When I trained to teach history, the person who trained me stressed the importance of treating historical figures, no matter their reputation, as nothing more than human beings. They're not heroes above criticism, nor are they villains who are objects to be slain.
You explained it so well. Just because some people made history doesn't automatically make them perfect or godlike. They are still the same species as pedestrians walking on the street every day.
I actually just saw a situation like this in a Joy Division comment section on TH-cam. I love this band and they did nothing wrong, but they were being put on a pedestal by their fans. They would rub in people's faces how better the past was, college students with first jobs were seen as lesser than Ian Curtis, the bandmates' talents were described in a way that made other musicians seem insignificant. It made me sad to see Ian Curtis, a struggling young musician, being treated like a god. It's like giving a cancer patient a pat on the back for just suffering. I simply see him as a human that inspired me to write my own poetry. Nothing more, nothing less. Same goes for the rest of the band getting me into post-punk. It was bizarre seeing them being thrown into sensationalism when they were actually against that.
What if he didn't want the baby? He should have the right to say no. That's what women get to do. I'm just standing for "men's rights"! I don't actually think that. Men AND women should own responsibility for their decisions. It just somehow doesn't work that way.
@@allforugod only the woman is risking her life, to give birth. these are very high stakes, while for the man there are no stakes at all. he can just wander away any time he wants. he gets no say whatsoever.
Um... no. There are good human beings. Despite his drawbacks, MLK is a great man worthy of being known about and whose legacy deserves recognition. The issue is deifying people. And with European culture, who is considered great is hella terrifying, because there are MANY white people who fought for civil rights and sought to end colonization and imperialism. But that's not who is considered great. John Brown should be on every person's lips, but the same people who dismiss and reason away mass unaliving by the likes of Columbus and the U.S. Founding Fathers cannot stand him because... well let's just say he wasn't as discriminating in *WHO* he was mass unaliving
With regards to dangers of deifying. A warmongering religeous leader that married a 9 year old girl was not mentioned, but a peaceful charity worker that overzealously converted a few people was. Bias?
Bill Burr was right. Nerds held him in such high regard but was he really that great? He was also part of the deal between Disney and Universal to underpay animators so they had no competitive pay and no choice but to accept worse working conditions or be fired that lead to the 2008 strike in Hollywood
@@VisualEnjoyer9756 You don't get that powerful without backdoor behavior. Everything is so corrupt these days, the heroes are the ones who figure out how to navigate the corruption to come out looking clean, full of great ideas and good works.
@@Jenifer_R_ sorry 🙏 but I would rather not say. Because although this happened a few years ago now . I am still traumatized by the whole experience 😔 !.
Churchill would know. He thought Indians were subhuman and brutalized them. He also purposefully starved and killed millions of them. Our heroes from the past are going to be problematic to most of us in this new world but as adults we should be able to praise their heroic side but with our eyes wide open.
I’m a history major. I did a research paper about Alexander Graham Bell, who also believed in eugenics. He was friends with Helen Keller, and advocated for all Deaf people to not learn ASL, and not marry a fellow Deaf person. The kicker? AGB was married to a Deaf woman and his mother was Deaf as well.
@@SirsasthNigam. He taught them to speak using pictures and hand placements over the face and throat and how to read lips. Essentially, I think he was wrong to prevent sign language from growing.
Lipreading is especially stressful for the deaf. Nowadays, there are schools that offer sign language. I'm taking sign language classes in college right now. I recently bought a book about Hellen Keller, but was genuinely shocked when she did this before I even had a chance to read it. Yeah, that just sours my taste in historical idols I've ever known. And how does Graham Bell spell hypocrite?
John Maynard Keynes was an advocate of Eugenics too. As were the Catholic and Anglican communions in Canada in the 1950's who murdered children. He was part of the Bloomsbury set who could be fairly described as a bunch of deviants anyway but Hitler was a fan of his ideas so we maybe shouldn't be too surprised.
PT Barnum used to keep all of his show animals in a big warehouse, each animal in a cage. The warehouse caught fire one year, and all animals perished, likely burned alive 😢😢😢
I heard he died alone, and his maid and chauffeur found his body, both black people. ... and he was a cross dresser ..he liked to dress in womans cloths.
Helen Keller was very clear that she wishes that they hadn't done what they did and that they would have just let her die because her life was so hard even after she learned to communicate. Her support was because she was in fact suicidal but could not actually harm herself. She didn't want to truly be alive because she wasn't truly living because she was so severely disabled. She was not talking about people who were just deaf or just blind or have just one foot that has something wrong with it. She also wasn't talking about people who can fully recover. She was talking about those who are truly suffering and since she herself was truly suffering, she would know better than us who are not suffering. She advocated for Mercy.
I worked at several tech companies in the early 90's, and nobody - I mean NOBODY - had a good word for Steve Jobs. He was universally viewed as an arrogant jackass. His ugly treatment of his daughter didn't surprise me at all when I heard about it. I'd have been surprised if he hadn't behaved that way.
He's free...there was no evidence....they wanted him to die behind bars...it didn't happen...He's at home with his family.....DJT is a felon & is still able to run for POTUS...that's beyond me....anywho....When is he going to pay the woman for what he did?
Living in the PNW we are taught about it because it's an integral part of our Asian community. It is sad the rest of the nation does not learn it as we do.
It is sad that this happened nonetheless, but thanks to war, anything could have happened. The Japanese killed a lot of American POWs after the bombing of Pearl Harbor, which roared negative sentiment on Japanese communities. After president Roosevelt issued Executive Order 9066, General DeWitt (who was head of defense in the west coast) took the racist approach of beginning to put Japanese-American civillians in internment camps (which we know 99% of them were innocent). We cannot repeat this approach here in the US ever again, we have to learn from our mistakes.
The Japanese killed a lot of American POWs after the bombing of Pearl Harbor, which roared negative sentiment on Japanese communities. After president Roosevelt issued Executive Order 9066, General DeWitt (who was head of defense in the west coast) took the racist approach of beginning to put Japanese-American civillians in internment camps (which we know 99% of them were innocent).
Right? Imagine saying bad things about a country or people you are at war with whom also sneak attacked you? I'm sure the Japanese were saying honorable and positive things about the Americans, right?
