House of the Dragon ~ Lost in Adaptation
ฝัง
- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 20 ก.ย. 2024
- Visit www.audible.com... or text noble to 500-500. Let Audible help you discover new ways to laugh, be inspired, or be entertained. New members can try it free for 30 days.
Let's talk about the somewhat unique relationship between Fire and Blood by George RR Martin and the HBO adaptation House of the Dragon.
More Dom:
Patreon: / domsmith
Website: www.dominic-no...
Second channel: / @domnobletoo8238
Twitter: / dominic__noble
Instagram: / dominic__noble
Merch: www.teespring....
Editor: sophiakricci.com
Original music by Il Neige: / djilneige - บันเทิง
Respect to the writers for deciding that Alicent and Rhaenyra's dynamic was going to be 'never married but nonetheless having an incredibly messy divorce'
JAJAJAJA PERFECT DESCRIPTION
Daemon is definitely the troublemaking child in this and nobody can change my mind.
@@edoardoprevelato6577 why would we try to change your mind?
@@edoardoprevelato6577 Well no one can despute daemon had not had peak scolded boy vibes after Rhaenyra showed u on dragonstone to get the egg back ^^
“Rhaenyra, I want Kings Landing in my half of the divorce.”
“Alicent, we aren’t even married”
“Not anymore we aren’t”
"Not as good as early GoT, but much better than late GoT" bro that range is wider than the grand canyon
Roughly season 4/5 quality.
Season 4 and 5 Different in Quality is Galaxy level wide @@blizzardgaming7070
"stop flirting with your uncle at your wedding to your cousin"
There was a dwarf briefly seen at the wedding feast for Rhaenyra and Laenor that according to the writers was Mushroom, so I guess he can assume he is there but in the background. It does make sense that Mushroom would overinflate his importance in the story.
I hope they bump him up to co star in the next season
@@Cal6009 Top billing in season 2
@@HuxtableKfuck it, make the rest of the show just about the adventures of Mushroom
I have to say, as a woman who has had two very rough births, I quite like (or at least appreciate) the visceral birth scenes. We do not see how frankly horrific giving birth can be in media very often. And I think it actually does something to start to show people who do not give birth (or first time birth-givers) what people go through to bring babies into the world.
Basically, as hard as they are to watch.... I actually really like the birth scenes, including the Queen's death in episode one.
I 100% agree with. I understand people’s critique, but at the same time I really do think it was used well and was gruesome but in a way that made sense with the story/themes
Yes! I also feel it's a testament to R. R. Martin's historical knowledge because it happened all the time. It's only very recently that, at least, most of the developed world has got access to the combination of reliable contraception and clinical sanitation, so people were having children all the time, so it was almost inevitable that it would go wrong extremely often.
I liked them because they are realistic people view pregnancy, birth and child rearing as a trivial thing and it really isn't
I think childbirth definitely gets really sanitized in media as this painful, but still mostly joyous occasion where everything is very clean and easy to watch. In most births on tv you’ll see a slightly sweaty woman scream in pain for a few seconds and then she’ll be handed a magically cleaned baby straight out of the womb and everyone will smile and laugh as if a creature the size of a cantaloupe hadn’t just ripped it’s way out of her after hours of agony (and that’s if things go WELL). As awful as it is to watch scenes like Aemma’s, I can appreciate the novelty and honesty of it compared to literally every other birth I’ve seen on screen. It didn’t flinch away from the ugly parts and try to sugarcoat anything.
@@rasmusn.e.m1064 god the history of childbirth is so interesting. Not to say it has always been super safe but you can see a dramatical uptick in maternal mortality every time midwives and other women with expertise and experience are actively removed from their role and replaces with cis male doctors.
As sad as the scene was the look on Aemond’s face was very much “Crap, no one is going to buy that this was an accident”
I have to agree, excellent acting. I love it when non verbal acting "delivers the lines" perfectly, like here.
Completely different example, but in Mr. and Mrs. Smith, John (Brad Pitt) happily puts a bit of his dinner in his mouth, then realises it might be poisoned by his wife who is sitting there and watches him eat, and has to quickly think of a way to dispose of it in a way that doesn't raise her suspicion. No words, just bout 20 seconds of excellent acting that tells you everything.
I love it.
And no one did. History never cares lol.
I also think it genuinely terrified him how he lost control over Vhagar and ended up killing his Nephew because of it.
It shows that at the end of the day dragons are just animals, and while they can follow orders, if their angered, there’s nothing their supposed masters can do to stop their wraths.
The Targaryen relationship with dragons is like kids playing with a loaded gun, or more accurately, playing with fire.
@@seanmcloughlin5983 i think it also shows that the bond between dragon and rider is more primal and less controlled than expected. ie arrax senses lucerys' fear and responds by trying to defend them from vhagar. its not that human controls dragon or dragon controls human but instead they are bound together with no one fully in control
@@seanmcloughlin5983 oh I thought it was 100% intentional he killed luceryes
Rhaenyra & Daemon _absolutely_ enabled Laenor to run away to Essos. She outright says "the Sea provides esacpe" while talking about house Velaryon. Daemon responds to Rhaenyras marriage proposal to him & acknowledging Laenor needs to not be her husband anymore "if you love him let him be free". Daemon also straight up murders an unfortunate dude to provide the corpse stand in for Laenors "death".
I would say neglecting mentioning Helaena & Viserys are Dreamers in F&B is also a notable change.
To be fair, Dragon Dreams are magic and the Maesters frown upon that
"The sea is always right."😂
@@contextTBD And nobody actually listens to anything Helaena says, so her ability being overlooked by history seems inevitable
Who knows V is a dreamer besides Rhaenyra and maybe Daemon?
And nobody at this point knows H is a dreamer except us the audience.
@@ischeele7203
Helassandra.
I'd like to think that Aemond listens.
Honestly, I must commend Aemond for going back to King's Landing after that happened. I mean, where I in his place, and had a dragon under my command, I would just start flying east across the Narrow Sea, and don't stop until I saw Yi Ti on the horizon.
He would not abandon Helaena.
And of course he sees himself as "the dutiful son" in contrast to the ne'er-do-well Aegon.
@@alanpennie8013, Aemond does indeed care for Halaena. Ironically, his actions cause her irreparable grief and eventually, her life.
