Stealing first base is technically still possible. Here's how.
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 7 ก.ย. 2024
- One guy kept stealing first base until MLB said no more. Well, sort of. They could've made this all so much easier for everyone, but we'll explain.
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Someone on my team once stole second but thought the ball was foul so he went back to first and the defense didn’t know what to do. He wasn’t deliberately confusing the defense, making a travesty of the game, and the pitcher was not in pitching position, so I think that he legally stole first base.
This exact thing happen to an opponent once; for some reason the first base coach for whatever reason decided to wait until after the next pitch to tell him it wasn’t foul
I did this once too lol. The funniest thing is that it was the opening game of the season and I was the first baserunner
@@tobyespinoza253 if I remember correctly my first base coach told him and the umpire allowed him to have second base. It was maybe the weirdest thing I’ve seen in a baseball game before
What did the batter do?
I did this before too in JV ball. Most embarrassing moment of my baseball life. It was a 1st and 3rd situation and I swear I heard a foul ball (we used metal bats, so the sound was very obvious). Maybe there was someone in the batting cage near us? Idk, but regardless I just started trotting back to 1st base, and was none the wiser. I tried stealing 2nd again the next pitch, this time is was _actually_ a foul ball. My manager then screamed "[NAME], STAY THERE!!!!!!"
I literally had no idea why I was getting yelled at. I figured it out two pitches later when I asked the first basemen what had happened lol.
From then on, I always forced the umpire to tell me to go back to first base.
I remember reading about Schaefer when I was a kid. His story of stealing first base was in a book called “The Giant Book of Strange but True Sports Stories” The book also has a bunch of the other stories told by SB
Loved that book
Musta read that book 100 times as a kid. Great cartoon drawings inside.
Uhoh ... You've figured out Secret Base's source material!
You the author?
thanks for stating the source material
If this rule didn't exist, the 2021 Pirates would've definetly have done this. They seem to have a thing for 1st base.
Man I’m just trying to watch a fun video, no need to call my miserable lifeless franchise out
absolutely brutal but fair
I used to go to pirates games all the time with my dad when i was a kid, and his boss had given us his box seats (looking back on it, I realize why he never wanted to go). We must've gone to like 20 games. I can't be sure, but i wouldnt be surprised if won none
Don't forget, in 2001 the Pirates manger DID steal first
@@vjm212 I was born in 2001. I didn't know about that.
Of course it’s possible, Tim Locastro knows how to steal first!
He's pretty much everybody's "favorite weird player" nowadays!
Unfortunately he can't hit, but I mean you gotta love everything else about the guy though?
@@JWex-jy7sk i was sad because i loved him but then he went to the yankees but he redeemed himself by going to the red skx
Baseball bits
@@theforbiddensauce ah yes the red skx’s
He's an international art thief and MUST BE STOPPED!
for those wondering about stealing first off an error/wild pitch/etc, MLB doesn't score that as a stolen base. the base acquisition is scored as a passed ball/wild pitch/error
Thanks I was wondering about that
It has to be a dropped third strike for the runner to take first without putting the ball in play, which then is scored as both a strikeout (for batter and pitcher) and either a wild pitch or passed ball.
Reaching first on a fielding error is just a regular error.
It's also called a strike out.
Thanks, buddy. Answered my question before I even finished typing it! 😁👍🏻
Well of course. Tim locastro has been able to steal first base for years now.
Cue the Captain America “I understood that reference!”
Thank Summoning Salt for that fact 😀
@@bluntizard4481 lol I love this. Salt is goated btw.
A person of culture, I see
When he was in the Blue Jays minor league system my buddy used to call him 'Lean In' Locastro which is pure gold.
Not only could he have stolen 3 bases in the same inning, he could have, if he stole third and home, stolen 5 bases on one trip around the bases.
So…since the extra innings runner starts on 2nd, does that mean they could steal 1st since they technically didn’t previously occupy 1st?
Yay another loophole !
Please tell me you’ve broken into the world of coaching over the past year. It is your duty to make this happen.
Lloyd Moseby in 1987 stole second. The throw was so bad high that he thought it was a hit ball to center field. He went back to first base because he thought he had to tag up.
Unfortunately, the throw to first was also wild and he ended up back at second.
Why was this not brought up!?!?