Andrew Jackson's actions are especially egregious when one discovers (as that Supreme Court case demonstrated) that the Cherokee had converted en masse to Christianity, developed a written language and composed a constitution to present to Congress because they were going to apply for admission to the national union as a state. Just think of how our history might have been different if the U.S. would have admitted them.
It's not conversion when it's forced. They were killing people who weren't converting but then again white Christians kill people who don't convert which is why they are so f****** popular because they kill their enemies. Even if their enemies don't want to kill them.
I'm a retired U.S. History Professor and focused on Women's history and Cultural histor. Remarkable how little University students know about their OWN HISTORY.😵😵 PATHETIC ACTUALLY!!👎🏼👎🏼👎🏼👎🏼👎🏼
@@RenataKleinRKThe teachers fine get as much say over curriculum as you think. Administrators, school boards, state and federal agencies and politicians are all in the mix.
My Great Uncle was a Japanese POW. When he returned from War, he wouldn’t speak of the things; around ladies, that they had done to him over there. (Unspeakable, cruel, torturous things.) But he did tell my Grandfather,(his brother), and some of us found out. He HATED the Japanese and honestly, I can empathize. Who among us; during that era, had we been one of their POW’s, wouldn’t have some strong feelings?! Maybe Dr. Seuss had his reasons 🤷🏼♀️….
I said almost the same thing. Americans were so traumatized by the actions of the Japanese in the war, and they couldn’t separate the people from the soldiers. His feelings were one of many, and had nothing to do with the fact that he was famous
The fact that Hellen Keller, of all people, would advocate for eugenics! Something I'm sure her cohorts in said thought would have no problem doing to her if she were not famous.
Keller wasn't famous as a baby or child - that was in adulthood and after her achievements. I'd say that she only advocated for it because she appreciated as to how extremely fortunate she was to have a loving , supportive family who were also wealthy - which therefore provided her with the future she eventually lived. Circumstances that wouldn't have occurred otherwise for others..
@@Tracymmo Sanger started a whole organization just to annihilate an entire portion of the American population. She was more evil than can be imagined!
What she MIGHT have meant was that nobody should have to go through the same darkness as she was forced to endure. Not everyone is accepting of handicapped people and when people don't understand or refuse to accept it, they ostracize and villainize them. It's socially as difficult as it is physically.
And intentionally re-used syringes, contributing to the spread of the HIV in India despite knowing that even where single-use needles canulas etc. are unavailable, auto-claving of reusable equipment had become the standard of practice world-wide by the 1980s. She apparently insisted on re-use without autoclaving. So well funded were her activities, that single use equipment and autoclaving would have been easily obtainable for her hospices. Absent that isolation of HIV patients from other patients along with establishment of different sets of equipment used on the two different groups might have limited spread. She didn't do that either. As it was medical instruments were used indiscriminately after being washed with dish soap. The only conclusions that can be drawn are that 1) she drew no particular distinction between diseases effecting patients and had a pessimistic view of possible outcomes, to the extent that she saw her role as essentially managing the process of death or 2) that her amount of medical knowledge was both limited and she had failed to keep up with improvements in medicine, utilising clinical practices which had fallen behind by decades. In either instance it seems like almost anyone with a more pro-active view of care and up-to-date medical qualifications would likely have avoided the same degree of errors. Her preference for women who were (and are) primarily characterisable by the intensity of their faith in the order she founded, despite many of them lacking so much as a complete secondary education, let alone any relevant further education was also a problem. They were nuns, not nurses. Some were from the social class which sent their daughters to university, but many had an education equivalent to the average for Indian society at the time, not more than seven or eight years of formal schooling. Would you want someone with a primary school education providing your medical care ? She herself did complete high school, but her further education consisted of a few months of training at a convent in Ireland to become an *educational* missionary, during which getting up to speed in speaking English must have been a major focus. The number of people in India who can speak Albanian or Macedonian is vanishingly small, after all. Her many televised interviews provide an indication of how successful that was. Her spoken English remained heavily accented, halting and elementary over fifty years later and she resorted to the assistance of an interpreter during interviews throughout her life.
Yup, and when she got ill got the best treatments available including enough pain killers to numb a horse, the woman took double standards to an entire new level.
@@TeddyB-hf3ks That's EXACTLY why she committed suicide. Heartbreak and betrayal all at once all the while she had cancer, and her one person she thought she could rely on betrays him? Yeah, that would drive someone to suicide, buddy. And the fact that you're laughing at the fact makes you pretty gross, by the way.
6:30 "Behind every musician, there's a human being with failures and faults" - a great quote from WatchMojo, which is why I'm better off not meeting my heroes or any historical figure. They did something admirable, but they're humans after all.
*It's not a surprise!* Take an ordinary person that becomes famous (whatever route) and they are treated like a god, they can have anything, no one tells them no...whether it's right or wrong, they get the best of the best... *Yes, that person will become a horrible human being,* add the narcissism that comes with fame...they will NEVER acknowledge it or think they have any kind of faults.
I'm surprised anyone believes it. The same agents who claimed this nonsense were the ones sending him letter telling him to end it. COINTELPRO was a horrorshow.
He treated Priscilla poorly, and married her when she was awfully young, and he had a temper that I'm glad I wasn't around, but I've never heard anything shocking about him.
@@cathyv3424 I used to hate the Beatles myself, most certainly because they’re just talked about so much. But nowadays, I actually appreciate their music (though “Maxwell’s Silver Hammer”still sucks!)
