I finished it recently, and...yeah, I struggled to get through it. [SPOILERS AHEAD] My main issue was with Stoner's passivity, particularly with respect to his relationship with his wife and his daughter. I see his resilience but also the way he allows others to sort of dominate him. Others take advantage of him, push him around, literally throw him out of his own study, and he repeatedly fails to stand up for himself or his life, even when his daughter's emotional and physical health is at stake. I agree the work is masterfully written, but I came away from the book feeling it was more tragedy than anything, and I was so disenchanted with the main character's lack of spine (IMO) that I lost hope in him and thus my interest in the story waned the more I read. The ending left me wanting so much more.
I kind of left thinking that was the beauty of it all. Stoner is a person that we all know, in a way the person we fear becoming, someone who kind of lets life happen to him without much resistance to assert himself against it. He kind of gets pulled along and trampled by life and the people in it, but I think the stunning moment is how it wraps up the tragedy in a beautiful way where he's able to find his peace in the work he's left behind in spite of it all. The ending surprised me and moved me immensely for some reason.
I stayed up far too late finishing Stoner last night. It took about 100 pages to get me hooked, but once I was hooked I wasn’t stopping until I finished. It was such an emotional story for such straightforward writing. I think it’s a book that I will appreciate more and more as time goes on and one that will stay with me for a long time. Loved it!
I can’t seem to find a copy with the same cover as yours, Roro. As it did with you, the story left a huge impression and I’ve always wanted a copy with that cover. Often think about his red bound book… 😢
Read Butcher’s Crossing last year and Stoner has been kicking around since then. I am going to start it today, cause Butcher’s Crossing was special. I am also finishing up Wellness based on your review and loving that as well. As someone who works in Higher Education I wish I read some of these books when I was younger. Would have helped me recognize some patterns a bit earlier. Thanks for the channel. Really enjoying tracking some of the reads. P.S. You single handedly got me to read The Whale, and I think your enthusiasm really helped push me through some of the more negative reviews. So, hyperbole is effective and you’ve used it well so far.
@@rororeads Just finished it and you weren't joking, I don't think anyone who recommends this book is joking. One aspect that I do not see commented on enough, or maybe at all from the reviews I've read and watched is how much this book is about love...I have only read this once, but I almost want to say that "love", true love, is the primary focus and question of this book. How does it insist iteslf into our lives and how do we recognize and respond to it when it does? I will withhold my dissertation, but there is a lot of writing about "love" in here and Stoner's limited, but deep and profound, experiences with it, both professionally and relationally, will stick with me for a while. Literature, Grace, Finch and Katherine...Anyone would be lucky to experience that much love in their lives.
Thank you for your recommendation! This is a great academic novel. It's amazing how adult students were at that time and the kind of assignments and readings they were able to handle. Department politics changed little though :)
I read Stoner recently. Two thirds through I had to put it down for a bit. The wife was making me so mad and my heart hurt for Stoner. I eventually got back to it and finished. 4 stars for me. Not sure how you read it so fast, I thought it was a slower paced novel. lol
One of the best books I’ve read. It caught me off guard. I know it’s been praised but what classic isn’t? I cried a lot just because of the sheet power of the prose.
I’m here for the negative feedback lol. So I started this book not too long ago and it made me realise that being stoic was absolutely not the answer to life’s problems. I hated his relationship with his wife and the only time I felt thrilled was when he stood up for himself academically. This book was a test for my patience really 😅 2/5.
Delighted to be influencing so much of your reading 😂😂 I am amazed that you read it in one sitting though - great effort! If you’re looking for another awesome book everone should read - Soldier Sailor by Vlaire Kilroy needs to be on your TBR 😜
You’re on a role Gemma! Amazingly, it didn’t feel like an effort…I started, blinked, and I had 50 pages left. Totally consumed. Love it when that happens. I don’t have time to read the women’s prize longlist this year but I’m aiming to do the whole shortlist, I’d put good money on soldier sailer making the shortlist, so I’m gonna hold fire until announcement. But it’s definitely in my TBR. Are you planning on watching the new shogun tv show? (If you have the time).
