@@Baul_spiral9629no, the pronunciation is not wrong. Modern pronunciation is a completely legitimate convention. There is no rule that if you read a text written in an older form of any language that you must use some reconstructed pronunciation. Virtually no English speaker reads Shakespeare, the KJV Bible, or even Chaucer with a reconstructed 16th, 17th, or 14th century south-eastern English accent nor does an Icelander forgo his accent when reading the saga and no one complains about these, yet when it comes to Greek, it's apparently a sin to do what Greeks have been doing since time immemorial and what all the West was doing before Erasmus. Ridiculous.
@@Caralaza I'm not talking about some states of language, i'm talking about *different languages* . Modern greek is not ancient Greek. It's more than a simple evolution : Modern greek is a brand new language.
@@Baul_spiral9629 do you know modern and/or ancient Greek? The language is *extraordinarily* conservative when compared to every single other Indo-European language. The modern Greek is able to read the New Testament, a nearly 2000 year old text, with relative ease, whereas the average English speaker struggles with Shakespeare and is mostly helpless with Chaucer. Greek is NOT brand new, that is an utterly ridiculous statement. Modern Greek didn't just pop out of nowhere, it evolved directly from the ancient form. Every language evolves, but changes in grammar and diction does NOT suddenly make it a completely different language. Here is the Lord's prayer line by line in its original form, followed by the modern Demotic and then the conservative Katharevousa: Πάτερ ἡμῶν ὁ ἐν τοῖς οὐρανοῖς, Πατέρα μας, που εἰσαι στους ουρανούς, Πάτερ ἡμῶν ὁ ἐν τοῖς οὐρανοῖς, ἁγιασθήτω τὸ ὄνομά σου· ας αγιαστεί το όνομά σου· ἁγιασθήτω τὸ ὄνομά σου· ἐλθέτω ἡ βασιλεία σου· ας έρθει η βασιλεία σου· ἐλθέτω ἡ βασιλεία σου· γενηθήτω τὸ θέλημά σου, ας γίνει το θέλημά σου, γενηθήτω τὸ θέλημά σου, ὡς ἐν οὐρανῷ καὶ ἐπὶ τῆς γῆς· όπως στον ουρανό, έτσι και επάνω στη γη· ὡς ἐν οὐρανῷ, καὶ ἐπὶ τῆς γῆς· τὸν ἄρτον ἡμῶν τὸν ἐπιούσιον δὸς ἡμῖν σήμερον· το αναγκαίο μας ψωμί δώσε σε μας σήμερα· τὸν ἄρτον ἡμῶν τὸν ἐπιούσιον δὸς εἰς ἡμᾶς σήμερον· καὶ ἄφες ἡμῖν τὰ ὀφειλήματα ἡμῶν, ὡς καὶ ἡμεῖς ἀφίεμεν τοῖς ὀφειλέταις ἡμῶν· και συγχώρεσε σε μας τις αμαρτίες μας, όπως και εμείς συγχωρούμε σ’ αυτούς που αμαρτάνουν σε μας· καὶ συγχώρησον εἰς ἡμᾶς τὰς ἁμαρτίας ἡμῶν, καθὼς καὶ ἡμεῖς συγχωροῦμεν εἰς τοὺς ἁμαρτάνοντας εἰς ἡμᾶς· καὶ μὴ εἰσενέγκῇς ἡμᾶς εἰς πειρασμὸν, ἀλλα ῥῦσαι ἡμᾶς ἀπὸ τοῦ πονηροῦ, και μη μας φέρεις μέσα σε πειρασμό, αλλά ελευθέρωσέ μας από τον πονηρό, καὶ μὴ φέρῇς ἡμᾶς εἰς πειρασμόν, ἀλλὰ ἐλευθέρωσον ἡμᾶς ἀπὸ τοῦ πονηροῦ. ὅτι σοῦ ἐστιν ἡ βασιλεία καὶ ἡ δύναμις καὶ ἡ δόξα εἰς τοὺς αἰῶνας· Ἀμήν. επειδή δική σου είναι η βασιλεία και η δύναμη και η δόξα στους αιῶνες. Αμήν. Διότι σοῦ εἶναι ἡ βασιλεία καὶ ἡ δύναμις καὶ ἡ δόξα εἰς τοὺς αἰῶνας· Ἀμήν. The differences are NOT extreme by any means. The ancient and modern Katharevousa versions are nearly identical. Changes are modernizations, not