Lol, when they mentioned Rudyard Kipling, my brain literally went "Huh? Was he known for anything ELSE than coloniali... Oh right; "Jungle Book"' Also I'm pretty sure Dr. Seus ended up changing his mind later in life. However it's generally a good idea to NEVER put historical figures on a pedestal, since they were all subject to specific times with specific concerns about specific (perceived) problems and specific ways of thinking, common blind spots, and lacking (or mis-)information. All of which makes it way too easy to judge them in hindsight with the benefit of current insights and knowledge they didn't have. For example, it's way too common to brush Hitler's doctrines off as the ideas of a psychopatic maniac, because no one (especially right after the war) wishes to remember how incredibly prevalent those ideas were all over Europe AND North America. In fact, we are already starting to forget the biggest lesson we learned from WO2: How INCREDIBLY dangerous nationalism is when it becomes the birthground, feeding ground, and excuse for the scarier looking isms. Namely racism, fascism, nazism, communism, AND "ethnic cleansing". Which were/are all the results of decades of conscious efforts to destruct the languages and cultural identities of countless minorities in the name of the 19th century Nationalism hype. Commonly under the motto "One country, one people, one language" (See all those "speak Murican!" 'Karens' online? Yes, that's how it starts. That, and book burnings). Seriously, Look up 'Vergonha' for a good example ((France's systematic campaign of shaming and punishing the over 50% of French inhabitants who didn't speak French around the mid 19th century, in order to root out most of the +/- 50 other historic French languages (Breton, Occitan, Basque, etc.), to then (and still) declare French the most beautiful language in the world.)). If you want to control people and make them die for you on the warfront, you need to control and foster their national identity first. Oh, and Churchill didn't just wreak havoc in India, he also (together with president Eisenhower) destroyed democracy in Iran in 1953 in order to get their hands on cheap oil for the post-war restoration. And as we all know, Iran ended up descending into religious dictatorial theocracy that Iranians (and international politics) are still suffering from today. (Wikipedia: 1953 Iranian coup d'état for more) However Cromwell is a super random appearance on this list (both editing-wise and content-wise) since if we go that far back in history, most countries have had at LEAST one leader, dictator or invader who at some point went on a religion-excused political killing spree. From Genghis Khan, Vlad III and the 3rd Duke of Alba, to Videla, Pol Pot, Franco en Mussolini. Why on earth list Cromwell and not the countless other murderous 'big men' even worse than him? Don't technically ALL dictators in history fall under "Influential people"? Sorry, rant over.
The facts about Hoover, I only heard of them in movies before, but it is technically logical about his actions, even before the Red Scare and beginning of the Cold War. As for President Wilson, his promotion of segregation was not the only apparent unethical movement of his. I learned in high school history that he technically kept the U.S. out of World War I out of unethical means. And about Cromwell, he technically was a type of military dictator in some accounts, due to his censoring of theater and other activities in England itself. And he was also a Puritan, which helps put his actions in context if people know the events of the Salem Witch Trials.
When I had my kid I was vulnerable, very young and very stupid. I did crazy pranks for Peta, sometimes ruining peoples fur coats. I heckled people eating meat. When I got pregnant I was surrounded by a home birth, naturopathic, looney tunes community and refused to vaccinate my kid. I was obnoxious to people who suggested that was a bad thing. I judged those people. Thats right, I was an anti-vaxer. In time, as I got a little older and wiser I realized the stupidity in what I had believed was true. I did research and got my kid vaccinated. Anyway, all of this is to say, had I died at 21 I would’ve been remembered as that terrible person. I sometimes wonder if some of these people had enough time and education- would they be able to make changes? I would hate for my whole identity to be based off my ill informed actions as a young adult. (I’m a nurse now. I make it a point to reach out to people who think the way I used to think in the hopes that with a little compassion and a little education, they, too can see the light.)
That’s a really good and thought-provoking thought. I almost laughed when they mentioned Dr. Seuss as having anti-Japanese sentiments, I said in my head, “Yeah, him and the rest of America”. That’s the information they had. Had they been given a different perspective, I’d like to think they would change their minds
My sperm donor (Who was there in our lives but an abusive,alcoholic,drug-addicted POS who didn’t lift a finger to help my mother) denied my brother and I were his to try and get out of paying child support but when my mom finally took us and left him for good tried to say we were his and he had a right as our father to see us.
That's why I like the interviews the American Academy of Television (?) does because they start with a few biographical basics then do an extensive interview about someone's work. I don't care who they married or if they are alcoholics. I want to know about their careers as actors, directors, etc.
Odd though that in the US it is still legal in over 20 States to marry a minor age 12 with parental consent and in a few States it is low as 10 years with parental and judicial consent...
No No No No No he did not Mary her at 14 that’s a lie he waited till she was old enough and married at 21 Then they did all that!!! It’s good to look at the facts!!!
@Mind-podcast it’s a lie he wasn’t he waited till she was 21. He wasn’t that bad I’m not gonna listen to people who cherry pick stuff it inconveniences me too much!!!
Kind of hard hearing about Helen Keller's views about Euthanasia 😢 I had a Cousin who was almost completely nonverbal & retarded. My Aunt & a group of others helped found the Northwest Center in WA. & helped to establish the "Education for all" bill. Wow, Joe Kennedy had a lobotomy performed on his own daughter, Rose😢
I’m a historian by profession and I don’t buy the “oh, but it was a different time” thing. There are many complex (and honestly, frequently tedious) arguments about why people did this or that and the choices they could’ve picked, and from a (relatively) liberal modern stand point you can argue it was immoral or barbaric or whatever. But to horribly (horribly!) simplify it, people have acted the same way throughout history. There’s a billion sources across cultures and continents that show both the best and the worst of humanity. We fight each other, we’re pacifists, we’re racists and we’re accepting. It happens everywhere all the time. That’s the human condition. For example: my grandparents were witness to the atrocities of WW2, there parents witnessed the atrocities of WW1, before that slavery, before that the subjugation of the American proletariat, before that the genocide of native Americans, before that and before that and before that the crusades and on and on and so forth. We always focus on the major violent things because, frankly, the history of people just hanging out and getting by is tedious. That being said…don’t be chatting at me about all this back in day shit. Nothing changes, it’s just new forms of cruelty to each other.
read the book, "The British mad dog, Debunking the Myth of Winston Churchill" by M. S. King. to learn the truth of Winston. He was more horrible than you can imagine.
Never meet your heroes, unless your heroes are Geddy Lee and Alex Lifeson from Rush. I've met them twice and got to speak to both of them at length, and can attest to how nice they are.
It does excuse Dr. Seuss's sentiments. The whole western hemisphere felt the same way. The Japanese had bombed Pearl Harbor and were trying to take over the South Pacific.
The fact that Martin Luther King may have seen an SA take place and simply laughed at it is absolutely disgusting. So many of these incidents are just disgusting but people choose to look over them like with JFK and his infidelity
@lilshawano1014 exactly. I mean, the Japanese were our enemies and killing Americans on American soil and all. Surprised watch MOJO didn't go after him, or any other celebrity at the time, for mocking Hitler.
But it contributed to the suffering of Japanese migrants and Japanese-American people within the US. Just because he was ordered doesn't excuse the suffering it contributed to.