Many people don't like the female characters. They were not likeable but that's the point. That doesnt mean the author is a misogynist😢 Middle-class women in the past did not have that much freedom to be an interesting person. You can see in this novel how women's mind were constrained within a narrow circle, which trapped them into chronic depression. Stoner has a job he loves but her wife doesn't.
Hi Roro, I’ve watched a couple of your videos and it’s scary how similar your book taste is to mine! I l o v e d Stoner, I took it with me on a trip to Tokyo and read it in one sitting on the way back home. Butcher’s Crossing is on my TBR and I have high hopes for it.
I'm half way through, although I really identify with him and enjoy reading about him I really struggle with the figure of his wife Edith. Not a one evening read for me.
I’m late to the party, but I just finished Stoner. I loved the writing & I always enjoy an academic setting. And I really liked Stoner himself. However, what I didn’t like was his treatment of the female characters - wife, daughter, lover. We only saw one side of each of them. This is no doubt a stylistic choice that I don’t understand. But it didn’t work for me and lessened my overall enjoyment of the book.
I DNF’d Stoner about 90% through. It’s well-written and brilliant, absolutely, but Stoner’s character defeatism just killed me. I struggle with passive characters who let the world walk all over them, with little agency or desire to make their situations better. Maybe it’s my own lack of empathy, or that I know too many passive people in real life who I just want to help and can’t, but it’s my biggest beef with a lot of millennial contemporary fiction as well. The depressed and “it is what it is” wallowing that just sort of ends without resolving anything. I’m glad everyone else loves Stoner, but I just want to sock him in the eye.
I read this book last year after hearing all the rapturous praise, and while I didn't dislike anything about the book (except for the way the wife was written), I definitely lack the component required to hyperbolize about it, or call it a masterpiece. Loads of people seem to have that component though.
I have been thinking about this novel ever since I watched this podcast a few days ago. I read "Stoner" last summer because I, too, heard great things about it. I thought it was an undeniably incisive, sensitive work, and I was very moved by it. It has resonance; it stayed with me. There is no question that "Stoner" is an intelligent, perceptive, elegant piece of writing. In its way, yes, it may very well be "a perfect novel," a masterpiece" And yet.....the caveat of "in its way" does gnaw at me. While never less than absorbed by it, I did feel, that though it never failed to hold my interest, still, there there was something rather arid, one might say, even oppressively over -deterministic in its sensibility. By the time the book began dealing with Stoner's adult daughter, I had the uncomfortable sense that the author was pressing down on me, was too insistent on imposing his believable, but narrow, limited vision of life on the reader. I began feeling that, good as it was, the novel didn't breathe. It didn't open up into a fuller, less tidy view; it lacked a degree of imagination, a hint of risk, a glimpse of larger, unresolved, (and, perhaps, even less bleak, melancholic) possibilities. Within its narrow range, it was just about flawless, but while I was aware of all the fine observations, I also found myself wondering what would have happened if Williams had taken an occasional leap beyond that narrow range. There was something a bit stunted, a little tamped-down in the tone here. It may be a difference in temperament between myself and the author, but I couldn't help thinking at times, "Life is not all grey tones." No matter the incident, that greyness seemed nearly all-pervasive, and there were passages in which I felt it was artificially imposed on the narrative. In formal terms, "Stoner" is a beautiful book, but there is an inherent lack of excitement in this kind of "perfect novel," an absence of surprise in this type of "masterpiece" that precludes exhilaration. And yet, yes, it made me think; I was consistently invested in it; I cried. And I did recommend it to everyone.
Well, I absolutely loved reading this comment. Thanks so much for sharing your thoughts! I agree with everything you said…my one add-on would be mood. As I found myself enjoying its restrictions and grip on form, on my first read I was in the mood for something focused and controlled…it’s what I really loved about it. I’m currently on my second read through and have found myself feeling / pondering exactly what you’ve mentioned. If this novel was 200 pages longer whats risks could John Williams have taken. How could he have shifted our expectation of the form he created. Thanks so much for sharing!
@@rororeads Thanks for responding to my comment! I watch your videos faithfully and love hearing your commentary. Your enthusiasm for reading is inspiring!
