I see a lot of criticism on Stockhausen and I think many people don't show the respect his work deserves. Something isn't bad just because you don't get it. You have to be really ignorant to... ignore!... the devotion he shows for his music. He doesn't strike me at all as a charlatan, as some people say. I'm not saying that he is "far away from the rest of the world, an enlightened genius" or whatever. He's delivering a message: his message as an artist and visionary. A quite original point of view. I like the way he behaves about his music, it seems very sincere.
@ Thomas Manana: Have you ever done deep research only to realise when you talk about it with people they think you're crazy? obviously not. I worked with stockhausen and he is far away from being mad. only most people can't follow him for the lack of capacity of focus
@@paologalliani4172 The essence of music and art is 'meaning.' His music means nothing. If culturally very few people can relate to his music, then it's of low cultural value. Art that's not for humans is no longer art. It's just graffiti for fun.
It's funny, in the experimental music scene today, there are literally about 50,000 people or more who now think like Stockhausen, but seldom have the aesthetic quality or feel of his music.
Robert Pearson : snobism is not always misleading, you know ;-) aesthetic feeling stems from recognition. But you cannot recognize what you never heard before. So it can take time to get the feeling. Believe me or not: you will find it here in this very piece!
Thank you for uploading this fascinating series of videos. I was one of the two pianists performing during these three lectures. The other was Jerzy Romaniuk. Would you be so kind as to credit the two of us in the description sections of your uploads, please? Thank you so much.
I listened to this piece quite some times. And it works each time! What Stockhausen says may seem foolish and snobishingly formal but you can hear it just describes exactly what happens! And where this comes to genius is when adding the ring modulator.
We´ll be enormously amazed -as we are just in the present- in the future by acknowledging the incredible amount of musical vision KS had. Thanks not only to his music (which he said can be understood in the same amount of time it took him to compose, and probably thinking almost on a daily basis). Many musical developments of today began thanks to him. Just think of the "raum musik", the space music. Or the formula composition. Or the electronik musik. Etc. So I believe in the far future he will be considered kinf of a myth..."Did it really existed a person who fasted for a week in order to compose?", the children of tomorrow will ask their moms...
Very well put. It's the same with Ligeti and Xenakis I guess that's because some post modernists, accustomed with his philosophy pairs, are interested in the more political and ideological aspects of culture today, they end up missing the point completely.
It is striking how he explains his ideas, the structural principle of his musical piece, in visual terms. Maybe it explains why his music is inaudible?
I find it interesting how mantra seems to go over so many heads in the the comments field, I taught my daughter these techniques and she has played with them for days with no need to intervene, she's off into her own mirror world of mantra with her toy instruments. I have used this technique for many years in my organ and synth work.
Well, sorry if I'm incorrectly assuming your child's age, but I find it hard to believe someone that isn't at least 16 can understand these processes, much less "play with them", this is nothing crazy or super genius, but it's pretty advanced non the less
Stockhausen represents a NEW WAY of thinking and making music´in 20th century. His virtuosic strict structuralism supports his free intuitive constructivism. He understood and used art and technology better than anyone to objectify his musical visions. Stravinsky was right in the '60s: "Stockhausen is the music of the future".
Someone had to do this non-sounding non-sensing de-structurization as a principle of music. If we hadnt had Stockhausen, we probably had never understood nothing like this.
Try though he may to endow these parameters that he has established with some kind of organic functionality - he does not escape the mere arbitrariness of it all - and the relationships - both metric and melodic, are not particularly interesting or compelling at all...
+lourak613, which is better, happiness or a ham sandwich? Answer: Happiness, because nothing is better than happiness and a ham sandwich is better than nothing.
Don't underestimate how complicated it was back in the days to produce these sounds. Hardware was very expensive and limited: he would have required a five-channel tape recorder, but had to settle for a four-channel one and mix the fifth channel into the fourth. There was probably no automation that would have automatically synthesized the whole the piece. There was not even a spreadsheet helping with all these calculations. Today we have cool software that can render electronic music with unimaginable complexity. In fact, there are programming languages created especially for this purpose. And still it takes an extraordinary amount of tinkering to exactly get at what one wants, and one has to understand the underlying concepts very well.