We should do the same( and at my hs we did..taught by a nun no less) about Vietnam. If we ignore or gloss over the hard lessons of our history what do we learn? I am eternally grateful to that wonderful brave teacher for doing what she knew was right❤
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This is why I can’t understand people idolising celebrities. No one is perfect, and you’ll be disappointed.
When I trained to teach history, the person who trained me stressed the importance of treating historical figures, no matter their reputation, as nothing more than human beings. They're not heroes above criticism, nor are they villains who are objects to be slain.
You explained it so well. Just because some people made history doesn't automatically make them perfect or godlike. They are still the same species as pedestrians walking on the street every day.
I actually just saw a situation like this in a Joy Division comment section on TH-cam. I love this band and they did nothing wrong, but they were being put on a pedestal by their fans. They would rub in people's faces how better the past was, college students with first jobs were seen as lesser than Ian Curtis, the bandmates' talents were described in a way that made other musicians seem insignificant. It made me sad to see Ian Curtis, a struggling young musician, being treated like a god. It's like giving a cancer patient a pat on the back for just suffering. I simply see him as a human that inspired me to write my own poetry. Nothing more, nothing less. Same goes for the rest of the band getting me into post-punk. It was bizarre seeing them being thrown into sensationalism when they were actually against that.
True. Present the facts and let the student form their own opinions. That's actually the way all schooling should be, but I digress.
True
Any man who denies the mother of their child money when they need it and you have it is a disgrace
@PrincessDie187 And yet, he is looked upon as a god by many.
Absolutely
weird/bizarre/strange Steve Jobs named one of his computers "The LISA."
What if he didn't want the baby? He should have the right to say no. That's what women get to do. I'm just standing for "men's rights"!
I don't actually think that. Men AND women should own responsibility for their decisions. It just somehow doesn't work that way.
@@allforugod only the woman is risking her life, to give birth. these are very high stakes, while for the man there are no stakes at all. he can just wander away any time he wants. he gets no say whatsoever.
This is the precise reason why we shouldn’t name streets, schools, hospitals, ect after human beings. Every single one of us is fallible.
Um... no. There are good human beings. Despite his drawbacks, MLK is a great man worthy of being known about and whose legacy deserves recognition. The issue is deifying people. And with European culture, who is considered great is hella terrifying, because there are MANY white people who fought for civil rights and sought to end colonization and imperialism. But that's not who is considered great. John Brown should be on every person's lips, but the same people who dismiss and reason away mass unaliving by the likes of Columbus and the U.S. Founding Fathers cannot stand him because... well let's just say he wasn't as discriminating in *WHO* he was mass unaliving
So what should we name them? Numbers, Binary?
I Love that one.
Could be fun.
@@XaraK1Laughing at sexual abuse and not helping the victim is much more than a "drawback"
With regards to dangers of deifying. A warmongering religeous leader that married a 9 year old girl was not mentioned, but a peaceful charity worker that overzealously converted a few people was. Bias?
We can't automatically believe someone who speaks ill of the dead. They waited until the person wasn't here to defend themselves, and that's not fair.
Steve Jobs wasn't kind to his employees either. He forced them to talk about work and nothing else even during breaks and lunchtime.
Bill Burr was right. Nerds held him in such high regard but was he really that great? He was also part of the deal between Disney and Universal to underpay animators so they had no competitive pay and no choice but to accept worse working conditions or be fired that lead to the 2008 strike in Hollywood
@@VisualEnjoyer9756 You don't get that powerful without backdoor behavior. Everything is so corrupt these days, the heroes are the ones who figure out how to navigate the corruption to come out looking clean, full of great ideas and good works.
That's why you don't idolize no human being.
Any
@@mszoomy Hi, honey. That irked me too. I hate to sound like the grammar police, but come on !!
Never meet your heroes in real life, because you might be very disappointed. I did and I was 😢 !...
@@alancrisp1582 Come on, who was it?
@@Jenifer_R_ sorry 🙏 but I would rather not say. Because although this happened a few years ago now . I am still traumatized by the whole experience 😔 !.
Sometimes Mojo pisses me off, but I've got to admit that it's pretty fearless in criticizing the rich and powerful.
That is because its sells.
I'm surprised Walt Disney didn't make the list.
They might just be avoiding a law suit.
@@Kat19760 Excatly.
They're not gonna mess with the Disney machine
J. Edgar Hoover could have his own video about all the bad and shady things he did and was behind, although it would be about 3 hours long!!
"Great and good are seldom the same man"
- Winston S. Churchill
Yes one of the biggest cowards ever lived all world leaders are cowards send people in the battle then hide
Churchill would know. He thought Indians were subhuman and brutalized them. He also purposefully starved and killed millions of them. Our heroes from the past are going to be problematic to most of us in this new world but as adults we should be able to praise their heroic side but with our eyes wide open.
One thing Churchill & Woodrow Wilson had in common? They were really racist, and displayed racist beliefs. Yikes!
Churchill and Roosevelt were huge alcoholics, unlike that unmentionable enemy leader who never drank alcohol and championed animal welfare.
Yeah well were you the p.m that kept a country together against fascists?NO so do one...
That's why I don't look up to these celebrities and influencers sometimes you got to be your own hero.
Nobody’s perfect, except Keanu Reeves 😂
Haven't heard a bad word against Robin Williams or Michael J Fox, either.
so was mr rogers
Roger Staubach too
Yes Keanu Reeves is a great guy.😄
Constantine wants a word.
The word “complicated” should never replace the word “evil.”
Except for when referring to gender re-assignment surgery, right?
@@Paul-nn9ojSeek help.
@@Paul-nn9oj,
How is that a bad thing, though? That's just a person becoming transgender.
@@Paul-nn9oj,
How is that a bad thing, though?
I’m a history major. I did a research paper about Alexander Graham Bell, who also believed in eugenics. He was friends with Helen Keller, and advocated for all Deaf people to not learn ASL, and not marry a fellow Deaf person.
The kicker? AGB was married to a Deaf woman and his mother was Deaf as well.
Not to mention, He stole the idea which made him famous.
i dunno how he communicated with them
@@SirsasthNigam. He taught them to speak using pictures and hand placements over the face and throat and how to read lips. Essentially, I think he was wrong to prevent sign language from growing.
