The history of D&D isn't exactly something I expected on The Cold War, but it is for me a very nostalgic topic. I was a game geek back in the 70's and 80's and still own a vintage set of the small, tan colored D&D booklets that was released in the form of a Collector's Edition box set.
My dad and I used to play some of Milton Bradley's war games back in the 70's, things like Sub Search, Tank Battle and Stratego. In around 1977 my mom gave us for Christmas a set of Avalon-Hill's D-Day, about the 1944 invasion of Normandy. We loved it and I still have that set stashed away.
I also still have Avalon Hill D Day and enjoy how the challenges change over the turns. First, getting ashore, then breaking out, liberating Paris, dashing east while not outrunning supply, breaking through the West Wall, and finally crossing the Rhine. Recently purchased used copies of Panzer Leader and Panzer Blitz
We are definitely going to come back to the Satanic Panic in a future episode! It is a really fascinating topic on its own but even more so when framed as being just one more moral panic in a long line of moral panics
As a long haired greasy teen wearing an Iron Maiden T-shirt and players handbook in my stack of books, while living in southern part of the Bible Belt I remember it well.
I still remember my friend trying to explain it to me . 7th grade 1978 he said his sister who was going to college at the time had a bunch of friends over the night before and were playing a game using mostly dice and note books . Could not wrap my head around it but 2 weeks later He had found were to get the books and dice. I think it was the dragon sitting on gold book ….. I think it was tinted blue. It spread fast 1 kid borrowed the book and xeroxed about 5 books at his moms office. Then the players hand book dungeon masters guide came out.. The last year of high school we had about 30 players in our school . It lasted about 2 years after high school before we went our separate ways . Looking back it helped bring outcasts together who became friends and helped get through rough times in high school . 🤘
This led me into a bit of deep dive because I thought there was an error at 13:24. (It wasn't an error.) You say the Basic Set was the "blue box". I got my Basic Set sometime around 1982 or 1983. By then the basic set was "the red box" (although my copy was kind of closer to a magenta-pink rather than red). For me the "blue box" was always the "Expert D+D" boxed set that came out around that time, and which I got a year or two later before moving on to AD+D. So, I was unaware that there was an earlier version of the basic set that was in a blue box. But a bit of googling later I now have a better idea of the history of those early boxed sets. Thanks for sending me down this rabbit hole. Now I have more knowledge to use in the critical task of establishing myself as the alpha geek in the room. ;-)
Yeah, in the earliest "Boxed D&D days" after 1977, you effectively have (arguably) four different games called D&D, and one called AD&D. The earliest boxed editions of the "new" D&D (Holmes, 1977), (Moldvay-Cook, 1981) are pretty much "here is an introductory game of D&D. If you want to go past 3rd level, play AD&D". Later on, in the Expert expansion for the 1982 game, there was a sense that D&D was a different game than AD&D. This continued with the "Basic/Expert/Companion/Master/Immortal rules" (D&D BECMI, Mentzer, 1983-1985). It wasn't until third edition AD&D where they finally just put the "Advanced" wording to bed and D&D effectively was cancelled, with AD&D being re-named to D&D. This was almost certainly better for sales and customer retention. The early-mid 90s had TSR producing FAR too many products, product lines, campaign settings, etc.
I started playing D&D in 1982. Met Gary once in Spokane, WA. He was a good guy. This game has changed so much over the decades. I stopped playing when 3.5 edition was usurped by the horrible 4th edition.
It's game that has changed and evolved, as it was always designed to do. D&D is part of a legacy of evolution in games. Hopefully future versions may be able to draw you back in
Started in the '80s myself as an 8 year old playing with my older brother and cousins. Was reintroduced in college in the middle '90s and played D&D through 3.5. Also stopped playing D&D when 4th edition came out, but switched to other settings and rule systems that were more in line with my group. But always have been fascinated by the history of D&D, where everything originated. Thanks!
@@alemander_01Nice thing about D&D, along with other TSR games was their adaptability to customization and house rules. A friend and I have redone Gamma World set in the Fallout world.
I see the rise of 5th edition, and the rise of critical role as return to form for d&d. however, like usual the owner’s of d&d destroyed the fanbase’s good will with their ogl fiasco. Seriously the owners of d&d make 1 highly successful edition of their role playing game and think they’re untouchable. Imagine if d&d didn’t have to deal with usually terrible even edition’s essentially going from stride to stride. The game would be massive it would have a rpg on the scale of bg3 every year, it’s movies would be marginally successful enough to become a franchise, it would be more mainstream/profitable than ever before.
The Cold War, can you please make a video on Argentina during the era of Juan Peron. It would mean a lot to me if you made a video on this topic, since your audience will understand how Argentina's economy, politics and society all ended up as they are today.
