Millar Time EP21 - Comic Book Retailer Roundtable
ฝัง
- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 18 ต.ค. 2024
- Three weeks ago, Florida retailer Phil Boyle wrote an article saying the direct market would be dead in 2 years if Marvel and DC didn't change course from the kind of books they were selling. It caused an outcry among creators, but other retailers agreed and so we spoke to Ryan Seymore from Comic Town in Ohio and John Robinson from Graham Crackers in Chicago. These men have weathered several recessions over the decades and perfectly placed to explain both what's gone wrong and how the market can be corrected before it's too late. Some incredible information in here. A must watch!
![The Wall Song ร้องข้ามกำแพง | EP.215 | พาเวล นเรศ - พูห์ กฤติน | 17 ต.ค. 67 [1/5]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/IUzrjuf60P4/mqdefault.jpg)
This is exactly what's needed. There's no better way to display the state of the industry than having people in that industry describe it themselves.
No you are incorrect because they are all white men ... (lol)
Actual owners who know the numbers and the history - powerful conversation & spot on Bartenders to the Nerds!
There is a part of me that enjoys the struggle. I've been illustrating comics for nearly 30 years and the first half of that made me lazy with how easy it was to half ass or even fail and still make a living. I've also been more concerned with the approval of my peers more than the fans. Comicsgate made me realize my mistake of not considering one of the most important aspects of what we do and that is pleasing the comic fan. This has given me a new lease on my comic life with a focus on the fan and crating the best work I'm capable of in an effort to promote a better future for myself as a creator. The 2 go hand in hand. This struggle will realign us, make us stronger, and more creative in the long run, and hopefully give the American comic book it's best round yet. Big thanks to these fine retailers for doing this and Thank you Mark for having this sorely needed discussion! It gives me hope.
..and I also think the Crowdfunding model differs from the established norms of the current industry allowing small press to build an audience and actually make a living in Comics. Hail Kelsey!!✋🏾✋🏾✋🏾
Well said Kelsey. You are a powerhouse in comicsgate. Really looking forward to shank 👍
Your Shank art is amazing so far. Don't lose that energy and passion!
@@driakos Thanks, Brother! You got it! ;)
@@taklovesart2421 Indeed! Thanks, Bud! ;)
this is such an incredible interview. you just did 5 years worth of comics journalism in the time it takes "journalists" 10 years to get to
THANK YOU, MARK!
00:00:00 - Introduction to the Industry Experts
00:02:28 - The Decline of the American Comics Industry
00:04:59 - The Impact of Industry Changes on Comic Stores
00:07:49 - Criticisms of the Comic Book Industry
00:10:25 - Worries About Job Security in the Industry
00:13:01 - The Importance of Consistent Long-Term Runs in Comics
00:15:24 - Diminishing Returns in Comics Sales
00:18:10 - Quality Issues in the Industry
00:20:26 - The Importance of Long-Term Cohesive Stories
00:23:11 - The Retail Community's Voice on the Internet
00:25:45 - The Importance of Marvel and DC in the Indie Scene
00:28:15 - The Importance of Pricing in Sales Strategies
00:30:46 - Lack of Editorial Direction at Marvel and DC
00:33:36 - The Decline in Sales and Fear of Change
00:36:11 - Attracting High-End Talent to Marvel and DC
00:38:51 - The Need for Source Material in Hollywood
00:41:15 - The sustainability of small press comics
00:43:39 - Boosting the Industry with Big Name Creators
00:46:24 - The Decline of Hickman X-Men
00:48:56 - The Age of Comic Book Buyers
00:51:30 - The Impact of Movies on Comics Sales
00:54:04 - The Passion for Comic Retail
00:56:32 - The Importance of the Comics Community
00:58:47 - The Importance of Retailers Having a Voice
And thank you, timestamp guy
Thanks for the kind word, guys!
Great interview Mark! Would love to see more of these retailer talks!
Ryan is an amazing shop owner. He and his crew make great recommendations, they talk with everyone who comes in the store and geek out. Can’t convey enough my appreciation for him. For free comic book day they would even hold sensory friendly events.
Agreed. Worst part of moving away from Columbus was losing my Comic Town LCS.
I've been saying it and I'll keep saying it. Put comics back on spinner racks in convenience stores. Convenience stores are the one type of brick and mortar store that is immune to the digital economy. They're among the only brick and mortar industry that is expanding and has growing profits year after year. And most importantly, kids and teenagers go in there to spend their own money. They don't go into grocery stores or book stores. Comics needs a thriving general market if its going to have a thriving direct market. And also this means comic companies have to go back to taking on the risk. If they need to make profits, they won't put out so much garbage.
Jim Shooter was a guest on The BARON EARLS Show which streamed live on June 22nd, 2022. During the last 11 minutes, Mike Baron asked “Why don’t they sell comics in movie theatre lobbies?” Jim’s answer addressed ID wholesaler distribution which he described as “corrupt beyond imagining” and how "it’s not as easy as people think".
