@@B-Dad I give that award to Harmony. She was bitten during an eclipse in the middle of a battlefield, but we were asked to believe a vamp survived that battle long enough to feed her enough vampire blood for her to come back later. Sandy was left unconscious at a table after vamp Willow drank for a few seconds, so her being fed off screen by vamp Willow or one of the other vampires hanging out at The Bronze is more believable to me.
Figures that in a supernatural show with vampires and demons and monsters of all sorts, the thing to harm Joyce is a normal brain tumour that Buffy can neither fight nor reason with, nor use magic against. It's kind of the perfect antagonist for a character like Buffy because it's attacking her mother directly but there is actually nothing she can do about it. And it was kind of foreshadowed in season two, in the episode Killed By Death, when Giles says "death and disease are perhaps the only two things Buffy cannot fight."
The effects for that snake demon are sometimes incredible for the time, and sometimes bad even for its time. The shot that panned up to Glory's house, I could never get over how obvious it was she was punching a rubber dummy.
"is he trying to get turned into a vampire and be like Angel so then Buffy will Love him" You're on the right track. As usual Spike knows what to say. He said Buffy needs a bit of darkness in her men. Riley is treading on the dark side.
Buffy knew back in _Doomed_ she wasn't ready to be girlfriend material. It is why she said she wasn't ready. She used Faith and Angel as the reasons (although there is more to it, like being a slayer in general, and how few understand issues dealing with that), but Riley refused to understand and called her "stupid" and "self-involved" for it, which made Buffy assume she could get over those issues by being with Riley. Of course Buffy shuts Riley down. She knew her relationship with Angel and to some degree her friendship with Faith made her that way. Now that Riley is being faced with her issues, and has issues of dealing without the initiative, he is not doing any better than Buffy. That is the reason he is encouraging her when she isn't ready. It is part of his own issues. _Out of My Mind_ and _Hush_ also shows Buffy and Riley's communication isn't entirely one-sided. While Buffy is doing the best she can (as she blatantly stated in the _Out of My Mind_ episode, and knew some of way back in the _Doomed_ episode) concerning her past, Riley isn't dealing with his initiative issues at all and is going through the same issues as Angel was in S3; meaning his identity, without the initiative, is wrapped entirely around Buffy. Which is causing him to push for things she isn't ready for. It took Buffy 22 months to see Giles as a father figure. Riley's known Buffy 13 months and been dating her 10 months. Patience could be key for wanting to allow Buffy to lean on him for emotional support. They both have issues that aren't allowing Buffy to cry on his shoulder, but that are also making Riley too pushy in wanting her to do so.
@@RLucas3000 Herself, Angel, and Riley. By lying to herself she lies to Riley and Angel. Being pushed into the relationship with Riley has made her believe the "honeymoon" phase of it is love. She still doesn't know any other way, as it was the same with Angel and her belief in that relationship being love.🙄 And Angel is an ex which she was purposely trying to hurt for helping Faith. Angel is actually the first real test to the Buffy and Riley relationship and Riley has had unhealthy jealously issues about said Buffy and Angel relationship (and her vampire "thing") ever since. Riley failed that test. Buffy lying to herself is just another one of her issues revolving around the issues I mentioned above. Not a problem with the theory itself.
What makes Riley the worst is how he internalizes everything, refusing to communicate any of his needs, and then blaming Buffy for not meeting those needs, lashing out at her in the process. He places these unfair expectations on her and lets Buffy believe their relationship is fine. Spike definitely loves her more than him, and that's messed up. Riley wants a lot from her while not knowing or understanding how to earn it, while Spike clumsily tries to make himself look better to her. Riley thinks she needs to be a certain way for her to be sincere in her feelings, but Spike loves who she already is with Buffy giving him absolutely nothing. I'm not saying Spike is right for her, just that Riley could have learned something from him.
Buffy wants the drama. Riley was the nice solid guy, that treated her right. Nice guys that you know will always be there for you, don't create the drama that many women crave. So she put him on the back shelf. She takes him out when it's convenient and then puts him back when she doesn't need him. He was the text book definition of a Simp. The one time that Riley calls Buffy out (Family) and actually says something, Buffy never addresses it. If Riley was smart, he would have stayed on the offensive, but instead he wanted to be the nice guy. He didn't want to create a situation where Buffy would feel bad, so he kept everything to himself. That rabbit hole led to her taking him for granted even more, and then him secretly acting out like an idiot. Here is the conversation that Buffy had with Willow, showing exactly how she felt about Riley and relationships Buffy: I really like him. I do. Willow: But..? Buffy: I don't know. I really like being around him, you know? And I think he cares about me.. but.. I just.. feel like something's missing. Willow: He's not making you miserable? Buffy: Exactly. Riley seems so solid. Like he wouldn't cause me heartache. Willow: (Fake worry) Get out. Get out while there's still time. Buffy: I know.. I have to get away from that bad boy thing. There's no good there. Seeing Angel in LA.. even for five minutes.. hello to the pain. Willow: The pain is not a friend. Buffy: But I can't help thinking - isn't that where the fire comes from? Can a nice, safe relationship be that intense? I know it's nuts, but.. part of me believes that real love and passion have to go hand in hand with pain and fighting.
