How Pro Violinists Make it Look Easy
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 13 ก.ค. 2023
- For those interested in Skype (or your favored video chat platform) lessons, email admin@murphymusicacademy.org. Learn violin, the right way!
How do pro violinists perfect their playing?
Violin is often claimed to be the hardest instrument to learn to play (by no greater an authority than watchmojo in this video: • Top 10 Hardest Instrum... ). Whether or not this is actually the case, it is still an incredibly challenging instrument. But at it's core, Pro level violin playing is simple. But why then is it so difficult? In this online tutorial video, Murphy Music Academy founder and pedagogue Tobiah Murphy seeks to answer that question, and also shows you what you can do to overcome it and realize your dream of being a truly good violinist.
Featuring Jascha Heifetz Wieniawski, David Oistrakh Tchaikovsky, Hilary Hahn Dvorak Violin Concerto, Nathan Milstein, and Augustin Hadelich playing the Brahms Violin Concerto.
Clips of Heifetz, Oistrakh's, and Milstein's Left Hand Technique compiled by @vladimirdyo7301 - เพลง
Sometimes I feel watching your video is like comitting a robbery. The knowledge that you have shared here is more than what some students could ever learn in a conservatory. Thank you for your passion and great insights - it definitely benefits so many violinists around the world. May your life be blessed with great health, abundance and success!
She IS an amazing violinist 👍 let alone how she makes it look so easy ❤
I don’t if it has happened to alot of people too but sometimes there’s things that my teacher told me ages ago that I end up understanding just much further down the line because I didn’t feel aware if it before.
I think the real difficulty in violin playing is that even though it’s simple motions, to achieve them you need to have much more awareness of each part of your body to isolate what needs to be used. The more consistency you want, the more awareness is required.
Yes. I go into this in the end of the video
Yehudi Menuhin
He actually did put in the work.
IT'S NOT A TEACHER'S RESPONSIBILITY TO HELP YOU UNDERSTAND!!!!
It’s definitely a thing, it happens to me no matter what I study
@@RatPfink66 Not really sure why the caps 😅… Teachers can help you get there but understanding is something that comes from the student. The whole point of my comment is not that it was my teacher’s responsibility that it took me time to understand, it’s that in my opinion what makes it hard is in fact realizing it internally. And that’s why even the greats like Pablo Casals said still to be making progress after their practices.
Hadelich and Szeryng using the same instrument in these videos! I like to refer to the events as "bus stops" - no one likes it when the bus stops too often! Appreciate your videos!
That is fascinating! I did not know this
I will definitely put this into practice. Thanks for the video!
Great video. Thank you.
Dude I just love your channel.
Glad you're enjoying it!
Thank you so much for explaining the beauty of simplicity. I have been playing Fiddle for 7 years and I struggle with keeping the bow arm and wrist loose and not fingering the strings so hard (I also play guitar where you have to press down hard there). I think I can learn more from you so I will subscribe. My hero is someone you did not mention, Isaac Stern.
Interesting examples and perspectives on violin playing and performance in general. I like the phrasing examples of comparison.
Thank you for this video!! 💛🏵️💛
The lessons on your channel are very very helpful to my practice, they add some clarity to what i am doing, thank you!
Thank you for the video
i feel like the only way someone doesn't think hadelich is the best violin player alive is if they've never heard of him haha the guy is just. On Another Level. other worldy, i'm obsessed with his technique and musicality, wish he'd record every concerto cuz it seems his interpretations are always my favorite
I saw him live a couple month ago. Absolutely incredible
@@MurphyMusicAcademy so good! saw him live last year on a recital and seeing him again in a couple weeks playing prok 2, can't wait
I'm not sure about best, he has competition.
Honestly the best content... And I watch a lot. If only I could execute as seamlessly as you describe it! But seriously, you're just amazing.
Glad you're enjoying!
Excellent video!
Thanks for watchign!
Thank you for sharing. :)
Absolutely!
