Biblical Greek grammar: Why this is the best I've found yet for learning NT Greek
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 29 ก.ย. 2024
- I think I found my favorite biblical Greek grammar - at least for beginning Greek. There are a number of reasons why Rodney Decker's grammar is a strong candidate for the best grammar available today if you want to learn NT Greek. In this video, I'll share with you why I love this grammar, what is unique about its approach and why you shouldn't be scared off by its size. But it's not perfect and toward the end of the video, I'll share with you the minor changes I would make if this was my grammar.
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I am currently working through this grammar on my own. One thing I'll say about the lack of answer key is that since most of the exercises are verses from the NT an interlinear NT can function as an answer key.
Is this recommended for those trying to self-learn the language? if not, what would you recommend to someone who is hoping to learn on his/her own? What I gathered from your video is that this is the most thorough Grammar out there. Thank you for your videos, very helpful.
No grammar is perfect, but this would be a great choice for someone self-studying.
@@bma great! I have watched a bunch of your videos in one sitting, they are really good! Keep up the good work!
Thanks! Thank you for watching!
Even without an answer key to the exercises?
I know a little bit about latin having studied it at around a grade one to grade two level. Will that benefit me at all in the study of koine Greek?
It really depends why you want to learn. If you want to get into the classics, you probably want to learn Classical Greek. But if you want to learn to read and study the New Testament then yes, Koine is perfect!
The more languages you already know, the easier it becomes to learn yet another language. Because you are already familiar with many different phenomena of grammar.
As a modern Greek speaker in America learning the koine form, I really appreciate his stated goal; I think that I would really benefit from this, ευχαριστώ!
Love your videos! Just discovered you recently. Looking forward to the arrival of this book on your recommendation. My goal is to read and understand koine to have access to extra biblical texts as well. Hopefully I can start to get access to Patristic fathers and the language or the Ecumenical councils . Hope to enrich my homiletics!
I bought this on your recommendation and agree it’s excellent in its explanations and range of material and vocabulary, but the lack of an answer key is a serious omission which limits its usefulness for self - learners and means it can’t claim to be a one stop shop. Hope Plummer’s new one does include one (preferably in the book)
Few beginning Greek grammars have the answers in the book. But Dr Plummer's will have an answer key. You might find Decker a helpful secondary grammar and benefit from working through Mounce in MNTG in the meantime. :)
Thank for your videos! Is this a god grammar for self-taught learning of NT Greek? I am using Black in the moment and I am not coming forward with it.
You are right about the confusing causing explanation that present tense Greek means present continuous. This is very misleading. Mounce writes clearly that it can be either, depending on the context. This way the reader wont develop a misconception that the English bible when translating present tense, means something else (continuous). We dont have to overanalyze and disassemble quite simple facts of language idioms to teach or learn. It works the same way in English as well, and the traditional translations are fine and consistent. Too much getting into the aspect maybe misleading for this author. I am about half way through it and will finish it indefinitely.
Can you please tell me what books make up the Christian canon. Thanks
I have read and considered this book for my first year class. I found that it is a LOT of material for first year students. I've thought about using it as a summer class after the first year, but fewer and fewer students want to keep going beyond what is required. This is a good video and I may reconsider my decision.
SamLam
It is a privilege to serve. Thank you for your comments!
I read this recently as an intermediate level student. I thought it was great and really helped to reinforce and expand on the things I already knew. It was so good to have recent scholarship incorporated into a beginner's grammar. It is very long and very detailed. I did wonder if it wouldn't be better as a second grammar after working through a shorter beginner's grammar. However I was studying it on my own. With a teacher I imagine it would be very good as a first grammar. I lead a small church group who were taught Greek by another teacher using Dobson and I have recommended that they use Decker as the next book to move on to before tackling Deeper into Greek.
Thanks Graham! I felt that the detail was offset by a) the what you need to know and b) coming back to many points a second time. I think you're right that a teacher would serve this grammar well and that alone a student might miss these structural components.Thanks for watching!
Is there an answer key for the exercises?
I like that approach he is taking with this book.