Yeah he went back to face the music. That was brave ain't gonna lie I'd have been far far away by the time the news reached my mother. He couldn't have known his brother would welcome the news of igniting a war with a celebration. I do think because Aegon had been sheltered his entire life he didn't truly understand how badly a war could hurt him and his. Like he knew about war but he didn't KNOW war. He probably thought they'll just crush their enemies in one swoop and everything will be alright. Aemond's 'easy victory' probably also lured him into a false sense of security. That or he thought his grandfather and mother will deal with his problems like they always did. Not making excuses for Aegon but up until this point there weren't many consequences for actions beyond a slap or two from his mother and a scolding. Also Rhaenyra had never actually attempted to hurt her brothers. Maybe he thought ruthlessness wasn't in her nature? Or maybe he just forgot about Daemon...
He loves his mum
@@livelovelife32 Daemon was the only one they feared. They presumed if they could kill Daemon Rhaenyra would bend the knee. They truly thought of her as just Daemon's whore wife. Til Daemon was dead and she was still going to war. Hell even after her death they where stunned that her side kept fighting. Aegon really did think himself beloved right up until the moment he died.
Another difference: in the show, Rhaenyra propose to marry Jacaerys to Helaena, in the book, it was Alicent proposed this, and Rhaenyra turned it down.
Another one: in the book Laena Velaryon was BFF with Rhaenyra, and Laena died on Driftmark, Rhaenyra even fly her own measter to Driftmark on dragon back when Leana was having problem with labor.
I like how each source seems like they describe an aspect of R.R. Martin's personality. Like he split himself into various authors and thought of how each one as a person would tell the same story differently.
Please, he's mostly Mushroom!
@@clownpendotfart I thought that Mushroom was a stand in for HBO execs or something like that😂
Every draft is canon while being lies
@@Daemonussy GRRM liked the SNL skit that had a boy played by Andy Samberg who helped GRRM on the show by adding more nudity. He criticized the South Park sketch which depicted him as fixated on weiners... because he says everybody knows he's actually obsessed with boobies.
@@Daemonussy 😂
Yeah, Viserys's health issues changing from "general fat issues and/or gout" to "westerosi-leprosy from the throne slowly eating him alive and giving him a Baldwin IV mask" was a much better story.
ive not watched or read this series, but "naming your daughter heir and accidently sparking a civil war" reminds me a lot of norman england's drama regarding stephen & empress maude. i wouldn't be surprised if GRRM was inspired by this bit of history, especially since (I believe) the OG series was partially inspired by the wars of the roses
You’re not wrong - GRRM has gone on record saying that the dance was inspired by the anarchy and you can see what the inspirations were for the various characters/events
Speaking of that conflict here's hoping Dom does Cadfael one day.
Great book series and decent series
Yes. A lot of things in both series are taken from history. Scottish, French, English etc, royalist history inspired a lot of stuff. Like Red Wedding is inspired by Scottish history.
There is a historial novel series based on certain time of French royalty. And GRRM does an introduction of the series and speaks on how this series influenced him.
@@sexydoorframes 'The Accursed Kings' by Maurice Druon based on the reigns of the last four Capetian Kings of France. I read the series many years ago and liked it.
@@perplexedbystander6203 Yes! That's the series I was talking about but couldn't think of the name off the top of my head and was too lazy to search. It's an excellent series, though I never read the 7th book because of how it is completely different style from the others. Did you read the 7th book? If so, did you like it?
I didn't mind the Viserys illness story because I saw it as part of the Maester conspiracy. In the book it's very subtle that Rhaenyra does not trust the Maesters and only trusts her own one, I like that they made it seem like Otto Hightower was working with the Maester to slowly kill the King.
The Hightowers connections to the Maesters is super interesting to me, I like that they played a bit with the idea.
Why would Gerardys by trustworthy if he is also a maester?
very Preston jacobs
@Alex Pokrandt Marwyn is full of it. He claims that Maester Aemon was sent to the Wall rather than made an archmaester but we know the actual reason: people wanted him to set aside his maester's vow to take the throne instead of Aegon V, and he shut that down by joining the Night's Watch. In discussing that he says it was because the maesters couldn't trust Aemon any more than they trust Marwyn... but Marwyn WAS made into an archmaester, and appears to have been given free reign to do whatever he wants even if others ignore him (a lot like academic tenure). Marwyn tells Sam he's at risk of getting poisoned, but Aemon certainly never gave any such indication when he agreed with Jon's plan for him to go back to Oldtown.
We do know of some divided loyalties among maesters. Pycelle is a lackey for Tywin Lannister, and as far as we can tell this is because his experience as Grand Maester under Aerys convinced him Tywin was the most competent to rule. When Tyrion imprisons him the Citadel selects Archmaester Gormon Tyrell as his replacement, so Tywin reversed the order. Tywin could be wrong about Gormon retaining loyalty to his family, but he does indeed have no reason to think any replacement the Citadel might select would be similarly loyal to him personally.
You can totally tell the Maester's are in the Hightower pocket in the book. The biggest tell is how it goes out of it's way to be like "Alicent grew more and more beautiful with age. She never looked a day over 19. Rhaenyra got fat and ugly with every kid. She's just a miserable, jealous woman. Oh, and even though she was in full armor at the time the iron throne TOTALLY cut her! BIG wound, she was in the wrong and the throne KNEW!" Like this is supposed to be a historical war account but we gotta get those jabs in there.
@@KoiPuff Elio Garcia has said the line about the throne cutting her was supposed to be indicative of the bias of Septon Eustace (called out as a Green partisan in F&B), not a maester. As for Alicent being beautiful despite having four children... Cersei is as well in A Game of Thrones. She only starts getting fat later. The way her story ends where she's essentially a madwoman urging her daughter to to murder the king she's married is not something the Hightowers were likely to have been behind.
One of the things the show really didn't highlight is how MASSIVELY unlikely Viserys marrying Alicent was. Despite the squicky age difference, Laena was a much more likely match. Otto may have been Hand of the King, but he was a second son and NOT the head of House Hightower. Alicent being paired with even the son of a Lord Paramount would have been unlikely and if it were, probably would have been a younger son. Note how they thought Ned being paired with Ashara Dayne was suitable for his status as a younger son of the Warden of the North.
I thought it was well highlighted that it was the king's choice. just because it was the smart thing to do does not mean it was the right thing to do. much like Rob stark marrying jeyne westerling even though th knew the consequences and this is a king who can do almost anything he likes
Importantly, Grand Maester Runciter wanted Viserys to marry Laena. Later, Grand Maester Mellos would successfully convince Viserys to betroth Rhaenyra to Laenor rather than Aegon II (as the Greens wanted) despite Laenor's preference for men being known. This is relevant to people who think the maesters were in a conspiratorial alliance with the Greens because the Citadel is in Oldtown.