Very insightful content. I wonder if you could consider creating an bio-vid about Jan Karski or Witold Pilecki? I feel as if their heroic stories are unknown to some ppl. Basically they've made their life mission to inform the world about the atrocities conducted by the Germans. The Hollywood movies don't fully portray those crimes as they were far worse in real life. I had some filmmaking / acting experience and I swear it's about time to accurately represent Polish bravery and German's cruelty. My whole family was affected by WWII. I had a Jewish uncle who was a Holocaust survivor and lost his mother during a Nazi raid when he was only 14. We have to keep the memory about it alive no matter how painful it may seem. Also; equally important is the story of Irena Sendler and Julian Grobelny.
Absolutely, Yan Karsky . Even b4 the Ken Burns PBS production which was great. If more ppl did the background on Karsky , he's probably one of the most unknowns and unsung heroes of the holocaust immigration plight.
Love this little series you're doing about the Cold War origins of geeky franchises ! The Star Trek video was great, and now this! I'd love to see one about WarHammer as well as Star Wars
Growing up, my dad and I enjoyed chess and Stratego. I don't guess it ever occurred to me that D&D grew out from military tactic style games. Thank you for another interesting episode. God be with you out there everybody. ✝️ :)
I spent my teenage / young man Cold War days playing SPI games - Next War, MechWar, China War, AirWar, Phanton & Foxbat; so many wargames with SPI spending quite a bit of effort during the Cold War making games and sims of wars that may happen. That might be a good topic to cover here.
I was first introduced to D&D with 4th edition, but then played mostly 3rd Lots of good memories rolling the dice and enjoying Baldur's gate 3 at the moment
Just after Wizards of the Coast bought D&D in 1997 Baldur's Gate was released in 1998. Baldur's Gate 2 was released in 2000. Both follow AD&D 2nd edition rules. I played through BG2 about 20 years ago when I was a teenager or more likely in my early 20s. Now I'm playing it for the second time. This time the 2013 Expanded Edition. Even my gaming name Bhaalspawn84 stuck for 20 years from BG. Icewind Dale (2000) also uses 2nd edition AD&D rules but Icewind Dale 2 (2002) uses 3rd edition rules. Neverwinter Nights (2002) not only uses 3rd edition rules but is a 3D game not an isometric one. I remember waiting to have a PC capable of running it.
Well wasn't expecting this but definitely interested. Did my D&D thing back in the day, both on the table and on the C64 (thank you SSI for your Gold Box games).
Moved on from AD&D to Aftermath. It was an RPG similar to Advanced Dungeons and Dragons but using modern technology in a post apocalyptic Earth with a population reduced by 99 percent. I always ended up as a Dungeon Master / Game Master as I like enforcing RULES (edited) and am pretty creative. Miss those times and my 50 plus Avalon Hill games, especially Jutland and Victory in the Pacific.
I played Victory in the Pacific as a kid with my dad. Plus he had Civil War games like Terrible Swift Sword. I remember War at Sea as a kind of simplified version of the Pacific game. We had others, too, but I don't remember them all. It's cool to meet someone else who played these games!
It should be noted that although Greyhawk was one of the first supplements released for OD&D, it was NOT a campaign setting. It was a rules expansion that included now core classes like the thief, and spells. It had very, very little, if any information about the setting itself. It wasn't until the Greyhawk Folio that you got actual information on the setting. The Temple of the Frog was featured in the supplement to follow, Arneson's Blackmoor supplement, again, a rules expansion, not a campaign setting nor a module as we know it.
A very fair assessment. You missed some crucial details but that’s completely a-ok considering the format of the vid. I get it. I imagine that, if you’re not already, you’d enjoy the ODD74 and/or Dragonsfoot forums wherein we discuss and still play older or the original iterations/editions of the game. I began playing in the late 80s but went “backwards”, finding the earlier editions easier, more solid and far more malleable. I love your vids and I hope you join us. After all…a bunch of us love Cold War gaming with Top Secret and other games as well. Heh. Cheers, man!
I believe, that my first contact with D&D was via ET movie (they were playing this game on the night of the first contact. Also in "Strange Things" they were also playing this game). My first contact with role-playing games was at the beginning of 90', and that time it was AD&D
"This is...Cold War-adjacent." Lmao, I was wondering how you would tie this to Cold War politics. And the answer is, nah, it's just the history of D&D 😂
Post WWII miniature war gaming also grew in popularity especially in the 1950s. During WWII there were shortages of materials used in the manufacture of toy soldiers, many of the would be player base were busy, there weren't many rules for how to play, and there weren't any clubs around yet for war gaming.
D&D is the grandmother of many todays great computer games. As a kid I never had the money to buy D&D but it inspired me to make my own. One day may parents got home only to see their big bedsheet with checker pattern on the floor. Me and my friends playing rule based wargame with battleships, Carrier and airplanes built by Lego.