This is the exact kind of grammar I'm looking for. I personally have a hard time learning languages with several failed attempts at German and Spanish under my belt. But I've always wanted to be able to read the NT (and the LXX as well as the Church Fathers) devotionally in the original language, so the addition of this grammar sounds like a perfect fit. I've got it in Logos and I'm jumping in with both feet this year!
Its a great grammar! Enjoy!
@@bma greek orthodox in church 2000 years use koine greek in all says prays hymns readings never used 2000 years now the erasmius way
Thank you for this video! I am planning on starting to learn koine greek by myself this summer, and I will take this into consideration when buying a grammar. I would like to ask about your opinion on the logos version vs the printed book, what would be the advantages/disadvantages?
You can print/export from Logos which might be handy for workbook sections (I know this is helpful with other workbooks). You can also search the logos version more easily than the physical book, plus it is tagged, making it easier to open linked resources when they are mentioned. But it depends on whether you prefer physical or electronic. Personally with something I'm going to spend this much time with, I like to have both, but that isn't always possible. Thanks for watching!
That’s a very helpful review, really appreciate it!
Thanks Steven!
I think reading Koine Greek is the best goal to have! To be able to read the New Testament and the Septuagint with fluency is my goal. At the moment I am listening to the New Testament whilst walking the dog using LOGOS on my mobile. I am studying the Vocab with Flashcards Pro thanks to MNTG. I have added the book to my wishlist in LOGOS. Will you be moving from Mounce to Decker for Basic Greek?
I'm considering it. I have a few others to look at before I make the decision though.
Thank you for that Great review. If I need to contact you directly or some other way, or if you need to refer me to someone else please feel free to redirect me as this is somewhat lengthy but of the utmost importance....I am a 4th Generation Church leader needing some guidance one where to pick up my Greek studies. I have a BA in bible from 20 yrs ago that included Greek 1 and 2 but dont remember a whole lot. I am an extremely fast learner however.. The heart of what im trying to achieve is understanding the original meanings as closely as possible to the original and as OBJECTIVELY as possible as were the original writings regardless of the implications of where truth would lead me. Ive become appalled at how often Churches are divided based on poor and vague translations. 2. Also someday built on that commitment and passion for truth and accuracy, i will be hiring and funding the worlds leading scholars of like passion for accuracy to the original regardless of what it costs them theologically implicationally etc to create a Digital Interactive English translation that translates so accurately It can ONLY BE INTERPRETED ONE WAY (unless the original word or phrase is truly vague. but even then its still accurate to the original) regardless of how wordy it is BUT since this will only be a digital version and not on paper, then also utilize all interactive technologies and methods (Links, maps, pictures, gifs, sort of like YouVersion but way better) So that a person can choose whether to see the full Complete connotations of what was originally said versus a more concise yet slightly more vague wording than what was originally said. For example: in the beginning God "Created" isn't technically an inaccurate translation depending on the situation, but for my purposes I would want the reader to have access to it saying "in the beginning God created out of nothing…" Since thats What the original writer actually meant by the word he used for "created". I will mostly be funding this project and overseeing it but I want to have enough understanding to have the respect of the scholars I hire AND be able to monitor their own accuracy and objectiveness watching out for conflicts of interest. If this Needs to include even more foundational research, for example, I don't even know how much the Manuscripts agree that our English translations are based on and I want to be able to know that what we are working with is correct or we'll go that route first. So I'm willing to fund whatever it takes to get that as correct as possible, even doing archaeological dig's or something else etc. I believe capitalizing on modern ability for interactive translation can be as far a leap forward in translation as the first english translation was compared to no english translation. (infinite possibilities, maps, visual mindmaps showing time lines etc). Thanks again for your great resources. Would this book be the best place for me to start? I have 1 to 2 hours every Sunday to work on this and prefer to not do anything on paper but as digital as possible
Thanks for your question. Best bet would be to email me at support@masterntgreek.com, and I'll help you out. Blessings!
I have also found the Decker grammar to be excellent, but for self-study it has the significant drawback that the answer key for the exercises doesn’t seem to be available. If I’m wrong about that, I’ll be grateful to anyone who can tell me how to get the answer key.
