For years I've been telling christians about this when they start preaching the NT-version about satan. But is like trying to convince the square peg to slide into the triangular hole.
I usually just tell them that genesis makes clear the serpent's sentence was to lose its legs. If they still claim satan was disguised as a serpent then either their god is utterly stupid for punishing a whole innocent species for something none of them did, or utterly sadistic for the same reason. That tends to shut them up and not bring the topic again.
Yes, unfortunately I’ve come to the conclusion that you cannot change Christians’s minds about things. That’s not an issue in itself since they can believe whatever they want, but it’s when they tell me that I’m reading the texts wrong and not understanding them fully; that’s when I get annoyed. They can’t seem to understand that they are literally injecting the NT traditions into the Hebrew Bible, when in reality the Hebrew Bible doesn’t say anything about said topic.
@@Julian0101 I've tried that too. But I also realize that I don't have access to the original stories. And even if I did, I don't understand hebrew, their culture and so on. So all I have are crappy translations of texts I don't actually understand. It is at that point I shift my focus from the jeezbuz crowd to activities having more value to me. Like taking a nap, looking at some flowers or taking a dump. 😊
It's my experience that you can indeed force a peg of any shape into a hole of any other shape if you're willing to put in enough effort. That, of course, presupposes the effort is worth the expenditure of time and, well, effort. In some cases like this one, it's led to truly interesting and educational conversations... but those cases are a depressingly tiny percentage of all such attempts.
Fascinating as always. One question though, how do scholars come to the conclusion that in the book of Revelation the “original serpent” is Leviathan? Great work as always!
Fun fact: Isaiah's mention of Lucifer is also a callback to their Canaanite mythology. In the Baal cycle after Baal has died (and before Anat beats the everliving shit out of Mot) the gods try to decide who will take Baal's place in the divine assembly. Athtar the Awesome is decided to take Baal's place: Let Athtar the Awesome be king! Then Athatar the Awesome went up to the heights of Zaphon, he sat on Baal the Conqueror's throne. His feet did not reach the footstool, his head did not reach the headrest. And Athter the Awesome spoke: "I can't be king on the heights of Zaphon." Athtar the Awesome descended, descended from the throne of Baal the Conqueror, and he became king of the earth, the god of it all... Compare that to what Isaiah says in verses 13-17: You said in your heart, "I will ascend to heaven; I will raise my throne above the stars of Elohim; I will sit on the mount of assembly on the heights of Zaphon; I will ascend to the tops of the clouds, I will make myself like the El Elyon." But you are brought down to Sheol, to the depths of the Pit. Those who see you will stare at you and ponder over you: "Is this the man who made the earth tremble, who shook kingdoms, who made the world like a desert and overthrew its cities, who would not let his prisoners go home?" Note that Isaiah even calls YHWH's mountain Zaphon rather than Zion, and the basic layout is the same (though more antagonistic to the supposed usurper)
@@K4rm4ness Give Anat her due, she's always a veritable force of violence. We always point to Baal beating River early in the cycle, but not many discuss Anat going out swinging in support of her bro to the point of forcibly forcing Death to give him back. Honestly, I'd love to see an epic movie on part with Bahubali that is based on the Baal Cycle. The sibling vibes between Baal and Anat are great and overall the whole story feels quite epic. Gods really were the superheroes of the ancient world.
The Star! Compare bible translations verses. [System of Things] vs [End of the Age] [Morning Star] vs [Bright Morning Star] I do realize how a word or phrases changes the meaning. I used the King James Bible that's where I learned God's name. Psalms 83:18 unless you use a revised King James Bible. Matthew 20:18 Jesus approached and spoke to them, saying: “All authority has been given me in heaven and on the earth. 19 Go, therefore, and make disciples of people of all the nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the holy spirit, 20 teaching them to observe all the things I have commanded you. And look! I am with you all the days until the conclusion of the [system of things].” Jesus is the Bright Morning Star. Jesus said I would be with his disciples until the end of the age. Matthew 28:20 Teach these new disciples to obey all the commands I have given you. And be sure of this: I am with you always, even to the [end of the age].” The end of the age was 2012 it was The Transit of Venus and Jesus is the Bright morning star. Revelation 22:16 “‘I, Jesus, sent my angel to bear witness to you about these things for the assemblies. I am the root and the offspring of David and the [bright morning star].’” Jesus shows up in Jerusalem when he is 12 years old. He shows up 18 years later and throws out the money changers. So 2012 + 18 years 2030. But right after when the 8th King is ruling the earth. I use bible hub for most translations and New World Translation. Here's the Dragon. This is why the beast like a lamb started speaking like a dragon. Satan is a morning star who was hurled to the earth. The morning star of 1874 The Transit of Venus. Who gathered the nations for the Great War of 1914. Isaiah 14:12 How you have fallen from heaven, [morning star], son of the dawn! You have been cast down to the earth, you who once laid low the nations! Isiah 14:12 How has Lucifer, that rose in the morning, fallen from heaven! He that sent orders to all the nations is crushed to the earth.
That is why there is a new testament atheist. Been 2000 years and Jews STILL havent figured out the messiah yet. Even though he raised the dead, healed the sick. cured the blind, Raised from the dead. I guess it was a fly by.
Yeah, I never understood why God would pushing the serpent from the Garden of Eden story to "crawn on its belly and eat dirt" if it was the actual Devil. Why punish the serpent as it's never said the serpent willingly allowed itself to be possessed by Satan? If the serpent was Satan himself, why curse the other innocent serpents with that cruel fate?
What doesn't make sense is the depiction of this serpent either. It shouldn't look like a snake. The snake is the after picture, not the before picture.
And God said, “Let the land produce living creatures according to their kinds: the livestock, the creatures that move along the ground...And God saw that it was good. Genesis 1: 24-25 (abridged) Now the serpent was more crafty than any of the wild animals the Lord God had made. He said to the woman...." Genesis 3:1 (you know the rest) *Seems to me God has some 'splaining to do."
Great video as always, Dan. I have one quibble: I don't believe the statement in Luke about seeing Satan fall like lightning is a reference to Enoch. I have an article at my blog (Is That in the Bible) explaining the main scholarly viewpoints if anyone is interested.
It is more correct to say that Satan as we understand him as the "Devil" is not found in the OT. And even in the NT, the diabolos is very different from what we have today.
I also like how many Christians claim Satan is in hell. How can Satan be in hell if your end times book says he will be cast out of heaven? God: Go grab Satan from Hell so we can throw him out of heaven into hell! (Angels glancing at each other). Michael:You heard the boss! Unless it has already happened, which creates many other problems. Speaking about who is doing the throwing out. I attribute Michael to being the Ophiucus (the serpent bearer) constellation primarily due to him being depicted in art holding scales (Libra). Scorpio is under his foot. This hints at either common symbols in art, or a common knowledge by which the artist communicates their affiliation. Ophiucus also makes it a good candidate for the serpent in the tree. Constellation Heracles is also to the east, which would then be the angel with the flaming sword. Heracles in art is often depicted with a sword held above his head, potentially inspiration for the swastika symbol. Which was very common in religion and hijacked by the nazis. Diving into the woo, the gematria of Adam (45) (Arabic) and Eve (as hawwa) 15 correspond to the “magic square” of Saturn. Which fits quite nicely to Eve being a rib (rings of Saturn). On a few Kabbalistic tree of life diagrams Binah is associated with Saturn, and on some you will see the association YHVH, though I am not sure the origins or methodology of this construction. I am also curious as to dating a myth - I.e. when Saturn was in Scorpio. How many data points do we need? Sort of like a written down version of the Hoover Dam Astrological site data. Apologies for the stream of consciousness meandering.
I just remembered I took the Satan class. Tho Satan isn’t in the Hebrew Bible he is in the retelling of David census who sent the pestilence. Not to the degree Satan is in Christianity lore. Devil/Satan in the Midrash is an influential Hebrew book I suspect Paul and Jesus would have learned. Let me know Dan if that’s incorrect
It seems to me that the closest English word for _satan_ would be _jester._ In both cases it refers to someone whose role it is to forward an opposing viewpoint or speak an uncomfortable truth (thus improving situational awareness and improving decision-making).
And God said, “Let the land produce living creatures according to their kinds: the livestock, the creatures that move along the ground...And God saw that it was good. Genesis 1: 24-25 (abridged) Now the serpent was more crafty than any of the wild animals the Lord God had made. He said to the woman...." Genesis 3:1 (you know the rest) *Seems to me God has some 'splaining to do."
