No, the M&M's box goes in the hole in front of the trigger guard... Politicians are jealous of the armed civilian having the ability to carry more candy-coated chocolate treats than they can.
Dear Lan. I Chinere， GUN lover，now live in japan, I have many Chinese friends like shooting and guns. They live in Canada and the United States.I often go to them to experience shooting. Although my English is super poor, I can only speak Chinese and Japanese, and a little Russian. Your explanation and introduction are very interesting and objective without any prejudice or other negative things. China have many interesting weapons，Firearms are an interesting things，Now is a peaceful era, and firearms can also be a fine piece of industrial art..For various reasons, many interesting Chinese guns are unknown. LanI would be very grateful if you could continue to introduce some unknown weapons from China and other Asian countries, because everything about guns is interesting, interesting and artistic except killing people. Your program gives me great pleasure. Thank you 谢谢
In Canada we only have the rifle length version right now, both fixed stock and folding. No LMG models to my knowledge. It retails about $1k CAD. All the guns are newly manufactured overruns for (if I remember correctly) Bangladesh, no milsurps whatsoever. Apparently there will only be two more shipments to Canada for the foreseeable future according to the importer so they will be $~2k guns in 10 years.
i dont think so cos it makes no business sense to have them sitting around for months and taking up warehouse space. btw. its not Bangladesh cos they produce their own.
@@gnutzguy I am a member of the Canadian gun forums and people who have bought rifles from the later shipments have gotten rifles with the same 2017 production dates that the first shipment had. Believe it or not, this is what happened. The importer had to wait about 4 years to get the guns actually produced in the first place, since the Canadian market is so small the Chinese factories would not have tooled up to produce such a small order (less than 5000) unless they were already making a large amount of Type 81 rifles for a military order. There was huge backlash and many people were angry and cancelling their pre orders because it was thought they would never come. The second and third shipments came as a surprise as it was initially advertised that only 1000 rifles were coming and this would be a once in a lifetime opportunity. There was some backlash over this as well. The importer likely knew they wouldn't get another chance to get Type 81's made for a long time (until another military order comes in) so made as many as they could afford when the factory was working and are now drip feeding them into the country.
yes, the importer is a master of promotion of their product, thats why i take everything they say with a grain of salt. this is my understanding, the first production-first shipment was produced in early 2017, then production switched for someone else and resumed for us in late 2017 which appeared in 2018 as our first production-second shipment. the shipment arriving next month should be marked 2018, if 2017 then you would be right.
Please do a series on small arms development during active conflict covering the broader picture of the conflict too. You're a great orator and easy to learn from.
Ian your videos are so amazing man! ive shared them with a lot of friends, its so cool to see not only some very rare guns but someone who knows the history of how they were made. Love it man.
When I heard we were getting Type-81s in Canada I'd hoped we might get some of these LMGs too, the sight radius on the rifles is pretty short since the front sight is right in front of the gas block rather than at the muzzle. Didn't stop me from buying a rifle though, it's a comfortable and shoots pretty well, and I get a lot of comments about it at the range :)
these go for like 900 dollars Canadian. yet we aren't allowed any kind of AK patern rifle except the very few valmets that were imported before the import ban. they go for $12,000 plus
It’s speculated the reason this rifle is not more popular on the international market is because it looked too similar to an AK and thus there was a lack of awareness of it’s existence. This was due to the Chinese army stipulating an AK like furniture over the designer’s objections. In addition to a higher accuracy requirement, the rifle was also designed to last longer in service with significantly higher round count. These requirements made the rifle twice as expensive as the AK, which is another reason it didn’t sell that well.
when I was a kid going to gun shows I remember the days of Chinese AK or sks and a plethora of cool looking albeit not so practical firearms lined the tables for cheap prices. I'd also go as far to say popularity of those types rivaled todays popularity of "black rifles" even pre internet.
Great video. I'd like to leave some constructive feedback. I really wish you'd pointed out what exactly makes this more accurate than an AK. Design features, tolerances etc.
Starting at 0:24 I believe that is a man very violently and repeatedly clearing his nose for the following minute. You can see Ian's face change when it happens and keeps happening...
@@endjfcar not really, battle rifles weren't really new at the time but the main thing is that submachine guns are automatic carbines using pistol cartridges. Not intermediate nor full power cartridges.
Hey Ian. I have the regular "rifle" model of the Type 81. It's the closest thing we can get to an AK47 pattern rifle here in Canada anymore. I used to say that about my CZ 858 tactical 2 but I think the 81 looks even closer. You can get AK47 mags to work in the Type 81 if you notch out the top back of the mag and file down the front top. There is videos on here that show how its done and I have done it and it works. Only thing is the bolt hold open does not engage when empty if you have an AK mag in an 81 but that's not that big of a deal. Thank you for all the great videos and this one for sure. Keep up the good work and cheers from Canada.
Jim Squire agreed, this is probably the closest to a Kalashnikov variant we can have, other than the extremely rare and costly Valmets kicking around in 30-06, 308, 223, and one or two in x39. That said, I think I prefer the VZ58 as a comblock gat over the Norinco
Fun fact, despite all type 81 rifles have rifle grenade capability, those grenades that are supposed to be used with the launcher were never really issued to the troops…………very very few people have actually seen one of those grenades in real life.
i have two rifles, one with a wood stock and other is a folder (check my vids) . i think the GL is a stupid idea, its like have a fixed bayonet, all that weight and its hardly used.