Thanks for watching! I'm not aware of any either. Thanks for the feedback!
The stated goal of the Grammar is very good. I like it.
Thanks for watching!
1. If your going to teach Greek (and Hebrew for that matter) teach me ALL of it. Don't give me basic or separate basic from intermediate. I want to learn all of it.
2. The purpose of learning Greek and Hebrew any way is so you can study the Bible better.
3. Great so see that the workbook is included in the book. it makes no sense to have them be separate unless your wanting more money.
4. Make it easy to learn and cover everything about tenses and whatever else no matter how obscure. If I'm going to run into it I might as well know it.
5. Personally I think the learn to read Greek book as well as Hebrew should all be included in one book so its a one stop shop for all my needs in case I need to refer back to it.
Thanks for your comments! One thing that can be difficult for students is the sheer amount of information. This is one reason why many grammars don’t have every conceivable piece of information - to prevent the student from being overwhelmed angle giving up before they start. Covering everything and keeping it simple is a huge challenge. I commend you for wanting to know everything!
Apart from my interest in the NT, I'm also linguistics hobbyist, so it's obvious I want to learn Koine in general. I really really love the Rodney Decker book. It's in my view an outstanding example of how any language should be taught. I like the clear and full explanations of things he gives. Many thanks for your videos and God bless you.
Thanks for watching!
I do like the stated goal of this grammar as I would like to be able to read not only the NT in Greek, but also the Apostolic Fathers and possibly even the Septuagint. My access to the LXX has even helped me to confirm my theory on how the name Elisheba (the name of Aaron's wife) became the name Elisabeth (the name of John the Baptist's mother).
Great job brother love your videos!
Welcome, brother! Thanks for watching
Excellent! I studied Mounce on my own years ago before spending a couple years with Porter's Idioms in seminary. I do like Porter's Fundamentals a lot, but it may be too much for a starting student. Seems like Decker and Porter et. al. were working on their grammars at the same time (by publication date), but I think Decker died around that time too? Anyway, I recently familiarized myself with Decker's text and really like it!
The major drawback to me is that Decker's grammar doesn't get student's vocab down to 30 occurrences, where it really should, given its stated goal of reading Koine Greek (where the vast majority of learners will be wanting to start with the NT). 465 words is much better than Mounce, but if Porter and team are having students do ~1000 successfully, there's no reason a beginning grammar as a rule can't get a student down to 30 occurrences *and in addition* still teach some vocab from the Septuagint/patristic lit.
It could be coupled with Decker's Koine Greek Reader. Mathewson and Emig (or Idioms) would be a great year 2 follow-up.
Thanks sharing your comments! I've just put Porter on the list of grammars to review. I agree with you that students could learn more grammar (I actually edited out a comment about this for this video). I have students learn vocab to 50x, then all the remaining words in 1 John in beginning Greek. After that they learn vocab book by book as they read the NT.
As always another great video!!! I just started using Decker and like the way he writes and explains things. Hopefully using both Decker and Mounce will keep me moving forward :)
Awesome! Thank you!
i just bought this on amazon. thank you for your review ❤️
You’re welcome 😊
Using this in my class now -great, book
Great to know! Let me know how you feel about it toward the end!
You’re a life saver brother! Thanks again for these great resources. 👊🏼🙏🏼
Thanks for watching!
Excellent work. I just finished it a few weeks ago.
Nice work! Thanks for watching!
Thanks for the video! I will check this book out for sure!
I wonder if you’ve thought about making a video discussion the difference between the approach of Wallace’s intermediate compared to Mathewson’s and Emig’s. I’m referring to the section in Mathewson’s introduction where he talks about maximalism and minimalism. It would be great to know which school of thought you tend toward and the reasoning behind both?
Hi, you mentioned that this grammar has more vocabularies and that the exercises include texts outside the Greek NT. How else would you say this grammar can be used as second year grammar?
Mostly as a reference. It has usage examples in each chapter that could be used in a second year class. However, I'd probably work with something else like Mathewson and Emig as a second year grammar - though tis would still be helpful as a reference. Decker's explanations are very good.
