I'd say similarly forgotten as USAF bomber interceptors (eg Delta Dagger/Dart) as they had limited use after ICBM proliferation and functioned mostly as technology test subjects. Seems the Su-15 suffered similarly as American and GB interceptors for range, radar and missile limitations.
@@rshust never in my wildest dreams did I think my fav TH-cam aviation channel would be the one to do a deep, credible, up-to-date English language video on this plane that’s fascinated me since I was a kid! Sometimes you really CAN have it all!
They're only dangerous if you're flying in a high flying airliner. Lower flying aircraft (especially civil propeller driven aircraft like Cessnas) are relatively safe due to the Flagon's inability to shoot down lower flying aircraft and inability to do air combat maneuvering.
Same, I love these videos but I always seem to fall asleep whilst watching them because I start them when I'm in bed or drowsy, I swear Not A Pound probably gets 3-4 views out of me per video lol.
Just like Drachinifel ! He's absolutely not boring but has such a calm well measured speaking voice. The only drawback is he dryly slips in a fair number of witty sarcasms that grab my attention, lol.
How about a video on the Tu 128 Fiddler interceptor..an absolute giant of a heavy fighter. Also a video on Mig 25 Foxbat operations in the Middle East would be great.
21:40 - "It turned out that although Factory 500 in Moscow could make the engines properly, Factory 26 in Ufa could not. "In June 1969, PRESUMABLY AFTER A ROUND OF 7.62MM CALIBRE HR AND QUALITY IMPROVEMENTS, the Ufa factory did manage to produce engines that met the design specifications." Heavens that was dark but it was also witty. Interesting video on the Flagon. Didn't know much about it apart from it's homicidal tendencies against civilian airliners. Very interesting.
Anyone else find it Ironic the Soviets thought the Korean Air 747 was a spy plane while Korean Air gave it the call sign 007......as in James Bond....the most famous spy,fictious or real
Su-15TM (and MiG-19`s) are my favorite , cold war era , Soviet aircraft, when Trumpeter released a 1:48 Su-15TM modelkit i was happy until i opened the box and saw that the Nose wasnt angled downwards slightly, but no Problem a modelmagazin came to help how to rebuilt the downward angle by scratch. Thx for the Flagon video
I love the Flagon - one of those weird mutants that can only exist in an isolated, resource-rich environment where the niches haven't yet been filled to capacity. Basically it's the jet equivalent of a Moa.
For 007, articles and TV dramas spent years speculating on why the plane went off course, usually having it due to some technical problem as the pilots could not be at fault. Some surprise when the later release of the recovered FDR’s showed the pilots had simply forgotten to switch from Heading Mode to INS Mode after leaving Alaska.
This is my favorite Cold War Soviet jet aircraft - note, I said “my favorite” and not “the best”. It has a particular retrofuture look that screams 1960’s, with heavy space-age influences. Was it objectively garbage? Well, yes. Unless making a rear-on interception against a non-maneuvering target, it was hopeless as a combat system. But man, those feets and speeds! Those sexy Jet Age lines! Those crimes of war! I always side with the freaks and mutants of a given field, and this thing was a little bit of both. RIP everyone whose life it ever claimed.
@@zacklewis342 taking nothing away from the Yak-28, which definitely also scratches my “freak and/or mutant” itch. Really, any fighter or light bomber made by a non-MiG OKB after about 1947 has a place in my heart.
The Su-15 was a notoriously difficult aircraft to fly, even the later variants with the cranked wing. As mentioned, the aircraft had a high takeoff and landing speed. This was compounded by the fact that as a tailed delta design it could not use the high angle of attack landing approaches used by pure delta aircraft like the Mirage III or F-106 due to the need to maintain airflow over the horizontal stabilators. Even if a high AoA approach had been aerodynamically feasible, the Flagon's long nose would have made it impractical due to visibility concerns. I've seen a few comparisons made where it is stated that the Flagon's western counterpart was the F-106 but that is not quite true. Even though the F-106 entered service earlier than the Flagon, it was still a better aircraft in terms of serviceability, reliability, and effectiveness in the intercept role. I've often thought that the only reason the Su-15 entered production at all given that the MiG-25 was a superior interceptor is simply as a "keep-busy" measure to keep the Sukhoi OKB open. The Flagon's only kills against live targets were scored against unarmed (and unaware) airliners - KAL flight 902 (a Boeing 707), an Argentine Canadair CL-44 propliner, and KAL flight 007 (a Boeing 747). It is questionable how well a Flagon would have done in intercepting/shooting down a B-52 given the B-52's ECM capability in the late 70's. All in all, the Flagon was a disappointment and I've read one Flagon pilot's interview where he said that being assigned to fly them was a sort of punishment - when one pilot told his relatives that he was assigned to fly the Flagon his father (who had flown MiG-15's and 17's during the 1950's) asked him who he had pissed off.
You named all bad things about flagon and not a single good one? It is well known Interceptor for excellent rate of climb 230m/s and supersonic acceleration Surpassed only by MiG-25. With two R-98MR missiles was capable of 1.9 Mach and without armament 2.1 Mach. Also when engines are redlined (it have that Redline throttle stick ability like most of PVO strany interceptors) it was able to reach max speed of 2.5 mach in clean configuration. Radar Taifun-M RP-26 have two separate working frequencies (it is a derivative of RP-25) and have a range of 70km which is a good performance at a time. serviceability, reliability, and effectiveness in the intercept role between F-106 & Su-15TM... we can not compare this two because all available information are covered with propaganda fog of war ,where one side mock another side. But Su-15 because of its acceleration (1/3 faster rate of climb - 230m/s vs 150m/s) will catch its target much faster than F-106, especially if we compare armament of Su-15 with R-98MR/MT missile (23km range) with F-106 with unbelievable unreliable AIM-4F Falcon (9.7km range) !!!
