carry it around my house. I get home, I put it on the table with my keys and don't pick it back up until I go somewhere.
@@Jehty_ no, the robot uses the phone (or rather the app on the phone) to calculate its moves. Without it, this is just an ordinary chess board. It can't do anything on its own
@@thesteelrodent1796 sorry if I wasn't clear enough.
Of course the board needs your phone. But *you* don't need to look at your phone. You can just put your phone next to the board and don't look at it.
Congrats on winning your first game. Glad you enjoyed it.. "I could challenge friends...if I had any friends." Love that line..
It's pretty cool, I'd probably prefer a wood version over a plastic version, but as you mentioned relying on a phone app is a deal breaker. They should try make a deal with the big online chess sites to be able to use this board as an interface.
I think the Chessnut Evo is going to do something similar to what you're saying.
@@destroyerofsimps6574 Thanks, looks interesting.
The wood wouldn't work with the lights and would have to be pretty thin for the magnets to do their job. I've seen glass chess boards though and I could imagine that working.
@@Houshalter That's not true at all, I just tried a couple of tiny neodymium disc magnets (10mm diameter, 2mm thickness) on each side of a 15 mm thick board and no problem moving the magnet on top by moving the magnet on the bottom, they were strong enough that the bottom one is held in place and wouldn't fall off. You could even add an LED in the chess pieces themselves and use inductors to transfer a current to light them up, kind of like how you wirelessly charge your toothbrush, phone, watch etc.
Cheers,
Jake
Back in the 1990s there was a chess system called the Tasc Smartboard. Although it did not move the pieces, it was a standalone system, or it could be hooked up to a PC to operate with other chess programs. It was stunningly beautiful, with the board and chess pieces made out of wood. The board had LED lights embedded in it, at each grid corner, to indicate the moves. The chess pieces had capacitive coils in them (pre-RFID), so that the board could identify what each piece was. It was a cool system, and a lot of fun. I still have my Tasc Smartboard, although it has not seen the light of day for many years. I really should take it out of storage, and see if it still works. Thanks for sharing this video!
That's more what I'd be interested in. Pitiful that it can't tell which piece of which, and requires an app and internet connection. This thing is a glorified smartphone accessory, unfortunately.
@@technoman9000 Unfortunately, I do not have a good dedicated space where I can set up, and leave out, my Tasc chessboard. So it stays in storage most of the time, rather than collecting dust in some corner of my room. Incidentally, the Dutch company that made the Tasc Smartboard was, more-or-less, sued out of business because of patent infringement involving their chess piece identification system. This perhaps explains why their products are only rarely seen nowadays.
think it was Atari (could be wrong on the make) that made a magnetic chess board - in the 80s or 90s - that had LEDs to tell you what to move where. It did everything internally and had different skill levels, but it was not a challenge for anyone who actually knew how to play chess, so it was more like a gimmick for kids than a proper chess game
@@thesteelrodent1796 The first computerized chessboards were pretty basic. I had a Fidelity Chess Challenger portable game, back in the 80s - and I could beat it as long as I was paying close attention. But I don't think I ever beat the Tasc Smartboard. Maybe once or twice. But I'm not a rated player, and the Tasc Smartboard is tough. The thing I discovered about computer chess programs is that they cannot be freaked-out by a provocative move. Whereas a human opponent might make a mistake after I make a dramatic and unexpected move, that simply does not happen with a chess program. So the elements of surprise and psychology are not present when playing a machine. Turns out that playing against a human is just more fun because of the unexpected things that can happen.
I suggest they get an official Techmoan voice for their boards. I mean, it inspires confidence, down to earth and … he's Mat.
Bravo, that ending was perfect. Absolute classic. Really hope you get the other board with all the options.
Great to see a followup to the original chess with a ghost - probably my favourite techmoan video. It is a shame the smaller set can't stream games, even though I'm not particularly interested in watching other people play chess, I feel like it would be a great way to use the set as background decoration when you're not actively using it.
Thank you for this great video. And, also thank you for all the video's this year so far. They are much appreciated by myself (and many others). Take care.👍
I can say I also enjoy these non-HiFi related gadgets. Be it vintage or retro. Please more of that! There's lots of stuff to explore in this area.
FULL DISCLOSURE: Mat enticed me here originally with the Communicator episode, also featured in the outro. I stayed for the puppets, of course.
vintage or retro? aren't those one and the same? Or did you mean "new or retro"?
@@goeland4585 retro means it's a style imitating something old or vintage. for example: That '70s Show is retro. so in case of electronics retro would be all these cheap record players you can buy today.