translations into a whole new language. The dative is replaced by εις/σε (σε is a contraction of εις, NOT a new word) because the dative became obsolete outside of set constructions (e.g., εν αρχή). The jussive is replaced by ας (< ἀφίημι) + perfective in Demotic because 3rd person imperatives fell out of common use. The subjunctive does NOT disappear in Demotic, rather it merges with the indicative due to the two tenses having become pronounced more or less the same in the later half of the ANCIENT Koiné period. Most individual word changes are due to trends in diction and are still very ancient words (e.g., όπως for ως), and the original word often still exists in the modern language but with a restricted meaning (e.g., αφήνουμε/ομε(ν) from ancient ἀφίεμεν retains the ancient meaning of "to let go" but not typically in the sense of "forgiveness" as we see here). I can go on and on, but this should be enough evidence to show that Modern Greek IS Greek and not some new and foreign language. The evolution can *clearly* be seen and no hellenist worth their salt would disagree. Μὴ ἀφήσῃς νά σε τυφλώσῃ ἡ κατὰ τὴν νέαν ἑλληνικὰν προκατάληψή σου...
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Merci! À défaut de pouvoir écouter la radio en grec ancien pour s’imprégner de la langue, une telle lecture d’Homere à haute voix est très utile.
Very perfect
It is not Ancient Greek, it is a disaster
It is and with the correct articulation.
@@ONESHOT92E However it's the wrong pronunciation. The text is pronounced as if it was modern Greek.
@@Baul_spiral9629no, the pronunciation is not wrong. Modern pronunciation is a completely legitimate convention. There is no rule that if you read a text written in an older form of any language that you must use some reconstructed pronunciation. Virtually no English speaker reads Shakespeare, the KJV Bible, or even Chaucer with a reconstructed 16th, 17th, or 14th century south-eastern English accent nor does an Icelander forgo his accent when reading the saga and no one complains about these, yet when it comes to Greek, it's apparently a sin to do what Greeks have been doing since time immemorial and what all the West was doing before Erasmus. Ridiculous.
@@Caralaza I'm not talking about some states of language, i'm talking about *different languages* . Modern greek is not ancient Greek. It's more than a simple evolution : Modern greek is a brand new language.
@@Baul_spiral9629 do you know modern and/or ancient Greek? The language is *extraordinarily* conservative when compared to every single other Indo-European language. The modern Greek is able to read the New Testament, a nearly 2000 year old text, with relative ease, whereas the average English speaker struggles with Shakespeare and is mostly helpless with Chaucer. Greek is NOT brand new, that is an utterly ridiculous statement. Modern Greek didn't just pop out of nowhere, it evolved directly from the ancient form.
Every language evolves, but changes in grammar and diction does NOT suddenly make it a completely different language.