@@svinche2You are ignoring the context, the Su15 was an interceptor that wasn’t as capable in the pure interceptor role as the MiG-25. The comparison between F106 and Su15 is not the main point the person commenting was making, rather that the Flagon was simply considered a lesser jet in the Soviet inventory compared to its contemporaries. Ergonomics matter more than you’d think lol, a pilot needs to be able to safely take off and land to get their flight hours in.
@@FishFlys Ignorant is you in this topic, because i read so many books about Su-15 and soviet jets from authors like Yefim Gordon and others. And all that Soviet Lesser jet is Invented by Western Propaganda outlets ! If this jet is in any way Lesser jet they will not built 1,290 pieces of it ! At first (before MiG-25 entered production) it is considered a elite PVO strany fighter jet ! Soviets didn't considered even obviously less capable Yak-28P lesser jet. And Su-15 production continued even after MiG-25 entered production told us that story, because Su-15 is much cheaper for production and exploitation. Only Su-9 is considered failed project and quickly updated in Su-11 version. Crampy not spacious cockpit, well all soviet jets have small cockpits but you should know that average height of soviet pilots are 1.65. They choose small bodied people for pilots !
@@svinche2 I never called the flagon “failed”. I said, truthfully mind you, that it is objectively inferior to its contemporaries that the Soviets already had access to. Your anecdotal evidence is worthless and adds nothing to the general context of the jet. It just wasn’t as good as the alternatives so it never saw much use.
Actualy plane was quite reliable. Landing speed was nothing new compared to contemporary 21 for example. Video is bit spiling bile on the plane like its some kind of serial killer not a machine. But I guess in current age its a norm on videos of this type.
All of the NATO names come from lists of random words. For aircraft, their are one syllable word lists for propeller driven aircraft and two syllable word lists for jet powered aircraft. The SU-15 was a jet powered fighter, so it was assigned a name that started with 'F' and had two syllables [the TU-95 was a propeller driven bomber, so it got a one syllable name starting with 'B']. The names are assigned in their order on the list. Given the chronology of the MiG-15, MiG-21, MiG-23, MiG-25, and MiG-29 (Fagot', Fishbed, Flogger, Foxbat, and Fulcrum) the list may be sorted alphabetically, but I could be wrong about that.
This plane would be a fine addition to War Thunder on the condition that Gaijin add high-altitude jet bombers like the big Boeings, V-Bombers, Tu-16, and so on. Tim’s Variety has made some good arguments about the changes needed to bomber play for air battles. Pure interceptors like the F-106, Flagon, Foxbat, Lightning F.3, F-89B, and frankly all the F-104s would finally have a viable playstyle!
@j.mangum7652 well it can do one or the other, oreasily overstress its 6.5Gmax and then perhaps loose a wing, or get itself attitude out of control past its limited control surfaces' areas & restricted elevon throw abilities to regain control.
Seen and heard them scramble. Very impressive (and LOUD). No photos of course, not in the USSR while waiting for our flight to depart somewhere in Siberia.
'Flagon' all names given to Soviet types were for reporting purposes, F were for fighters, B for bombers (Bull, Bear, Bison), the name is simply from Webster's Dictionary and a noun in the entry and chosen so as not to be confused for any other word - Fishbed MiG 21, Foxbat MiG 23, Flagon SU 15. They rarely have any connection to the ability of the type.
But they absolutely did. They just happened to call the first common Soviet jet fighter the "MiG-15 Fagot" after an "easily kindled bundle of fuel for fire starting" from sheer coincidence? Bullshit. The first very high performance one that actually concerned them was the MiG-25, the "Foxbat". Then the first two really competitive designs were the "Fulcrum" and "Flanker", which just happened to more impressive sounding. Code words are not _necessarily_ chosen for any specific reason, but they can be selected for memorability.
@@justforever96 Why did you post this ? It contradicts nothing I wrote. The NATO 'Reporting Name' system was adopted from the US system for naming Japanese aircraft types simply to differentiate between them. What is the meaning of 'Foxbat' in relation to a Mach 3 interceptor apart from 'F' for fighter type? The definition of the word used is irrelevant and picked to avoid confusion with anything else. Fulcrum and Flagon are not descriptive either. Stop using cuss words in discussion, it is a substitute for thinking things through.
Excellent job, as usual. The Flagon is a bit of an obsession for me. I had a Ukrainian airframe Lidar scanned a few years ago, and have been working (off and on) on a CAD model. All complete except for cockpit and landing gear. Hope to sell it as either a 3d printed kit in 1/48, or as STL files. Thought I'd seen every photo ever published, but you found more. Psycho Killer, maybe I'll put that on the box art!
Also looking forward to Su-17/22 and the precursor Su-7 video(s). Those Cold War Sukhoi jets seemed to be quite prolific around the world but don't get as much exploration as MiGs.
@@NefariousKoel Yes, YES, YES!!!! I 100% agree and would love to learn more about the Sukhoi jets, especially from a NAPFATG perspective. A wit worthy of Clive James.
Жаль мало сказано было о системах автоматизированного управления и наведения перехватчиков, начиная с "Вихрь-1". Ведь самолет Су-15 являлся частью сложнейшего комплекса, в этом и стоит искать причины достоинств и недостатков этой, несомненно, контроверсивной машины.
@chrismartin3197 t-10 seemed like a breakthrough even in it's original form, but t-10s is something stellar compared to something contemporary produced like MiG-23MLD.