@@goeland4585 vintage is old stuff, retro is new stuff made to look old
@@goeland4585vintage IS old, retro LOOKS old.
I bought a Swap (or whichever the one you don't have) specifically because of that video you made on the original board. Once I saw they were making cheaper, smaller boards that could also play other games I was sold! It took a few years to get here but mine finally arrived in March. I unfortunately haven't had the chance to use it too much but so far I've enjoyed it!
I remember _Chessmaster 2000_ for MS-DOS. You could play with beeps, silent, or music (PC speaker) which plays a short melody for every particular action. I quite liked that latter option. The people who made your Square-Off should have added that as an option.
From what've seen in the video, the company doesn't seem as interested in making a product as in making money. The board is just a plastic box with a primary movement mechanism and circuitry to recognize piece positions, nothing too expensive I imagine. At that price, they could've at least used some nicer pieces and a wood veneer for the board itself instead of paper, or just gone with injection-moulded plastic (one easy and cheap way to make the wooden part would be to take a light wood veneer, laser-etch the black onto it and then cover it with clear varnish for protection). Many visible corners were cut. The paid subscription also doesn't make them look any better. It would be a fun project to make one of these yourself.
A great way to describe the times we live in: 'I'm happy with it (what I bought), but I'm now wondering if wouldn't been happier with something else'. ♥
Consumerism gone mad I tell ya'!
I gave up playing chess in my teens when I realised that my playing level would never be higher than incompetent but my dislike of losing was at a very high level.
Haha that's me, I've never won a single game ever. No point flogging a dead horse.
lol, same...
I feel that. Once my uncle who introduced me to the game pwned me with a 'fool's mate' that was about it for my interest in Chess. I hate losing far too much. I was better off PKing people in EverQuest's PVP servers. 🙂
Sounds like my life in a nutshell... If I have expectations I'll be disappointed so I should not have expectations, but then I just don't want to play it altogether. Doesn't apply to only chess either...
You,me and countless others across the planet!😂
another addition that might be nice: add a set of Magnet so you have your own figures.
Shure, you could source your own magnets but it's nicer and enocouraging if there are some in the Box
I got suckered into the kickstarter from your previous video, but ordered the Swap because my hope is that I can have it stream games endlessly completely unattended as a decorative ornament! Ideally someone reverse engineers the bluetooth protocol and makes a third party chess server to run on a raspberry pi or something so it doesn't have to be tethered to a phone.
Or you could just use an old phone
@@DeAthWaGer If you can get the phone to run without a battery on mains, that'd be safe. Otherwise you run the risk of overcharging the battery
I think he said it was wifi.
That would be quite fun. Hell I wouldn’t even care if it was the same game on repeat, because no one would notice
@@plapbandit overcharging the battery? That's not a thing. Smartphones have protection against that.
(Of course it's still not healthy for the battery, but that doesn't matter with an old phone.)
Great video Matt......4 years, where did the time go!!..
Other is still going strong and comes out often. Friends are always stunned playing a game, esp the ending when all the pieces return to their respective starts.
But like you state, the old version does require a large room to leave set up. And yes, the phone stand is useless with new style phones esp with cases.
Square off regularly send updates through.
Highly recommended to any budding chess player.
Back in the late-1970s I had the Chess Challenger by Fidelity Electronics. It was extremely slow making moves in the intermediate and advanced levels, and it tended to move "ghost" pieces; I was always very careful not to move a pieces in the wrong square.
They've certainly come a long way since my first and only computerized chess board in the late 80s! Can't remember much about it, other than picking it up from Service Merchandise as a kid, and you had to firmly press down on each piece and again on the square you moved it to.
In a perfect world, the EU or someone else with a big stick would mandate that all products which rely on an app must open source said product's app either as soon as the product goes out of production or 3 years since its introduction to the market, whichever occurs first. Even though it'd be better to not rely on an app at all, at least it can be kept alive by one or more keen volunteers after the original developers wash their hands of it and move onto other things.
Agreed, but it does conflict with the intellectual properly laws, so you need change a few paragraphs to make that fly. They did however go after Apple for artificually bricking phones through software updates when they tried to force people to buy new models, so there is some precedence
Those laws need to be changed anyway. We just need the critical mass of public support, sustained for long enough for politicians to stop seeing those paragraphs as sacrosanct and beyond criticism. @@thesteelrodent1796
After reading a bunch about these boards and *almost* ordering the "NEO Z" I decided to back the chessnut evo. It's not as "cool" because the pieces don't move by themselves but it seems to me that chessnut has a better reputation than square off (when it comes to delivering) + the eco doesn't require a separate app.