Dan, just one additional point: even though 3rd century patristic writers are beginning to make connections between the Lucifer in Isaiah and Satan it was still a very rare and loose connection. In the 4th century Christians were still naming their children Lucifer. There was even a Bishop Lucifer who was an ally of Athanasius of Alexandria in the mid 4th century. Just some interesting bits of data that suggests how late the connections were and were not being made.
it would still work as the concept of an adversary. he is being tempted, does it need to be a specific human, or were they the weaknesses within himself that he overcame to become truly the messiah? it was always weird to me(outside of just seeing it as the cultural influance of zorostrianism) that The divine would have a not quite as powerful foil that kind of works for him, but also tries to destroy his creations,and he doesnt destroy him?. I consider myself religious, but i dont really think people need an evil spirit tempting us to find sin, we are pretty quick on our own.
Dan. Stop recommending books. I cant keep up and already have 6 on my shelf unread. So much great scholarship, so little time. And I suppose I will have to buy your new offering too. 😁
Wait, what does that mean for exorsisms & ministries where demons manifest and are prophesied against. Revelation Church or Kathryn Krick's 5Fold Ministry. I'd really appreciate your intellectual thoughts on that.
Always confused me, if you feel the love of God why would you need fear of the devil to obey? I always assumed he was made up along with hell to give people relief of bad things happening to good people and vise versa, because everyone will be made to answer for their “sin” 😂 ty dan
Everyone except that serial killer that gets "saved" 5 minutes before their execution... then they are on a narrow path to Heaven, thus avoiding any reckoning because they're saved. Sigh.
@@bigskypioneer1898dont judge literally means dont be satan lol. If you think there is a heaven then the part of you thats God is what goes back to God, and is completely aware of all good and wrong the flesh was a part of. And is no longer that thing anymore but now unified with God.. there is nothing left to be punished because you and your ego are now dead
@@toniacollinske2518 I know that, but there are some similarities in both books , also some controversies also. For example, Gospel of BARNABAS, mention of Jesus escaping crucifixion and same in quran. In that sense, I asked him his opinion on Satan in Quran.
@@sriramkumar9577gospel of Barnabas is post Islamic probably. Shaytan is mostly viewed as a cognate to Satan. So it probably means the same thing. But Al-Shaytan, aia Iblis seems to be an ex angel and Jinn(ety ambiguous, Guardian spirit[ginayya] or Covered one, Hidden one). Mentioned to be (formerly)with the Angels(Malaikah) and also the Melei Ala(The High Ones, Supreme society). So it does seem like there is a similar divine council in the Quran as well.
Honestly, even if Satan were real, it’d be silly for the Hebrews to go ignorant of such a dangerous figure for centuries - only for Satan to only be revealed as a threat long after Jesus. Of course, Christians will dismiss it with “God’s Ways are not our ways” and “His timing is not our timing”, though of course, the other possibility they’ll completely gloss over is that the Church made it up. Can’t stand people doing scholarship that questions their teachings or legitimacy, after all! 😂
They are essentially the gods. So in ancient pantheons you usually had the main god who was at the top. Then the 2nd tier gods were often designated as “children of [name of god]” or “children of god”. This designation was due to the idea that those 2nd tier gods were the actual children of the high deity.
So this is dumb, but you just incidentally explained the demonology of the Netflix Sabrina series. In that, Lucifer is Satan is the devil, cast out of hell, Lilith was the first witch who served him, blah blah blah. In the show there are other demons that are semi-autonomous from Satan that I didn’t understand in the show’s theology. But they would just fit as either other, lesser, cast out angels or as Nephilim! It’s dumb and nonsense, but your background here made it fit in my brain more completely. Thanks!
Which Protestants have called Job the oldest book in the bible? Do you have any reference, like a book or article? . . . In my view, Lutherans started critical bible studies in Germany. And those studies point to a late date of Job, probably the Persian period.
@@Achill101 all the Protestants I grew up around. My parents, for example, and people at their church and Bible study groups. Idk how they came up with this idea.
Luke 10 is strange because he exclaims it as a celebratory statement. Hard to see how the Enochic notion of the Watchers falling to earth to do evil as somehow a good thing. Probably some kind of mystery cult thing.
In my understanding, Satan had to be objective in order to "accuse" God of anything, so I was always trying to steelman his position. Turns out, he was the *GOOD* guy in the book.
"Satan" only killed like 10 men where "God" annihilated millions and was going to totally wipe out humanity... until Jesus got BBQ'd and he wasn't hangry anymore.
Christians had to make up Satan as an enemy of God, or else the whole human sacrifice for all eternity doesn't make sense, because Humans can overcome "sin" & obstacles without blood.
@@mickeydecurious - no, biblical scholars assume today that the Book of Enoch was a Hebrew book from the early Hellenistic times, like the 3rd century BC. Small parts of it have been found among the Dead Sea Scrolls, but the complete Book of Enoch has only been preserved by the Ethiopian Church.
@@Achill101 I've read The book of Enoch it's an interesting read with nothing scientifically more or morally applicable to society, and it gets insight into how ancient Men . But other than that nothing applicable about it. Just think if Christians weren't so handy with the sword and force conversions Christianity be a dead and done religion, and we could actually discuss adult things and put away things from childhood like fantasies and not accountability 🤔 When the world be a better place if we just put the religion to the side all of them they have done nothing to improve society; and you can't say that Christianity gave us our laws, because that's not true we have had laws and society things that are taboo or not taboo since society first was a society.
@mickeydecurious - societies before Judaism and Christianity certainly had laws and morals, but if you studied them, you might be surprised how different they would be from our still Christian-influenced morals: Caesar conquering Gaul and killing a million people in the process was not seen as immoral but as laudable by the Romans. Christian nations had their share of atrocities, too, but there was always internal criticism of how people were treated, despite the wealth and power these atrocities brought.
The Bible is a salvation story of the Father you spring from, the ruler of this world, David, the Morning Star. Adam, the Christ, is a third-party mediator to this world and these heavens between you and your Father. For who is greater: the one seated at table or the one who serves? Is it not the one seated at table? I am among you as the one who serves. (Luk 22:27 NABO) Esau, the firstborn, lives by the sword (sacrifice) and serves his brother, Jacob, who was born gripping (striking at) his heel. Isaac blessed Esau saying: Ah, far from the fertile earth shall be your dwelling; far from the dew of the heavens above! (Gen 27:39 NABO) You will not always have me (Mat 26:11 NABO) I am with you always, until the end of the age. (Mat 28:20 NAB) My kingdom does not belong to this world. (Joh 18:36 NABO) Where I am going you cannot come. (Joh 8:21 NABO) Then I took my staff "Refuge" and snapped it asunder, breaking off the covenant which I had made with all peoples (Noahic covenant) (Zec 11:10 NABO) Then I snapped asunder my other staff, "Heritage" (Deu 32:8) breaking off my brotherhood with (or between?) Judah and Israel. (Zec 11:14 NABO) the one who ascended far above all the heavens themselves (Eph 4:10 NABO) never to return to corruption (Act 13:34 NABO) "By your sword (sacrifice) you shall live, and your brother you shall serve; But when you become restive (weak; faint; infirm; a worm; man of suffering; restless; wanderer in the desert; way of the Lord in the desert), you shall throw off his yoke from your neck." (Gen 27:40 NABO) Save me, I pray, from the hand of my brother Esau! (Gen 32:12 NABO) Esau ran to meet him, embraced him, and flinging himself on his neck, kissed him as he wept. (Gen 33:4 NABO) Take my yoke upon you and learn from me, for I am meek and humble of heart; and you will find rest for yourselves. For my yoke is easy, and my burden light. (Mat 11:29-30 NABO)
In the Quran, Shaytan or Satan is real and is the enemy of mankind. He was called Ibliis before he disobeyed God. After that he is referred to only as Shaytan. 7:10 We have indeed established you on earth and provided you with a means of livelihood. ˹Yet˺ you seldom give any thanks. 7:11 Surely We created you, then shaped you, then said to the angels, “Prostrate before Adam,” so they all did-but not Iblîs, who refused to prostrate with the others. 7:12 Allah asked, “What prevented you from prostrating when I commanded you?” He replied, “I am better than he is: You created me from fire and him from clay.” 7:13 Allah said, “Then get down from Paradise! It is not for you to be arrogant here. So get out! You are truly one of the disgraced.” 7:14 He appealed, “Then delay my end until the Day of their resurrection.” 7:15 Allah said, “You are delayed ˹until the appointed Day˺.” 7:16 He said, “For leaving me to stray I will lie in ambush for them on Your Straight Path. 7:17 I will approach them from their front, their back, their right, their left, and then You will find most of them ungrateful.” 7:18 Allah said, “Get out of Paradise! You are disgraced and rejected! I will certainly fill up Hell with you and your followers all together.” 7:19 ˹Allah said,˺ “O Adam! Live with your wife in Paradise and eat from wherever you please, but do not approach this tree, or else you will be wrongdoers.” 7:20 Then Satan tempted them in order to expose what was hidden of their nakedness. He said, “Your Lord has forbidden this tree to you only to prevent you from becoming angels or immortals.” 7:21 And he swore to them, “I am truly your sincere advisor.” 7:22 So he brought about their fall through deception. And when they tasted of the tree, their nakedness was exposed to them, prompting them to cover themselves with leaves from Paradise. Then their Lord called out to them, “Did I not forbid you from that tree and ˹did I not˺ tell you that Satan is your sworn enemy?” 7:23 They replied, “Our Lord! We have wronged ourselves. If You do not forgive us and have mercy on us, we will certainly be losers.” 7:24 Allah said, “Descend as enemies to each other. You will find in the earth a residence and provision for your appointed stay.” 7:25 He added, “There you will live, there you will die, and from there you will be resurrected.” 7:26 O children of Adam! We have provided for you clothing to cover your nakedness and as an adornment. However, the best clothing is righteousness. This is one of Allah’s bounties, so perhaps you will be mindful. 7:27 O children of Adam! Do not let Satan deceive you as he tempted your parents out of Paradise and caused their cover to be removed in order to expose their nakedness. Surely he and his soldiers watch you from where you cannot see them. We have made the devils allies of those who disbelieve. 14:19 Do you not see that God has created the heavens and the earth for a purpose? He can eliminate you if He wills and bring into being a new creation 14:20 that is no difficult thing for God 14:21 They shall all appear before God and the weak will say to those who behaved proudly, We were your followers. Can you protect us from God's punishment? They will reply, Had God given us guidance, we would have guided you. It is all the same whether we are patient or impatient; there is no escape for us 14:22 When the Judgement has been passed, Satan will say to them, God made you a true promise; I too made you promises, but I failed you. I had no authority over you, except that I called you and you responded to me. Do not now blame me, but blame yourselves! I cannot help you, nor can you help me. I reject your former act in associating me with God. The wrongdoers will have a painful punishment 14:23 But those who believed and did good deeds will be brought into Gardens with rivers flowing through them. They shall abide there forever by their Lords permission, and will be welcomed with the greeting, Peace.