Common fan theory. Joyce only has the tumor because of the lifetime of memories the monks placed in her head of Dawn. Buffy, as the slayer was strong enough to take it. The scoobies only got a few years of memories having only met The Summers’ as sophomores, so they also suffered no problems.
That is such a mean theory. Thanks for posting about it. I didn't watch this show when it came out so I am still learning what the original fans thought at the time. On my first watch, I personally resented that Giles insisted magic couldn't fix Joyce. Magically removing a "shadow" or a small tumorous lump shouldn't be more difficult than magically removing Adam's energy source in the last season. Yeah, they had bad dreams as punishment for playing around with that sort of magic, but it was worth it. In retrospect, I'm even more resentful. The magic displayed in season 6 makes this entire "magic can't help with a physical ailment" plot seem intentionally cruel and mean.
@@arimina5353 I completely understand what you’re saying. And that was my initial reaction as well, help her; use all the magic! But if anyone could fix anything with magic, the world would be chaos. That’s why magic has to come at a price, it’s never free. And its consequence will be just as severe, if not more, than its reward. And season 6 had consequences for everyone….that carry over. I do appreciate the themes of the show, even to this day. High school can feel like hell. Growing up and becoming an adult, feels like monsters constantly attacking you. The uphill battle that isn’t always won, feels like magical forces against you. Life is bittersweet, but if it was that easy, it wouldn’t be worth it or mean as much, and there is good in all of it. No one is ever going to 100% win, good can’t exist without bad, it’s just a necessary lesson of life about reality, balance, and acceptance. It is and remains my favorite show of all time.
@@whitneytincher6016 I think I agree with you about the message of this series. I didn't grow up with it, but I can see how those who did got great things from it. I just have a problem with this particular plot-point, and the fan-theory that the creators did it to punish Joyce for what those monks did with their key makes it even worse.
@@arimina5353 Again, I agree and understand. Joyce was crossing a line, that was not accepted when originally aired. But I will say, the older I got, the more I appreciated that they (writers) weren’t afraid to do it…? Not because I agree with it or accept it. Because it’s a real pain that, basically, everyone in their life will experience. If they fantastically saved her, I would have been instant gratification thrilled, but it would have lost its realness and relatability. The show, while being supernatural and fantasy, keeps one foot emotionally grounded in reality. And after suffering those kinds of losses, personally, it doesn’t make Joyce’s circumstance easier, but it does make me feel less alone about going through something like that and having those feelings. Which as I said, favorite show, and I will be the old lady still watching it over and over. lol
I'm far from a Riley fan - especially season 5 Riley, because I have come to find that his character comes off a bit different in season 4, but the impression left of him from season 5 tends to supersede that - but a lot of people say something like, "Riley, it's not about you, it's about Buffy;" and the thing is, _that's the point. _ Riley's not seeking attention from Buffy, he's not trying to take her away from her family. He wants her to know she can be vulnerable with him (like she's been vulnerable with Angel); he wants to help her shoulder that burden. That's the opposite of Riley making it about him, but Buffy rebuffing him hurts him, because he keeps trying to connect with her and show he loves and her and give her a reason to love him and she's oblivious. I feel like the writers put this stuff Sandy the vampire or going half halfcocked with the vamp nest, to scuff up his character more, so that Buffy doesn't come off like the bad guy for not pulling away from Riley emotionally; when there doesn't need to be a reason. Sometimes two people just drift apart.
Here's the thing. Buffy doesn't need nor want Riley to shoulder the burden. Buffy needs to be the strong one, that's how she gets through this, this is always how she does things and by now Riley should know that. Buffy is trying her hardest not to fall apart, while Riley comes in saying it's ok to fall apart. It's exactly what she doesn't need to hear right now, it's like someone is running a marathon and their spouse is constantly telling them how it's ok to give up and not finish when they really need to hear that they can do this. It feels like he wants credit for doing things nobody asked or wanted and he's pissed that nobody is acknowledging the things he does. It is about him and it's probably because he already feels that they are drifting apart, or at least he is.
@@MarkusR144 Except it's definitely _not_ how Buffy has handled things. She has _always_ turned to people like Willow, Giles, Joyce and _especially Angel in times she needed emotional support. The one time she completely retreated - running away to LA - was the one time Angel was gone, presumably forever and in large part because of her; and Joyce told her to never come back. And running away was not how she dealt with her emotional pain; it was when she found the strength to come back. and she went straight to her mom. Later, when Giles had a good idea that Buffy was bottling up her feelings by not talking about the full details of what happened with Angel and how he had gotten his soul back, Giles gave her to opportunity to open up to him; to potentially be vulnerable with _him. _ That was no different from what Riley was doing here. He wasn't yelling at her, "Cry for me! Now! Let me be a bring strong man for you!" He wanted to be her _partner. _ Riley was offering her emotional support, so that she didn't have to bottle everything up. Newsflash, trying to bottle up your emotions, especially in times of stress, is not healthy. To compare that to someone egging on a person to quit has to be the _dumbest_ possible idea. Allowing yourself to be upset over stressful circumstances, much less have someone willing to be there for you during those time, rather than go through it alone, is the furthest possible thing from "quitting;" and only a complete f-ing moron would think otherwise.
