i have two Li Time 100 Ah minis that I really like. They have just as much stored power as their full size 100 Ah batteries. I really appreciate how light and compact that they are. They fit into smaller spaces and are so much easier on my 76 year old back. These minis are a real improvement!
Thank you for opening this up... I was wondering what they were doing to jam that capacity in the smaller form factor.. I did cringe a little when I saw pouch cells.. I guess that's just what I've been trained to do.. Probably in the real world, the pouch cell is just as reliable as the prismatic.. The only thing that bothers me is the cells are in a 4s4p config.. So you have 16 things that could fail instead of 4 in the prismatic battery box format.
Size definitely matters when you are talking about my tongue weight. I bought one of these and wonder what people are doing for battery boxes for them.
I would highly recommend Redodo Batteries to anyone in need of high-quality lithium iron batteries. The product is top-notch, and the customer service is exceptional.
Nice, i hope they have a version of this in their 12v 200 Ah models. Also, I hope customers and these battery companies start switching to 48v batteries and inverters as we can use smaller gauge wire and be more efficient in our systems?
Shared with family member who wants to swap Class B RV lead acid house batteries. Will consider for a van conversion for compactness if I do a DIY assembly and not a ready made power station.
LOVE the form factor. Same capacity in a smaller footprint can only be a positive. Just when you think LiFePO4 batteries could not get any better, this comes along. Sweet!
Interesting how they can be connected in series, I wonder how well they'd stay in balance without communication or balancing between packs. Nice size too.
LiTime, Redodo, and PowerQueen all have essentially identical “Mini” batts. Pouch vs. Prismatic cell form factor is still pretty “new” in these types of batteries.
This is perfect for someone like me. It never goes below 10c here. Maybe 9c at the lowest night of december. Most of the year it is above 30 . And for few months as high as 47. Like today was 44c. So i don't need any low temperature disconnect. Two of them should run my home for more than 3 hours. And that is long enough that I won't need a generator because the typical power outage is less than 1hr. While outage can be as long as 7 days if the cyclone decides to wreck the grid.
the cover doubles as an Ice cube tray for camping the size is always helpful when you are cramming for space. Redodo is a weird name but they make solid batteries it seems.
Love the small form factor too. If there was one with a bluetooth chip in it so I can monitor how much is left and what is going in and out then I would buy it.
Awesome video as always, Jason! Thanks for the excellent breakdown, pun half intended. Would love to hear your thoughts on the viability/tradeoffs (if any tradeoffs) in using pouch cells for LiFePO4 batteries. For example, thermal management, longevity, repairability, etc. Maybe a video idea, I'm not sure. In any case, I'm very tempted to pick up one or a few of these for a series setup. Any chance you plan to elaborate on a safe/smart way to add low-temp protection for a battery like this? Perhaps that could be part of some future video?
The main benefits of pouch cells are cost savings, weight savings, and added flexibility with the shape of the battery. Pouch cells are some of the most energy dense types of LFP batteries since they don't have a metal casing around them. If they are properly compressed they shouldn't have issues with de-lamination over the life of the battery. I feel they are reliable if they are protected. In this plastic case they should be well protected. In comparison, lithium ion (ncm) pouch cells swell with high discharge and charge cycles. If you have ever seen a swollen laptop battery or a swollen Lipo battery used in the RC industry you know what I am talking about. They look like balloons! I'm not sure that's the case with LFP pouch cells since I don't think they can swell like lithium ion ones.
Smaller form factor is definitely a plus. I have been considering changing out my 36v trolling motor batteries to lithium. I think 3 of these might work out well.
*UPDATE* I did, in fact, change out my group 31 lead acid batteries for 3 of these 100ah Mini's. They have performed very well & not only save space but they each weigh a bit over 40 lbs less in weight. So that is a total weight savings of 120 lbs.
I think i’d rather see a standard size battery with a higher Ah capacity. My RV trailer has a compartment for a single group 31 battery, so a smaller 100 Ah battery doesn’t do anything for me., however, a group 31 with 130 or 140 Ah would be awesome.
Thanks for the teardown. Ugh, I'm not a fan of pounch cells, especially when EVE battery packs are just 'larger' packs. I hope those smaller pouch cells don't inflate.
Less weight is always better since gas prices r so high. I still feel the battery r high price even with discount. Thx u for the video. Informative & helpful.
Same as Li Time and other battery makers that are offering this pouch (Polymer Coated Aluminum Foil) configuration. Supposed to be a lot cheaper on materials to make. I don't exect the manufacturers to pass on any savings. I worry about the long term reliability of the pouch cells due to gas swelling. I know pouch are used in a lot of new new laptops, and Cell Phones. I read that Apple had swelling issues with pouch cells used in their earlier I Phones, and other products. Is there any product that has used multiple, series /parallel, configured pouch cells in a product like this for a significant period? If such a product exists, then what is the long term product reliabilty. Not sure what happens when a foil cell enclosure fails. Is the cell electrolite conductive/corrorsive? Personally, I will wait a while, until they have been around for a while. This will allow the the manufacturing, safety, and reliablity issues of this new product to be worked out.
mini pouch style battery, i haven't seen a video of someone destroying a lfp pouch cell yet, hopefully it's still safe. i think prismatic are a bit better and cylindrical are the most protected, but when you want space efficiency, pouch cells will do that. the bolt fires that use pouch cells in the nmc variety are the ones that scare people, as the fire can easily spread to other cells when there is a failure. i wonder if we will see 24v or 200ah in these small form factors
If they were NMC pouches I'd be a bit worried. I have seen many of those laptop batteries puff up like a balloon. Since these are LFP it shouldn't do the same thing, especially since they are compressed. I think they are planning to make a 200ah battery in the same form factor. That will really make a difference since the 200ah batteries are HUGE!!