This is because the Muslims take the concept from Christians and Talmudic Jews. The original hebrews did not have a concept of a single Satanic entity; Satan is whatever that opposed humans, including angels sent by God to test Job/Ayyub
"Satan" is the name of a prosecuting angel in the Heavenly Court. Yet some say that he became an independent ruler over a realm of eternal damnation, and that he acts in opposition to God's will - i.e., that he is a separate god. This idolatrous concept is not even a belief in an intermediary, since it claims that Satan is not under God's control.
It's interesting how religions all mix together. They pick and choose from different beliefs and toss it all into a blender to make their own religion, kind of like how the Egyptians and the Greeks made their own King of the gods.
That's the best way to start a new religion and get converts from existing ones. You make it familiar enough that makes people believe they had most of it right, making your new additions easier to embrace, especially if you throw in the part about being a fulfillment of their religion. It's ironic, Christianity and Islam both did that with Judaism and look how many of each their are today.
I mean the Catholic Church teaches that human death didn't exist until Eve ate the fruit, so when the serpent says "you will not certainly die" it can be seen as the first lie. It's pretty straightforward to say the individual who told the first lie is the 'father of all lies', or 'king of lies' etc.
@@skypangolin8576 I understand. I was Catholic for 30 years before I left (long story). We could discuss the details on it because it could go both ways. It all depends on your point of view Remember, Ben Kenobi said all truth depends on a certain point of view lol.
Holman Christian Standard Bible Genesis 3:4 No! You will not die,” the serpent said to the woman.” Is Lying a Righteous Deception or an Unrighteous Deception? We are born into Satan's Kingdom. This is why we need the tree of life. Jesus is the vine the true branch of life to God. Jesus will crush this Kingdom. Eve transgressed against the Law of God. Eve is the mother of everyone living. So in birth pains everyone was born into lawlessness. The cherub angel in charge of the garden of Eden deceived her with an unrighteous deception. This made this cherub angel the ruler of this world. Satan is an Angel of Light By an unrighteous deception she ate the fruit. 2 Thessalonians 2:9 But the lawless one’s presence is by the operation of Satan with every powerful work and lying signs and wonders 10 and every unrighteous deception for those who are perishing, as a retribution because they did not accept the love of the truth in order that they might be saved. 11 That is why God lets a deceptive influence mislead them so that they may come to believe the lie, 12 in order that they all may be judged because they did not believe the truth but took pleasure in unrighteousness. 2 Corinthians 2:14 And no wonder, for Satan himself keeps disguising himself as an angel of light. 15 It is therefore nothing extraordinary if his ministers also keep disguising themselves as ministers of righteousness. But their end will be according to their works. 2 Timothy 2:14 Also, Adam was not deceived, but the woman was thoroughly deceived and became a transgressor.
Adam wasn't deceived. The ground did produce thorns and thistles because Jesus worn the crown of thorns and thistles. God told Adam the prophecy of the resurrection. Genesis 3:15 The Sacrifice of Jesus was the first part of the prophecy of Genesis 3:15 And I will put enmity between you and the woman and between your offspring and her offspring. He will crush your head, and you will bruise him in the heel.” Satan the Dragon and the Wild Beast the 6th Kingdom executed Jesus on their image the cross. It was the Roman Empire of Italy that is also the shape of the heel. So the first part of the prophecy is complete . Satan bruised Jesus in the heel.
Dan McClellan is a later day saint he isnt a christian, he isnt an athiest. He speaks facts but draws conclusions that are aimed at turning people away from Christianity. E.g It is true Lucifer most likely isnt Satan and is most likely not even a name, it is also true that Ezekiel's description of the anointed Cherub most likely wasnt referring to satan. Satan isnt even a name, its similar to the word devil, they are both titles. Most of the common bibles dont talk much about Satan. Satan becomes more present in the new testament together with things like demonic possession. But why is that? The common bible we have today doesn't talk much about angels or the sons of God. Even in the great flood were they are mentioned, it doesnt say what happened to the sons of God that took human wives. However the story is interesting... You started with the garden of eden story, go to the book of enoch, go to the book of Job, go to the book of exodus, then Daniel, then the gospels, then the book of revelations. His name was most likely Azazel, the one who accuses himanity. So listen to Dan with caution, he isnt an atheist, he is a later day saint who believes that the bible contains lies and has to be done away with. He wants people to stop believing the bible as truth because he believs it causes more harm than good at the moment. He also doesn't have a spiritual approach to scripture, all his interpretations are based on the idea that scripture isnt univocal. In other words, he teaches half truths that exclude other teachings because he cannot reconcile the opinions he finds differing. These he calls contradictions, like God's omnipotence and omnipresence, which is just failure on his part to understand scripture. You can try to use some of his conclusions, but trust me in reality, you have no idea how bad his points are. And i dont blame you. You see, the facts he points out are true, but the conclusions, are usually not true because he rejects the univocallity of the bible, so if the facts he is pointing out are true, then the conclusion is also true. But the conclusions are wrong, because he is leaving out other facts, which when added to the equation, produce a completely different conclusion. Listen to his facts, do your own research then draw your own conclusions.
The Satan is an archetype of which there are many instantiations in the text. Making him concrete could be a cultural development but there is an internal logic to it. Jesus alludes to him and was himself Jewish, after all. Since he clearly expected his audience to understand the reference, it seems unlikely that first century Judaism didn't find Satan or the devil in their own text. How else do you explain the NT text short of rejecting its authenticity.
@@20quid Actually, you find several different words being used in place of a name. Father, God, Gods, gods, Spirit, Lord, Angel of the Lord, Sir, Lord of Hosts...it goes on. Even Yah, Yahweh, Yahveh or Big Daddy J, is more of a word than a name. Something to do with existing. Who shall I say sent me? The one who really exists sent you. Same with the devil, Lucifer, Belial, father of lies, tempter, accuser, serpent, sneaky snake, Nicholas Scratch, etc. No definite name his mommy and daddy gave him when he was born and he was held up daddy said, 'Behold, Myron, the only thing greater than yourself '. Kudos if you get the reference. And yes, the devil's name is Myron. That's why he's so mad all the time. 😂
The Hebrew Bible is quite technical, Dan. Even many Christians have hard time understanding it. So you need to tread carefully. Study Isaiah 14 & Ezekiel 28 & see if you will still not find Satan there! To prove the technicality of the Hebrew Bible, here is a text from Isaiah. Can you explain what the sevenfold brightness of the sun means? "On every lofty mountain and on every high hill there will be streams running with water on the day of the great slaughter, when the towers fall. *The light of the moon will be as the light of the sun, and the light of the sun will be seven times brighter, like the light of seven days,* on the day the Lord binds up the fracture of His people and heals the bruise He has inflicted." Isaiah 30:25-26.