@@KintounKalI always wondered this. When Star Wars came out, I wanted to know why weren't the theaters selling SW books, magazines, and figurines. Even today, movie theaters could be selling movie memorabilia because the biggest films are part of franchises. But no, all they're interested in selling is food. Movie theaters are in the FOOD BUSINESS,
@@KintounKal Shooter is one of the people who is for putting them back on newstands and on spinner racks in corner stores. And he always argued they never should have been removed in the first place.
@@RawPowerComics The latter statement is true but not so much the first sentence. Unfortunately, there's a gigantic difference between saying "comic books never should have left newsstands" and "putting comic books back on newsstands is feasible in 2023".
I agree but the truth is comics are so low margin and the retail space for magazines has shrunk to a point that they just don’t want those $3.99 books taking up space that a $15 magazine.
Love this. I could honestly listen for hours. If everyone in the business felt like this we’d have such a different outlook
This was the single best video made, everything and I do mean everything that'was said was absolutely spot on.
Please get everyone back if possible periodically so fans can be excited again for something coming down the pipeline, because what we need right now is excitement and energy, and most of all hope.
Thanks so much for this! I'm a mostly lapsed fan, and Marvel and DC would have to do a massive overhaul to win me back. Apologize for the behavior of the horrible people they've hired, GET RID of those problem people, incentivize talent to return, commit to a plan that focuses on quality over the Dynamite method of a bajillion variant covers, and price at a rate that encourages people like me to take chances on new titles. Indies account for most of my purchases these days and tbh it's been hard finding stuff that speaks to me even on that front the last couple years.
I haven't been excited for New Comic Day in a long time, and the closest thing that's gotten me into that "gotta be there!" mood is the new Energon Universe books from Skybound. I wish I felt that way about Marvel and DC again, but me and people like me having been continuously insulted and bait and switched on their efforts are going to need to see contrition in their actions going forward. Otherwise, more of my money and attention is simply going to go to other things. Comics was my first hobby growing up, and I feel like I've been through the messiest divorce over the past decade.
We've discussed this several times on our show Pontificators, but we've never had retailers to discuss the issue with. I'm very intetested in what you guys have to say.
I haven't been buying comics the last 6 years or so. What I have noticed about them today is that they have a great cover, done by great comics artists...but inside they look like coloring books and the stories are "preachy," if that's even an actual word. They are abandoning actual fans in order to pander to a different crowd that isn't even going to buy the books anyways. In the end, no one buys them. It's a bizarre business strategy.
Let me highly recommend Big Game. Great read, great art Well worth the pice of admission and I wasn't entirely familiar with all the cast of characters but it was the best thing I read this year as far as current releases are concerned. Much like Minus One was the best film I've seen in years.
@@mindandbody7971 I am aware of it. Mark Millar is one of the few left worth reading. But my comment was about the comics industry in general. Mainly Marvel and DC.
I figured that might be the case, but in case it wasn't. :laughing:@@DM-sy4hg
What a wonderful discussion. Refreshingly mature, commonsense conversation about the problems and possible solutions for the industry.
Well said!
Wow! I've put forward the idea that editorial oversite seemed to be a major issue but I've never had any comic store owners willing to discuss it to that level with me. The pros I've been able to discuss it with seem to say the editors went from being the keepers of the characters to just being glorified secretaries. Does that track with you guys?
Great to hear so many retailers tell their story. Agree that comic shops are all about the community. This was great.
When I began reading comics they were in numerous gas stations and grocery stores and they were cheap enough that a kid could afford them.
i would sign a contract tomorrow to be on a page rate for a 3 year run - i've only ever wanted to draw comics and the industry is falling apart. saddening as much as it is maddening
What a great idea to discuss this ! Having grown up on comics here in Australia it is so sad to see comic stores closing down! One major problem is that comics are so expensive ! The prices for comics here are almost double the cover price! So sad!
Yeah, price is a big part, but I feel quality is a big part of that as well. Price, quality, and competition for your entertainment dollar are the 3 biggest issues I feel.
Seriously! Went sniffing for recent Marvel Annuals and it was something like $16AU for ONE of an EIGHT-part gimmick! I can get 3 or 4 back issues for that and KNOW I'm getting all winners. Haven't felt that way about new issues since around 2011. Brutal!
Yes,I do feel quality plays a part but years ago when comics were cheaper you would take the risk for the sake of quality.Nowadays I am not so much prepared to lay my money for the sake of the quality except for Sean Gordon Murphy!
That's true in my part. I love DC (named my son Grayson, after Nightwing), but I am getting sick and tired of these stupid card stock covers. I don't care about that. Make your stupid multiple Variants. Don't charge an extra dollar for it an Artgerm cover. I don't care. They did it right with DC Rebirth.