I haven’t done this book on audio, so I’m afraid I’m unable to recommend one. If listening in English I would say go with an American narrator as it would feel more authentic.
I somehow managed a degree over 50 yrs ago, was worth it in the sense that it opened me up to a wide range of literature… otherwise, yeh time somewhat wasted.
Watched Shogun (Richard Chamberlain) TV mini-series as a child, read the book in my early forties. Good entertainment. Sex and violence. Have not read Stoner yet. I read lots of books on Internet Archive. Uncommonly listen to audio books; the narrator has to be "perfect," or I ain't listening.
I pretty thoroughly hated this. What you call his "stoic principles of endurance and acceptance" I would call masochism. My sympathy of or even tolerance for him bottomed out by the midway point and I couldn't finish it though I did skim the rest which only confirmed for me that I was right to do so. But of course one of my own favorite novels is Hawkes' The Blood Oranges which many seem to detest so that might indicate I was probably not going to be the most receptive audience for this.
I wouldn't balme you for delaying reading this for so long, because the blurb reads just hell boring😂😂 Read other Williams' works! They are as good as Stoner, if not better 😊 Border Crossing has changed my life in some way.
I finished it recently, and...yeah, I struggled to get through it. [SPOILERS AHEAD] My main issue was with Stoner's passivity, particularly with respect to his relationship with his wife and his daughter. I see his resilience but also the way he allows others to sort of dominate him. Others take advantage of him, push him around, literally throw him out of his own study, and he repeatedly fails to stand up for himself or his life, even when his daughter's emotional and physical health is at stake. I agree the work is masterfully written, but I came away from the book feeling it was more tragedy than anything, and I was so disenchanted with the main character's lack of spine (IMO) that I lost hope in him and thus my interest in the story waned the more I read. The ending left me wanting so much more.
I kind of left thinking that was the beauty of it all. Stoner is a person that we all know, in a way the person we fear becoming, someone who kind of lets life happen to him without much resistance to assert himself against it. He kind of gets pulled along and trampled by life and the people in it, but I think the stunning moment is how it wraps up the tragedy in a beautiful way where he's able to find his peace in the work he's left behind in spite of it all. The ending surprised me and moved me immensely for some reason.
Thanks for this you inspired me to read it. I read it. I get it. I'm rereading it.
A perfect novel. One of, if not the, best books I’ve ever read.
My favorite book so far this year. Adored every page.
This one has been on my radar for awhile. I ordered it right away as soon as I saw your video pop up, before I even watched. 😊
I stayed up far too late finishing Stoner last night. It took about 100 pages to get me hooked, but once I was hooked I wasn’t stopping until I finished. It was such an emotional story for such straightforward writing. I think it’s a book that I will appreciate more and more as time goes on and one that will stay with me for a long time. Loved it!
Well, I've had this book on my shelves for a long time now and I can see I'm going to have to dust it off sometime this year.
I can’t seem to find a copy with the same cover as yours, Roro. As it did with you, the story left a huge impression and I’ve always wanted a copy with that cover. Often think about his red bound book… 😢
Read Butcher’s Crossing last year and Stoner has been kicking around since then. I am going to start it today, cause Butcher’s Crossing was special.
I am also finishing up Wellness based on your review and loving that as well. As someone who works in Higher Education I wish I read some of these books when I was younger. Would have helped me recognize some patterns a bit earlier. Thanks for the channel. Really enjoying tracking some of the reads.
P.S. You single handedly got me to read The Whale, and I think your enthusiasm really helped push me through some of the more negative reviews. So, hyperbole is effective and you’ve used it well so far.
I’ve just ordered butchers crossing. Couldn’t resist. Thanks for watching. I’m glad you found some good reads from watching :)
Butcher’s Crossing is great!
@@rororeads Just finished it and you weren't joking, I don't think anyone who recommends this book is joking. One aspect that I do not see commented on enough, or maybe at all from the reviews I've read and watched is how much this book is about love...I have only read this once, but I almost want to say that "love", true love, is the primary focus and question of this book. How does it insist iteslf into our lives and how do we recognize and respond to it when it does? I will withhold my dissertation, but there is a lot of writing about "love" in here and Stoner's limited, but deep and profound, experiences with it, both professionally and relationally, will stick with me for a while. Literature, Grace, Finch and Katherine...Anyone would be lucky to experience that much love in their lives.
