Although the game isn’t cannon, they were only using it as an example since there was only 1 time GER showed up in the manga. World over heaven did almost the same thing as Joker’s ability and it over powered GER, since that was the closest thing to their powers directly interacting, they wanted to use it.
Yaldobaoth did the same thing as GER, which Satanael countered. I think Death Battle should have definitely talked about who Yaldobaoth and Satanael are, especially since they made it short and left out that Satanael is Arsene's evolved form, not just a random Persona.
@ they did say that Sataneal was the evolution of Arsene and they did talk about bit about the reality warping powers of Yaldobaoth. I think people just focused on the jojo game being mentioned. They could’ve talked about bit more about who the two were though.
I know the people who was betting on Joker was having a field day on this battle, I already knew Giorno would lose but he actually give out an decent fight against Joker but Gold Experience Reqium definitely wasn’t gonna be able to put Joker in a Death Loop
This isn't even the only thing that can do cus he was heavily nerfed He has a few personas that can not only nullify physical attacks but can also reflect them
@ReggieWolf Social link is an arsenal of a wild card But amother reason rtz cant affect Jokernis because of his archetype of being a Trickster and an aspect of rebellion against control or aurthority
So I wanted to make things a bit clearer for you on some points you might be confused about that death battle didn't go too in depth about. So Ren (Joker) is a wild card persona user, which as they said gives him access to every single persona in the franchise but one thing they didn't mention is, that because Joker is a wild card he has an ability called Unshakable Will which negates any sort of will manipulation which is why GER return to 0 wouldn't be able to affect Joker's willpower. They also briefly mentioned this with Maruki and Yaldabaoth but Joker has gone toe to toe and defeated many reality warpers that can do what GER does but better and on a much larger scale so that should gibe you an idea of the scope of how absurd a wild card user such as Joker can be.
@@ReggieWolf eyes of heaven is like dragon ball heroes to dragon ball z/super. It’s more like an alternative timeline then a part of the main timeline. But I imagine bc they take all instances like with goku v superman 3 they added it
@@ReggieWolf Well its not canon, it is written by Araki (its as YohanceRoss said, its like DB heroes - Either way they didn't need to pull the feat to make G.E.R. Fail as its causality manipulation, which in part 8 we see Causality Manipulation fail to stop attacks that go simply beyond it (though its a different ability and different stand, it uses the same type of manipulation of causality though instead of reverting, it causes calamity) (its actually mentioned in the corner) but didn't talk about it as it would be manga spoilers for an unadapted part.
"So if I perceive his gun can't do nothing to me, and can't do nothing to me" Yes, exactly. It's explained early on that the reason it works in the metaverse is because it looks insanely realistic, so the shadows assume it's real. Because of this, it fires bullets like a real gun. So, if you are aware it's a prop, in theory, it shouldn't work.
To clear it up even without Joker's social links recharging his will in canon a Persona user's will is unshakable they cannot be broken even a Persona user who hasn't even tapped into their powers yet or even knew about them unknowingly resisted a God trying to destroy their will so even Gold Experience Requiem's busted return to zero ability could not break Joker's will.
Yaldobaoth is a literal God and final boss who can rewrite concepts at will. Satanael is the Ultimate Persona evolution of Arsene, and Yaldobaoth's opposite. Yaldobaoth has all of Gold Experience Requiem's on steroids on Satanael countered it and took the power for himself for Joker to use in the game.
@@DR_REDACTED he is not a god damn god bruh, it is literally said in the game that he’s an entity born from the will of the masses, that BELIEVES he is a god, that doesn’t mean he is one. Takes one search to find out.