The “making a travesty of the game” part of the rule basically makes it so intentionally stealing first from second is always an out, but accidentally doing it is okay.
The reason there isn't a blanket rule that says the runner can't go back to a previous base once they reach a subsequent base is in case the runner believes they missed touching a previous base. It's not really relevant for stealing, but if the runner advances from first to third on a base hit but thinks they missed touching second, even if they _DIDN'T_ miss second, they will try to return to second to ensure they are no longer in peril. Doing so in that situation isn't an attempt to confuse the defense or make a travesty of the game; it's ensuring you aren't put out for missing a base. This wording allows a runner to make a good-faith mistake and not be penalized for it, because running back to second in that situation puts the runner in peril again, and they can be tagged out even if they had legally occupied third base. Yes, sometimes baseball rules seem confusing or oddly worded with just a cursory reading, but there are generally specific reasons why the rules are worded the way they are.
“generally specific” is a beautifully confusing phrase. Thank you for that explanation though!
@@bernier42 I didn't catch that when I typed it...but I intended 'generally' in this case to mean "usually" rather than "non-specifically." I should have chosen my words more carefully. lol
That makes sense, as far as it goes, but I don't think the rule should exist at all. Why shouldn't a runner be permitted, under any circumstances (except after reaching home), to return to a previous base?
@@kqatsi Well, I supposed specifically to prevent runners from creating the scenario described in the video. Prior to that, it's likely no one considered the need for a rule to tell runners they can't go back to bases they'd previously occupied because no one could envision a reason any runner would _want_ to return to a previous base. I guess I envision it as similar to someone hitting the ball over the fence and deciding they'd rather just hold up at third base rather than running all the way around the bases to score a run. (Actually, I'm pretty sure the rules require the runner to touch all four bases and exit the field if they hit a fair ball out of play in the air as long as the ball has travelled at least 250' from home plate...but the idea is similar; doing something less productive for your team just because there isn't a rule that tells you not to.) But, yeah, returning to a previous base is almost always going to be a less optimal choice than advancing to the next base, so if a runner wants to do it, why not let them? As a player, I'd be all for an opponent wanting to run from second to first, giving my team another opportunity to throw them out.
@@frocat5163 Yeah, I hear you. Running backwards would generally not make any sense for the hitting team, so I don't see any reason not to let them. My guess is that the situation described in the video was just a nuisance. Perhaps the batting team felt they were more likely to score that runner from third if they baited a throw from the catcher on a steal than if they just tried to hit him home. That strategy just doesn't make any sense in the contemporary context, particularly because running back to first puts the back-stealing runner at a high risk of getting caught going back. Anyway, I'm generally in favor of a fewer-rules, wild-west approach (e.g., no infield fly rule, no infield shift ban, etc.) unless a rule is truly necessary to preserve some fundamental aspect of the game, and this seems like one that's just not necessary.
The delivery of "They would have to, it's a security risk" was perfect. Well played
At first I thought it be just casually walking to first without taking a swing at the bat.
I mean players on base can take off whether the batter swings or not, so why not the batter too? Just take off as he is about to throw. It wouldn't work at all unless you confused the catcher enough to make him not catch the pitch. Which actually if you across him you might actually pull that off
@@The2ndGrimReaper or if the catcher breaks something while he is catching... or even if they decide to throw to 3rd instead
The Atlantic League is testing a rule that any hitter can steal first base after a wild pitch
Can the "zombie runner" steal first in extra innings? They started the inning on second base, they never previously occupied first!
I think you're on to something.
Especially if your best hitter was up. Then you're dissuading an intentional walk and not confusing the defense.
@@ericarechiga9752 It only dissuades the intentional walk by giving the defense what they wanted in the first place (set up for a double play or at least a force-out on the lead runner) without needing to take the cost of adding an additional baserunner. If the batter is so superior that an intentional walk would have been a consideration, the defense can still take this option with a runner at first and they are no worse off than if the lead runner had just stayed at second the whole time. And if they do decide to pitch to the batter anyway, an RBI is less likely since the lead runner has retreated out of "scoring position." This "tactic" of retreating to first only gives the defense more options and advantages.
I have been binging the hell out of this series, favorite on the whole channel.
Weird Rules first got me into Secret Base, now I love all their content!