@@20quid And the king of Babylon in Isaiah 14 is a conflation of two characters - one human & the other was a divine being that gave the human component his power. This is a theme so prevalent in the Prophets. For example, if you study Daniel 10, the kingdoms of Greece & Persia are also portrayed as having divine entities standing behind the power of the human kings! So the king is an integration of two separate beings: 1. Human king 2. And the wicked angelic being known in Isaiah 14 as Lucifer! These are intricate details which can easily escape the notice of a secular scholar who is hellbent on destroying the Bible!
@@danieldengL4Rnothing was named as Lucifer in the Hebrew bible, since Latin didn't exist yet. Conflating a modern English text with what was originally written doesn't prove your point.
So someone argued with God about Job but it was just a vague nobody in a role. Get real, weakest argument I've ever heard and not even true to the OT account. A being that can stand before God's throne and argue the case about Job directly to God, but who could it be? Well just a vague somebody you say. Can't be a spirit being you say. It's a title sure. Ask yourself why is it a title. This non-existent being sure has you fooled.
Why would a fallen angel who had fought a war against God before being cast out for all eternity even be able to stand before God's throne let alone be allowed to argue a convincing case? Either way, what is clear is that the modern western evangelical understanding of Satan/Lucifer/the Devil is a post-Biblical invention that differs significantly from the text itself.
Thr serpent isn't Satan. Christians did what christians always do, ie colonise and butcher the culture of others to manufacture their own narrative. Hence christians falsely claimed the serpent to be Satan even though their own bible the serpent is just a serpent, not Satan.
That doesn’t make any sense. How can you believe in God without Satan also? You’re supposed to believe and worship God and believe that Satan exists in Hell for all eternity. How can there be good without evil? How can there be light in the world but also darkness, sin, and evilness in the world and universe? Satan is mentioned in the Bible, though. Jesus said that He saw and was there for Satan’s fall from Heaven to Hell. This is exactly what Satan wants you to believe. He wants us all to believe in anything or anyone else other than God. He doesn’t care if you’re Atheist, pagan, Buddhist, Hindu Indian, Muslim, in which they worship Allah also, which isn’t true salvation. Or, even a Satanist. It doesn’t matter. But, you’re not a true Christian unless you believe in Satan also. And I thought that Jews also believe that Satan is an actual epitome and symbol but real entity at the exact same time of any type or level of sin and wickedness.
@Heather You're confused. Satan does not exist in hell: he's going there for his final destruction according to the book of Revelation upon Jesus's return for judgement on all the earth .
It's interesting that you see the massive flaw in the christian mythology and worldview. The fact that Satan didn't exist untill christians invented it should explain a lot as there was no concept of Satan in the Hebrew bible and culture. Even in the development of christian mythology, the Satan modern christians include in their god pantheon is different from the Satan of the 1st and 2nd century which is different from the Satan of the middle ages. In the same way the Jesus in the christian pantheon is vastly different from the jesus of christians of the past. Satan was created as a christian political tool. A scapegoat to attach to those they hated, despises and persecuted. Christians right up to today still practice "demonising" those they hate and cannot control. Anything and anyone that doesn't conform the the ever changing and fickle christian worldview is "satanic" or " evil. It's such an effective christian dogma that it has even allowed christiand to justify the horrific genocides, slavery, rape and slaughter of children, persecutions and subjugation of people groups and general physical and political violence so as to become a world dominant religion. The biggest irony is even in the christian version and rewriting of the hebrew bible, Satan still isn't the bad guy in the story. It's not Satan who commits mass genocide, commands his people commit brutal genocide, legislates chattel and sex slavery, abolishes free speech, command women obey men and legislates the slaughter and persecution of non believers and lgbtq people. All those ateocities and morally depraved acts and commands are all done by the christian gods. Satan is nothing more than a scapegoat. Which is essential in the christian mythology as the christian worldview and foundation of its dogma is to avoid accountability for one's actions and put the blame and punishment on someone or something else. You only want to be a christian so that you can do morally depraved things and call it "good" and blame a "Satan" scapegoat for your actions.
You’re confused. Satan is mentioned in the Bible numerous times and is a real entity who was the first one to sin against God and influence Adam and Eve to sin against God also. And he isn’t a “scapegoat” and he is the baddest one in the Bible and universe. God only committed massive genocide in the Old Testament because the people were truly evil and wicked who were doing all of those things that you just mentioned. God never once encouraged sin. He didn’t say for women to marry their rapists from the field. It was men having consensual sex with the women from the fields. That’s why the women were to be labeled as whores if they didn’t marry the man that they had random but consensual sex with in the fields. If you think that somehow God is evil and Satan is an awesome guy, then, I hope you get everything you’re looking for in the afterlife and on Judgement Day. God is good all of the time. And Satan is the ultimate evil and he is in Hell. He’s just free and rules over Hell as his kingdom. It’s only in the Book of Revelations that he will be captured and imprisoned and then completely destroyed by Jesus. But, like I said earlier, Jesus saw Satan in the desert and saw him fall from Heaven into Hell. And the Bible means this literally not symbolically or metaphorically. It’s very important to remember and know which things in the Bible are literal or symbolic or an analogy for something to convey its meaning. And just because Christians aren’t God’s chosen people, like the Hebrews, Israelites, and Jews are, doesn’t mean that Christians aren’t valuable to God. In fact, God loves us all, even the worst people imaginable. The only difference is whether or not we love Him and want to spend all of eternity with him.
For years I've been telling christians about this when they start preaching the NT-version about satan. But is like trying to convince the square peg to slide into the triangular hole.
I usually just tell them that genesis makes clear the serpent's sentence was to lose its legs. If they still claim satan was disguised as a serpent then either their god is utterly stupid for punishing a whole innocent species for something none of them did, or utterly sadistic for the same reason.
That tends to shut them up and not bring the topic again.
Yes, unfortunately I’ve come to the conclusion that you cannot change Christians’s minds about things. That’s not an issue in itself since they can believe whatever they want, but it’s when they tell me that I’m reading the texts wrong and not understanding them fully; that’s when I get annoyed. They can’t seem to understand that they are literally injecting the NT traditions into the Hebrew Bible, when in reality the Hebrew Bible doesn’t say anything about said topic.
@@Julian0101 I've tried that too. But I also realize that I don't have access to the original stories. And even if I did, I don't understand hebrew, their culture and so on. So all I have are crappy translations of texts I don't actually understand. It is at that point I shift my focus from the jeezbuz crowd to activities having more value to me. Like taking a nap, looking at some flowers or taking a dump. 😊
It's my experience that you can indeed force a peg of any shape into a hole of any other shape if you're willing to put in enough effort. That, of course, presupposes the effort is worth the expenditure of time and, well, effort. In some cases like this one, it's led to truly interesting and educational conversations... but those cases are a depressingly tiny percentage of all such attempts.
I’m so very happy you’ve cleared this up. Many individuals step into this role down the ages with evil intentions
So the devil is in the details.
😊 actually, the Devil ISN'T in the details!
Last I heard he was down in Georgia. Probably in MTG's district.
@@user-gk9lg5sp4yis MTG. There, fixed it for ya 😂😂
@@alanb8884 lt is. You are trying to be devilishly clever.
@@colinsmith1288 😈
That was always my understanding that Satan wasn’t an evil entity, or a figure of mischief, or a fallen angel from Grac.
This is fascinating! Great work as always Dan! Can't wait to buy your book!
My first instinct when seeing the title was to mention the Book of Job but I’m glad to see you addressed that pretty quickly
Fascinating as always. One question though, how do scholars come to the conclusion that in the book of Revelation the “original serpent” is Leviathan? Great work as always!
Have you spoke on why the Enoch book wasn’t canonized and if not could you do a video explaining why?
This is why you are well-loved.
Thank you for the succinct and informative content. Thank you.
Yeah, Ancient Hebrews would be utterly perplexed if confronted with modern Christianity 😂
True. Modern Christianity is filled with flaws and fairy tales
Superb!!! Extremely enlightening! Shabbat shalom young professor!
Fun fact: Isaiah's mention of Lucifer is also a callback to their Canaanite mythology. In the Baal cycle after Baal has died (and before Anat beats the everliving shit out of Mot) the gods try to decide who will take Baal's place in the divine assembly. Athtar the Awesome is decided to take Baal's place:
Let Athtar the Awesome be king!
Then Athatar the Awesome
went up to the heights of Zaphon,
he sat on Baal the Conqueror's throne.
His feet did not reach the footstool,
his head did not reach the headrest.
And Athter the Awesome spoke:
"I can't be king on the heights of Zaphon."
Athtar the Awesome descended,
descended from the throne of Baal the Conqueror,
and he became king of the earth, the god of it all...