I absolutely love your imitation of beginner. so much control
haha, it's kind of hard to play with a bad sound after you've spent over 20 years trying to perfect a good one
@@MurphyMusicAcademy Its so funny because I just started the viola, and I'm just like ok, i want long straight strokes across each string in both directions. If I were to try to deviate, I would never evven get it right. I mostly play the flute, and I also have a really hard time replicating tone issues.
For intonation, I used a tuner to practice with and that made a huge difference when playing scales
Tuners can be great but you have to be careful they don't become a crutch. A student who relies on a tuner too much can end up tuning notes with their eyes rather than their ears
That’s the problem. Everyone tries to copy these “pros” instead of finding their own voice on their instrument. Not just the violin.
I’ve never thought Hilary makes it look easy. when I played with her I thought her sound was very pressed and her technique seemed very tense when viewed up close. I was sort of shocked she could avoid injury. Her playing is obviously extremely impressive though and she’s incredibly easy to follow
Yeah I can definitely see how it appears like that up close; all that work to project which might not sound great near her but to the audience sounds wonderful.
It's a very "American School" way of playing in my opinion. Joshua Bell too...
Hilary is a Curtis grad... so it makes sense. I'm truly interested in your comment about "very American School." Please elaborate so I can understand your comment better. Also interested in your opinion about the likes of Maxim Vengerov and Ray Chen.
Super super super lovely tips Augustine violinist from Malaysia
Hilary’s Brahms is everything
one of the first things i noticed while starting closed notes is it takes basically no pressure to make it shift to the note, but i worried it was still gonna be bad technique, so id been wondering. thank you for bringing this up, Murphy. still struggling with keeping the fingers not touching the strings until i need them to without being too far to play efficiently though
It's an art, for sure. One of the best exercises I know is Sevcik Op 1 to practice this sort of thing. It's so simple, just groups of 4 notes at a time at first, but that simplicity allows you to really work on your hand frame and finger action. I give it to almost every student when they first start working with me
@MurphyMusicAcademy it is, and thank you for your advice! i am hoping to take classes despite my low funds, but for now youre helping me get started :). hope you have a great week Murphy
ALWAYS worry about bad technique. Even when you get the result you think you want. Because _the worst thing you can be is a "natural."_
The fear of God needs to be in every note you play. Until you internalize that, freedom and peace are luxuries you cannot afford.
As age takes hold I wish I had practiced my EARS sooner
This is an underrated aspect of playing.
I wish you and your TH-cam channel would have been around back in 1989 when I was learning this instrument.
the new bumper is sweet
Danke
😮 eye opener
Mil gracias por el vídeo! Hadelich es también mi favorito! En el violín nada, absolutamente nada es fácil...pero es el instrumemto más maravilloso que existe! Mi sensación es que durante los primeros años de estudio se van incorporando muchos conocimientos y experimentamos cada día con lo que nuestros profesores y nosotras mismas aprendemos... Con el paso del tiempo vamos eliminando lo que no es útil, y optimizamos nuestra manera de tocar... Aún no he llegado a conseguirlo pero no dejaré de estudiar hasta conseguir que mi sonido no sea "sonido de estudiante" como decías en un video anterior😅 Eres un gran profesor y aprendo mucho contigo!💜🎶💜🎻
Gracias!
E
Great video! I think another good way to phrase this is "straightforward". Many times the problem/hurdle is straightforward, but execution is a lot more difficult than just stating what to do. Just because the end goal is clear doesn't mean the journey will be. Also, at least for me, I find I can easily get more tense when I think too much about simplifying/relaxing. Being aware without overly fixating on a particular aspect of playing is a skill in and of itself (e.g. noticing certain notes in a scale are out of tune but waiting until after the whole scale to evaluate and improve it for next time).
And, speaking of Hadelich, his philosophy of simplifying technique (to an extent) to serve the music better I find great. Anyone who hasn't seen his Ask Augustin series of videos should watch some of them; he has a lot of gems.