If the runner stole 2B and mistakenly believed there had been a foul ball or the batter struck out for the third out of the inning, and headed back to 1B, and the defence was asleep at the wheel, you could have a situation where there is no attempt to confuse or cause travesty.
Also could happen if the runner in front of them gets in a run down and they go back to first to make space at second for them
@@CinemaDemocratica if he is going back because he thought there is a foul ball then he isn’t giving himself up. He isn’t conceding that he is out
Lloyd Mosbey did exactly what they said at the end when he stole 2nd twice in one play for the Blue Jays in '87. He stole 2nd but the throw sailed into the outfield, he didn't know where the ball was and assumed it was fouled off so he started jogging back to first. Halfway there he realizes the mistake and books it back to first while the outfielder tries to throw him out. That throw then gets away and Mosbey goes back to 2nd.
Foolish Baseball fans are going to ruthlessly attack this comment section with “Tim Locastro”
I think there’s a real way to pull this off. Runners on 2nd and 3rd. Before the pitcher comes set, The guy on 2nd kinda stumbles and falls onto the dirt inbetween 1st and 2nd, and the pitcher throws to the shortstop covering second. That runner is now in a pickle, the guy at third takes off for home, and the defense throws home to try and get him out. the other runner is closer to first and unable to advance, so he returns to first. Now we have 1st and 3rd, 1st and an out, or 1st and a run, depending on how the throw to the catcher goes
I suggested the Segura thing in the comments of a Weird Rules video a long time ago. I'm a Brewers fan and watched that game live. It's my single favorite thing that one of my teams has done while I was watching live, and that now includes both my NFL team (Packers) winning a Super Bowl and my NBA team (Bucks) winning the Finals. If the Brewers never win a World Series in my lifetieme, I'll always have Jean Segura stealing first. I don't know if my comment was responsible or not, but either way I'm very happy that this video got made.
“Gave up second” is more accurate…
Back in ‘93 my friend Hillary gave up second
It’s called a defensive indifference, and is not counted as a steal if it’s clear it was given up
All this talk about stealing 1st base reminded me of an infamous play involving Lloyd Moseby. He was on 1st base, goes for 2nd base, the catcher throws the ball into centre field, Moseby gets confused and doesn't know where the ball is, retreats back to fist base while the centre fielder is retrieving the ball, steals 1st base, the centre fielder throws the ball away, and Moseby goes back to 2nd base, stealing 3 bases on the same play, 1st base once, and 2nd base twice. One of the strangest plays I remember, along with the infamous Alfredo Griffon "hurry up offince" strikeout where he intentionally chased a wild pitch to get a rainy day game past the 5th so if it got rained out it would count as a Blue Jays win, rather then starting over with a makeup game in a later double header.
Can we get a rewinder for Flyers vs Bruin 2010 ECSF, Flyers become 3rd team in NHL history to come back from 0-3 series deficit to win it in 7, series had amazing classic moments, Bruins game 1 OT win, Gagne coming back from foot surgery to score in game 4 OT, Flyers shared shutout in game 5, Flyers coming back from down 0-3 in the first period of game 7 to win it 4-3, historic series with so many classic moments
As someone with a rudimentary knowledge of baseball, it's the "still" that blows my mind.
8:02
"The runner may not return to a previously occupied base..."
So if the runner is placed on 2nd at the start of an extra inning, as a time saving measure, and therefore 1st was *never* occupied...
Jimmy Piersall once tried to circle the bases in reverse order on a home run but they wouldn't let him, so he just ran backwards.
If the player starts an extra inning on 2nd, could he steal 1st since he hadn't legally acquired title to it?
I was watching that game live, and this play made me incredibly happy precisely because I knew, years later, someone would make a retrospective about the dumbest thing I have ever seen happen in a baseball game. 😂😂
Germany Schaefer was one of the early 1900s baseball's great characters. In addition to this story he once slid into every base after hitting a walk off home run. He was once ejected from a game because of an incident in the off season in which he scared a drunk umpire. And during the 1907 World Series he asked a question that the commissioner wouldn't answer that would become relevant thanks to him.
I'd have to imagine he was hit by a pitch the next time he faced the team after sliding into every base after the walk off HR
@@jonathanzuckerberg8850 He actually said he was going to hit a home run to the crowd before he did it and the first pitch in that at bat was right at him IIRC.