If you do a video on the Su-9 Fishpot, I’ll be eternally grateful! My grandpa was one of the first pilots to serve in the Su-9, and many of his friends died from Lyulka engine failures
I had to put captions on to be sure of what I heard... After a round of 7.62mm quality control improvements..." Absolutely brutal commentary and darkly humorous. I loved it. 😅
Idea: Do a overview video on the Voyska PVO. I don't think many people outside hardcore Cold War nerds understand there were TWO Soviet air forces. (well, three, counting Naval Aviation, but you know what I mean)
01:05 The MiG-27 was a TV guided ground attack strike craft - not a RADAR guided interceptor like the MiG-23 which the MiG-27 airframe was derived from. The statement of 'the MiG-27 being a rubbish fighter' sounds very much like a confusion of the two types since the MiG-23 hardly managed to replace the MiG-21 as an interceptor. Even including the MiG-15 and MiG-17, the only dedicated air superiority fighter in Soviet service were the Su-27 and the MiG-29 - something similar can be said about Western aircraft before the F-X and VFX programs (apart from the export lightweight F-5A, the advanced F-15A, the lightweight F-16A, the advanced naval F-14B that took more than a decade to sort out engine issues and to considerable degree the lightweight naval F-18A). The mission of intercepting intercontinental bombers requires the specifications and flight characteristics of interceptors - whether the concept of an 'air superiority fighter' is strategically and operationally viable ('The bomber always gets through') should be up to debate, even recently when the mission still is an interception of a 'multi-role' aircraft that is in fact dragged down by stand-off strike ordnance that any 'dogfight' is out of the question (as it was already the case in Vietnam)... Instead of focusing on the downing of civil aircraft - in a Cold War of frequent illegal NATO air space violation (CIA operated U-2) and nuclear armed bombers as the main delivery of armed contest - thus characterizing the Su-15 design, one could have began from _doctrine_ and the fact of a two tier system of air defense in analogy to the T-55/T-62/T-72 versus the T-64/T-80 armament of Tank regiments (in an assault gun role for Motor Rifle or as main battle tanks for Armor units). Assessed this way, the mass produced and attritable Su-15 was adequate to intercept the subsonic US B-52 that is still in service, today - matching the suicidal British 'V Bombers' (never meant to return to base) the same, leaving the advanced, supersonic B-58 and the then cancelled XB-70 to the advanced, costly and rare MiG-25 and finally the MiG-31 (neither of them were 'fighters' as the CIA insinuated, triggering the US Air Force' unsustainable F-X programs which lingers on without the planed resolution by the JSF) that had put an end to incursions and which is still in modernized service (considering the state of late Soviet and Russian ground based air defense, arguably also confirming the strategic decision, away from manned aviation). The Su-15 appears like a curiosity from the perspective of a NATO 'Fighter Mafia' - within the factual context of Soviet air defense doctrine, it is self-evident - even if actual assembly of components fell short of expectations as in all areas of Soviet economic planning (yet, inflicting a loss rate of almost 30-50 percent of NATO equipment, achieved with second tier assets - as in Korea and Yom Kippur - was likely an acceptable strategic deterrence in case of conflict).
There were certain angles in certain photos you showed where, from one third of the fuselage behind the wing root to the tip of the tail looked like the F-105 Thunderchief. I know it was a trick of the camera, but damn, looked just like it. Thanks for this long vid. I love Russian/Soviet aircraft. So exotic from the usual Western fair.
Thank you OP. For the last 20 years since I developed a love for combat aviation, I’ve always had a fascination for this good looking and somewhat mysterious interceptor. There is very little easily accessible English speaking information on the Flagon when compared to Foxbat and other more notable models
Have you done a video on the early F-16 Vipers? I recently found your channel and dont know much about the early years of 4th generation jets, and would love to learn about it all from you!
Except for Yak-28, apparently - I read an interview with an ex-pilot claiming that Brewer was "very tricky" but fun to fly. Despite having some serious flaws the plane was much loved because of that.
I’d translate “tricky but fun” as agile enough to be fun but unforgiving to mistakes and prone to bite. So, not a nightmare, but not an easy plane. Fun makes me think Yak-130. I want to fly that thing so badly.
How? Vincennes shot down an airliner on an established route in international airspace, the Korean Air Lines flight 007(!) shoot down was after TWO overflies. Korean Air did this ‘navigation error’ thing before.
To be fair, the suggestion that a near-collision with a SU-15 caused Gagarin's fatal crash is not well established, the theory being based on a recollection by Alexi Leonov. Still, a great introduction to the bloody history of the SU-15.
If it reduced the amount of spying overflights over the USSR which I suspect it did, then it did its job and served well and achieved what was intended.
Astonished to know that Su-15 is not a fast plane and usually armed with only 2 missiles. What about the story of Su-9 and Su-11? They seem to be the prettier version of the Mig-21 but slower (at least for Su-9)
having only just discovered this channel, the one thing I’ve come to realise is how useless both sides' interceptors were in the Cold War. If only they had known nobody would have bothered with those massively complex and expensive ICBM programs
I've always liked the looks of the Su-15. When I was a small kid in the 1950s and making drawings of airplanes was a major source of entertainment in those WAY pre-internet days, I often drew things that resembled this plane. That was just how I thought an interceptor of that era should look. But otherwise, as you describe, not really a lot of capability. Still, a good-looking airplane IMHO. Thanks for the video.
One weakness of the SU-15 is its lack of operational flexibility, especially in close combat environments or when operating in contingency situations. Aircraft such as the MiG-21 or F-5 can easily perform a wider range of missions with greater flexibility. The SU-15, while powerful, is specifically designed for strategic strike and interception missions, which makes it less flexible when faced with rapidly changing combat situations.
Thanks for this NAPFATG! Been waiting for ages for someone to do an in depth review of the SU-15. Could you perhaps cover the TU-28/128 as i absolutely adore that big old fat bird! Quite interesting to compare VVS vs PVO aircraft and facilities of the same eras, what was the percentage of resources that each branch was allocated WRT airforce budgets? Anyhoo, keep up the awesome work comrade!
Since your video on it the f106 has impressed me almost every day with how fast it was. It makes me wonder how fast a gripen could go with moving inlet ramps.
Thank you. The Sukoi teen series rarely gets the attention it deserves. That doesn't mean they were good mind you. I still believe the "hero fighters" of the USSR until the 70s were MiGs because of Artem Mikoyan's brother. Yeah I know "nepotism In the USSR? No way." It is note worthy that once he died in Dec 1970 SU quickly became the primary aircraft designer. The SU-24, 25, 27, etc. Meanwhile MiGs last big hits were the 29 and 31. The 29 has been over shadowed by the 27 and the 31 is a niche aircraft with "only" about 500 built.