Much has been asked about Pros/Cons vs. Prismatic form factor. I, too, am still …. Ambivalent (?). The ONE Thing that gives me pause, is that I’ve heard mention of ‘thermal runaway’ scenarios, which is where ‘Concern’ comes up. While I have heard of this, associated with Pouch and not Prismatic, I have yet to find any objective, science-based explanation as it would pertain to LifePO4 POUCH cells and Thermal Runaway …..
It's not the form factor or the case of the battery that leads to thermal runaway, it's the internal electrolyte of the battery chemistry. LFP (lifepo4 or lithium iron phosphate) batteries do not use nickel as the internal electrolyte. Lithium ion batteries do and that's why they go boom boom. LFP cells don't have any fire risk and that's one of the big advantages over lithium ion batteries.
I have a battery box on my 5th wheel is 11"x14". This form factor will allow me to put two mini batteries in it, and give me 200ah, instead of one 100ah larger battery. Just wish they had put low temp cutoff in them.
@@Jasonoid That is correct. Haven't heard of an RV that comes with a charge controller that would have that feature, unless it has solar. That's also just another expense the manufacturer doesn't provide with the sale. Owners would have to purchase and install an MPPT controller with that type of function. However, I don't have solar, just want LifePo4 batteries right now. Hard to find a charge controller that isn't setup for solar charging with cold temp cutoff.
Victron has a sensor that will bind with their bluetooth charge controllers that will disabled charging at the programmed temperature: 100voc / 30amp charge controller: amzn.to/47nPBVU Smart temp sensor: amzn.to/3Knfb3o
@@Jasonoid Yes, Victron has a way to shut off PV from charging a battery with a temperature sensor, but I'm talking about a non-solar charging system. RV connected to shore power or a vehicle, to inverter/converter, to battery and still able to use the battery when the temp gets down, but won't charge it.
@@farside87 gotcha, if you're charging off shore power you could always heat the batteries with heating pads or have a small heating element in the box to keep them above freezing.
I'm guessing you should charge and discharge it more gently than the bigger battery, due to potential internal heat buildup in something so dense, maybe happening before it reaches the external temp sensor. 1C is pretty aggressive in any case. I like sticking to 0.2C or 0.25C whenever possible. Slow and steady wins the race when it comes to battery life. I do like it being smaller and lighter, even if my impression of pouch cells is that they're iffy.
Agreed, but I appreciate Jason testing the higher C rates; if the battery passes at 1C+ charge/discharge, it'll likely have no issues at lower rates. I think many who watch this channel are pretty savvy when it comes to battery care and maintenance, but Jason also does a good job adding disclaimers for newbies. RE: pouch cells, I have a similar perspective, but wonder if that's just because I read one too many articles on Chevy Bolts catching on fire (with NCM batteries rather than LiFePO4). I'd be curious to hear what Jason, Will Prowse, and others think are the tradeoffs that come with pouch cells. Maybe they're really solid in this form factor!
The owners manual recommends a 20 amp charge rate (0.2C rate) for the best longevity. In the video I demonstrate what the BMS can handle and for the best lifespan the battery shouldn't be treated this way. I basically torture the battery to make sure it doesn't fail. 'Slow and steady' definitely wins the race if you want to have a long lasting battery. Lithium ion pouch cells have a bad reputation since they off gas if they are charged or discharged at high levels. I'm sure you have seen the swollen laptop / RC batteries looking like a balloon! I'm not sure LFP has that same issue with swelling.
I think Power Queen released a similar form factor recently Would be interesting to see a comparison. I def. am interested in this form factor for a DYI power station.
I bought the redodo mini's and I believe Redodo, Li Time ND Power Queen are the same company. The packets that come with them are exactly the same and they come with the same decals. Just branded differently
Another great review Jason. What are your feelings about pouch cells ? Seems like the only way to make Lifepo4 smaller and lighter is to use pouch cells. Any negatives vs prismatic cells ? I was interested in Btr Power 24v 140ah and they are smaller and lighter than every other battery in its class. I messaged them on Amazon and they told me prismatic. I'm still not convince and I email Btr directly and they confirmed pouch cells.
The main benefits of pouch cells are cost savings, weight savings, and added flexibility with the shape of the battery. Pouch cells are some of the most energy dense types of LFP batteries since they don't have a metal casing around them. If they are properly compressed they shouldn't have issues with de-lamination over the life of the battery. I feel they are reliable if they are protected. In this plastic case they should be well protected. In comparison, lithium ion (ncm) pouch cells swell with high discharge and charge cycles. If you have ever seen a swollen laptop battery or a swollen Lipo battery used in the RC industry you know what I am talking about. They look like balloons! I'm not sure that's the case with LFP pouch cells since I don't think they can swell like lithium ion ones.