Thanks for this. I am really learning a lot, especially with verbal aspect.
Thanks Darryl
Thanks for watching!
Ordered, and reading it now. 👍
Awesome! Let me know how you go!
Thank you! This is what I need. I watched a lot of videos while I was searching for koine Greek but they taught with Erasmic pronunciation ☹️. And I realized that a lot of those videos did not show ,for instance, the difference between an aspirated consonant vs an unaspirated consonant, what type of Greek do you teach in your course ? Thank you for your videos.
I teach koine Greek and while I use erasmian, we have students who use modern or reconstructed pronunciation and we get along just fine! Thanks for watching!
I think that I want to buy Decker's book!
I can already read some Greek. I've been working on reading through First Corinthians. So, I am not a novice but still something of a beginner. I've learned enough to know whom this book is for. It's for people like me.
This is a great book for beyond beginning Greek. Decker designed it so it could be used as a reference, so it is a good one to have on your shelf (or in Logos - mntg.me/decker)
I am using Decker's textbook as I try to learn Biblical Greek.
I was recently thinking of going to purchase John Schawandt textbook. Do you have a review on this Greek textbook?
Hi Reece! Not yet but I will review it in the next couple of months!
I found the Summer parsing charts to be very helpful in understanding the points for proper exegesis. I'm considering this book to master the language more than just looking things up in Browns or other sources. It seems if I can read, exegesis shouldn't be a problem or as a problem, it would be self solving. Am I wrong in this?
Grammar is critical for exegesis, but being able to read doesn’t mean you know the grammar well (just ask any English speaker about their usage of prepositions...). Exegetical reading includes solid understanding of the grammar too, and yes, then you’ll find that exegesis is much faster!
Thank you so much for all your videos that you have put out! You have been a major encouragement to me as I’ve been studying Greek for about a year now, and did formally through my MDIV program at Liberty.
I use logos and have bought books there before. Ideally if I had the $$ I would love to have books in electronic and hard copy, but typically I can’t. I think my ultimate preference is hard copy but I do love the portability electronic brings. I noticed this grammar is available on kindle for $28 rather than logos for $50. Do you know if there be some serious drawback to getting the kindle version?
Great question! The main benefit of Logos is the ability to search multiple grammars at once (see this video for an example: th-cam.com/video/PXyIRhww2Z4/w-d-xo.html). Kindle is great for reading, but disconnected from a reference library. So it depends how you expect to use it. 😀
Great video, great grammar. Put Black's "Learn to Read New Testament Greek" on your review list, please.
Done! Thanks for the request - Black’s review is a common request!
Is there a answer key included or available somewhere for the integrated workbook? I’ve been searching online and cannot find an answer
I don't think there is. I think this was intended more as a classroom grammar, so the publisher has some materials available on their site, but I don't recall an answer key.
So how much does he incorporate other Koine texts? Can you characterize the exposure and ability to handle Koine in general versus other grammars that only deal with the New Testament? Great video and very helpful!
Many of the exercises are drawn from outside the New Testament and sit with NT passages. The final result will depend on factors like vocab, so the student will still find the NT the easiest to read, if for no other reason than previous familiarity. Thanks for your comment and for watching!
Thank you for all your videos. I notice in some of you videos (including this one) if ask your viewer if they are aiming to read greek or they are aiming to do exegesis. I am wondering what's the different? Don't we all want to read in order to exegesis?
The process of exegesis requires understanding the relationship between the words. Many don't care about this level of detail and just want to be able to intuitively "know" what the words mean. We do this regularly in our own language if we don't have a lot of clarity about the grammar, so some argue on this basis that this level of knowledge is not necessary. I hope that helps!
Hearing about the novel way to present aspect/tense and the middle voice makes me suggest videos about the latest scholarship and the current issues in studying Koine Greek.
I did a series on verbal aspect last year. You can get an overview here: th-cam.com/video/hCINNdEcDIU/w-d-xo.html
Outstanding! Whets my appetite for the Apostolic Fathers and Septuagint
Yes! We regularly read these in MNTG.