Don't understand why rifle grenades weren't used more often. A company size volley of rifle grenades would pretty well wipe out an opposing force in open country. Or easily take out a tank.
Have seen a Type 63 myself in China. That was summer 2015. It was during the mandatory military training post university admission. We were to be told how to aim and shoot a gun, so some was instructed by the drill instructor to fetch the rifle from the school's Department of People's Armed Forces. I was one of them. It was a small dark room, and these rifles were stacked against the wall, without magazine. Due to the wooden stock, the wooden handguard and the lack of magazine I thought these were Type 56 SKSes, but when I actually got one I noticed that there were places on the guns for magazines I realized these were the mythical Type 63s. These seemed relatively untouched, most even didn't have the folded spike bayonet sharpened. Shame I hadn't much knowledge about that back then, and the time we were allowed to touch these guns were short anyway. We didn't get to shoot these. We were told that on the range we would shoot QBZ-95s, but at the range (it was a base stationed with People's Armed Police) we were again told that due to the amount of stockpiled 7.62*39 ammo and that they were about to surplus some Type 56 SKSes, they arranged us to shoot these instead. 5 round a person, and everyone got to shoot it(again, it was mandatory). This is one of the rare occasion to actually legally shoot guns as a civilian in mainland China. Also got the chance to field strip a Type 81 assault rifle during the mandatory military training post high school admission. It was 2012 so I can't remember that much, but after watching this video it kinda reminds me all these stuff.
The Norinco has a shooting range that is commercially open to the civilian public in Beijing. It's just ridiculously expensive. You can be easily charged more than 1000 yuan(~$200) for just shooting a few guns for a few rounds.
The 80's were awesome in SoCal. Lots of firearm industry/importers at the time in Arcadia, Irwindale, Monrovia, El Monte, Chino, and Ontario to mention a few.
My guess would be no. I can't speak for Soviet arms, but generally "package" is a bit of a euphemism. It's more than just a stack of documents or a parcel. When my company wants to introduce a new product to a contract manufacturer, we will among other things send engineers to provide instruction and supervision. I would imagine that for something like guns you very well might send tooling as well, because even with very good drawings, starting from absolute scratch is nearly as much work as a new design would be. Once the line is up and running you can more easily replicate tooling as it wears out. But if all you send is drawings of the parts and drawings of the tooling to make the parts... They may not have to figure out processes for making the parts, but instead they have to figure out processes for making the tooling. It's sort of like explaining creation of the universe using "God": you still have to explain the creation of God, so ultimately you're left with the same complexity of bootstrapping. But if I'm wrong it would be cool to see.
@@cooliobob1274 It does though. The "technical data package" for a gun is not just a set of dimensions and machinist drawings. It's everything you need to know to start production. A monkey with a set of calipers can take a rifle and give you dimensional drawings. The TDP would include what order to make the cuts in, which tools (1/4" ball nose end mill vs 2" shell mill etc) you need for each machining operation, how to hold the part in the machine so you can get at all the parts you need to cut, how to make the jigs and clamps used in those work holdings, what grades of steel to use, what heat treatment each part requires, tolerances for each part so they run smoothly..... It's an enormous amount non-gun information that goes into making a gun. It's not just the blueprints, it's all the knowledge that it takes to use them effectively.
This rifle, or it’s brother, has been making the rounds, each time increasing considerably in price. First time I saw it pop up was in a MG forum for sale for something like $1000 in the early 2000s and it has been regularly appearing since, adding a few K to the price 🤣
@WrathMachine yeah, but it is a weapon platrofm above all and we don't have many of those. Alas, I guess we have to wait until Gun Jesus blesses us with his visit to the Motherland
Accordingly to my research, there are 4 of these type 81 LMG’s in the US, 2 in the 7.62x39 and 2 in the 556. They were imported for ATF importation evaluation. I recently acquired the other one in 7.62 from Larry Vickers.
Most wars in East Asia were/are fought from fortified positions with few entry points, effectively creating bottlenecks for any opposing force. These would definitely shine in those situations.
I think this is designed as a SAW, which means the one using this, rather than picking off targets, are meant to suppress enemy position and cover your squad. Since you're suppressing a general position/ direction, you don't need a complicated bipod for the fancy stuff, you just need it for the stabilization. Also maybe consider the fact that this weapon is meant to arm an army of several millions in a dire situation of the need to replace outdated weapons. I guess a cent saved is a cent saved, as long as the work is done.
Great video Ian! I found it after publishing my Type 81 review, which is unfortunate because it would have benefited from what I learned from yours. You do great research. All the Type 81 rifles here in Canada (and I believe the SMGs as well) are made by PolyTech, whose history I discussed in my video. I didn't know that Norinco made any of these. Here's my review in case you're interested: th-cam.com/video/A1hhs7y96hA/w-d-xo.html
To be fair, relatively little of this is actually "new". It looks very like it was designed with existing tooling in mind, while moving to a more practical operating method for the gun itself. For a company reliant on the sort of turnover rates that were required by the party (5.45 had been in development for a while in Russia as opposed to the quick Chinese decision to improve half their small arms arsenal) and with limited manufacturing quality options, this is a very ingenious and effective solution to their problem.