So once there was someone on first, and they hit the ball to me at shortstop, and I was about to throw the ball to second before I realized he was already there, so I threw it to first base and got the out. So the runner at 2nd was safe. Although he thought he was out for some reason, and started running back to the first base dugout, then our defense and the runner realized that he could be tagged at the same time, and since he was running to the dugout and was closer to 1st base, he just went back to 1st. He was also way out of the baseline, although I'm not sure how that rule applies here. He ended up being called safe and wondering if that is the correct call? He didn't seem to try to do it to confuse the defense, and the pitcher never got back onto the mound to assume his pitching motion, so I guess it seems legal?
I think the *one* situation in which stealing first would still be legal as the rules are written is if in the exact same Braun/Segura situation, the trail runner (i.e. Braun) would have gotten to second, seen the lead runner and the ball coming back towards the bag, noticed that no one was covering first, been aware of the specificity of the rules, and took off to run back there before the ball and runner made it back to second and then made it in safely, rather than just holding at second as Braun actually did. No travesty whatsoever, since you're just trying to save an out. Lorenzo Cain (what is it with the Brewers?) did something almost exactly like this in a two-man rundown once but it doesn't count as a stolen base because it came off of a batted ball rather than a double steal: th-cam.com/video/-PHZmYYjytU/w-d-xo.html
My initial thought to the question «how does one steal first» was to start running before the pitch, the pitcher pitches a pitch to get a strike then the batter mid-run yeets the bat and hits the ball. I don’t know if that’s legal but I love the idea
Stepping out of the box when time isn't called seems very illegal
In Rule 5.09(b)(10) the "making travesty of the game" was later added because Jimmy Piersall celebrated a homerun by running the bases backward and would do all other types of stunts. He later payed homage to this when he hit his 100th career homerun and ran the bases running backward.
I think "making a travesty of the game" makes sense if you think about the time period. The business was a lot more like a promotion back then.. Imagine if your friend convinced you to pay money to see this new tennis league and one of the competitors in the match is clowning around and clearly not that bothered about whether he wins the match. Avoiding that kind of public reputation was something baseball was extremely serious about, with lifetime bans for match fixing and all of that. I think there was a fear back then that running the bases backwards would make the crowd think the players weren't taking it seriously and feel ripped off.
This rule was written with children in mind. How many times does a kid get confused and run the wrong way? They're not "trying to confuse the defense" when they, themselves, are confused.
How many children play in the MLB? I am pretty sure youth leagues have their own rulebooks.
I just binge watched so many weird rules from years ago..so glad to catch one as it dropped 🔥🔥
I don’t know if I should laugh as hard as I do at these 😆 alot of nerd jokes and witty humor
I love it, you’re only allowed to do it if you have no idea what’s going on. A perfect tule
Really enjoyed when Ryan did Weird Rules, but Clara has such witty comments. I laugh out loud every time she's on. Love this series!
Collapse: how the Montreal canadiens failed to reach sniffing distance of Lord Stanley for 28 years
Rewinder: the 2006 champions league final that kickstarted one of the greatest eras in Barcelona history
Untitled: Ted Williams
Untitled: Gilbert Perrault
Untitled: Johan Cruyff never winning a World Cup
Rewinder: the miracle of Istanbul
Untitled: Jeremy Roenick
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Collapse: how the Chicago White Sox went from sweeping the Astros in the World Series to not even making the playoffs for a decade and a half
Heck, you could do an Untitled: Fenway Left Fielders. Williams, Yaz, Rice. Three Hall of Famers in a row patrolling in front of the Green Monster for the better part of fifty years (1939-1989). Only 4 World Series appearances in total (1946, 1967, 1975, 1986) between them: 0-4 Record (In fact, the ONLY 4 losses the Red Sox have in the World Series. 9-0 in their other appearances between 1903-1918 and 2004-2018).