Will two of those fit in the Licetti box? It doesn't look like it, but thought I'd ask. Yes, my Licetti box arrived, a lot more quickly than I expected. The main switch seems a little flaky, but it seems to be working.
Two of them won't fit into the case unfortunately. So I'd stick with my previous recommendation of the Dr. Prepare due to cold temp charging protection built in.
Hi very informative video. Definitely this battery is the one can fit in my kayak hatch and run all my electronics, exept the motor. I am wondering if i can mount this battery on the side and if yes, which side would be recomanded. Also i am a little bit confused, i have an 20 amp charger with lithium option and LiFePo4 option. Can i ask please which option will be the best for my battery charging. I am assuming this battery can be charged with other chargers too than Redodo sells. Thank you so much for your answear.
Most trolling motors only pull 20 to 30 amps at peak power. This one can handle 100 amps consistently so it would probably run your trolling motor for a couple hours just fine. You'll want to select LIFEPO4 mode when charging, the other lithium setting is probably for a different type of battery.
This battery uses a different type of battery outer shell. Instead of 'cylindrical cells' or 'prismatic cells' that have larger metal casings that take up more space, this battery uses 'pouch cells'. These have less material and can be formed in different shapes. There are advantages to each type of cell, you'll need to google each one to get the full list. Some people say these aren't as durable but I'm not that sure it would be an issue since they have the outer plastic case protecting them.
This battery would definitely fit into the Licitti battery box, there just would be lots of wasted space. I'm sure in the future as more companies pickup on smaller batteries the battery boxes will get smaller.
@@Jasonoid Hey, maybe that "wasted space" would allow the installation of a better charger in the licitti box, or better battery monitoring gear that could now be included in the single box..... There is a thought for a new video... i enjoy watching the videos, because I have all thesse ideas, and don't have the money to play around and experiment myself, LOL
@@Jasonoid Great video Jason, I did notice that ReDodo has a bundle with their own battery box, about $80. Has 2 Cig ports @15 amps, and some USB ports.
Hi All, I am planing on a build around a Renogy 2000W 12V Pure Sine Wave Inverter and 4 Redodo 12V 100Ah Mini LiFePO4 battery run in parallel. The battery lugs are 5.5” apart. I plan on buying pre made wire. My questions are… What size wire gauge would you recommend for the batteries and how long? Also what gauge would you recommend from batteries to inverter. Thank you all in advance.
You'd see around 175 amps peak while running a 2000 watt inverter on a 12v battery setup (volts X amps = watts 12volts X 175 amps ~ 2100 watts). I'd recommend using a 175 amp fuse and 2/0 wire between the batteries and inverter. The length doesn't really matter as the wire should handle the peak load just fine.
Hey Jason, I know you are asked to review many products but I'm very intrigue with the Btr Power 24v 140ah. Its the only kind in its class. They are smaller and lighter than every 24v 100ah because they use pouch cells even with the higher capacity. Very curious to see how they pack those pouch cells inside this battery
That battery does look a little more compact than most 24v 100ah batteries. They must have really found a compact cast to put all that power into. Most companies just use a standard case and they have lots of air gaps. What are you wanting to use the battery for?
@@Jasonoid I have 2 older 12v Valence rated @138ah that I hooked in series creating 24v. No way of expanding this unless I find some more of these(I don't want to) or start from scratch. I figured I can get 1 Btr 24v @140ah and see if I can hook these in parallel since their capacity is similar. If it doesn't work out I will just buy another Btr 24v. No one of the net has this battery in review.
newbie to all this, I have an interstate deepcycle battery for my rv, can I replace that battery with this one and not need a special charger? will it charge with truck while driving or a generator like I do the deep cycle. all i use my battery for is water pump and lights just wanted something that will last longer without worrying about running out of battery after 5 or 6 days. Thank you and sorry for all the noob questions.
LFP batteries are meant to be "drop in replacements" to lead acid batteries. It should be fine to do that since the BMS will keep the battery from being over-charged. Just be aware this does NOT have low temp charging protection so charging it in cold temps will damage the battery.
The main benefits of pouch cells are cost savings, weight savings, and added flexibility with the shape of the battery. Pouch cells are some of the most energy dense types of LFP batteries since they don't have a metal casing around them. If they are properly compressed they shouldn't have issues with de-lamination over the life of the battery. I feel they are reliable if they are protected. In this plastic case they should be well protected. In comparison, lithium ion (ncm) pouch cells swell with high discharge and charge cycles. If you have ever seen a swollen laptop battery or a swollen Lipo battery used in the RC industry you know what I am talking about. They look like balloons! I'm not sure that's the case with LFP pouch cells since I don't think they can swell like lithium ion ones.
It should fit into that battery box but you'd have to really put a lot of foam padding around it to keep it secure. Might be best to go with the Dr. Prepare on that box.
Is this mini asteroid hood as the trolling battery for a trolling motor? I have kayaks and need a small and light battery but only if it performs or lasts in the water as the bigger trolling battery?
@@JasonoidI thought the only trolling battery was a group 31, the group 31 is big. I order a mini but if you can tell me which newer smaller battery is better i will order it. Thanks a bunch.