It's not that they "had to" but because they didn't want to be seen as a Soviet client. China wanted their own tanks and aircraft too, but rifles were much easier
After the Vietnam War, China wanted to develop a new rifle that has the reliability of the AK-47 but with the accuracy and range of the M-16. So type 81 is an attempt for China to make the Type 56 (an AK-47 variant) more like M-16, an accurate rifle with full automatic capability, not just a sub-machine gun.
@@LOLHAMMER45678 INSAS development is kinda like SA80's development but done a bit faster and cheaper which also led a similar performing rifle, in SA80 AR18 was the mother design whereas in INSAS it was mix of FNFAL, AK and G3 . Reportedly the INSAS family of rifles is to be replaced with AK203s soon because Indian armed forces were impressed with the performance of 7.62x39mm in urban anti insurgency ops .
Which shows that it is a good weapon, for one to be able to easily pull it apart and put it back together with no prior knowledge of what it looks like inside
That is a Chinese style handguard, because China doesn't hold much walnut tree or other traditional gun wood, so sometimes they have to use some wood with extreme light color
That was the last Chinese rifle with Soviet blood lineage. Type-97 family that became standard has smaller caliber, black polymer material, modular design, detachable grenade launcher ... more of Eugene Stoner's M-16, AR-15 design concepts.
Type 81s were never officially adopted or trialed by Burma (Myanmar) army but they did reach to the hands of ethnic rebel groups close to China. In fact some of the ethnic rebel groups (such as KIA, NDAK, WA etc.) do have small arms factories and they produce their own version of the Type 81 themselves (some of those Type 81s even reach to ethnic rebles in India as well).
I know someone who was a PLA soldier in late 60s to early 70s guarding the Sino-Indian border. He never used an SKS and they all carried AKs. It seems that the PLA also ditched SKS from frontline use in that period.
In sino-vietnam war, only previous batches of PLA troops are using SKS rifle as service weapon. The main force use Type56 AK replace the mostly Type56 SKS rifle before they enter vietnam.
Lol I got the exact rifle mine the pistol grip and handguard screw got loose through me shooting it a lot😅 oh and the gaz block take down knob flew off my rifle too I’d recommend anybody who wants to shoot this rifle a lot should loctite down these screws and knob
@@natenizz8930 our gun laws might suck, but atleast our country isn't run by a veteran-hating draft dodger who thinks stealth aircraft are invisible to the naked eye, and that the M4 sherman is still in service :P
Ian, is the man! I would love to meet this guy and talk firearms all day. He could point out all the junk I thought were treasures in my safes. Love the videos and the knowledge this guy has.
It's very interesting that in October 2000 there was a red dot sight applicated for this gun, to be installed on the rear of it's receiver's cover some how.But few people had actually seen that sight.
Here in Canada the type 81 is non-restricted.. meaning you don't have to register it so the government doesn't know you have one or if you have 10. Same deal with the Type 97 bullpup in 5.56. however a civilian version of the AK is PROHIBITED. Canadian gun laws are something. Center fire semi auto rifles are only allowed a capacity of 5 rounds. So many magazines have a 2 cent rivet in them to block them off so only 5 fit. Like I said. Canadian firearm laws are something.
Ian looks like you should come to Canada again to review the type 81 they are unrestricted here and you should have no problem finding a shop to let you review it. You can also get your Tim Hortons fix at the same time
Like Ian said, if you don't have a cartridge to adjust the gas you really have no reason to adjust it anyway, but it looks like the broken cartridge extractor in the cleaning tool kit can be used for that function as well.
Thanks for the video Ian. And there are sevral chinese light weapons shootable in the Chinanorth International Shooting Range like type 95-1 with 5.8mm cartridge. They serve both chinese and foreigns, so would there be a choise for you?
That was rejected by the Russian military. They didn't like the idea of a big open hole to the chamber right in the moment when a soldier rolling in a mud/sand/snow searching for a new mag. The problem could be partly solved by adding an ejection port cover but they don't like added complexity either. For a civilian market it's non a problem at all, but a standard mag has no specific follower feature.
I know the one your talking about I had one the rare sks paratrooper. I converted mine to full auto and modified stock so it would except drum mags also. Too bad the ATF got mine. It's actually on my TH-cam video. Search (Me before I was busted by the ATF)
WhiskeyWhiskers but if it can only get 50% into that grouping, then that wouldn’t really be correct either. Without knowing how far off the mark is the remaining 50% would be, it can’t be said that this a 1.54 moa rifle. It would necessarily have to be worse than that, but difficult to say how much worse.
An elegant solution to the ak safety hole. Must be significantly better for mud. If only they would shift the grip forward, maybe make the stock higher.
Shout out to all the fellow Canadians who are watching this after they just bought new production Type 81 LMG's today.
Lol just bought one
I can’t wait till mine shows up!!
Ha good call. That's exactly why im here.
hoping to get one in the next shipment
Just got mine. Very heavy for a 5-shot rifle but it's certainly of machine gun stature.
Buttstock compartments? That's a funny way of saying the M&M's box.
No, the M&M's box goes in the hole in front of the trigger guard... Politicians are jealous of the armed civilian having the ability to carry more candy-coated chocolate treats than they can.
How else would you get snacks into the cinema?
How to find a guy who isnt from the U.S. step1: what does he call movie theaters?