That White Sox one would be good. That 2005 turned out to be an anomaly
Collapse: How the Packers blew the NFC Championship Game (Multiple)
@@E-Brightvoid They’re still contending so no. Collapses are mainly for when teams from contenders to rebuilding
Now I’m theory crafting this; what if a base runner didn’t TOUCH second base, but took a lead off and stole backwards during the next pitch (assuming a runner has been on third and were trying to bait a throw)
If I haven’t touched second base, I haven’t legally acquired it right? Or am I making a travesty of the game
the Brewers had a semi-related version of this even more recently with Lorenzo Cain and I think Christian Yelich (?) caught in another one of those traffic jams at 2nd base but Cain was I guess, the one player that knows the rules about occupying a same base so he just told Yelich to come back to second and took off to first because nobody was covering there anymore because baseball is a funny sport
My proposed scenario is a runner steals second, slides into the bag, and is declared safe. But he's in an awkward position from the slide, and so when he goes to stand back up (assuming time hasn't been called), he kinda of trips and falls off the bag, back towards first. At the same time, the second baseman never actually threw the ball back to the pitcher, as he has noticed that time wasn't called he's waiting to try and get an out on the hidden ball trick. But when the runner trips, he ends up far enough away from the bag such that when the second baseman tries to tag him, he misses and the runner, seeing first open, takes off back to first to get away from the defender with the ball.
so glad weird rules is making a comeback!! my favorite
This coulda been awesome. Steal 2nd, abandon stealing 3rd, steal 1st, steal 2nd, steal 3rd, steal home... if he'd only not gotten caught his 3rd time at 2nd base...
It has to be legal to steal first in case there is a double steal and the lead guy is caught out as the follower reaches the next base. It needs to be legal for both runners to assume their previous bases, else the defense gets an out merely because the follower is too good at stealing bases, which isn't in the spirit of the game.
The updated rule covers every situation where stealing first could be exploited. If the play is over, you must try to advance, not run backwards to exploit some crazy edge case.
Some people play for the love of the game, others play for the love of first base ❤️
More baseball videos please!
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Rewinder: Hemric’s xfinity title from last week. The full context to that whole story is insane
Rewinder: Both of Tracy Porter’s interceptions in the 2009 NFCCG and Super Bowl 44
I think that since it says "previously occupied" if you were to hit a double, and you never stopped a first but just ran right through, you could argue that you never occupied first base.
"if I did something that got into a book, I would do it every day!"
That's a pretty solid approach to life.
On my baseball team, someone stole 2nd but thought they were out so they went back to the dugout on the first base side. Once they realized they were safe they went to first which was the closest bag to the dugout.
At the end, replace "wallet" with "scouting report" and you bet Kevin Kiermaier would be stealing first!
Here's what I don't understand about the original German McGerman example -- why did the catcher fall for the double steal the second time they tried it? I mean, he saw what they were doing on the first try, two minutes earlier. Did he forget?
is anyone else old enough to remember a player named Jimmy Rollins? He was one of the best best stealers ive seen
Suppose Segura was taking off for third, sees the throw to third and runs back to second. However, seeing Braun running to second and not wanting to have two runners on second at the same time, Segura runs to first. Now let’s say the third baseman throws to second but whichever defender is covering doesn’t apply the tag on Braun in time. Segura then safely makes it back to first. He didn’t do it to make a travesty of the game but to avoid an out and possibly two. I don’t know Braun passing Segura on the base paths would apply but even if it did, Segura would still be safe given the current rule.
Well this just brings up another, different question:
Can you steal second, starting at third?
Obviously there is NO situation in which you would even want to do this, but... could you? Assuming there wasn't a teammate already on the bag.
Maybe if you were on the barry bonds SF Giants. Theres 0 or 1 outs runners on 1st and 3rd and the opponents probably walk him, but if you steal second maybe the opposition decides to pitch to him in that scenario since the sac fly is gone.
As long as the pitcher hasn't assumed his position and the decision to run back to second isn't made to confuse the defense or make a travesty of the game, yes, you could return to second from third. I can't think of a single scenario where doing so would be beneficial for your team, though. Doing so sets up additional double-play opportunities or the possibility of an infield fly (assuming there's no more than one out).
And, as @InsaneisEpic points out, the only time it might make a little sense is if your team's next batter is an incredible homerun or deep-ball threat who's highly unlikely to hit into a double play or infield fly and is almost certain to be walked if there are only runners at the corners. Even then it wouldn't be a good baseball decision. It's almost always better to have the bases loaded with 0 or 1 out after an intentional walk than to have runners on 1st and 2nd with 0 or 1 out and a power hitter in the box who might be walked to load the bases.