@@stargazer1682 I agree but ppl are right too that buffy tried to tell Riley several times that she isn't ready for a relationship and he called her stupid and pushed her into one. They both made mistakes.
@@CarrotFlowers421 See, I don't know about that. Yeah, he calls her stupid, which is taken literally and without context sounds derisive, but it's arguably the same as Willow telling Tara in "Family" "See, that's where you're a dummy..." for thinking Willow wouldn't like her if she knew she was part demon. In both cases, the language is kind of indelicate, and not how I would want to word it, but the point for either Riley or Willow wasn't to hurt the other's feeling but a clumsy way of refuting idea the other had that was born out of insecurity. Riley wasn't bullying Buffy into a relationship anymore than Willow was. He might have been naive about the dangers for what they do, but he also wasn't strictly wrong in his general point that, just because Buffy had a bad relationship with someone who was apart of her Slayer world, she couldn't find someone that could actually be a partner with her. He was trying to combat Buffy's conclusion that being the Slayer meant having to be alone. Even if that person's not Riley either, the core concept still stands.
I think so many people hate Riley because he represents a feeling we all deny we've experienced because it's so humiliating and vulnerable. Being head over heels in love with someone whom you can feel is leaving you by inches is a soul crushing experience. If we've felt that, we will try to do anything to forget it.
I know..... I mean, people can feel when someone's not really in the relationship, you know. How can you not, its like talking to a wall. The feeling you get when you start to miss someone when they are right there in front of you, its so gut-wrenching. And none of this is meant to throw shade on either Buffy or Riley, just that its a bad relationship situation that they both just couldn't make work, I don't why the hell people try to blame either him or her. Relationships are not always right or wrong, they just are. In fact, very few things are truly wrong in any relationship, and those are along the lines of abuse.
I think what is incredible about S5 is even though this is a supernatural/fantasy show, the harsh realities of real life are always there, and are manifested in this Season especially. Joyce's illness is in the background at this point, and Buffy has to try and contend with this as well as trying to protect Dawn form Glory. The pressure on Buffy on a personal level is intense. The build up from here on in to the arc of the Season is exceptional. Amazing writing.
I blame Angel. If a 40 yr old man had bedded a girl one day over the age of 16, he would be deemed a monster by some people. In this series, a 200 yr old man did that and fans love him for it. If Buffy were a real person, she would need a lot of therapy to recover from that relationship. But because the show portrays it as a good and romantic one-true-love relationship she will never get the help she would need to have a normal and healthy adult life. So I don't dislike Buffy's character. I like her and I feel awful for her, and I feel bad for any non-abusive man who comes close enough to care for her. I think the show is pretty honest in portraying her as an adult unable to form a healthy relationship with a man who doesn't cause her to suffer torment and pain. She went through a very traumatic thing at the hands of someone old enough to be her great great grandfather. She'll never feel for a "normal" person the emotional roller coaster she felt for the creature she consummated her love with at the vulnerable age of one day over 16. When Angel kissed her she wanted to die. That is an actual line that Buffy speaks in this show. That is what Buffy thinks love should feel like. Death. She's broken, ruined, and I think the series shows that quite well.
@Peter from NZ The dude has serious ptsd after what Doctor Walsh did to him. All he knows is the military. He may find something eventually. All he seems to want right now is a reciprocal relationship...not sure Buffy is made for that.
Poor Sandy, bitten and turned by displaced Vampire-Willow, dusted by stupid Riley and one with the more ugly vampirefaces, she was really a tragic girl. Tara, for sure we need more of her 😍. Buffy told Angel several times that she loves him (famous in S2 finale). I think Riley and Graham would have been a cool duo to turn Supernatural into a Buffy spinoff instead of the brothers.
Riley gave up everything that makes himself at the end he made the right when army ask for back because there nothing for him there anymore with vampires show how toxic real ship was he needed a purpose he got with army at the end
The snake creature outfit did not seem convincing to me in certain scenes. In a couple of closeups, it was obviously a person in a suit. And in the closeup of Buffy punching the creature repeatedly, it looked to me like she was just punching a rubber dummy. I assume that she was only hitting it with her right fist, because her left arm was still sore from the fight with Glory (thus the scene with the ice pack).
