If anyone may wonder why Patton picked Louisiana of all places for his monologue ("shoveling shit in Louisiana") it's because of where he gave that particular speech. He was addressing new enlistees at a bootcamp in Louisiana, specifically Fort Polk, which is notoriously hot, humid, and swampy. I grew up about a hundred miles north of there. Anyway, I suppose if he'd been giving the speech in Texas, he might have said "shoveling shit in Texas." Just a neat little factoid.
When Tom said tell us about the battle of Crete I knew we were off on a meander. 15 mins in we have barely touched Monty or Patton. Meanders and rabbit holes happen quite a lot in these podcasts, arguably part of their charm, but sometimes you have to be patient. Superb overall.
As an American it’s wild to me that they’re acting like Eisenhower, Patton, Bradley, and MacArthur aren’t extraordinary famous historical figures from ww2
I agree with Otto, Kevin Klein’s character in A Fish Called Wanda: If it wasn’t for us Americans the UK would be the smallest new province in the German Empire.
Patton is one of my favorite movies of all time. George C. Scott was magnificent! And Patton was an excellent tank commander. Omar Bradley was also an excellent general. He ended up as a 5 star general, the highest in the US Army (there were only a handful ever). You guys should study up on those US generals in Europe and the US admirals in the Pacific.
I believe war memorials should honor the troops, not the generals. The blood was spilled by those young people, not by old men. BTW-my father and 5 of his brothers served in the American and Canadian armies during the war. My attitude reflects their stories told to me as a youth.
The boys did a three-part series on BBC Sounds. I knew nothing at the beginning and learned he was unique.... completely different than any beginner to the subject would expect. Well worth the education and I'm no fan of bloody wars.
@@charlesfrith No doubt Nelson was a hero ... just wondered if this was some kind of nautical pun ... ie. Nelson heroic sinker of enemy ships ... Titanic a huge ship that sank.
@@fraserct533 No punning. if it is, I do that by accident, if at all. As for Titanic. Surely you mean the Olympic insurance switcheroo, just like 9/11... almost a trope
Auchinleck left a huge and well trained and supplied army for Monty, old 10 to 1. Monty is an appalling example to use to make the case for a leader vs men and materiel. He never won a campaign he did not overwhelming outnumber, outgun and outsupply his opponents and actually lost some!
Was disappointed considering the title how little was said about Patton (An Interesting character even aside from military abilities. Olympic contestant in modern pentathlon, belief in reincarnation and having previously been officer in Napoleonic and Roman battles) I had heard that Wellington on being asked about best officer said the duke of Marlborough.
Slim is regarded as the greatest British General of the last century, so I would love to know how he ( Slim ) and Patton would of got on together . I think that Patton would of appreciated Skim .
I agree with a lot of this, but I think Patton was wounded in WWI. This podcast started out with the usual sainthood for Montgomery and Patton was irrelevant and Eisenhower was no warrior; the US troops were useful cannon fodder. The UK soldiers were good but it was lions led by the incompetent for all their leadership training and experience, they were in danger of being ground down by a swarm of just awful leadership. That fixation with the Celtic hero warrior leading from the front and heroically being the first over hill 451 went out with the roman legions. Rommel didn't learn this. Generals like Montgomery and Patton have to have narcissistic tendencies to sleep at night. One author said Patton and Montgomery understood that troops do rally around their commanders, so Patton had his pistols and Montgomery had his jacket and corduroy pants as that contrast made them stand out. They BOTH lost battles and both were nearly fired. However the British loss of Singapore was unforgivable but the commander was NOT demoted after the war. Further, a lot of British podcasts have a lot of good info notwithstanding that UK archeologists can't help themselves declaring that without the Anglo Saxons the world would be irreversibly uncivilized.
I love listening to Stephen Kotkin. I guess some might feel that his public speaking in history isn't as "narrative driven" as this podcast would like.
No no no no. The Romans were not always destined to conquer Gaul. Take a quick look at the map of the Roman Empire and you will see it stretches around the Mediterranean. It almost never extends deep inland, besides Gaul only Dacia and Mesopotamia, both temporary adventures. Caesar's campaign in Gaul was exceptional, and something that would have not happened without Caesar the man, both wildly ambitious and wildly capable.