I've seen a few teams intentionally balk a runner from 2nd to 3rd if they had a multi run lead so the runner wouldn't get a view if the catcher's signs so maybe that's a scenario where you would try it
Assuming the pitcher has not returned to pitching position, there is maybe one scenario. A runner successfully advances to third, but overslides a hook slide (a slide designed to avoid a tag). The fielder comes off the bag in the direction of home plate, perhaps to recover a bobbled ball. The runner, unable to beat the fielder back to third base, runs back to an unoccupied second base. I'm not convinced this scenario ever would happen where you wouldn't just take your chances crawl-diving back to third, or where you wouldn't be ruled as having failed to re-touch third after passing it, but maybe.
In 2021, you could technically surrender 2nd base and steal 1st (before the pitcher is set) and BLAME the travesty on the other team- for getting clowned so hard that a runner got away with that. It should function as a mercy rule or a golden snitch: an automatic end to the game: a revelation of what was a travesty all along. It should occur if the runner re-steals 2nd, especially
There is a way to steal first base… it’s a dropped third strike. Tim Locastro has done it loads of times
I'm pretty sure runners aren't credited with stolen bases unless they're on the 'new' base the next time the pitcher assumes the pitching position. E.g. runner on first breaks for second, touches 2nd base bag ahead of throw, but overslides bag and is tagged out before regaining contact with the bag is not a stolen base. Runners can retreat to a previous base (until the pitcher is ready to pitch) which would normally only happen to prevent multiple runners on one base, but it is really stretching the definition to call this 'stealing'.
this is old news to my favorite weird player, Tim Lacastro
It says you can't do if to confuse the defense. It doesn't say anything about trying to confuse the offense... Big brain plays to confuse your own team...
That brewers 1st base coach was ahead of his time. He saw the whole thing and the smallest window of opportunity to game the system.
Me: *trying to explain to the ref that I'm the Bowser of baseball and my top speed in running only works if I start at first base rather then staying on second*
5:00 braun not even paying attention. he arrives so casually and satisfiedly at second. bro, this is MLB.
"If you love a base, set it free...if you can steal it again, it's yours; if not, it never was."
I wish they could really steal first. Pitcher makes a wild pitch, or the catcher just misses the ball, then the batter just hauls ass to first without being hit by pitch walked or hitting the ball. That would be fun
I think the reason they don’t outright say it because the runner from 1st in the 2013 clip got to second and was safe but then could get off second and run back to first before the pitcher got back to the mound making him steal second then first. Think this actually happens pretty commonly
5:38 peak video editing, bravo
If you look up box scores and play by play recaps of that Segura game (4/19/13), some of them will say he was thrown out trying to steal third because the programs used to compile play-by-play simply can't compute the turn of events that happened. Baseball-reference's box score - along with a detailed explanatory paragraph at the top of the page - says "Braun caught stealing 2B, Segura advances to 1B" which really kinda shows why the paragraph up top is there. Who could make sense of that?
5:21 Love that Maxwell Divergence of magnetic field equals zero
Can you do a video about how in the CFL you can win by missing a field goal?
Hey Clara. So Herman Schaefer is very veeeeeerry German. Not in the S-tier category of "Thomas Müller" or "Martin Schmitt", but its at least a upper A-Tier old German name
It’s no Otto von Bismarck but certainly Schaefer is about as German as it gets, seeing as it means shepherd in German.
to her credit, I (Will) am capable of making any name/word sound not anything like its place of origin because I spent too long in Texas
@@SecretBaseSBN All in good fun 😊
Hey Secret Base, I got a great Collapse idea for a future video, can we get a Collapse on the San Antonio Spurs dynasty as I haven’t seen something fall apart this dramatically in years that followed
Best TH-cam channel ever!
I would assume the reason they don't just have a "you can't run the other way" rule is that you could have a situation where a runner believes a catch was made in the outfield after reaching the next base and goes to tag up but it was actually caught on the hop or something.
With the specific rules, he is fine if he goes back. If it said "once you legally acquire a base you can't go back" and nothing more, he would be out.