The problem with the Buffy-Riley relationship is that she shuts him off. Simple question: What would you do if you have a boyfriend and then your mother has to go to the hospital? Would you give him a call to get support or would you shut him off like Buffy did? Not to mention that Buffy told everyone but Riley about the problem - even Spike. That's just messed up. 20:52 "Buffy is going through a lot". That's exactly the point. That's when you rely on your partner to help you and give you the strength to see it through. What people do not do in such situations is letting your partner in the dark and completely forget them and cut them off. But that's exactly what Buffy does and that is 100 % failsafe proof that she does indeed not love him. 21:08 Are you serious? You would treat your boyfriend like that? This is nothing but a huge red flag for Riley that Buffy is indeed not loving him. She should have taken him with her into the room which is exactly what people do in such situations because in a serious relationship the partner is indeed family! You completely misunderstand what's going on here. It's not that Riley wants Buffy do focus on him instead of her mom, it's about him wanting to support and help her deal with the situation. "Not everything is about him" Seriously - it's like you didn't even watch the episode - or is there any specific reason why you misinterpret the situation that badly?
1) People need to be in the right frame of mind to talk about their problems or be vulnerable with other people. If Buffy's not in the mood to let Riley comfort her, she's not in the mood. That's not a failing on her part, it's an entirely natural potential outcome of learning that her mother has a brain tumour. I have been in situations where I have intentionally not confided in people who I know for a fact I can trust because I knew I wouldn't feel up to it at the time. I didn't want to talk about it, or I couldn't talk about it. It happens. Also, Buffy did *not* tell everyone except Riley. Spike found out because he happened to be there when Buffy was crying about her mother's impending hospitalisation. Riley knew before any of the other Scoobies, save Spike. 2) Everyone deals with trauma differently. while there are certainly unhealthy ways to react to trauma, there is no one, singular, objectively correct way to respond. The answer to "what do you do if your mother goes into hospital" doesn't *have* to be "call your boyfriend for support." People are not "wrong" if they choose to act differently in that situation, and, honestly, how someone behaves in the midst of an emotional crisis is not a good litmus test for how much they love you. 3) Buffy does tell Riley what she needs. "Not right now. I need space. Comfort me *later."* He's still sad. He's not sad because he thinks she's making a mistake, it's because he's insecure about how much she loves him. Buffy has said what she needs, and she can't adjust what she wants or needs in this moment just because Riley wants her to need something else right now.
@@Talisguy To your point 1: She told everyone but Riley what was going on - Giles, Willow, Xander, Anya and Tera. Even Spike for god's sake! If she would not have been in the mood to speak about the problem she would not have told anyone about it. However she told absolutely everybod except her boyfriend. Sorry to say that but your first point doesn't make any sense whatsoever and you're wrong on that one, plain and simple. Granted - people deal differently with trauma. However Buffy did call a lot of people... back at point 1 so again - no, you're wrong. Point 3 - partly true. And exactly the point that proves that she doesn't love Riley. I stand by what I said: In such situations you want your partner at your side, simple as that. And no, people do not react that differently, this is what the overwhelmingly vast majority of people does. What you describe - people shutting their partners off while including even mortal enemies - is done by maybe one in a billion people. This is a massive red flag. And its also not what she needs by the way, she needs all support she can get right now, and pushing people away that she claims she loves (but clearly does not) is the exact opposite of what she needs and also the exact opposite of what people do in such situations.
@@Talisguy "Spike found out because he happened to be there when Buffy was crying about her mother's impending hospitalisation. " And Spike is telepathic?
Or maybe Riley shouldn't place unfair, unrealistic expectations on Buffy and then get upset when she doesn't act exactly how he wants. The only reason Riley was in the dark was because he was somewhere else. This was before everyone had cell phones, and Buffy hadn't spoken with him since the previous morning. Riley went patrolling and presumably slept in his own bed, and in the morning, the Summerses went to the hospital before he woke up or had his coffee or whatever. Buffy can only feel what she feels. Why does Riley get to resent her for that?
Ever think you'd see a villain waltz into the protagonists' shop to buy supplies? I love Glory so much. She is my favorite villain of Buffy.
I especially like Giles's words immediately after she leaves, 'She could be anywhere."
The vamp Riley killed was Sandy. Sandy was created by vampire Willow.
I don’t know how many times I’ve watched the series without noticing that. I had to find out in the comments of a reaction channel.
I already figured out months ago,but it's crazy that she was sired by a clone that lived in alternative world
First person to ever turn without drinking vamp blood before dying! 🤷🏾♂️
I didn't remember her doing that
@@B-Dad I give that award to Harmony. She was bitten during an eclipse in the middle of a battlefield, but we were asked to believe a vamp survived that battle long enough to feed her enough vampire blood for her to come back later.
Sandy was left unconscious at a table after vamp Willow drank for a few seconds, so her being fed off screen by vamp Willow or one of the other vampires hanging out at The Bronze is more believable to me.
Figures that in a supernatural show with vampires and demons and monsters of all sorts, the thing to harm Joyce is a normal brain tumour that Buffy can neither fight nor reason with, nor use magic against. It's kind of the perfect antagonist for a character like Buffy because it's attacking her mother directly but there is actually nothing she can do about it. And it was kind of foreshadowed in season two, in the episode Killed By Death, when Giles says "death and disease are perhaps the only two things Buffy cannot fight."
