HI, PLEASE READ THIS: 1) Part 5 of this video touches upon Michael Jackson and the documentary Leaving Neverland, but it does not go into detail about the content about the latter. If you would like to skip this section, it happens at 39:54-43:20 2) Unfortunately it seems that any comments with the word q*eer are automatically deleted on this channel. I've been working with YT's team to figure out why that is, as I have no filters on, but unfortunately it's still happening for now. Since this video is about LGBTQ experience, I just wanted to say that so nobody thinks I'm deleting the comments or something. So, so sorry about this!! But thanks for watching!!💝 What's your favorite Kenny Ortega movie?🌈
As a bi tenor whose two favorite rolls have been Berger and Jesus in Superstar and who grew up on disney, thank you so much for introducing me to my new Q idol 💗💙💜
I always felt Troy's story was a metaphor for bisexuality. Everyone told Troy he had to "pick one" and there was definitely more people pushing him to specifically pick the "right one".
Aassdffghjk Thank you for talking about Julie and the Phantoms!! Its certainly my new favorite Ortega production! Killer video as always! Will probably come back to rewatch a few times
I agree! It was the best show I'd seen in years. So mad Netflix didn't renew it. I also feel like the show had bisexual coding, and since Alex has a love interest, there were actually 2 openly gay characters.
This might be my favorite video you've done! When I was little, I was OBSESSED with High School Musical and ESPECIALLY SHARPAY. Fun Fact: This was undoubtedly unintentional, but her character could definitely be read as a lesbian experiencing comp-het (compulsory heterosexuality: lots of lesbians feel like they are attracted to men bc so much of womanhood is framed around men) since her infatuation with Troy stemmed from the ~image~ of them together rather than him as a person. I felt that same way about boys, which is probably why I resonated with her so much (also super feminine, pink, fun, glamour). Just thought I'd share! Loved this video!
Oh I love To Wong Fu, Thanks For Everything, Julie Numar! So when High School Musical was at the height of its popularity I was in my early 20's and working at Build-a-Bear Workshop. I would regularly host HSM themed birthday parties. I even went out of my way to borrow my sister's (who's 10 years younger) CD's and DVDs so I could learn the songs and some of the choreography. I loved seeing the kids' faces light up when I'd yell WHAT TEAM?? and they'd chant back at me WILDCATS!! The parents would specifically request me by name (which helped boost my hours)....but despite all this hard work and profit I was generating for the company, I got NO appreciation or thanks. My hours would get arbitrarily cut if my manager was in a bad mood. I was constantly berated, yelled at, humiliated in front of customers. Don't get me started on having to wear a gross mascot costume that NEVER got washed in the 6 years I worked there. All while HSM merch and soundtrack were blasted at me from all sides constantly. Over the years I ended up with a deep resentment of HSM and BABW (and capitalism!) BUT.....hearing your cover of What I've Been Looking For at the end made me genuinely emotional and nostalgic. I would quite like to watch the films again and listen to the soundtrack....what have you done to me???
the "what ive been looking for" rendition at the end was genius. ive never looked at the song in this light and it honestky brought me to tears. thank you so much for this video, ive never seen anyone put why i feel so much for his movies into words better than you have! this made my inner child so happy 🌈💗
Having just watched HSMTMTS for the first time and then a second time back to back this week... plus having an extremely rough day mental health wise today.... this came out at the perfect time for me. I was watching the video and thinking "I need to remember this point to comment" but they became so many I just need to say... this means a fucking lot to me. Thank you ❤
You mentioned that we were sometimes denied the vocabulary to describe our experiences and I feel that completely! I can remember the confusion I felt in middle school when I was bullied for being a "lesbo". I liked girls...but I also liked boys. So what does that make me? Everyone seemed to know I wasn't straight but I knew I wasn't a lesbian either. Then when I got into highschool, I heard the word bisexual for the first time...and everything came together. Well, until gender identity started entering the conversation recently and I understood that non-binary and gender fluid are things that exist...and then I realized why I felt so great dressing up as men or boys for Halloween, really cherished parts of my femininity but my connection with feminity would wax and wane. Vocabulary is so important when it comes to validation.
Okay the funny thing I just realized - I was around 11-12 and I was in love with High School Musical 2 when it came out. And I really loved singing as Troy whenever me, my sister and our friends would sing the songs and dance. I felt this weird gender stuff when watching it, much like most of the media I consumed starting from a young age. Now as a trans guy who’s been out for a good 5 years, it’s funny how a lot of that queer coding in HSM and even Hocus Pocus probably helped me a lot in discovering my queer identity, and I think that’s pretty neat haha.