This is the new one I saw: www.redodopower.com/products/redodo-12v-100ah-group-24-deep-cycle-battery They are all going to perform nearly the same. Don't stress it.
If it's the same chemistry and size of capacity, it should be just fine. For example connecting with another full size 100ah LFP battery it's good to go.
I'm not familiar with that term, 'the BMS opens up'. When I was testing this battery it shut down around 11 volts (maybe a little lower) and stopped charging around 14.5 volts.
While charging, the bms stops allowing to charge. when it goes up to 13.53 it will jump up to 14.4v. and the amps drops to 0 amps. meaning Bms went to protect right? I build my own batteries for a hobby, if well balanced the bms stops at 14.5 to 14.6 hope that helps. @@Jasonoid
@@KR1IS yes, that could be the case. The BMS is possibly sensing one of the cells is hitting 3.65v or so before the others and shuts off. Usually the balancing happens at a pretty high SOC. You could try to put a adjustable power supply on it for a couple days sitting at 13.4 volts and maybe the BMS will equal things out very slowly.
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When was that decided? Read the comments in the last battery video here: th-cam.com/video/UDf2BI_VIss/w-d-xo.html I asked about tear downs and the 99% majority said yes to tear downs.
@@Jasonoid Definitely teardown. Why not do it if you're able to unless the manufacturer said NO and they want their stuff back. In that case Jason probably wouldn't bother with it. Companies are probably knocking down the door asking Jason to review their stuff.
lol so they changed the case, it isn't smaller cells. , ytubers. the battery is the same just a case sized to it instead of group 27 stuffed full of foam etc.
I should have pulled both put of their cases to show you the size of the cells, my bad. These are 'pouch cells' and take up less space as well, it's not just the case that changed. You can see that with the weight of the batteries combined.
i have two Li Time 100 Ah minis that I really like. They have just as much stored power as their full size 100 Ah batteries. I really appreciate how light and compact that they are. They fit into smaller spaces and are so much easier on my 76 year old back. These minis are a real improvement!
I agree, weight savings and space savings are very important!
Thank you for opening this up... I was wondering what they were doing to jam that capacity in the smaller form factor.. I did cringe a little when I saw pouch cells.. I guess that's just what I've been trained to do.. Probably in the real world, the pouch cell is just as reliable as the prismatic.. The only thing that bothers me is the cells are in a 4s4p config.. So you have 16 things that could fail instead of 4 in the prismatic battery box format.
I was so impressed with the REDODO 100AH mini battery, and the support, that I purchased another one!
I just found one of these on Amazon for $225 after a 10% off promotion. You can't beat this level of convenience & performance for that price.
A good review Jason. Smaller and lighter is a good thing, especially for us older people!
I hope more brands adopt this form factor!
Size definitely matters when you are talking about my tongue weight. I bought one of these and wonder what people are doing for battery boxes for them.
Always appreciate your new info. and reviews Jason !
size and weight is very important for an RV or overlanding, especially for DIY
For rv? try kayak that doesn’t have much space and you are the one pulling it in and out of the water.
I would highly recommend Redodo Batteries to anyone in need of high-quality lithium iron batteries. The product is top-notch, and the customer service is exceptional.
Thanks, loving these "mini" 100Ah batteries, the smaller size is an important plus for me
Nice, i hope they have a version of this in their 12v 200 Ah models. Also, I hope customers and these battery companies start switching to 48v batteries and inverters as we can use smaller gauge wire and be more efficient in our systems?
Shared with family member who wants to swap Class B RV lead acid house batteries. Will consider for a van conversion for compactness if I do a DIY assembly and not a ready made power station.
LOVE the form factor. Same capacity in a smaller footprint can only be a positive. Just when you think LiFePO4 batteries could not get any better, this comes along. Sweet!
Thank you for the great review!
I will definitely factor this one in for the upcoming house battery upgrade in my camper.
Nice tear down man, I like the mini size instead of the other one, very cool. Thanks for sharing too.
No problem 👍
Interesting how they can be connected in series, I wonder how well they'd stay in balance without communication or balancing between packs. Nice size too.
Love the small form factor testing. Would really like to see more like this. Power Queen has a small factor that you should test and compare.
LiTime, Redodo, and PowerQueen all have essentially identical “Mini” batts.
Pouch vs. Prismatic cell form factor is still pretty “new” in these types of batteries.
They’re the same battery. It’s a white label product
This is perfect for someone like me. It never goes below 10c here. Maybe 9c at the lowest night of december.
Most of the year it is above 30 . And for few months as high as 47. Like today was 44c.
So i don't need any low temperature disconnect.
Two of them should run my home for more than 3 hours. And that is long enough that I won't need a generator because the typical power outage is less than 1hr.
While outage can be as long as 7 days if the cyclone decides to wreck the grid.
the cover doubles as an Ice cube tray for camping the size is always helpful when you are cramming for space. Redodo is a weird name but they make solid batteries it seems.
Ice cube tray! LOL Love it!
Love the small form factor too. If there was one with a bluetooth chip in it so I can monitor how much is left and what is going in and out then I would buy it.
Good review as always Jasonoid :)
Thanks RamblinBob :)
What up Doe!?
I think I like the smaller one. It would be a bit more compact when building a diy solar system?