Lipreading is especially stressful for the deaf. Nowadays, there are schools that offer sign language. I'm taking sign language classes in college right now. I recently bought a book about Hellen Keller, but was genuinely shocked when she did this before I even had a chance to read it. Yeah, that just sours my taste in historical idols I've ever known. And how does Graham Bell spell hypocrite?
John Maynard Keynes was an advocate of Eugenics too. As were the Catholic and Anglican communions in Canada in the 1950's who murdered children. He was part of the Bloomsbury set who could be fairly described as a bunch of deviants anyway but Hitler was a fan of his ideas so we maybe shouldn't be too surprised.
PT Barnum used to keep all of his show animals in a big warehouse, each animal in a cage. The warehouse caught fire one year, and all animals perished, likely burned alive 😢😢😢
I just realized that I have never seen Dr Seuss before and had been picturing a who like person whenever he was mentioned 😅
I would have been more shocked by the discovery that there was something redemptive about J. Edgar Hoover's life.
🤔 You and me both !..
Good fashion!
JEH was a horrible, horrible person.
I heard he died alone, and his maid and chauffeur found his body, both black people. ... and he was a cross dresser ..he liked to dress in womans cloths.
@@Alpha67Wolf Nowdays that would be considered his redeeming quality, and his transgressions would be hidden so as not to tarnish the trans community.
Helen Keller was very clear that she wishes that they hadn't done what they did and that they would have just let her die because her life was so hard even after she learned to communicate. Her support was because she was in fact suicidal but could not actually harm herself. She didn't want to truly be alive because she wasn't truly living because she was so severely disabled. She was not talking about people who were just deaf or just blind or have just one foot that has something wrong with it. She also wasn't talking about people who can fully recover. She was talking about those who are truly suffering and since she herself was truly suffering, she would know better than us who are not suffering. She advocated for Mercy.
I worked at several tech companies in the early 90's, and nobody - I mean NOBODY - had a good word for Steve Jobs. He was universally viewed as an arrogant jackass. His ugly treatment of his daughter didn't surprise me at all when I heard about it. I'd have been surprised if he hadn't behaved that way.
Have people forgotten how incredibly influential and popular Bill Cosby was before we found out what a horrible person he is?
He's free...there was no evidence....they wanted him to die behind bars...it didn't happen...He's at home with his family.....DJT is a felon & is still able to run for POTUS...that's beyond me....anywho....When is he going to pay the woman for what he did?
Yes..I remember him on Captain Kangaroo back in the day...
@@caronstout354Really?! If only Mister Moose had something heavier than ping pong balls drop on him.
I was just thinking about the questionable things Cosby's done
No one's perfect and no one's a saint.
No one said anyone is.
@@TeddyB-hf3ksSome people would beg to differ.
@@kevinmurker8980 For all have sinned and fallen short of the glory of God
maybe we should consider the fact that anyone, ANYONE, whose goal is to be universally-known, rich, famous, etc, should be questioned. period..
Ahhh, yes. They’re flawed and you’re flawed, so all the same? Except they did something great with their lives, unlike, well, you?
They are at the very least all narcissists 🥰
facts!! any person that look for glory, power, fame, money is problematic
@paul-nn9og no not really.! Some are some aren’t!
What about Franklin D. Roosevelt having Japanese-Americans on the West Coast put into internment camps in the aftermath of Pearl Harbor.
and the fact that i - and many others- had to learn about it as as adult via an interview with George Takei instead of history class in school
Living in the PNW we are taught about it because it's an integral part of our Asian community. It is sad the rest of the nation does not learn it as we do.
It is sad that this happened nonetheless, but thanks to war, anything could have happened. The Japanese killed a lot of American POWs after the bombing of Pearl Harbor, which roared negative sentiment on Japanese communities. After president Roosevelt issued Executive Order 9066, General DeWitt (who was head of defense in the west coast) took the racist approach of beginning to put Japanese-American civillians in internment camps (which we know 99% of them were innocent).
We cannot repeat this approach here in the US ever again, we have to learn from our mistakes.
It is sad that this happened nonetheless, but thanks to war, anything could have happened.
The Japanese killed a lot of American POWs after the bombing of Pearl Harbor, which roared negative sentiment on Japanese communities. After president Roosevelt issued Executive Order 9066, General DeWitt (who was head of defense in the west coast) took the racist approach of beginning to put Japanese-American civillians in internment camps (which we know 99% of them were innocent).
John Lennon was a selfish parent. I have no respect for him
Just remember that not all influential people are bad. There is still good in the world. I see it everyday.
I don’t think anyone has to be sorry about making anti-axis propaganda during WW2.
Right? Imagine saying bad things about a country or people you are at war with whom also sneak attacked you? I'm sure the Japanese were saying honorable and positive things about the Americans, right?
Andrew Jackson's actions are especially egregious when one discovers (as that Supreme Court case demonstrated) that the Cherokee had converted en masse to Christianity, developed a written language and composed a constitution to present to Congress because they were going to apply for admission to the national union as a state. Just think of how our history might have been different if the U.S. would have admitted them.
It's not conversion when it's forced. They were killing people who weren't converting but then again white Christians kill people who don't convert which is why they are so f****** popular because they kill their enemies. Even if their enemies don't want to kill them.
Jobs was a real piece of work personally and in private.
Louis (Orphan) With Rina Sawayama & Thomas Doherty
So, in other words, the FBI has never changed. Yet they still exist 😒
Corrupt and dishonest ever since it was founded
I'm a retired U.S. History Professor and focused on Women's history and Cultural histor. Remarkable how little University students know about their OWN HISTORY.😵😵 PATHETIC ACTUALLY!!👎🏼👎🏼👎🏼👎🏼👎🏼
@@RenataKleinRKThe teachers fine get as much say over curriculum as you think. Administrators, school boards, state and federal agencies and politicians are all in the mix.
It seems most people aren't interested in history unless it's presented as a movie or other entertainment fashion.
Nobody gives a crap about Women's History.
Even art historians acknowledge that Mary Cassatt and Frida Kahlo were inferior artists.
@@shawnycoffman History in film is usually fiction.
They obtained power and lost their humility, if they even had any to begin with. Arrogance is what they all have in common. It’s sad really.