Trust me you wouldn't be mad. Having a sibling during a parents death is some comfort. No matter who is comforting who.
Glory's minions are honestly one of my favorite things in the whole show. they're just so funny
This one in particular. He provides the comic relief that makes this sad episode bearable.
The effects for that snake demon are sometimes incredible for the time, and sometimes bad even for its time. The shot that panned up to Glory's house, I could never get over how obvious it was she was punching a rubber dummy.
"is he trying to get turned into a vampire and be like Angel so then Buffy will Love him"
You're on the right track. As usual Spike knows what to say. He said Buffy needs a bit of darkness in her men. Riley is treading on the dark side.
Riley puts words to it later, it's about "need".
@@CarrotFlowers421 Talking about later stuff might spoil the reactor.
She told angel all the time she loved him
I think Buffy loves Riley but isn't in love with him.
Buffy knew back in _Doomed_ she wasn't ready to be girlfriend material. It is why she said she wasn't ready. She used Faith and Angel as the reasons (although there is more to it, like being a slayer in general, and how few understand issues dealing with that), but Riley refused to understand and called her "stupid" and "self-involved" for it, which made Buffy assume she could get over those issues by being with Riley. Of course Buffy shuts Riley down. She knew her relationship with Angel and to some degree her friendship with Faith made her that way. Now that Riley is being faced with her issues, and has issues of dealing without the initiative, he is not doing any better than Buffy. That is the reason he is encouraging her when she isn't ready. It is part of his own issues.
_Out of My Mind_ and _Hush_ also shows Buffy and Riley's communication isn't entirely one-sided. While Buffy is doing the best she can (as she blatantly stated in the _Out of My Mind_ episode, and knew some of way back in the _Doomed_ episode) concerning her past, Riley isn't dealing with his initiative issues at all and is going through the same issues as Angel was in S3; meaning his identity, without the initiative, is wrapped entirely around Buffy. Which is causing him to push for things she isn't ready for. It took Buffy 22 months to see Giles as a father figure. Riley's known Buffy 13 months and been dating her 10 months. Patience could be key for wanting to allow Buffy to lean on him for emotional support. They both have issues that aren't allowing Buffy to cry on his shoulder, but that are also making Riley too pushy in wanting her to do so.
The problem is, she tells Angel she loves Riley. Is she lying to herself, Riley or Angel?
@@RLucas3000 Herself, Angel, and Riley. By lying to herself she lies to Riley and Angel. Being pushed into the relationship with Riley has made her believe the "honeymoon" phase of it is love. She still doesn't know any other way, as it was the same with Angel and her belief in that relationship being love.🙄 And Angel is an ex which she was purposely trying to hurt for helping Faith. Angel is actually the first real test to the Buffy and Riley relationship and Riley has had unhealthy jealously issues about said Buffy and Angel relationship (and her vampire "thing") ever since. Riley failed that test. Buffy lying to herself is just another one of her issues revolving around the issues I mentioned above. Not a problem with the theory itself.
What makes Riley the worst is how he internalizes everything, refusing to communicate any of his needs, and then blaming Buffy for not meeting those needs, lashing out at her in the process. He places these unfair expectations on her and lets Buffy believe their relationship is fine. Spike definitely loves her more than him, and that's messed up. Riley wants a lot from her while not knowing or understanding how to earn it, while Spike clumsily tries to make himself look better to her. Riley thinks she needs to be a certain way for her to be sincere in her feelings, but Spike loves who she already is with Buffy giving him absolutely nothing. I'm not saying Spike is right for her, just that Riley could have learned something from him.
@@TigerNightmare 👍
Buffy wants the drama. Riley was the nice solid guy, that treated her right. Nice guys that you know will always be there for you, don't create the drama that many women crave. So she put him on the back shelf. She takes him out when it's convenient and then puts him back when she doesn't need him. He was the text book definition of a Simp. The one time that Riley calls Buffy out (Family) and actually says something, Buffy never addresses it. If Riley was smart, he would have stayed on the offensive, but instead he wanted to be the nice guy. He didn't want to create a situation where Buffy would feel bad, so he kept everything to himself. That rabbit hole led to her taking him for granted even more, and then him secretly acting out like an idiot. Here is the conversation that Buffy had with Willow, showing exactly how she felt about Riley and relationships
Buffy: I really like him. I do.
Willow: But..?
Buffy: I don't know. I really like being around him, you know? And I think he cares about me.. but.. I just.. feel like something's missing.
Willow: He's not making you miserable?
Buffy: Exactly. Riley seems so solid. Like he wouldn't cause me heartache.
Willow: (Fake worry) Get out. Get out while there's still time.
Buffy: I know.. I have to get away from that bad boy thing. There's no good there. Seeing Angel in LA.. even for five minutes.. hello to the pain.
Willow: The pain is not a friend.
Buffy: But I can't help thinking - isn't that where the fire comes from? Can a nice, safe relationship be that intense? I know it's nuts, but.. part of me believes that real love and passion have to go hand in hand with pain and fighting.