Well yes in most cases but in Joker has two different resistances against the return to zero ability (Said ability allows GER to return it's target to zero which would be causality manipulation the power to change the causes and effect of something), the first would be just him being a wild card user, Joker is unaffected by the predetermined fates that exist within the Megaten and stated in lore to have a unbreakble will making it impossible to turn to zero and his bonds with his social links he made thourghout the game and stat by Death Battle themselve, Yu (Persona 4 MC), was able to come back to life with the bonds of his social links or even the same with Makoto (Persona 3 MC), as he was able to seal away Nyx in his final battle with the help of his social links or he could go to the velvet room to save himself from the effects of return to zero as it exist outside normal spacetime and GER Range wouldn't be far enough to be able to reach the velvet room so there that as well There are more but I would be here forever explaining everything Joker has 21:04
I'd have a problem w/ them using Eyes of Heaven, but Araki (the managaka of JJBA) was the one who wrote it, so that's about as official of a counter to GER as we're ever gonna get. He also acted as a supervisor on the game. It's not canon, but given Araki's involvement, I don't mind it being used, as it's the only other source for GER knowledge beyond like 5 minutes in Part 5 and a stats page.
Social link is an arsenal of a wild card But amother reason rtz cant affect Jokernis because of his archetype of being a Trickster and an aspect of rebellion against control or aurthority
I figured Giorno couldnt lose.....then at 6:44 they mentioned breaks any defense and rewriting reality.....i knew it was over. That was gonna be the smoking gun *pun intended*. And he won by the power of friendship 😭
as you said, there's no reason why Joker's willpower wouldn't keep getting restored every time it got reset, but that would just mean he could act and fight normally, as it only paralyzes you if you're stuck at zero. And even then, they also mentioned how Joker's willpower actually can't be reset in the first place, so yes, the argument is correct. the episode also straight up says that Araki wrote Eyes of Heaven himself, there's no reason not to use the video game
4:50 it's the perception of humanity as a whole, so if you could get all of humanity to think prop guns don't look like the real deal, then yeah his gun would stop working. But if it's just you while fighting him, it wouldn't do much.
That's pure wank. Don't get me wrong he wins, but there's no reason to believe he's got passive resistance to reality warping when he's explicitly shown not to be immune to reality warping.
To add to that, it’s not mentioned but Giorno can only create life in a suitable environment, which isn’t a problem normally, but it’s shown that in extremely cold conditions, he can only create small bits of grass
By the way, the story boards confirm the the real world version of Giorno outside the metaverse had has cognitive shutdown negated by GER, meaning that both of them technically survived this battle.
I give this a 8/10 battle, it has a great analysis and the fight is full of creativity and understanding of the characters but the animation quality is only serviceable and the length of it is short, but I’m sure they’ll get back on their feet once they get used to being independent ALSO Jesus isn’t officially a Jojo but he IS in part 7
20:57 to answer that, if I’m correct on how Requiem works: Requiem can’t affect passive traits with Return to Zero, just actions. The social links that recharge Joker is a passive trait.
From what I hear, the creator of Jojo was heavily involved in a supervisor role. He green lit a lot, which would presumably include green lighting what World over Heaven achieved against Gold Experience Requiem. I suppose it all comes down to how people want to interpret it though. All art is subjective.
I never understood this about any reactor's ideaology of canon when reacting to Death Battle, because Death Battle, from my recollection, has always taken information from everything. i.e; books/comics, movies, tv shows, games, etc... I have never seen this change unless a specific series didn't have much information on certain characters.
I understand why giorno lost I just dont know how I feel about the analysis since the battle kinda contradicted it since Golden experience was doing really well in base and as you said wouldn’t revert to 0 still revert jokers willpower?
To anwser your question, yea Jesus actually plays a huge role in Part 7 and is heavily theorized if not outright confirmed to be a JoJo. Also Giorno is Part 5, Jolyne is Part 6. And yes you should watch it.
It wouldn't be fair. . Persona 3 mc is the strongest mc in the persona franchise. . He has the universe arcana. . Giorno would get negged including the Jojo verse with him. .
@ReggieWolf the black box in the top right corner when the game is on screen says that information i presume they did that because it didn't fit the flow of the video
Joker has defeated foes who can rewrite reality on a wider scale than GER or Epitaph, so assuming that he can’t overcome GER’s reality warping is just the “no limits” fallacy,
My pfp is Joker so you know I'm smoking that Giorno pack 🗣️
Big W for The Persona community
@@ReggieWolfYeah I wasn’t sure if almighty would have killed Giorno, but I am so happy Joker won.