Mate it is sad. Aussie here too. I enjoyed comics in the 2000s price was very oof. Sad too that my main store went out of business then now a store opened near me but they had to do a couple gofundmes to stay afloat and keep up with their sales to keep their supply
since 2020, I have purchased 15 or so crowdfunded comics for an average price of $30. would love to be able to purchase the latest narwhal book in a store 😊
I tried to buy a crowd funded comic and with the shipping, it went to 50 bucks and there wasn't many pages. I went to the shop and decided to buy a DC trade instead. It was tick and costed like 15 bucks.
@@johnnyskinwalker4095 if it's a decent book and you love it then you won!!
@@johnnyskinwalker4095 Tick has never been published by DC comics. Are you getting the character created by Ben Edlund confused with Blue Beetle?
Big quality creators will pull people back in. I dropped out in the 90’s malaise days of comics after buying since the early 80’s. Got back in when I saw Jim Lee’s amazing cover and interiors for Batman # 612 on a weird spinner rack at a Borders book store… bought it and then went and found my local LCS at the time.
As just some random dude, I loved this format mark!
Really cool hearing from the shop owners, or heck maybe one from each step of the process next time!
There’s clearly a lot of love and passion at each level, it’s nice hearing the wins and woes of each step.
Thanks!
The Identity Politics hires would rather get a free ticket on a sinking ship than work hard to earn a ticket on a successful voyage.
And they'll slander seaworthyness as "white privilege."
Most of them couldn't hack it even if they tried.
They seem to only fail upwards, or are otherwise supported by parents or their circles so don't seem to be afraid of any real consequences beyond losing a perceived zero sum culture war.
Thank you for doing this Mr. Millar. You don't have to do this for your own benefit, you appear to be doing it because you love comics and want the industry to thrive. I hope this conversation grows into a chorus that the Big 2 can't ignore. Cheers bud.
Thanks Mark Millar and company for fighting the good fight and demanding maturity and professionalism and passion to craft entertainment not propaganda about politics and gender ideology. This is about solid sequential storytelling at an affordable price and it has to look cool, cause if the visuals didn't matter, we would be reading novels.
Im 38 years old have been reading and collecting comics since i was 7 years old. I was a huge consumer of Marvel up until 2016. Thats when i noticed that theyre stories started to get very uninspired. I would still buy some issues here and there up until Covid happened. I dont know what happened but ever since Trump became president and Covid happened the world has gone Bat sheet crazy. What made me totally drop comics was the fact that writers and artits started to be very rude and political on twitter. I dropped Moon knight because the writer at that time stated a very divisive and biggoted tweet.
I then started to see that very wierd people were being brought on into the big two. These people literally changed legacy characters sexuality and if i as a customer voiced my disagreement then i was shot down and labled a racist, homophobe etc.
The industry has been infiltrated by far left ideologues that push their warped views unto comic consumers. I personally want absolutely no involvement with being apart of a community and industry that hates me and pushes degenerate garbage to comic book lovers. Comic books is no longer cool now that SJWs are part of the group. No one likes these people. I now know why gatekeeping exits. Its like having your annoying little sister being forced into your tree house club by your mom. Its never good.
The elephant in the room that no one talks about is that comics were mainly a straight male demographic. Comics now have these feminists write characters that are obnoxious and not relatable. The big two have been watered down because of this. They are trying to target an audience that doesnt exist while alienating their core base.
But unfortunately nothing will change as long as these big corporations champion this DEI and ESG nonesense. The big two have let in these identity politic wierdos and even if they wanted to change they will have a very very hard time getting rid of these roach.
Marvel and DC went cheap, which allowed them to be infiltrated and taken over by TDS-infected activist cancel pigs that hate their customers. These companies are almost dead because of their inability to shake off these parasites.
Yep, we have now got activists writing for themselves instead of the comic buying public.
I was just going to post something along those lines, but you pretty much summed it all up for me. I think it all really kicked into high gear just after ‘Secret Wars’ by Hickman with the All-New, All-Different Marvel initiative.
@@clab9041 very true. Id say thats around the same time too. That was the last event i purchased before calling it quits.
38? Considering how youth isn’t interested in comics, that’s a newbie.
I am here for this now.
Subscribed
Definitely a quality issue. 10 year old nephew loved the original MCU movies so I tried to get him into comics. He hates them. But boy is he eating up manga. He enjoys the 80s-mid 90s comics but the store in his area doesn't carry those. He has to visit my neck of the woods. Breaks the heart.
Can you expound on what issues specifically your nephew tried and hated? He sounds smart to prefer comics from those 2 eras but I'm curious to hear what he disliked the most.
The comment that there’s no one at the big two that don’t care about the care the comics they’re working. Nor are they being good stewards. That’s the crux of the problem. When there’s dozens of people that do care and would give their right eye to work on those characters and see them thrive. But they don’t because they don’t fit a desired demographic or do have the same clapping seal world view as the ones who are working at those companies.