Growing up I was fortunate to have a couple of hobby shops nearby that dealt in strategy and role-playing games. I still own several of them, including a bunch of books from the best science fiction RPG ever published...GDW's Traveller.
Anyone interested in a VERY deep dive of D&D/AD&D/role-playing game history, I highly recommend Shannon Appelcline's "Designers & Dragons" series of books/ebooks/audiobooks. There are four volume, one for the 70s, 80s, 90s, and 2000s, with a good addendum which covers the period shortly thereafter.
I played the original white box edition in 1975. I still have it although the original box is quite battered. I had already played a Three Musketeers world role playing game called En Garde. I also still have that book. Later in 1975 my nerd group discovered Empire of the Petal Throne which we continued to play up until Covid ended our in person playing in 2020. I once in 1986 made a list of all of the different RPGs I had played at least once and stopped counting at over 80. I still play 5th ed once or twice a week. I guess that makes me an ubernerd.
5:00 that's funny, Gettysburg immediately proving it's popularity among gamers... I'm pretty sure one of my first RTS games was also just called Gettsyburg 😅
i remember the different colored box, but I was more into Middle Earth. I still have the 3rd edition rule books behind me, I think it was the best version. So many options to build characters and a lot of different worlds to play in. The main reason I enjoyed those old school RPG was the team work. Or as a GM, to challenge the players. There was always a good solution, a bad one and the crazy ideas players had.
Started playing D&D in 2003 and I'm still doing it! Well, it and many other systems and settings. I was expecting if D&D got inside the Iron Curtain and how...
"socially malfeasant" - good RPing is the opposite of this, and the game itself is social af in its nature. It just happened to be the one place where we could be ourselves and not catch flak from everyone else. A good half the fun was just getting together and hanging out.
It really threw me when I heard you pronounce "Gygax". I had the odd notion that I could have been that wrong for so many decades. I was relieved to find out I was not wrong. :D
I would like to have heard more about his analysis in the last few minutes of the presentation - what he said was really interesting and seemed to explain a lot, but I would like to have had it more developed with reasons and examples.
Don't know why the military was so against d&d. When I was drafted people said to never mention I play it in interviews. It was said that d&d indicated detachment from reality (while hard partying didn't)... Later, in cadet school, I played Magic with other cadet who also had Magic cards and the instructor saw us and looked like they caught us doing drugs
I remember the D&D craze when I was in high school. In school I was one of the athletic/jock/cool dudes. Unlike most of them I thought of geeks as people that were far ahead of everyone else. Plus most were nice dudes that I had no issue sitting next to me at lunch. I used to watch them play D&D in the morning before class started. I had no idea what I was looking at. I wouldn't have gotten through algebra without their help. I waged my own cold war with those that tried to bully geeks while I was around. 🥊👊🏾
What was nerd culture in the soviet block like? I know chess was popular. Fantasy literature like Tolkien filtered in with a trickle through bootleg copies. I've been told even access to a copy machine was not easy. Historically, I find it interesting to look at which games were adjacent to eachother. What was happening in Chaosium, WEG, White Wolf etc at any given time. Ones from WEG and WW who puttered off to their own sides to Mayfair who got accused of copyright infringement at times.
Also, as you’re interested in history and (now I see, in gaming), I strongly encourage you to read Jon Peterson’s amazing book “Playing at the World”. It is a fully in-depth and exhaustively researched look at the birth of the hobby and the birth of D&D. It’s not to be missed. Peterson did superb and yeoman work on his research and the like. It’s…amazing and nigh without peer.
What makes table top role playing games popular after so many decades? As both a Game master and player it's that you can try stuff that you can;t in a computer RPG game. When I GM and one of the players come up with an idea I had not planned on but is super cool I'll say take a 10 minute break and think of how to wing it. _My best old man voice_ Back in the day playing it used to be a sausage fest. Men and women do approach problems in a different way, ex gf and one of her friends were "girl fighting" the big bad, they didn't know he was wearing a kevlar vest. They were both going for crotch shots, fire extinguisher sprayed to the face, knocking him to the floor and pinning his hand to the floor with a knife. It was one of the best fights I've ever run cause they were by-passing his armor without even knowing it. :)
No. It had been translated into French and German by the late 80s but was also competing with local spin-off RPGs by that time. But D&D never made it to the other side of the Wall before it all came down.
@@TheColdWarTV I can see several sessions happening at the Kremlin with Gorbachev DMing, and a young Putin playing the charismatic, yet ruthless, rogue.
I think the Vietnam experience was crucial in the game success. Going down foxholes, looting villages and dehumanizing one's enemies as monsters was part & parcel of the Vietnam long hangover.