Oooooh snap, coming back in the morning when I can commit to an hour long video. Shared on FB anyway! And will here on YT too, so excited to see this tomorrow! 🤩💜😍🥰
this video was amazing and indepth and really interesting! i didn't grow up with that much disney so i learned a lot that i hadn't heared about before in this one of my favorite songs, immaterial by the late SOPHIE references material girl, which wouldn't be the same without the video so even if kennys work wasn't often relevant in my life directly his reach is so far and from what i seen nowi love the direction that he's going into! It's really exciting to me in the same way that the shera reboot is
this video got me on a rollercoaster! Kenny made that aweful Let's do the time warp again????!!!!!!!!!!!! *SMH in spanish * OMG THERE'S ANOTHER JULIE AND THE PHANTOMS?????!!! *JOY SCREAMS IN SPANISH *
Ortega saying Disney is one of the most progressive companies he's worked with gave me whiplash lmao, well I guess that speaks about the state of the industry at the time. Incredible video btw!
Thank you for watching! I think that Ortega quote is nuanced and is best contextualized within the specific types of mainstream media he works in, also the fact that when he started acting it was a much different world than it is today. I think it’s also different for Disney because even though the company has been reluctant to completely embrace LGBTQ identities before the last few years, they did begin providing workplace protections and benefits for LGBTQ people before that was standard industry practice and I believe the Lesbian and Gay United Employees (LEAGUE) was the first of its kind in Hollywood. But, it still required employees to organize in the early 90s for Disney to do that. So, problematic history, but I can see how someone who grew up in a time when LGBTQ people were more fiercely rejected and then (after doing mainstream movies and music) worked in a company like Disney beginning in the early 90s can have positive experiences w/the company internally even if the public representation was different. And the fact that that part is couched between a sentence about whether or not having an openly LGBTQ character would have been “family-friendly” shows you what the standard was that he was up against.
or it speaks to his limited work experience. if you only worked at 2 or 3 companies saying x is the best/most anything is just fillabustah. now if you worked at 10 or more? im listening
Making me reflect on my young mega crush on Ryan Evans in a time where the heart throb being pushed was Zac Efron- I think I was just drawn to how Ryan was everything I wanted. He would just bounce through school hallways in a pastel pink shirt and hat, he could be himself and no one in the school says anything about it. I knew realistically anyone who had the guts to really act like Ryan at the time would’ve been bullied ruthlessly, so I think I just loved seeing this glimmer of who I wanted in a world I’d have rather been in. You know, the kind of world where break ups are best processed leaning against lockers singing about fairy tales
@@serenityq26 while I ultimately disagree with you about my reasonings since it’s me I’m going to take that and raise you one better- Chad and Ryan 100% fucked.
“I would rather talk about how we can simultaneously be inspired and disturbed by someone.” WOW. YES. That is the best response to cancel culture I’ve ever heard.
Whoa, I didn't realize Kenny Ortega did a lot more works than I realize. I absolutely love this deep dive and about Kenny Ortega and your complicated feelings with q*33rcoding. I feel you on that.
One project of Ortega's that wasn't mentioned: he did choreography for Dirty Dancing! One of the dance scenes in "Julie and the Phantoms" is an homage to it.
I don't know how this ended up on my recommended but I watched the whole thing and this hit so deep on why I loved all the movies and characters that I did, even if I didn't realize they were coded until this video. This is really well done, thank you.
the music in hsm & hsm2 was such a comfort for me the year I came out, and I was so excited when I heard y’all were doing this video! The snaps through the curtain that begin What I’ve Been Looking For?? Iconic!!! Kenny Ortega really is an icon!! Thanks to the whole team for all the work put into these videos, it does not go unnoticed!!
COME ON NOTIFICATIONS!!! Kenny Ortega is the ONE and Im so happy to hear more about him, literally my brother (straight) and I (so hella gay) always reel off his work whenever we mention him or HSM and he absolutely shaped our childhood - we have been changed for good (oh sorry, wrong musical 😂)
I love this video but one element of Descendants that I wish was discussed further and would like to share my thoughts on is the plot of the first movie being basically about a group of kids who ultimately find they have to cut ties with their parents because those parents weren't able to provide them a safe home environments. Obviously parental abuse isn't just a LGBT+ kid thing, plenty of kids regardless of gender identity or sexuality unfortunately have grown up in abusive environments. But for the villain kids this abuse is tied with an expectation to behave in a certain way. With Evie there's definitely a gender expectation thing going on with her plotline. Her mother taught her that looks were all that mattered and her plotline involved realizing that her intelligence and talents matter not trying to be pretty for the sake of a guy. Obviously not every LGBTQ+ kid has a bad relationship with their parents but for the ones that do, and for the cis straight kids growing up in an abusive environment I LOVE that there's this kid film saying that "it's okay to cut ties with your parents if they're not treating you right". As someone who has had to cut ties with my father (not because of me being a lesbian but due to just general emotional abuse) I can absolutely see the value in a story that tells kids (without ever actually using the word "abuse") that not all biological families are good and sometimes the support/found family from your friends is more what you actually need. There's a dynamic that forms with the villain kids, who are the only ones who can really get it. That scene where Mulan's daughter asks if their parents have made cookies with them and all the villain kids are confused, that scene hit INCREDIBLY hard all without saying the word "abuse". The dynamic of the VK's feels very similar to the found families that many LGBTQ folks have formed and it's nice to see that portrayed as a valid alternative. Knowing Ortega's work I feel it had to be intentional. Also I haven't seen the second movie in its entirety but Uma and Mal have BIG ex-girlfriends energy
I agree about the story, honestly - that would have been included if it had not already been running so long. Since there's never been a video this long on the channel before, we didn't want to completely overwhelm ourselves. I hope we can make more Descendants-related content in the future, though!