Everyone is really appreciating that you’re opening these dialogues Mark. Reaching out to find solutions to the problems currently facing comics.
Really enjoyed the discussion, but they unsurprisingly STUDIOUSLY avoided the elephant in the room - ‘I won’t get into the social issues…’. THAT’S the problem, along with ‘blame it on the fans’. Heroes don’t resemble what they once were & have been ‘updated for a modern audience’. The MCU should’ve driven massive comics sales. But there wasn’t because comics simply didn’t match what fans were enjoying on screen. And the further the MCU goes, the closer it resembles the comics, and the further it falls. But let’s avoid the ‘social issues’. Sigh.
The big 2 don’t give customers what they want, and then vilify the customers for not wanting it. There is simply no better recipe to drive customers away than that.
When the industry finally openly calls it what it is, and grapples with the rot, it can heal. But the folks calling for the big 2 to fail were once their biggest customers…who’ve sadly become apathetic to what they loved for so long. And they understand that nothing short of abject financial failure could possibly lead to any improvement. And of course, that’s the fans’ fault, as well. SMH. 🤷🏻♂️
What are your thoughts on kickstarter comics?
A conversation with 4 people can easily become a mess, but this stayed on the tracks for the full hour! More roundtables please Ser Millar
Great video ! Let's all save western comic books from dying completely !
"Let's all laugh at an Industry
that never learns anything
tee hee hee."
Only Men of Culture will understand.
This was a great discussion and I'd love to see something like this every month to get updates on the situation.
Thanks for hosting this. I loved the analogy at the end: Bartender for nerds. Reminded me what I miss (in addition to missing great books) about the LCS experience.
Great discussion and insight! Thank you for hosting, Mark.
Good chat with these guys. As for the comics, if it's $3.99 for a story, a complete story, that's fine, but most of the time it's a part 3 of 5, or whatever, you aren't getting anything of substance, just a portion of a bigger story. You can have A plots that see their start and finish in that single issue, and a B plot that weaves throughout and is paid off down the road, giving incentive to continue reading.
I am okay paying $3.99 for an ongoing, given how much everything else costs now. But I do agree with the retailer who mentioned that $6.99 for a new book is too steep.
I am fortunate enough to have a wife who actually reads comics, and I have slashed my ongoing purchases to the books she reads. For the books i read, I wait until they are collected, as that makes it much more affordable. They look better on a shelf as well.
Fantastic show. I think having professional comic creators and comic shop owners comparing notes like this is EXEEDINGLY important.
The state of the industry has been a point of contention for several years, and anyone who poked their head up above the trench to point out a problem has been attacked as all sorts of ridiculous things.
It's unfortunate, because most of us who have noticed the problems, have only said something due to our love of the industry, and wanting it to be the best it can be.
I've watched my own local comic shops struggling and it breaks my heart.
We all want this industry to be healthy and prosperous; both creatively and financially.
And the sad thing is that it has been in a slump. For innumerable reasons, not just the culture war nonsense. (Although that is a contributing factor, to be sure.)
I hope nothing but the best for everyone in the industry. I truly hope things turn around.
The constant revamps, the lack of quality artists & writers, the rarity of great titles, the cost of living/comic prices & the availability of free graphic novels from public libraries/TH-cam channels are all the reasons I haven't stepped into let alone bought a comic from a comic store since 2015. Also I really miss (because they no longer output) the b & w Marvel Essential collections
I know this is supposed to be a meeting to address issues about the industry not doing well but man was this fun to watch.
John Robinson’s question at 50:10 reminds me of the Marvel Premiere Classic hardcovers published between 2006 and 2013. The very first volume reprinted all 6 parts of 1987’s “Kraven’s Last Hunt”. Volume 4 focused on “Death of the Stacys” spanning from 1970-1973.
Volume 27 collected 1990’s “Torment” by Todd McFarlane along with material from Marvel Age #90. Volume 31 featured all 6 parts of 1990’s “Sinister Six” or “The Return of the Sinister Six” story arc plus 1964’s Annual #1. Volume 70 dealt with “The Death of Jean DeWolff” spanning from 1985-1988.
Next, volume 83 featured 1991’s “Masques” by Todd McFarlane along with X-Force #4 (“Sabotage Part 2”). Volume 95 finished Todd McFarlane’s adjectiveless run with 1990’s “Perceptions”. Volume 97 highlighted 1979’s “Return of the Burglar”.
Since volume 103 included a 1991 sequel by Erik Larsen, it was inaccurately titled “Return of the Sinister Six” rather than “Revenge of the Sinister Six”. Lastly, volume 105 was called “Nothing Can Stop the Juggernaut” from 1981-1982. These are perhaps ten of the best Spider-Man collected editions.
great interview. thanks! lots of interesting stuff. hope comics recover. i feel like they will. i have a few books coming out that will help!