MiG aircraft outclassed competitors from Sukhoi all the way until Su-27, simple as that. In this example, Su-15 loses on all accounts against MiG-25 - except for price. Su-15 was just cheaper
I've seen articles on how the 747 was considered for several roles during the Cold War, such as a flying aircraft carrier and a cruise-missile-focused "bomber." Now I know why so few saw military usage: the Flagon was the kryptonite of jumbo jets!
Very interesting video. I remember the 1986 KAL shoot down and ensuing outrage very well. I’ve also noticed that you used “RC One-Three-Five” when reading “RC-135”; in the USAF, however we say “RC One-Thirty-Five”.
Although I do think these incidents show the weaknesses and vulnerability of the PVO and Soviet airspace, the use of an interceptor shows that high command was not certain of the target or else why not just use a SAM? GCI really showed no true awareness and once it was said to be a civil airliner they shot anyway versus pursue a forced landing. In fairness Aeroflot is said to have been used to conduct covert intel gathering so Soviet thinking was likely these were either camo or carrying out recce, either way they chose to take the shot. In the end I suspect the Flagon would have done little to impede any true penetrations or forestall the bombings to come. Another more paper than substance system the USSR put up.
interceptors only became reliable in the late 80's. No one had a interceptor reasonably reliable until them, the technology simple wasn't mature enough.
This is the most comprehensive piece of media on the Su-15 I’ve ever seen… the jet is practically forgotten by everyone else
I'd say similarly forgotten as USAF bomber interceptors (eg Delta Dagger/Dart) as they had limited use after ICBM proliferation and functioned mostly as technology test subjects. Seems the Su-15 suffered similarly as American and GB interceptors for range, radar and missile limitations.
This is professional quality!
@@rshust never in my wildest dreams did I think my fav TH-cam aviation channel would be the one to do a deep, credible, up-to-date English language video on this plane that’s fascinated me since I was a kid! Sometimes you really CAN have it all!
The F-106 served with the ANG until the late 1980s. They were very active and busy over the USA. They were replaced by F-16.
@@frankez99 Njaa.... I am afraid it may be BETTER than "professional".
As a South Korean, i feel a deep fear in genetic level whenever I see this aircraft.
They're only dangerous if you're flying in a high flying airliner. Lower flying aircraft (especially civil propeller driven aircraft like Cessnas) are relatively safe due to the Flagon's inability to shoot down lower flying aircraft and inability to do air combat maneuvering.
As an American Southerner, I would love to personally see an SU-15 up close, but would approach cautiously, observe quietly, and depart quickly.
Is that fear multiplied if you are aboard a Boeing?
Me too It's a very pretty aircraft.
@@epikmanthe3rdLOL. Su-15 behind the Boeing you are in. Those are slim odds.
Flagon was the first..."Oh hey, look! A civilian airliner!"
Those are worth the most points.
Easy pickings, Comrade!
@@ShortArmOfGodHero of Soviet Union for you, Comrade!
USN did too
@@andyf4292 uhhh, no.
I look forward to falling asleep to this in about an hour or so and then enjoying it again in full with my Saturday morning coffee. Cheers mate
Same, I love these videos but I always seem to fall asleep whilst watching them because I start them when I'm in bed or drowsy, I swear Not A Pound probably gets 3-4 views out of me per video lol.
All wonderfully well organised into playlists for convenience. High Quality. 👍
I'm not alone with this channel being ASMR? LOL I'm good for 2 views for this reason
Dude same, puts me right to bed. Go to work. Come home smoke a bowl and watch again fully. Best Friday ever
Just like Drachinifel ! He's absolutely not boring but has such a calm well measured speaking voice.
The only drawback is he dryly slips in a fair number of witty sarcasms that grab my attention, lol.
How about a video on the Tu 128 Fiddler interceptor..an absolute giant of a heavy fighter. Also a video on Mig 25 Foxbat operations in the Middle East would be great.
Yep the 128 and the 15 when viewed from above are perfection in aviation aesthetics
Would love to learn more about the Tu 128, especially from a NAPFATG perspective!
the problem with talking about the air war between the arabs and the israelis, is that they both keep lying 😭
@@1KosovoJeSrbija1 I AGREE WITH YOU 1000 PERCENT!!!!!!
Definitely failed the No-Airliner challenge, plus , supposedly, "maneuver-kill" against a cosmonaut
21:40 - "It turned out that although Factory 500 in Moscow could make the engines properly, Factory 26 in Ufa could not.
"In June 1969, PRESUMABLY AFTER A ROUND OF 7.62MM CALIBRE HR AND QUALITY IMPROVEMENTS, the Ufa factory did manage to produce engines that met the design specifications."
Heavens that was dark but it was also witty.
Interesting video on the Flagon. Didn't know much about it apart from it's homicidal tendencies against civilian airliners. Very interesting.
I just posted a similar comment.
This channel never fails to entertain 😂
In soviet russia, we take safety very seriously
Audits are conducted with body armor and a full combat load
@@coced You still have a window problem.
@@rtqiiquality control in the deli is questionable at best
Anyone else find it Ironic the Soviets thought the Korean Air 747 was a spy plane while Korean Air gave it the call sign 007......as in James Bond....the most famous spy,fictious or real
There was an RC135 not far from that 747.
@Max_Da_G i am aware of that
That was well worked provocation
@@Max_Da_G and the Usa did use air liners to spy in east germany.
Su-15TM (and MiG-19`s) are my favorite , cold war era , Soviet aircraft, when Trumpeter released a 1:48 Su-15TM modelkit i was happy until i opened the box and saw that the Nose wasnt angled downwards slightly, but no Problem a modelmagazin came to help how to rebuilt the downward angle by scratch. Thx for the Flagon video
A Swedish Viggen got an unintentional maneuver kill on an Su-15 in the 80's
Fantastic!