This video is SO important- like it belongs in textbooks and museums!! Thank you for your (continued) contribution(s) to the Q*eer (and Q*eer Disney and Q*eer entertainment) communities 🌟💕
I definitely felt what you said towards the end about resenting coded characters. I think that’s still the stage where I’m at. It’s so frustrating that we still don’t have many LGBTQ characters. But I do want to appreciate the work LGBTQ creators have done to get to where we are now, where Ortega can finally include a fully-developed gay character in his work. It inspires me to write more LGBTQ content myself. My sister really enjoyed Julie and the Phantoms, I’ll be sure to check it out too!
oh wow I didn't even know that he directed the Rocky Horror tribute/reboot! I love that special a lot. the original meant a lot to me as a tween, and I think the reboot captured its energy really well. it also updated some aspects of the original that haven't really aged that well. High School Musical was also incredibly important to me and my friends, since we were THE target demographic when it came out :P I related a lot to Kelcy at the time and nowadays people saying that she was also queercoded makes....a lot of sense lol as always, great video and cover!
I love the Descendants franchise and its affiliation with q*eerness. Dove Cameron, who plays Mal, has made many tweets about being bi herself and how she thinks Mal is bi and Maddie, one of the characters she plays on the tv show Liv and Maddie, is bi too. This makes me so happy.
This is a wonderful video - thank you for making it! I’m a big fan of the HSM soundtracks and this was a delight to watch. I love how there are these patterns in the songs from movie-to-movie (Troy Sings About Indecision While Doing A Sport; Gabriella Sings About How Troy Let Her Down While Leaning Against A Wall, etc) I also think it’s fascinating that in every movie the “I Want” song is performed not by either the two lead protagonists but by Sharpay who wants: 1) To return to the status quo 2) Fabulous 3) It all It’s such an interesting choice to always give the I Want narrative to the “antagonist” (although I was always team Sharpay and Ryan and think they were robbed in the winter musicalé!)
ok but who else loves singing along to the outro songs? just me? i'm just sitting here harmonizing while sketching and i wish the song could go on forever
Ok how do you make a 1 hour long video about a director I have never heard of and movies that I have no oppinions on and still have it feel like it was only 10 minutes long?
My Q experience was weird, I’ve only recently been reflecting on the clues leading to me being gay and non-binary in my childhood, though now I do see that Kenny Ortega has a big part in it. I quite literally grew up with high school musical (I was 2 when the first movie came out and I only started to reject the series when I was 12 because I was “too grown up” for that). I had three Halloween’s in a row where I played Sharpay. I know in this video you mostly focus on Ryan’s Q-coding and I think that’s definitely prevalent and important to the narrative you told here, but I think Sharpay evans is fully responsible for my obsession with hyperfemininity in the last year. I always adored her and I didn’t know why but there’s just something about her overperforming of gender I identified with. When I realized I was non-binary I thought I had to push myself into an androgynous-masculine aesthetic and I HATED it for years. Sharpay though, she overdramatized every single part of her personality and she 100% gave me the overly pink, overly poofy, and overly feminine aesthetic I love today. Kelsie and Sharpay almost single handedly shaped my wlw/nblw identity and I love them for it!
As bad as HSM and really most of the DCOM lineup are (let's be real here), I still have major respect for Kenny Ortega for going out there and doing all this for the LGBT community. Funny how that goes. Also, Mal X Evie forever.
Thank you SO much for mentioning "Julie & The Phantoms." Two openly gay character & also some bisexual coded characters. It was the best show I'd seen in years & I was so mad that Netflix didn't renew it for another season. The music is top notch & one dance scene is an homage to a movie Kenny Ortego did choreography for (Dirty Dancing.)
im so glad kenny ortega was there giving disney that good good q-coding when howard ashman couldn't any longer. ortega's work never spoke to my particular repression, but im glad it was there for those who it did speak to. thanks for showing how impactful his work was!
Newsies is the gayest movie/musical I’ve ever seen, literally everyone I’ve watched it with thought Jack was gonna get with Davey and not Sarah/Katherine
I absolutely LOVE Newsies!!! Newsies made me trans, I swear. I watched the 1992 movie as a kid and it changed my life, so I'm really excited to see that you touched on it briefly here and connected it to our community's culture! The tension between David and Jack always felt significant to me as a gay person. I never knew much about Kenny Ortega, so thank you for enlightening me :)
I love this video a lot... I just wanted to bring up the fact that in Descendants 3 there is a quite obviously coded achillean pairing.... Jay and Gil actively parallel the canon romantic pairings in the franchise. They even dance together during the final song of the movie, which is reserved only for canon/canon implied pairings.
Hey! Love this video! But could you put in a trigger warning if you're going to talk about things like you did in the part "What I really don't want to talk about" I was abused too, and it sent in a spiral because I wasn't prepared.