A great discussion. The biggest challenge ive seen is definitely the price of entry which then goes into issues of profit margins for retailers. Hopefully there will be a balance of affordability and revenues for comic shops
Hey hopefully Ryan from Comic Town sees this….Ryan, I’m so very bummed to hear you are changing careers but I’m glad you found something else that you are passionate about that will make your life better all around.
You are one of the best store owners I’ve ever met regardless of the industry. God bless you and yours as you go on this new endeavor.
I don’t know many people who buy single issues. We get collected editions from instocktrades or the library. Maybe that eats into sales. So It’s not surprising that single issue sales are down. Yes, There are bad comics. But 80 percent of dc and marvel is great. The last couple of years have given us Spider-Man alien reality by Peter David, Batman by jock, Batman by Ennis, demon days by Momoko, Batman Universe by Bendis, robin and Batman by Lemire, Spider-Man Beyond, Justice league dark, venom by cates, Harley/Joker: Criminal Sanity, Batman by Silvestri, Hulk by Rugg, beta ray bill and Wonder Woman by Daniel Warren Johnson, etc. So the problem isn’t quality. It’s single issues. It’s not 1995 anymore. People want collected editions. They don’t want to buy a single issue for 6 bucks plus bags and boards and boxes. We want to absorb an entire story in one sitting, like a movie. And they’re free from the public library. I don’t care about long runs. I care about collected editions. I used to buy single issues. No more.
This was a great idea, Mark and gents. It will be interesting to see what the response from the usual suspects will be.
Thank you Mark and retailers!
This felt like a convo that flew by and easily could have gone on for more hours and no one would have noticed!
If there were to be a follow up, i think you all were on to something with Hickman X-Men. That is a run that should be analyzed for what brought the excitement and what brought it down as well as what point in time did readers lose interest in what was going on in those comics and why.
I knew readers who were returning AND brand new who were coming to my LCS just to try that run out.
That was only half a decade ago
It's clear new and returning readers are willing to give something a shot!
Thanks for putting this together Mark. I whole-heartedly agree that we need A-List talent on A-List properties to juice up the industry, Even though we got a Millar take in Ultimates, I'd selfishly love to see what you and Matteo Scalera would do on a 616 Iron Man book. Tony Stark deserves better than what he's gotten since Matt Fraction left.
What a fantastic panel
Really interesting conversation from some really big hitters
This is just me, but I started seeing a lot of changes that I didn’t like maybe a year or so after the start of Rebirth. Then once DC brought Bendis in, I ended up trimming my pull by half. When the Rebirth one shot came out, that was the last time I was excited about a book. Now there is nothing to get excited about. Like was said here, there is no book that a person needs to read in the parking lot.
Rebirth really lost its thunder the longer it took Geoff Johns to get his stuff out - waiting forever for Doomsday Clock negatively impacted the line as a whole, and impacted stuff like JSA and Legion etc
I noticed it kicking into high gear after Hickman’s ‘Secret Wars’ with the All New, All Different Marvel initiative.
The last good era of DC and everyone knew when it was over when Bendis was announced
@@joebi-wankenobi1538 Agree to disagree. Sure we didn’t get Doomsday Clock as the main event title it was supposed to be but I don’t know how much of that was Johns’ fault. They basically went back to the New 52 with Snyder’s Metal. Metal was supposed to be a Batman event and Didio wanted it to be the main DC event and made Doomsday Clock non-canon. When I’m talking about Rebirth, I’m talking about all of the great solo titles. Superman, Action Comics, HJ and the GL Corps, Aquaman, Flash, Super Sons, Titans, Teen Titans, etc were all really good to excellent books and they blew it up with Metal and Bendis.
It's fairly obvious that the retailers are afraid to call out the overwhelming negative effect politics have had on the books because they don't want the backlash. The problem is that cancel pigs can't tell the difference between politics enhancing a story and politics being the reason why people have stopped buying books. The hacks that are being hired today cannot put politics into a book without it being hamfisted, preachy, boring and demonising to one side. Let's be clear here, you can say the problem is quality, you can say the problem is that there's no excitement for comics anymore, but if you say these things you need to examine why. And the answer is that writers were hired for the boxes they checked rather than their talent. That was a POLITICAL hiring decision and they had free reign because editors are obviously terrified of editing their work. They couldn't stop putting their ideologies into books and it drove off the customers in droves. Now we see the likes of Gail Simone backtracking and pretending she wasn't one of the instigators of all this. Longstanding fans were berated and called all sorts of horrible names by comic pros for the mildest of takes and once customers like that drop the habit you will not get them back. Why go back when a writer you once loved (Waid, Marz, Conway, Slott, I'm looking at you) has publicly called you every "ist" and "Phobe" under the sun? Even the very few books that are decent will be left on the shelf because Manga is across the isle and they've never told me the product wasn't for me anymore.
Yes, the books are low quality. Yes, there's no excitement anymore. But the root cause of this is agenda, virtue signalling and politics. It needs to be called out. You cannot fix a problem without understanding it's root cause.
