Appreciate you showing and speaking truth of ownership, buying and repairing a plane before I start my journey as a regular working man to save up to attend flight school and purchase my own plane. Your video helps me to believe that I can achieve just have to believe in myself, work hard and save lots of money.
What a timely post, I am in the midst of a similar project on a '58 Boanaza and in the process of looking at options for a panel upgrade. A friend, who recently used a similar system to install avionics in his RV8, recommended I look into this fast stack system. Very interested to see how it goes for you.
Nice!! Tell Tim you heard about it here! I'm really looking forward to hooking everything up. I now have everything ready to go except the auto pilot :(. Hit a delay on that :/. So painful to wait!!!!
Thanks Jimmy for the tip! I too agree the costs associated with avionics anything is simply out of control. Appreciate you brining this option to our attention!! Keep it up!
Being an Engineer/Tech for an avionics wiring company that works on mostly aerospace and defense, I can tell you that $5k for harnesses and wiring is still cheap. I know it can get pricey, especially for some of the stuff we work on ($1500 connectors for modern aircraft is crazy). But when it comes to wiring, sometimes it pays to go with a better product. 22AWG cheap wire is heavy. If they use a 24AWG wire, but it's good wire, weight reduction and reliability are maximized without detriment to the system. Let alone using comms with cheap wire. I know it's done already, but in the future, maybe rely on a company that's continuing to outfit/upfit systems that (I believe) you've used in a previous life. 😉
Hi Jimmy, this is a nice project. can you tell me it looks like you did most of the work yourself. Are you an Aircraft mechanic? or were you working on the plane with the guidance of an aircraft mechanic? Is this something you would recommend someone do to get into a plane vs spending hundreds of thousands of dollars on a flight worthy one? As I am going through this series of videos, which it had been a bit more detailed. Not for my reference on how to put a plane together but it would have been nice to see you toil and curse as things don't fit like you expected. Its a real nice overview of the stuff you did though. Great work.
My MOS in the Marine Corps included building and repairing wiring harnesses for Marine Corps aircraft. Had I known I could sell one of them for $5000 I would have started my own business when I left the military. What a scam.
I owned N8237Y for close to 20y, Piper PA30B Miller conversion. I loved that airplane. I hope this Cherokee 6 flies as well and is as reliable as my twin comanche. Great series. How are you gonna handle ADS requirements?
Sounds like a nice plane. Tell me more about the Miller conversion. The AD's are somewhat in line. I have documentation on some and the others (mostly due to age) will need to be complied with again. And the new one will cost me $300-$500 for the lower wing spar.
@@therealjimmysworld there were several variants of a Miller conversion. The basic tenet was 200 hp IO 360 C1C engines on each wing, with dorsal fin so that single engine VMC was possible through greater yaw control (could remove the required 104mph placard from dash legislated by so many single engine Vmc demonstrations gone wrong), some of the Miller conversions had additional nacelles on the wing, some with more fuel via nacelle tanks. Mine had Brittan tip tanks so my fuel was 104 gallons useful which was more than enough to outlast my bladder three times over. My avionics were Garmin 430 WAAS, KX-155, CI209, KCS55a (electric HSI), retained vacuum AI in copilot panel for added safety in case of electrical failure, slaved both 430 and 155 to hsi and 209, has century 2000 with alt hold, and garmin digital transponder (can’t remember number right now). I removed ADF when it broke. Also had an ancient WX7 stormscope that worked, but I would never ever trust it. It was a really nice plane. I was always impressed by how well made Pipers were.
@@therealjimmysworld I had a elevator tube AD that required periodic check of the elevator attachment at the pivot tube. Also had a landing gear wiring harness AD, so I replaced the harness.
I am like you. No AD or IA, but had a friend who was chief mechanic at Piper in Memphis for a number of years awhile ago. He inspected my work. Only had to pay for the harness.
I'm new to GA. I've been a process control engineer for 43 years working with computer systems (ancient tech and new) that are used to control very volatile processes (i.e., one wrong move and BOOM!). These systems are distributed, so the copper wire length is reduced by putting environmentally hardened RTUs (smart termination devices) out where the measurements are needed and just running a redundant network cable back to the system, whereupon all the components of the system have access to the data without need for further wiring. GA is SO behind the times. I understand the need for conservatism, as trust me, my business is about as conservative as GA when it comes to change. But all those harnesses just screamed at me that there is a much better way to wire up private planes that is every bit as reliable (maybe more so), and it would save HUNDREDS of pounds in copper wire. That in and of itself should be cause to change the paradigm. That being said, great vids Jimmy. I'm learning a lot and having my eyes opened again and again...
Neil, this is an intriguing idea that is over my head, but my question is how resilient such a system would be to the environmental considerations in an aircraft, most notably a lightning strike, which is not entirely uncommon.
I’m TRYING to put 2 G5s and the GMU-11 in a Cherokee six 260 right now. Where is the magic spot for the GMU. It sure doesn’t like the top rear fuselage area :(
Ok Jimmy. Love your videos. I just bought a 1978 Bellanca Super Viking. New paint. New interior. Low time engine. But the avionics stink. What’s your advice to get it IFR capable? Thanks. Viking Joe
Looks like you’re an A&P as well pilot, between being able to do your own work and getting a good deal on this plane it definitely looks like you’re on the up and up. Can’t wait to see some videos of it flying.