Talking about ceasar Alexander etc , they were all born with an advantage, the only one who stands out, and stands out head and shoulders is Napoleon, you can't give the same to ghengis khan because of his sheer barbarity,but for sheer genius not just as a general but as a statesman who virtually had the world against him the man towers above others
The pontificating about Russia and Ukraine toward the end has not aged well, to say the least. In fact the blindness to the reality of the conflict generally on TRIH is not a good look for historians, embarrassing really. Perhaps stick to history rather than commentary on current events, or at the very least interview someone like Jeffrey Sachs or John Mearsheimer to get a more balanced view.
Jeffrey Sachs is responsible for the free market shock therapy mess in post-Soviet Europe that contributed to the rise of the Russian oligarchs and the discontent that helped Putin to consolidate his power. He should sit somewhere in a dark basement and pray for forgiveness rather than opine on the war in Ukraine.
If anyone may wonder why Patton picked Louisiana of all places for his monologue ("shoveling shit in Louisiana") it's because of where he gave that particular speech. He was addressing new enlistees at a bootcamp in Louisiana, specifically Fort Polk, which is notoriously hot, humid, and swampy. I grew up about a hundred miles north of there. Anyway, I suppose if he'd been giving the speech in Texas, he might have said "shoveling shit in Texas." Just a neat little factoid.
When I saw the thumbnail I thought the title was Monty Python vs. the Nazis.
Now there's a musical box-office smash
That's what I thought 🤣
That's what I thought 🤣
That's what I thought 🤣
Yep, me too
When Tom said tell us about the battle of Crete I knew we were off on a meander. 15 mins in we have barely touched Monty or Patton. Meanders and rabbit holes happen quite a lot in these podcasts, arguably part of their charm, but sometimes you have to be patient. Superb overall.
For one moment I thought we'd get a 50 minute sketch about Mr Hilter, but this is actually even funnier!
Yes, until I put my glasses on, I too thought it was an episode about Monty Python versus the Nazis!
Get Al Murray on again!
Yes please! Your dynamic together is smashing.
As an American it’s wild to me that they’re acting like Eisenhower, Patton, Bradley, and MacArthur aren’t extraordinary famous historical figures from ww2
As an American I can say it is hard to find another American who knows when WWII takes place - more have heard of Patton than know anything about WWII
I agree with Otto, Kevin Klein’s character in A Fish Called Wanda: If it wasn’t for us Americans the UK would be the smallest new province in the German Empire.
@@mirrage42 1. You are deluding yourself; 2. Britain was supporting Europe because Hitler wasn't about to invade GB after the Battle of Britain.
Bradley perhaps but no I’ve never heard of the rest of them haha
@@j0nnyismnot even ike?? 😢😢 surprising
Patton is one of my favorite movies of all time. George C. Scott was magnificent! And Patton was an excellent tank commander. Omar Bradley was also an excellent general. He ended up as a 5 star general, the highest in the US Army (there were only a handful ever). You guys should study up on those US generals in Europe and the US admirals in the Pacific.
My grandfather shovelled shit in Oregon during the World War Two. I imagine that it probably beat the hell out of being shot at...
beautiful stuff
I have a feeling his beetroot field is a personal rather cherished memory
My father was a Royal Marine captured on Crete at the end of May 1941. In the area of Suda Bay I think.
I believe war memorials should honor the troops, not the generals. The blood was spilled by those young people, not by old men.
BTW-my father and 5 of his brothers served in the American and Canadian armies during the war. My attitude reflects their stories told to me as a youth.
I love ideas that make sense. Count me in
US General James Gavin gets my vote but its difficult if not impossible to compare generals, who operated at different levels .
Did you really say Nelson was a Titanic figure?
The boys did a three-part series on BBC Sounds. I knew nothing at the beginning and learned he was unique.... completely different than any beginner to the subject would expect. Well worth the education and I'm no fan of bloody wars.