Ok, I agree that Space Between is really queer coded BUT everyone is ignoring the fact that Mal and Uma are obviously exes. That's very much the dynamic they're giving in the movies but also Disney released a short film between Descendants 2 and 3 where Mal and Uma sing "What Doesn't Kill You Makes You Stronger" at each other which is literally a song about getting over your ex. Also Harry is sort of queer coded.
sigh not sorry but now you talking about madonna and all i want to do is go on a deep dive and rewatch all her 80s videos. sigh MATERIAL GIRL IS GOOOOOOOOOD! ok byeeeeeeeeeeeeee
hey so it was under my understanding that leaving neverland was actually debunked multiple times? i mean no disrespect bringing this up btw! just thought it should be brought to your attention because there seems to be a lot of info disproving that documentary
This! It has been debunked, or at least a lot of the claims in it have been. When people make false accusations, it's such a slap in the face to people who have actually been abused in that way.
I loved this, when I was younger I didn't know what kept calling me about these movies and it makes sense, even when I didn't know how to put in words who I was, I knew how it felt and that these movies felt like a safe place for feeling that way. Thank you for your work, you're amazing 💖
lets go way back to when he worked with CHER in Las Vegas when she had her first residency at Caesars Palace....he was the choreography for that show in 1981....off to a great start there with CHER: A Celebration at Caesar's Palace....they had male stripped in the actual show. GAY! mmm i suspect she met him when she did her 1978 "CHER: Special" that has The Tubes Dolly Parton and Rod Stewart as guests.
Thanks for the video, love your channel! I notice that this video doesn't have captions enabled, just wondering if you know why? Most of your videos have the auto-captions which help me to catch the words I don't understand - but this one doesn't for some reason.
So sorry about that! I don't know why that is the case, must've turned it off by accident at some point along the way. I'll change it when I have time tomorrow and also make sure the other vids are auto-captioned as well.
FINALLY SOMEONE TALKING ABOUT KENNY ORTEGA!!! THANK YOU!!!! i have just realized the before watching this, i had never seen young kenny. he was always an old man to me lmao! also, i see your "mal and evie" and i raise you every other character in that franchise is not straight. i could go on and on in depth as to why, but i'll just say the last movie has a lot wrong with, but the fact that lowkey jay and gil are hinted as a possible couple is enough to make me forgive its sins
HI, PLEASE READ THIS:
1) Part 5 of this video touches upon Michael Jackson and the documentary Leaving Neverland, but it does not go into detail about the content about the latter. If you would like to skip this section, it happens at 39:54-43:20
2) Unfortunately it seems that any comments with the word q*eer are automatically deleted on this channel. I've been working with YT's team to figure out why that is, as I have no filters on, but unfortunately it's still happening for now. Since this video is about LGBTQ experience, I just wanted to say that so nobody thinks I'm deleting the comments or something. So, so sorry about this!!
But thanks for watching!!💝 What's your favorite Kenny Ortega movie?🌈
Newsies or hocus-pocus
My boi Kenny did the choreography for Dirty Dancing. Imaging Patrick Swayze lifting me up changed my life!!! 😳😏😉💃
As a bi tenor whose two favorite rolls have been Berger and Jesus in Superstar and who grew up on disney, thank you so much for introducing me to my new Q idol 💗💙💜
@Angelique Racine right?! The dots connect the more and more I think about it *insert conspiracy map meme here*
Descendants.... for nostalgia reasons
Why is this video an hour long?
When the gods send you a blessing, don’t ask why it was sent.
I always felt Troy's story was a metaphor for bisexuality. Everyone told Troy he had to "pick one" and there was definitely more people pushing him to specifically pick the "right one".
I saw that reading of the film mentioned within the last few years, and I love it. It makes complete sense.
That would explain why it spoke to me so much as a kid!
Definitely!
i actually felt Chad's journey (especially on hsm2 but not only) was a metaphor for bisexuality. but i think we can read it in troy's journey too.
He’s not the right father in the future who..kenny ortega he’s not my real father
The biggest surprise to me from this video was seeing how Kenny Ortega looked like in his younger years. Daaaaaamn
the ending cover made me tear up when the full meaning hit :'-)
Fun fact: as of now/the time of the comment no one has watched the video entirely therefore we are technically early.
Well.... ummmm I guess I was right?
Aassdffghjk
Thank you for talking about Julie and the Phantoms!! Its certainly my new favorite Ortega production!
Killer video as always! Will probably come back to rewatch a few times
I agree! It was the best show I'd seen in years. So mad Netflix didn't renew it. I also feel like the show had bisexual coding, and since Alex has a love interest, there were actually 2 openly gay characters.
This might be my favorite video you've done! When I was little, I was OBSESSED with High School Musical and ESPECIALLY SHARPAY. Fun Fact: This was undoubtedly unintentional, but her character could definitely be read as a lesbian experiencing comp-het (compulsory heterosexuality: lots of lesbians feel like they are attracted to men bc so much of womanhood is framed around men) since her infatuation with Troy stemmed from the ~image~ of them together rather than him as a person. I felt that same way about boys, which is probably why I resonated with her so much (also super feminine, pink, fun, glamour). Just thought I'd share! Loved this video!