Not an A&P, just play one on tv. Seriously, though, I'm not an A&P. I am working under very close supervision of an awesome IA. Working on getting the 3 years of experience to take the test for the A&P.
Love your attitude towards excessively overpriced products. Most folks just say if you have to ask for a price you shouldn’t be flying but that’s just wrong! Most companies will price themselves outta business and there is no need for aviation to be soooo expensive! I own a 1961 172B. No show queen but she runs great and is structurally sound!
Please hear me out. When pilots or Mechanics do there own avionics that can be scary. Because most don’t do incoming inspections to test out there current avionics like existing coaxes, antennas. That’s the biggest misconception that a lot people have. Like for example you take a certified calibrated IFR-6000 test set to heck the current transponder and encoder to see how well it’s performing on the current configuration. Ya a pilot or a mechanic can say I fly it and everything works which is always good to here. But the other thing is to verify it. Because without checking the power out put checking or pressure altitude and squawk code you don’t know if your existing coax, antennas, and encoder will work for your current configuration. The other thing do you have the proper calibrated tools like crimpers for Garmin pins, crimpers for the coax that need to be changed, the manufacture current install manual for the avionics your going to be interfacing with, and the calibrated test set to check out your avionics when your done. Like an IFR 6000, ramp tester transponder check out for Mode A, Mode C and ADS-B test set. Or ramp tester, or IFR 4000 for ILS, VOR, Glodeslope test set. Plus don’t forget the very important test set your suppose to check if you break into the pitot/static system is a calibrated test set to check for leaks on your pitot and static system! Most experimental guys that do there own avionics can get away from doing a lot. Like going to Lowe’s, Home Depot, Ace Hardware, Autozone to get there aircraft supplies. Certified world everything needs paper work, correct approved wiring per system and coaxes too. The last thing is the training and experience of wiring. Like what is the current install manual for the right software version you need for you configuration. Yes you will spend money a lot of money for avionics and installation. The good thing is that if the avionics shop has a good reputation then if anything happens they warranty comes with the job which is so worth it! If you have your family in that aircraft you need to make sure the job is done right. Because in the air you can’t just pull over and call for a tow.
@@therealjimmysworld It depends on the shop or the avionics tech that’s signing off the work. Because the biggest problem I see is paper work trail for both the Form 337 and logbook entry has none or the work didn’t have its STC, 8130’s, install manuals it was compiled with during that time of the install. When I see customers that have this done by either they did it themselves or had a experimental tech install it! There always some type of issues or paperwork was never done correctly and legally. For example installing your own GNS-430W with let’s just say Dual or single G5. You have to make sure both G5 and 430W have the current software and that a Garmin Dealer can only change software version on the GNS to meet the current interfacing. Trust me I see that all the time. The other issue is ya a kit like the one for your audio panel seems to be a quick plug in play. But if you don’t ground your shield drains then you can get some weird noise in your intercom. Plus if you don’t terminate and solder your ICS jacks like Mic, head phone jacks. Then you chasing your tail on why your getting either stuck TX key in either Com radio or won’t have side tone!
@@andy1esp105 That makes sense on the paperwork. Have you messed with the Fast Stack system before in other planes? What tips/tricks can you pass along to everyone?
I found you totally by chance and so clad I did I watched one of your more recent videos but decided to go back to thd beginning and watch it all I'm looking to start flying lessons next year need to save up the £8000 first though
Sad part is I would love to be an airline pilot, however I have 13 religious tattoos on my face , sad that the major airlines discriminate against tattooed individuals. So it makes me more hungry to own my own plane. I will fly I won't let this world or judgment stop me
The best option is buying a prefabricated wiring harness wired exactly how the install manual says with the exact wire fast stack approach sells you a Harness that connects to There hub so everything interfaces through there hub would be much more difficult to trouble shoot or interface newer equipment with other new inputs like the Garmin g3x
Back in 2013, I bought a Cherokee 235 that had been sitting in a hangar for twenty years. It was an absolutely wonderful airplane! When I decided to put in a new panel, I bought a Garmin 400W GPS, audio panel, indicators and radios on eBay. I had it installed at a local shop in 2018 and it was a nice setup. Then unfortunately, the plane was destroyed in the Paradise CA wildfire in November of that year. I’m still trying to find another good airplane that needs me to save it. Thanks Jimmy for the entertaining, informative and funny videos.
im not plane owner and not likely to be ........ but it do find this stuff interesting and your making it fun too...keep the good work up love-in it......
It’s an endless cycle. The more planes and repairs/maintenance cost, the less people who fly due to high cost. That means less work for repair shops so they raise prices to stay in business. The more new planes cost, the less they sell, so the price goes up due to lower volume. And, the less new planes sold, the more the price increases on used planes. It’s an endless bubble that is goes to pop one day. Slow death. Renting an antique airplane around here, I would rather be run over by a semi truck. It didn’t use to be this way. There were lots of new rental units available at multiple airports in this area. It was affordable and no chicken shit repairs/maintenance. Best wishes.
You will love your new plane. My wife and I have about 700 hours in our Cherokee 6. Perfect for a family or friends to travel with golf clubs or luggage. Can't wait for the first flight.