Great job Dr J'👍🏼
Awesome video as always, Jason! Thanks for the excellent breakdown, pun half intended. Would love to hear your thoughts on the viability/tradeoffs (if any tradeoffs) in using pouch cells for LiFePO4 batteries. For example, thermal management, longevity, repairability, etc. Maybe a video idea, I'm not sure.
In any case, I'm very tempted to pick up one or a few of these for a series setup. Any chance you plan to elaborate on a safe/smart way to add low-temp protection for a battery like this? Perhaps that could be part of some future video?
The main benefits of pouch cells are cost savings, weight savings, and added flexibility with the shape of the battery. Pouch cells are some of the most energy dense types of LFP batteries since they don't have a metal casing around them. If they are properly compressed they shouldn't have issues with de-lamination over the life of the battery. I feel they are reliable if they are protected. In this plastic case they should be well protected.
In comparison, lithium ion (ncm) pouch cells swell with high discharge and charge cycles. If you have ever seen a swollen laptop battery or a swollen Lipo battery used in the RC industry you know what I am talking about. They look like balloons! I'm not sure that's the case with LFP pouch cells since I don't think they can swell like lithium ion ones.
@@Jasonoid Thank you for the feedback! Great to get your take on the pouch cells - seems like it'll be largely upside in this form factor/chemistry.
Smaller form factor is definitely a plus. I have been considering changing out my 36v trolling motor batteries to lithium.
I think 3 of these might work out well.
That would work well to save on space and weight!
*UPDATE*
I did, in fact, change out my group 31 lead acid batteries for 3 of these 100ah Mini's. They have performed very well & not only save space but they each weigh a bit over 40 lbs less in weight. So that is a total weight savings of 120 lbs.
Any problems with balancing?
@LaurieNCooper No problems. I use a 4 bank charger, so each battery has an individual charge lead.
😎 thanks Jason 🌷
I like that I was able to replace my four GC2 batteries with five mini batteries and basically quadrupling my amp hours
They are super compact! Great power density!
This battery seems like a good value for the price.
I think i’d rather see a standard size battery with a higher Ah capacity. My RV trailer has a compartment for a single group 31 battery, so a smaller 100 Ah battery doesn’t do anything for me., however, a group 31 with 130 or 140 Ah would be awesome.
Thanks for the teardown. Ugh, I'm not a fan of pounch cells, especially when EVE battery packs are just 'larger' packs. I hope those smaller pouch cells don't inflate.
They seemed compressed pretty decently, I'd hope they won't inflate overtime.
Less weight is always better since gas prices r so high. I still feel the battery r high price even with discount. Thx u for the video. Informative & helpful.
I feel ya on gas prices! Sheeesh!
Lighter weight is nice, but I think I would prefer the older form factor and have more amp hours in the box at the same weight.
Agreed, hope they start making those as well. More power-more better :)
they make them already, I've seen a 150ah
Hi good video,I am always running out of space so any savings can only be a good thing. 👍🐝🌞
At 35% smaller you can fit 4 of these batteries where you could only fit 3 of the others! Pretty sweet!
Size is important. I am waiting for inexpensive quality 150ah Group 31 lithium battery
Size matters.
I like this skinny model.
LOL
I ordered a 100ah Redodo battery a while back.. Slow shipping. Still waiting. Hopefully it's worth the wait.
Shipping wasn't horrible for me. When did you buy it? Any tracking number from the order?
I like the smaller size for RV and Marine use.
Add low temp protection and I am in.
Lithium batteries definitely needed to be taller. As a boater, a ten inch high battery is quite welcome
Same as Li Time and other battery makers that are offering this pouch (Polymer Coated Aluminum Foil) configuration. Supposed to be a lot cheaper on materials to make. I don't exect the manufacturers to pass on any savings.
I worry about the long term reliability of the pouch cells due to gas swelling. I know pouch are used in a lot of new new laptops, and Cell Phones. I read that Apple had swelling issues with pouch cells used in their earlier I Phones, and other products.
Is there any product that has used multiple, series /parallel, configured pouch cells in a product like this for a significant period? If such a product exists, then what is the long term product reliabilty.
Not sure what happens when a foil cell enclosure fails. Is the cell electrolite conductive/corrorsive?
Personally, I will wait a while, until they have been around for a while. This will allow the the manufacturing, safety, and reliablity issues of this new product to be worked out.
Wow China is way ahead! Forward thinking and winning the game😊
Size matters as replacing RV LA batteries
Good test, thanks.
mini pouch style battery, i haven't seen a video of someone destroying a lfp pouch cell yet, hopefully it's still safe. i think prismatic are a bit better and cylindrical are the most protected, but when you want space efficiency, pouch cells will do that.
the bolt fires that use pouch cells in the nmc variety are the ones that scare people, as the fire can easily spread to other cells when there is a failure.
i wonder if we will see 24v or 200ah in these small form factors
If they were NMC pouches I'd be a bit worried. I have seen many of those laptop batteries puff up like a balloon. Since these are LFP it shouldn't do the same thing, especially since they are compressed. I think they are planning to make a 200ah battery in the same form factor. That will really make a difference since the 200ah batteries are HUGE!!