LOL. I am afraid you don't know what you're talking about. Does dualism exist in art? what value has the term "better" here?. You don't seriously compare the complexity of what we hear in KS music with the art of richard d james. It might be interesting if you can give it some consistence. Shure you are right when you mean that you like Aphex Twins music more
Avant garde music was an interesting experiment, even refreshing. But it all became a self contained madness. Eventually the joy and the experience of music were replaced with the concept of music, with the theory of how it is created, with the mathematical processes used to derive a series of notes, regardless if the result is disgusting to listen to. The video shows the formal rules used to compose this piece, which is absolutely distant from the audiences, it's alien even to an educated listener. It has only academic value, and I doubt there is someone who truly enjoys listening to it. It may only arouse intellectual curiosity. You need only to listen to it once and it compensates for all time.
I would not have said it better. This is interesting but clearly it is not musical and anyone who claims this is music is mentaly ill. This is a concept of something else but definitely not music
The rules serve the purpose of creating an underlying form which results in a piece being beautiful to listen to. This, that the form is done for the purpose of the music being good, is blatantly obvious to anyone who has even taken a brief look at the philosophies behind said music. Your presumptuous opinion is, frankly, wrong because it assumes that people are deriving some sort of "intellectual" pleasure from a piece which is irrelevant to the music itself. Don't you think that you are coming to this opinion just because you can't enjoy the music because it sounds "disgusting" to you on an aesthetic level? Who are you to tell other people why they enjoy certain music? Have you even listened to a Stockhausen piece in full, or did you just scrub around the video until you determined that it was disgusting?
@@Melpheos1er What none sense you say. This IS music. The mentally ill or mentally backward rather, cannot concieve this as music just as a chimp cant concieve poetry as something artistic. You have to have a quite broad conception of music to enjoy this, you have to break free from the regular diatonic music. This is music but it has evovled. You cant grasp it because your brain is not ready. You lag behind.
Nothing more than math Right? Thats barely Art Look at his Klavierstück VI. Although music laws are Based on math there is more as I say: we dhouldnt give somone the possibility to expiroence the objective thing. Because then Art would be the same picture in the mirrow for everyone who understaand maths. That shouldnt be way we have to Go
I would say that even the most banal and simple music can written in musical notation. And musical notation is notation of time and frequencies. So it it physics and maths. Even John Cage 4'33" isthe "absence of frequencies" but the time is still there. If music like Mantra iscomplex and then we call it math, ok, but all music is the art of combine the maths and physics of the acoustics. The mix of sound and time.
![Lecture 7 [Part 2/3] Karlheinz Stockhausen - MANTRA (1973) British Lectures](/img/n.gif)
I see a lot of criticism on Stockhausen and I think many people don't show the respect his work deserves. Something isn't bad just because you don't get it. You have to be really ignorant to... ignore!... the devotion he shows for his music. He doesn't strike me at all as a charlatan, as some people say. I'm not saying that he is "far away from the rest of the world, an enlightened genius" or whatever. He's delivering a message: his message as an artist and visionary. A quite original point of view. I like the way he behaves about his music, it seems very sincere.
he is mad in a good way
@ Thomas Manana: Have you ever done deep research only to realise when you talk about it with people they think you're crazy? obviously not. I worked with stockhausen and he is far away from being mad. only most people can't follow him for the lack of capacity of focus
Criticism? Who is the fool who can criticize one of the greatest musicians of all times?
He was the same person in private that he was in public.
@@paologalliani4172 The essence of music and art is 'meaning.' His music means nothing. If culturally very few people can relate to his music, then it's of low cultural value. Art that's not for humans is no longer art. It's just graffiti for fun.
you can't deny how genius he is
I can.
17:48
+Hayden McGowan LOL
@Bruno56 By this logic, any artist is just "an idiot putting blobs of color on canvas" ;-)
@Bruno56 And yet, there are many "idiots" appreciating even modern pieces of art.
It's funny, in the experimental music scene today, there are literally about 50,000 people or more who now think like Stockhausen, but seldom have the aesthetic quality or feel of his music.
Robert Pearson : snobism is not always misleading, you know ;-) aesthetic feeling stems from recognition. But you cannot recognize what you never heard before. So it can take time to get the feeling. Believe me or not: you will find it here in this very piece!
