Honda Accord - Slight Miss At Idle - Case Study
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 16 ก.ค. 2024
- Come along with Eric O at the SMA shop as we have a look at this Honda Accord 3.0 that has a slight misfire at idle and goes away when you give it a little gas. This testing process could have been done very quickly but we take some time to try an analyse this one in several different ways using our PICO Scope with a WPS500 cylinder pressure transducer. We also explain the importance of gathering all the data you can before tearing into an engine, because once them heads are of there is no more starting it to "check one last thing." --Enjoy!
Honda Slight Miss At Idle Part II: • Honda Accord - Slight ...
-Misfire Strategies for Today's Vehicles with Dave DeCourcey: • Misfire Strategies for...
- Launch x-431 Pad II AE: www.aeswave.com/cart.php?m=af...
- AES uTest Advanced Terminal Test Kit: www.aeswave.com/cart.php?m=af...
- 4-Channel PICO 4425 Advanced Kit in case and foam: www.aeswave.com/cart.php?m=af...
- FREE PICO 4425 Software: www.picoauto.com/downloads
- MY FILES ON THIS CAR (Must Download Pico Software First!!): drive.google.com/open?id=0B6G...
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The cranking waveforms show much more difference between cyl 1 and 5 than the running ones, probably because at low cranking speed there is more time for air to leak out of the cylinder during the compression and expansion strokes. The cranking test also has atmospheric pressure at the start of the compression (due to WOT rather than idle manifold vacuum) so the cylinder pressures will be higher, increasing the amount of leakage. On the cyl5 cranking trace the pressure at the bottom of the expansion stroke is lower than at the bottom of the intake stroke, if the pressure is lower and the volume of the cylinder is the same (piston at BDC in both cases) then physics says there must be less air in the cylinder by the end of the expansion stroke - as there is no combustion you would expect the compression and expansion strokes to cancel out (you take a fixed amount of air at BDC intake, compress it to TDC firing, then expand it again to BDC expansion and end up back where you started....assuming a slightly idealised case where the intake valve closes exactly at BDC and the exhaust valve also opens exactly at BDC). I don't think the pressure trace can tell you where the leak is (inlet valve, ex valve, rings) - just that there is/isn't a leak....
Thanks for sharing the scope data, really interesting to have a look at
A comment of value. Thank you.
Steve THANK YOU! You can teach an old dog new tricks.
so, where is the good old leakdown tester :)
Intake runner pressure pulses can cross feed the cylinders.
You can tell exactly were a leak is with in cylinder wave forms. Id suggest you look into some of Bernie Thompson's training material.
As a first year apprentice technician I love watching your case studies and learning more about the electronic diagnostics instead of just cranking wrenches! Keep up the extremely hard work, we are still extremely grateful 🙏
Working on cars is time consuming enough, now making videos and bringing this kind of info and then some...Beyond Repair 🤙🏼
It depends on environment that you're in and you're in a if you're in a dealership you have more customers well in the waiting area and I'm waiting for their cars you don't have time to make videotapes you can only do this in private shops where you have one two cars a day
Not afraid to admit what you know and don't. Respect you more every time I see one of your videos.
Wow ! i have been an Electronic tech for over 50 Years and I am so impressed at your skills
to understand how these modern cars use electronics to do everything ! The days of the shade tree
mechanic are forever gone. If you're successfully fixing modern cars, you understand the electronic
components involved ! Kudos to you, and to the handful of techs out there with your knowledge !
I know that you will do well and your videos are teaching many would be techs about what's needed
to diagnose these newer vehicles. Love watching your videos and what it takes to resolve problems
that did not exist 25 years ago.. Amazing. Thanks ! Keep up the great work..
thank you...i'm a 'Bucket full of Harbour freight' man...and I learnt a lot.
My arthritis began around 43 in my lower back , It's now pretty much everywhere to a degree . We humans are far more fragile than I had ever thought when I was younger . TheReaper!
joeblackakareaper Same here. L5 & L4 are deteriorating daily. Still bent over a hood though...By the time the damage reveals itself you’re trapped.