Smoke it well my dude
Although the game isn’t cannon, they were only using it as an example since there was only 1 time GER showed up in the manga. World over heaven did almost the same thing as Joker’s ability and it over powered GER, since that was the closest thing to their powers directly interacting, they wanted to use it.
Yaldobaoth did the same thing as GER, which Satanael countered. I think Death Battle should have definitely talked about who Yaldobaoth and Satanael are, especially since they made it short and left out that Satanael is Arsene's evolved form, not just a random Persona.
@ they did say that Sataneal was the evolution of Arsene and they did talk about bit about the reality warping powers of Yaldobaoth. I think people just focused on the jojo game being mentioned. They could’ve talked about bit more about who the two were though.
I know the people who was betting on Joker was having a field day on this battle, I already knew Giorno would lose but he actually give out an decent fight against Joker but Gold Experience Reqium definitely wasn’t gonna be able to put Joker in a Death Loop
I knew things were dangerous with that all mighty bullet
This isn't even the only thing that can do cus he was heavily nerfed
He has a few personas that can not only nullify physical attacks but can also reflect them
@ReggieWolf Social link is an arsenal of a wild card
But amother reason rtz cant affect Jokernis because of his archetype of being a Trickster and an aspect of rebellion against control or aurthority
So I wanted to make things a bit clearer for you on some points you might be confused about that death battle didn't go too in depth about.
So Ren (Joker) is a wild card persona user, which as they said gives him access to every single persona in the franchise but one thing they didn't mention is, that because Joker is a wild card he has an ability called Unshakable Will which negates any sort of will manipulation which is why GER return to 0 wouldn't be able to affect Joker's willpower.
They also briefly mentioned this with Maruki and Yaldabaoth but Joker has gone toe to toe and defeated many reality warpers that can do what GER does but better and on a much larger scale so that should gibe you an idea of the scope of how absurd a wild card user such as Joker can be.
The mangaka himself made the story of eyes of heaven
So it's canon, then it's valid
@@ReggieWolf eyes of heaven is like dragon ball heroes to dragon ball z/super. It’s more like an alternative timeline then a part of the main timeline. But I imagine bc they take all instances like with goku v superman 3 they added it
@@ReggieWolfWell not exactly cannon, but the things that happen in it are accurate to what the characters are capable of in the cannon story.
@@ReggieWolf Well its not canon, it is written by Araki (its as YohanceRoss said, its like DB heroes - Either way they didn't need to pull the feat to make G.E.R. Fail as its causality manipulation, which in part 8 we see Causality Manipulation fail to stop attacks that go simply beyond it (though its a different ability and different stand, it uses the same type of manipulation of causality though instead of reverting, it causes calamity) (its actually mentioned in the corner) but didn't talk about it as it would be manga spoilers for an unadapted part.
"Maybe you didn't hear me before..... Checkmate !!"
"So if I perceive his gun can't do nothing to me, and can't do nothing to me"
Yes, exactly. It's explained early on that the reason it works in the metaverse is because it looks insanely realistic, so the shadows assume it's real. Because of this, it fires bullets like a real gun. So, if you are aware it's a prop, in theory, it shouldn't work.
But at the same time he has so many other ways to end you that we might as well believe it's real too 🤣
@@ReggieWolf Honestly, the gun might be the quickest and least painful way to go out.
To clear it up even without Joker's social links recharging his will in canon a Persona user's will is unshakable they cannot be broken even a Persona user who hasn't even tapped into their powers yet or even knew about them unknowingly resisted a God trying to destroy their will so even Gold Experience Requiem's busted return to zero ability could not break Joker's will.