@@charlesfrith No doubt Nelson was a hero ... just wondered if this was some kind of nautical pun ... ie. Nelson heroic sinker of enemy ships ... Titanic a huge ship that sank.
@@fraserct533 No punning. if it is, I do that by accident, if at all. As for Titanic. Surely you mean the Olympic insurance switcheroo, just like 9/11... almost a trope
Auchinleck left a huge and well trained and supplied army for Monty, old 10 to 1. Monty is an appalling example to use to make the case for a leader vs men and materiel. He never won a campaign he did not overwhelming outnumber, outgun and outsupply his opponents and actually lost some!
Monty as inspiration for Milligan and Sellers the original Goon. Monty Python vs. the Nazis.
Was disappointed considering the title how little was said about Patton
(An Interesting character even aside from military abilities. Olympic contestant in modern pentathlon, belief in reincarnation and having previously been officer in Napoleonic and Roman battles)
I had heard that Wellington on being asked about best officer said the duke of Marlborough.
Slim is regarded as the greatest British General of the last century, so I would love to know how he ( Slim ) and Patton would of got on together . I think that Patton would of appreciated Skim .
Well, I can tell you something about Gen. Omar Bradley: My dad fought under his command in Italy.
I agree with a lot of this, but I think Patton was wounded in WWI. This podcast started out with the usual sainthood for Montgomery and Patton was irrelevant and Eisenhower was no warrior; the US troops were useful cannon fodder. The UK soldiers were good but it was lions led by the incompetent for all their leadership training and experience, they were in danger of being ground down by a swarm of just awful leadership.
That fixation with the Celtic hero warrior leading from the front and heroically being the first over hill 451 went out with the roman legions. Rommel didn't learn this. Generals like Montgomery and Patton have to have narcissistic tendencies to sleep at night. One author said Patton and Montgomery understood that troops do rally around their commanders, so Patton had his pistols and Montgomery had his jacket and corduroy pants as that contrast made them stand out.
They BOTH lost battles and both were nearly fired. However the British loss of Singapore was unforgivable but the commander was NOT demoted after the war. Further, a lot of British podcasts have a lot of good info notwithstanding that UK archeologists can't help themselves declaring that without the Anglo Saxons the world would be irreversibly uncivilized.
Please get on Stephen Kotkin
Assuming that’s the one who believes he’s hilarious. All he provides is distractions from what I came for-history 😵💫
I love listening to Stephen Kotkin. I guess some might feel that his public speaking in history isn't as "narrative driven" as this podcast would like.
No no no no. The Romans were not always destined to conquer Gaul. Take a quick look at the map of the Roman Empire and you will see it stretches around the Mediterranean. It almost never extends deep inland, besides Gaul only Dacia and Mesopotamia, both temporary adventures. Caesar's campaign in Gaul was exceptional, and something that would have not happened without Caesar the man, both wildly ambitious and wildly capable.
There are films of Patton speaking.
Talking about ceasar Alexander etc , they were all born with an advantage, the only one who stands out, and stands out head and shoulders is Napoleon, you can't give the same to ghengis khan because of his sheer barbarity,but for sheer genius not just as a general but as a statesman who virtually had the world against him the man towers above others
😳🤯🥺🧐🥴🤯😭😱 How can you just jump from Trafalgar to ww2. Waterloo!!! My ancestors!!
Did anyone else first read this as Monty Python vs. the Nazis? 😂
No
it is a merit-based system, installed at all levels.
Yea i read that as monty python as well. Didnt bother with it for a bit
😊
Much of the discussion of the Indian Army was just historically inaccurate.
The pontificating about Russia and Ukraine toward the end has not aged well, to say the least. In fact the blindness to the reality of the conflict generally on TRIH is not a good look for historians, embarrassing really. Perhaps stick to history rather than commentary on current events, or at the very least interview someone like Jeffrey Sachs or John Mearsheimer to get a more balanced view.
Jeffrey Sachs is responsible for the free market shock therapy mess in post-Soviet Europe that contributed to the rise of the Russian oligarchs and the discontent that helped Putin to consolidate his power. He should sit somewhere in a dark basement and pray for forgiveness rather than opine on the war in Ukraine.