Oh I love To Wong Fu, Thanks For Everything, Julie Numar!
So when High School Musical was at the height of its popularity I was in my early 20's and working at Build-a-Bear Workshop. I would regularly host HSM themed birthday parties. I even went out of my way to borrow my sister's (who's 10 years younger) CD's and DVDs so I could learn the songs and some of the choreography. I loved seeing the kids' faces light up when I'd yell WHAT TEAM?? and they'd chant back at me WILDCATS!! The parents would specifically request me by name (which helped boost my hours)....but despite all this hard work and profit I was generating for the company, I got NO appreciation or thanks. My hours would get arbitrarily cut if my manager was in a bad mood. I was constantly berated, yelled at, humiliated in front of customers. Don't get me started on having to wear a gross mascot costume that NEVER got washed in the 6 years I worked there. All while HSM merch and soundtrack were blasted at me from all sides constantly. Over the years I ended up with a deep resentment of HSM and BABW (and capitalism!) BUT.....hearing your cover of What I've Been Looking For at the end made me genuinely emotional and nostalgic. I would quite like to watch the films again and listen to the soundtrack....what have you done to me???
the "what ive been looking for" rendition at the end was genius. ive never looked at the song in this light and it honestky brought me to tears. thank you so much for this video, ive never seen anyone put why i feel so much for his movies into words better than you have! this made my inner child so happy 🌈💗
Having just watched HSMTMTS for the first time and then a second time back to back this week... plus having an extremely rough day mental health wise today.... this came out at the perfect time for me. I was watching the video and thinking "I need to remember this point to comment" but they became so many I just need to say... this means a fucking lot to me. Thank you ❤
You mentioned that we were sometimes denied the vocabulary to describe our experiences and I feel that completely! I can remember the confusion I felt in middle school when I was bullied for being a "lesbo". I liked girls...but I also liked boys. So what does that make me? Everyone seemed to know I wasn't straight but I knew I wasn't a lesbian either. Then when I got into highschool, I heard the word bisexual for the first time...and everything came together. Well, until gender identity started entering the conversation recently and I understood that non-binary and gender fluid are things that exist...and then I realized why I felt so great dressing up as men or boys for Halloween, really cherished parts of my femininity but my connection with feminity would wax and wane. Vocabulary is so important when it comes to validation.
Thank you so much for making this! I LOVE your longer video's ❤️
Okay the funny thing I just realized - I was around 11-12 and I was in love with High School Musical 2 when it came out. And I really loved singing as Troy whenever me, my sister and our friends would sing the songs and dance. I felt this weird gender stuff when watching it, much like most of the media I consumed starting from a young age. Now as a trans guy who’s been out for a good 5 years, it’s funny how a lot of that queer coding in HSM and even Hocus Pocus probably helped me a lot in discovering my queer identity, and I think that’s pretty neat haha.
Oooooh snap, coming back in the morning when I can commit to an hour long video. Shared on FB anyway! And will here on YT too, so excited to see this tomorrow! 🤩💜😍🥰
this video was amazing and indepth and really interesting! i didn't grow up with that much disney so i learned a lot that i hadn't heared about before in this
one of my favorite songs, immaterial by the late SOPHIE references material girl, which wouldn't be the same without the video so even if kennys work wasn't often relevant in my life directly his reach is so far and from what i seen nowi love the direction that he's going into! It's really exciting to me in the same way that the shera reboot is
this video got me on a rollercoaster!
Kenny made that aweful Let's do the time warp again????!!!!!!!!!!!! *SMH in spanish *
OMG THERE'S ANOTHER JULIE AND THE PHANTOMS?????!!! *JOY SCREAMS IN SPANISH *
I just learned that we are the same age :O
what do you mean cheetah girls 2 didn't have a Q undertone???? you really don't think Channel and Marisol were obviously in love??????
James Cameron’s avatar
Tbh It’s an lgbtq hate crime that this video doesn’t have more views
Zoe Vega
I’m a leftie
I’m not a drug dealer
Okay but for real Chad and Ryan were in love and slept with each other after that sexual tension filled baseball number and I'm here for it
Ortega saying Disney is one of the most progressive companies he's worked with gave me whiplash lmao, well I guess that speaks about the state of the industry at the time. Incredible video btw!
Thank you for watching! I think that Ortega quote is nuanced and is best contextualized within the specific types of mainstream media he works in, also the fact that when he started acting it was a much different world than it is today. I think it’s also different for Disney because even though the company has been reluctant to completely embrace LGBTQ identities before the last few years, they did begin providing workplace protections and benefits for LGBTQ people before that was standard industry practice and I believe the Lesbian and Gay United Employees (LEAGUE) was the first of its kind in Hollywood. But, it still required employees to organize in the early 90s for Disney to do that. So, problematic history, but I can see how someone who grew up in a time when LGBTQ people were more fiercely rejected and then (after doing mainstream movies and music) worked in a company like Disney beginning in the early 90s can have positive experiences w/the company internally even if the public representation was different. And the fact that that part is couched between a sentence about whether or not having an openly LGBTQ character would have been “family-friendly” shows you what the standard was that he was up against.
or it speaks to his limited work experience. if you only worked at 2 or 3 companies saying x is the best/most anything is just fillabustah. now if you worked at 10 or more? im listening
Fun fact! I named myself Ryan after Ryan from HSM 😊
❤
👏👏👏 yay!!!