My Great Uncle was a Japanese POW. When he returned from War, he wouldn’t speak of the things; around ladies, that they had done to him over there. (Unspeakable, cruel, torturous things.) But he did tell my Grandfather,(his brother), and some of us found out. He HATED the Japanese and honestly, I can empathize. Who among us; during that era, had we been one of their POW’s, wouldn’t have some strong feelings?! Maybe Dr. Seuss had his reasons 🤷🏼♀️….
True, and the Chinese will never forget what the Japanese did to them, as they now go about Asia doing that same hated thing to others
I said almost the same thing. Americans were so traumatized by the actions of the Japanese in the war, and they couldn’t separate the people from the soldiers. His feelings were one of many, and had nothing to do with the fact that he was famous
The fact that Hellen Keller, of all people, would advocate for eugenics! Something I'm sure her cohorts in said thought would have no problem doing to her if she were not famous.
Charles Lindburgh also believed in eugenics...
A lot of people believed in it at the time, including Margaret Sanger.
Keller wasn't famous as a baby or child - that was in adulthood and after her achievements.
I'd say that she only advocated for it because she appreciated as to how extremely fortunate she was to have a loving , supportive family who were also wealthy - which therefore provided her with the future she eventually lived.
Circumstances that wouldn't have occurred otherwise for others..
@@Tracymmo Sanger started a whole organization just to annihilate an entire portion of the American population. She was more evil than can be imagined!
What she MIGHT have meant was that nobody should have to go through the same darkness as she was forced to endure. Not everyone is accepting of handicapped people and when people don't understand or refuse to accept it, they ostracize and villainize them. It's socially as difficult as it is physically.
The number of horrible things done by influential people is massively higher than 20.
Mother Teresa also denied many people pain meds stating that suffering was from the lord
She was an awful selfish narcissist person
And intentionally re-used syringes, contributing to the spread of the HIV in India despite knowing that even where single-use needles canulas etc. are unavailable, auto-claving of reusable equipment had become the standard of practice world-wide by the 1980s. She apparently insisted on re-use without autoclaving.
So well funded were her activities, that single use equipment and autoclaving would have been easily obtainable for her hospices. Absent that isolation of HIV patients from other patients along with establishment of different sets of equipment used on the two different groups might have limited spread. She didn't do that either. As it was medical instruments were used indiscriminately after being washed with dish soap.
The only conclusions that can be drawn are that
1) she drew no particular distinction between diseases effecting patients and had a pessimistic view of possible outcomes, to the extent that she saw her role as essentially managing the process of death or
2) that her amount of medical knowledge was both limited and she had failed to keep up with improvements in medicine, utilising clinical practices which had fallen behind by decades.
In either instance it seems like almost anyone with a more pro-active view of care and up-to-date medical qualifications would likely have avoided the same degree of errors.
Her preference for women who were (and are) primarily characterisable by the intensity of their faith in the order she founded, despite many of them lacking so much as a complete secondary education, let alone any relevant further education was also a problem. They were nuns, not nurses. Some were from the social class which sent their daughters to university, but many had an education equivalent to the average for Indian society at the time, not more than seven or eight years of formal schooling.
Would you want someone with a primary school education providing your medical care ?
She herself did complete high school, but her further education consisted of a few months of training at a convent in Ireland to become an *educational* missionary, during which getting up to speed in speaking English must have been a major focus. The number of people in India who can speak Albanian or Macedonian is vanishingly small, after all.
Her many televised interviews provide an indication of how successful that was. Her spoken English remained heavily accented, halting and elementary over fifty years later and she resorted to the assistance of an interpreter during interviews throughout her life.
The assumption to my theory, I can't believe this, here we have a mother who no one wants to sleep with
Yup, and when she got ill got the best treatments available including enough pain killers to numb a horse, the woman took double standards to an entire new level.
@@RenataKleinRK Yup and yet the Catholic church made her one anyway, smdh.
To add more in Dr. Seuss, he was also cheating on his wife-while she was battling cancer. She committed suicide due to his infidelity. 😢
And then he married his affair partner.
That's not why someone suicides. 😂😂😂😂
There was something more going on inside her head and/or body.
That's not why someone suicides. 😂😂😂😂😂
There was something more going on inside her head/body.
@@TeddyB-hf3ks That's EXACTLY why she committed suicide. Heartbreak and betrayal all at once all the while she had cancer, and her one person she thought she could rely on betrays him? Yeah, that would drive someone to suicide, buddy. And the fact that you're laughing at the fact makes you pretty gross, by the way.
@@TeddyB-hf3ks Maybe the affair wasn’t the sole reason, but it definitely was a factor.
I remember when Blueberry Hill, Chuck Berry's bar and grill in St. Louis, was caught with cameras in the women's bathrooms
6:30 "Behind every musician, there's a human being with failures and faults" - a great quote from WatchMojo, which is why I'm better off not meeting my heroes or any historical figure. They did something admirable, but they're humans after all.
*It's not a surprise!* Take an ordinary person that becomes famous (whatever route) and they are treated like a god, they can have anything, no one tells them no...whether it's right or wrong, they get the best of the best... *Yes, that person will become a horrible human being,* add the narcissism that comes with fame...they will NEVER acknowledge it or think they have any kind of faults.
8:50
For Hoover, it just should have said, 'Everything'
13:29 Dorothy Day deserves her sainthood far more than Mother Theresa does.
The one about MLK Jr surprised me the most
I remember hearing of MLK's transgressions when they first established his birthday as a holiday.
I'm surprised anyone believes it. The same agents who claimed this nonsense were the ones sending him letter telling him to end it. COINTELPRO was a horrorshow.
@@MT_Madmaninteresting 😢
The one about him supporting the pastor's misconduct was never proven to be true.
Surprised Elvis isn't here, but maybe for another list
He treated Priscilla poorly, and married her when she was awfully young, and he had a temper that I'm glad I wasn't around, but I've never heard anything shocking about him.
No No No No he didn’t marry Priscilla till she was 21 and that’s that!!
How come Jobs wasn't sued up the ass for child support payments and negligence.
That pronunciation of Roald Dahl... ouch.
The new game: give your kids names AI will never be able to pronounce properly.
the move "Judas and the black Messiah" shines a light on the repression of the Black Panther Party
I said the same thing!!
Jerry Lee Lewis? James Brown? Henry Ford? Harvey Weinstein?
I hope everyone has positive change for their negative actions.