That’s a point, they skipped that Otto was hand of the king entirely. But in the overall sense, I don’t think it matters for season one. Maybe they’ll talk about it in season 2?
Speaking of Ashara Dayne I think Jon is her son with bran. That was the other secret Ned kept. Cause he would of lost the river land like Robb lost the freyas.
The lemon tree gate.
@@Skabanis It feels weird seeing Brandon's name as "Bran", particularly in this context. Makes it feel a little gross haha
I think Alicent age is a change, because she was nine years older than Rhaenyra in the book and that seems like an odd thing to mistake by historians, regardless of any friendship or not she had with Rhaenyra before everything fell apart. Like it's mentioned several times she read to Jahaereys as he lay dying, and that would be a lot more notable if she had been 3-4 at the time.
Yh I heard this she was app 18 when Rhaenyra was named heir at 9 also she cared for the king before Viserys while he was dying
I’ve always just looked at the live-action show and the books as alternate universes. I don’t bother with “the show is the real events we didn’t see in Fire and Blood” when Game of Thrones has already diverted so much from A Song of Ice and Fire that it is already massively non-canon
@@TheJadedJames well in this case gorug sayed that hotd is canon. The book is just a very badly made history book
@@yuvalgabay1023 nah he literally said it's different canon
What does cannon even mean with this author if you read closely? George doesn’t even let you feel sure that things narrated through a first person pov really happen, and he’s changed his mind more than a handful of times about character details he confirmed or denied.
One of my favourite interpretations is Aemond accidentally killing Lucerys. It ties into the "Dragons are not pets" for one, another is while the kids hated each other, it was still just a intense version of dysfunctional family being dysfunctional, however once things were set into motion, there really was no going back and tragedy kept piling up, which just makes the dance even more tragic, especially if we see how it affects the later Targaryens.
I loved many of the outfits in the season especially Ryeanyras byzantine looking outfit, I'd always heard of and thought of the connect between the Targaryens and Byzantines and it was nice to see that visually
and the atmosphere of Kingslanding and what i would imagine Constantinople would feel like
And Old Valyeria is basically Old Rome. Kings Landing is New Rome (the Byzantines)
That little chuckle regarding the star wars series... perfection.
The Fandom Remembers! 😉
Oh yes! 😏
We laugh till this day lol 😆
Interesting thing is that Tales of the Jedi and Andor are doing very well... without D&D's help.
Well, D&D kind of forgot about the Iron Fleet that is Disney's fear of losing potential profit by hiring show runners who were very unpopular with the age group they were trying to target with Star Wars
They were in on it. Daemon’s scene with Quarl and him snapping the neck of the rando to use as “Laenor” were the tells. Plus Rhaenyra was “setting him free” as a thank you for everything they’ve been through together. I actually found it very nice.
I would have counted Rhaenyra and Alicent's friendship as an outright change because they're made the same age in the show, while being further apart in age in the book. On the other hand, the book does say they had a good relationship when Alicent first married Viserys and Rhaenyra was a kid. I'm not complaining, I liked the change, but I would have mentioned it.
Considering high born girls/women relationships we see in asoiaf I would say the age gap is actually not an issue in regards to them being friends. Seeing as they are both unmarried daughters of highborns at court, they were very likely to spend time together doing activities such as reading, hawking, sewing etc.
i actually love the tiny detail they put in the show regarding stuff that never appeared in the book, there's never any maesters or officials in the room during these moments so it's easy to see why they would've never been written down if no one even knew about them. and i love the fact that they kept things like the sesame street house and the Cargyll twins' names the same as the book, it shows that the showrunners want to be true to the source material (no matter how goofy some of it is) and they don't just see the GoT world as this cold and cruel fantasy world that needs to be taken extremely seriously like D&D.
I definitely feel like Rhaenyra was in the plan to fake Laenor's death. It seems ridiculous to have his lover be the assassin unless you want the death faked.
This spin-off was suspiciously good. Like it was so excellent in pacing, character work, and action I couldn’t believe it. It’s like they made a deal with a witch lmao
Frankly I'm shocked that Benioff and Wise were even offered HotD and I'm glad they turned it down. Wishing nothing but the worst for both of them 🙏🙏🙏
As disappointing GOT Season 8 was, D&D at least proved they can do well with the first 4 seasons, and unlike The Song of Ice and Fire, the good thing about prequels is that the story already incorporated into the lore. HBO probably offered out of courtesy (and also thought that there was no way they could muck up a prequel.)
I just think that they were like either bored with working on GOT or maybe they couldn't really use the ending that George has planned because they fucked up some of the storylines/killed off certain people (like Stannis) and completely excluded other characters and storyline. Either way, I think they really fucked up and I will forever hold a grudge against them. A lot of their writing was awful (like the one sandsnake saying to bronn "you need a good girl but want a bad pussy" lol )
They also left out every redeeming quality of Daemon or heartfelt scene he was in. Like when Laena died, he carried her body back after she collapsed in the stairs and held vigil over her body for a week. We're also missing the love that Daemon's kids have for him as again Daemon loves his family.
Daemon clearly just want's Targaryen supremacy, he loved Laena because she was a Targaryen.... He could not give two shits about Rhaenyras sons being bastards, since they're still Rhaenyra's children, thus Targaryens.
The only reason he feel animosity towards Viserys other children, is because he knows they've been brought up with the Hightower worldview.
That's atleast my take on him.
He’s still lovable because Matt Smith.
Some of his more negative qualities got left out too so it’s only fair ig
@@slayerr3086 which ones? The only thing he wasn't responsible on the show for that he may have been in the books was Harwin and Lyonel's deaths.
@@kingjonstarkgeryan8573 that plus he was implied to have caused Laenor’s death too. Not to mention his fondness for young girls
Was really excited to see this. IMO, this is SUCH a better adaptation of Fire and Blood than GOT was compared to ASOIAF. I loved most of the "changes" and liked how the characterizations were translated, particularly because Fire and Blood, by its very nature, will contain some inaccuracies.
I was pretty ambivalent about watching HOTD but after watching this video, I can't wait to see it.
I liked the changes other than Aegon and Criston Cole. They were terrible.
It makes you realise the time during A Game of Thrones is the most boring part of westeros history.