Never heard of that!
@@christianpethukov8155 An armed Su-15 tried to follow a Swedish sea recon Viggen in a split S at low altitude. Bad idea !
@AdurianJ Oops. Thanks for letting me know!
I remember reading about this, thanks for reminding me
The first two minutes of this were a fantastic hook. I appreciate that.
That intro had me rolling on the floor! "Yo, Flagon! Take care of dis guy! Make sure he sleeps with da fishes!"
Love the title Psycho Killer ......are you a Talking Heads fan? Another great video 😊😊😊😊
Qu'est-ce que c'est?
Run run run run run, run run run away... OOOooooooo aaaaa eeeeee aaayyyyyyy!
@@morteforte7033 C'est une chanson. _Psycho Killer_ par Talking Heads.
Oh... perhaps you are quoting a favorite part of the lyric?
@@morteforte7033 UNREAL LOVE IT 😊😊😊😊😊
@@sergioleone3583LOVE IT MAN I FORGOT ABOUT THAT ONE😊😊😊
I love the Flagon - one of those weird mutants that can only exist in an isolated, resource-rich environment where the niches haven't yet been filled to capacity.
Basically it's the jet equivalent of a Moa.
For 007, articles and TV dramas spent years speculating on why the plane went off course, usually having it due to some technical problem as the pilots could not be at fault. Some surprise when the later release of the recovered FDR’s showed the pilots had simply forgotten to switch from Heading Mode to INS Mode after leaving Alaska.
Another conspiracy that may be true 🤔 did you know about the congressman that was on board?
5:00 Forgive my language. But GYATT
...erm, ..do you get a Yacht with that Gyatt , you know, a Gyatt Yacht ??
Love the level of detail in your videos. It's just enough without getting into the "weeds" of too much information. Very well done.
21:50 is probably the darkest double entendre you've put in a video yet.
I can think of a few places who could use such a effective HR department...
“Airliner hate him, Find out how this Soviet interceptor shot down 3 airliners and go away with it”
Man.. this channel really makes this interesting.. this is like "Discovery Wings Channel" but for 2025.
This is my favorite Cold War Soviet jet aircraft - note, I said “my favorite” and not “the best”. It has a particular retrofuture look that screams 1960’s, with heavy space-age influences. Was it objectively garbage? Well, yes. Unless making a rear-on interception against a non-maneuvering target, it was hopeless as a combat system. But man, those feets and speeds! Those sexy Jet Age lines! Those crimes of war! I always side with the freaks and mutants of a given field, and this thing was a little bit of both. RIP everyone whose life it ever claimed.
Nah, it looks like it was designed by a 12 year old. The Yak 28 is the droid you're looking for.
@@zacklewis342 taking nothing away from the Yak-28, which definitely also scratches my “freak and/or mutant” itch. Really, any fighter or light bomber made by a non-MiG OKB after about 1947 has a place in my heart.
The Su-15 was a notoriously difficult aircraft to fly, even the later variants with the cranked wing. As mentioned, the aircraft had a high takeoff and landing speed. This was compounded by the fact that as a tailed delta design it could not use the high angle of attack landing approaches used by pure delta aircraft like the Mirage III or F-106 due to the need to maintain airflow over the horizontal stabilators. Even if a high AoA approach had been aerodynamically feasible, the Flagon's long nose would have made it impractical due to visibility concerns. I've seen a few comparisons made where it is stated that the Flagon's western counterpart was the F-106 but that is not quite true. Even though the F-106 entered service earlier than the Flagon, it was still a better aircraft in terms of serviceability, reliability, and effectiveness in the intercept role. I've often thought that the only reason the Su-15 entered production at all given that the MiG-25 was a superior interceptor is simply as a "keep-busy" measure to keep the Sukhoi OKB open. The Flagon's only kills against live targets were scored against unarmed (and unaware) airliners - KAL flight 902 (a Boeing 707), an Argentine Canadair CL-44 propliner, and KAL flight 007 (a Boeing 747). It is questionable how well a Flagon would have done in intercepting/shooting down a B-52 given the B-52's ECM capability in the late 70's. All in all, the Flagon was a disappointment and I've read one Flagon pilot's interview where he said that being assigned to fly them was a sort of punishment - when one pilot told his relatives that he was assigned to fly the Flagon his father (who had flown MiG-15's and 17's during the 1950's) asked him who he had pissed off.
You named all bad things about flagon and not a single good one?
It is well known Interceptor for excellent rate of climb 230m/s and supersonic acceleration Surpassed only by MiG-25. With two R-98MR missiles was capable of 1.9 Mach and without armament 2.1 Mach. Also when engines are redlined (it have that Redline throttle stick ability like most of PVO strany interceptors) it was able to reach max speed of 2.5 mach in clean configuration.
Radar Taifun-M RP-26 have two separate working frequencies (it is a derivative of RP-25) and have a range of 70km which is a good performance at a time.
serviceability, reliability, and effectiveness in the intercept role between F-106 & Su-15TM... we can not compare this two because all available information are covered with propaganda fog of war ,where one side mock another side.
But Su-15 because of its acceleration (1/3 faster rate of climb - 230m/s vs 150m/s) will catch its target much faster than F-106, especially if we compare armament of
Su-15 with R-98MR/MT missile (23km range) with F-106 with unbelievable unreliable AIM-4F Falcon (9.7km range) !!!
@@svinche2You are ignoring the context, the Su15 was an interceptor that wasn’t as capable in the pure interceptor role as the MiG-25.
The comparison between F106 and Su15 is not the main point the person commenting was making, rather that the Flagon was simply considered a lesser jet in the Soviet inventory compared to its contemporaries.
Ergonomics matter more than you’d think lol, a pilot needs to be able to safely take off and land to get their flight hours in.