A) the movies
B) the cinema
A-merican
B-ritish
It’s called the crayon compartment in a marines’ M16
Do you mean knock-off chocolate beans?
Amazingly simple, clean, beaultiful and functional design.
Dear Lan.
I Chinere， GUN lover，now live in japan,
I have many Chinese friends like shooting and guns. They live in Canada and the United States.I often go to them to experience shooting.
Although my English is super poor, I can only speak Chinese and Japanese, and a little Russian.
Your explanation and introduction are very interesting and objective without any prejudice or other negative things.
China have many interesting weapons，Firearms are an interesting things，Now is a peaceful era, and firearms can also be a fine piece of industrial art..For various reasons, many interesting Chinese guns are unknown.
LanI would be very grateful if you could continue to introduce some unknown weapons from China and other Asian countries, because everything about guns is interesting, interesting and artistic except killing people.
Your program gives me great pleasure.
Thank you 谢谢
Your English is great!
I heard Hong Kong is a great vacation spot right now with this era of peace. lol
@@KC-bg1th lol the us is super safe ;););););)
Dude, you seen those videos of your countrymen firing cool weapons in a shooting range on Guam?
Soviet plagiarism of counterfeit Chinese guns
Canada now has the LMG version just came out today, just like this one!
All ready sold out, i tried to buy one
In Canada we only have the rifle length version right now, both fixed stock and folding. No LMG models to my knowledge. It retails about $1k CAD. All the guns are newly manufactured overruns for (if I remember correctly) Bangladesh, no milsurps whatsoever. Apparently there will only be two more shipments to Canada for the foreseeable future according to the importer so they will be $~2k guns in 10 years.
but why would they stop production after two more shipments?
@@gnutzguy They made them all at once, and only ship about 500 to a thousand at a time to create artificial scarcity.
i dont think so cos it makes no business sense to have them sitting around for months and taking up warehouse space. btw. its not Bangladesh cos they produce their own.
@@gnutzguy I am a member of the Canadian gun forums and people who have bought rifles from the later shipments have gotten rifles with the same 2017 production dates that the first shipment had. Believe it or not, this is what happened. The importer had to wait about 4 years to get the guns actually produced in the first place, since the Canadian market is so small the Chinese factories would not have tooled up to produce such a small order (less than 5000) unless they were already making a large amount of Type 81 rifles for a military order.
There was huge backlash and many people were angry and cancelling their pre orders because it was thought they would never come. The second and third shipments came as a surprise as it was initially advertised that only 1000 rifles were coming and this would be a once in a lifetime opportunity. There was some backlash over this as well. The importer likely knew they wouldn't get another chance to get Type 81's made for a long time (until another military order comes in) so made as many as they could afford when the factory was working and are now drip feeding them into the country.
yes, the importer is a master of promotion of their product, thats why i take everything they say with a grain of salt. this is my understanding, the first production-first shipment was produced in early 2017, then production switched for someone else and resumed for us in late 2017 which appeared in 2018 as our first production-second shipment. the shipment arriving next month should be marked 2018, if 2017 then you would be right.
Please do a series on small arms development during active conflict covering the broader picture of the conflict too. You're a great orator and easy to learn from.
Ian your videos are so amazing man! ive shared them with a lot of friends, its so cool to see not only some very rare guns but someone who knows the history of how they were made. Love it man.
The Chinese ban / 68 GCA and 89 Import ban are stupid. Id love to see more of these in the states
When I heard we were getting Type-81s in Canada I'd hoped we might get some of these LMGs too, the sight radius on the rifles is pretty short since the front sight is right in front of the gas block rather than at the muzzle. Didn't stop me from buying a rifle though, it's a comfortable and shoots pretty well, and I get a lot of comments about it at the range :)
It's actually a pretty nice rifle
Civilian lmg
Holy words right there.
We have to replace the AK !
How about with an AK ?
Brilliant !
these go for like 900 dollars Canadian. yet we aren't allowed any kind of AK patern rifle except the very few valmets that were imported before the import ban.
they go for $12,000 plus
Wolverine just imported valmet m88 for sale for C$3600
@@gnutzguy 3600 for an ak actioned 30-06 hunting rifle with a semi pistol grip.
mehh
an sks in a tapco stock is more of an ak than that thing
The type 81 is also produced in Bangladesh as the BD-08, in both rifle and LMG variant. And yes, I'm from Bangladesh....
Perfect combination of ak/vz 58/svd
always nice to see Ian taking a look at non American or German weapons
Civilian form huh ...
I like it.
Very Cool Norinco model 313
Thank you ,Ian .
It’s speculated the reason this rifle is not more popular on the international market is because it looked too similar to an AK and thus there was a lack of awareness of it’s existence. This was due to the Chinese army stipulating an AK like furniture over the designer’s objections.
In addition to a higher accuracy requirement, the rifle was also designed to last longer in service with significantly higher round count. These requirements made the rifle twice as expensive as the AK, which is another reason it didn’t sell that well.
when I was a kid going to gun shows I remember the days of Chinese AK or sks and a plethora of cool looking albeit not so practical firearms lined the tables for cheap prices. I'd also go as far to say popularity of those types rivaled todays popularity of "black rifles" even pre internet.
Great video. I'd like to leave some constructive feedback. I really wish you'd pointed out what exactly makes this more accurate than an AK. Design features, tolerances etc.