@@yogikhan1936 At least in Poland tabletop role-playing games like D&D became relatively popular quite quickly after the fall of communism. But D&D itself didn't achieve the same dominant position; having to compete with other games, like Warhammer Fantasy Roleplay, Vampire: The Masquerade (and other World of Darkness games), Call of Cthulhu or Cyberpunk 2020 (it's not a coincidence that a Polish studio made the videogame adaptation of this franchise), as well as Polish games like _Kryształy Czasu_ (Crystals of Time) or _Dzikie Pola_ (Wild Fields).
@@Artur_M. How about The Witcher series? The books I mean. I only know it is from the 90s but how it was during this period that these games were geting launched in Poland?
@@luisfelipegoncalves4977 The author of the Wicher books - Andrzej Sapkowski actually played a role in popularising such games in Poland, writing articles about them in magazines about sci-fi and fantasy (since 1993 writing articles for a magazine dedicated to TRPGs - "Magia i Miecz") and even created his own game in 1995: "Oko Yrrhedesa" (the Eye of Yrrhedes). It had no relation to the world and characters of his books. It was supposed to be simple and beginners-friendly. I don't think it got very popular, though. I've only heard about it as a curiosity. But in general, it's safe to say that the same crowd was into RPGs (both tabletop and computer ones) and Sapkowski's books.
"Gig ax" tho? Really? Well done otherwise, but that was painful. Tell you what I remember about ET. My mom made me throw away my D&D box set in 81 because of the panic. So here I am watching this movie with her, and the kids are playing D&D and one of them calls another one "penis breath." Not helping, guys. Not helping. Great movie tho.
A game that would tie more directly to the Cold War is Twilight: 2000 from GDW, which was released in 1984. In this game, NATO and the Warsaw Pact go to war, tac nukes get used, and everything just falls apart. You play American soldiers trapped in Poland, trying to survive and maybe someday get home. GDW was also a wargame publisher, so it was very detailed in terms of arms and equipment. In a total surprise to me, the game was revived by a Swedish company (Free League) with a hugely successful Kickstarter. Having lived through the Cold War myself (I got into D&D in 1979), I didn't think there was any nostalgia for a game like T:2000 but it has had a successful comeback. The new game retains the original setup but also offers Sweden as an alternate place to start a campaign. en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Twilight:_2000
The history of D&D isn't exactly something I expected on The Cold War, but it is for me a very nostalgic topic. I was a game geek back in the 70's and 80's and still own a vintage set of the small, tan colored D&D booklets that was released in the form of a Collector's Edition box set.
Growing up during this era, I always find documentaries about D&D's impact interesting.
My dad and I used to play some of Milton Bradley's war games back in the 70's, things like Sub Search, Tank Battle and Stratego. In around 1977 my mom gave us for Christmas a set of Avalon-Hill's D-Day, about the 1944 invasion of Normandy. We loved it and I still have that set stashed away.
I also still have Avalon Hill D Day and enjoy how the challenges change over the turns. First, getting ashore, then breaking out, liberating Paris, dashing east while not outrunning supply, breaking through the West Wall, and finally crossing the Rhine. Recently purchased used copies of Panzer Leader and Panzer Blitz
Plus the satanic panic regarding the game
There was a nice artistic depiction of this in the latest (as of writing this comment) season of Stranger Things. Eddie Munson FTW
We are definitely going to come back to the Satanic Panic in a future episode! It is a really fascinating topic on its own but even more so when framed as being just one more moral panic in a long line of moral panics
@@TheColdWarTVto which we’re in the middle of ANOTHER one involving queer/trans folks.
As a long haired greasy teen wearing an Iron Maiden T-shirt and players handbook in my stack of books, while living in southern part of the Bible Belt I remember it well.
Personally I think that was a marketing tactic lol
I still remember my friend trying to explain it to me . 7th grade 1978 he said his sister who was going to college at the time had a bunch of friends over the night before and were playing a game using mostly dice and note books . Could not wrap my head around it but 2 weeks later
He had found were to get the books and dice. I think it was the dragon sitting on gold book ….. I think it was tinted blue.