Cute!
We love to see it!!
Ok thats so wholesome
Making me reflect on my young mega crush on Ryan Evans in a time where the heart throb being pushed was Zac Efron- I think I was just drawn to how Ryan was everything I wanted. He would just bounce through school hallways in a pastel pink shirt and hat, he could be himself and no one in the school says anything about it.
I knew realistically anyone who had the guts to really act like Ryan at the time would’ve been bullied ruthlessly, so I think I just loved seeing this glimmer of who I wanted in a world I’d have rather been in. You know, the kind of world where break ups are best processed leaning against lockers singing about fairy tales
nah, you just want the blonde white boy aka typical murican gay. it was all about corbin blu aka hottest guy in the film
@@serenityq26 while I ultimately disagree with you about my reasonings since it’s me I’m going to take that and raise you one better- Chad and Ryan 100% fucked.
“I would rather talk about how we can simultaneously be inspired and disturbed by someone.” WOW. YES. That is the best response to cancel culture I’ve ever heard.
"Who even is Kenny Ortega" what is this betrayal 😱
Whoa, I didn't realize Kenny Ortega did a lot more works than I realize. I absolutely love this deep dive and about Kenny Ortega and your complicated feelings with q*33rcoding. I feel you on that.
One project of Ortega's that wasn't mentioned: he did choreography for Dirty Dancing! One of the dance scenes in "Julie and the Phantoms" is an homage to it.
I don't know how this ended up on my recommended but I watched the whole thing and this hit so deep on why I loved all the movies and characters that I did, even if I didn't realize they were coded until this video. This is really well done, thank you.
Check out his other stuff it's great =)
the music in hsm & hsm2 was such a comfort for me the year I came out, and I was so excited when I heard y’all were doing this video! The snaps through the curtain that begin What I’ve Been Looking For?? Iconic!!! Kenny Ortega really is an icon!! Thanks to the whole team for all the work put into these videos, it does not go unnoticed!!
COME ON NOTIFICATIONS!!! Kenny Ortega is the ONE and Im so happy to hear more about him, literally my brother (straight) and I (so hella gay) always reel off his work whenever we mention him or HSM and he absolutely shaped our childhood - we have been changed for good (oh sorry, wrong musical 😂)
I love this video but one element of Descendants that I wish was discussed further and would like to share my thoughts on is the plot of the first movie being basically about a group of kids who ultimately find they have to cut ties with their parents because those parents weren't able to provide them a safe home environments. Obviously parental abuse isn't just a LGBT+ kid thing, plenty of kids regardless of gender identity or sexuality unfortunately have grown up in abusive environments. But for the villain kids this abuse is tied with an expectation to behave in a certain way. With Evie there's definitely a gender expectation thing going on with her plotline. Her mother taught her that looks were all that mattered and her plotline involved realizing that her intelligence and talents matter not trying to be pretty for the sake of a guy.
Obviously not every LGBTQ+ kid has a bad relationship with their parents but for the ones that do, and for the cis straight kids growing up in an abusive environment I LOVE that there's this kid film saying that "it's okay to cut ties with your parents if they're not treating you right". As someone who has had to cut ties with my father (not because of me being a lesbian but due to just general emotional abuse) I can absolutely see the value in a story that tells kids (without ever actually using the word "abuse") that not all biological families are good and sometimes the support/found family from your friends is more what you actually need. There's a dynamic that forms with the villain kids, who are the only ones who can really get it. That scene where Mulan's daughter asks if their parents have made cookies with them and all the villain kids are confused, that scene hit INCREDIBLY hard all without saying the word "abuse". The dynamic of the VK's feels very similar to the found families that many LGBTQ folks have formed and it's nice to see that portrayed as a valid alternative. Knowing Ortega's work I feel it had to be intentional.
Also I haven't seen the second movie in its entirety but Uma and Mal have BIG ex-girlfriends energy
I agree about the story, honestly - that would have been included if it had not already been running so long. Since there's never been a video this long on the channel before, we didn't want to completely overwhelm ourselves. I hope we can make more Descendants-related content in the future, though!
@@DreamsoundsVideo I figured it was a likely length thing but yeah I'd love to see more videos exploring descendants more in depth in the future :)
Regarding the runtime of this video:
"Larger than life is just the right size."
Kenny Ortega does everything that Ryan Murphy thinks he's doing.
His name sounds very familiar, but I'll probably learn why in the next hour
*WHEN I TELL YOU I CLICKED SO FAST*
Julie and the Phantoms was soooooo goood idk why people aren’t a talking about it more. I watched it in one go😅
This video is SO important- like it belongs in textbooks and museums!! Thank you for your (continued) contribution(s) to the Q*eer (and Q*eer Disney and Q*eer entertainment) communities 🌟💕
Thank you so much for your kindness, we're so glad you dig it🌈
I DEFINITELY thought Chad & Ryan were a thing.