Thanks Tom, that's fantastic! I love to hear of others that actually fly their airplanes! It pains me to see something so wonderful fall into derelict.
how to estimate budget....whatever you think it is, add a "0" to the end! just kidding. I use ebay to research the actual cost of parts, and always add 10% extra to the budget to cover unexpected things. Labor is very difficult to budget. There are lots of piper forums that go over all this too. What project are you doing?
Hi Jimmy. Have you considered upgrading to a lavallier microphone. Your videos are based heavily on talking and it could really make the video quality pop. You could use a relatively affordable audio recorder and lav mic and itll be so much better. Love the videos, theres a severe lack of aircraft ownership videos out there (plenty of ones about flying them though!). I'll be doing the same with my Comanche 400 when I can finally start!
What a difference now from the 80's avionics, most of it was manually installed and running cables for connecting components. The time and materials it's worth 2600 you pay. Looking great and can't wait to see the final project, Oh I forgot to tell you on your other video, Flying a six over to Peter Knight Tampa Florida, while landing we hit FOD on the runway while landing and blew the left tire, The aircraft stayed on the runway and brake OK. We first notice it while we stop on the exit ramp taxing to the FBO. So if you ever have a flat it's good to know it handles OK.
The previous owner installed the HUB in my PA28R-180 when he installed a 430 W and new Transponder. Now I’m removing an old KX 150 replacing with a second 430, adding an Aspen, and a Trio autopilot. So we called Fast Stack, provided our N # and advised them of the equipment we are adding. They are making the new harness taking into account all the previous avionics, and will ship to my shop for a quick install. Plug and play. Amazing.
I have a 1965 Cherokee 6 with a 6 place intercom. The middle and back seat connections are in the overhead panel. It seems to work good. If you need some pics let me know. Looks pretty straightforward to put them there.
Definitely subscribed! I’m looking At a Cherokee 6 but it’s in dire need of an avionics upgrade. To my knowledge the 3rd row didn’t have any connection for intercoms.
Thanks so much!! Welcome to the party! In the next few videos, I'm going to go through my avionics upgrades for this fossil. I've come across a few with rear intercoms, and several awesome people connected with me from these videos about where they have rear intercoms. Let's see how this goes...
Have you been able to complete the install or bench test? Curious as to how things went. Thx for the video and the info. I will be looking to contact fast stack if you find no issues.
Not yet, I just learned about the process to get a field approval from the local FSDO, so that might be the next video. Stand by. the physical use of the product is great from everyone I've spoke to. It's the paperwork for a certified plane :/
Pardon my ignorance as I’m just getting started but I didn’t think all this fell under part 43? Not going to pretend I’ve read enough of it to make a statement hence the question. Thanks for the honest videos. I’m basically doing what you did except still in the ground school phase. 👍🏻
@@therealjimmysworld No. Your video saved myself a huge headache even though I can do it myself. I was actually looking into who could do this for me. As an A&P/IA I am doing the same carefully overseeing an annual/ upgrade on a Cessna 340 here at KBLM. I am interested in my own airplane resurrection someday similar to yours. Good luck and I'll be watching.
Great question, that several others are asking. I am not currently an A&P, I am under the close watchful eye of an IA. Honestly, I would rather do this work myself and have him double check everything as I can make sure it 100% gets done all the way. I've heard lots of stories and know a few A&P's/IA's that don't go to the depth that I want since it sat so long. I also have a thorough engineering and restoration background (see old videos on this channel). I also discovered that it takes 3 years to even qualify to take the A&P tests... seriously...
@@therealjimmysworld excellent. I was a crew chief on a Huey while in the army, so I am old and mechanically inclined, 😀 yep three years is a long time, I need to make friends with a IA I guess, not much I can’t do. My dad was a McA gold card judge, so you know I have torn apart a few toys and rebuilt them.
Jimmy, I would like to thank you for all the videos that you provide beautifully and at the same time useful and rich in information about spare parts. I am a fan of your channel thanks for taking the time and editing to shier all your work. I am from the Hashemite Kingdom of Jordan, airline pilot sens 27 years overseas
Thanks for the comment. I'll definitely double check to make sure everything is followed correctly and all the paperwork is in order. Have you used the system? What was your experience?
@@therealjimmysworld I did use it once, and it made for an easy install. I have not seen anything one way or the other on someone getting a field approval. I can say I got a quote from Park Rapids Avionics that makes the Approach Fast Stack, and I asked if they use the system for their installations. The answer was no. Obviously would be a great choice for amateur builds. One of the the downfalls is all of the extra pins connections are additional points for corrosion. As mentioned before FAA field approvals are best attained prior to installation in case it isn’t approved.
@@blimpcommander1337 Thanks for your comment. I asked the IA today about this and he said the same thing. We have to get all the docs together and call them, then submit some paperwork and probably wait months for a government to get a decision... Looks like that could be the next video! Any suggestions to make sure it goes through the first time?
The "6" is a great choice for a single engine cross country airplane, especially if you need the capacity. You have done well to find one in airworthy condition without excessive repairs. I flew many of the light twins and single engine airplanes in that era and always enjoyed a trip in the "6." Stay with your plan to make it "right" and it will reward you with many hours of service.
