Love that card Rick. I’m collecting HOF pitchers and want to pick up a Big Train for my collection. I always appreciate the information you give. Between you and Mangini class is always in session.
Gave a video like. Great Walter Johnson card!! I have been slowly working on completing a Frankenset consisting of mostly vintage cards. I have one card that I have been searching for that is a modern card of a legend which there are ten or less copies of known to exist. One which I know is in another collectors' collection. I have been searching for a copy for some time and have never seen another copy. Even though it's technically manufactured scarcity, I know I may never see one for sale. They all may remain tucked away in collections somewhere. Since it would also be one of the top five most valuable cards in my collection. I would consider it rare. I tend to connect rare with extremely scarce and also valuable. And tend to think of scarce as something that is hard to find yet can still expect to find one and may or may not necessarily be deemed valuable. Just my take, these terms are more individualistic. They don't have clear boundaries because they can be based on personal experiences. I liked hearing you talk about graded pop reports aren't everything, because many may not be graded. Such a great point! Terms can be fun to discuss. Thanks for sharing your thoughts and inviting other perspectives.
Awesome cards, Rick! I love that Walter Johnson! I like that it's an actual photo and not an artists rendition. I live prewar cards, but I'm not ready to dip my toe in at this point. I do think some kind of scale or guide would be nice with prewar. There are so many sets out there. I think any tools we as collectors can use for education is a good thing. Awesome video!
Rick - I love the idea of a Scarcity scale! I think it would be very popular, and a useful reference for all collectors. In fact, I can't believe it hasnt been done already. After all, to own a scarce item is a very special thing, and it is a feeling many collectors seek. I am really glad you started this conversation, Rick. Next, we need to define criteria for different degrees of scarcity. And, no, this does not mean the modern "Superfractor", 5/25/50/199 etc.
Hi Rick! Beautiful cards as always! Really love the Walter Johnson! I think it would be tough to come up with an accurate rarity scale for pre-war cards especially. It would be nearly impossible to find out how many cards were issued originally then to figure out how many are squirreled away in collections. To me if I can’t go out and buy one somewhere within the next week or two it’s at the very least scarce! 🤷🏻♂️
Rick you never cease to amaze with your collection. All of those are beyond incredible and based on the history and numbers I would say extremely rare to borderline extinct. Take care
I’m loving the new display Rick. Lots of cool stuff back there. Very sweet Walter Johnson. Even with a hole in his face.😁 Maybe we need to have a secondary grading company place stickers on slabs, like CAC in the coin world, that signify rare or scarce. Interesting thought my friend.
looking great my very handsome friend! Sorry to see the oddball plates go. Glad to have my friend back where he belongs! In the captains chair of all things oddball! I am going to start using a scarcity & rarity scale with every purchase I make from here on out. I think I'd be better off?
Rick, I love the thoughts. I made a video on this idea and threw out my idea for a scale 2 months ago. You are right on the most challenging part being figuring out how many of a card exist. I have tried to consider the graded population average of a set (on average how many of each card in a set have been graded) to figure out the rarity of a set. There are obviously short prints and other things that come into play, but I found that to balance out the grading disparity between the stars and commons. There is a sort of rarity scale with population reports, but I like the idea of having a way to talk about cards that are in the same range of rarity and to be able to communicate something different when you say the T206 Wagner is rare and the Diaz Cigarettes Walter Johnson is rare.
Love the Diaz Johnson Rick , what a great and an excellent representation of a rare card in my humble opinion. I would be very excited to see a scale of scarce to different degrees of rarity developed but that would be a daunting project to quantify. This would be a great project for you and the new hobby president 😂. LOL
Sweet pickup . Thankful to have a Walter Johnson in my collection now too . Rare is overused/ loosely used term in the hobby today . But that card is most definitely rare
Amazing cards! I usually use the word rare when there are 100 or less and less than 20 is where I consider it super rare or ultra rare, or whatever. How we determine the real population is a good guess of course as you mentioned. Great topic!
Very cool card, Papa Rick. Another I have never seen before today. I agree with your thoughts on rarity. Mangini is just addicted to the word "rare". Haha
Just a beauty! No rarity scale please.....lol....no way to truly gauge it.....Pop Reports very sketchy as many cards have been crossed over from one grading company to the next and maybe back again....many cards dont get slabbed as you mentioned...sales good way but lots of the rare stuff in big collections that never see the light of day....
Great backdrop Rick. Love that Mays and Mathewson are greatly represented. I think a rarity scale is fun and have no issue with using that term. Correct me if I'm misunderstanding, but are you saying that using the term rare for graded cards that collectors would generally not grade should not be applied so strongly? If so, I can somewhat agree. I can agree if the card can be commonly found raw (with a low pop report for that reason). It would be easy for you to go and grade it yourself after buying it. However, a non-star card that is tougher to find raw with a low pop report, I would classify that as rare.