Much has been asked about Pros/Cons vs. Prismatic form factor. I, too, am still …. Ambivalent (?). The ONE Thing that gives me pause, is that I’ve heard mention of ‘thermal runaway’ scenarios, which is where ‘Concern’ comes up. While I have heard of this, associated with Pouch and not Prismatic, I have yet to find any objective, science-based explanation as it would pertain to LifePO4 POUCH cells and Thermal Runaway …..
It's not the form factor or the case of the battery that leads to thermal runaway, it's the internal electrolyte of the battery chemistry. LFP (lifepo4 or lithium iron phosphate) batteries do not use nickel as the internal electrolyte. Lithium ion batteries do and that's why they go boom boom. LFP cells don't have any fire risk and that's one of the big advantages over lithium ion batteries.
I have a battery box on my 5th wheel is 11"x14". This form factor will allow me to put two mini batteries in it, and give me 200ah, instead of one 100ah larger battery. Just wish they had put low temp cutoff in them.
I have heard of some charge controllers have that feature built into them. Then you wouldn't need it in the battery.
@@Jasonoid That is correct. Haven't heard of an RV that comes with a charge controller that would have that feature, unless it has solar. That's also just another expense the manufacturer doesn't provide with the sale. Owners would have to purchase and install an MPPT controller with that type of function. However, I don't have solar, just want LifePo4 batteries right now. Hard to find a charge controller that isn't setup for solar charging with cold temp cutoff.
Victron has a sensor that will bind with their bluetooth charge controllers that will disabled charging at the programmed temperature:
100voc / 30amp charge controller: amzn.to/47nPBVU
Smart temp sensor: amzn.to/3Knfb3o
@@Jasonoid Yes, Victron has a way to shut off PV from charging a battery with a temperature sensor, but I'm talking about a non-solar charging system. RV connected to shore power or a vehicle, to inverter/converter, to battery and still able to use the battery when the temp gets down, but won't charge it.
@@farside87 gotcha, if you're charging off shore power you could always heat the batteries with heating pads or have a small heating element in the box to keep them above freezing.
great job another battleborn killer. great battery
Agreed!
I'm guessing you should charge and discharge it more gently than the bigger battery, due to potential internal heat buildup in something so dense, maybe happening before it reaches the external temp sensor. 1C is pretty aggressive in any case. I like sticking to 0.2C or 0.25C whenever possible. Slow and steady wins the race when it comes to battery life.
I do like it being smaller and lighter, even if my impression of pouch cells is that they're iffy.
Agreed, but I appreciate Jason testing the higher C rates; if the battery passes at 1C+ charge/discharge, it'll likely have no issues at lower rates. I think many who watch this channel are pretty savvy when it comes to battery care and maintenance, but Jason also does a good job adding disclaimers for newbies.
RE: pouch cells, I have a similar perspective, but wonder if that's just because I read one too many articles on Chevy Bolts catching on fire (with NCM batteries rather than LiFePO4). I'd be curious to hear what Jason, Will Prowse, and others think are the tradeoffs that come with pouch cells. Maybe they're really solid in this form factor!
The owners manual recommends a 20 amp charge rate (0.2C rate) for the best longevity. In the video I demonstrate what the BMS can handle and for the best lifespan the battery shouldn't be treated this way. I basically torture the battery to make sure it doesn't fail. 'Slow and steady' definitely wins the race if you want to have a long lasting battery.
Lithium ion pouch cells have a bad reputation since they off gas if they are charged or discharged at high levels. I'm sure you have seen the swollen laptop / RC batteries looking like a balloon! I'm not sure LFP has that same issue with swelling.
Awesome
I think Power Queen released a similar form factor recently Would be interesting to see a comparison.
I def. am interested in this form factor for a DYI power station.
I bought the redodo mini's and I believe Redodo, Li Time ND Power Queen are the same company. The packets that come with them are exactly the same and they come with the same decals. Just branded differently
Why not use a grinder on the edges to open the case?
Gotta avoid shorting out the BMS and the terminals that are super close to the lid on this design.
I got the litume mini 100 amp.
Another great review Jason. What are your feelings about pouch cells ? Seems like the only way to make Lifepo4 smaller and lighter is to use pouch cells. Any negatives vs prismatic cells ? I was interested in Btr Power 24v 140ah and they are smaller and lighter than every other battery in its class. I messaged them on Amazon and they told me prismatic. I'm still not convince and I email Btr directly and they confirmed pouch cells.
The main benefits of pouch cells are cost savings, weight savings, and added flexibility with the shape of the battery. Pouch cells are some of the most energy dense types of LFP batteries since they don't have a metal casing around them. If they are properly compressed they shouldn't have issues with de-lamination over the life of the battery. I feel they are reliable if they are protected. In this plastic case they should be well protected.
In comparison, lithium ion (ncm) pouch cells swell with high discharge and charge cycles. If you have ever seen a swollen laptop battery or a swollen Lipo battery used in the RC industry you know what I am talking about. They look like balloons! I'm not sure that's the case with LFP pouch cells since I don't think they can swell like lithium ion ones.
Will two of those fit in the Licetti box? It doesn't look like it, but thought I'd ask. Yes, my Licetti box arrived, a lot more quickly than I expected. The main switch seems a little flaky, but it seems to be working.
Two of them won't fit into the case unfortunately. So I'd stick with my previous recommendation of the Dr. Prepare due to cold temp charging protection built in.