@@therealjimmysworld Cessna 310, Baron 55, and Cessna 401. All good performers, Cessnas had best single engine performance and 401 had a little boost plus nicer cabin. The 310J through 310P were 180kt cruise with reasonable fuel economy. Very reliable airplanes for Bahamas, etc.
Sure. Mount the hub where you don’t have a sharp bend in the wires right at the connector. With the FastStack you have double the pins and double the connectors. So double the failure points. A little planning and routing goes a long ways. Oh and good grounds. Always have a good ground.
@@therealjimmysworld the intercom was in there when we got the airplane so not sure were they are routed but i think they go from the floor and up the sides behide the interior. We had all the interior out at one time and thats what remember
Yes, FAR 43 is the "owner maintenance" section. As an owner, it's surprising just how much you CAN do! I am under the close supervision of an IA for this stuff. Yeah, replacing avionics is WAAAAY outside that box.
@@therealjimmysworld Too late for a PMA8000BT? There are a lot of benefits and is it wired exactly like the GMA340 so your fast stack will work perfect.
I always said, "The only guy that never got laid off at Piper was the one who raised prices." When I was installing avionics we did them one wire at a time. No shortcuts. But, labor was cheap 50 years ago. BTW, I hope you don't run into any routing problems where you have to run a 2 inch plug through a 1 inch hole somewhere. For your intercom in the back, they used to put ash trays on the side panels so just make a small plate out of aluminum to mount your head phone/mic jacks in. If the interior was done over, they may have already eliminated them. If they are still there, you can cut away the back part of the receptacle and reuse the chrome front part for a nice looking install. Look to a salvage yard for parts if yours are gone.
Thanks for putting up the videos. I bought a pa-32-300 last year and your videos are fun to watch and helpful as I want to do the same types of upgrades on mine.
Appreciate you showing and speaking truth of ownership, buying and repairing a plane before I start my journey as a regular working man to save up to attend flight school and purchase my own plane. Your video helps me to believe that I can achieve just have to believe in myself, work hard and save lots of money.
I put an approach fast stack in my Comanche a couple years ago during a panel forward restoration. Best decision I ever made. Worth it.
Nice!!! I'm super excited and already have seen the benefits as I have the option to swap out avionics (think G5's) and it will be soooo much easier!
What Comanche do you operate Rudy? I'm tempted to do the same in the restoration of my 400.
@@smokingspitfire1197 59 180
I just got my private and since I'm only 17 I cant buy my own plane yet but I can watch you. You earned a sub thank you!
Congrats! Glad more young people are flying. There is a HUUUGE demand for pilots and it's only going to get bigger.
What a timely post, I am in the midst of a similar project on a '58 Boanaza and in the process of looking at options for a panel upgrade. A friend, who recently used a similar system to install avionics in his RV8, recommended I look into this fast stack system. Very interested to see how it goes for you.
Nice!! Tell Tim you heard about it here! I'm really looking forward to hooking everything up. I now have everything ready to go except the auto pilot :(. Hit a delay on that :/. So painful to wait!!!!
Thanks Jimmy for the tip! I too agree the costs associated with avionics anything is simply out of control. Appreciate you brining this option to our attention!! Keep it up!
Being an Engineer/Tech for an avionics wiring company that works on mostly aerospace and defense, I can tell you that $5k for harnesses and wiring is still cheap. I know it can get pricey, especially for some of the stuff we work on ($1500 connectors for modern aircraft is crazy). But when it comes to wiring, sometimes it pays to go with a better product.
22AWG cheap wire is heavy. If they use a 24AWG wire, but it's good wire, weight reduction and reliability are maximized without detriment to the system. Let alone using comms with cheap wire.
I know it's done already, but in the future, maybe rely on a company that's continuing to outfit/upfit systems that (I believe) you've used in a previous life. 😉
Good stuff! Learning a lot and going along for the journey!
Thanks so much!
Thanks it’s good to find out about cheaper alternatives
I hope so. They said it would save tons of time on the install as well. Soon to come!
Thanks for sharing your experience with the restoration project. Saludos !!!
Glad you enjoyed it
These are awesome man keep up the great work!
thanks!
Hi Jimmy, this is a nice project. can you tell me it looks like you did most of the work yourself. Are you an Aircraft mechanic? or were you working on the plane with the guidance of an aircraft mechanic? Is this something you would recommend someone do to get into a plane vs spending hundreds of thousands of dollars on a flight worthy one? As I am going through this series of videos, which it had been a bit more detailed. Not for my reference on how to put a plane together but it would have been nice to see you toil and curse as things don't fit like you expected. Its a real nice overview of the stuff you did though. Great work.
you beat me to the video. thanks for the comment!
My MOS in the Marine Corps included building and repairing wiring harnesses for Marine Corps aircraft. Had I known I could sell one of them for $5000 I would have started my own business when I left the military. What a scam.
Yeah, it seemed way to expensive even for airplane money.
Thx
I can also help you with where our rear intercom plugs are.
Would love to get more info on that. email me at jiminize1@yahoo.com
Thanks in advance
Jimmy, how in the world are you affording all these planes and upgrades etc?
BaCoN
It’s a basic element!
I owned N8237Y for close to 20y, Piper PA30B Miller conversion. I loved that airplane. I hope this Cherokee 6 flies as well and is as reliable as my twin comanche. Great series. How are you gonna handle ADS requirements?