Here is the Lord's prayer line by line in its original form, followed by the modern Demotic and then the conservative Katharevousa:
Πάτερ ἡμῶν ὁ ἐν τοῖς οὐρανοῖς,
Πατέρα μας, που εἰσαι στους ουρανούς,
Πάτερ ἡμῶν ὁ ἐν τοῖς οὐρανοῖς,
ἁγιασθήτω τὸ ὄνομά σου·
ας αγιαστεί το όνομά σου·
ἁγιασθήτω τὸ ὄνομά σου·
ἐλθέτω ἡ βασιλεία σου·
ας έρθει η βασιλεία σου·
ἐλθέτω ἡ βασιλεία σου·
γενηθήτω τὸ θέλημά σου,
ας γίνει το θέλημά σου,
γενηθήτω τὸ θέλημά σου,
ὡς ἐν οὐρανῷ καὶ ἐπὶ τῆς γῆς·
όπως στον ουρανό, έτσι και επάνω στη γη·
ὡς ἐν οὐρανῷ, καὶ ἐπὶ τῆς γῆς·
τὸν ἄρτον ἡμῶν τὸν ἐπιούσιον δὸς ἡμῖν σήμερον·
το αναγκαίο μας ψωμί δώσε σε μας σήμερα·
τὸν ἄρτον ἡμῶν τὸν ἐπιούσιον δὸς εἰς ἡμᾶς σήμερον·
καὶ ἄφες ἡμῖν τὰ ὀφειλήματα ἡμῶν, ὡς καὶ ἡμεῖς ἀφίεμεν τοῖς ὀφειλέταις ἡμῶν·
και συγχώρεσε σε μας τις αμαρτίες μας, όπως και εμείς συγχωρούμε σ’ αυτούς που αμαρτάνουν σε μας·
καὶ συγχώρησον εἰς ἡμᾶς τὰς ἁμαρτίας ἡμῶν, καθὼς καὶ ἡμεῖς συγχωροῦμεν εἰς τοὺς ἁμαρτάνοντας εἰς ἡμᾶς·
καὶ μὴ εἰσενέγκῇς ἡμᾶς εἰς πειρασμὸν, ἀλλα ῥῦσαι ἡμᾶς ἀπὸ τοῦ πονηροῦ,
και μη μας φέρεις μέσα σε πειρασμό, αλλά ελευθέρωσέ μας από τον πονηρό,
καὶ μὴ φέρῇς ἡμᾶς εἰς πειρασμόν, ἀλλὰ ἐλευθέρωσον ἡμᾶς ἀπὸ τοῦ πονηροῦ.
ὅτι σοῦ ἐστιν ἡ βασιλεία καὶ ἡ δύναμις καὶ ἡ δόξα εἰς τοὺς αἰῶνας· Ἀμήν.
επειδή δική σου είναι η βασιλεία και η δύναμη και η δόξα στους αιῶνες. Αμήν.
Διότι σοῦ εἶναι ἡ βασιλεία καὶ ἡ δύναμις καὶ ἡ δόξα εἰς τοὺς αἰῶνας· Ἀμήν.
The differences are NOT extreme by any means. The ancient and modern Katharevousa versions are nearly identical. Changes are modernizations, not translations into a whole new language. The dative is replaced by εις/σε (σε is a contraction of εις, NOT a new word) because the dative became obsolete outside of set constructions (e.g., εν αρχή). The jussive is replaced by ας (< ἀφίημι) + perfective in Demotic because 3rd person imperatives fell out of common use. The subjunctive does NOT disappear in Demotic, rather it merges with the indicative due to the two tenses having become pronounced more or less the same in the later half of the ANCIENT Koiné period. Most individual word changes are due to trends in diction and are still very ancient words (e.g., όπως for ως), and the original word often still exists in the modern language but with a restricted meaning (e.g., αφήνουμε/ομε(ν) from ancient ἀφίεμεν retains the ancient meaning of "to let go" but not typically in the sense of "forgiveness" as we see here).
I can go on and on, but this should be enough evidence to show that Modern Greek IS Greek and not some new and foreign language. The evolution can *clearly* be seen and no hellenist worth their salt would disagree.
Μὴ ἀφήσῃς νά σε τυφλώσῃ ἡ κατὰ τὴν νέαν ἑλληνικὰν προκατάληψή σου...
My cel Heard me praying in greek
Finally! Modern Greek pronunciation, and not some ridiculous, hideous, clunky, ugly, abomination of a reconstructed pronunciation! Thank you!