This was a great stream Mark and I really hope we have more of them in the future.
They don’t hitch their message cart to a narrative horse. They have a huge cart with no wheels towering over a lame horse with flies buzzing about its head.
Exactly. I was thinking the same thing as i watched this stream.
"bartenders of the nerd sect". Love it!
This is a very enlightening conversation, but it satisfies one angle of a bigger and more complex problem. I would love to see this conversation in roughly five other approaches. 1: interview editors from at least three companies. 2: interview at least three creators currently working at the Big Two that don't have a name. 3: interview three creators who are enjoying almost mutual success with crowdfunding. 4 interview three well-known creators who have left the Big Two but still work with a publisher. 5: interview three readers who really love all kinds of comics, but have lost enthusiasm for the past time.
The point you made about comic DNA, Mark, where every stand out scene in a Spiderman movie are the scenes that simply are based on Stan Lee's ideas and Hollywood writers don't understand comics or at least don't have the right DNA and even remotely comparable telling fascinating stories is just brilliant!
You could have applied that to “modern” comics in the same way in this talk, because very few comic creators today have this DNA! Rather, they see themselves as "authors" who have managed to let off steam in the playground of really good comic authors, without considering losses and certainly not what fans of the old comics might think.
This indifference towards the fans and the actual comic characters, along with the arrogance of some authors and the lack of DNA for comic stories, is the main problem and the reason why many switch to manga.
We need creators who really love their product and their stories in COMICS! And not "writers" who try to use big name books as jumping point to Hollywood.
Bring back the Comic-DNA people or find new blood who has this kind of DNA!
'We're the bartenders for the Nerd Sect.' Lmao. 🎯
Fk the cancel pigs! LFG! Thanks for doing this Mark Millar!
ty4 the vid... old guy here that buys back issues.. and new variants
I never expected someone of Mark Millar's caliber to take a swing at this. I was hoping Frank Cho was going to speak up, but he called everyone nazis and peaced out.
Thank God for this.
I think a lot of creators are scared and will tow the line set by these cancel pigs who have been given power by the editors and executives or find themselves black-balled or attacked.
@ComicBookBob Agreed. Got to focus on the positive. Imagine this all getting fixed. Maybe Mr Beast can help.
Cho is a coward
@@uglyewok6715 I don't disagree about Cho, but I think a lot of other creators are just scared of loosing their livelyhood. I've talked to a few fairly big creators and that seems to be where they are.
Hi Mark, I'm sure you're busy but I'd certainly love it if you returned to doing this podcast/interview series
Thanks, Mr. Millar. You're the most valuable voice in this quest to save Comics. To be honest I'd be happy to see it all burn after the attitude Marvel and DC Corporate and Pros have taken to its 'too old, too pale, male and stale' audience, but if there's a hope things can be good again...
This was a good "Part One." Mark (or someone) needs to interview retailers or publishers who disagree and think comics are doing great. (In June 2023, Allied Market Research reported a global comic book market growth of 5.9% in 2023; Marvel and DC hold over 50% of the market that includes manga.) This is followed by "Part Three," with these retailers and those with opposing views discussing the issues together.
Excellent discussion from guys in the trenches!
More episodes with comic shop owners monthly or bi-weekly would be great!
Intelligent & articulate gentlemen who explain the problems facing small businesses trying to earn a living through the comics biz.
Stuff like this is a microcosm of why indie media is dusting corporate media. Long-form interviews where people get to explain reality thanks to their expertise.
This was so good! Thank you for setting this up and for caring about the comic shops, Mark! I can remember the first time my mother took me to the local comic shop and I was like a kid walking into Willy Wonka’s chocolate factory for the first time! Superheroes everywhere I looked and books I never knew existed!
A wonderful conversation with retailers who evidently love comics. Thanks Mark and all the retailers for taking the time to do this.
Some very good ideas being put out here. It's good to see some positive ideas and not just moaning.
Now we need a publisher's roundtable to respond to this!
Great interview.
What a fascinating conversation. Thank you Mark for spotlighting these retailers!
Wow great conversations and smart/insightful comments to boot. Anybody know what those posters are in John’s office…they’re driving me crazy 😀
I'm reasonably confident they're fluorescent ink 20" x 30" posters first available in 1971 from The Third Eye, Inc.. Luckily, Abrams Comicarts reproduced a dozen of these ready-to-frame psychedlic images on November 16th, 2021.
It was sold as Marvel Classic Black Light Collectible Poster Portfolio volume 1. Roy Thomas even provided an introduction on the history of the Silver Age black light publishing program. A second volume completed the set on October 18th, 2022.