Sounds like a nice plane. Tell me more about the Miller conversion. The AD's are somewhat in line. I have documentation on some and the others (mostly due to age) will need to be complied with again. And the new one will cost me $300-$500 for the lower wing spar.
@@therealjimmysworld there were several variants of a Miller conversion. The basic tenet was 200 hp IO 360 C1C engines on each wing, with dorsal fin so that single engine VMC was possible through greater yaw control (could remove the required 104mph placard from dash legislated by so many single engine Vmc demonstrations gone wrong), some of the Miller conversions had additional nacelles on the wing, some with more fuel via nacelle tanks. Mine had Brittan tip tanks so my fuel was 104 gallons useful which was more than enough to outlast my bladder three times over. My avionics were Garmin 430 WAAS, KX-155, CI209, KCS55a (electric HSI), retained vacuum AI in copilot panel for added safety in case of electrical failure, slaved both 430 and 155 to hsi and 209, has century 2000 with alt hold, and garmin digital transponder (can’t remember number right now). I removed ADF when it broke. Also had an ancient WX7 stormscope that worked, but I would never ever trust it. It was a really nice plane. I was always impressed by how well made Pipers were.
@@therealjimmysworld I had a elevator tube AD that required periodic check of the elevator attachment at the pivot tube. Also had a landing gear wiring harness AD, so I replaced the harness.
I am like you. No AD or IA, but had a friend who was chief mechanic at Piper in Memphis for a number of years awhile ago. He inspected my work. Only had to pay for the harness.
So $2600 was a bargain for a box of wires? Listen, Jim, I got some ocean front property in Arizona, and if you'll buy that...
no kidding, plane prices are no joke... now if this was an experimental...$500 out the door, but because of the faa stuff, add a zero and double it!
can I work for yah?
Wanna sell the 6?
We are in the market for a Six as well. Enjoying your videos, please don’t leave us hanging. ;)
how are the videos so far?
I'm new to GA. I've been a process control engineer for 43 years working with computer systems (ancient tech and new) that are used to control very volatile processes (i.e., one wrong move and BOOM!). These systems are distributed, so the copper wire length is reduced by putting environmentally hardened RTUs (smart termination devices) out where the measurements are needed and just running a redundant network cable back to the system, whereupon all the components of the system have access to the data without need for further wiring. GA is SO behind the times. I understand the need for conservatism, as trust me, my business is about as conservative as GA when it comes to change. But all those harnesses just screamed at me that there is a much better way to wire up private planes that is every bit as reliable (maybe more so), and it would save HUNDREDS of pounds in copper wire. That in and of itself should be cause to change the paradigm. That being said, great vids Jimmy. I'm learning a lot and having my eyes opened again and again...
Thanks for the info, good to know!
Neil, this is an intriguing idea that is over my head, but my question is how resilient such a system would be to the environmental considerations in an aircraft, most notably a lightning strike, which is not entirely uncommon.
I’m TRYING to put 2 G5s and the GMU-11 in a Cherokee six 260 right now. Where is the magic spot for the GMU.
It sure doesn’t like the top rear fuselage area :(
Ok Jimmy. Love your videos. I just bought a 1978 Bellanca Super Viking. New paint. New interior. Low time engine.
But the avionics stink. What’s your advice to get it IFR capable?
Thanks. Viking Joe
Looks like you’re an A&P as well pilot, between being able to do your own work and getting a good deal on this plane it definitely looks like you’re on the up and up. Can’t wait to see some videos of it flying.
Not an A&P, just play one on tv. Seriously, though, I'm not an A&P. I am working under very close supervision of an awesome IA. Working on getting the 3 years of experience to take the test for the A&P.
Love your attitude towards excessively overpriced products. Most folks just say if you have to ask for a price you shouldn’t be flying but that’s just wrong! Most companies will price themselves outta business and there is no need for aviation to be soooo expensive! I own a 1961 172B. No show queen but she runs great and is structurally sound!
Nice!! Those are great airplanes!
Please hear me out. When pilots or Mechanics do there own avionics that can be scary. Because most don’t do incoming inspections to test out there current avionics like existing coaxes, antennas. That’s the biggest misconception that a lot people have. Like for example you take a certified calibrated IFR-6000 test set to heck the current transponder and encoder to see how well it’s performing on the current configuration. Ya a pilot or a mechanic can say I fly it and everything works which is always good to here. But the other thing is to verify it. Because without checking the power out put checking or pressure altitude and squawk code you don’t know if your existing coax, antennas, and encoder will work for your current configuration. The other thing do you have the proper calibrated tools like crimpers for Garmin pins, crimpers for the coax that need to be changed, the manufacture current install manual for the avionics your going to be interfacing with, and the calibrated test set to check out your avionics when your done. Like an IFR 6000, ramp tester transponder check out for Mode A, Mode C and ADS-B test set. Or ramp tester, or IFR 4000 for ILS, VOR, Glodeslope test set. Plus don’t forget the very important test set your suppose to check if you break into the pitot/static system is a calibrated test set to check for leaks on your pitot and static system! Most experimental guys that do there own avionics can get away from doing a lot. Like going to Lowe’s, Home Depot, Ace Hardware, Autozone to get there aircraft supplies. Certified world everything needs paper work, correct approved wiring per system and coaxes too. The last thing is the training and experience of wiring. Like what is the current install manual for the right software version you need for you configuration. Yes you will spend money a lot of money for avionics and installation. The good thing is that if the avionics shop has a good reputation then if anything happens they warranty comes with the job which is so worth it! If you have your family in that aircraft you need to make sure the job is done right. Because in the air you can’t just pull over and call for a tow.