Severe Author comes from eating animal proteins for a life time. You're simply consuming the wrong type of fuel!
Rj Aquaponics - That’s a load of nonsense. We’re literally made of animal protein - the most compatible, extremely bioavailable protein for human consumption is animal protein. We need animal protein and fats for proper function of our endocrine system among other systems in the body.
The only reason people live, “well,” as vegans is because the body is incredibly resilient and can still survive on almost anything you can feed it.
I’d venture to say the OP could eat an elimination diet of solely red meat for a month or two and see improvement in his condition.
I’m speaking from personal experience.
@@JosephQPublic Because we are made of proteins, our bodies have a hard time digesting animal protein. It is a constant battle of eliminating the acid loads while fighting autoimmune issues. It is not our proteins that digest the animal proteins, it is our microbiome that makes the animal flesh and fats available. The cholesterol in meats are not the cholesterol used by our brains, we manufacture that type of cholesterol. Bar none, everyone who eats a meat, cheese, milk and eggs diet will eventually grow slower, sicker, weaker bones, and suffer as a big pharma cash cow. I learned this for personal experience.
HiEric
I won;t say you missed your calling as you are definetly atop grade mechanic.
However you may not have noticed yuar also grade a Instructor. People just seem to understand sometimes difficult concepts easily from your videos.
Please keep them coming and say hi to Sheba for me as well.
He's famous and has a huge following and a solid platform, so he made the right decision. I can't name a single Grade A car repair instructor. Can you?
Paying for school to be a tech but I'm learning so much from SMA idk sometimes why I'm going to school 😂😂
Nice simple explanation of how relative compression works on a scope for us dummies. Thanks from the UK.
Cant get enough of your videos dude, you work on vehicles I'll never come across - I watch em anyway
Fantastic diagnostic. I do not know anyone in this area that can to this type of thorough diagnostic AND be able to repair the vehicle - take off the head. Thumbs up video.
Bet your butt we want to see the whole fixing process on this Honduuu!
This was a great case study! Thanks for showing it to us.
Thanks again for a full informative video and no worries on the rushed feelings. I got more out of you rushing and teaching than I get out of most people on their best days !!!
I love your case studies. I didn't really know what you were talking about most of the time lol, but the way you explained it helped me imagine it and did make some sense to me.
As always thank you for the time you spend making these videos.
Eric you did a great job of explaining them waveforms. Until the next one.
3:05 Love that Scotty Kilmer with a chainsaw on the wall XD
Great info! The best part of your videos are your explanation of scan tool values and how they relate to engine mechanics...
3:18 explains current clamp and measuring starter current in relationship to weak compression (3:50)
John Thornton is an amazing instructor. Have been going to his classes for a number of years. He hits it out of the park every time. Yeah, Honda's are great vehicles, but not perfect. You did a great job explaining everything. Nice work my friend.
Stepping back in time. Interesting to see how the technical diagnostic tools and process has changed from then to today September 2020
Absolutely fantastic information. Lots going on in the world of diagnostics and the added links are a huge help, thanks. I really enjoyed this one.
Excellent video!! You go way beyond the average guessing mechanic and use technical procedures to pinpoint the problem. Must say, really like the tool collection you have too. Thanks for sharing this and keep ahead of that arthritis.
That Dave Decourcey video is a good one. I watched it a long time ago. Seemed like a really cool guy and he really knew his way around a scope. He passed away late last year.
Great diagnostics, thank you Eric!!!
Pretty dang cool. Here I am thousands of miles away on a business trip overseas and still get to watch Eric O videos at 3 am.
Total cure for jet lag and time changes! Thanks Eric. Very much appreciate all you put into making these great videos. I am a decent car, boat, and landsacape mechanic, (no where near your experience), but watch every video just for the sheer enjoyment. Still learn something every session. You should be teaching full time someplace probably like NASA.
As one NY'er to another, awesome....
Mike B
Yes, we want to see the repair video Eric. We cant let you go through the pain alone!