I guess what I’m saying is just because a card has a low pop doesn’t always mean the card is rare. You need to look at the set itself. Might be other factors why that card hasn’t been graded. Like your mays oversized card. I don’t know what the pop is but, I’m sure it’s low. But, because of the size, some collectors will not grade it. You need to research other avenues to figure out its rarity
Is there a best estimate of the number of cards produced? Maybe a reverse logarithmic scale would help. If there’s only 1, then it gets a score of 10. If there are 10, it gets a 9 , down to if there are a billion, it gets a 1. Just an example without much forethought. A 1 of 1 made in 2024 is ineligible to participate. By the way, I loved seeing the “rare” Walter Johnson card!
Very interesting. I wouldn't call Wagner's t206 rare just scarce. Your Walter Johnson obviously rare. I have 3 Tabacelera La Morena cards, Cardinals and Washington team cards total 4 each graded by PSA and SGC and a Pennock /Meadows only 3 graded by SGC. Though they are rare,, not sure how desirable. I just won a 1916 BF2 Ferguson Pennant Jennings on VCP only one has sold in the past. Are they rare or people just do not grade them. Anyway love that Williams never seen it.
The problem with a rarity scale is that there would be no way to gauge what a "rare" card is. Not everyone grades or authenticates their collections. Theres very few cards qualifying for that rare criteria, anyhow. Ironically, on another note, PSA doesnt even authenticate alot of truly rare collectibles, like photo slides, negatives, laserphotos, etc. So basically, theyll authenticate any other photo, but suddenly stopped authenticating laserphotos. How do you accept authenticating a type 1 photo and suddenly stop with the (laserphoto) type III? It seems to me that PSA has a ton of kinks to work out of their authentication methods before even bothering with anything else. Imagine this: you have a type 1 Bird rookie PSA authenticates, then you have a type III of the same photo that PSA rejects. How does this make any sense? Am I missing something here?
@@vintageoddballcards6103 Isn't that concerning, though? Everytime I think PSA is doing better, they take a step back. I've even seen many Jordan photos from the 1980s labeled as 1990s. Their levels of expertise isn't very impressive, especially considering the fact they stopped authenticating laserphotos, and also continue to mislabel alot of photos they authenticate. It just doesn't seem sustainable, and I can't be the only one noticing this as a big problem. Sure, they're rare, but accurate labeling still matters.
Great video and love that Johnson. I’m on the lookout for a Vance from that set. About the topic, David at cardboard history made a great video on this topic th-cam.com/video/4JwmFEVWxyw/w-d-xo.htmlsi=XKcc_4d5INLke6FX
We don't need a rarity scale....we need a ODDBALL scale!
How about an oddball scale for collectors. I can think of plenty of oddball collectors
Love that card Rick. I’m collecting HOF pitchers and want to pick up a Big Train for my collection. I always appreciate the information you give. Between you and Mangini class is always in session.
Hope everything is going well with you and your family. Say hi to your parents for me.
Great vintage cards! Thanks for sharing. Congratulations on the newest addition.
Thanks!
Gave a video like. Great Walter Johnson card!! I have been slowly working on completing a Frankenset consisting of mostly vintage cards. I have one card that I have been searching for that is a modern card of a legend which there are ten or less copies of known to exist. One which I know is in another collectors' collection. I have been searching for a copy for some time and have never seen another copy. Even though it's technically manufactured scarcity, I know I may never see one for sale. They all may remain tucked away in collections somewhere. Since it would also be one of the top five most valuable cards in my collection. I would consider it rare. I tend to connect rare with extremely scarce and also valuable. And tend to think of scarce as something that is hard to find yet can still expect to find one and may or may not necessarily be deemed valuable. Just my take, these terms are more individualistic. They don't have clear boundaries because they can be based on personal experiences. I liked hearing you talk about graded pop reports aren't everything, because many may not be graded. Such a great point! Terms can be fun to discuss. Thanks for sharing your thoughts and inviting other perspectives.
It’s impossible to really come up with a rarity scale
Great pickup, Rick! You know I LOVE that card!
Glad to see you back in the card room. Would love to see more items you have on display in future videos.
Thanks!
Awesome cards, Rick! I love that Walter Johnson! I like that it's an actual photo and not an artists rendition. I live prewar cards, but I'm not ready to dip my toe in at this point. I do think some kind of scale or guide would be nice with prewar. There are so many sets out there. I think any tools we as collectors can use for education is a good thing. Awesome video!
I hope to come up with some kind of scale. Love doing the research. Thanks for watching
Awesome Diaz Johnson Rick! Congrats on the pickup! Really liked the Ruth and Joe D as well!! Thanks for sharing!