Thanks again for another in depth comment and items to consider. What would you recommend for an owner assisted install to be done correctly?
@@therealjimmysworld It depends on the shop or the avionics tech that’s signing off the work. Because the biggest problem I see is paper work trail for both the Form 337 and logbook entry has none or the work didn’t have its STC, 8130’s, install manuals it was compiled with during that time of the install. When I see customers that have this done by either they did it themselves or had a experimental tech install it! There always some type of issues or paperwork was never done correctly and legally. For example installing your own GNS-430W with let’s just say Dual or single G5. You have to make sure both G5 and 430W have the current software and that a Garmin Dealer can only change software version on the GNS to meet the current interfacing. Trust me I see that all the time. The other issue is ya a kit like the one for your audio panel seems to be a quick plug in play. But if you don’t ground your shield drains then you can get some weird noise in your intercom. Plus if you don’t terminate and solder your ICS jacks like Mic, head phone jacks. Then you chasing your tail on why your getting either stuck TX key in either Com radio or won’t have side tone!
@@andy1esp105 That makes sense on the paperwork. Have you messed with the Fast Stack system before in other planes? What tips/tricks can you pass along to everyone?
I've got lots of Lowe's materials in/on my certified aircraft! 🤫
I found you totally by chance and so clad I did I watched one of your more recent videos but decided to go back to thd beginning and watch it all I'm looking to start flying lessons next year need to save up the £8000 first though
Thanks for sharing this 🙌 🙏 ❤
I'll be showing off more about this very soon as I'm upgrading avionics again :)
Sad part is I would love to be an airline pilot, however I have 13 religious tattoos on my face , sad that the major airlines discriminate against tattooed individuals. So it makes me more hungry to own my own plane. I will fly I won't let this world or judgment stop me
The best option is buying a prefabricated wiring harness wired exactly how the install manual says with the exact wire fast stack approach sells you a Harness that connects to
There hub so everything interfaces through there hub would be much more difficult to trouble shoot or interface newer equipment with other new inputs like the Garmin g3x
Well done Jimmy. Cant wait to see you get it all together.
Back in 2013, I bought a Cherokee 235 that had been sitting in a hangar for twenty years. It was an absolutely wonderful airplane! When I decided to put in a new panel, I bought a Garmin 400W GPS, audio panel, indicators and radios on eBay. I had it installed at a local shop in 2018 and it was a nice setup. Then unfortunately, the plane was destroyed in the Paradise CA wildfire in November of that year. I’m still trying to find another good airplane that needs me to save it. Thanks Jimmy for the entertaining, informative and funny videos.
Jimmy why don’t you use a forehead camera so that you can use both hands while working.
im not plane owner and not likely to be ........ but it do find this stuff interesting and your making it fun too...keep the good work up love-in it......
That price is a steal
I hope so... it's also a risk if that engine craps out.
Found the channel today because of cleetus. Love the content. Always wanted to fly. Maybe someday ill get my pilots license.
If I am doing a whole new avionics stack and panel in, where on the Cherokee is the main electrical power bus where the power wires go
It’s an endless cycle. The more planes and repairs/maintenance cost, the less people who fly due to high cost. That means less work for repair shops so they raise prices to stay in business. The more new planes cost, the less they sell, so the price goes up due to lower volume. And, the less new planes sold, the more the price increases on used planes. It’s an endless bubble that is goes to pop one day. Slow death. Renting an antique airplane around here, I would rather be run over by a semi truck. It didn’t use to be this way. There were lots of new rental units available at multiple airports in this area. It was affordable and no chicken shit repairs/maintenance. Best wishes.
Thanks and I can see that cycle playing out.
That box doesn’t look like it has all that stuff in it.
Unpacking that box reminded me of the scene in the Mary Poppins movie when she was unpacking her carpetbag.
hahaha
You will love your new plane. My wife and I have about 700 hours in our Cherokee 6. Perfect for a family or friends to travel with golf clubs or luggage. Can't wait for the first flight.
Thanks Tom, that's fantastic! I love to hear of others that actually fly their airplanes! It pains me to see something so wonderful fall into derelict.
You are so serious in this video Jimmy
LOVE the BA Co N shirt!
Although in Europe I'm learning a lot from this, what other resources can you recommend for a piper project? How did you estimate your budget?
how to estimate budget....whatever you think it is, add a "0" to the end! just kidding. I use ebay to research the actual cost of parts, and always add 10% extra to the budget to cover unexpected things. Labor is very difficult to budget. There are lots of piper forums that go over all this too. What project are you doing?
Great investment Jimmie
What happened to the 310
Fantastic!
Good luck with the rebuild. Get it finished, then learn how to land it...
landing is the easy part. You're guaranteed to land ;)
5000 for a wire harness build.