Eric you are truly the best in explaining and sharing your knowledge. You explain things so that we can learn right along with you. Thanks for sharing your knowledge
Nice! Its been a while since you made a mini series! Cant wait to see it!
I had a 'Frozen Shoulder (Adhesive capsulitis) last year, my primary care doctor referred me to an Orthopedic doctor . The Orthopedic doctor recommended PT instead of a cortisone injection. Did 8 months of PT and my frozen shoulder went away. Good luck with your PT and get well soon. Great video and explaining how to diagnose low compression.
After 10 years I went yo my GP Cortisone injection cleared mine it came back but nothing like as bad after a couple of years but another cortisone injection did the trick -- now 12+ years free of that horrible ache.
Appreciate the vid and all the time you took to give us those files, definitely gonna give it a look. Cheers Eric
Thank You For Your Time .
Nice video. Takes me back to review a course I had in May, 2017, "Theory and Application of Pressure Transducers." Reviewing the course materials the case studies only covered mechanical issues never a burned exhaust valve being identified. Interestingly, to make a diagnosis for compression leakage, peak in cylinder pressure had to be correlated with top dead center. Leakage will be present where peak compression does not align with TDC (setting up another channel on ignition and adjusting the degrees BTDC to calculate actual TDC).
Eric, thank you for this great info. I look forward to the repair process. I've been up against arthritis as long as I can remember, tried the anti-inflammatory drugs once, but the side effects were worse than the arthritis. We just have to keep moving and use a mind over matter kind of attitude. Again thank you.
Thank you . Really love the information and the links. Please keep these type of videos coming!
Thank you for posting a link to the files you saved during your testing. It was great to be able to look at them at our own pace and zoom into different areas that may not have been highlighted during the video. Please keep posting links to test data in future videos.
pressure transducer brings new level of detail to a compression test .
Could get same conclusion most times with old school or HF test tools but what you learn from seeing all this transducer info will pay off with the tricky fault diagnosis .
Good informative vid. picoscope is superb bit of kit and having it run on windows a bonus in many ways, wish more scan tools would be built to load on notebooks and tablets over dedicated devices .
Wow, 4:40 am. Turn on computer, bring up you tube and watch SMA!! Good vid.
You were specially good at explaining things in this video. I learned how to use my oscilloscope for compression test. Not bad
The electrical engineer in me was glad you mentioned "conventional current." Yes, current (the electrons) flows from negative to positive. A lot of people don't know that. The convention of current flowing from positive to negative is basically to eliminate tons of negative numbers in the math. Another great diagnostic video, by the way.
Also an EE. "Current" is never the correct name for "flow of electrons". Current is defined as the rate of flow of _charge_ . Since electrons carry negative charge, when electrons flow from negative terminal to positive, they move negative charge (at some rate) from negative to positive terminal. This means that the _current_ in the direction from negative to positive terminal _is negative_ . Negative current in one direction is the same as positive current in the other. So this requires positive current (rate of charge flow) to be in the direction from positive terminal to negative.
These are all part of the same convention, not alternatives. You can discuss electron flow and current and they are completely compatible. But when the word "current" is used as the name for electron flow itself, that is just incorrect.
I hear what you're saying. I was being a bit vague. I was just making note that Eric O. had the direction of electron flow correct.
Fair enough. For some reason, lately I've been hearing a number of youtubers and others blurring this electron flow vs current distinction, and making subsequent incorrect logical leaps (not Eric), either about basic electricity, or made up explanations about how "conventional current" is some sort of band aid to make things more convenient in the light of Franklin's "mistake". All of which serve to confuse people whose knowledge is not solid in this area. Most egregiously www.allaboutcircuits.com/textbook/direct-current/chpt-1/conventional-versus-electron-flow/. You can pretty much guarantee that where "conventional current flow" is mentioned, the explanation will be wrong.
Lol my head hurts now, all I know is I hook up wires and bulbs light up haha
+Graham Wideman what?