It's short stroke system with gas regulator. AK delivers too much energy into shooter
Hi Ian, I’m Canadian. We’re not allowed AKs in Canada, however we are allowed the type 81. Our laws make no sense. It’s the “AK” of Canada. Cheers.!
They banned the AR15 which is even more retarded
Fuck!!! How the hell you got that badass. Still available in the market? 😂😂😂
You can about smell this video. Something about this era of Norinco guns smells like that weird wood varnish once it gets hot and burned powder.
A semi-auto LMG. What a concept.
AKA the Canadian AK
Starting at 0:24 I believe that is a man very violently and repeatedly clearing his nose for the following minute. You can see Ian's face change when it happens and keeps happening...
I want one of these
Just bought one for 1500 bucks here in canada lol theyre everywhere here
Yep even my local shops have them with plenty to go around. That delivery from the factory must have been a big one.
Very cool rifle. Probably much better than the AK. Too bad it's unobtanium
has anyone done an accuracy test with this?
No fire testing and the impression of how good/bad of the rifle?
One day, I wish I can see the Schiessbecher in action...
Screw that I want full auto
This pisses me off that in the "land of the free" we dont have a miriad of these guns in the US
That is a head scratcher.
Thank Clinton
And still I can't uderstand dat logic, when assault rifle called SMG or automatic ( full auto, not self loading) rifle called machinegun
That's what happens when an authoritarian government is in place.
@@Isaac-ho8gh That's really irrelevant to be honest. It was the early ages of "assualt rifle". Even battle rifles were new back then as well...
@@endjfcar not really, battle rifles weren't really new at the time but the main thing is that submachine guns are automatic carbines using pistol cartridges. Not intermediate nor full power cartridges.
@@Isaac-ho8gh screw you i love our government, although they fuck us a lot
@@Isaac-ho8gh the Russians still call the AK a submachine gun, it was basically designed to have longer range than pistol ammo.
Hey Ian. I have the regular "rifle" model of the Type 81. It's the closest thing we can get to an AK47 pattern rifle here in Canada anymore. I used to say that about my CZ 858 tactical 2 but I think the 81 looks even closer. You can get AK47 mags to work in the Type 81 if you notch out the top back of the mag and file down the front top. There is videos on here that show how its done and I have done it and it works. Only thing is the bolt hold open does not engage when empty if you have an AK mag in an 81 but that's not that big of a deal. Thank you for all the great videos and this one for sure. Keep up the good work and cheers from Canada.
Jim Squire agreed, this is probably the closest to a Kalashnikov variant we can have, other than the extremely rare and costly Valmets kicking around in 30-06, 308, 223, and one or two in x39. That said, I think I prefer the VZ58 as a comblock gat over the Norinco
@@bilodeaumichael3 Wolverine has some Valmets in 308 and 30-06 in stock and the prices aren't bad.
Make one wonder why they only target ARs and AKs when you can get a slew of other firearms that accomplish the same task.
@@cooliobob1274 because evil guns >:(
@@ExplosiveFetus I thought Valmets were prohib? Or are you guys the ultimate of licensed owners?
Fun fact, despite all type 81 rifles have rifle grenade capability, those grenades that are supposed to be used with the launcher were never really issued to the troops…………very very few people have actually seen one of those grenades in real life.
Pretty much same thing happened with Finnish RK95 rifle.
Why? Sounds like a good video topic hehe.
Cool fact, thank you
i have two rifles, one with a wood stock and other is a folder (check my vids) .
i think the GL is a stupid idea, its like have a fixed bayonet, all that weight and its hardly used.
Don't understand why rifle grenades weren't used more often. A company size volley of rifle grenades would pretty well wipe out an opposing force in open country. Or easily take out a tank.
Have seen a Type 63 myself in China.
That was summer 2015. It was during the mandatory military training post university admission. We were to be told how to aim and shoot a gun, so some was instructed by the drill instructor to fetch the rifle from the school's Department of People's Armed Forces. I was one of them. It was a small dark room, and these rifles were stacked against the wall, without magazine. Due to the wooden stock, the wooden handguard and the lack of magazine I thought these were Type 56 SKSes, but when I actually got one I noticed that there were places on the guns for magazines I realized these were the mythical Type 63s. These seemed relatively untouched, most even didn't have the folded spike bayonet sharpened. Shame I hadn't much knowledge about that back then, and the time we were allowed to touch these guns were short anyway.
We didn't get to shoot these. We were told that on the range we would shoot QBZ-95s, but at the range (it was a base stationed with People's Armed Police) we were again told that due to the amount of stockpiled 7.62*39 ammo and that they were about to surplus some Type 56 SKSes, they arranged us to shoot these instead. 5 round a person, and everyone got to shoot it(again, it was mandatory). This is one of the rare occasion to actually legally shoot guns as a civilian in mainland China.
Also got the chance to field strip a Type 81 assault rifle during the mandatory military training post high school admission. It was 2012 so I can't remember that much, but after watching this video it kinda reminds me all these stuff.
i saw alot of type 63 in vietnam.
We didn’t get to use type 81s during my training, so I ended up buying a semi type 81 here in Canada.
sounds much like SEU
@@朱语杰 Nah, Zhejiang University when the Type 63 experience took place.