Compare that to what Isaiah says in verses 13-17:
You said in your heart,
"I will ascend to heaven;
I will raise my throne
above the stars of Elohim;
I will sit on the mount of assembly
on the heights of Zaphon;
I will ascend to the tops of the clouds,
I will make myself like the El Elyon."
But you are brought down to Sheol,
to the depths of the Pit.
Those who see you will stare at you and ponder over you:
"Is this the man who made the earth tremble,
who shook kingdoms,
who made the world like a desert and overthrew its cities,
who would not let his prisoners go home?"
Note that Isaiah even calls YHWH's mountain Zaphon rather than Zion, and the basic layout is the same (though more antagonistic to the supposed usurper)
I appreciate the descriptive “beats the everliving shit out of”. I would pay $$$ to see that preached on a Sunday 😂😂😂.
@@K4rm4ness Give Anat her due, she's always a veritable force of violence. We always point to Baal beating River early in the cycle, but not many discuss Anat going out swinging in support of her bro to the point of forcibly forcing Death to give him back.
Honestly, I'd love to see an epic movie on part with Bahubali that is based on the Baal Cycle. The sibling vibes between Baal and Anat are great and overall the whole story feels quite epic. Gods really were the superheroes of the ancient world.
"Lucifer" means "Venus" in Koine Greek.
@@Nudnik1 I know, and Dan covered that in the video lol
The Star!
Compare bible translations verses.
[System of Things] vs [End of the Age]
[Morning Star] vs [Bright Morning Star]
I do realize how a word or phrases changes the meaning. I used the King James Bible that's where I learned God's name. Psalms 83:18 unless you use a revised King James Bible. Matthew 20:18
Jesus approached and spoke to them, saying: “All authority has been given me in heaven and on the earth. 19 Go, therefore, and make disciples of people of all the nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the holy spirit, 20 teaching them to observe all the things I have commanded you. And look! I am with you all the days until the conclusion of the [system of things].”
Jesus is the Bright Morning Star. Jesus said I would be with his disciples until the end of the age.
Matthew 28:20 Teach these new disciples to obey all the commands I have given you. And be sure of this: I am with you always, even to the [end of the age].”
The end of the age was
2012 it was The Transit of Venus and Jesus is the Bright morning star. Revelation 22:16 “‘I, Jesus, sent my angel to bear witness to you about these things for the assemblies. I am the root and the offspring of David and the [bright morning star].’”
Jesus shows up in Jerusalem when he is 12 years old. He shows up 18 years later and throws out the money changers. So 2012 + 18 years 2030. But right after when the 8th King is ruling the earth.
I use bible hub for most translations and New World Translation.
Here's the Dragon.
This is why the beast like a lamb started speaking like a dragon.
Satan is a morning star who was hurled to the earth. The morning star of 1874 The Transit of Venus. Who gathered the nations for the Great War of 1914.
Isaiah 14:12
How you have fallen from heaven, [morning star], son of the dawn! You have been cast down to the earth, you who once laid low the nations!
Isiah 14:12
How has Lucifer, that rose in the morning, fallen from heaven! He that sent orders to all the nations is crushed to the earth.
Thank you Dan, I am glad you covered this topic! I created a few shorts about it but your explaining is way better!
That is why there is a new testament atheist. Been 2000 years and Jews STILL havent figured out the messiah yet. Even though he raised the dead, healed the sick. cured the blind, Raised from the dead. I guess it was a fly by.
Yeah, I never understood why God would pushing the serpent from the Garden of Eden story to "crawn on its belly and eat dirt" if it was the actual Devil. Why punish the serpent as it's never said the serpent willingly allowed itself to be possessed by Satan? If the serpent was Satan himself, why curse the other innocent serpents with that cruel fate?
What doesn't make sense is the depiction of this serpent either. It shouldn't look like a snake. The snake is the after picture, not the before picture.
And God said, “Let the land produce living creatures according to their kinds: the livestock, the creatures that move along the ground...And God saw that it was good.
Genesis 1: 24-25 (abridged)
Now the serpent was more crafty than any of the wild animals the Lord God had made. He said to the woman...."
Genesis 3:1 (you know the rest)
*Seems to me God has some 'splaining to do."
Great video as always, Dan. I have one quibble: I don't believe the statement in Luke about seeing Satan fall like lightning is a reference to Enoch. I have an article at my blog (Is That in the Bible) explaining the main scholarly viewpoints if anyone is interested.
It is more correct to say that Satan as we understand him as the "Devil" is not found in the OT. And even in the NT, the diabolos is very different from what we have today.
Love this! So interesting!
I also like how many Christians claim Satan is in hell. How can Satan be in hell if your end times book says he will be cast out of heaven?
God: Go grab Satan from Hell so we can throw him out of heaven into hell! (Angels glancing at each other). Michael:You heard the boss!
Unless it has already happened, which creates many other problems.
Speaking about who is doing the throwing out. I attribute Michael to being the Ophiucus (the serpent bearer) constellation primarily due to him being depicted in art holding scales (Libra). Scorpio is under his foot. This hints at either common symbols in art, or a common knowledge by which the artist communicates their affiliation.
Ophiucus also makes it a good candidate for the serpent in the tree. Constellation Heracles is also to the east, which would then be the angel with the flaming sword. Heracles in art is often depicted with a sword held above his head, potentially inspiration for the swastika symbol. Which was very common in religion and hijacked by the nazis.
Diving into the woo, the gematria of Adam (45) (Arabic) and Eve (as hawwa) 15 correspond to the “magic square” of Saturn. Which fits quite nicely to Eve being a rib (rings of Saturn). On a few Kabbalistic tree of life diagrams Binah is associated with Saturn, and on some you will see the association YHVH, though I am not sure the origins or methodology of this construction. I am also curious as to dating a myth - I.e. when Saturn was in Scorpio. How many data points do we need? Sort of like a written down version of the Hoover Dam Astrological site data. Apologies for the stream of consciousness meandering.
You're the Man, Dan!
You on point with this one
I just remembered I took the Satan class. Tho Satan isn’t in the Hebrew Bible he is in the retelling of David census who sent the pestilence. Not to the degree Satan is in Christianity lore. Devil/Satan in the Midrash is an influential Hebrew book I suspect Paul and Jesus would have learned. Let me know Dan if that’s incorrect
haSatan is in the Hebrew Bible!
@@davidjanbaz7728 it is as a definition of a human or messenger but not as a proper pronoun.
Thanks again, Daniel!
It seems to me that the closest English word for _satan_ would be _jester._ In both cases it refers to someone whose role it is to forward an opposing viewpoint or speak an uncomfortable truth (thus improving situational awareness and improving decision-making).
There is also a mention of a Satan in 1 Chronicles; though there he fills the role that God did (tempt David) in the equivalent story in 2 Samuel
And God said, “Let the land produce living creatures according to their kinds: the livestock, the creatures that move along the ground...And God saw that it was good.
Genesis 1: 24-25 (abridged)
Now the serpent was more crafty than any of the wild animals the Lord God had made. He said to the woman...."
Genesis 3:1 (you know the rest)
*Seems to me God has some 'splaining to do."
Dan, just one additional point: even though 3rd century patristic writers are beginning to make connections between the Lucifer in Isaiah and Satan it was still a very rare and loose connection. In the 4th century Christians were still naming their children Lucifer. There was even a Bishop Lucifer who was an ally of Athanasius of Alexandria in the mid 4th century. Just some interesting bits of data that suggests how late the connections were and were not being made.
who does Jesus meet in the wilderness
Who sent Jesus into the wilderness?
it would still work as the concept of an adversary. he is being tempted, does it need to be a specific human, or were they the weaknesses within himself that he overcame to become truly the messiah? it was always weird to me(outside of just seeing it as the cultural influance of zorostrianism) that The divine would have a not quite as powerful foil that kind of works for him, but also tries to destroy his creations,and he doesnt destroy him?. I consider myself religious, but i dont really think people need an evil spirit tempting us to find sin, we are pretty quick on our own.
Dan. Stop recommending books. I cant keep up and already have 6 on my shelf unread. So much great scholarship, so little time. And I suppose I will have to buy your new offering too. 😁
I know right!?!? My book budget is busted due to all the book recommendations, lol!
What about when satan tempted Jesus in the dessert?
Wait, what does that mean for exorsisms & ministries where demons manifest and are prophesied against. Revelation Church or Kathryn Krick's 5Fold Ministry. I'd really appreciate your intellectual thoughts on that.
Great. Thanks Dan.
Always confused me, if you feel the love of God why would you need fear of the devil to obey? I always assumed he was made up along with hell to give people relief of bad things happening to good people and vise versa, because everyone will be made to answer for their “sin” 😂 ty dan
Everyone except that serial killer that gets "saved" 5 minutes before their execution... then they are on a narrow path to Heaven, thus avoiding any reckoning because they're saved. Sigh.