And that’s why John Lennon is my least favorite Beatle
Miles Davis, Jerry Lee Lewis & Morrissey respect the work not the acts
I don’t like the Beatles lol
I don't care about his personal life tbh, I love his music, especially his work with the beatles
@@cathyv3424 I used to hate the Beatles myself, most certainly because they’re just talked about so much. But nowadays, I actually appreciate their music (though “Maxwell’s Silver Hammer”still sucks!)
His elder son decided not to have children due to his childhood. He also was considerably closer to Paul than his own father.
Lol, when they mentioned Rudyard Kipling, my brain literally went "Huh? Was he known for anything ELSE than coloniali... Oh right; "Jungle Book"'
Also I'm pretty sure Dr. Seus ended up changing his mind later in life. However it's generally a good idea to NEVER put historical figures on a pedestal, since they were all subject to specific times with specific concerns about specific (perceived) problems and specific ways of thinking, common blind spots, and lacking (or mis-)information. All of which makes it way too easy to judge them in hindsight with the benefit of current insights and knowledge they didn't have.
For example, it's way too common to brush Hitler's doctrines off as the ideas of a psychopatic maniac, because no one (especially right after the war) wishes to remember how incredibly prevalent those ideas were all over Europe AND North America. In fact, we are already starting to forget the biggest lesson we learned from WO2: How INCREDIBLY dangerous nationalism is when it becomes the birthground, feeding ground, and excuse for the scarier looking isms. Namely racism, fascism, nazism, communism, AND "ethnic cleansing". Which were/are all the results of decades of conscious efforts to destruct the languages and cultural identities of countless minorities in the name of the 19th century Nationalism hype. Commonly under the motto "One country, one people, one language" (See all those "speak Murican!" 'Karens' online? Yes, that's how it starts. That, and book burnings). Seriously, Look up 'Vergonha' for a good example ((France's systematic campaign of shaming and punishing the over 50% of French inhabitants who didn't speak French around the mid 19th century, in order to root out most of the +/- 50 other historic French languages (Breton, Occitan, Basque, etc.), to then (and still) declare French the most beautiful language in the world.)). If you want to control people and make them die for you on the warfront, you need to control and foster their national identity first.
Oh, and Churchill didn't just wreak havoc in India, he also (together with president Eisenhower) destroyed democracy in Iran in 1953 in order to get their hands on cheap oil for the post-war restoration. And as we all know, Iran ended up descending into religious dictatorial theocracy that Iranians (and international politics) are still suffering from today. (Wikipedia: 1953 Iranian coup d'état for more)
However Cromwell is a super random appearance on this list (both editing-wise and content-wise) since if we go that far back in history, most countries have had at LEAST one leader, dictator or invader who at some point went on a religion-excused political killing spree. From Genghis Khan, Vlad III and the 3rd Duke of Alba, to Videla, Pol Pot, Franco en Mussolini. Why on earth list Cromwell and not the countless other murderous 'big men' even worse than him? Don't technically ALL dictators in history fall under "Influential people"?
Sorry, rant over.
The facts about Hoover, I only heard of them in movies before, but it is technically logical about his actions, even before the Red Scare and beginning of the Cold War. As for President Wilson, his promotion of segregation was not the only apparent unethical movement of his. I learned in high school history that he technically kept the U.S. out of World War I out of unethical means. And about Cromwell, he technically was a type of military dictator in some accounts, due to his censoring of theater and other activities in England itself. And he was also a Puritan, which helps put his actions in context if people know the events of the Salem Witch Trials.
20:53 The man even screened DW Griffiths' _The Birth of a Nation_ in the White House. Another horrid man.
Oh just calm down and smell the coffee ☕ is it really that important ?..
@@alancrisp1582Yes, it is.
When I had my kid I was vulnerable, very young and very stupid. I did crazy pranks for Peta, sometimes ruining peoples fur coats. I heckled people eating meat. When I got pregnant I was surrounded by a home birth, naturopathic, looney tunes community and refused to vaccinate my kid. I was obnoxious to people who suggested that was a bad thing. I judged those people. Thats right, I was an anti-vaxer. In time, as I got a little older and wiser I realized the stupidity in what I had believed was true. I did research and got my kid vaccinated.
Anyway, all of this is to say, had I died at 21 I would’ve been remembered as that terrible person. I sometimes wonder if some of these people had enough time and education- would they be able to make changes? I would hate for my whole identity to be based off my ill informed actions as a young adult. (I’m a nurse now. I make it a point to reach out to people who think the way I used to think in the hopes that with a little compassion and a little education, they, too can see the light.)
That’s a really good and thought-provoking thought. I almost laughed when they mentioned Dr. Seuss as having anti-Japanese sentiments, I said in my head, “Yeah, him and the rest of America”. That’s the information they had. Had they been given a different perspective, I’d like to think they would change their minds
The only one that surprised me was Helen Keller. Disappointed and sad that she internalized ableism 😞
Man, showbusiness is filthy.
Not just show business.
politicians, activists, authors aren’t“show business” lol
It’s wild that racial coexistence is described as utopian…
Influential people aren't really influential they just waste their own time with nonsense
RIP To All The Innocent 🕊️🕊️🕊️🕊️
Even influential people were/are capable of being awful!
Helen Keller included!
You have the capacity to be awful too.
@@dhenderson1810 I know
Were? Meaning they passed away?
@@dhenderson1810 I don't deny that, but I hope I never will be!
22:19 WOW im amazed you pronounced drogheda correctly! I grew up there. One of the biggest towns in ireland
Simon Whistler keeps writers in his basement can believe you quote him I this !!😂
My sperm donor (Who was there in our lives but an abusive,alcoholic,drug-addicted POS who didn’t lift a finger to help my mother) denied my brother and I were his to try and get out of paying child support but when my mom finally took us and left him for good tried to say we were his and he had a right as our father to see us.
I’m so sorry you all had to go through that. Yes, your sperm donor makes the list !
@@evasilvalayton758 Thank you.
Wow! Very informative and shocking video!
Why would people support Jobs? I will NEVER buy Apple. He is a HORRIBLE person.
Always find it weird why people obsess over people's personal lives
That's why I like the interviews the American Academy of Television (?) does because they start with a few biographical basics then do an extensive interview about someone's work. I don't care who they married or if they are alcoholics. I want to know about their careers as actors, directors, etc.