Crazy
Yeah, that's what I thought! I was expecting $500-$1000...nope
Hi Jimmy. Have you considered upgrading to a lavallier microphone. Your videos are based heavily on talking and it could really make the video quality pop. You could use a relatively affordable audio recorder and lav mic and itll be so much better.
Love the videos, theres a severe lack of aircraft ownership videos out there (plenty of ones about flying them though!). I'll be doing the same with my Comanche 400 when I can finally start!
Thanks for the comment. I've heard lots about those Comanche's. How do you like it?
What a difference now from the 80's avionics, most of it was manually installed and running cables for connecting components. The time and materials it's worth 2600 you pay. Looking great and can't wait to see the final project, Oh I forgot to tell you on your other video, Flying a six over to Peter Knight Tampa Florida, while landing we hit FOD on the runway while landing and blew the left tire, The aircraft stayed on the runway and brake OK. We first notice it while we stop on the exit ramp taxing to the FBO. So if you ever have a flat it's good to know it handles OK.
Thanks for sharing!
The previous owner installed the HUB in my PA28R-180 when he installed a 430 W and new Transponder.
Now I’m removing an old KX 150 replacing with a second 430, adding an Aspen, and a Trio autopilot.
So we called Fast Stack, provided our N # and advised them of the equipment we are adding.
They are making the new harness taking into account all the previous avionics, and will ship to my shop for a quick install.
Plug and play.
Amazing.
You had 999 subscribers. So I had to subscribe so I could be number 1,000. So that means I get first chance at the 180 when you put it up for sale.
You are my hero!!! and sure, when it goes up, I'll let you make the first offer over $1m ;)
I restored a 1959 Chevrolet Apache pickup truck once. I feel for you. Keep it up.
Love those trucks!
I have a 1965 Cherokee 6 with a 6 place intercom. The middle and back seat connections are in the overhead panel. It seems to work good. If you need some pics let me know. Looks pretty straightforward to put them there.
Good idea. Can you send pics? jiminize1@yahoo.com I haven't thought of the overhead panel.
Keep em coming! Keep em short. Really enjoying following along. Thanks for posting.
Thanks, will do!
working on my PPL and saving for a 6/300 now.... love this project
Good for you! Good luck!
Definitely subscribed! I’m looking At a Cherokee 6 but it’s in dire need of an avionics upgrade. To my knowledge the 3rd row didn’t have any connection for intercoms.
Thanks so much!! Welcome to the party! In the next few videos, I'm going to go through my avionics upgrades for this fossil. I've come across a few with rear intercoms, and several awesome people connected with me from these videos about where they have rear intercoms. Let's see how this goes...
Love the videos Jimmy!
What I wouldn't have given for premade cables back in the day when I was doing panel avionics!!!
Have you been able to complete the install or bench test? Curious as to how things went. Thx for the video and the info. I will be looking to contact fast stack if you find no issues.
Not yet, I just learned about the process to get a field approval from the local FSDO, so that might be the next video. Stand by. the physical use of the product is great from everyone I've spoke to. It's the paperwork for a certified plane :/
Its great your open and honest about cost / pricing! Great videos!
Thanks for your comment, glad you enjoyed the video!
Love your BaCoN shirt. Going to ask my wife for one for Christmas.
Pardon my ignorance as I’m just getting started but I didn’t think all this fell under part 43? Not going to pretend I’ve read enough of it to make a statement hence the question. Thanks for the honest videos. I’m basically doing what you did except still in the ground school phase. 👍🏻
Nevermind. I should have just read others comments. Thanks for the videos. Fly safe.
@@thebigbilltheory4388 haha, thanks for the comment. keep at it and I'll see you in the sky!
Using approach now for a 172 upgrade. Very valuable information and interesting with the comedy sprinkled in. Thanks!
nice!! Let me know how it goes! Did you know about them before my videos?
@@therealjimmysworld No. Your video saved myself a huge headache even though I can do it myself. I was actually looking into who could do this for me.
As an A&P/IA I am doing the same carefully overseeing an annual/ upgrade on a Cessna 340 here at KBLM. I am interested in my own airplane resurrection someday similar to yours. Good luck and I'll be watching.
@@toddgalloway9122 nice! glad I could help!
I am so glad that I can use non-TSO avionics for my Experimental plane. Same performance for a fraction of the price.
Curious. Are you an AP or is your work just being signed off? If so how is that working for you. Thanks.
Great question, that several others are asking. I am not currently an A&P, I am under the close watchful eye of an IA. Honestly, I would rather do this work myself and have him double check everything as I can make sure it 100% gets done all the way. I've heard lots of stories and know a few A&P's/IA's that don't go to the depth that I want since it sat so long. I also have a thorough engineering and restoration background (see old videos on this channel). I also discovered that it takes 3 years to even qualify to take the A&P tests... seriously...
@@therealjimmysworld excellent. I was a crew chief on a Huey while in the army, so I am old and mechanically inclined, 😀 yep three years is a long time, I need to make friends with a IA I guess, not much I can’t do. My dad was a McA gold card judge, so you know I have torn apart a few toys and rebuilt them.
The inputs i saw a on a plane was 28 volts dc adove front geer and 115 × 3 side of fuselage on a boeing
Interesting... I bet there are some smart people that see these comments that could help.
Im not certified mechanic
@@DavidBerquist334 do some research and let us know, now I'm curious
@@therealjimmysworld im not a certified mechanic
Very interesting project, thank you for sharing it with us
My pleasure!