It spread fast 1 kid borrowed the book and xeroxed about 5 books at his moms office. Then the players hand book dungeon masters guide came out.. The last year of high school we had about 30 players in our school . It lasted about 2 years after high school before we went our separate ways . Looking back it helped bring outcasts together who became friends and helped get through rough times in high school . 🤘
This led me into a bit of deep dive because I thought there was an error at 13:24. (It wasn't an error.) You say the Basic Set was the "blue box". I got my Basic Set sometime around 1982 or 1983. By then the basic set was "the red box" (although my copy was kind of closer to a magenta-pink rather than red). For me the "blue box" was always the "Expert D+D" boxed set that came out around that time, and which I got a year or two later before moving on to AD+D. So, I was unaware that there was an earlier version of the basic set that was in a blue box. But a bit of googling later I now have a better idea of the history of those early boxed sets. Thanks for sending me down this rabbit hole. Now I have more knowledge to use in the critical task of establishing myself as the alpha geek in the room. ;-)
Yeah, in the earliest "Boxed D&D days" after 1977, you effectively have (arguably) four different games called D&D, and one called AD&D. The earliest boxed editions of the "new" D&D (Holmes, 1977), (Moldvay-Cook, 1981) are pretty much "here is an introductory game of D&D. If you want to go past 3rd level, play AD&D". Later on, in the Expert expansion for the 1982 game, there was a sense that D&D was a different game than AD&D. This continued with the "Basic/Expert/Companion/Master/Immortal rules" (D&D BECMI, Mentzer, 1983-1985). It wasn't until third edition AD&D where they finally just put the "Advanced" wording to bed and D&D effectively was cancelled, with AD&D being re-named to D&D. This was almost certainly better for sales and customer retention. The early-mid 90s had TSR producing FAR too many products, product lines, campaign settings, etc.
I started playing D&D in 1982. Met Gary once in Spokane, WA. He was a good guy. This game has changed so much over the decades. I stopped playing when 3.5 edition was usurped by the horrible 4th edition.
It's game that has changed and evolved, as it was always designed to do. D&D is part of a legacy of evolution in games. Hopefully future versions may be able to draw you back in
Started in the '80s myself as an 8 year old playing with my older brother and cousins. Was reintroduced in college in the middle '90s and played D&D through 3.5. Also stopped playing D&D when 4th edition came out, but switched to other settings and rule systems that were more in line with my group. But always have been fascinated by the history of D&D, where everything originated. Thanks!
@@alemander_01Nice thing about D&D, along with other TSR games was their adaptability to customization and house rules.
A friend and I have redone Gamma World set in the Fallout world.
@@TheColdWarTV5E is good.
I see the rise of 5th edition, and the rise of critical role as return to form for d&d. however, like usual the owner’s of d&d destroyed the fanbase’s good will with their ogl fiasco. Seriously the owners of d&d make 1 highly successful edition of their role playing game and think they’re untouchable. Imagine if d&d didn’t have to deal with usually terrible even edition’s essentially going from stride to stride. The game would be massive it would have a rpg on the scale of bg3 every year, it’s movies would be marginally successful enough to become a franchise, it would be more mainstream/profitable than ever before.
The Cold War, can you please make a video on Argentina during the era of Juan Peron. It would mean a lot to me if you made a video on this topic, since your audience will understand how Argentina's economy, politics and society all ended up as they are today.
😂😂😂 Love the Ferris Bueller reference. That was awesome
Probably my favourite part of the episode, tbh 😂
This is an unexpected topic, but a welcome one.
Very insightful content. I wonder if you could consider creating an bio-vid about Jan Karski or Witold Pilecki? I feel as if their heroic stories are unknown to some ppl. Basically they've made their life mission to inform the world about the atrocities conducted by the Germans. The Hollywood movies don't fully portray those crimes as they were far worse in real life. I had some filmmaking / acting experience and I swear it's about time to accurately represent Polish bravery and German's cruelty. My whole family was affected by WWII. I had a Jewish uncle who was a Holocaust survivor and lost his mother during a Nazi raid when he was only 14. We have to keep the memory about it alive no matter how painful it may seem. Also; equally important is the story of Irena Sendler and Julian Grobelny.
Absolutely, Yan Karsky . Even b4 the Ken Burns PBS production which was great. If more ppl did the background on Karsky , he's probably one of the most unknowns and unsung heroes of the holocaust immigration plight.
@@frankknudsen842 Thank you for the reply.
Love this little series you're doing about the Cold War origins of geeky franchises ! The Star Trek video was great, and now this! I'd love to see one about WarHammer as well as Star Wars
Star Wars: yes!
Warhammer? We'll, I don't play Warhammer 😂
@alexxxelleringtonwatch Jordan Sorcerery for great warhammer history
Well done David! A refreshing change from your usual content.
I am going to choose to take this as a compliment! 😂
@@TheColdWarTV It does read like a back-handed comment, doesn't it?
Rolled a twenty on this one, David. Thanks.
I never thought I would never see any references to Dungeons & Dragons on this channel 🤘.
There is an older video about Tolkien censorship in the URSS
Growing up, my dad and I enjoyed chess and Stratego. I don't guess it ever occurred to me that D&D grew out from military tactic style games. Thank you for another interesting episode.
God be with you out there everybody. ✝️ :)
I spent my teenage / young man Cold War days playing SPI games - Next War, MechWar, China War, AirWar, Phanton & Foxbat; so many wargames with SPI spending quite a bit of effort during the Cold War making games and sims of wars that may happen. That might be a good topic to cover here.
I started to enjoy and play D&D because of critical role and their love of RPGs. Hope D&D continues on.