50001 incompetent morons if you add them up together
The most beautiful white board with music notation ever!!!!!!
For those interested, the melody he started with is: A/B/G#/E/F/D/G/Eb/C#/C/Bb/F#/A
One of my biggest musical inspirations truly a genius
Wonderful. Brings it alive.
After Webern my new obsession is Stockhausen. I love him!!
Flaco, sos un genio por publicar esto!!! You're a genius!!! Thanks!!!
This guy was a genius...
Thank you for uploading this fascinating series of videos. I was one of the two pianists performing during these three lectures. The other was Jerzy Romaniuk. Would you be so kind as to credit the two of us in the description sections of your uploads, please? Thank you so much.
I notice this request has fallen on deaf ears. I do notice your name in the introductory titles though Roger.
this is important guys
I listened to this piece quite some times. And it works each time! What Stockhausen says may seem foolish and snobishingly formal but you can hear it just describes exactly what happens! And where this comes to genius is when adding the ring modulator.
We´ll be enormously amazed -as we are just in the present- in the future by acknowledging the incredible amount of musical vision KS had. Thanks not only to his music (which he said can be understood in the same amount of time it took him to compose, and probably thinking almost on a daily basis). Many musical developments of today began thanks to him. Just think of the "raum musik", the space music. Or the formula composition. Or the electronik musik. Etc. So I believe in the far future he will be considered kinf of a myth..."Did it really existed a person who fasted for a week in order to compose?", the children of tomorrow will ask their moms...
Very well put.
It's the same with Ligeti and Xenakis
I guess that's because some post modernists, accustomed with his philosophy pairs, are interested in the more political and ideological aspects of culture today, they end up missing the point completely.
It is striking how he explains his ideas, the structural principle of his musical piece, in visual terms. Maybe it explains why his music is inaudible?
Equally intelligent and emotional. That makes a masterpiece. Like the art of fugue is this mantra.
Love his lucid madness.
still love it!!
Great to fall asleep to!
This is so f***ing great!
Like Christoph Columbus he is Setting sail for a new world.
Thumbs up if Dr. Kalhous' class brought you here! :)
Spectacular
I find it interesting how mantra seems to go over so many heads in the the comments field, I taught my daughter these techniques and she has played with them for days with no need to intervene, she's off into her own mirror world of mantra with her toy instruments. I have used this technique for many years in my organ and synth work.
awesome!!!
Well, sorry if I'm incorrectly assuming your child's age, but I find it hard to believe someone that isn't at least 16 can understand these processes, much less "play with them", this is nothing crazy or super genius, but it's pretty advanced non the less
how noble of you to indoctrinate your daughter into your cult, how absolutely gracefully you've blessed her.
cult? wtf are you joking?@@Whatismusic123
It's just fantastic. And they say Germans don't have a sense of humor.
Stockhausen represents a NEW WAY of thinking and making music´in 20th century.
His virtuosic strict structuralism supports his free intuitive constructivism.
He understood and used art and technology better than anyone to objectify his musical visions.
Stravinsky was right in the '60s: "Stockhausen is the music of the future".
Wow, thanks for sharing.
Grazie infinite.
great upload
37:20 epic ! "Roger ... :/ "
37:40 Roger: Roger that!
lol
Why did you count the repeated C but didn't count the repeated F and D in the previous bar, Karl? Karl...?
Loco manso perfectamente presindible
Genial 👏🏽👏🏽
THANK YOU. Amazing!
Gotta appreciate the music humor at 11:57
I have no idea why I'm watching this
Russel Blacker : but you were - weren't you? A possible explanation: because it is fascinating! You don't know why, but still it is.
I want to know what the musictheory in his pieces is, but it seems, that I just hit rock bottom...
Genius
The STEINWAY logo is not entirely inconspicuous...
Is that roger Woodward at the piano or am i just getting excited?
Yup - see opening credits.
"We were four people in the car"
Such a pity the communication between KS and the pianist(s) wasn't optimal due to a language barrier...
Someone had to do this non-sounding non-sensing de-structurization as a principle of music. If we hadnt had Stockhausen, we probably had never understood nothing like this.
12:07
@33:40 Johnny Depp as a young pianist.
Cool accent.