Thanks Darren!
Rick - I love the idea of a Scarcity scale! I think it would be very popular, and a useful reference for all collectors. In fact, I can't believe it hasnt been done already. After all, to own a scarce item is a very special thing, and it is a feeling many collectors seek. I am really glad you started this conversation, Rick. Next, we need to define criteria for different degrees of scarcity. And, no, this does not mean the modern "Superfractor", 5/25/50/199 etc.
lol no superfractors!
Amazing cards Rick! Love the Walter Johnson card as well as the Propagandas cards!
Thanks Jason!
Hi Rick. Wow, what a real beauty. Thanks for sharing my friend. Talk soon pal.
Thanks! It’s not a Jackie but it’s the next best thing
Incredible Johnson card, congratulations on the rare pickup. Thank you for sharing the beautiful Cuban issues.
I thought you might like the card. I’m really happy to add it to my collection
Hi Rick! Beautiful cards as always! Really love the Walter Johnson! I think it would be tough to come up with an accurate rarity scale for pre-war cards especially. It would be nearly impossible to find out how many cards were issued originally then to figure out how many are squirreled away in collections. To me if I can’t go out and buy one somewhere within the next week or two it’s at the very least scarce! 🤷🏻♂️
Thanks Jim! It would be very tough
Hey Hey my friend! Nice to see a video! Always enjoyed your content! Happy collecting all!
I appreciate the kind words.
Rick you never cease to amaze with your collection. All of those are beyond incredible and based on the history and numbers I would say extremely rare to borderline extinct. Take care
Thanks David! I’m glad you took the time to watch. Hope you have a great rest of the week
Awesome discussion! THanks for sharing and showing. I think that rare would also depend on a persons collecting habits as well.
Yes! Everybody is going to have an opinion on what is rare. It’s impossible to tell how many cards are really out there
Let Mangini take on that project Rick. He can put a rare to super rare stickers on the back of slabs. Awesome card.
lol yes all we need is a Mangini sticker on a card
I’m loving the new display Rick. Lots of cool stuff back there. Very sweet Walter Johnson. Even with a hole in his face.😁 Maybe we need to have a secondary grading company place stickers on slabs, like CAC in the coin world, that signify rare or scarce. Interesting thought my friend.
Yes more stickers on slabs. Lol
@@vintageoddballcards6103 😂
looking great my very handsome friend! Sorry to see the oddball plates go. Glad to have my friend back where he belongs! In the captains chair of all things oddball! I am going to start using a scarcity & rarity scale with every purchase I make from here on out. I think I'd be better off?
@@BringingTheHeat-VBC yep! If it’s not rare it’s worthless
Great background Rick.
The Johnson card is fantastic. I would love to talk to you more about the rarity topic.
Thanks John!
Rick, I love the thoughts. I made a video on this idea and threw out my idea for a scale 2 months ago. You are right on the most challenging part being figuring out how many of a card exist. I have tried to consider the graded population average of a set (on average how many of each card in a set have been graded) to figure out the rarity of a set. There are obviously short prints and other things that come into play, but I found that to balance out the grading disparity between the stars and commons. There is a sort of rarity scale with population reports, but I like the idea of having a way to talk about cards that are in the same range of rarity and to be able to communicate something different when you say the T206 Wagner is rare and the Diaz Cigarettes Walter Johnson is rare.
@@cardboardhistory thanks! Yes! Somebody pointed out your video in the comments.
Bring back the plates !! 😂😂😂 awesome pick up Rick and love if there was a scale for scarcity 👊👊
lol
Love the Diaz Johnson Rick , what a great and an excellent representation of a rare card in my humble opinion. I would be very excited to see a scale of scarce to different degrees of rarity developed but that would be a daunting project to quantify. This would be a great project for you and the new hobby president 😂. LOL
Thanks Doug! I really enjoyed your video with Dan. Wow! You got a great collection of Joe wood cards
@vintageoddballcards6103 Thanks Rick !!
Sweet pickup . Thankful to have a Walter Johnson in my collection now too . Rare is overused/ loosely used term in the hobby today . But that card is most definitely rare
Thanks Adam!
Amazing cards! I usually use the word rare when there are 100 or less and less than 20 is where I consider it super rare or ultra rare, or whatever. How we determine the real population is a good guess of course as you mentioned. Great topic!
Thanks! I going to come up with some kind of scale. Stay tune. lol
Wow Rick what a find! Extremely rare card - never seen these before! Congratulations on the rare find!!
Thanks!
Very cool card, Papa Rick. Another I have never seen before today. I agree with your thoughts on rarity. Mangini is just addicted to the word "rare". Haha
He is! I’m becoming an alcoholic watching his videos
Great card. Dazzy Vance's rookie is in this set....as is Ted Lyons, I believe.