Intro music is THE BEST! Never fails to engage me.
Just started playing last year and while it’s VERY time consuming but with the right amount of players and a good Dungeon Master it’s fun!
Sounds like you are doing it correctly. 😃
This is a legit, true gamer classic. My compliments to the chef.
I was first introduced to D&D with 4th edition, but then played mostly 3rd
Lots of good memories rolling the dice and enjoying Baldur's gate 3 at the moment
D&D was among the last things I expected on this channel.
Played a ton of AD&D when I was stationed in Germany back in the Cold War days, but Twilight: 2000 seemed alot more realistic! Great video!
Just after Wizards of the Coast bought D&D in 1997 Baldur's Gate was released in 1998. Baldur's Gate 2 was released in 2000. Both follow AD&D 2nd edition rules. I played through BG2 about 20 years ago when I was a teenager or more likely in my early 20s. Now I'm playing it for the second time. This time the 2013 Expanded Edition. Even my gaming name Bhaalspawn84 stuck for 20 years from BG. Icewind Dale (2000) also uses 2nd edition AD&D rules but Icewind Dale 2 (2002) uses 3rd edition rules. Neverwinter Nights (2002) not only uses 3rd edition rules but is a 3D game not an isometric one. I remember waiting to have a PC capable of running it.
"Cold War Adjacent" Lovely!
Well wasn't expecting this but definitely interested. Did my D&D thing back in the day, both on the table and on the C64 (thank you SSI for your Gold Box games).
Watching this right after my Sunday d&d game.
Moved on from AD&D to Aftermath. It was an RPG similar to Advanced Dungeons and Dragons but using modern technology in a post apocalyptic Earth with a population reduced by 99 percent.
I always ended up as a Dungeon Master / Game Master as I like enforcing RULES (edited) and am pretty creative.
Miss those times and my 50 plus Avalon Hill games, especially Jutland and Victory in the Pacific.
I played Victory in the Pacific as a kid with my dad. Plus he had Civil War games like Terrible Swift Sword. I remember War at Sea as a kind of simplified version of the Pacific game. We had others, too, but I don't remember them all. It's cool to meet someone else who played these games!
It should be noted that although Greyhawk was one of the first supplements released for OD&D, it was NOT a campaign setting. It was a rules expansion that included now core classes like the thief, and spells. It had very, very little, if any information about the setting itself. It wasn't until the Greyhawk Folio that you got actual information on the setting. The Temple of the Frog was featured in the supplement to follow, Arneson's Blackmoor supplement, again, a rules expansion, not a campaign setting nor a module as we know it.
I survived the Satanic Panic. Forty years later, I’m immersed in Baldur’s Gate 3.
Hey, I caught that Ferris Bueller quote. Lol
George Orwell as also an avid war gamer, and he event complied his own rules into a pamphlet.
3rd Edition was such a fantastic game. It's downhill since 4th released. Thankfully, Paizo stepped up to save the day.
I'm curious did you ever play Warhammer 40K tabletop?
I never got into D&D, but I was a big wargamer (Avalon Hill, SPI, etc.). Personally, I resent TSR for how they destroyed SPI. Take care.
A very fair assessment. You missed some crucial details but that’s completely a-ok considering the format of the vid. I get it.
I imagine that, if you’re not already, you’d enjoy the ODD74 and/or Dragonsfoot forums wherein we discuss and still play older or the original iterations/editions of the game.
I began playing in the late 80s but went “backwards”, finding the earlier editions easier, more solid and far more malleable.
I love your vids and I hope you join us. After all…a bunch of us love Cold War gaming with Top Secret and other games as well. Heh.
Cheers, man!
I believe, that my first contact with D&D was via ET movie (they were playing this game on the night of the first contact. Also in "Strange Things" they were also playing this game). My first contact with role-playing games was at the beginning of 90', and that time it was AD&D
"This is...Cold War-adjacent." Lmao, I was wondering how you would tie this to Cold War politics. And the answer is, nah, it's just the history of D&D 😂
Straight-up nerd history 😂
Post WWII miniature war gaming also grew in popularity especially in the 1950s. During WWII there were shortages of materials used in the manufacture of toy soldiers, many of the would be player base were busy, there weren't many rules for how to play, and there weren't any clubs around yet for war gaming.
D&D is the grandmother of many todays great computer games. As a kid I never had the money to buy D&D but it inspired me to make my own. One day may parents got home only to see their big bedsheet with checker pattern on the floor. Me and my friends playing rule based wargame with battleships, Carrier and airplanes built by Lego.
Growing up I was fortunate to have a couple of hobby shops nearby that dealt in strategy and role-playing games. I still own several of them, including a bunch of books from the best science fiction RPG ever published...GDW's Traveller.