Another awesome diagnostic vid Eric! Can't wait to see part 2.
Nice too see all the info you can get just by looking to those compression "waveform"! I'm impress! nice job
I had a 3.8L Ford Windstar leaking between #2 and #3 cylinder once, had a blown head gasket.
Thanks for sharing! Man you've got some nice tools.
It will be interesting to see what you find when you tear it down.
Wow; a masterful diagnosis!
First of all Erick O. Loved the video made by Scanner Danner - you, Ivan and Paul to the "get together." Was great. All of we subscribers joined in on the fun. Loved the control arm presentation - laughed out loud. You, Ivan, Paul are "Da Man!" Thanks. You guys don't really know how much knowledge you are "giving away for free." :) Many "tanks."
Excellent video Eric O. It's so hard to know when to just call it and know you're gonna be taking the head off. I understand that knowing is knowing, and I always would like to REALLY know for sure (that's probably why most of us got into the biz anyway) but, when you've got three other cars to get to and a ringing phone... This is the kind of situation where you really get to understand that time IS money. Thanks for all the great work.
I had a V6 Accord just like this, and it was one of the fastest rides I have ever driven! I ran it to 276.000 miles and sold it. I'm going to find a Copart wreck like it and go again.
Great Video Diagnostics using the Pico Scope with the cylinder pressure sensor! If you had valve opening/closing specs, in degrees, that would be helpful to identify it all on the scope waveforms.
WHEN YOUR GOOD, YOUR GOOD ! ! !
He makes a great point about disabling the fuel system for a compression test, and having the throttle open. Adding fuel, or anything other than air to a cylinder during the test can lead to very unreliable readings. In actual fact, for inexperienced fellas, or diy boys it makes more sense to use the amperage method, it is every bit as good a test. I have had plenty of engines with good compression readings still have internal mechanical problems.
man the beard! ain't ya had that since 12? great video as usual Eric, keep em coming
Dave is correct. "Conventional current" was imagined by Franklin. His idea of current flowing from "+" to "-" is the reason that the arrows on schematic diagrams for things like diodes, transistors, and similar devices point in the direction they do, which is the opposite of electron current.
Excellent video. Thanks for making it.
3:50 +1 for the "If it ain't red, leave it in the shed" poster on the wall.
Great video, thanks Eric, this has helped me solve a similar issue.
Superb video!
Another terrific vlog.
Great video and I have been looking into getting a scope looks like a peco for the win
Another great vid Eric. It would have been cool to see a secondary from both banks on that relative comp waveform.
It could have possibly shown cam timing confirmed.
you blew up my brain i bought the earthquake gun but i'm not buying diagnostic machine as long as i'm watching your channel thank you for posting
Some excellent diagnostic tests. Thanks
Excellent information.Thanks!
love these in depth video's
Will be looking for part 2
Jeez man you have a lotta kit and special tools I'm very impressed. Another great video, keep 'em comin..
No decent mechanic could do the right job without them and the ability to use them.
Awesome video Eric and Thornton is the man on that stuff. That is a neat feature never paid attention that you could turn off the injectors on them. Glad to see the Pico out And nice that you have the pressure transducer. I'm still saving for mine lol. Great Job and thanks for all your hard work
Thanks for sharing the files, didn't know you could view them for free.
Great diagnostic video! Would love to see repair done in a video.
HI Eric if you look closely at the exhaust pocket zoomed in you will see a definite point where it starts to ramp up when exhaust vale opens on good cylinder compared to the bad cylinder where it is more gradual
I wish we had more people like you, that are dedicated to doing it right. I know many in my area that we call parts changers and bill you for it with out fixing the problem. I am disabled now and can no longer do my own work and things are above my skill level now. I love to watch your work and you are hard one to follow, you have great skill. Thank you for your time.
As mentioned to me years ago - your tools can make you or break you , the smoke machine test - showed smoke coming out the exhaust pipe and knowing the timing indicators aligned properly - pulling the head is the call 🤔👍✌️
Boy, how lucky. Cyl 5 at TDC on compression stroke without hunting for it. Hopefully you have gotten yourself a tens unit by now, one of the best purchases I've ever made.