Right. Just like how in the book, you are getting information by multiple people all over westeros, all of which belonging to different allegiances and adding fan fiction in Mushroom's case lol
Where IS Mushroom though, has he even been cast?
Never click on a video so fast! I remember reading Fire and Blood while writing my Ancient History dissertation because obviously, the only thing better than reading copious amounts of real history is copious amounts of fantasy history! Love you Dom xx
Same here i shouted “YES!”
What do you think of the show?
*clicked
The most inaccurate thing about Fire and Blood is that Glydayn actually cites his sources. If only Suetonius was so thorough.
I like the change from intentional to accidental. This may just be my world view, but genuine psychopaths tend to be pretty rare. Most of the time, people do awful things without realizing exactly how big the rippling ramifications will be. And the recontextualizing of intent in the history books is an example of the tendency humans have to assume the worst intent in the actions of others. How many times have we looked at others failures or mistakes and blamed it on some fault of character, and how many times to we give ourselves a pass for similar errors due to external circumstances?
Agreed, and especially since "accidental" in this situation was still kiiiiiinda ambiguous. Like, Aemond was definitely playing more dangerously than he should have and it IS his fault, but there's also a plausible deniability. I wonder how they're going to show him reacting to it in later seasons when he has to tell his mother/brother that he kicked off a civil war.
Except in the books he decapitates Lucerys' corpse and presents the head as a gift to his betrothed.
I also like this scene, but he is still a genuine psychopath. They are human, and have complicated thoughts and feelings. Jeffrey Dahmer was also surprised by the deaths of some of his victims.
@@thecoolestfaisal The book states that Mushrooms claims (who was at Dragonstone, not in KL at the time) that Aemond took Lucerys' eyes, maybe even balls and brouth them to Alicent. And even in the chapter the author is like: yeah that probably didn't happen. Mushroom is extremly biased for the blacks, he was not present to see any of this happen and he is the only source who claims it was that bad.
@@TemariNaraannaschatz Mushroom wasn't biased, he was just gross. He claimed he had sex with Rhaenyra to give her practice to seduce Criston Cole.
The scene with Meleys and Rhaenys I feel could have been swapped out in the history books for Aegon flying around on Sunfyre for the sake of propaganda? That’s the only explanation I can think of.
“A dragon got loose during the coronation??”
“Oh no, no! Aegon rode Sunfyre around the Dragon Pit three times, don’t worry about it!”
There is no dragon escape in Ba Sing Se!
@@ischeele7203 I think theirs a difference between riding a dragon around the bit vs something bursting out of the pit and killing many innocent people
Another thing they changed that kinda impacted the show for better or worse depending on the various opinions is that by casting black actors as the Velaryons, it made the speculation on the parentage of Rhaenyra's first three sons that much harder to ignore because in the books they never come outright and say that Harwin Strong is their father. It is highly probable that he was given how many of his facial feautures they seemed to have, but there was still doubt and uncertainty over their parentage because Rhaenys, Laenor's mother, had black hair like Harwin, which she inherited from her mother, Jocelyn Baratheon. So it was speculated that Rhaenyra and Laenor's sons could have inherited their dark hair from Rhaenys, but they also changed her hair to Targaryen silver in the show making it virtually impossible for Laenor to even be claimed as their father.
Interesting. I do agree. But I can also see how now it shows the lengths they would be willing to go to be willfully ignorant. If it was subtle with alot of excuses. Then sure anycould write it off as a rumor. But to make it so blatantly obvious it shows the irrational thought behind it
There are plenty of real life people with one mixed raced and one white parent with very white children to make the skin plausable, although I would have kept Rhaenys hair dark, at least in the scene in the first episode when she was still young, so people could have forgotten that her hair was dark and simply got white in age, as opposed to the other Targaryens around her.
@@TemariNaraannaschatz Yes, changimg Rhaenys' hair was a bit of a misstep. In the book, even in middle age, her hair was Baratheon black with streaks of silver weaving in it.
@@RyLHatch1989 idk the more and more i think about it, its the right call for the medium. Like sure in Westeros over the years people could have forgotten her hair was black. But us the audience see these events in chunks of time, would have just had to accept "oh people must have simply forgot that so them kids maybe are plausible". But that could be alot for the simple casual fan to remember from a glimpse in an episode. or if they kept it black her whole life, then the audience would really question the queens motive because then they'd have to give her a new reason why she was so mad at the situation. But when you make it so blatantly obvious it just makes all the motivations of the queen, the willful blindness of the king, all the rumors and doubt just that much easier to swallow for a more casual watcher.
@@TemariNaraannaschatz Don't be obtuse. It wasn't just a single child that had pale skin and dark hair; which neither parents had. It was ALL THREE. And all with dark hair. Even if Rhaenys had dark hair, it's absurd to think that none of Laenor's features reflected in the children and all obtained their grandmother's hair coloring.
Seriously, these conversations would be a lot less cringe if people didn't try and make excuses for this. It's obvious. Period. End of story.
30:23 I think Laenor’s escape was meant to be one of Daemon’s “light” moments (they say he’s made of light and dark). It also serves to highlight the lack of consideration for the low born. Letting Laenor live is a point in Daemon’s favor, but it came at the cost of an innocent man’s life. Thematically I think it was a solid choice
Oh i thought it was obvious that Daemon and Rhaenyera planned Laenor's escape. Daemon told Qarl they needed witnesses. Daemon killed the servant whose body they burnt to make it look as if it was Laenor's. When they are hatching the plan, they talk about how they would "grant him this kindness, set him free".
They know people will think they did kill him, but Daemon thinks Rhaenyra should be feared. So yeah, it all fits.
All the variations on GRRRRRR Martin's name had me howling. Bravo sir.
"George rah rah Martin" and "George R & R Martin" where some of my favorites.
It is refreshing to hear someone talk about Hot D that understands the relationship between the book and show.
22:20 I do like the detail that Alicent’s involvement with Larys doesn’t include touching or nudity. It’s in character for her, she can tell herself that it’s not truly sinful or adulterous, since she finds it disgusting and it’s just her feet. If Larys had asked for something else I believe she would have turned him down on principle
Dom: this is the longest intro I have ever done.
Also Dom: makes whole videos to introduce Earthsea and Ender's Game.
And American Gods lol
I thought what happened to Rhynira's mother was also a good choice because of how it further pushed to motivate her to defy her own gender rolls. She saw her mother's life as tragic and refused to have her life dictated by others. The echo of her struggling to deliver her still born daughter was made more meaningful.