Yes, but what was Role Playing like on the Moscow side of the Iron Curtain? That would be most interesting
Anyone interested in a VERY deep dive of D&D/AD&D/role-playing game history, I highly recommend Shannon Appelcline's "Designers & Dragons" series of books/ebooks/audiobooks. There are four volume, one for the 70s, 80s, 90s, and 2000s, with a good addendum which covers the period shortly thereafter.
Intersting stuff🙂
I never played Dungeons and Dragons. I've heard of it but never played. But I've seen a few movies with it in the title.
I played the original white box edition in 1975. I still have it although the original box is quite battered. I had already played a Three Musketeers world role playing game called En Garde. I also still have that book. Later in 1975 my nerd group discovered Empire of the Petal Throne which we continued to play up until Covid ended our in person playing in 2020. I once in 1986 made a list of all of the different RPGs I had played at least once and stopped counting at over 80. I still play 5th ed once or twice a week. I guess that makes me an ubernerd.
5:00 that's funny, Gettysburg immediately proving it's popularity among gamers... I'm pretty sure one of my first RTS games was also just called Gettsyburg 😅
those game nights were some of the best :)
i remember the different colored box, but I was more into Middle Earth. I still have the 3rd edition rule books behind me, I think it was the best version. So many options to build characters and a lot of different worlds to play in. The main reason I enjoyed those old school RPG was the team work. Or as a GM, to challenge the players. There was always a good solution, a bad one and the crazy ideas players had.
Started playing D&D in 2003 and I'm still doing it! Well, it and many other systems and settings.
I was expecting if D&D got inside the Iron Curtain and how...
An interesting topic. When I think of D&D these days, the 80's based show Stranger Things comes to mind.
"socially malfeasant" - good RPing is the opposite of this, and the game itself is social af in its nature. It just happened to be the one place where we could be ourselves and not catch flak from everyone else. A good half the fun was just getting together and hanging out.
I mean this in the sense that it's a stereotype about the game that's never made sense to me.
It really threw me when I heard you pronounce "Gygax". I had the odd notion that I could have been that wrong for so many decades. I was relieved to find out I was not wrong. :D
I would like to have heard more about his analysis in the last few minutes of the presentation - what he said was really interesting and seemed to explain a lot, but I would like to have had it more developed with reasons and examples.
Ah, Avalon Hill, love those games too!
Don't know why the military was so against d&d. When I was drafted people said to never mention I play it in interviews. It was said that d&d indicated detachment from reality (while hard partying didn't)...
Later, in cadet school, I played Magic with other cadet who also had Magic cards and the instructor saw us and looked like they caught us doing drugs
Check out that movie Mazes and Monsters btw, it's hilarious.
18:14 Talking about the 80s & 90s & Spelljammer, but you have the 5e Spelljammer abomination on screen. Why not use a 2e pic?
do you have any more information about "fantasy game'?
its the first time i heard of it
thx
I was expecting an explanation of how the Soviets threatened American RPG supremacy
I remember the D&D craze when I was in high school. In school I was one of the athletic/jock/cool dudes. Unlike most of them I thought of geeks as people that were far ahead of everyone else. Plus most were nice dudes that I had no issue sitting next to me at lunch. I used to watch them play D&D in the morning before class started. I had no idea what I was looking at. I wouldn't have gotten through algebra without their help. I waged my own cold war with those that tried to bully geeks while I was around. 🥊👊🏾
21:46 missed the chance to say that "history has lawful neutral alignment and is rarely good or evil"
What was nerd culture in the soviet block like? I know chess was popular. Fantasy literature like Tolkien filtered in with a trickle through bootleg copies. I've been told even access to a copy machine was not easy.
Historically, I find it interesting to look at which games were adjacent to eachother. What was happening in Chaosium, WEG, White Wolf etc at any given time. Ones from WEG and WW who puttered off to their own sides to Mayfair who got accused of copyright infringement at times.
That cartoon show was amazing
Also, as you’re interested in history and (now I see, in gaming), I strongly encourage you to read Jon Peterson’s amazing book “Playing at the World”.
It is a fully in-depth and exhaustively researched look at the birth of the hobby and the birth of D&D. It’s not to be missed. Peterson did superb and yeoman work on his research and the like. It’s…amazing and nigh without peer.
the first rule of d&d was never talk about d&d around girls
What makes table top role playing games popular after so many decades? As both a Game master and player it's that you can try stuff that you can;t in a computer RPG game. When I GM and one of the players come up with an idea I had not planned on but is super cool I'll say take a 10 minute break and think of how to wing it.
_My best old man voice_ Back in the day playing it used to be a sausage fest. Men and women do approach problems in a different way, ex gf and one of her friends were "girl fighting" the big bad, they didn't know he was wearing a kevlar vest. They were both going for crotch shots, fire extinguisher sprayed to the face, knocking him to the floor and pinning his hand to the floor with a knife. It was one of the best fights I've ever run cause they were by-passing his armor without even knowing it. :)
Is there any way to find and buy this war chess game?