Knowing that you already watched 5x16, this one hits differently…
I've just discovered that I have no idea what Peter Pan is all about. I thought it was just the Lost Boys without the motorbikes.
Just noticed. That doctor was Lord Refa..
Common fan theory.
Joyce only has the tumor because of the lifetime of memories the monks placed in her head of Dawn. Buffy, as the slayer was strong enough to take it. The scoobies only got a few years of memories having only met The Summers’ as sophomores, so they also suffered no problems.
That is such a mean theory. Thanks for posting about it. I didn't watch this show when it came out so I am still learning what the original fans thought at the time.
On my first watch, I personally resented that Giles insisted magic couldn't fix Joyce. Magically removing a "shadow" or a small tumorous lump shouldn't be more difficult than magically removing Adam's energy source in the last season. Yeah, they had bad dreams as punishment for playing around with that sort of magic, but it was worth it.
In retrospect, I'm even more resentful. The magic displayed in season 6 makes this entire "magic can't help with a physical ailment" plot seem intentionally cruel and mean.
@@arimina5353 I completely understand what you’re saying. And that was my initial reaction as well, help her; use all the magic!
But if anyone could fix anything with magic, the world would be chaos. That’s why magic has to come at a price, it’s never free. And its consequence will be just as severe, if not more, than its reward. And season 6 had consequences for everyone….that carry over.
I do appreciate the themes of the show, even to this day. High school can feel like hell. Growing up and becoming an adult, feels like monsters constantly attacking you. The uphill battle that isn’t always won, feels like magical forces against you. Life is bittersweet, but if it was that easy, it wouldn’t be worth it or mean as much, and there is good in all of it. No one is ever going to 100% win, good can’t exist without bad, it’s just a necessary lesson of life about reality, balance, and acceptance.
It is and remains my favorite show of all time.
@@whitneytincher6016 I think I agree with you about the message of this series. I didn't grow up with it, but I can see how those who did got great things from it.
I just have a problem with this particular plot-point, and the fan-theory that the creators did it to punish Joyce for what those monks did with their key makes it even worse.
@@arimina5353 Again, I agree and understand. Joyce was crossing a line, that was not accepted when originally aired.
But I will say, the older I got, the more I appreciated that they (writers) weren’t afraid to do it…? Not because I agree with it or accept it. Because it’s a real pain that, basically, everyone in their life will experience. If they fantastically saved her, I would have been instant gratification thrilled, but it would have lost its realness and relatability. The show, while being supernatural and fantasy, keeps one foot emotionally grounded in reality.
And after suffering those kinds of losses, personally, it doesn’t make Joyce’s circumstance easier, but it does make me feel less alone about going through something like that and having those feelings.
Which as I said, favorite show, and I will be the old lady still watching it over and over. lol
Is that House of Leaves on your bookshelf? Amazing, terrifying book.
Looks like it. Good eye! I hadn't noticed that.
Yes it is. Lexi has great taste in novels!
I'm far from a Riley fan - especially season 5 Riley, because I have come to find that his character comes off a bit different in season 4, but the impression left of him from season 5 tends to supersede that - but a lot of people say something like, "Riley, it's not about you, it's about Buffy;" and the thing is, _that's the point. _ Riley's not seeking attention from Buffy, he's not trying to take her away from her family. He wants her to know she can be vulnerable with him (like she's been vulnerable with Angel); he wants to help her shoulder that burden. That's the opposite of Riley making it about him, but Buffy rebuffing him hurts him, because he keeps trying to connect with her and show he loves and her and give her a reason to love him and she's oblivious.
I feel like the writers put this stuff Sandy the vampire or going half halfcocked with the vamp nest, to scuff up his character more, so that Buffy doesn't come off like the bad guy for not pulling away from Riley emotionally; when there doesn't need to be a reason. Sometimes two people just drift apart.
Here's the thing. Buffy doesn't need nor want Riley to shoulder the burden. Buffy needs to be the strong one, that's how she gets through this, this is always how she does things and by now Riley should know that. Buffy is trying her hardest not to fall apart, while Riley comes in saying it's ok to fall apart. It's exactly what she doesn't need to hear right now, it's like someone is running a marathon and their spouse is constantly telling them how it's ok to give up and not finish when they really need to hear that they can do this. It feels like he wants credit for doing things nobody asked or wanted and he's pissed that nobody is acknowledging the things he does. It is about him and it's probably because he already feels that they are drifting apart, or at least he is.
@@MarkusR144 Except it's definitely _not_ how Buffy has handled things. She has _always_ turned to people like Willow, Giles, Joyce and _especially Angel in times she needed emotional support. The one time she completely retreated - running away to LA - was the one time Angel was gone, presumably forever and in large part because of her; and Joyce told her to never come back. And running away was not how she dealt with her emotional pain; it was when she found the strength to come back. and she went straight to her mom.