@@FishFlys Ignorant is you in this topic, because i read so many books about Su-15 and soviet jets from authors like Yefim Gordon and others. And all that Soviet Lesser jet is Invented by Western Propaganda outlets ! If this jet is in any way Lesser jet they will not built 1,290 pieces of it ! At first (before MiG-25 entered production) it is considered a elite PVO strany fighter jet ! Soviets didn't considered even obviously less capable Yak-28P lesser jet. And Su-15 production continued even after MiG-25 entered production told us that story, because Su-15 is much cheaper for production and exploitation. Only Su-9 is considered failed project and quickly updated in Su-11 version. Crampy not spacious cockpit, well all soviet jets have small cockpits but you should know that average height of soviet pilots are 1.65. They choose small bodied people for pilots !
@@svinche2 I never called the flagon “failed”.
I said, truthfully mind you, that it is objectively inferior to its contemporaries that the Soviets already had access to.
Your anecdotal evidence is worthless and adds nothing to the general context of the jet. It just wasn’t as good as the alternatives so it never saw much use.
Actualy plane was quite reliable. Landing speed was nothing new compared to contemporary 21 for example. Video is bit spiling bile on the plane like its some kind of serial killer not a machine. But I guess in current age its a norm on videos of this type.
All of the NATO names come from lists of random words. For aircraft, their are one syllable word lists for propeller driven aircraft and two syllable word lists for jet powered aircraft. The SU-15 was a jet powered fighter, so it was assigned a name that started with 'F' and had two syllables [the TU-95 was a propeller driven bomber, so it got a one syllable name starting with 'B']. The names are assigned in their order on the list. Given the chronology of the MiG-15, MiG-21, MiG-23, MiG-25, and MiG-29 (Fagot', Fishbed, Flogger, Foxbat, and Fulcrum) the list may be sorted alphabetically, but I could be wrong about that.
We are still waiting for this plane to be added into War Thunder!!!
... surely it's too structurally weak & also too weak in interception capabilities for WT to be useful?
@razor1uk610 well that doesnt matter much to me, but i get your point
This plane would be a fine addition to War Thunder on the condition that Gaijin add high-altitude jet bombers like the big Boeings, V-Bombers, Tu-16, and so on. Tim’s Variety has made some good arguments about the changes needed to bomber play for air battles. Pure interceptors like the F-106, Flagon, Foxbat, Lightning F.3, F-89B, and frankly all the F-104s would finally have a viable playstyle!
@@razor1uk610 In War Thunder the Flagon would work out for zoom and boom types of flying.
@j.mangum7652 well it can do one or the other, oreasily overstress its 6.5Gmax and then perhaps loose a wing, or get itself attitude out of control past its limited control surfaces' areas & restricted elevon throw abilities to regain control.
21:56 "A round of 7.62mm HR quality improvements" Fantastic statement. HR and facisim haven't changed since.
Perun level side side remark
Seen and heard them scramble. Very impressive (and LOUD).
No photos of course, not in the USSR while waiting for our flight to depart somewhere in Siberia.
That opening, now I am imagining every Flagon pilot flying with that Michael Myers Halloween theme blairing in their helmets.
I'm a believer.
Like all the Sukhoi interceptors and fighters. I like how you can see the direct evolution from the Su-7 all the way into the Su-22 and Su-15.
21:50 "...7.62 caliber... quality improvement..." quite possibly. 🙂
Australian Flagon is a 2 litre plus bottle of wine 🍷
'Flagon' all names given to Soviet types were for reporting purposes, F were for fighters, B for bombers (Bull, Bear, Bison), the name is simply from Webster's Dictionary and a noun in the entry and chosen so as not to be confused for any other word - Fishbed MiG 21, Foxbat MiG 23, Flagon SU 15. They rarely have any connection to the ability of the type.
But they absolutely did. They just happened to call the first common Soviet jet fighter the "MiG-15 Fagot" after an "easily kindled bundle of fuel for fire starting" from sheer coincidence? Bullshit. The first very high performance one that actually concerned them was the MiG-25, the "Foxbat". Then the first two really competitive designs were the "Fulcrum" and "Flanker", which just happened to more impressive sounding.
Code words are not _necessarily_ chosen for any specific reason, but they can be selected for memorability.
@@justforever96 Why did you post this ? It contradicts nothing I wrote. The NATO 'Reporting Name' system was adopted from the US system for naming Japanese aircraft types simply to differentiate between them.
What is the meaning of 'Foxbat' in relation to a Mach 3 interceptor apart from 'F' for fighter type? The definition of the word used is irrelevant and picked to avoid confusion with anything else. Fulcrum and Flagon are not descriptive either.
Stop using cuss words in discussion, it is a substitute for thinking things through.
Excellent job, as usual. The Flagon is a bit of an obsession for me. I had a Ukrainian airframe Lidar scanned a few years ago, and have been working (off and on) on a CAD model. All complete except for cockpit and landing gear. Hope to sell it as either a 3d printed kit in 1/48, or as STL files. Thought I'd seen every photo ever published, but you found more. Psycho Killer, maybe I'll put that on the box art!
I was waiting for someone to cover Su-15, thank you!
One of my favorite Cold War jets!
I’d love to see a video on the Su22Fitters. This channel is great
Also looking forward to Su-17/22 and the precursor Su-7 video(s). Those Cold War Sukhoi jets seemed to be quite prolific around the world but don't get as much exploration as MiGs.
@@NefariousKoel exactly
@@NefariousKoel Yes, YES, YES!!!! I 100% agree and would love to learn more about the Sukhoi jets, especially from a NAPFATG perspective. A wit worthy of Clive James.
Dude! This is a GREAT video of a pretty unique Cold War beast. Good stuff brother 👍
Additional engine= heavier plane? Hadn’t thought of that.
Жаль мало сказано было о системах автоматизированного управления и наведения перехватчиков, начиная с "Вихрь-1". Ведь самолет Су-15 являлся частью сложнейшего комплекса, в этом и стоит искать причины достоинств и недостатков этой, несомненно, контроверсивной машины.