YES!! Thank you - you just made my night@@KintounKal
Something that seems evident is that editorial isn't doing it's job at the big two. They are not cultivating new talent to carry new or existing series for years at a time. They ar also not availing of big talent for events or mini series. Big takent like yourself mark can only give so much, but a mini from you creates footfall and hopefully that footfall picks up on an ogoing series. Ah there is so much to say kn the matter but this stream will help. You should get some pros who are no longer at the big 2 to see what they'd need to get in for sone big events. Also a fan talk, an ex editor talk, a current indie talk, and a current newbie (at the big 2) talk would be useful. Can't fix problems till we know what they all are. You're an absolute statesman of comics mark 👍
Just subbed.
Interesting conversation. You touched upon one of the problems the Big Two have and that is retaining and attracting big name writers and artists. Ed Brubaker a few years ago in an interview vented his frustration at being asked how much money he made from the Captain America, Winter Soldier, and related Marvel films whose storylines were adapted from his works. He made nothing since it was work for hire while the studios made billions. The Brubakers, Ennis, Rucka's, Vaughns, Remenders, and their artistic heirs won't be putting in years of creative thought and action into any Marvel or DC books that may be adapted in the future in a multimillion or billion t.v. and/or film. Marvel and DC won't be sharing those profits in any contract I imagine. Millar gets this. He's not writing for them either. Unless something changes the creative brain drain will continue, where those creators use their energy for their own books retaining creator rights. DC and Marvel will have to settle for creators with less talent.
Love it. When's this show coming to Spotify Podcasts?
Phil had a good point with his parking lot books - can't remember the last time there was a book I couldn't wait to read.... but back in the day? Couldn't wait for the next Grant Morrison Animal Man, the next Suicide Squad by Ostrander, the next JSA by Geoff Johns (2007), the next Flash by Mark Waid... and the other point about long-term runs, what happened to those? The constant restarting ... when I was a kid in the 70s and discovered a comic that was #157... if I really liked that issue, I knew I had 156 previous issues to enjoy. There is little to enjoy today from the big two IMO.
It's interesting that Ethan Van Sciver discussed how The Authority #20 ("Earth Inferno") written by Mark Millar and pencilled by Frank Quitely was a parking lot book for him a mere seven days ago. It's found in a 21 minute video titled 'NECESSARY EVIL: Shutting these Cancel Pigs DOWN.' on his ComicArtistPro Secrets channel.
Caught ur interview with Glenn from comic palace. Glad to subscribe to more comic creator's, I'm interested to hear ur view on the comic industry!
It’s great giving these guys an opportunity to talk
Great job Mark, this is important in the fight to save comics!
Variant covers are mini posters some hang on a wall or slab with their ccg rating, the interiors are an after thought. At MegaCon that was all that was being sold variants for insane prices, cover used to intrigue you to delve in to the floppy and take in the tale. Now it is just eye candy.
Marvel have had legacy creators on revisit of classic runs for a while, (Peter David on Maestro, Chichester on Daredevil - Black Armor) Why these books aren't grouped together in an imprint and advertised hard to Boomers/Gen X is beyond me.
Marvel does nothing to market them after the initial announcement. Expand the X-Men "Legends" title to theme the books, run retro-styled ads in the books to promote the others, rather than starting form square one every time.
@@stevenregina6429 Right on! I noticed Ron Lim's Silver Surfer stuff has the 90s Marvel Comics logo on. Use that on all the 'legacy' books and they're away.
@@jaro4742 It's probably the same reason Stan Lee only agreed to script Fantastic Four #296 ("Homecoming") if Jim Shooter provided the plot. Stan wasn't too familiar with Bronze Age continuity and he didn't want to research everything that happened since issue 236 ("The Challenge of Dr. Doom") or even earlier in Fantastic Four #154 ("The Man in the Mystery Mask").
@@jaro4742 No disagreement, I just see Marvel have something that's PRETTY MUCH an imprint, that they won't mint or advertise. Pretty strange.
Speaking of D.G. Chichester, he and Jim Shooter scripted The Good Guys #5 ("Monster Truc") together at Defiant comics. This story drawn by Greg Boone went on sale March 28th, 1994 in between Daredevil #327 ("System Error") and issue 329 ("The Chernobyl Packet").
One scene takes place at a comic book store named Dan's Comic Castle. As Laura Neale/Flex enters the door, a fan mentions "See what they done with Daredevil's costume?". Another replies "Better'n runnin' around New York in red jammies!" 😏
I've posted this quote from Dean Koontz on multiple different channels, but I feel like it's extremely relevant and worth reiterating:
"There is a law of economics which describes the insidious nature of currency inflation: 'Bad money always drives out good.' This same law could be applied to publishing. When the number of badly written books far outnumbers the good books within any category of fiction, then that category will suffer a decline in popularity. For a time, it seemed that half the shelf space in bookstores was given over to bodice rippers. Of the scores of new titles that appeared every month, 90 percent were wretched beyond description. Readers of the genre, confronted by this bewildering array of titles, which were all identically packaged, were so often burned by amateurish or cynically written books that they kept their money in their pockets or went looking for something new and different to read. The bodice ripper is still a profitable category of fiction, but the sales floor beneath it is substantially lower than was once the case, and the number of titles being published in that previously dominant genre has declined dramatically in the past two years.