Later, when Giles had a good idea that Buffy was bottling up her feelings by not talking about the full details of what happened with Angel and how he had gotten his soul back, Giles gave her to opportunity to open up to him; to potentially be vulnerable with _him. _ That was no different from what Riley was doing here. He wasn't yelling at her, "Cry for me! Now! Let me be a bring strong man for you!" He wanted to be her _partner. _
Riley was offering her emotional support, so that she didn't have to bottle everything up. Newsflash, trying to bottle up your emotions, especially in times of stress, is not healthy. To compare that to someone egging on a person to quit has to be the _dumbest_ possible idea. Allowing yourself to be upset over stressful circumstances, much less have someone willing to be there for you during those time, rather than go through it alone, is the furthest possible thing from "quitting;" and only a complete f-ing moron would think otherwise.
@@stargazer1682 I agree but ppl are right too that buffy tried to tell Riley several times that she isn't ready for a relationship and he called her stupid and pushed her into one. They both made mistakes.
@@CarrotFlowers421 See, I don't know about that. Yeah, he calls her stupid, which is taken literally and without context sounds derisive, but it's arguably the same as Willow telling Tara in "Family" "See, that's where you're a dummy..." for thinking Willow wouldn't like her if she knew she was part demon.
In both cases, the language is kind of indelicate, and not how I would want to word it, but the point for either Riley or Willow wasn't to hurt the other's feeling but a clumsy way of refuting idea the other had that was born out of insecurity. Riley wasn't bullying Buffy into a relationship anymore than Willow was. He might have been naive about the dangers for what they do, but he also wasn't strictly wrong in his general point that, just because Buffy had a bad relationship with someone who was apart of her Slayer world, she couldn't find someone that could actually be a partner with her. He was trying to combat Buffy's conclusion that being the Slayer meant having to be alone. Even if that person's not Riley either, the core concept still stands.
@@CarrotFlowers421 she was ready til she found out he was also a demon hunter.
You may want to set up Ep 15 and 16 as a dual episode on your channel
I think so many people hate Riley because he represents a feeling we all deny we've experienced because it's so humiliating and vulnerable. Being head over heels in love with someone whom you can feel is leaving you by inches is a soul crushing experience. If we've felt that, we will try to do anything to forget it.
I know..... I mean, people can feel when someone's not really in the relationship, you know. How can you not, its like talking to a wall. The feeling you get when you start to miss someone when they are right there in front of you, its so gut-wrenching. And none of this is meant to throw shade on either Buffy or Riley, just that its a bad relationship situation that they both just couldn't make work, I don't why the hell people try to blame either him or her. Relationships are not always right or wrong, they just are. In fact, very few things are truly wrong in any relationship, and those are along the lines of abuse.
I think what is incredible about S5 is even though this is a supernatural/fantasy show, the harsh realities of real life are always there, and are manifested in this Season especially. Joyce's illness is in the background at this point, and Buffy has to try and contend with this as well as trying to protect Dawn form Glory. The pressure on Buffy on a personal level is intense. The build up from here on in to the arc of the Season is exceptional. Amazing writing.
Ride it like a horsey? Girl, you naaasty.
Never did like Buffy she always the no man would ever be good for her
I blame Angel. If a 40 yr old man had bedded a girl one day over the age of 16, he would be deemed a monster by some people. In this series, a 200 yr old man did that and fans love him for it. If Buffy were a real person, she would need a lot of therapy to recover from that relationship. But because the show portrays it as a good and romantic one-true-love relationship she will never get the help she would need to have a normal and healthy adult life.
So I don't dislike Buffy's character. I like her and I feel awful for her, and I feel bad for any non-abusive man who comes close enough to care for her. I think the show is pretty honest in portraying her as an adult unable to form a healthy relationship with a man who doesn't cause her to suffer torment and pain. She went through a very traumatic thing at the hands of someone old enough to be her great great grandfather. She'll never feel for a "normal" person the emotional roller coaster she felt for the creature she consummated her love with at the vulnerable age of one day over 16. When Angel kissed her she wanted to die. That is an actual line that Buffy speaks in this show. That is what Buffy thinks love should feel like. Death. She's broken, ruined, and I think the series shows that quite well.
the fact that u used this scene in ur intro HOW DARE YOU
I need to be able to laugh at the pain otherwise i’d go insane
@@TheLexiCrowd Joyce is in a better place. (She moved to LA and reconciled with her husband.)
In a show full of metaphores, Buffy's feeling towards Riley are obvious...Nice guys finish last!
@Peter from NZ The dude has serious ptsd after what Doctor Walsh did to him. All he knows is the military. He may find something eventually.
All he seems to want right now is a reciprocal relationship...not sure Buffy is made for that.
you can see that buffy has a lot on her shoulders
:(
Poor Sandy, bitten and turned by displaced Vampire-Willow, dusted by stupid Riley and one with the more ugly vampirefaces, she was really a tragic girl.
Tara, for sure we need more of her 😍.
Buffy told Angel several times that she loves him (famous in S2 finale).
I think Riley and Graham would have been a cool duo to turn Supernatural into a Buffy spinoff instead of the brothers.