The Norinco has a shooting range that is commercially open to the civilian public in Beijing. It's just ridiculously expensive. You can be easily charged more than 1000 yuan(~$200) for just shooting a few guns for a few rounds.
I just want to thank the old Cali triad in the 80’s for bringing weapons from home to our shores. May your ancestors and decedents smile upon you.
The 80's were awesome in SoCal. Lots of firearm industry/importers at the time in Arcadia, Irwindale, Monrovia, El Monte, Chino, and Ontario to mention a few.
What's funny is when Reagan was governor of California he actually tightened gun laws.
@@dylanhaugen3739 he did the exact same thing as president.
@@dylanhaugen3739 why is that funny reagan is why you cant buy full autos anymore
@@dylanhaugen3739 It's not funny at all... Reagan is known for passing gun laws. He gave us that little gem called the Hughes amendment...
Thanks again Ian for covering Chinese weapons, is there any chance you could get your hands on a technical package just to show what you get etc.
l'm have a Chinese small arms film,here:th-cam.com/video/Rq04WDdi3Mo/w-d-xo.html
My guess would be no. I can't speak for Soviet arms, but generally "package" is a bit of a euphemism. It's more than just a stack of documents or a parcel. When my company wants to introduce a new product to a contract manufacturer, we will among other things send engineers to provide instruction and supervision. I would imagine that for something like guns you very well might send tooling as well, because even with very good drawings, starting from absolute scratch is nearly as much work as a new design would be. Once the line is up and running you can more easily replicate tooling as it wears out. But if all you send is drawings of the parts and drawings of the tooling to make the parts... They may not have to figure out processes for making the parts, but instead they have to figure out processes for making the tooling. It's sort of like explaining creation of the universe using "God": you still have to explain the creation of God, so ultimately you're left with the same complexity of bootstrapping.
But if I'm wrong it would be cool to see.
@@marshaul
Way to bring a topic that has nothing to do with firearms into the discussion.
@@cooliobob1274 its called an analogy, and it helps illustrate points. But get angry cause "muh gawd" was questioned
@@cooliobob1274 It does though. The "technical data package" for a gun is not just a set of dimensions and machinist drawings. It's everything you need to know to start production. A monkey with a set of calipers can take a rifle and give you dimensional drawings. The TDP would include what order to make the cuts in, which tools (1/4" ball nose end mill vs 2" shell mill etc) you need for each machining operation, how to hold the part in the machine so you can get at all the parts you need to cut, how to make the jigs and clamps used in those work holdings, what grades of steel to use, what heat treatment each part requires, tolerances for each part so they run smoothly.....
It's an enormous amount non-gun information that goes into making a gun. It's not just the blueprints, it's all the knowledge that it takes to use them effectively.
That looks so old school Chinese.
KURTONOIRTECH9 Anything from an ak
It’s so...ugly
Treiber04 I agree
@@Fofiddly
I love it, it just looks like a stretched ak
@@Fofiddly i feel its fine, just looks like a larger AK.
A low poly rpk
Luis Santiago but did you forgot about Dre?
@@luissantiago5163 Chinese RPD is the type 56 LMG
This rifle, or it’s brother, has been making the rounds, each time increasing considerably in price. First time I saw it pop up was in a MG forum for sale for something like $1000 in the early 2000s and it has been regularly appearing since, adding a few K to the price 🤣
The "broken cartridge extractor" in the tool kit was notched to serve as a tool to adjust the gas system. Neat.
The broken cartridge extractor looks like a broken cartridge.
Look up all the uses of the AKM tool kit. It's pretty incredible.
I like to watch your videos to calm down. You're like Bob Ross, just with weapons.
me too
Word never thought of it that way, but you a right he is the Bob Ross of guns.
Happy little bipods.
Ian! Do you plan to take a closer look at the Groza? It's a really interesting weapon platform.
Given that it's only used by the Spetsnaz, it's unlikely any examples exist outside of Russia.
If he can find one I bet he'd love to do a video on it
@WrathMachine yeah, but it is a weapon platrofm above all and we don't have many of those. Alas, I guess we have to wait until Gun Jesus blesses us with his visit to the Motherland
I just hope that some day larry vickers takes ian for a trip to kalashnikov concern to do videos on guns like this one. (Also ak107 and whatnot.)
@@anzaca1 even the VSS now has a civilian version (simi auto only) being sold in Russia right now, shouldn't be too hard to find a groza
Accordingly to my research, there are 4 of these type 81 LMG’s in the US, 2 in the 7.62x39 and 2 in the 556. They were imported for ATF importation evaluation. I recently acquired the other one in 7.62 from Larry Vickers.
Isn't it a bad idea to make bypod fixed on horizontal axis? Makes switching targets really inconvenient, doesn't it?
Most wars in East Asia were/are fought from fortified positions with few entry points, effectively creating bottlenecks for any opposing force. These would definitely shine in those situations.
@@arifhossain9751 Still, seems like a relatively simple feature to add.
Boomerisadog I’m guessing somewhat inconvenient target switching was worth it for the bipod stability to the designers
I think this is designed as a SAW, which means the one using this, rather than picking off targets, are meant to suppress enemy position and cover your squad. Since you're suppressing a general position/ direction, you don't need a complicated bipod for the fancy stuff, you just need it for the stabilization.