I would like to know who makes this battery, as there is about 6 resellers with different names.
Probably 1 large manufacturer in China that just allows brands to mark them as they wish. I don't know the offical name of the company.
Hi very informative video. Definitely this battery is the one can fit in my kayak hatch and run all my electronics, exept the motor. I am wondering if i can mount this battery on the side and if yes, which side would be recomanded. Also i am a little bit confused, i have an 20 amp charger with lithium option and LiFePo4 option. Can i ask please which option will be the best for my battery charging.
I am assuming this battery can be charged with other chargers too than Redodo sells.
Thank you so much for your answear.
Most trolling motors only pull 20 to 30 amps at peak power. This one can handle 100 amps consistently so it would probably run your trolling motor for a couple hours just fine.
You'll want to select LIFEPO4 mode when charging, the other lithium setting is probably for a different type of battery.
Size matters for sure , what is the highest inverter you can use with this battery ? Thanks
1280 watts peak
I like the smaller form factor. Are there any drawbacks from it being smaller? Curious why all of them are not this size.
This battery uses a different type of battery outer shell. Instead of 'cylindrical cells' or 'prismatic cells' that have larger metal casings that take up more space, this battery uses 'pouch cells'. These have less material and can be formed in different shapes. There are advantages to each type of cell, you'll need to google each one to get the full list. Some people say these aren't as durable but I'm not that sure it would be an issue since they have the outer plastic case protecting them.
Seems odd that the size would not work with common products like Licitti battery box.
Seems they're nonconvergent development cycles.
Damn... both are 'transcendent' and of interest to me...a fulltime RVer.
C'est la vie... we go on.
This battery would definitely fit into the Licitti battery box, there just would be lots of wasted space. I'm sure in the future as more companies pickup on smaller batteries the battery boxes will get smaller.
@@Jasonoid Hey, maybe that "wasted space" would allow the installation of a better charger in the licitti box, or better battery monitoring gear that could now be included in the single box..... There is a thought for a new video... i enjoy watching the videos, because I have all thesse ideas, and don't have the money to play around and experiment myself, LOL
@@Jasonoid Great video Jason, I did notice that ReDodo has a bundle with their own battery box, about $80. Has 2 Cig ports @15 amps, and some USB ports.
Hi All, I am planing on a build around a Renogy 2000W 12V Pure Sine Wave Inverter and 4 Redodo 12V 100Ah Mini LiFePO4 battery run in parallel. The battery lugs are 5.5” apart. I plan on buying pre made wire. My questions are… What size wire gauge would you recommend for the batteries and how long? Also what gauge would you recommend from batteries to inverter. Thank you all in advance.
You'd see around 175 amps peak while running a 2000 watt inverter on a 12v battery setup (volts X amps = watts 12volts X 175 amps ~ 2100 watts). I'd recommend using a 175 amp fuse and 2/0 wire between the batteries and inverter. The length doesn't really matter as the wire should handle the peak load just fine.
Hey Jason, I know you are asked to review many products but I'm very intrigue with the Btr Power 24v 140ah. Its the only kind in its class. They are smaller and lighter than every 24v 100ah because they use pouch cells even with the higher capacity. Very curious to see how they pack those pouch cells inside this battery
That battery does look a little more compact than most 24v 100ah batteries. They must have really found a compact cast to put all that power into. Most companies just use a standard case and they have lots of air gaps. What are you wanting to use the battery for?
@@Jasonoid I have 2 older 12v Valence rated @138ah that I hooked in series creating 24v. No way of expanding this unless I find some more of these(I don't want to) or start from scratch. I figured I can get 1 Btr 24v @140ah and see if I can hook these in parallel since their capacity is similar. If it doesn't work out I will just buy another Btr 24v. No one of the net has this battery in review.
newbie to all this, I have an interstate deepcycle battery for my rv, can I replace that battery with this one and not need a special charger? will it charge with truck while driving or a generator like I do the deep cycle. all i use my battery for is water pump and lights just wanted something that will last longer without worrying about running out of battery after 5 or 6 days. Thank you and sorry for all the noob questions.
LFP batteries are meant to be "drop in replacements" to lead acid batteries. It should be fine to do that since the BMS will keep the battery from being over-charged. Just be aware this does NOT have low temp charging protection so charging it in cold temps will damage the battery.
I already have 2!
Are the pouch cells less reliable over time than the type of cells found in its larger sibling?
The main benefits of pouch cells are cost savings, weight savings, and added flexibility with the shape of the battery. Pouch cells are some of the most energy dense types of LFP batteries since they don't have a metal casing around them. If they are properly compressed they shouldn't have issues with de-lamination over the life of the battery. I feel they are reliable if they are protected. In this plastic case they should be well protected.
In comparison, lithium ion (ncm) pouch cells swell with high discharge and charge cycles. If you have ever seen a swollen laptop battery or a swollen Lipo battery used in the RC industry you know what I am talking about. They look like balloons! I'm not sure that's the case with LFP pouch cells since I don't think they can swell like lithium ion ones.
5year warranty ?? Not good enough for me
I have been told that size doesn't matter. Not sure that is true :)
LOL
Would it fit the LICITTI Battery Box ?