I don't always commit to hour long videos but when I do it's because Dreamsounds is amazing.
Same
I definitely felt what you said towards the end about resenting coded characters. I think that’s still the stage where I’m at. It’s so frustrating that we still don’t have many LGBTQ characters. But I do want to appreciate the work LGBTQ creators have done to get to where we are now, where Ortega can finally include a fully-developed gay character in his work. It inspires me to write more LGBTQ content myself. My sister really enjoyed Julie and the Phantoms, I’ll be sure to check it out too!
oh wow I didn't even know that he directed the Rocky Horror tribute/reboot! I love that special a lot. the original meant a lot to me as a tween, and I think the reboot captured its energy really well. it also updated some aspects of the original that haven't really aged that well.
High School Musical was also incredibly important to me and my friends, since we were THE target demographic when it came out :P I related a lot to Kelcy at the time and nowadays people saying that she was also queercoded makes....a lot of sense lol
as always, great video and cover!
That statement by Lucas Grabeel about not playing Ryan if HSM was made today is the most "you dropped this, King" moment I've ever seen.
I am a cis straight woman, and the question "Who is Kenny Ortega?" hurts my soul! He deserves so much respect and to be more well-known.
I love the Descendants franchise and its affiliation with q*eerness. Dove Cameron, who plays Mal, has made many tweets about being bi herself and how she thinks Mal is bi and Maddie, one of the characters she plays on the tv show Liv and Maddie, is bi too. This makes me so happy.
I’ve been waiting for this video for so long!!! Time to find out how Kenny ruined (*improved*) my life 🌈🏳️🌈
This is a wonderful video - thank you for making it! I’m a big fan of the HSM soundtracks and this was a delight to watch. I love how there are these patterns in the songs from movie-to-movie (Troy Sings About Indecision While Doing A Sport; Gabriella Sings About How Troy Let Her Down While Leaning Against A Wall, etc)
I also think it’s fascinating that in every movie the “I Want” song is performed not by either the two lead protagonists but by Sharpay who wants:
1) To return to the status quo
2) Fabulous
3) It all
It’s such an interesting choice to always give the I Want narrative to the “antagonist” (although I was always team Sharpay and Ryan and think they were robbed in the winter musicalé!)
I’ve been so looking forward to this and what a pay off. Well done, as usual. You have such a honest and vulnerable voice. Thank you.
ok but who else loves singing along to the outro songs? just me? i'm just sitting here harmonizing while sketching and i wish the song could go on forever
Ok how do you make a 1 hour long video about a director I have never heard of and movies that I have no oppinions on and still have it feel like it was only 10 minutes long?
Ryan and Chad absolutely boned after that musical number
My Q experience was weird, I’ve only recently been reflecting on the clues leading to me being gay and non-binary in my childhood, though now I do see that Kenny Ortega has a big part in it. I quite literally grew up with high school musical (I was 2 when the first movie came out and I only started to reject the series when I was 12 because I was “too grown up” for that). I had three Halloween’s in a row where I played Sharpay. I know in this video you mostly focus on Ryan’s Q-coding and I think that’s definitely prevalent and important to the narrative you told here, but I think Sharpay evans is fully responsible for my obsession with hyperfemininity in the last year. I always adored her and I didn’t know why but there’s just something about her overperforming of gender I identified with. When I realized I was non-binary I thought I had to push myself into an androgynous-masculine aesthetic and I HATED it for years. Sharpay though, she overdramatized every single part of her personality and she 100% gave me the overly pink, overly poofy, and overly feminine aesthetic I love today.
Kelsie and Sharpay almost single handedly shaped my wlw/nblw identity and I love them for it!
As bad as HSM and really most of the DCOM lineup are (let's be real here), I still have major respect for Kenny Ortega for going out there and doing all this for the LGBT community. Funny how that goes.
Also, Mal X Evie forever.
Thank you SO much for mentioning "Julie & The Phantoms." Two openly gay character & also some bisexual coded characters. It was the best show I'd seen in years & I was so mad that Netflix didn't renew it for another season. The music is top notch & one dance scene is an homage to a movie Kenny Ortego did choreography for (Dirty Dancing.)
im so glad kenny ortega was there giving disney that good good q-coding when howard ashman couldn't any longer. ortega's work never spoke to my particular repression, but im glad it was there for those who it did speak to. thanks for showing how impactful his work was!
My favorite Disney channel musical is Teen Beach movie. I feel like Leila made me gay lol. Sadly, it's not Kenny Ortega though.