@@bigskypioneer1898dont judge literally means dont be satan lol. If you think there is a heaven then the part of you thats God is what goes back to God, and is completely aware of all good and wrong the flesh was a part of. And is no longer that thing anymore but now unified with God.. there is nothing left to be punished because you and your ego are now dead
Very interesting. Then, can you explain what satan means in quran? Thanks 🙏
He's a scholar of the Bible, not the Quran unfortunately
@@toniacollinske2518 I know that, but there are some similarities in both books , also some controversies also. For example, Gospel of BARNABAS, mention of Jesus escaping crucifixion and same in quran. In that sense, I asked him his opinion on Satan in Quran.
@@sriramkumar9577gospel of Barnabas is post Islamic probably.
Shaytan is mostly viewed as a cognate to Satan. So it probably means the same thing. But Al-Shaytan, aia Iblis seems to be an ex angel and Jinn(ety ambiguous, Guardian spirit[ginayya] or Covered one, Hidden one). Mentioned to be (formerly)with the Angels(Malaikah) and also the Melei Ala(The High Ones, Supreme society).
So it does seem like there is a similar divine council in the Quran as well.
@@sriramkumar9577that always struck me as weird. Why not have jesus die and just not come back? It would drive the point home.
I always thought Satan was a Slovakian hockey player.
Honestly, even if Satan were real, it’d be silly for the Hebrews to go ignorant of such a dangerous figure for centuries - only for Satan to only be revealed as a threat long after Jesus.
Of course, Christians will dismiss it with “God’s Ways are not our ways” and “His timing is not our timing”, though of course, the other possibility they’ll completely gloss over is that the Church made it up. Can’t stand people doing scholarship that questions their teachings or legitimacy, after all! 😂
Who are the sons of god in the divine council?
They are essentially the gods. So in ancient pantheons you usually had the main god who was at the top. Then the 2nd tier gods were often designated as “children of [name of god]” or “children of god”. This designation was due to the idea that those 2nd tier gods were the actual children of the high deity.
That’d make a good T-shirt
need to get that book currently working through the DSS Bible think gods monsters has to be next
Does he play a good fiddle?
Not as good as Johnny
@@jackskelington7377 Well obviously not 😁
@@jackskelington7377 Turns out gold fiddles have terrible tone.
For Muslims, "Haram" means something forbidden, or sinful. I guess that's why it was changed
Wow! Well done!
Thanks. This complicated it a little bit for me. I thought Satan was simply a guy who asked questions.
Well. I'm not so far away though.
So this is dumb, but you just incidentally explained the demonology of the Netflix Sabrina series. In that, Lucifer is Satan is the devil, cast out of hell, Lilith was the first witch who served him, blah blah blah.
In the show there are other demons that are semi-autonomous from Satan that I didn’t understand in the show’s theology. But they would just fit as either other, lesser, cast out angels or as Nephilim! It’s dumb and nonsense, but your background here made it fit in my brain more completely. Thanks!
Who were the members of the Isrealite pantheon?
EL ,Ashearh Ba'al Marduk, Yam, Chemosh Yahweh, etc.
I've heard from Protestants many times that "Job is the oldest book of the Bible"; if that was the case, it wouldn't be a new development.
Which Protestants have called Job the oldest book in the bible? Do you have any reference, like a book or article?
. . . In my view, Lutherans started critical bible studies in Germany. And those studies point to a late date of Job, probably the Persian period.
@@Achill101 all the Protestants I grew up around. My parents, for example, and people at their church and Bible study groups. Idk how they came up with this idea.
@@k98killer - thanks. I can't explain why.
Would you mind telling us the church/congregation you and your parents went to?
@@Achill101 Baptist and then Presbyterian
@k98killer - thanks.
Maybe a Baptist or Presbyterian can tell you more how they saw Job.
Luke 10 is strange because he exclaims it as a celebratory statement. Hard to see how the Enochic notion of the Watchers falling to earth to do evil as somehow a good thing. Probably some kind of mystery cult thing.
🤘🏾🖖🏾✊🏾
In my understanding, Satan had to be objective in order to "accuse" God of anything, so I was always trying to steelman his position. Turns out, he was the *GOOD* guy in the book.
LOL 😂 ! U R handle says it all !
That seems to be the understanding of it. It's all myth and legend anyway, but they should at least get their fairy tales correct. Well said
"Satan" only killed like 10 men where "God" annihilated millions and was going to totally wipe out humanity... until Jesus got BBQ'd and he wasn't hangry anymore.
What about Satan or the accuser in Job?
Did you watch the video?
I consider the Job story to be a theater piece. Otherwise it doesn't make a lot of sense.
Is the Christian Satan figure based on zoroastrianism, or is it a convergent idea?
There is are videos made by Religion for Breakfast on the topic of both Satan and Demons. They're both very good videos and an overall great channel.
Christians had to make up Satan as an enemy of God, or else the whole human sacrifice for all eternity doesn't make sense, because Humans can overcome "sin" & obstacles without blood.
Satan as fallen angel is in the Jewish book of Enoch IIRC that was widely read in pre-Christian Judaism but didn't make it into the canon.
@@Achill101
What's an Enoch Persian, like from Persia where Zoastorism originated?
@@mickeydecurious - no, biblical scholars assume today that the Book of Enoch was a Hebrew book from the early Hellenistic times, like the 3rd century BC. Small parts of it have been found among the Dead Sea Scrolls, but the complete Book of Enoch has only been preserved by the Ethiopian Church.
@@Achill101
I've read The book of Enoch it's an interesting read with nothing scientifically more or morally applicable to society, and it gets insight into how ancient Men . But other than that nothing applicable about it.
Just think if Christians weren't so handy with the sword and force conversions Christianity be a dead and done religion, and we could actually discuss adult things and put away things from childhood like fantasies and not accountability 🤔
When the world be a better place if we just put the religion to the side all of them they have done nothing to improve society; and you can't say that Christianity gave us our laws, because that's not true we have had laws and society things that are taboo or not taboo since society first was a society.
@mickeydecurious - societies before Judaism and Christianity certainly had laws and morals, but if you studied them, you might be surprised how different they would be from our still Christian-influenced morals: Caesar conquering Gaul and killing a million people in the process was not seen as immoral but as laudable by the Romans. Christian nations had their share of atrocities, too, but there was always internal criticism of how people were treated, despite the wealth and power these atrocities brought.
Who tempts Jesus in the desert
Who sent Jesus to the desert to be tempted?
@@20quid Depends on the gospel doesn't it?
The Bible is a salvation story of the Father you spring from, the ruler of this world, David, the Morning Star.
Adam, the Christ, is a third-party mediator to this world and these heavens between you and your Father.
For who is greater: the one seated at table or the one who serves? Is it not the one seated at table? I am among you as the one who serves. (Luk 22:27 NABO)
Esau, the firstborn, lives by the sword (sacrifice) and serves his brother, Jacob, who was born gripping (striking at) his heel.
Isaac blessed Esau saying: Ah, far from the fertile earth shall be your dwelling; far from the dew of the heavens above! (Gen 27:39 NABO)
You will not always have me (Mat 26:11 NABO)
I am with you always, until the end of the age. (Mat 28:20 NAB)
My kingdom does not belong to this world. (Joh 18:36 NABO)
Where I am going you cannot come. (Joh 8:21 NABO)
Then I took my staff "Refuge" and snapped it asunder, breaking off the covenant which I had made with all peoples (Noahic covenant) (Zec 11:10 NABO)
Then I snapped asunder my other staff, "Heritage" (Deu 32:8) breaking off my brotherhood with (or between?) Judah and Israel. (Zec 11:14 NABO)
the one who ascended far above all the heavens themselves (Eph 4:10 NABO)
never to return to corruption (Act 13:34 NABO)
"By your sword (sacrifice) you shall live, and your brother you shall serve; But when you become restive (weak; faint; infirm; a worm; man of suffering; restless; wanderer in the desert; way of the Lord in the desert), you shall throw off his yoke from your neck." (Gen 27:40 NABO)
Save me, I pray, from the hand of my brother Esau! (Gen 32:12 NABO)
Esau ran to meet him, embraced him, and flinging himself on his neck, kissed him as he wept. (Gen 33:4 NABO)
Take my yoke upon you and learn from me, for I am meek and humble of heart; and you will find rest for yourselves. For my yoke is easy, and my burden light. (Mat 11:29-30 NABO)
In the Quran, Shaytan or Satan is real and is the enemy of mankind. He was called Ibliis before he disobeyed God. After that he is referred to only as Shaytan.
7:10 We have indeed established you on earth and provided you with a means of livelihood. ˹Yet˺ you seldom give any thanks.
7:11 Surely We created you, then shaped you, then said to the angels, “Prostrate before Adam,” so they all did-but not Iblîs, who refused to prostrate with the others.