I really wanted to like the square off boards & I'll be keeping an eye on their self-moving stuff in the future.
It’ll probably need a new belt in the future.
😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂
He can't wait for sure. lol
In the future there will be someone making a video about replacing the belts in one of these only to realize the app doesn’t run on quantum os 9000.
"...the internals were, really quite obvious- and very easy to predict" me, for the 3rd time this video: "theres a little man inside which moves the pieces OBVIOUSLY."
I had a similar chess board in 2004, each space had a button you would press when moving pieces, the pieces all had magnets in them, and the chess board would move its own pieces. It was completely offline. I never did win against that board.
I genuinely look forward to each new video you put out. The effort and quality to explaining each item makes it more enjoyable than any tv show! Keep up the amazing content
If they just added voice commands and moving the pieces you clicked on it would almost be an assistive device. :)
I did own the original, but I didn't know this had come out, just bought one with your code Sir ^_^
The beeps are pretty cheap and obnoxious sounding, they should put a better speaker in it and have pleasent and more meaningful sounds, that would improve the feeling of quality 100% for a relatively small upgrade.
Do note that their website says the the Neo Z does not have those embedded lights nor the "no press" function. Those are reserved for the Swap
The best thing about being American and having insomnia is that I have something new and good to watch at 5am anytime techmoan uploads :)
I agree with you. Relying on an app is a downside. One of the pleasures of chess is to escape and forcing you to use your phone alongside it, feels a bit clunky.
The tech is there to make a completely automated, stand alone automatic chess board.
I'm not very good at chess, but my Czech mate is.
😢😢😢😢😢😢😢😢
Surely a built-in microcontroller in the chess board could run the game by itself, no phone app needed. Nowadays there are plenty of these uC at low price with power and memory to spare, and could even connect to wifi, bluetooth or what have you
"nowadays"
I've got a chesscomputer-board as a gift in the early 2000. So even back then that functionality was cheap.
(to be fair I guess that computer probably wasn't the best chess player)
@@Jehty_ "nowadays" fixed!
Yes even microprocessors with external ROM-RAM chips were cheap.
So glad you showed how the knight moved haha! My finger was poised over my keyboard ready to ask! 😅
Im so pleased you're enjoying it, i really, really do prefer the original model so much more, especially visually. Its.such a shame, they seem to have gone backwards.
Did you look at the swap? That's the sequel to the old version he showed. This one is an upgrade of their cheaper chess computers and isn't even in the same line as the old one. Except for company name they're unrelated.
@@medes5597 I am aware I still prefer the other aesthetics and I'm not the only one. Your talking to someone who owns the original. It was just an opinion, hey I'm pleased he loves his new one and is enjoying using it.. Plus it great to get as many folk hooked on chess..!!
I agree about the dependency on an app. I think it would have made more sense to have a built in web server for it that has a webpage with all of the options present in the app. Maybe that would have cost too much to implement with a competitive computer, but I doubt it.
The pieces being accidentally knocked over looked hilariously aggressive. They should make it a feature for when the computer captures a piece. Like wizard chess.
You know your old when you know that's a rip off of battle chess.
Ooh, Battle Chess! That was fun to watch and play. And lose...
Don't ever feel guilty about promoting or advertising anything on here Matt, you've got a living to make and we appreciate and support what you do here.
definitely something I would have wanted but the moment I see "app" is the moment I cease wanting it. too many horror stories of devices being bricked because a company either decides that they want to sell the next product or they just go under completely
2:30 - It's really interesting, but the fact it requires a mobile app is an immediate deal-breaker. Too many opportunities for planned obsolescence; no guarantee I could still use the game as intended 5 years out.
Something like this shouldn't rely on an app. I am sure everything this can do can be done on a Raspberry Pi. App could be optional, but not required.
Really like this. Love your comment about chess having a physical board. Recently bought electronic set I had as a kid, I really trained up on that. Hope you learn and love it. 👍
The ability to play chess is the sign of a gentleman. The ability to play chess well is the sign of a wasted life. -- PM
Sounds like a salty comment from a guy that can't play chess well.
@@nickelion1760i don't know, I'd be willing to bet Paul Morphy could play a damn sight better than you...
@@Joseph-pt9ynOf course he can, it was a joke.
I honestly don't know if that's a fake name or not.
@@nickelion1760Two words: Bobby Fischer. If that’s not a wasted life, I don’t know what is.