No disrespect, Just saying - "Now we have it . . . there it is: {0,4,6,7} "Meet George Jetson" (allowing for T+6)
I do not understand what you are saying.
This is really funny
STEINWAY
nice hair
so great at 2x speed
i think he takes his look from mozart
La uea uena ueon
this is a big deal
Try though he may to endow these parameters that he has established with some kind of organic functionality - he does not escape the mere arbitrariness of it all - and the relationships - both metric and melodic, are not particularly interesting or compelling at all...
What isn't arbitrary about a Bach fugue, or even a Mozart sonata?
Plus, some people do find this compelling
White folks sho is crazy!
"intellectual comment"
There is about as much music in this work as a ham sandwich - (maybe less)....
+lourak613, which is better, happiness or a ham sandwich? Answer: Happiness, because nothing is better than happiness and a ham sandwich is better than nothing.
Your brain is dull. Sucks to be you
Don't underestimate how complicated it was back in the days to produce these sounds. Hardware was very expensive and limited: he would have required a five-channel tape recorder, but had to settle for a four-channel one and mix the fifth channel into the fourth. There was probably no automation that would have automatically synthesized the whole the piece. There was not even a spreadsheet helping with all these calculations. Today we have cool software that can render electronic music with unimaginable complexity. In fact, there are programming languages created especially for this purpose. And still it takes an extraordinary amount of tinkering to exactly get at what one wants, and one has to understand the underlying concepts very well.
Sometimes i hear in music in my ham sándwiches 😂
Aphex Twin is better.
LOL. I am afraid you don't know what you're talking about. Does dualism exist in art? what value has the term "better" here?. You don't seriously compare the complexity of what we hear in KS music with the art of richard d james. It might be interesting if you can give it some consistence.
Shure you are right when you mean that you like Aphex Twins music more
This guy was a nutcase an eloquent nutcase but a nutcase all the same.
Avant garde music was an interesting experiment, even refreshing. But it all became a self contained madness. Eventually the joy and the experience of music were replaced with the concept of music, with the theory of how it is created, with the mathematical processes used to derive a series of notes, regardless if the result is disgusting to listen to. The video shows the formal rules used to compose this piece, which is absolutely distant from the audiences, it's alien even to an educated listener. It has only academic value, and I doubt there is someone who truly enjoys listening to it. It may only arouse intellectual curiosity. You need only to listen to it once and it compensates for all time.
I would not have said it better. This is interesting but clearly it is not musical and anyone who claims this is music is mentaly ill.
This is a concept of something else but definitely not music
Mariano Hernandez : let it infuse and retry later! This piece is a true gem!
The rules serve the purpose of creating an underlying form which results in a piece being beautiful to listen to. This, that the form is done for the purpose of the music being good, is blatantly obvious to anyone who has even taken a brief look at the philosophies behind said music. Your presumptuous opinion is, frankly, wrong because it assumes that people are deriving some sort of "intellectual" pleasure from a piece which is irrelevant to the music itself. Don't you think that you are coming to this opinion just because you can't enjoy the music because it sounds "disgusting" to you on an aesthetic level? Who are you to tell other people why they enjoy certain music? Have you even listened to a Stockhausen piece in full, or did you just scrub around the video until you determined that it was disgusting?
+ Melpheous1er, this is music I'm not sick.
@@Melpheos1er What none sense you say. This IS music. The mentally ill or mentally backward rather, cannot concieve this as music just as a chimp cant concieve poetry as something artistic. You have to have a quite broad conception of music to enjoy this, you have to break free from the regular diatonic music.
This is music but it has evovled. You cant grasp it because your brain is not ready. You lag behind.
Nothing more than math Right? Thats barely Art Look at his Klavierstück VI. Although music laws are Based on math there is more as I say: we dhouldnt give somone the possibility to expiroence the objective thing. Because then Art would be the same picture in the mirrow for everyone who understaand maths. That shouldnt be way we have to Go
I would say that even the most banal and simple music can written in musical notation. And musical notation is notation of time and frequencies. So it it physics and maths. Even John Cage 4'33" isthe "absence of frequencies" but the time is still there. If music like Mantra iscomplex and then we call it math, ok, but all music is the art of combine the maths and physics of the acoustics. The mix of sound and time.