The use of Simon whistler is always a win
My great aunt got married at 12 so Charlie Chaplain ain’t surprising. The past is the WORSED.
Yeah, just look at all these 50+ year old kings in the past, that married teens
@@kevindagame and a majority were at least 14 or up
Odd though that in the US it is still legal in over 20 States to marry a minor age 12 with parental consent and in a few States it is low as 10 years with parental and judicial consent...
@@MPM6785ChitChat,
Japan is also notorious for treating minors in a romantic fashion. Eesh! 😬
@@MPM6785ChitChat Yeah, it’s messed up
You don’t become famous and rich by being a good person.
Top comment
I wish. 🙃🫠🫠
Don't forget about Elvis . He married a 14 year old
I have been saying this for the longest even made a video about this they don't want to listen but you right
He married Priscilla when she was 18... But yeah, they started having a relationship when she was 14
@@marinadeburgos8666 Priscilla was born in 1945. They married in 1967. She was 22 then.
No No No No No he did not Mary her at 14 that’s a lie he waited till she was old enough and married at 21 Then they did all that!!! It’s good to look at the facts!!!
@Mind-podcast it’s a lie he wasn’t he waited till she was 21. He wasn’t that bad I’m not gonna listen to people who cherry pick stuff it inconveniences me too much!!!
I’m telling Simon you clipped him without recognition
Kind of hard hearing about Helen Keller's views about Euthanasia 😢 I had a Cousin who was almost completely nonverbal & retarded. My Aunt & a group of others helped found the Northwest Center in WA. & helped to establish the "Education for all" bill. Wow, Joe Kennedy had a lobotomy performed on his own daughter, Rose😢
Can you even blame Dr Seuss? I would hate the people killing my friends and fellow soldiers too.
It’s “Rolled” Dahl Never heard it pronounced “Ru-Olled”
No, it should be "roo-all". Norwegian name from Norwegian parents. After Roald Amundsen.
Sounds like Hitchcock was Weinstein Sr.
I’m a historian by profession and I don’t buy the “oh, but it was a different time” thing. There are many complex (and honestly, frequently tedious) arguments about why people did this or that and the choices they could’ve picked, and from a (relatively) liberal modern stand point you can argue it was immoral or barbaric or whatever. But to horribly (horribly!) simplify it, people have acted the same way throughout history. There’s a billion sources across cultures and continents that show both the best and the worst of humanity. We fight each other, we’re pacifists, we’re racists and we’re accepting. It happens everywhere all the time. That’s the human condition. For example: my grandparents were witness to the atrocities of WW2, there parents witnessed the atrocities of WW1, before that slavery, before that the subjugation of the American proletariat, before that the genocide of native Americans, before that and before that and before that the crusades and on and on and so forth. We always focus on the major violent things because, frankly, the history of people just hanging out and getting by is tedious. That being said…don’t be chatting at me about all this back in day shit. Nothing changes, it’s just new forms of cruelty to each other.
Yep the common person has had a terrible time throughout history & its mostly undocumented.
Most of these surprised me Number one didn't surprise me because I even remember studying in school about that.
Great video! Very interesting!
putting a morrissey song in this video is insane he could probably fit on the list
read the book, "The British mad dog, Debunking the Myth of Winston Churchill" by M. S. King. to learn the truth of Winston. He was more horrible than you can imagine.
The only one that surprised me was Hellen Keller. The nerve of that woman.
I knew Steve Jobs was a nasty selfish man but I didn't know that it went deeper.
Never meet your heroes, unless your heroes are Geddy Lee and Alex Lifeson from Rush. I've met them twice and got to speak to both of them at length, and can attest to how nice they are.
Not Steve Jobs bein a deadbeat dad 😫
Not even a crappy old computer from 'Dad'
It does excuse Dr. Seuss's sentiments. The whole western hemisphere felt the same way. The Japanese had bombed Pearl Harbor and were trying to take over the South Pacific.
I agree.
US school books are no longer allowed to refer to it as "The Trail of Tears". Now the Native Americans "went willingly".
Of course, because americans dont want people to know how awful they really are
Even the old terminology was awful. "Indian removal." It's right up there with "occupation."
That is so sick that they're saying that. OMG.
The fact that Martin Luther King may have seen an SA take place and simply laughed at it is absolutely disgusting. So many of these incidents are just disgusting but people choose to look over them like with JFK and his infidelity
What is it with Hollywood and kids?
Eric Clapton should have been on the List because of his Racist Rant
The Dr Suess one…yeah that kinda sorta definitely makes sense with that whole WW2 thing
He was just doing what he was ordered to do for the time. If continued after the military than yeah he would be bad then.
@lilshawano1014 exactly. I mean, the Japanese were our enemies and killing Americans on American soil and all. Surprised watch MOJO didn't go after him, or any other celebrity at the time, for mocking Hitler.
But it contributed to the suffering of Japanese migrants and Japanese-American people within the US. Just because he was ordered doesn't excuse the suffering it contributed to.
@@IceMaidenxx3 What? I don't think FDR and Governor Warren were interning American citizens because Geisel drew funny pictures.
Dr. Seuss's greatest sin was his ridiculous penchant for making up words just to complete a poetic rhyme.
wow! Didn't know about Helen Keller!
Albert Einstein dumped his wife for his first cousin.
Simon Whistler is everywhere!!!!
When it said "Influential people" I thought they were going to talk about influencers 😅
We all did, but instead they just meant people we already knew sucked
yeah. me too 😅
Same I thought the same thing
Me too. That's why I was hesitant to see the video at first! 😂
At least Steve Jobs daughter got named after the worst computer ever made
Interesting Video.
Some people are horrible and abusive them workers it sad and depressing money is evil they supposed to good and influence 😭
Steve jobs may have been goid at business but he was a horrible person
We should do the same( and at my hs we did..taught by a nun no less) about Vietnam. If we ignore or gloss over the hard lessons of our history what do we learn? I am eternally grateful to that wonderful brave teacher for doing what she knew was right❤
it saddens that some people want 'all Black schools' .. in my opinion, it's a step backward 😞
Well don’t get upset about it. Let people do whatever the fuck they want and mimd your own fucking business.
Yeah last Gens revolutionaries are this Gens reactionaries, its a cycle only a non-mediated understanding of history will prevent us repeating
@@RenataKleinRK I don't agree with that either
19:22 Fancy seeing Simon Whistler here!