Rhaenyra*
Ffs
You make a good point.
@@browniebear sorry for having Dyslexia and having to rely on spell check. Unfortunately her name isn't corrected in my phone.
It was Rhaenyra's idea to offer Laenor an escape. The conversation with Daemon proves that.
oh I 100% think that Daemon and Rhaenyra were apart of the plot to allow Laenor to run off with Qarl. I think the way it’s portrayed in the show (and Rhaenyra’s relationship with Laenor) hints at them having set the whole thing up, but it’s interesting that it’s left ambiguous. Daemon kills a servant (ostensibly to take away witnesses but really to provide a body to throw into the fire), he gives Qarl a bag of gold (to kill Laenor but really to bribe him to leave with Laenor/enough money to live in the Free Cities or something like that.) I think Rhaenyra shows too much love/fondness for Laenor in the earlier scene between them for her to suddenly turn around and kill him, we don’t really see Rhaenyra become ruthless ‘til after sweet Luke dies. I think it was a way to 1. marry Daemon and secure a stronger alliance between the two of them and 2. to make people fear what they will be capable of together (like she says)
also Idk what they’re gonna do about Seasmoke, since no one can claim him and that might make people suspicious but if they do have Laenor come back as Addam of Hull, that might be interesting.
I didn't really read that scene as ambiguous because of the dialogue between Rhaenyra and Daemon when they discuss "setting Laenor free". So yeah, I think they were all in on it, not just Laenor and his lover :)
@@omolisa3783 oh yeah absolutely! but I totally think Laenor and Qarl were in on it. at least, I hope so, otherwise that presents problems for Rhaenyra if the writers decide to bring Laenor back and he tells people what happened.
of course, people already think she did it and she did say it would make people wonder what she and Daemon are capable of so I guess it wouldn’t change much lmao
@@kristenfaith Oh yeah, I totally agree!
That closeup just to laugh at Benioff and Weiss's hubris just gives me so much life.
I think we’ll see more ruthless versions of Alicent and Rhenyris in season 2, but this will now be understandable after we’ve gone through the whole first season getting to know them. I think their stories will be more compelling and heartbreaking as we’ll have plenty of evidence from season 1 that it didn’t have to be this way, that they were pushed into becoming monstrous.
I really respect Viserys, a lot of people call him a weak and vassilating king for doing things like not forcing people to do something or supporting the war in the stepstones straight away.
But I’d like to remind everybody that while things seem chaotic in the capital, if your an average dude living in the Riverlands or really anywhere else in the kingdom, things are pretty good, since wars, especially civil wars, tend to be bad for basically everyone.
In Russia, between the reigns of Ivan lll who history calls “Ivan the great,” and Ivan IV who history calls “Ivan the terrible/fearsome,” was Vasily lll who people jokingly refer to as “Vasily the competent,” because he didn’t win any major wars, expand the empire, or do much of anything besides keep the peace.
The just ok rulers in history don’t get enough respect.
I’m convinced the heir for a day part was a lie by Otto Hightower. It wasn’t confirmed that Dæmon said it, only that he was at the brothel that night, and that we are only shown that scene. Or for all we know, he could’ve said it more mournfully, and the scene we see is Otto’s retelling. After all Dæmon was truly loyal to Visarys regardless of his actions
...Was Daemon *truly loyal* to Viserys? Sure, he loved his brother, and that doesn't even slightly mean that he couldn't be deeply cruel to him.
I mean...if that wasn't true wouldn't Daemon just say it. Like, I'm pretty sure myself that it did happen.
@@Scott-ql2kx He was loyal to Viserys but frustrated by his lack of strength at the same time. Daemon saw people openly plotting at his desk and Viserys did nothing about it.
Long story short: Otto can pound sand
I'm more of the opinion that Dæmon didn't mean it the way it came out, myself, 100%. Too many accounts are that he said it, so it's *probably* got some truth to it.
But.
It *sounds* really bad *if* you put the worst possible spin on it which Otto has every incentive to do, but try to think on what he's said to have said neutrally.
It *could* be a insult, the "only" being heavily implied, but he didn't say actually say only. He toasted the heir. Heir for a day, or a year, or a decade, maybe that part wasn't the focus. Maybe the point was even if it was only a day, he was still heir. He still had value. Maybe the point was to verbally acknowledge them peers, even if just for a day, him and I were the same, I mourn him as I'd have you mourn me.
I love the whole concept of the heir of a day toast, because it's so deliciously context-dependant for how little context we get.
It could be mocking. It could be respectful. It could be grief-stricken or cynical about the cost paid for a mere day, it could be honouring or dismissive. It could be multiple conflicting tones and motivations at once even, and we only know how other people decided to interpret it. It's great.
To me Laenor surviving seems to be a reaction to the "bury your gays" trope that is very popular in fiction. They decided they didn't need to contribute to the trope and Laenor gets to live. The boys recently did the same with Queen Maeve surviving a likely demise. I think its a good thing btw.
Also alongside his sister's death changing makes less of the character fates the same.
Keep in mind that Georges RR Martin loves unreliable characters
And remember also that he enjoy rome antic history and inspired him to write this book
Not exacly the most acurate historians was around at that time period
I also agree. I watch the show with a group (we’re all queer) and we were just waiting for Laenor to die bc it’s practically expected. Making joke bets on which episode it was gonna be. When he didn’t we were like woah hey that’s cool actually. Wildly original and fresh when the sole gay character ends up living
@@Joyride37Spoilers for S2:
I don’t think Laenor is the only main gay character anymore
Funny that Dom used the picture of Maegor killing Quicksilver and Aegon the Uncrowned when describing the Dance of Dragons given those events are over 80 years apart.
Rhaenyra and Daemon were definitely in on the plan of faking Laenor's death. There's that scene of Daemon arranging it with Ser Qarl. And the reason Rhaenys didn't burn Aegon and the Greens was because at that point, Rhaenys hadn't declared for the Blacks yet and she had some amount of sympathy for Alicent following their meeting earlier in the episode.
On top of that, there's the scene where Daemon kills some random guy alone in the halls. It was Daemon that provided the decoy body.
BenMedia
It's really quite surprising Rhaenys ultimately sided with Daenyra if she still believes they murdered her son.