It is very easy to get the original apart without damaging it. I had to repair mine. There are some screws hidden under the green felt on the base. You can feel them if you run your finger around close to the edge. Push a screw driver through the felt at each screw and remove it. It only needs a very small hole. There are screws further from the edge but do not remove those or the innards will fall apart. When all screws round the edge have been removed the top and bottom can be separated. Assembly is a reversal and the felt will close over the screw holes with hardly any visible sign left. No need to destroy it.
Would be cool, if it would work without a smartphone app and connection to the internet, so it would still work in 5 years. You could just put it in your house as decoration and as soon as a visitor would move one of the pieces the pieces of the opposite color would start moving on their own.
If something's got to be dependent on an app, then at least what's necessary for basic offline functioning should be open-sourced (or at least something to give the enthusiasts as bone) so people can keep it running if they wish. There's nothing quite as infuriating as working hardware bricked by external internet/software negligence.
I do not understand why built-in features require a subscription, when this thing is as expensive as it is already.
As always thanks for another excellent video.
FWLIW: I share you thoughts, suggestions, and concerns - above all that this device relies on an app. The added logic to drive a chess machine would cost a couple of quid on a mass-produced machine, could be flash-upgradeable, and then the app would be a bonus rather than a concern.
Maybe if the pieces had NFC tags in them along with a reader in the 'movement head' that would allow greater flexibility and error correcting.
Each piece should have a unique RFID chip to identify it so that the board can set itself up just by placing them on the board.
Yeah it's kinda silly it doesn't have that.
But you can get new (fancier) pieces yourself now right? As long as they are magnetic.
Assume it's that the RFID reader would have to scan every piece at the beginning, and it couldn't go on the same arm as the magnet. So probably would add a lot of complexity they didn't think was worth the R&D
@@rumsfeld99 I don't believe it's RFID in the more expensive version. You put the pieces in the allocated spots along side the board and it then moves them into position using that
Nope - never said any of these had RFID.
Hello Mr Techmoan. I hope you have a nice weekend. You always make cozy videos.
It is like everything these days --- get an app, but if our company fails our servers die, you are left with and expensive paperweight --- oh and you need a smart phone and connect to the internet so there are $$$$ on top of the product costs --- GREAT AN EXPENSIVE PRINTER!
"Challenge a friend... if i had any friends" damn
So, this is what playing chess in The Sims by yourself feels like...
The quality of these videos is amazing. Being an obsessed anglophile since 1984 when I found the Beatles. Then Monty Python. And years later finding Techmoan keeping up with the standards of the aforementioned. The pace and the clarity of information is immensively and immersively soothing to my sore ears and eyes. Thank you.
It requires a slanted side for the captured pieces to easily slide off.
I had this idea a couple years back. Seems quite a few people have beat me to it. I think I will still eventually build one though.
I really hope they'll make a standalone version of it, without an app. Even if it would be even bulkier than the original board, that'd be a huge improvement - not a fan of apps.
So who exactly do you play against? The same boring 3 AI presets?
@@DeAthWaGer I was thinking more of an imbedded "phone" with similar app that would receive updates and you'd select challenges and such. So once board would go offline you'd still have what you downloaded before. Putting AI presets into the board itself by default is already enough for many people, but while servers are still up you could play with others.
@@DeAthWaGer Any device that relies on an app to even function is extremely vulnerable, which means you’re essentially gambling (hahaha…) on the developer to not only stay in business, but to keep throwing money at updates for new OS versions etc. for as long as you want to keep using the product.
The moment the updates stop, the device becomes a completely nonfunctional waste of space and money, which is something any purchaser needs to consider.
Even supposing it would only have “3 AI presets” (and I don’t see why the choice would necessarily be so limited), the device would at least still work if the app updates stopped.
Delighted you received yours and also delighted it appears to do more than I had hoped. Now I shall wait with glee for mine to arrive!
It's arrived!
For the vast majority of people, chest software that was more than good enough to at least be a real challenge came out in the 1970's. And required a few kilobytes of memory.
Yeah I don't buy the "Powered by AI" bollocks. It's chess, my 486 was able to play a respectable game back in the day. It should be able to play a basic game, self-contained, with no Internet or bluetooth connection.
but it requires a proper processor (not super fast or modern, just an actual processor) to calculate the moves, which means they have to add more electronics to the thing, beyond the obviously very basic motor controller. I'm just guessing the people who made this board decided it was too much effort, or they just don't know how, to add a chess computer into the board. Not trying to defend their decision, because I really don't care for products that rely on apps, but when they have to do everything else on the app anyway, you can see why they didn't see a need to make the board work without. It is very cheap to develop an app, and you can find the chess algorithms online, you don't even have to come up with them yourself.