Yaldobaoth is a literal God and final boss who can rewrite concepts at will. Satanael is the Ultimate Persona evolution of Arsene, and Yaldobaoth's opposite. Yaldobaoth has all of Gold Experience Requiem's on steroids on Satanael countered it and took the power for himself for Joker to use in the game.
Not just God but The God of Control.
not really, lets not jump our horses, Yaldabaoth is not a god, he is an entity who believe's he is a god due to the will of the masses.
@@critical_6164 He is a god born from the will of the masses.
@@DR_REDACTED he is not a god damn god bruh, it is literally said in the game that he’s an entity born from the will of the masses, that BELIEVES he is a god, that doesn’t mean he is one. Takes one search to find out.
@critical_6164 Ok bro. If that helps you sleep at night. Good bye now💀
Well yes in most cases but in Joker has two different resistances against the return to zero ability (Said ability allows GER to return it's target to zero which would be causality manipulation the power to change the causes and effect of something), the first would be just him being a wild card user, Joker is unaffected by the predetermined fates that exist within the Megaten and stated in lore to have a unbreakble will making it impossible to turn to zero and his bonds with his social links he made thourghout the game and stat by Death Battle themselve, Yu (Persona 4 MC), was able to come back to life with the bonds of his social links or even the same with Makoto (Persona 3 MC), as he was able to seal away Nyx in his final battle with the help of his social links or he could go to the velvet room to save himself from the effects of return to zero as it exist outside normal spacetime and GER Range wouldn't be far enough to be able to reach the velvet room so there that as well
There are more but I would be here forever explaining everything Joker has 21:04
I'd have a problem w/ them using Eyes of Heaven, but Araki (the managaka of JJBA) was the one who wrote it, so that's about as official of a counter to GER as we're ever gonna get. He also acted as a supervisor on the game. It's not canon, but given Araki's involvement, I don't mind it being used, as it's the only other source for GER knowledge beyond like 5 minutes in Part 5 and a stats page.
Not to mention that Joker has already faced opponents with similar abilities to Return to Zero and countered them.
Social link is an arsenal of a wild card
But amother reason rtz cant affect Jokernis because of his archetype of being a Trickster and an aspect of rebellion against control or aurthority
To truly understand, I'm gonna need to play persona, I see
I figured Giorno couldnt lose.....then at 6:44 they mentioned breaks any defense and rewriting reality.....i knew it was over. That was gonna be the smoking gun *pun intended*.
And he won by the power of friendship 😭
I kinda had the same thought
as you said, there's no reason why Joker's willpower wouldn't keep getting restored every time it got reset, but that would just mean he could act and fight normally, as it only paralyzes you if you're stuck at zero. And even then, they also mentioned how Joker's willpower actually can't be reset in the first place, so yes, the argument is correct.
the episode also straight up says that Araki wrote Eyes of Heaven himself, there's no reason not to use the video game
Technically the Araki bit isn't totally accurate. He didn't write Eyes of Heaven, but he _did_ oversee Eyes of Heaven's writing.
Giorno can’t make living objects in sub-zero temperatures, no living creature could survive it
4:49 as long as joker thinks it’s real it’s real.
Just like how one of the characters has a laser gun
4:50 it's the perception of humanity as a whole, so if you could get all of humanity to think prop guns don't look like the real deal, then yeah his gun would stop working. But if it's just you while fighting him, it wouldn't do much.
Joker is hella nerfed in this Death Battle. Being a Trickster himself, already make him immune to something like RtZ
That's pure wank. Don't get me wrong he wins, but there's no reason to believe he's got passive resistance to reality warping when he's explicitly shown not to be immune to reality warping.
They had to make things interesting somehow, you just can't equip Repel Phys Kaguya turn one, it gets boring
17:55 How does life sustain during an ice age? It would be insanely limited if Giorno tried.
To add to that, it’s not mentioned but Giorno can only create life in a suitable environment, which isn’t a problem normally, but it’s shown that in extremely cold conditions, he can only create small bits of grass
By the way, the story boards confirm the the real world version of Giorno outside the metaverse had has cognitive shutdown negated by GER, meaning that both of them technically survived this battle.