I can't understand how the Su-27 came out of the same design bureau as this atrocious (literally) piece of...
Have you seen the original Su-27? It’s not that unimaginable.
@chrismartin3197 t-10 seemed like a breakthrough even in it's original form, but t-10s is something stellar compared to something contemporary produced like MiG-23MLD.
Two ugly parents have beautiful kids all the time. Likewise, beautiful people have ugly kids.
This channel has to be among the best of aviation channels on TH-cam
If you do a video on the Su-9 Fishpot, I’ll be eternally grateful!
My grandpa was one of the first pilots to serve in the Su-9, and many of his friends died from Lyulka engine failures
I had to put captions on to be sure of what I heard...
After a round of 7.62mm quality control improvements..."
Absolutely brutal commentary and darkly humorous.
I loved it. 😅
Idea: Do a overview video on the Voyska PVO. I don't think many people outside hardcore Cold War nerds understand there were TWO Soviet air forces. (well, three, counting Naval Aviation, but you know what I mean)
Very enjoyable narration about flagon development and other interesting facts about its history!
Fantastic video, you obviously put so much work into these - thanks!
01:05 The MiG-27 was a TV guided ground attack strike craft - not a RADAR guided interceptor like the MiG-23 which the MiG-27 airframe was derived from.
The statement of 'the MiG-27 being a rubbish fighter' sounds very much like a confusion of the two types since the MiG-23 hardly managed to replace the MiG-21 as an interceptor.
Even including the MiG-15 and MiG-17, the only dedicated air superiority fighter in Soviet service were the Su-27 and the MiG-29 - something similar can be said about Western aircraft before the F-X and VFX programs (apart from the export lightweight F-5A, the advanced F-15A, the lightweight F-16A, the advanced naval F-14B that took more than a decade to sort out engine issues and to considerable degree the lightweight naval F-18A).
The mission of intercepting intercontinental bombers requires the specifications and flight characteristics of interceptors - whether the concept of an 'air superiority fighter' is strategically and operationally viable ('The bomber always gets through') should be up to debate, even recently when the mission still is an interception of a 'multi-role' aircraft that is in fact dragged down by stand-off strike ordnance that any 'dogfight' is out of the question (as it was already the case in Vietnam)...
Instead of focusing on the downing of civil aircraft - in a Cold War of frequent illegal NATO air space violation (CIA operated U-2) and nuclear armed bombers as the main delivery of armed contest - thus characterizing the Su-15 design, one could have began from _doctrine_ and the fact of a two tier system of air defense in analogy to the T-55/T-62/T-72 versus the T-64/T-80 armament of Tank regiments (in an assault gun role for Motor Rifle or as main battle tanks for Armor units).
Assessed this way, the mass produced and attritable Su-15 was adequate to intercept the subsonic US B-52 that is still in service, today - matching the suicidal British 'V Bombers' (never meant to return to base) the same, leaving the advanced, supersonic B-58 and the then cancelled XB-70 to the advanced, costly and rare MiG-25 and finally the MiG-31 (neither of them were 'fighters' as the CIA insinuated, triggering the US Air Force' unsustainable F-X programs which lingers on without the planed resolution by the JSF) that had put an end to incursions and which is still in modernized service (considering the state of late Soviet and Russian ground based air defense, arguably also confirming the strategic decision, away from manned aviation).
The Su-15 appears like a curiosity from the perspective of a NATO 'Fighter Mafia' - within the factual context of Soviet air defense doctrine, it is self-evident - even if actual assembly of components fell short of expectations as in all areas of Soviet economic planning (yet, inflicting a loss rate of almost 30-50 percent of NATO equipment, achieved with second tier assets - as in Korea and Yom Kippur - was likely an acceptable strategic deterrence in case of conflict).
There were certain angles in certain photos you showed where, from one third of the fuselage behind the wing root to the tip of the tail looked like the F-105 Thunderchief. I know it was a trick of the camera, but damn, looked just like it. Thanks for this long vid. I love Russian/Soviet aircraft. So exotic from the usual Western fair.
Thank you OP. For the last 20 years since I developed a love for combat aviation, I’ve always had a fascination for this good looking and somewhat mysterious interceptor.
There is very little easily accessible English speaking information on the Flagon when compared to Foxbat and other more notable models
I've been looking forward to you educating me on the SU fighters. GianLuigi... love it. As always, a great video. Please more on Sukhoi aircraft!
Have you done a video on the early F-16 Vipers? I recently found your channel and dont know much about the early years of 4th generation jets, and would love to learn about it all from you!
They're called Fighting Falcons.
They're called both
Got a sealed trumpeter model kit of this plane and then you drop this the next week 😂
*watching the production numbers on the aircraft slowly increase as the video goes on*
19:12 almost there
19:15 Nice.
Are you a 12-year-old?
Aside from the MiG-21, this era of Soviet interceptors and fighters all look like a nightmare to fly.
Except for Yak-28, apparently - I read an interview with an ex-pilot claiming that Brewer was "very tricky" but fun to fly. Despite having some serious flaws the plane was much loved because of that.
I’d translate “tricky but fun” as agile enough to be fun but unforgiving to mistakes and prone to bite. So, not a nightmare, but not an easy plane. Fun makes me think Yak-130. I want to fly that thing so badly.
Its a forgotten jet ! , i have never seen anything on this, you sir have excelled yourself again . splendid.
Much appreciated from india .
FINALLY A VIDEO ON THE SU-15! I LOVE YOU
This certainly beats the USS Vincennes' destruction of Iran Air 655 for sheer malice.
How? Vincennes shot down an airliner on an established route in international airspace, the Korean Air Lines flight 007(!) shoot down was after TWO overflies. Korean Air did this ‘navigation error’ thing before.
Awesome video. More content on cold war Soviet aircraft please.