Lol is that a pic of Scotty Kilmer on the dry erase board holding a chainsaw? Love the videos by the way. Keep on educating us. Every little bit helps. Thanks
Wow great diagnostic video. Great work!
Good job and thanks.
Good luck with PT, never did me any good post back surgeries... I did get a Health Mater Forever TENS unit on Amazon and that helped. If you look around the Amazon you can find the sticky pads cheap and in bulk. I did have to swap out the jacks to use the cheaper pads but it was well worth it, I shortened the cables and hardened everything with heat shrink. Now I just toss it in my pants pocket and run it all day.
well done,sam
nice job thank you for the education
I keep saying it and I'll say it again...ERIC IS A GENIUS...and he can predict the future :: )
I like the fact that you shared those Pico files. Great stuff to play around with. That's all I can do I realized after I saw that price. hehe
Cool beans, great vid!
I plan on doing that every time I have a video using it. I mean the software is free and no reason why you guys can't have a peek at it too right?
I just downloaded the software and the files. It is so cool to see what you are seeing on my own computer! I want a Picoscope but they are too expensive for me (DIY). This is the next best thing! Keep doing videos like this. I always learn something new.
Indeed, it's a great thing, it feels like I'm there in the shop with you looking through the data and stuff. That Pico thingie is an amazing tool to have. Great stuff, can't wait to see more data files in the future. :D
Since the customer knew it was the #5 cyl, Someone already did some testing before it got to Eric. If you want the proof of concept, go to Eric. He Da Man. Lucky it wasn't on the other bank. Nice to wake up to South Main Auto And a strong cup of coffee.
Great video (as usual)
Good job dude 👍
Another great video
Great information and troubleshooting, for sure and for certain.
great video Eric O you can use the WPS500 in other ways and import them into the in cylinder waveform to see the realationship ex intake vacuum running and cranking look for anomilies in the vacuum pulls tailpipe with the j shaped stiff pico hose exhaust valve problems stick out dipstick for piston ring issues take care
Yeah I still have a lot of discovery with it :D
Loved Sheba (dog) sniffing the car at the end of the video. Low compression is definitely not due to contraband. "Detected something under the seat. There's your problem, lady!"
that smoke tester really puts out! makes the one at my shop look like a joke, i might have to get one of those!
Do the Physio exactly as they tell you to. I've got Psoriatic Arthritis and Anti inflammatory drugs like Naproxen help but Physio helps more. Because of the arthritis I tend to not wanna move, but moving is exactly what needs to be done to help.
Arthritis sucks but it's not too bad if you catch it early enough. I put off going to the doc for too long and ruined a lot of joints. I'll never be able to do gymnastics again.... of course I never did before...lol
Take care and thanks for the video.
I watched this whole video and honestly it’s really helping me get ideas for issues my Accord v6 is having. I’m also needing to do my timing belt but never even knew how to easily check it until just now when he showed how to check it
Your the Man Eric
I'LL BE LOOKIN FOR PART 2 OF THIS ONE. HAPPY FALL AT 4:04 PM YOUR TIME FRIDAY SEP 22.
Great video !!!! Pico is awsome!!!!
Nice diagnostic video Eric. However, I believe to be your third Hondo video with rather low miles and needing major work.
Take care of that shoulder! I got bad diagnosis years ago, now there isnt much left to fix. PT is better than the alternative.
Amazing video, thanks a bunch.
Coffee and South Main in the morning, nice.
Hell of a clean 05 Accord.. :-)
great video ...Thanks
Wow very nice video thanks!
33:12 nice vape ring. Great diag Eric
Oh yeah compression checks are just like changing oil right? Lol couldn’t even begin to imagine… I have a crazy issue with my 05 Honda Accord. But mine has sat for 2 years with a full tank of low grade gas. I’m hoping that’s the only problem I have aside from needing to do maintenance. Love these videos