Jimmy, I would like to thank you for all the videos that you provide beautifully and at the same time useful and rich in information about spare parts. I am a fan of your channel thanks for taking the time and editing to shier all your work. I am from the Hashemite Kingdom of Jordan, airline pilot sens 27 years overseas
Pays to research and shop around.
definitely!
I think the Faststack is a great product, but you are aware that has not been STC’d, and that you will have to get field approval prior to installing?
Thanks for the comment. I'll definitely double check to make sure everything is followed correctly and all the paperwork is in order. Have you used the system? What was your experience?
@@therealjimmysworld I did use it once, and it made for an easy install. I have not seen anything one way or the other on someone getting a field approval. I can say I got a quote from Park Rapids Avionics that makes the Approach Fast Stack, and I asked if they use the system for their installations. The answer was no. Obviously would be a great choice for amateur builds. One of the the downfalls is all of the extra pins connections are additional points for corrosion. As mentioned before FAA field approvals are best attained prior to installation in case it isn’t approved.
@@blimpcommander1337 Thanks for your comment. I asked the IA today about this and he said the same thing. We have to get all the docs together and call them, then submit some paperwork and probably wait months for a government to get a decision... Looks like that could be the next video! Any suggestions to make sure it goes through the first time?
The "6" is a great choice for a single engine cross country airplane, especially if you need the capacity. You have done well to find one in airworthy condition without excessive repairs. I flew many of the light twins and single engine airplanes in that era and always enjoyed a trip in the "6." Stay with your plan to make it "right" and it will reward you with many hours of service.
Thanks! What's your top 3 twins you liked flying and why?
@@therealjimmysworld Cessna 310, Baron 55, and Cessna 401. All good performers, Cessnas had best single engine performance and 401 had a little boost plus nicer cabin. The 310J through 310P were 180kt cruise with reasonable fuel economy. Very reliable airplanes for Bahamas, etc.
@@samphillips8322 Nice! Thanks for sharing. I'm looking at that for what's next after the 6.
I’ve put FastStack in a couple planes already. It’s great!
Great to hear! What tips/tricks can you share with me on this install?
Sure. Mount the hub where you don’t have a sharp bend in the wires right at the connector.
With the FastStack you have double the pins and double the connectors. So double the failure points.
A little planning and routing goes a long ways.
Oh and good grounds. Always have a good ground.
@@RowlandMax sounds good. The ground issues have come up several times.
The intercom for the back seats in our Cherokee 6 is right beside the center ceiling console just aft of the seats.
You're the second to have them in the ceiling. how much longer did the cables need to be and how are they routed from the panel?
@@therealjimmysworld the intercom was in there when we got the airplane so not sure were they are routed but i think they go from the floor and up the sides behide the interior. We had all the interior out at one time and thats what remember
@@jcontracting gotcha. Thanks for the follow up
@@therealjimmysworld ya no problem. I love the videos keep um rollin.
is there a limit to what you can do on a plane without being a certified mechanic?
Yes, FAR 43 is the "owner maintenance" section. As an owner, it's surprising just how much you CAN do! I am under the close supervision of an IA for this stuff. Yeah, replacing avionics is WAAAAY outside that box.
@@therealjimmysworld What the "IA" stands for?
@@sammoore8206 Inspection Authorization, it's a designation by the FAA for an A&P mechanic to sign documents.
Is the echo in the hanger or added effect 😁
hanger and phone mic. I got a wireless mic for that reason. Good catch
@@therealjimmysworld lol cool. Great videos by the way. Planning a 6 300 myself. In the next 24 months along with my license.
@@LucidFX. Rock and roll!!
What intercom did you go with?
I'm putting in a garmin 340 audio panel and 6 place intercoms.
@@therealjimmysworld Too late for a PMA8000BT? There are a lot of benefits and is it wired exactly like the GMA340 so your fast stack will work perfect.
@@markscheuer7091 email me and let me know what you want for it. I would like to update my 180. It's got an older kma24 in it.
@@therealjimmysworld I don’t have your email so could you email me? Contact@ps-engineering.com. Thanks
Just sent an email. FYI: I’ll gladly prostitute my videos for avionics!
I always said, "The only guy that never got laid off at Piper was the one who raised prices." When I was installing avionics we did them one wire at a time. No shortcuts. But, labor was cheap 50 years ago. BTW, I hope you don't run into any routing problems where you have to run a 2 inch plug through a 1 inch hole somewhere. For your intercom in the back, they used to put ash trays on the side panels so just make a small plate out of aluminum to mount your head phone/mic jacks in. If the interior was done over, they may have already eliminated them. If they are still there, you can cut away the back part of the receptacle and reuse the chrome front part for a nice looking install. Look to a salvage yard for parts if yours are gone.
100% right on the price guy!!
I'll check out the rear ash trays. That would be the best place.
@@therealjimmysworld ash trays ?!! Hilarious
And this is why I don't own an airplane lol. I am enjoying the heck out of watching you do all this.
This sounds so promising....what could possibly go wrong??!!
exactly!!
Thanks for putting up the videos. I bought a pa-32-300 last year and your videos are fun to watch and helpful as I want to do the same types of upgrades on mine.
Glad you like them!