7:12 Allah asked, “What prevented you from prostrating when I commanded you?” He replied, “I am better than he is: You created me from fire and him from clay.”
7:13 Allah said, “Then get down from Paradise! It is not for you to be arrogant here. So get out! You are truly one of the disgraced.”
7:14 He appealed, “Then delay my end until the Day of their resurrection.”
7:15 Allah said, “You are delayed ˹until the appointed Day˺.”
7:16 He said, “For leaving me to stray I will lie in ambush for them on Your Straight Path.
7:17 I will approach them from their front, their back, their right, their left, and then You will find most of them ungrateful.”
7:18 Allah said, “Get out of Paradise! You are disgraced and rejected! I will certainly fill up Hell with you and your followers all together.”
7:19 ˹Allah said,˺ “O Adam! Live with your wife in Paradise and eat from wherever you please, but do not approach this tree, or else you will be wrongdoers.”
7:20 Then Satan tempted them in order to expose what was hidden of their nakedness. He said, “Your Lord has forbidden this tree to you only to prevent you from becoming angels or immortals.”
7:21 And he swore to them, “I am truly your sincere advisor.”
7:22 So he brought about their fall through deception. And when they tasted of the tree, their nakedness was exposed to them, prompting them to cover themselves with leaves from Paradise. Then their Lord called out to them, “Did I not forbid you from that tree and ˹did I not˺ tell you that Satan is your sworn enemy?”
7:23 They replied, “Our Lord! We have wronged ourselves. If You do not forgive us and have mercy on us, we will certainly be losers.”
7:24 Allah said, “Descend as enemies to each other. You will find in the earth a residence and provision for your appointed stay.”
7:25 He added, “There you will live, there you will die, and from there you will be resurrected.”
7:26 O children of Adam! We have provided for you clothing to cover your nakedness and as an adornment. However, the best clothing is righteousness. This is one of Allah’s bounties, so perhaps you will be mindful.
7:27 O children of Adam! Do not let Satan deceive you as he tempted your parents out of Paradise and caused their cover to be removed in order to expose their nakedness. Surely he and his soldiers watch you from where you cannot see them. We have made the devils allies of those who disbelieve.
14:19 Do you not see that God has created the heavens and the earth for a purpose? He can eliminate you if He wills and bring into being a new creation
14:20 that is no difficult thing for God
14:21 They shall all appear before God and the weak will say to those who behaved proudly, We were your followers. Can you protect us from God's punishment? They will reply, Had God given us guidance, we would have guided you. It is all the same whether we are patient or impatient; there is no escape for us
14:22 When the Judgement has been passed, Satan will say to them, God made you a true promise; I too made you promises, but I failed you. I had no authority over you, except that I called you and you responded to me. Do not now blame me, but blame yourselves! I cannot help you, nor can you help me. I reject your former act in associating me with God. The wrongdoers will have a painful punishment
14:23 But those who believed and did good deeds will be brought into Gardens with rivers flowing through them. They shall abide there forever by their Lords permission, and will be welcomed with the greeting, Peace.
This is because the Muslims take the concept from Christians and Talmudic Jews. The original hebrews did not have a concept of a single Satanic entity; Satan is whatever that opposed humans, including angels sent by God to test Job/Ayyub
The gooder God gets, the more evil the Devil.
"Satan" is the name of a prosecuting angel in the Heavenly Court. Yet some say that he became an independent ruler over a realm of eternal damnation, and that he acts in opposition to God's will - i.e., that he is a separate god. This idolatrous concept is not even a belief in an intermediary, since it claims that Satan is not under God's control.
It's interesting how religions all mix together. They pick and choose from different beliefs and toss it all into a blender to make their own religion, kind of like how the Egyptians and the Greeks made their own King of the gods.
That's the best way to start a new religion and get converts from existing ones. You make it familiar enough that makes people believe they had most of it right, making your new additions easier to embrace, especially if you throw in the part about being a fulfillment of their religion.
It's ironic, Christianity and Islam both did that with Judaism and look how many of each their are today.
It always struck me as odd that the Catholic Church calls Satan the “king of lies” but Satan never told a lie.
I mean the Catholic Church teaches that human death didn't exist until Eve ate the fruit, so when the serpent says "you will not certainly die" it can be seen as the first lie. It's pretty straightforward to say the individual who told the first lie is the 'father of all lies', or 'king of lies' etc.
@@skypangolin8576 I understand. I was Catholic for 30 years before I left (long story). We could discuss the details on it because it could go both ways. It all depends on your point of view
Remember, Ben Kenobi said all truth depends on a certain point of view lol.
Holman Christian Standard Bible Genesis 3:4 No! You will not die,” the serpent said to the woman.”
Is Lying a Righteous Deception or an Unrighteous Deception?
We are born into Satan's Kingdom. This is why we need the tree of life. Jesus is the vine the true branch of life to God. Jesus will crush this Kingdom.
Eve transgressed against the Law of God. Eve is the mother of everyone living. So in birth pains everyone was born into lawlessness. The cherub angel in charge of the garden of Eden deceived her with an unrighteous deception. This made this cherub angel the ruler of this world.
Satan is an Angel of Light
By an unrighteous deception she ate the fruit.
2 Thessalonians 2:9 But the lawless one’s presence is by the operation of Satan with every powerful work and lying signs and wonders 10 and every unrighteous deception for those who are perishing, as a retribution because they did not accept the love of the truth in order that they might be saved. 11 That is why God lets a deceptive influence mislead them so that they may come to believe the lie, 12 in order that they all may be judged because they did not believe the truth but took pleasure in unrighteousness.
2 Corinthians 2:14 And no wonder, for Satan himself keeps disguising himself as an angel of light. 15 It is therefore nothing extraordinary if his ministers also keep disguising themselves as ministers of righteousness. But their end will be according to their works.
2 Timothy 2:14 Also, Adam was not deceived, but the woman was thoroughly deceived and became a transgressor.
Adam wasn't deceived. The ground did produce thorns and thistles because Jesus worn the crown of thorns and thistles. God told Adam the prophecy of the resurrection. Genesis 3:15
The Sacrifice of Jesus was the first part of the prophecy of Genesis 3:15 And I will put enmity between you and the woman and between your offspring and her offspring. He will crush your head, and you will bruise him in the heel.” Satan the Dragon and the Wild Beast the 6th Kingdom executed Jesus on their image the cross. It was the Roman Empire of Italy that is also the shape of the heel. So the first part of the prophecy is complete . Satan bruised Jesus in the heel.
@@strappedfatman7858 can I have some of what you are on?
Yeah but who is the serpent that made Adam and Eve leave paradise 😂?…
Dan McClellan is a later day saint he isnt a christian, he isnt an athiest. He speaks facts but draws conclusions that are aimed at turning people away from Christianity.
E.g
It is true Lucifer most likely isnt Satan and is most likely not even a name, it is also true that Ezekiel's description of the anointed Cherub most likely wasnt referring to satan.
Satan isnt even a name, its similar to the word devil, they are both titles.
Most of the common bibles dont talk much about Satan. Satan becomes more present in the new testament together with things like demonic possession.
But why is that?
The common bible we have today doesn't talk much about angels or the sons of God. Even in the great flood were they are mentioned, it doesnt say what happened to the sons of God that took human wives. However the story is interesting...
You started with the garden of eden story, go to the book of enoch, go to the book of Job, go to the book of exodus, then Daniel, then the gospels, then the book of revelations. His name was most likely Azazel, the one who accuses himanity.
So listen to Dan with caution, he isnt an atheist, he is a later day saint who believes that the bible contains lies and has to be done away with. He wants people to stop believing the bible as truth because he believs it causes more harm than good at the moment.
He also doesn't have a spiritual approach to scripture, all his interpretations are based on the idea that scripture isnt univocal. In other words, he teaches half truths that exclude other teachings because he cannot reconcile the opinions he finds differing. These he calls contradictions, like God's omnipotence and omnipresence, which is just failure on his part to understand scripture. You can try to use some of his conclusions, but trust me in reality, you have no idea how bad his points are. And i dont blame you. You see, the facts he points out are true, but the conclusions, are usually not true because he rejects the univocallity of the bible, so if the facts he is pointing out are true, then the conclusion is also true. But the conclusions are wrong, because he is leaving out other facts, which when added to the equation, produce a completely different conclusion.
Listen to his facts, do your own research then draw your own conclusions.
Yeshua the failed apocalyptic prophet.