"Being aware without overly fixating on a particular aspect of playing is a skill in and of itself"
Bang on. To me, though, this is another facet of the simplicity of violin playing. I'll often tell my students (and myself!) to play as if they could not miss a note. If you can successfully convince your mind of this, then you'd be surprised how much better you'll play. However, you will inevitably miss a note, and so easily you can be thrown from this mindset. I've been working for years to be comfortable with "just playing" and not trying to micromanage, and just now I feel like my mind is letting me handle things in a simple, or as you said, straightforward manner.
First of all they have great talent !
I don't even play violin, vut I found this video very interesting.
Love this video and very timely for me as I came to this conclusion yesterday whilst watching a really good chamber music group playing live. I realised I don’t have a stable left hand shape so consequently my fingers don’t fall back in the same place each time!! Any exercises/videos you have to correct this fault please?!! They/you make it look so simple in that your wrist/hand frame appears to stay the same and only the fingers move . So much more efficient!! Thanks.
The best exercises for this are in Sevcik Op. 1, but of course the key is HOW you practice it. It starts with only groupings of 4 notes, and you should play those note groupings over and over again until your fingers fall in the same way every time. Start slow, one note per bow, then 2, then 4 and then 8, getting slightly faster each time you play more notes per bow. ONLY move on to the faster iteration after your fingers are moving consistently in the same, efficient pattern.
Thank you so much! Will try that today😊
I’m curious, have you read much into Dounis’s pedagogue? He believes that the fingers shouldn’t stay in a fixed structure directly above the string but rather in a limp state where your pinky might not be as close. There’s a wind back of the finger lever before the drop of the finger and a very fast and articulate approach to the string where the finger strikes the string pushes it to the finger board and releases to the light finger pressure you mentioned earlier. I’ve found this fast strike and release helps a lot with vibrato because the energy and release allows the finger to roll more naturally as a response to that drop movement.
The fast drop also helps with intonation because the signals in your brain are coming from more of a “reflex”. If the movement is too slow then your brain is sending “start” “stop” “start” “stop” messages to the finger which leads to inaccuracies in finger placement. It’s like when your eye is tracking movement there’s little skips and stops when the tracking is slow, but when it’s faster and jumping from one side of the ball to the next then there is no little stutters.
I hope this all makes sense, would love to know your thoughts.
I'm not familiar with Dounis, beyond what others have mentioned to me. Some of the things I hear sound like what I teach, and others not so much, which I suppose is to be expected. I certainly agree you want to have most of your actions being a reflex and reaction, rather than having to think consciously about it, but I don't think developing a consistent frame to the hand gets in the way of this. I rather think it helps.
Someday, I'll have the time to read and study again and I will give Dounis' writings the time they deserve. . .
.
.
Someday . . .
I love Hilary Hahn. She’s a beautiful player
Anne Sofie Mutter, Joshua Bell, and less known (for no reason) Bartlomiej Niziol winner of Wieniawski International competition in 1996 curently principal in Zurich Symphony Orchestra.
Hilary han is amazing
Sir, when I see Yehudi Menuhin, the way he holds the violin, his left hand is so free, it looks like the knuckle of first finger doesn’t ever touch the violin and it’s just supported by the flesh of his thumb and his chin. I have tried so hard to balance. It just doesn’t happen.
Oh my
I like Szeryng's Bach better than all the others, too😊
At 13:29 you point out that slowing down on the last 4 sixteenth notes disrupts the musical line? I’m wondering why that is. Because Augustin does that same thing at 14:17. I believe that slowing does provide greater emphasis of an event ending because your ear is able to absorb each sixteenth note of the slow down as a sign of arrival.
It's not the slowing itself, it's the degree. Hadelich's ritardando is much less and allows for the momentum of the music to still move through it, not disrupting the musical line. The student's however is so dramatic that it completely cuts of the musical momentum
Well the bowing is just like bicycling. Less is more. When your balance is perfect you can even let go of the bars and it will stay stable.