Schaefer or Schäfer as we Germans would spell it literally means shepherd and is a very common surname in german speaking countries
I would argue that the original reason for stealing first is neither trying to confuse the defence nor making a travesty of the game.
The move to steal second in the hope of also stealing home is just bait, not confusion. The defence can choose whether to take that bait or not. It's clearly a legitimate thing to do.
So that act of stealing first is not done FOR THE PURPOSE of confusing anyone, it's simply a strategic decision to increase their tactical options. (It probably will cause confusion, but that's not the reason for doing it).
Given all that, I also can't see how it's making a travesty of the game - every attempt to steal forward or back has risk associated with it, so it's not like it's a loophole giving them a freebie. It's all just tactics.
I feel like "stealing first" is a known term. Dropped tip, batter takes off for first, etc. This feels more like "takebacksies". Like "You made it to second and gave up first: no takebacksies."
Yeah the third strike rule is fairly well known. Technically you don't have to tip it. Basically, if there's a third strike but somehow the catcher doesn't coral it, you can take off running and try and make it.
I thought that you could steal first if you strike out, but the catcher doesn't catch the ball, he has to throw the runner out at first. If he doesn't, you can steal first base that way.
Is it not stealing first when you run after a third strike when the catcher drops it?
Have you done a video on the Skunk in the Outfield trick play? I don't think anyone has tried it in the majors but they have in high school ball
Knowing the rule and exploiting it is when the Phoenix Suns threw the ball inbounds off the backboard, with no one touching it until Barkley scooped in the ball after it changed direction from hitting the backboard. The clock doesn't start until a player touches it, so the Suns basically got an extra pass without taking any time off the clock.
Edit: Here's the video of it from 1993. th-cam.com/video/WFe-71tNPQk/w-d-xo.html
"beta version" was actually really funny
Technically if they missed the first call of him being out on the tag, they should have called him out when the coach grabbed him and put him on the bag. Not allowed to do that when time's not out.
8:20 Ground rule double or a base given from an error could possibly but a runner on second with having “acquired the legal title” to first base or however the hell they phrased it? Or…? Or what about a pinch runner replacing a player on 2nd?
That's evil and I love it, lol
You still have to touch 1st on a ground rule double so that wouldn't count. I suppose with a pinch runner (or maybe the extra inning runner on 2nd) you could make a case that the runner didn't legally acquire 1st
Okay, I thought of a reason to intentionally steal first base that does not make a travesty of the game, nor is it to confuse the defense. (It's still very dubious, but this is the best I can do.) You can steal first base to challenge a pitcher who would otherwise be prone to pitching around or intentionally walking the current batter. Now that there isn't an open first base, it de-incentivizes the intentional walk. Sort of. Slightly.
I like using a term like “conceding 2nd base” better than “stealing 1st base”.
Lmao you alls regular conversations still sound like you’re narrating I can’t get it out my head. It’s the slurring and pausing for dramatic purposes. I love it
In 2003 I played softball I carried around a spoon called spoony that my gf made for me for good luck. I was the fast guy that's all I did. So I ran past first dropped the spoon. I went past second realized I dropped it and went back towards first retrieved the spoon and made a mad dash towards second being called out.
. . . "spoony" . . .
Player goes to steal second, but not seeing a challenge doesn't actually touch the bag. He doesn't claim it. So he is still able to return to first base.
What would be interesting is while the guy is being chased back to second, the other runner steals third.
Clearly, all you need is a contract bonus for stealing bases, then you can be as deliberate as you want and have an excuse to prove you're not trying to confuse anyone or make a travesty of the game. Plus, you'd force the issue of whether or not stealing can count previous bases.
Reminds me of the Lloyd Moseby play where he steals second twice in 1987. Technically he was on second, then ran back to first, so did he steal first in that situation? They mention it on the broadcast.
Neat analysis video! Thanks for uploading!
I actually knew about that play, I've seen it on multiple highlight videos
I’m 63 years old but if I could I would totally steal first and I would Never make a travesty of this game.
I always thought Segura got called out on that play
For beef history you guys should do the battle of Alberta
I think having baseball still being kind of like the Wild West of sports makes it interesting for casual viewers. When it gets slow having all these little things makes it cool. Other sports have tightened them up. Let baseball still feel like it’s the turn of the century.... The 20th century