I absolutely agree with your hyperbole. Masterpiece.
Just finished. Brilliant novel! Have you read anything else by John Williams?
Thank you for your recommendation! This is a great academic novel. It's amazing how adult students were at that time and the kind of assignments and readings they were able to handle. Department politics changed little though :)
I read Stoner recently. Two thirds through I had to put it down for a bit. The wife was making me so mad and my heart hurt for Stoner. I eventually got back to it and finished. 4 stars for me. Not sure how you read it so fast, I thought it was a slower paced novel. lol
I listened to Stoner on audio and yes it is a masterpiece.
One of the best books I’ve read. It caught me off guard. I know it’s been praised but what classic isn’t? I cried a lot just because of the sheet power of the prose.
The thumbnail says it all 😂 the hype is so real ive yet to read it im also waffling letting it sit on my shelf waiting for its right time
I’m here for the negative feedback lol. So I started this book not too long ago and it made me realise that being stoic was absolutely not the answer to life’s problems. I hated his relationship with his wife and the only time I felt thrilled was when he stood up for himself academically.
This book was a test for my patience really 😅 2/5.
Delighted to be influencing so much of your reading 😂😂 I am amazed that you read it in one sitting though - great effort!
If you’re looking for another awesome book everone should read - Soldier Sailor by Vlaire Kilroy needs to be on your TBR 😜
You’re on a role Gemma! Amazingly, it didn’t feel like an effort…I started, blinked, and I had 50 pages left. Totally consumed. Love it when that happens. I don’t have time to read the women’s prize longlist this year but I’m aiming to do the whole shortlist, I’d put good money on soldier sailer making the shortlist, so I’m gonna hold fire until announcement. But it’s definitely in my TBR. Are you planning on watching the new shogun tv show? (If you have the time).
@@rororeads If it doesn’t make the shortlist I am going to be very, very salty 😂
I am planning on watching it - haven’t yet gotten to it though 🫣
Many people don't like the female characters. They were not likeable but that's the point. That doesnt mean the author is a misogynist😢 Middle-class women in the past did not have that much freedom to be an interesting person. You can see in this novel how women's mind were constrained within a narrow circle, which trapped them into chronic depression. Stoner has a job he loves but her wife doesn't.
I agree, but I find it hard to read, still.
Hi Roro, I’ve watched a couple of your videos and it’s scary how similar your book taste is to mine! I l o v e d Stoner, I took it with me on a trip to Tokyo and read it in one sitting on the way back home. Butcher’s Crossing is on my TBR and I have high hopes for it.
Butcher’s Crossing is great! Haven’t read Stoner, but will…
I'm half way through, although I really identify with him and enjoy reading about him I really struggle with the figure of his wife Edith. Not a one evening read for me.
I’m late to the party, but I just finished Stoner. I loved the writing & I always enjoy an academic setting. And I really liked Stoner himself. However, what I didn’t like was his treatment of the female characters - wife, daughter, lover. We only saw one side of each of them. This is no doubt a stylistic choice that I don’t understand. But it didn’t work for me and lessened my overall enjoyment of the book.
I DNF’d Stoner about 90% through. It’s well-written and brilliant, absolutely, but Stoner’s character defeatism just killed me. I struggle with passive characters who let the world walk all over them, with little agency or desire to make their situations better. Maybe it’s my own lack of empathy, or that I know too many passive people in real life who I just want to help and can’t, but it’s my biggest beef with a lot of millennial contemporary fiction as well. The depressed and “it is what it is” wallowing that just sort of ends without resolving anything. I’m glad everyone else loves Stoner, but I just want to sock him in the eye.
Same.
I read this book last year after hearing all the rapturous praise, and while I didn't dislike anything about the book (except for the way the wife was written), I definitely lack the component required to hyperbolize about it, or call it a masterpiece. Loads of people seem to have that component though.