It should fit into that battery box but you'd have to really put a lot of foam padding around it to keep it secure. Might be best to go with the Dr. Prepare on that box.
Too tall to fit my RV. Can it be placed on it's side?
Pouch cells don't have a preference on how they are oriented, should be fine!
Is this mini asteroid hood as the trolling battery for a trolling motor? I have kayaks and need a small and light battery but only if it performs or lasts in the water as the bigger trolling battery?
* is this mini as good as the trolling
The newer small 100ah "trolling" battery is a better version in my opinion since it uses normal cells, not pouch cells.
@@JasonoidI thought the only trolling battery was a group 31, the group 31 is big. I order a mini but if you can tell me which newer smaller battery is better i will order it. Thanks a bunch.
This is the new one I saw:
www.redodopower.com/products/redodo-12v-100ah-group-24-deep-cycle-battery
They are all going to perform nearly the same. Don't stress it.
@@Jasonoid thanks 🙏🏻 a bunch for your help man.
Can these be put in parallel or series with the regular 100 battery?
If it's the same chemistry and size of capacity, it should be just fine. For example connecting with another full size 100ah LFP battery it's good to go.
@@Jasonoid Thanks!
Mine came way out of balance
Did you tear it apart to the the individual cell voltages? How did you know it's out of balance?
the bms opens up at 13.53v
@@Jasonoid that's 3.3825 if balanced
I'm not familiar with that term, 'the BMS opens up'. When I was testing this battery it shut down around 11 volts (maybe a little lower) and stopped charging around 14.5 volts.
While charging, the bms stops allowing to charge. when it goes up to 13.53 it will jump up to 14.4v. and the amps drops to 0 amps. meaning Bms went to protect right? I build my own batteries for a hobby, if well balanced the bms stops at 14.5 to 14.6 hope that helps. @@Jasonoid
@@KR1IS yes, that could be the case. The BMS is possibly sensing one of the cells is hitting 3.65v or so before the others and shuts off. Usually the balancing happens at a pretty high SOC. You could try to put a adjustable power supply on it for a couple days sitting at 13.4 volts and maybe the BMS will equal things out very slowly.
I like smaller
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KJV
Romans 5:12 - Wherefore, as by one man sin entered into the world, and death by sin; and so death passed upon all men, for that all have sinned:
Romans 3:10,23-24
3:10- As it is written, There is none righteous, no, not one
3:23-24 - For all have sinned, and come short of the glory of God; Being justified freely by his grace through the redemption that is in Christ Jesus.
1 Corinthians 15:1-4
Moreover, brethren, I declare unto you the gospel which I preached unto you, which also ye have received, and wherein ye stand; By which also ye are saved, if ye keep in memory what I preached unto you, unless ye have believed in vain. For I delivered unto you first of all that which I also received, how that Christ died for our sins according to the scriptures; And that he was buried, and that he rose again the third day according to the scriptures:
-(How that Christ died - he shed his blood)
Romans 3:25
Whom God hath sent forth to be a propitiation through faith in his blood, to declare his righteousness for the remissions of sins that are past, through the forbearance of God.
Hebrews 9:22
And almost all things are by the law purged with blood; and without shedding of blood is no remission.
Ephesians 1:7
In whom we have redemption through his blood, the forgiveness of sins, according to the riches of his grace;
Ephesians 2:8-9
For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God:
Not of works, lest any man should boast.
Hebrews 10:10
By the which we are sanctified through the offering of the body of Jesus Christ once for all
%^^^&&&&
Faith Alone
Galatians 2:16
Knowing that a man is not justified by the works of the law, but by the faith of Jesus Christ, even we have believed in Jesus Christ, that we might be justified by the faith of Christ, and not by the works of the law: for by the works of the law shall no flesh be justified.
Galatians 2:21
I do not frustrate the grace of God: for if righteousness come by the law, then Christ is dead in vain.
#####!!!
Once Saved Always Saved
Ephesians 1:13
In whom ye also trusted, after that ye heard the word of truth, the gospel of your salvation: in whom also after that ye believed, ye were sealed with that holy Spirit of promise.Which is the earnest of our inheritance until the redemption of the purchased possession, unto the praise of his glory.
2 Timothy 1: 9,10
Who hath saved us, and called us with an holy calling, not according to our works, but according to his own purpose and grace, which was given us in Christ Jesus before the world began, But is now made manifest by the appearing of our Saviour Jesus Christ, who hath abolished death, and hath brought life and immortality to light through the gospel:
I thought we agreed on no tear downs.
When was that decided? Read the comments in the last battery video here: th-cam.com/video/UDf2BI_VIss/w-d-xo.html
I asked about tear downs and the 99% majority said yes to tear downs.
@@Jasonoid Definitely teardown. Why not do it if you're able to unless the manufacturer said NO and they want their stuff back. In that case Jason probably wouldn't bother with it. Companies are probably knocking down the door asking Jason to review their stuff.
lol so they changed the case, it isn't smaller cells. , ytubers. the battery is the same just a case sized to it instead of group 27 stuffed full of foam etc.
I should have pulled both put of their cases to show you the size of the cells, my bad. These are 'pouch cells' and take up less space as well, it's not just the case that changed. You can see that with the weight of the batteries combined.
don't like them lpf mini new Battery they say are dangerous will not buy