Anybody that knows how to play an instrument well can’t make it look easy. I have played guitar since 1974. One day about five years ago, it was back when Best Buy was selling musical instruments and I was in their store, looking at their guitars and was playing them. And Laney walked up to me and said wow yeah sure I know how to play a guitar and make it look easy. She says I have tried so many times you make it look so easy. I think most people that have a lot of experience and playing music. They know how to make it look easy the age old saying is there is a lot more to it that meets the eye.👍🏼👍🏼😁🎸
golf is simple; all you have to do hit the ball into the hole.
When the violin, violin.
I'm following the instructions in the video right now to get in a comment cuss out fight with Hilary Hahn haters because she is my absolute favorite. Just doing what I can to help the video get exposure.
I actually think there would have been a better chance of it happening had I not said anything, lol
But I appreciate the effort
FLAT Intonation can come from not being firm enough in your left hand fingers.
Give some helpful information please.
Basically...use less _physical_ energy and much, MUCH greater amounts of _mental_ energy.
More or less. Rather use the mental energy to make your physical motions as efficient as possible
Why do I try?
I'm Still a Fan of Hahn lol.
Not a huge fan, but I respect her abilities
what are James Ehnes's idiosyncrasies that work for him but wouldn't work for others?
His unorthodox bow hold.
You mean besides what I mentioned in 15:53 of this video?
@@MurphyMusicAcademy missed the word "thumb" at first. thanks!
@@MurphyMusicAcademyyes that's right 👍👍
Idc what yall say Hilary is amazing bro
I never said otherwise, but I have gotten that comment a fair bit
Hilary Hahn makes it look "easy." I am not a violinist, but I do NOT believe for a moment that what she does is EASY. Instead, I get the impression that she puts enormous thought into each passage work and connects them flawlessly. Her technique is simply beyond question. So is her utter clarity, even in the fastest passages.
No, I have no idea how she does this. But it is NOT easy. It never will be.
Sanjosemike (no longer in CA)
06:50
I just wish I could stay in tune. I can play the same three notes in a row ten times and somehow get 30 different tones. OK maybe not 30, but still it is super frustrating.
She IS an amazing violinist 👍 let alone how she makes it look so easy 2:47
Yeesh
Is Ray Chen a good violinist?
Very good
I think you forgot one crucial thing, which majorly affects the left hand dynamics; i.e. holding the violin with your chin. If the violin is not sufficiently locked in place by your chin, the left hand needs to take over and thus a) the fingers need to press more on the strings b) the left hand needs to hold the violin and the frame shifting suffers from it and c) vibrato will also suffer from it. Overall stiffening the left hand.Thus, I hypothesise that in order to simplify your playing you'd have to make sure that your overall posture and stance is corrected first. The rest should follow. What are your thoughts on this?
He has a video about that. The short answer is No, don't clamp the instrument with your chin.
Who's your favorite living violinist?
Hadelich
@@MurphyMusicAcademy He's awesome!
How dare you not mention Augustin Hadelich in the "greatest violinist" section! This is my addition to the 50 comments :P
Your sound was too good, when you tried to imitate beginner sound. :D
Lol, I kind of realized that half-way through and tried to make it sound worse. It’s funny how producing that beginner sound becomes difficult 😅
@@MurphyMusicAcademy Yes and this continued for your other demonstrations as well :D
Congrats! :D :)
Maybe you should change left and right, next time. xD
I just got to 5 minutes 47 seconds in the video (so I don't know what you are going to say next), but I've been teaching that thing you just called "pronation" for years. I call it "pouring the tea" into the cup. I like to say, pour the tea, don't smack it with a meat tenderizer. Lol
Pronation is official kinesiological term for that motion, but I use the term primarily because the teachers I worked with used the term.