I hope more people find this out. It at least means the character is still alive irl. Probably as good as it's gonna get.
Joker had the grip on his hip with the almighty clip
🤣 that's a BAR
I give this a 8/10 battle, it has a great analysis and the fight is full of creativity and understanding of the characters but the animation quality is only serviceable and the length of it is short, but I’m sure they’ll get back on their feet once they get used to being independent
ALSO Jesus isn’t officially a Jojo but he IS in part 7
Animation quality is amazing youre tweaking. Unless you mean the beat down having like 2 choppy parts. The length does stop it from being a 10 tho.
20:57 to answer that, if I’m correct on how Requiem works: Requiem can’t affect passive traits with Return to Zero, just actions. The social links that recharge Joker is a passive trait.
From what I hear, the creator of Jojo was heavily involved in a supervisor role. He green lit a lot, which would presumably include green lighting what World over Heaven achieved against Gold Experience Requiem. I suppose it all comes down to how people want to interpret it though. All art is subjective.
The game unironically helps giorno more than harms him funnily enough, also yeah the author wrote it
I never understood this about any reactor's ideaology of canon when reacting to Death Battle, because Death Battle, from my recollection, has always taken information from everything. i.e; books/comics, movies, tv shows, games, etc... I have never seen this change unless a specific series didn't have much information on certain characters.
Even if Giorno Sets it back to Zero
The Social Links instantaneously recharge Joker.
Meaning if they kept at it the Battle would literally never end
Wait. Where'd my comment go? It was just here!
TH-cam mightve done something
@@ReggieWolf Anyway, Bill Cipher vs. Discord is also a great reality warping battle.
@@jaxcraft2848 Bet imma check it out!
In the world of persona if you didn’t know if you as a enemy see a gun as a real gun it will be a real gun with live bullets vise versa
The Arrow is Simply just a Treasure to Joker.
Once he's back in his own Universe it's just a trinket
even if not you gotta guess it'd be still more likely for it to work
I understand why giorno lost I just dont know how I feel about the analysis since the battle kinda contradicted it since Golden experience was doing really well in base and as you said wouldn’t revert to 0 still revert jokers willpower?
So that example wasn't the best one but here's a better one
It's due to his nature as a trickster that makes him immune to changes in his will
@@tposeinggojirainshoes4650
Joker has "Unshakable Will" as a Passive ability
To anwser your question, yea Jesus actually plays a huge role in Part 7 and is heavily theorized if not outright confirmed to be a JoJo.
Also Giorno is Part 5, Jolyne is Part 6. And yes you should watch it.
Feel like Persona 3 main character would’ve been a better choice? Life vs Life?
It wouldn't be fair. . Persona 3 mc is the strongest mc in the persona franchise. . He has the universe arcana. . Giorno would get negged including the Jojo verse with him. .
Maybe a better choice but an even bigger stomp
While it might be better, the most requested choice for Giorno is Joker. If you want a P3 fight, then Makoto Yuki vs. Neku from TWEWY js popular.
ice can never truly be alive since its like fire but instead of giving heat it gives cold which is the opposite of life
rechargiung constantly still gives you a charge
“Who can stop Giorno in JoJo’s”
Wonder of U
This mfer can warp reality and is the embodiment of logic
The only battles db get right are the ones that aren't close at all 💀
My money's on Eggman on the next battle
GER would've had to hit joker again to reset his willpower down to zero again.
21:59 the video game is written by the creator
Ok that's something I wish they would've stated
@ReggieWolf the black box in the top right corner when the game is on screen says that information i presume they did that because it didn't fit the flow of the video
First db used a non cannon game as a anti feat and requiem bypassed fate from diavlos epitaph where he was seen dying in,make it make sense
Joker has defeated foes who can rewrite reality on a wider scale than GER or Epitaph, so assuming that he can’t overcome GER’s reality warping is just the “no limits” fallacy,
Na Giorno won
You stopped right before the best part keep watching JoJos TRUST
I need to