@@alanpennie8013 I think Rhaenys ultimately decided to side with Rhaenyra because she understood that her grandchildren would be at risk if Aegon won.
also a lot of people say that rhaenys would have ended the war by killing the greens at the coronation but actually she would be starting one. aegon and helaena had two sons and grrm confirmed that daeron, alicnet and viserys's youngest son will be included in the show. there would still be green-aligned male claimants to challenge rhaenyra and the hightowers would absolutely have cause to do so. the war definitely wouldn't have lasted six months without aemond and vhagar, but there still would have been a war.
@@BenMedia7
Really quite surprising that The Greens didn't make more of an effort to recruit Rhaenys.
Too much else to think about maybe.
The biggest twist in the show hasn’t even come yet, we will find out that the dance of the dragons never actually even happened and everyone just got along well and reigned as a family together for 100 years.. the book was an in universe fiction.. mind blown
"Not wanting to do that to another mother" -as she crushes hundreds more. They tried to write in their own changes thinking they're as good as G. to the G. and it looks really dumb.
This is honestly one of my favorite series on TH-cam. This is also my favorite show on TV right now. I might need to make popcorn for this one.
The thing about Rhaenyra and Alicent’s friendship is that there wasn’t really any possibility of them being childhood friends in the books cuz when Rhaenyra was 9…Alicent was like, 18-19 😅
Considering high born girls/women relationships we see in asoiaf I would say the age gap is actually not an issue in regards to them being friends. Seeing as they are both unmarried daughters of highborns at court, they were very likely to spend time together doing activities such as reading, hawking, sewing etc.
And it was stated in the books that they had a good relationship before the wedding. Maybe not as close as the show portrays, but a friendship was absolutly possible.
@@TemariNaraannaschatz oh definitely. Not saying they couldn’t be friends, just childhood friends.
But yeah I always got a feeling of caretaking Alicent before the wedding to lil Rhae. Which is a bit awkward with the show now hah
I actually really appreciated the cesarean scene, and Rhaenyra's birth scenes. Because that's the first time I've ever seen the risks of childbirth portrayed so gruesomely accurate. I think it was also like the first huge hard decision Viserys had to make in a consecutive, horrible line of hard choices, up to his death. It was horrific, absolutely, but I honestly give points to anything that's honest about pregnancy and childbirth: Like people always forget how dangerous it is, back then and now.
What a brilliant first season. Viserys was my favorite character - his slow horrifying demise and death was perfect imo. One thing I wish they'd included = the twins Ser Arryk and Ser Erryk's final farewell.
Beautiful video Dom. I've read the book as soon as it came out and have it on Audible as well. I love the show and the one thing that stands out is the births. Each scene is beautiful, sad, infuriating and heartbreaking. For me as a mother, I'm glad this show is portraying childbirth closer to reality (painful distress). As someone who's been through a c-section without proper anesthesia (medical error) I felt we should see it as to understand that childbirth very often ends up in tragedy but it doesn't get to be this explicit on tv. There's always a story about someone who've lost a mother during childbirth but we stay far away from the dying person's pain and only focus on the romanticized grief.
As an academic historian, part of me really wants to analyse Fire and Blood as if it's really a historian writing a real history. Like what methodology does this Maester use to look at events? I'm not sure if it's possible, but it sounds like fun
If you're interested in that, I highly recommend DJ Peach Cobbler's video "The Stupid Reason I Love House of the Dragon" . The book Fire and Blood can be considered the biased historian's accounting of the events that happened while the show is basically the "how it mostly actually happened" accounting of the events. You only really appreciate what House of the Dragon does when you compare and contrast it to what it's adapting, Fire and Blood. If you're a history geek, you'll really love this video. Check it out and tell me what you think.
You should! Generally when the in-universe author comes across conflicting accounts, he reports on all versions but either dismisses one as less likely/having an unreliable source, or decides that the truth was somewhere between all stories. Like with poor Lord Beesbury, there were conflicting accounts of his death and the maester didn't know which was more reliable so just wrote that no matter how, it was true that he died around that time
It doesn't read at all like medieval history by medieval writers and reads an awful lot like a particularly hamfisted attempt to engage with disagreeable sources... which I suppose happens all the time, but is rarely published to a wider audience.
The tourney in HoD looked grand and like a proper tournament, Roberts in GOT season one looked like something someone set up in their back yard. The iron throne in HOD looks like it's described in the books a massive gnarled collection of swords in got it looks like a prop that's about to fall down. And that's why I love HoD
To be fair, the first season of GoT didn't have nearly the same budget as HotD. HotD had about four times the budget to work with lol
I do like how they worked the smaller throne into the story with Varys and Littlefinger having their little romance of wits and it like all legends being an illusion
I kind of figured that the reason (outside of out-of-universe budget reasons) Robert's tourney, as well as Robert's hunt, was so comparably... well, shit, was that the kingdom was in severe decline under his rule. The early Targaryen's were the glory-days, and then it kept declining after the Dance, until the dynasty finally fell, and King Robert, first of his name, killed by a pig, took over and did absolutely nothing to keep it from slipping any further. It's kind of a meme in fantasy overall, but it seems everything was always bigger and more glorious in the past.
@@shikuthetempest
See also, The Royal Hunt (episode 3).
4:30 I think the reason hotd didn't get its own theme is that they are trying to build up this "Throneverse" around that tune
I thought it was pretty clear that Rhaenyra and Daemon were in on the whole plot to help Laenor escape, that's the whole reason Daemon killed the random page on the steps.
My sister and I binged all of house of the dragon and the first 4 seasons of GOT earlier this year and we loved it. House of the dragon was surprisingly incredible
I think that regarding Alicent and Larys' actions, my perspective on it is that it amplifies the fact that Alicent is and has been exploited and taken advantage of by men for her entire life. She says it herself regarding her father, and while Viserys was not cruel to her, he represents the loss of innocence she has experienced. Similarly towards how she treats Aegon, who she also views as representation of the end of her childhood which is why she is rarely portrayed as a good mother. The show has left me a lot more divided on who's side I'm on, mainly because of their portrayal of Alicent which I prefer quite a bit.
Yeah Alicent is my favorite character. She’s so messy and tragic and brings all the doom onto herself with her actions, yet was sociologically groomed for that fate bc of all the exploitation and lack of agency she faced in her life
I thought my favorite part would be the variations of Martin's name, but then you made yourself laugh with that silly joke in the bloopers. What can I say, I love that sort of thing.