1:00 lmao, murphy the opportunist
At least one person has taken the bait, lol. But now I'm worried that since I said something I might not get as many people commenting, lol
@MurphyMusicAcademy lol i was tempted to try but idl enough about the artist tbh. the dreaded callout effect may back backfired tho. hope the video still goes well with the youtube algorithms
@@yellowbutterfly6796haha, I think it will, but I appreciate the thought in any case
You wanted comments? For the algorithm.
You're welcome.
I'll bet if the inventor of the violin knew what we know today about ergonomics it would be a totally different instrument today. Just saying.
Well, there wasn't really an "inventor" per say. People just experimented with stringed instruments for about 5-6 hundred years until we all decided this was how it was going to be. I'm not actually sure what a more "ergonomic" violin would look like. I'm sure someone out there is experimenting with different designs. Maybe we'll get to see someday
8:34 "dumb" really? I would not send my kid to you.
why must soloists stand while the rest of the orchestra gets to sit. i mean, except for Perlman of course… that never made sense to me.
I like your chinrest. Can you tell me more about it?
Haha, I get this question so much I used to have it in the channel "About" section. It's called a "Berber" chinrest. You can order them from just about any major violin dealer in the US. I love them. I used to buy a bunch and hand them out to my students, but I've run out now.
I have something similar, which seems to be a great shape for playing without shoulder rests
50 COMMENT FIGHT, BRING IT ON!!1
There was a guy in these comments who said "Hilary Hahn is the best example of what not to do" so you could go fight with him . . .I dunno
Fiddle playing and musicality like Liz Carroll, Martin Hayes, Paddy Canny, Natalie MacMaster, Aly Bain, Alasdair Fraser is also lots of fun to listen to and try.
I can play violin like you! I just choose not to!
And I can quit drinking any time I want . . . but I don't want to
I know her uncle.
Lol
I don't even play violin, wtf am i doing here
Well it looks like you're subscribed so I don't know what you're doing here either, but I'm glad to have you nonetheless
@@MurphyMusicAcademy well hearing the differences between the student and Hadelich was valuable. Plus id never heard of Hadelich. What a repertoire he's got!! But really it was just a cheeky testament to how good your content is. So Thanks
I'll get her drunk and then she might tell me her secret
I think ladies that authentically prayed for me or sided with me on whatever form some kind of psychic bond with me. And when other dudes dominate them sexually, it had an adverse effect on me physiologically. I'm over it now. I just expect that shit from everyone now.
Cynicism is the safe bet here.
Btw Hilary Hahn is a prime example of what Not to do. 😂
Simplistic? You sound like a DMV test.
Accidents happen when 2 vehicles try to occupy the same space.
Anyone else hate it when people add things that aren't in the score? Rubato, accents, etc?
Music is not all about whatever that can be notated or indicated. Throughout the history on ocassions, even the composers themselves did not adhere to their own written expressions. There are some music that can sound great even though they are badly played, but there are music that sounded horrible when played 'correctly', because context, traditions, history and intuitions have to be considered as well. And if we want a "perfect" performance as dictated by the score, we might as well leave it to AI. I think some people do need to broaden their perspectives on how music should be played. We may or may not be convinvced with how the musician interprets the music but I guess that's the beauty of this art - we don't want everyone sound the same. I guess hating on 'unkosher' interpretation is not a good point to start. The snobbism and gatekeeping made classical music so unappealing to many.
i dont like hillary hahn tell me otherwise
i mean everyone is entitled to an opinion, opinions often have reasons so whats your reason?
otherwise
You don’t have to like her. But you’ve got to respect her skill. I like HH. See seems super nice. Her fans on a whole are too fanatical and single minded however.
Hahn is brilliant, but far from my favorite, though I think she's become much more musically interesting in the past few years. Her technique is insane (last movement of Barber is otherworldly). She does have some annoying fans, for sure. The number of comments I got from my first video on how to not play with a shoulder rest that went something along the lines of "but Hilary Hahn plays with a shoulder rest" was far too many
People are, truly, stupid in this day and age...