Yep! Thanks for watching
Great cards Rick! Like the new background!
Thanks Scott!
Great looking image on that Big Train. I never saw anything from that set
Thanks Joe!
Awesome find right there, congrats!!!
Thanks Brad! Sorry about your Dolphins.
Well done my friend
Great rare oddball cards Rick.
That is a beautiful fruitcake card! 😂
Iol
great card. I would love a rarity scale !!
Thanks! I might come up with something
Nice new background! Interesting set.
Thanks!
Let’s creat that scale Rick!
So ironic, Rick. I just bought a diaz cigarros card the other day and it's on the way! Common player, but rare!!!!
@@the_card_closet Wow! Congrats!
Just a beauty! No rarity scale please.....lol....no way to truly gauge it.....Pop Reports very sketchy as many cards have been crossed over from one grading company to the next and maybe back again....many cards dont get slabbed as you mentioned...sales good way but lots of the rare stuff in big collections that never see the light of day....
I agree 100%
Very cools card nice video
Thanks!
I would definitely use a rarity scale....but at the same time, don't care enough to put it together myself.
Great backdrop Rick. Love that Mays and Mathewson are greatly represented. I think a rarity scale is fun and have no issue with using that term.
Correct me if I'm misunderstanding, but are you saying that using the term rare for graded cards that collectors would generally not grade should not be applied so strongly? If so, I can somewhat agree.
I can agree if the card can be commonly found raw (with a low pop report for that reason). It would be easy for you to go and grade it yourself after buying it. However, a non-star card that is tougher to find raw with a low pop report, I would classify that as rare.
I guess what I’m saying is just because a card has a low pop doesn’t always mean the card is rare. You need to look at the set itself. Might be other factors why that card hasn’t been graded. Like your mays oversized card. I don’t know what the pop is but, I’m sure it’s low. But, because of the size, some collectors will not grade it. You need to research other avenues to figure out its rarity
Good video
Thanks
Is there a best estimate of the number of cards produced? Maybe a reverse logarithmic scale would help. If there’s only 1, then it gets a score of 10. If there are 10, it gets a 9 , down to if there are a billion, it gets a 1. Just an example without much forethought. A 1 of 1 made in 2024 is ineligible to participate. By the way, I loved seeing the “rare” Walter Johnson card!
Thanks Rick! I’m going to attempt the impossible
Very interesting. I wouldn't call Wagner's t206 rare just scarce. Your Walter Johnson obviously rare. I have 3 Tabacelera La Morena cards, Cardinals and Washington team cards total 4 each graded by PSA and SGC and a Pennock /Meadows only 3 graded by SGC. Though they are rare,, not sure how desirable. I just won a 1916 BF2 Ferguson Pennant Jennings on VCP only one has sold in the past. Are they rare or people just do not grade them. Anyway love that Williams never seen it.
Congrats on the Ferguson pennant. Your right it’s tough to determine what is truly rare
There's only 1 rick...you are rare my friend
lol
Do we really need a Mangini Meter for how rare these cards are? 🤪
No we don’t!!!
The problem with a rarity scale is that there would be no way to gauge what a "rare" card is. Not everyone grades or authenticates their collections. Theres very few cards qualifying for that rare criteria, anyhow. Ironically, on another note, PSA doesnt even authenticate alot of truly rare collectibles, like photo slides, negatives, laserphotos, etc. So basically, theyll authenticate any other photo, but suddenly stopped authenticating laserphotos. How do you accept authenticating a type 1 photo and suddenly stop with the (laserphoto) type III? It seems to me that PSA has a ton of kinks to work out of their authentication methods before even bothering with anything else. Imagine this: you have a type 1 Bird rookie PSA authenticates, then you have a type III of the same photo that PSA rejects. How does this make any sense? Am I missing something here?
Thanks for your comments. Yes photos are difficult for even the experts to evaluate. I sure Henry Yee misses all the time.
@@vintageoddballcards6103 Isn't that concerning, though? Everytime I think PSA is doing better, they take a step back. I've even seen many Jordan photos from the 1980s labeled as 1990s. Their levels of expertise isn't very impressive, especially considering the fact they stopped authenticating laserphotos, and also continue to mislabel alot of photos they authenticate. It just doesn't seem sustainable, and I can't be the only one noticing this as a big problem. Sure, they're rare, but accurate labeling still matters.
Great video and love that Johnson. I’m on the lookout for a Vance from that set. About the topic, David at cardboard history made a great video on this topic th-cam.com/video/4JwmFEVWxyw/w-d-xo.htmlsi=XKcc_4d5INLke6FX
Thanks for sending me the link. I’ll check out the video.