Oh boy this is gonna be a good one! So proud of you Dom, this video is chonky and could NOT have been easy!
it feels like they set up Rhynera and Alicent to be good people in this season alone. I hope season 2 does a good job at showing us that the war is the reason they became so bitter towards each other. It would go a long way to explaining why the history books refer to them as being terrible people. I think it’s cool character development and adds to the flavor that history portrays people in a single light instead of the complex array of emotions we all have inside of us
I think it's an excellent primer in the truth that no one will care about your intentions. People, and history, will only remember your actions and their effects. Were you kind? Tormented by duty? Struggling to balance your own life with your family's and society's expectations? It doesn't matter when you also start a war that kills hundreds of thousands. That will overshadow nearly everything else. Our traumas and our lives are explanations, but never an excuse.
Oh. I never considered that she suicided via immolation to avoid a forced caesarian. But it's entirely plausible after what happens in episode 1. I wished that had been talked about more. The betrayal of what Viserys did to the wife he loved. Not to mention the contrast of Daemon, the "bad" brother, refusing to do so.
I think it's horrifying that a mother would choose to burn both herself and her child alive rather than chance that the baby could be saved by c-section
@@jessicawurm23 I mean, she was in King's Landing when Aemma had her C-section and the baby died, she probably assumed the same would happen to them. She knew she was dead either way with no guarantee that the baby would live, and she wanted to go out on her own terms rather than being held down and cut open against her will. She had no reason to sacrifice herself for the pregnancy, she had a brother with sons and stood little chance of inheriting anything. Dying in childbed in Pentos was the antithesis of everything Laena wanted in life.
Keep in mind that Georges RR Martin loves unreliable characters
And remember also that he enjoy rome antic history and inspired him to write this book
Not exacly the most acurate historians was around at that time period
@@jessicawurm23
I think your comment is kinda horrifying tbh. It implies a woman can't choose to die by her own choices. It's her body. It's her decision. And she didn't wanna die like Aemma did. Why is that horrifying? Aemma death was horrifying. Laena chose to go out on her own terms.
Women are their own people. They are not slaves to their wombs.
29:38 There is no such thing as dismissing a kingsguard until Cersei Lannister invented it in 299AC. The only options are executing or sending them to the wall.
Laenor’s escape was Rhaenyra’s plan. You can see her coming up with it during the conversation with Laenor about how he wants to be a better husband and wishes he wasn’t a homosexual. Then again while talking to Daemon she says she’s not going to be a tyrant. It was her plan.
I sometimes like to imagine how the Westeros crowd would do in other fantasy settings. Like in one of the worlds where dragons are sapient being and would need to be persuaded rather than commanded. Can just picture one of these plots being laid out for some dragon who then just goes "Are you kidding me?"
😂
Well in DnD all Targaryens are all Sorcerers with the draconic bloodline because yeah they have legit dragon blood in them. Its why miscarriages and stillbirths come out looking like dragons. Honestly I wish they had shown Viserys becoming more draconic as he got sicker to highlight this.
I mean tbf that's kind of a point that the show adaptations have made that whilst the dragons are animals, a part of the natural order that are willing to be commanded they are also these highly intelligent magical fire lizards and a power that is only really allowing itself to be commanded. Aemond loosing control of Vhagar (because he was never really the one in control) at a critical moment that could send the realm from extreme tensions to outright war because and killing Lucerys and Arrax is an important part of that understanding. Especially seeing as the house of the dragon is about to unleash these monsters upon each other and the wider would of westeros
I've heard apparently they have confirmed Mushroom appeared in one of the groups playing music for Viserys or Rhaenyra this season, which if true I would guess means he'll eventually be a relevant character. In this case I would additionally guess that his absence may be another one of those "we have too many characters already" changes, like them having Daeron be down South with the Hightowers rather than be present in King's Landing.
He is at the wedding with Laenor. I'd also add that Mushroom sounds like someone that makes himself look way more important than he actually was.
God I love the Targaryen history. It really is like the gods just flip a coin on whether they're going extremely competent, or horribly insane.
I think that Daemon and Rhaenyra planned Leanors "murder". Daemon kills the guy who would pose as a body double and they talk about setting him free because Rhaenyra loves him.
Reading the book after finishing season 1, have an interesting theory about Mushroom and his absence from the show. I think Mushroom's name was used as a pseudonym for one of the other characters. My guess is that "Mushroom" is really Daemon Targaryen who will be revealed at the end to have survived the Dance (his body is never recovered after all) and fled back to Pentos where he wrote his own account of the Targaryen civil war.
We see Mushroom in the show, though, albeit only briefly. He's the dwarf playing a drum during Rhaenyra and Laenor's wedding.
@@DominionSorcererMaybe Daemon based his cover story off this jester
Daemon and Rhaenyra were in on the plan regarding Laenor because it was Daemon who killed the rando dude that they used as Laenor's double.
A couple things I wished they kept was coles speech and larys blood oath. Those moments were essential to the characters of Cole and larys.
I'm really not sure why people attach so much importance to that speech.
The Small Council, which Otto had stuffed with people loyal to himself, would have declared for Aegon regardless of what he or Alicent said or did.
@@alanpennie8013 because it gives agency to Cole and larys. Coles reasons in the books are somewhat valid if you take it from a legal view. Rhayneras children were bastards objectively and though Cole is an unsavory character but he thought his motivations were just not the petty scorned nature they probably were. Larys by declaring a blood oath puts weight on everyone who declares for the greens even though he probably has no real loyalty to anyone
@@tenkenroo
Fair enough.
Re-reading the account of The Green Council I was quite startled by how much everyone (except Lord Beesbury) showed no hesitation at all about immediately usurping the throne.
@@tenkenroo Larys especially has no loyalty to anyone but himself. I can't understand why he even wanted to be head of his house since he truly doesn't give one fig for it.
@@livelovelife32 probably for access to his houses wealth but even that is tenuous. I think larys motivations are for pure nihilism, cause as much suffering as he can in his life. It’s why at the end of the conflict he doesn’t give a justification to the wolf.
In Episode 3, in the scene in front of the fire, Viserys tells Alicent (who's pregnant with Helaena, who is a dragon dreamer in the show) about dragon dreams and specifically about a dream he had about the baby boy they already have, Aegon.
"I saw it in a dream... as vivid as these flames, I saw it. A male babe born to me... wearing the Conqueror's crown."
He didn't tell her about the Conqueror's dream (he told Rhaenyra in Episode 1). In his final moments in Episode 8, he mentioned "Aegon" and a "dream" and she was reminded of that conversation.
He taught he was talking to Rhaenyra, though.
Great video! As a show watcher that has not read the book this was super informative without being too spoilery 😁😁😁 Thanks Dominic!