Newsies is the gayest movie/musical I’ve ever seen, literally everyone I’ve watched it with thought Jack was gonna get with Davey and not Sarah/Katherine
I love how when Dove Cameron came out as bisexual, she also said that all the Disney characters she’s ever played are gay too 😂
I absolutely LOVE Newsies!!! Newsies made me trans, I swear. I watched the 1992 movie as a kid and it changed my life, so I'm really excited to see that you touched on it briefly here and connected it to our community's culture! The tension between David and Jack always felt significant to me as a gay person. I never knew much about Kenny Ortega, so thank you for enlightening me :)
Commenting for the Al Gore Rhythm 🥰🥰
What a beautiful, informative and well done video! Thank you so much for this!
lets fucking goooo!!!!!!!!!
yay!!!!!!!!!!
always love your videos!
is there a playlist or site with just your covers?
I thought it was penn jillette in the thumbnail and I cried laughing
It's so cool to see quality documentaries on youtube, thank youuuuuu
I am looking forward for more video essays. That cover of what I've been looking for made me cry so much, thank you as always.
Random note: Thank you for the Chopin in the background.
I love this video a lot... I just wanted to bring up the fact that in Descendants 3 there is a quite obviously coded achillean pairing.... Jay and Gil actively parallel the canon romantic pairings in the franchise. They even dance together during the final song of the movie, which is reserved only for canon/canon implied pairings.
Hey! Love this video! But could you put in a trigger warning if you're going to talk about things like you did in the part "What I really don't want to talk about" I was abused too, and it sent in a spiral because I wasn't prepared.
Thank you for this comment. I am sorry about that - I've added a disclaimer to the pinned comment and description.
I Don't Dance 👀👀👀👀
I love these deep dive videos on the Q experiences behind the movies and TV shoes I grew up on as I’ve learned more about myself over the years 💕🏳️🌈
Ok, I agree that Space Between is really queer coded BUT everyone is ignoring the fact that Mal and Uma are obviously exes. That's very much the dynamic they're giving in the movies but also Disney released a short film between Descendants 2 and 3 where Mal and Uma sing "What Doesn't Kill You Makes You Stronger" at each other which is literally a song about getting over your ex. Also Harry is sort of queer coded.
sigh not sorry but now you talking about madonna and all i want to do is go on a deep dive and rewatch all her 80s videos. sigh MATERIAL GIRL IS GOOOOOOOOOD! ok byeeeeeeeeeeeeee
Honestly seeing qu33r characters in movies and shows makes me SO SO SO HAPPY now that I'm out of the closet
Don't mind me, just commenting for the algorithm... Amazing video! ❤️
Do you think I will get the money off my parents or brothers and sisters..I 🤷🏼♀️
I don't usually watch 1 hour long videos, but when I do, it's either you or Ladyknightthebrave
Beyond Ashman and Ortega... Rob Marshall is worth talking about too.
hey so it was under my understanding that leaving neverland was actually debunked multiple times? i mean no disrespect bringing this up btw! just thought it should be brought to your attention because there seems to be a lot of info disproving that documentary
This! It has been debunked, or at least a lot of the claims in it have been. When people make false accusations, it's such a slap in the face to people who have actually been abused in that way.
ok knowing that ryan had a (canon) crush on zeke and that he kisses him in the bloopers...oh my god
I’m getting attacked because of my credit rating that I’m trying to repay on Monday I’m not a lunatic or a crack addict
I loved this, when I was younger I didn't know what kept calling me about these movies and it makes sense, even when I didn't know how to put in words who I was, I knew how it felt and that these movies felt like a safe place for feeling that way. Thank you for your work, you're amazing 💖
Embarrassing really when you look at it all this money designed to drive me mad
You’re gonna have to move devon over to America I don’t want him here in nz
dududu~wohooohoohoo~ love the video, now enjoyng the cover song
Daniella ortega I’m not Inverness ortega
Michael didn’t do anything.
Do you do drugs no thankyou to meeting you
I don’t want to meet kenny when I am rich
when I become rich don’t come near me
Just to smart for me kenny ortega
Ah yes, a dance-off between the batters and catchers
lets go way back to when he worked with CHER in Las Vegas when she had her first residency at Caesars Palace....he was the choreography for that show in 1981....off to a great start there with CHER: A Celebration at Caesar's Palace....they had male stripped in the actual show. GAY! mmm i suspect she met him when she did her 1978 "CHER: Special" that has The Tubes Dolly Parton and Rod Stewart as guests.
we all know who kenny is
Thanks for the video, love your channel! I notice that this video doesn't have captions enabled, just wondering if you know why? Most of your videos have the auto-captions which help me to catch the words I don't understand - but this one doesn't for some reason.
So sorry about that! I don't know why that is the case, must've turned it off by accident at some point along the way. I'll change it when I have time tomorrow and also make sure the other vids are auto-captioned as well.
@@DreamsoundsVideo 💜💜
I love this and I love you. 🤟🏽
FINALLY SOMEONE TALKING ABOUT KENNY ORTEGA!!! THANK YOU!!!!
i have just realized the before watching this, i had never seen young kenny. he was always an old man to me lmao!
also, i see your "mal and evie" and i raise you every other character in that franchise is not straight. i could go on and on in depth as to why, but i'll just say the last movie has a lot wrong with, but the fact that lowkey jay and gil are hinted as a possible couple is enough to make me forgive its sins