Yeah, but then they cant lock you down with phone tethered DRM bollucks, and greedy ridiculous subscriptions paywalls
I really enjoy the content here. Not like super click baity, also not sponsored. Just interesting content.
Wow...a chess board that needs a firmware upgrade. This really is the future!
He had coffee mug, that needed firmware update before.
My GF also needs a update ... can't do it ... CPU is to slow.
Are you absolutely sure that the plugin host can support the upgrade?@@TomKappeln
My old set constantly needed hardware updates, cause the dog kept stealing and gnawing the Queens.
#darkesttimeline
‘I could add a friend if I had any friends…’
Story of my life
The Tech Collection has a video on the insides of the Square Neo chess board. Very simple X Y plotter mechanisms as you say Matt with an electric magnet. A long cylindrical Li-Ion battery pack and a very small PCB.
I definitely want to see the other board.
I feel the same. I played as kid and always imagined a board where the pieces would magically move.
As always grate video
Question: Is the 'thinking' done in the app, or by the mothership server via the Internet? Observation: I'm in Canada, and the Neo doesn't show up as an option at the bottom of the web page. If I identify as being in the UK, it does.
This is actually a really cool product. I’m not necessarily a chess player myself either but the way this works is pretty cool. I love that you can play bots or a friend online. I totally agree that playing a digital game just isn’t the same. The bot is great for someone who just wants to practice and being able to play with a physical board and see your friends moves physically happen on your board is much more satisfying. Would be a much more engaging experience than just playing on a computer screen.
If this were combined with the Lumisource LED chessboard, I'd be all over it.
The stress with the clock count down is the best buzz of the game. Love your videos ❤
Different sounds should be possible with a software update, I think. Or as an option in the phone app, coming from the phone's speakers
I don't know about that. Those beeps sound like a pretty low-quality piezoelectic buzzer. It may not even be able to do different tones.
Great video Mat! Brought back memories of watching Play Chess on BBC 2 when you were playing
$29 upgrade? A physical chees board with a DLC option, truly 2023. Still looks pretty fun though.
Not "upgrade", a 6 month subscription. Still sounds like a better deal than Xbox Gold 🤣
Hi, Techmoan..., Remember..., the White Queen goes on its color, the White Queen goes on the white or light color square and or White Queen wears white shoes. * As for the Black Queen.., the Black Queen goes on the black or dark square and the Black Queen wears black shoes... * Excellent video and very informative, and thank you for sharing the video... "Semper Fi" Mike in historic Uptown Butte, Montana, USA... P.S.: Excellent choice of using your cellphone holder... :)
Something mechanical like that being put together in a way that makes it impossible to open it without destroying it should be a crime. Only a matter of time before it needs maintenance or repair.
Well with the app being needed, which looks like it also needs internet access, it’s likely to be unsupported in a few years and thus the mechanical side of it will be useless anyway
@@deanolium well that doesn't make it any better, does it? Lol.
The circle on the base makes me think the moving parts are polar-coordinate based, likely with some kind of extension to get into the corners rather than the X-Y style of the older board.
So we have a none chess player who normally opens up all kinds of devices, now playing chess, not opening up the device. Still nice to watch this review.
He states exactly what is in it and tells you there is another video with a teardown. He doesn't want to destroy his own personal unit so respect that's his choice. If you feel like shelling out $300 to just tear apart a product for a video, voiding the warrant and rendering it useless, go right ahead.
No I won’t make that video , since there is already a video like that as you mentioned. I just found the points I mentioned funny and I do respect his choices, never said I don’t.
6:20 those stands are supposed to hold the phone in horizontal position. If the app is in portrait, then that doesn't make sense; but that stand is a standard little chinese thing, not made specially for this device, so it might be an oversight.
really seems mighty pricey for what it is
What we really need is a online Techmoan chess league, the winner gets the top 10 selling Laser discs.
THE ONLY WINNING MOVE IS NOT TO PLAY
Matt, if they knew who you are maybe they would be so happy that you were reviewing it that they would send you the other one for free pending a review or at a significant discount. I know you don’t do things for that reason, but I thought just the same that I would mention it. You have one of the best channels on TH-cam. Thank you.
At 14:54 I was surprised the computer didn't use the king to take your 'promoted' queen. Don't think it would be moving into check to do that. Or maybe there are rules to chess I don't remember, since it has also been _years_ since I have played it.