(It is encouraging to note that most of the best authors of romantic historical sagas survived the purge with their sales figures undiminished, and a couple of good new writers in that category actually managed to launch successful careers in spite of the fact that countless second and third-rate novelists were going down in flames at the same time. This is just one more indication that readers can tell the difference between the work of uncommitted hack writers and the work of those who sincerely care about what they're doing. They can also tell the difference between the fine craftsman and the inept amateur, and when the crunch comes, they actively support the former at the expense of the latter.)"
For the first time in years I’m starting to have hope. This is the right direction
I just started back on floppies with Daredevil Black Armour #1 because I really like that art. It took me a while to pick something from Marvel again and now I learn it's only going to be a 4 issue mini. This ties in with what John Robinson said about longer series, it can take time for a reader to invest and then if it's cut short all that effort is wasted in luring the reader in. Great discussion across the board.
Shoking interview, now I´m worried. Heartbreaking
Insta Sub - Been a fan since 2000 AD and really grateful for you pulling this together
Great conversation!
This is great!!
Good questions asked, and good plans proposed. I wish someone at WBD/Disney considered actual solutions.
Its good to see level headed people talking about the comic industry. If may add to the conversation one thing I think you all have touched on it already between DC and Marvel if they continue to go down this strange path of deconstruction by way of taking the wholesomeness out of being a superhero then you got nothing your foundation is built on sand you don't get the cool toys, statues, movies, video games and so much more. So thank for making the video.
This was a great convo and I bet store owners really love it too! The business side is fascinating and it takes brains to make it flourish, I'm hoping for the best.
Hey Hollywood - I've got a couple of book series for you.
As for comics, I started collecting in 1984. Last year I realized I had a pile of unread issues going back a year, so I pulled the plug. I had been picking up my books out of habit, but no longer looked forward to reading them.
Great discussion, agree on almost every level of what was said. The problem is, now DC & Marvel have to buy into this. That only happens if the retailers, and it would be the big guns to do it, all stopped playing the game. Stop ordering multiple copies of books for the multi covers, don't order crappy books- make them for subscribers only. You have to hit the publisher in the pocket for any change to occur. DC used to run a retailer summit back in the day for the top 50 stores (one per state) to participate in a discussion, I assume that has gone by the way side? At this point the retailers are going to need to speak up as one voice to make any meaningful changes happen.
Beta Ray Bill by Daniel Warren Johnson was really good too.
...also, Curt Swan Superman comics were the best! You know a good Superman when you see it!
Powers That Be is my favorite comic book by far which began in 1995. Jim Shooter has mentioned that Curt Swan was his first choice to draw half of the debut issue labelled Star Seed. One page can be found online but it was never published. Mr. Swan evidently changed his mind and politely declined given the amount of reference necesarry to draw "Because I Can".
It sounds like he was much more comfortable illustrating fictional DC locations like Metropolis. So it was a bit unexpected to see him associated with the Vertigo imprint. As a result, Andrew Wendel pencilled that story arc instead from start to finish. One hundred nineteen days later, Swamp Thing #165 ("Chester Williams: American Cop") written by Mark Millar went on sale.
Sadly, this was the final DC comic with every interior page plus the cover pencilled by Curt Swan. Only 5 more comics with contributions by him were released before he died on June 17th, 1996. The last 3 comics and a Superman: The Silver Age Sundays 1959-1963 hardcover hit the stands after he passed away.
No Parking Lot books is a great point. I haven't done that in years, but it used to happen all the time.
Amazing insight Mark! great episode!!
I was buying comics regularly until 2015, and I realized that the books were no longer written for me in no way shape or form. And my comic buying was slowing down by then too. I saw that that comics by the big 2 were being forced to conform to whatever was in the TV and movies, even when it made no sense, and a lot of stuff added, just for representation. So- I was out. The stories were getting worse and worse, and I had been finding a hard time finding books I was interested in. Anyway, my 2 cents.
This is an extremely interesting discussion. I grew up reading manga (teen in 2000's) so American comics haven't been a thing I've been interested in till now, and now it's nearly impossible to get what you want for a decent price or at all. - I have a hard time finding any art that is good along with a writer- and when you do it's a series with a million covers and makes it difficult to just pick up a copy unless you have a pull list. You should just be able to go into a store, get issues and leave instead of researching first. This is a major reason why manga absolutely destroys, everything clearly labeled by volume, you don't need side stories to get what you paid for. - Plus the price is just too high per issue- 7.99 for 24 pages?? WTF man - If people want to sell keeping it below the price of a coffee should be ideal.
As I look what is happening over the world what is really going on is a you will not have a comic book industry and you will be happy.
Wow. Astounding
Fascinating video,Mr Millar!!!