Also maybe consider the fact that this weapon is meant to arm an army of several millions in a dire situation of the need to replace outdated weapons. I guess a cent saved is a cent saved, as long as the work is done.
when my father was a soldier in 1980s he really like the type 81 family
Great video Ian! I found it after publishing my Type 81 review, which is unfortunate because it would have benefited from what I learned from yours. You do great research. All the Type 81 rifles here in Canada (and I believe the SMGs as well) are made by PolyTech, whose history I discussed in my video. I didn't know that Norinco made any of these. Here's my review in case you're interested: th-cam.com/video/A1hhs7y96hA/w-d-xo.html
They’re made by Norinco
Thank you gun Jesus for introducing more Chinese firearms.
Rock Island Estimate Price: $7,000 - $12,000
It will go for more.
It's not really a rip off its kind of a unicorn in the states, probably more common in Canada even
@WrathMachine is it the same as an ak?
Super common in Canada. You can pick up an excellent used gun for $700 or new for $1,000. So that would be $580-$800 US.
Me and my buddy laugh at the Chinese weapons now wish bought some
"simple" minute of angle measurement
There was Def an owner watching this who just now realized they had a cleaning kit in the stock
im pretty sure this is a common one today being used in middle east. 7.62x39, ak-sks combo.. what could go wrong
It isn't. The mag is different from a AK one, and short stroke piston do need some maintain
They showed up even at Balkan war in 90's and were liked for accuracy better than AK
It's interesting the Chinese had to design a new rifle where the Soviets accurized the AK with the 5.45 and the Finns with the RK62
To be fair, relatively little of this is actually "new". It looks very like it was designed with existing tooling in mind, while moving to a more practical operating method for the gun itself. For a company reliant on the sort of turnover rates that were required by the party (5.45 had been in development for a while in Russia as opposed to the quick Chinese decision to improve half their small arms arsenal) and with limited manufacturing quality options, this is a very ingenious and effective solution to their problem.
It's not that they "had to" but because they didn't want to be seen as a Soviet client. China wanted their own tanks and aircraft too, but rifles were much easier
After the Vietnam War, China wanted to develop a new rifle that has the reliability of the AK-47 but with the accuracy and range of the M-16. So type 81 is an attempt for China to make the Type 56 (an AK-47 variant) more like M-16, an accurate rifle with full automatic capability, not just a sub-machine gun.
As a college student I was able to tear it down and put it back in 1.5min with no guidance at all. Just all the FW I have seen is enough
@@LOLHAMMER45678 you mean the INSAS development .
@@LOLHAMMER45678 INSAS development is kinda like SA80's development but done a bit faster and cheaper which also led a similar performing rifle,
in SA80 AR18 was the mother design whereas in INSAS it was mix of FNFAL, AK and G3 .
Reportedly the INSAS family of rifles is to be replaced with AK203s soon because Indian armed forces were impressed with the performance of 7.62x39mm in urban anti insurgency ops .
1 min 5 seconds or one and a half minutes ?
@@RaferJeffersonIII one and a half
Which shows that it is a good weapon, for one to be able to easily pull it apart and put it back together with no prior knowledge of what it looks like inside
That wooden handguard is charmingly communistic.
That is a Chinese style handguard, because China doesn't hold much walnut tree or other traditional gun wood, so sometimes they have to use some wood with extreme light color
That was the last Chinese rifle with Soviet blood lineage. Type-97 family that became standard has smaller caliber, black polymer material, modular design, detachable grenade launcher ... more of Eugene Stoner's M-16, AR-15 design concepts.
Having a safety designed for right handed people, the short stroke piston and a last round bolt hold open makes this thing better than an AK on paper.
Type 81s were never officially adopted or trialed by Burma (Myanmar) army but they did reach to the hands of ethnic rebel groups close to China. In fact some of the ethnic rebel groups (such as KIA, NDAK, WA etc.) do have small arms factories and they produce their own version of the Type 81 themselves (some of those Type 81s even reach to ethnic rebles in India as well).
Hybrid AK, SKS, VZ58. I like how he didn't want to show us the rusty piston head. Funny.
Similar to the vz58 gas system. Cross of vz & sks trigger looked like.
Thank you Ian! Type 81 lmg landed last week here.(Tactical imports) $1499 cad so $1120 USD if you do the conversions.Greetings from Canada!
A few years ago I was at the Yellowstone shooting range here in Wisconsin and a guy had that exact gun plus a bunch of different firearms. Very cool
We can get this in Canada for $1500 now
Which is crazy as its 5x more Expensive in the US and Canada it's like one of the few guns we have more access to then the US
The way the rear sight can release the upper handguard was really neat and elegant.
Owning one, its kinda a stupid design... very stiff and hard on the hands. SKS style lever is way better
@@B52Stratofortress1 Once you break it in enough, it's really quite easy. Mine wasn't even that bad from the box.
I know someone who was a PLA soldier in late 60s to early 70s guarding the Sino-Indian border. He never used an SKS and they all carried AKs. It seems that the PLA also ditched SKS from frontline use in that period.
Those 75 round drum magazines are a pain to load.
Not reallly. Search for a video. Time consuming, but not hard.
The ChiCom drum isn't so bad. To me. And the ones I've owned worked well. They were made by Norinco.
Nope, easier to load than most drums.
This has just become available in Canada!