I think they were worried about topping the opening theme to GOT because they caught lightning in a bottle with that and Ramin Djawadi is a musical genius. Do I think it's possible for him to write an equivalent banger? Possibly, but they might have been worried it wouldn't hit as well as the original theme. It would've been nice to give HOTD it's own theme, but on the other hand it's pretty awesome to hear that familiar song again and know I'll be watching something good.
My jaw literally dropped when I got this notification lmao much love friend thank you!
I think Leonor surviving is great, because it makes the audience feel genuinely happily invested in Deamon and Rheneara. Also given Leonor and Rheneara’s friendship/ relationship it makes way more sense they’d fake his death rather than actually kill him.
I don't think Daemon's wife committed suicide to avoid forced caesarian. I think she chose what she mentioned earlier: a dragon rider's death. She would die in the noble fire of her dragon than linger in pain die crying out and withering in anguish.
Looks like you put a TON of effort into this one, your passion for GRRRRRR Martin's source material really jumps off the screen! Great work! :)
So the thing about jousting accidents is that they were extremely common in medieval europe historically; numerous monarchs and princes died this way. Most famously, Henry VIII was always furious his father never let him joust, and his various councilmembers didn't let him joust either, and yet when he eventually overruled him, he famously had a very bad fall, and it's that that is often held responsible for his sudden turn towards sadism and paranoia.
I would say that Rhaenys' choice to not make a barbeque of The Greens was explained in a very good way later. Her words "this is not my war to start" both rings true and is concistent with her words and actions through the season.
Also, it gave a very nice foreshadowing to the death of Luke. And additional context to Aemon's reaction when seeing Luke killed. Rhaenys choose to not to use her dragon to start the war. And Aemon knew that he instead was the one responsible.
I have tried so hard to care at all about this show, since so many people have been talking about it, and this is the first video I've seen that actually made me care some about the story. Dom is magic.
Did u not find it watchable? Season 1 had less action and way more politics which I know for some people can be a bit boring. I loved it quite a bit but if someone said they need more action I can understand. Season 2 promises to be more inline with GOT level of action so hoping it's more palatable for those that need that aspect.
Me too! I might actually give it a watch now.
I really loved the one sided fight Vaeghar had. It makes it clear that it doesn’t matter if Rhaenyra has like 13 dragons to Aegon’s 3 if Vaeghar can wipe out like half of them without in a flash.
It also highlighted Rhaenyra's point: none of their dragons are trained for war. They'd be better off getting the wild dragons that are used to fighting or freed dragons that fought in past wars on their side. Right now the only dragon on their side with real war training is Caraxes.
@@livelovelife32 Meleys has some training in combat but not as much
Whilst this is true, Vhagar is strong, She is also very slow, which is her weakness, as seen by the books (two times). It's said that Arrax would have gotten away from Storm's end if it wasn't for the Storm
As someone who has never cared about 'Game of Thrones' or the books it's based on, all I have to say is that I always appreciate Eddie Izzard being shown some love.
i just wanna tell you that this video alone made me finally go read fire and blood. i promise i'll go back to this video once i'm done reading
Dom's chuckle at D&D & Star Wars at 2:33 made my day. :)
Haven't been paying much attention to HoD, but I'm glad it's well-written and engaging its fans after the disaster of season 8.
The show never lived to it's true potential by keeping Mushroom out of the cast.
Nice to see Dom getting some of the HotD action.
I think House of the Dragon is going to be an anthology show. For now it's Dance of the Dragons but maybe after the Dance is over they might have a "House of The Dragon: Aegon's Conquest" and also rename Season 1-4 or however long it takes for Rhaenyra's story to be named "House of the Dragon: Dance of The Dragons"
Oh, there are definitely many team green fans out there. Many are hardcore Alicent fans who sympathize with her struggles. Or they just find Alicent’s children to be more interesting characters than Rhaenyra’s sons (something I have to agree with so far). And there are those who simply dislike Daemon and think he’d be a dangerous ruler/consort. People are mostly team black, but it’s not everybody.
I appreciated the "textbook" tone of the book. It put the deaths at a remove, making them less traumatic.
Just leaving a like, gonna watch this with my GF once she's caught up. Glad to see Westeros revived again, didn't think they could pull so many of us back in.
Cheers, Dom!
30:11 Daemon was not just in on it, he came up with it.
He paid the boyfriend and planted the idea, murdered a guard for a replacment body, and was friend of Laenor and his father after their 3 years of warring together.
No way he'd kill Laenor only cuz Rhaenyra wanted him out of the way.
I would point out that GRRM has said that a lot of stuff is just inventions of the show's writers that he was fine with. I think George's personal view is that nothing is canon because he hasn't quite decided on that himself 😂
I wonder if once the Dance is over they’ll cover the Blackfyre Rebellion or something (which I didn’t realize wasn’t in Fire and Blood)
My absolute favorite part of the adaptation, as a huge Doctor Who fan, is of course Matt Smith.
He's an amazing actor in his own right, but I always take subversive glee whenever an actor who was played The Doctor turns up in another series, because then I get to enjoy watching an entire fandom do the mental gymnastics required to explain how the hell everyone's favorite Timelord ended up in Westros.
I actually didn't watch the show (didn't get the chance to do so) but my bff did, and she said that there is a scene involving Rhaenyra that, if she had just used her dragon to burn someone, it would save A LOT of future bull crap from what she saw (she didn't read the book. She just made an educated guess).
I finally know what scene she's talking about thanks to your review. Good to know that you also agree that dragons should have burned them to stop a lot of future events from happening.
I'm super excited to show her this video! Thanks for doing so! ❤️
Honestly the Rhaenyra Alicent friendship should have gone into the very unlikely category since they have 9 year age difference In the books(Alicent is 18 and Rhaenyra 9 when she marries Viserys).
Considering high born girls/women relationships we see in asoiaf I would say the age gap is actually not an issue in regards to them being friends. Seeing as they are both unmarried daughters of highborns at court, they were very likely to spend time together doing activities such as reading, hawking, sewing etc.
And it is stated that they had a good relationship before the marriage.
@@TemariNaraannaschatz
Spending time together and getting along is one thing, but a 9 and 18 year old are just not going to have the same kind of relationship we saw in the first few episodes of the show.
@@chaserobinson5639 Yes the extremly close relationship they have in the show is unlikely, I meant a general friendship is possible.
Larys was blackmailing Alicent because is she refuses then Larys would bring everything down on her head