That opening was Gold
Getting through one of these episodes without adblocker is torture
Great content. Thanks for creating the video.
To be fair, the suggestion that a near-collision with a SU-15 caused Gagarin's fatal crash is not well established, the theory being based on a recollection by Alexi Leonov. Still, a great introduction to the bloody history of the SU-15.
Never heard of this jet…. she just kinda flew under the radar all these years, miraculously not going SPLAT, until now! Great video! Thanks.
Dude. I am. always impressed with your depth of the videos. Still outstanding work.
Great episode!
If it reduced the amount of spying overflights over the USSR which I suspect it did, then it did its job and served well and achieved what was intended.
Astonished to know that Su-15 is not a fast plane and usually armed with only 2 missiles. What about the story of Su-9 and Su-11? They seem to be the prettier version of the Mig-21 but slower (at least for Su-9)
It's amazing how much sukhoi is held up as an amazing aircraft maker. When they have only made one good plane (su-27)
The one we’ve been waiting for!
having only just discovered this channel, the one thing I’ve come to realise is how useless both sides' interceptors were in the Cold War. If only they had known nobody would have bothered with those massively complex and expensive ICBM programs
Please do F-106 and Tu-128!
The incident with the freighter sounds like the pilot was instructed to test the feasibility and survivability of ramming attacks.
Nice channel, the mafia analogy made me laugh out loud.
I've always liked the looks of the Su-15. When I was a small kid in the 1950s and making drawings of airplanes was a major source of entertainment in those WAY pre-internet days, I often drew things that resembled this plane. That was just how I thought an interceptor of that era should look. But otherwise, as you describe, not really a lot of capability. Still, a good-looking airplane IMHO. Thanks for the video.
The best looking Soviet fighter, especially later with the cranked delta and ogival radome.
One weakness of the SU-15 is its lack of operational flexibility, especially in close combat environments or when operating in contingency situations. Aircraft such as the MiG-21 or F-5 can easily perform a wider range of missions with greater flexibility. The SU-15, while powerful, is specifically designed for strategic strike and interception missions, which makes it less flexible when faced with rapidly changing combat situations.
Well... atleast they knew their interception system worked in real world scenarios...
Thanks for this NAPFATG! Been waiting for ages for someone to do an in depth review of the SU-15. Could you perhaps cover the TU-28/128 as i absolutely adore that big old fat bird! Quite interesting to compare VVS vs PVO aircraft and facilities of the same eras, what was the percentage of resources that each branch was allocated WRT airforce budgets? Anyhoo, keep up the awesome work comrade!
Since your video on it the f106 has impressed me almost every day with how fast it was. It makes me wonder how fast a gripen could go with moving inlet ramps.
Yay, Friday evening so NAPFATG and because it's summer a bottle of sparkling shiraz. Yay. Life is good.
"presumably after 7.62 caliber HR and quality improvements" Few truly remember the USSR's brutality. Thanks for these.
Awww Man...love the intro!😊
Love your content man
th-cam.com/video/hdCVygC6Vis/w-d-xo.html
Thank you. The Sukoi teen series rarely gets the attention it deserves. That doesn't mean they were good mind you. I still believe the "hero fighters" of the USSR until the 70s were MiGs because of Artem Mikoyan's brother. Yeah I know "nepotism In the USSR? No way." It is note worthy that once he died in Dec 1970 SU quickly became the primary aircraft designer. The SU-24, 25, 27, etc. Meanwhile MiGs last big hits were the 29 and 31. The 29 has been over shadowed by the 27 and the 31 is a niche aircraft with "only" about 500 built.
During the Cold War, MiGs always seemed to do better than Sukhois in export. Of course there are various reasons for that
MiG aircraft outclassed competitors from Sukhoi all the way until Su-27, simple as that. In this example, Su-15 loses on all accounts against MiG-25 - except for price. Su-15 was just cheaper
@@thatdude3938 MiG-27M/K and Su-17M4
@@_b_x_b_1063 MiG-27K is more capable than Su-17M4, it was one of the most advanced Soviet strike aircraft
How do you get so much insight into the internal machinations of the Soviet aerospace industry? That's really impressive.
I've seen articles on how the 747 was considered for several roles during the Cold War, such as a flying aircraft carrier and a cruise-missile-focused "bomber." Now I know why so few saw military usage: the Flagon was the kryptonite of jumbo jets!
Superb video!!
Very interesting video. I remember the 1986 KAL shoot down and ensuing outrage very well. I’ve also noticed that you used “RC One-Three-Five” when reading “RC-135”; in the USAF, however we say “RC One-Thirty-Five”.
Engaging work as always, thank you.
Thank you for covering the SU 15 😊 cheers
Superb video
Korean Airline's no.1 opp...
Essentially a long range SAM that had a human to navigate it to near its target
Great video - very interesting!
Although I do think these incidents show the weaknesses and vulnerability of the PVO and Soviet airspace, the use of an interceptor shows that high command was not certain of the target or else why not just use a SAM? GCI really showed no true awareness and once it was said to be a civil airliner they shot anyway versus pursue a forced landing. In fairness Aeroflot is said to have been used to conduct covert intel gathering so Soviet thinking was likely these were either camo or carrying out recce, either way they chose to take the shot. In the end I suspect the Flagon would have done little to impede any true penetrations or forestall the bombings to come. Another more paper than substance system the USSR put up.
You think the air defense operators were allowed to know about Aeroflot spying? It was just murder to make a point, like the mafia metaphor.
interceptors only became reliable in the late 80's. No one had a interceptor reasonably reliable until them, the technology simple wasn't mature enough.
These Nato Codes for Soviet aircrafts are always so nice
The psycho killer sat inside the cockpit, the Flagon was the gun...
Would love to see some videos on British air to air missiles such as the red top and fireflash
Brilliant. Please follow up with more PVO interceptors!
Really like the video, feels like the air force version of drachnifel and thats a good thing
Greatest introduction ever!
Excellent. Nice one.