I read it twice Arabic & English four years ago until now I Don't forget the story
I have been thinking about this novel ever since I watched this podcast a few days ago. I read "Stoner" last summer because I, too, heard great things about it. I thought it was an undeniably incisive, sensitive work, and I was very moved by it. It has resonance; it stayed with me. There is no question that "Stoner" is an intelligent, perceptive, elegant piece of writing. In its way, yes, it may very well be "a perfect novel," a masterpiece" And yet.....the caveat of "in its way" does gnaw at me. While never less than absorbed by it, I did feel, that though it never failed to hold my interest, still, there there was something rather arid, one might say, even oppressively over -deterministic in its sensibility. By the time the book began dealing with Stoner's adult daughter, I had the uncomfortable sense that the author was pressing down on me, was too insistent on imposing his believable, but narrow, limited vision of life on the reader. I began feeling that, good as it was, the novel didn't breathe. It didn't open up into a fuller, less tidy view; it lacked a degree of imagination, a hint of risk, a glimpse of larger, unresolved, (and, perhaps, even less bleak, melancholic) possibilities. Within its narrow range, it was just about flawless, but while I was aware of all the fine observations, I also found myself wondering what would have happened if Williams had taken an occasional leap beyond that narrow range. There was something a bit stunted, a little tamped-down in the tone here. It may be a difference in temperament between myself and the author, but I couldn't help thinking at times, "Life is not all grey tones." No matter the incident, that greyness seemed nearly all-pervasive, and there were passages in which I felt it was artificially imposed on the narrative. In formal terms, "Stoner" is a beautiful book, but there is an inherent lack of excitement in this kind of "perfect novel," an absence of surprise in this type of "masterpiece" that precludes exhilaration. And yet, yes, it made me think; I was consistently invested in it; I cried. And I did recommend it to everyone.
Well, I absolutely loved reading this comment. Thanks so much for sharing your thoughts! I agree with everything you said…my one add-on would be mood. As I found myself enjoying its restrictions and grip on form, on my first read I was in the mood for something focused and controlled…it’s what I really loved about it. I’m currently on my second read through and have found myself feeling / pondering exactly what you’ve mentioned. If this novel was 200 pages longer whats risks could John Williams have taken. How could he have shifted our expectation of the form he created. Thanks so much for sharing!
@@rororeads Thanks for responding to my comment! I watch your videos faithfully and love hearing your commentary. Your enthusiasm for reading is inspiring!
It's a weird book. It's not particularly interesting in itself but it keeps you hooked all the way
Also in my top five. ❤
Have you ever read The kindly ones by Jonathan Littel?
@@AnnNovella ooo! I’ve got this on my shelf. Found it in a charity but never read. Worth a go?
@@rororeads oh yes! The best villain ever! It’s in my top 10 of all times.
Can you recommend a narrator for the audible version?
I haven’t done this book on audio, so I’m afraid I’m unable to recommend one. If listening in English I would say go with an American narrator as it would feel more authentic.
I somehow managed a degree over 50 yrs ago, was worth it in the sense that it opened me up to a wide range of literature… otherwise, yeh time somewhat wasted.
Watched Shogun (Richard Chamberlain) TV mini-series as a child, read the book in my early forties. Good entertainment. Sex and violence. Have not read Stoner yet. I read lots of books on Internet Archive. Uncommonly listen to audio books; the narrator has to be "perfect," or I ain't listening.
Stoner is the best.
And Roro couldn’t stop 🛑!
I pretty thoroughly hated this. What you call his "stoic principles of endurance and acceptance" I would call masochism. My sympathy of or even tolerance for him bottomed out by the midway point and I couldn't finish it though I did skim the rest which only confirmed for me that I was right to do so. But of course one of my own favorite novels is Hawkes' The Blood Oranges which many seem to detest so that might indicate I was probably not going to be the most receptive audience for this.
Appreciate your thoughts. I’ll check out the blood oranges
I absolutely didn't love Stoner, understand me, i,m telling it's bad, but i didn't not enjoy my read
I wouldn't balme you for delaying reading this for so long, because the blurb reads just hell boring😂😂 Read other Williams' works! They are as good as Stoner, if not better 😊 Border Crossing has changed my life in some way.
You mean Butchers Crossing. Right?