I am very curious if the game or something like it ever made it behind the Iron Curtain?
No. It had been translated into French and German by the late 80s but was also competing with local spin-off RPGs by that time. But D&D never made it to the other side of the Wall before it all came down.
@@TheColdWarTV I can see several sessions happening at the Kremlin with Gorbachev DMing, and a young Putin playing the charismatic, yet ruthless, rogue.
"Or cast Chill Touch on us." Please, if we really wanted to do something, we wouldn't use a simple cantrip.
I think the Vietnam experience was crucial in the game success. Going down foxholes, looting villages and dehumanizing one's enemies as monsters was part & parcel of the Vietnam long hangover.
Vietnam? Gtfo. It's got more to do with fantasy sci fi of the day. Nothing to do with Vietnam. More like LOTR.
I always preferred realistic tactic simulators like Harpoon or Panzerblitz.
Was expecting an eastern take on D&D but watched it anyways
You forgot to mention the Soviet version of the game
Gulags and Kulaks
Stalin as Tiamat?
Everybody loves Ferris Bueller.
Did AD&D pernitrate the Iron Curtin in Soviet Eastern Europe?
Simple answer, no. There were German language versions and knock offs by the late 1980s but it never made it across the Wall until after the collapse
@@TheColdWarTV Thank you.
@@yogikhan1936 At least in Poland tabletop role-playing games like D&D became relatively popular quite quickly after the fall of communism. But D&D itself didn't achieve the same dominant position; having to compete with other games, like Warhammer Fantasy Roleplay, Vampire: The Masquerade (and other World of Darkness games), Call of Cthulhu or Cyberpunk 2020 (it's not a coincidence that a Polish studio made the videogame adaptation of this franchise), as well as Polish games like _Kryształy Czasu_ (Crystals of Time) or _Dzikie Pola_ (Wild Fields).
@@Artur_M. How about The Witcher series? The books I mean. I only know it is from the 90s but how it was during this period that these games were geting launched in Poland?
@@luisfelipegoncalves4977 The author of the Wicher books - Andrzej Sapkowski actually played a role in popularising such games in Poland, writing articles about them in magazines about sci-fi and fantasy (since 1993 writing articles for a magazine dedicated to TRPGs - "Magia i Miecz") and even created his own game in 1995: "Oko Yrrhedesa" (the Eye of Yrrhedes). It had no relation to the world and characters of his books. It was supposed to be simple and beginners-friendly. I don't think it got very popular, though. I've only heard about it as a curiosity. But in general, it's safe to say that the same crowd was into RPGs (both tabletop and computer ones) and Sapkowski's books.
uhhhh ferris bueller reference at the beginning
"Gig ax" tho? Really? Well done otherwise, but that was painful.
Tell you what I remember about ET. My mom made me throw away my D&D box set in 81 because of the panic. So here I am watching this movie with her, and the kids are playing D&D and one of them calls another one "penis breath." Not helping, guys. Not helping. Great movie tho.
9:08 JEFFEY!!!!!
A game that would tie more directly to the Cold War is Twilight: 2000 from GDW, which was released in 1984. In this game, NATO and the Warsaw Pact go to war, tac nukes get used, and everything just falls apart. You play American soldiers trapped in Poland, trying to survive and maybe someday get home. GDW was also a wargame publisher, so it was very detailed in terms of arms and equipment. In a total surprise to me, the game was revived by a Swedish company (Free League) with a hugely successful Kickstarter. Having lived through the Cold War myself (I got into D&D in 1979), I didn't think there was any nostalgia for a game like T:2000 but it has had a successful comeback. The new game retains the original setup but also offers Sweden as an alternate place to start a campaign. en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Twilight:_2000
Good video but how does this relate to the Cold War?
And now kids can just boot up Skyrim.
Roll a saving throw!!!
A game that's been used in illegal drafting for military operations.
Great game. Revolution in nerd culture.
Has everyone been pronouncing Gygax wrong for the past 50 years?
GIGax? Never heard it pronounced that way in all my life.
"A few years"
roll d6
Eddie Munson. He’s a real one.
I am guilty as charged.
I think eminem has a big player in the cold war ..
Dungeons & algorithms
I have never played D&D. 😁😁😁😁😁😁
Nerd stuff. I love it.
No wonder many guys can't get dates
Guy-Jacks
Heh i nearly got kicked out of school for DND , yea it was a christian pvt school.
Watching the toxic nerd heads explode as they realize their precious fascist ideology has always wanted to ban their beloved games.
I played football, D&D and LoTR and Warhammer in college until I started to play with panties... Women may you lose time for geek games.😅
Ha ha 😂