An eventual love story between Riley and Graham would have been everything.
@@RLucas3000 Nope, this was Forrest' job 🤣.
Riley gave up everything that makes himself at the end he made the right when army ask for back because there nothing for him there anymore with vampires show how toxic real ship was he needed a purpose he got with army at the end
The snake creature outfit did not seem convincing to me in certain scenes. In a couple of closeups, it was obviously a person in a suit. And in the closeup of Buffy punching the creature repeatedly, it looked to me like she was just punching a rubber dummy.
I assume that she was only hitting it with her right fist, because her left arm was still sore from the fight with Glory (thus the scene with the ice pack).
"She's going to be okay."
I like Ben better than Riley too, but then I like dog poo better than Riley.
The problem with the Buffy-Riley relationship is that she shuts him off.
Simple question: What would you do if you have a boyfriend and then your mother has to go to the hospital? Would you give him a call to get support or would you shut him off like Buffy did? Not to mention that Buffy told everyone but Riley about the problem - even Spike. That's just messed up.
20:52 "Buffy is going through a lot". That's exactly the point. That's when you rely on your partner to help you and give you the strength to see it through. What people do not do in such situations is letting your partner in the dark and completely forget them and cut them off. But that's exactly what Buffy does and that is 100 % failsafe proof that she does indeed not love him.
21:08 Are you serious? You would treat your boyfriend like that? This is nothing but a huge red flag for Riley that Buffy is indeed not loving him.
She should have taken him with her into the room which is exactly what people do in such situations because in a serious relationship the partner is indeed family!
You completely misunderstand what's going on here. It's not that Riley wants Buffy do focus on him instead of her mom, it's about him wanting to support and help her deal with the situation.
"Not everything is about him" Seriously - it's like you didn't even watch the episode - or is there any specific reason why you misinterpret the situation that badly?
1) People need to be in the right frame of mind to talk about their problems or be vulnerable with other people. If Buffy's not in the mood to let Riley comfort her, she's not in the mood. That's not a failing on her part, it's an entirely natural potential outcome of learning that her mother has a brain tumour. I have been in situations where I have intentionally not confided in people who I know for a fact I can trust because I knew I wouldn't feel up to it at the time. I didn't want to talk about it, or I couldn't talk about it. It happens. Also, Buffy did *not* tell everyone except Riley. Spike found out because he happened to be there when Buffy was crying about her mother's impending hospitalisation. Riley knew before any of the other Scoobies, save Spike.
2) Everyone deals with trauma differently. while there are certainly unhealthy ways to react to trauma, there is no one, singular, objectively correct way to respond. The answer to "what do you do if your mother goes into hospital" doesn't *have* to be "call your boyfriend for support." People are not "wrong" if they choose to act differently in that situation, and, honestly, how someone behaves in the midst of an emotional crisis is not a good litmus test for how much they love you.
3) Buffy does tell Riley what she needs. "Not right now. I need space. Comfort me *later."* He's still sad. He's not sad because he thinks she's making a mistake, it's because he's insecure about how much she loves him. Buffy has said what she needs, and she can't adjust what she wants or needs in this moment just because Riley wants her to need something else right now.
Also she refuses to cry with Riley here, but she cries on the steps with Spike one episode ago.
@@Talisguy To your point 1: She told everyone but Riley what was going on - Giles, Willow, Xander, Anya and Tera. Even Spike for god's sake!
If she would not have been in the mood to speak about the problem she would not have told anyone about it. However she told absolutely everybod except her boyfriend.
Sorry to say that but your first point doesn't make any sense whatsoever and you're wrong on that one, plain and simple.
Granted - people deal differently with trauma. However Buffy did call a lot of people... back at point 1 so again - no, you're wrong.
Point 3 - partly true. And exactly the point that proves that she doesn't love Riley. I stand by what I said: In such situations you want your partner at your side, simple as that. And no, people do not react that differently, this is what the overwhelmingly vast majority of people does. What you describe - people shutting their partners off while including even mortal enemies - is done by maybe one in a billion people. This is a massive red flag. And its also not what she needs by the way, she needs all support she can get right now, and pushing people away that she claims she loves (but clearly does not) is the exact opposite of what she needs and also the exact opposite of what people do in such situations.
@@Talisguy "Spike found out because he happened to be there when Buffy was crying about her mother's impending hospitalisation. " And Spike is telepathic?
Or maybe Riley shouldn't place unfair, unrealistic expectations on Buffy and then get upset when she doesn't act exactly how he wants. The only reason Riley was in the dark was because he was somewhere else. This was before everyone had cell phones, and Buffy hadn't spoken with him since the previous morning. Riley went patrolling and presumably slept in his own bed, and in the morning, the Summerses went to the hospital before he woke up or had his coffee or whatever. Buffy can only feel what she feels. Why does Riley get to resent her for that?
Yeah, Reilly iis boring and generally horrible. And this season gets really good, i promis.
I really dislike Riley here, he is so insensitive, he's been insensitive since episode 2-3
How so?