Maybe people then realised that yhwh is satan? They just accepted the image and name he gave moses😅
If you're nasty--er, I mean Gnostic. 😄
@@digitaljanusgnasty
How did these guys do? th-cam.com/video/DvbhOnOn9QU/w-d-xo.htmlsi=6W0zI1rqJVRTAJYv
So it’s in the Bible it’s just pronounced differently 😂
The Satan is an archetype of which there are many instantiations in the text. Making him concrete could be a cultural development but there is an internal logic to it. Jesus alludes to him and was himself Jewish, after all. Since he clearly expected his audience to understand the reference, it seems unlikely that first century Judaism didn't find Satan or the devil in their own text. How else do you explain the NT text short of rejecting its authenticity.
Sir your videos look absolutely silly. You can shoot in 4:3 and frame your shot in such a way that you can crop your videos to work in 16:9 and 9:16
I am haSatan of Dan's channel. 😈
So Dan lets get back to Sol invictus, you seem to have run away.
Lame, yet nobody 😂
Do we need to know any other data than that the Lord is God and that we are anti-God and anti-christ?
How can we know that?
In discourse with people who do not believe in christianity you need to make a argument for your position and have evidence to back it up
Huh?
Ain’t no satan when your a jew.
Lucifer is not Satan? The first horseman the white one is not evil. Abaddon is actually good? How low can they go. Just admit what they are already
White Rider of the 4 Horsemen is actually Jesus, yes.
Gee, Dan, you won't find God mentioned anywhere in the Bible either because that also is just a noun, title or job description, not a proper name.
You do, however, find the name of God all over the Bible.
@@20quid Actually, you find several different words being used in place of a name. Father, God, Gods, gods, Spirit, Lord, Angel of the Lord, Sir, Lord of Hosts...it goes on. Even Yah, Yahweh, Yahveh or Big Daddy J, is more of a word than a name. Something to do with existing. Who shall I say sent me? The one who really exists sent you.
Same with the devil, Lucifer, Belial, father of lies, tempter, accuser, serpent, sneaky snake, Nicholas Scratch, etc. No definite name his mommy and daddy gave him when he was born and he was held up daddy said, 'Behold, Myron, the only thing greater than yourself '. Kudos if you get the reference. And yes, the devil's name is Myron. That's why he's so mad all the time. 😂
The Hebrew Bible is quite technical, Dan. Even many Christians have hard time understanding it. So you need to tread carefully. Study Isaiah 14 & Ezekiel 28 & see if you will still not find Satan there! To prove the technicality of the Hebrew Bible, here is a text from Isaiah. Can you explain what the sevenfold brightness of the sun means?
"On every lofty mountain and on every high hill there will be streams running with water on the day of the great slaughter, when the towers fall. *The light of the moon will be as the light of the sun, and the light of the sun will be seven times brighter, like the light of seven days,* on the day the Lord binds up the fracture of His people and heals the bruise He has inflicted."
Isaiah 30:25-26.
He references Isaiah 14 at 2:40
@@20quid- oopsie, someone didn't watch the video. Nice catch.
@@20quid And the king of Babylon in Isaiah 14 is a conflation of two characters - one human & the other was a divine being that gave the human component his power. This is a theme so prevalent in the Prophets. For example, if you study Daniel 10, the kingdoms of Greece & Persia are also portrayed as having divine entities standing behind the power of the human kings! So the king is an integration of two separate beings:
1. Human king
2. And the wicked angelic being known in Isaiah 14 as Lucifer!
These are intricate details which can easily escape the notice of a secular scholar who is hellbent on destroying the Bible!
@@danieldengL4R The only intricacies I see are your unlettered delusions.
@@danieldengL4Rnothing was named as Lucifer in the Hebrew bible, since Latin didn't exist yet. Conflating a modern English text with what was originally written doesn't prove your point.
I am starting to think Dan McClellan could be Satan himself.
So you’re like a wanna be Dr Michael Heiser?
So someone argued with God about Job but it was just a vague nobody in a role. Get real, weakest argument I've ever heard and not even true to the OT account.
A being that can stand before God's throne and argue the case about Job directly to God, but who could it be? Well just a vague somebody you say. Can't be a spirit being you say.
It's a title sure. Ask yourself why is it a title.
This non-existent being sure has you fooled.
Why would a fallen angel who had fought a war against God before being cast out for all eternity even be able to stand before God's throne let alone be allowed to argue a convincing case? Either way, what is clear is that the modern western evangelical understanding of Satan/Lucifer/the Devil is a post-Biblical invention that differs significantly from the text itself.
Yes, this man is either a fool or a fraud.
Why God got angry at the serpent in Paradise if he was a faithful servant??? You lie all the time…
the serpent is just a serpent, plus its just a metaphorical story
Thr serpent isn't Satan. Christians did what christians always do, ie colonise and butcher the culture of others to manufacture their own narrative. Hence christians falsely claimed the serpent to be Satan even though their own bible the serpent is just a serpent, not Satan.
Where in Genesis does it say that the serpent is the faithful servant?
That doesn’t make any sense. How can you believe in God without Satan also? You’re supposed to believe and worship God and believe that Satan exists in Hell for all eternity. How can there be good without evil? How can there be light in the world but also darkness, sin, and evilness in the world and universe? Satan is mentioned in the Bible, though. Jesus said that He saw and was there for Satan’s fall from Heaven to Hell. This is exactly what Satan wants you to believe. He wants us all to believe in anything or anyone else other than God. He doesn’t care if you’re Atheist, pagan, Buddhist, Hindu Indian, Muslim, in which they worship Allah also, which isn’t true salvation. Or, even a Satanist. It doesn’t matter. But, you’re not a true Christian unless you believe in Satan also. And I thought that Jews also believe that Satan is an actual epitome and symbol but real entity at the exact same time of any type or level of sin and wickedness.
@Heather You're confused. Satan does not exist in hell: he's going there for his final destruction according to the book of Revelation upon Jesus's return for judgement on all the earth .
It's interesting that you see the massive flaw in the christian mythology and worldview.
The fact that Satan didn't exist untill christians invented it should explain a lot as there was no concept of Satan in the Hebrew bible and culture. Even in the development of christian mythology, the Satan modern christians include in their god pantheon is different from the Satan of the 1st and 2nd century which is different from the Satan of the middle ages. In the same way the Jesus in the christian pantheon is vastly different from the jesus of christians of the past.
Satan was created as a christian political tool. A scapegoat to attach to those they hated, despises and persecuted. Christians right up to today still practice "demonising" those they hate and cannot control. Anything and anyone that doesn't conform the the ever changing and fickle christian worldview is "satanic" or " evil. It's such an effective christian dogma that it has even allowed christiand to justify the horrific genocides, slavery, rape and slaughter of children, persecutions and subjugation of people groups and general physical and political violence so as to become a world dominant religion.
The biggest irony is even in the christian version and rewriting of the hebrew bible, Satan still isn't the bad guy in the story. It's not Satan who commits mass genocide, commands his people commit brutal genocide, legislates chattel and sex slavery, abolishes free speech, command women obey men and legislates the slaughter and persecution of non believers and lgbtq people. All those ateocities and morally depraved acts and commands are all done by the christian gods.
Satan is nothing more than a scapegoat. Which is essential in the christian mythology as the christian worldview and foundation of its dogma is to avoid accountability for one's actions and put the blame and punishment on someone or something else. You only want to be a christian so that you can do morally depraved things and call it "good" and blame a "Satan" scapegoat for your actions.
You’re confused. Satan is mentioned in the Bible numerous times and is a real entity who was the first one to sin against God and influence Adam and Eve to sin against God also. And he isn’t a “scapegoat” and he is the baddest one in the Bible and universe. God only committed massive genocide in the Old Testament because the people were truly evil and wicked who were doing all of those things that you just mentioned. God never once encouraged sin. He didn’t say for women to marry their rapists from the field. It was men having consensual sex with the women from the fields. That’s why the women were to be labeled as whores if they didn’t marry the man that they had random but consensual sex with in the fields. If you think that somehow God is evil and Satan is an awesome guy, then, I hope you get everything you’re looking for in the afterlife and on Judgement Day. God is good all of the time. And Satan is the ultimate evil and he is in Hell. He’s just free and rules over Hell as his kingdom. It’s only in the Book of Revelations that he will be captured and imprisoned and then completely destroyed by Jesus. But, like I said earlier, Jesus saw Satan in the desert and saw him fall from Heaven into Hell. And the Bible means this literally not symbolically or metaphorically. It’s very important to remember and know which things in the Bible are literal or symbolic or an analogy for something to convey its meaning. And just because Christians aren’t God’s chosen people, like the Hebrews, Israelites, and Jews are, doesn’t mean that Christians aren’t valuable to God. In fact, God loves us all, even the worst people imaginable. The only difference is whether or not we love Him and want to spend all of eternity with him.
Thoughts on Jer 31:31/32 depending on version, where the author refers to Hashem as ba’alti b’am? Thus isn’t that same deity is it? בָּעַ֥לְתִּי בָ֖ם
What do you think of Good Omens?
I loved the job scene, high tier comedy