In sino-vietnam war, only previous batches of PLA troops are using SKS rifle as service weapon. The main force use Type56 AK replace the mostly Type56 SKS rifle before they enter vietnam.
北方工业产的复刻版，实际上生产质量比我们用过的军81要更好，我的81上机匣盖要用拳头敲才能卡到位~。其实81综合性能相当不错，控制性比56冲好太多了。可惜国家把他定位为过度枪，没有扩展接口，上机匣盖也不稳，无法使用磁吸套件装镜子，在当前算是废了。
Lol I got the exact rifle mine the pistol grip and handguard screw got loose through me shooting it a lot😅 oh and the gaz block take down knob flew off my rifle too I’d recommend anybody who wants to shoot this rifle a lot should loctite down these screws and knob
i've seen one of these here locally in canada, it had a 5-round mag with a big metal wedge in it so you couldn't feed anymore
That's because Canada sucks. Fuck Canada.
That sounds like Tecknoheresy.
Was that a drum?
@@blackbird8632 oh sorry, i should have specified, it was not! it was a banana style magazine
@@natenizz8930 our gun laws might suck, but atleast our country isn't run by a veteran-hating draft dodger who thinks stealth aircraft are invisible to the naked eye, and that the M4 sherman is still in service :P
Thanks to TI, $1499 in Canada now!
7:13 Looks a bit like a welrod magazine!
Ian, is the man! I would love to meet this guy and talk firearms all day. He could point out all the junk I thought were treasures in my safes. Love the videos and the knowledge this guy has.
Ian finally get his hands on one of these. First time I ever see a lmg version. Thank you for uploading Ian.
Should see what Canada’s been doing to this series of rifles lmao
It's very interesting that in October 2000 there was a red dot sight applicated for this gun, to be installed on the rear of it's receiver's cover some how.But few people had actually seen that sight.
I have a folding stock Type 81. It's a great rifle. Not as nice as the VZ-58 though.
Here in Canada the type 81 is non-restricted.. meaning you don't have to register it so the government doesn't know you have one or if you have 10. Same deal with the Type 97 bullpup in 5.56. however a civilian version of the AK is PROHIBITED.
Canadian gun laws are something. Center fire semi auto rifles are only allowed a capacity of 5 rounds. So many magazines have a 2 cent rivet in them to block them off so only 5 fit. Like I said. Canadian firearm laws are something.
That corn cob carry handle reminds me of the forend of an ithaca 37. Probably the most aesthetically pleasing aspect of the gun.
The original Type-81 had a wooden stock, just like this LMG. The ones had folding stocks were Type 81-1s, which were much more widely seen.
Didn't expect the sight adjustment knob to be a load-bearing part.
this rifle sold for 32K after this video was made.
Ian looks like you should come to Canada again to review the type 81 they are unrestricted here and you should have no problem finding a shop to let you review it. You can also get your Tim Hortons fix at the same time
Like Ian said, if you don't have a cartridge to adjust the gas you really have no reason to adjust it anyway, but it looks like the broken cartridge extractor in the cleaning tool kit can be used for that function as well.
Thanks for the video Ian.
And there are sevral chinese light weapons shootable in the Chinanorth International Shooting Range like type 95-1 with 5.8mm cartridge. They serve both chinese and foreigns, so would there be a choise for you?
Really Ian? You just couldn't help yourself from pulling the cleaning kit out right after telling us it probably hasn't ever been removed 😆👍
I wish regular Aks had a bolt hold open
That was rejected by the Russian military. They didn't like the idea of a big open hole to the chamber right in the moment when a soldier rolling in a mud/sand/snow searching for a new mag. The problem could be partly solved by adding an ejection port cover but they don't like added complexity either.
For a civilian market it's non a problem at all, but a standard mag has no specific follower feature.
Thanks for covering the Chinese weapons. If it’s possible would you like to review the new norinco assualt rifles? The NAR family. Thank you so much
Ian, would you ever do a video on the Norinco SKS?
in particular, the one with the thumb whole grip and uses AK 47 magazines
I know the one your talking about I had one the rare sks paratrooper. I converted mine to full auto and modified stock so it would except drum mags also. Too bad the ATF got mine. It's actually on my TH-cam video. Search (Me before I was busted by the ATF)
1.78 inches equates roughly to 45 millimetres so at 100 metres it would be approximately 4.5 minutes of angles requirement.
@@MollyGermek Just realised that, thanks for pointing that out.
Double check conversions before building space rockets.
WhiskeyWhiskers but if it can only get 50% into that grouping, then that wouldn’t really be correct either. Without knowing how far off the mark is the remaining 50% would be, it can’t be said that this a 1.54 moa rifle. It would necessarily have to be worse than that, but difficult to say how much worse.
Can anyone else hear someone breathing loudly throughout the video?
It's your wife dude shes behind you........shes pissed
TheFellaZone It’s all through the video, though you can hear it as Ian is talking at 7:55 ish mark.
Ed walmsley Ain’t married dude, and the booty call isn’t here yet hahah
Hence why I’m watching some Forgotten Weapons 👌🏼
An elegant solution to the ak safety hole. Must be significantly better for mud.
If only they would shift the grip forward, maybe make the stock higher.
It's more Wang (Zee)Zi (Joon)Jun, what you said sounded more like Wang Xizhen. :P
Still, better than most.