Ευχαριστω πολυ
This book is on sale right now at Logos. I bought it for 34.99.
Good deal!
I always enjoy watching your videos. Thanks.
Thanks for watching!
I am studying for exegesis purpose. It seems all have strengths and weakness es and therefore with control of budgets it becomes a hard decision. I studied Clayton, and Story.
Thanks for letting me know. I have Clayton on the list to review. I haven't come across Story yet. How did you find it?
@@bma Did Greek 1 (Grammar and Vocab) in one semester by one of the professors. and took Greek 2 (translation of 1 and 2 Thessalonians from Greek to English) under another professor. The first did Clayton and the second semester we followed Story. Looking for an opportunity to further my Greek.
I noticed that it appeared you could type answers into the book via electronic book form? or website? Could you elaborate, please?
Yes, where a grammar leaves a blank, Logos Bible software provides a blank space to type and save your work. Some people in MNTG use this approach rather than a physical book.
@@bma That's the way I'll go, then. I already own Logos. Fantastic. Thank you.
I am definitely wanting to learn biblical Greek but I am a little older and it has been years since college and so I worry that it may be too technical for me, Would this be recommended for me or is there something else I should start with?
If you're interested in learning Greek, I have a beginning Greek course starting in August. If you're interested, download my Roadmap to Mastery (mntg.me/roadmap) and you'll hear about it when it comes up. This is easier than learning Greek alone. However, if you really do want to learn alone, then yes, this grammar is a good choice. 😀
Decker explains all grammatical terms and concepts quite extensively, in terms aimed at people who are new to learning any language.
How does this compare to Constantine's Reading Biblical Greek?
It has more detail and takes a very different approach to Campbell and Gibson. Also Decker takes a slightly different view of the Perfect tense form. I reviewed Campbell and Gibson recently.
@@bma Thanks. There is also another one that is pretty new. An Introduction to Biblical Greek Grammar: Elementary Syntax and Linguistics by Dana M Harris. The intro video appeals to me because it says it is designed for the struggling greek student who self studies, someone like me. I've been behind my greek classes in seminary and I'm desperate to catch up so I interested to learn how this would help. Have u done a review of this already? I couldn't find it in your videos. We're using the campbell grammar, which i like but would prefer a grammar that would help with more explanations especially in how the greek grammar relates to english grammar.
I haven’t reviewed that one yet, but I would like to. Thanks for the suggestion!
Any plans to review BibleMesh?
No, but I’ll take a look! What specifically are you thinking?
In the same vein that you review grammars, I was interested in a review of its pedagogical effectiveness. BibleMesh is an online NT Greek course that primarily uses its own lessons (including written text and videos) to teach the language. I suppose it would not be easy to review, though, because it’s not a book you can buy (you’d have to pay for the courses). They also use Ceregro (formerly iKnow) for vocabulary. I’m referring to their Greek Reading courses (the Zondervan courses are Mounce’s BBG). I just would enjoy hearing others’ thoughts on their curriculum and approach, any experiences you have with graduates of their courses, etc. I’m currently taking the courses as a refresher and they’re alright (but I’m not a newcomer to NT Greek so I may not be the best gauge). There are a number of minor spelling errors and some inconsistencies in the materials (e.g., some instructors in the videos use Erasmian pronunciation, some another academic pronunciation, some modern Greek pronunciation; some videos speak only of tense whereas the text will also discuss aspect, etc.) but overall it’s been good for me as a refresher thus far.
Thanks Dan. I don’t know that I would be very partial as my own Master NT Greek Mastery Membership competes with it. Others might be able to comment on the effectiveness though.
Ah yes, I didn’t consider the competition factor. I’m really digging your videos and materials. I intend to print my own GNT soon. I’ll have to dig more and see if I can’t find an LXX text to print also (for all I know you have a video on this I just haven’t stumbled across yet haha)
Hi Darryl, have you ever reviewed "Learn to Read New Testament Greek" by David Alan Black? It could be one to add to your review videos.
No, but it is on my list! Thanks for the suggestion!