Excellent analysis. I agree with everything you said about Michael. I always found it interesting the way Micheal seemed to project his own negative emotions onto Toby as an allegory for his own unresolved issues. I've also always thought that Micheal attacks Toby bc Toby represents what Micheal is afraid to become, a divorced man with no friends and a child he rarely sees. On the flip side, I've always viewed Ryan as a conduit through which Micheal projects his own grandiose beliefs of himself. Basically, I think Micheal sees (what he believes to be) his good qualities in Ryan (looks, ambition, social skills, etc). That's why Michael is so irrational when it comes to both Toby and Ryan, one represents everything Micheal dislikes about himself and the other represents the things Michael wants to have. I suppose a similar argument could be made for why Michael would hang out with someone like Todd Packard. Yeah Packard is a jerk but he's also confident, funny, and does well with women. Perhaps Micheal believes that if he hangs out with Packard enough some of those things will rub off on him. That's what she said
There's some layers under Michael's personality that are shown firsthand regarding Michael's need to fit in and be liked but hating Toby really feels like a comedic device for the writer because it's irrational. What is said directly on the show is that initially the dislike came from Michael thinking Toby was trying to prevent him from being 'himself' rather than some inner turmoil of abandonment issues and making Toby the face of it. That seems so far reaching. The explanation of the hatred came directly from Michael. He tries to create 'fun' and Toby tries to destroy it. That was the explanation for the audience. Anyway, following is what I wrote separately that disagreed with Mulverine's take. I'm going to say the Toby thing is purely a benefit to the writer to write a relatively 'easy' bit. Michael isn't disproportionately aggressive to Stanley or Meredith when it came to destruction of the family unit meaning just because Toby got a divorce, it wouldn't be the catalyst to why Michael hates him. I think the dichotomy was really just down to being a writers' aide rather than having any intrinsic meaning. I'm so glad the writers didn't push growth between Michael and Toby and this episode fell massively flat as far as trying to establish a relationship when Michael realised his conversation was out of necessity rather than friendship. Novak definitely knew the comedic value of having Michaels' hatred of Toby being shallow added a factor of humour that wouldn't happen if he befriended everyone. There was an authentic moment between them but was quickly crushed. Great writing, great bit.
I'd just like to add, Michael has always liked Packer because despite being a jackass, Packer has always been loyal to Michael. He's not a good guy but their friendship makes Michael feel WANTED - Packer is one of few people in his life who in the long term never really rejected him.
Honestly I’ve always LOVED how Pam just went and changed he title like that. She is a great worker, sales just wasnt her thing but she was an asset to the office!
Also, as someone with a psych degree, your insight into why Michael is the way he is is pretty right on if you ask me. I have a friend who has more than a few Michael Scott mannerisms and he almost has the same background (father not in the picture, mom wasn’t around that much, never got much much praise or guidance because of that and had to learn social cues elsewhere). He also stayed in a management job he was good at much longer than he should have believing that his hard work would be noticed and commented upon by the incompetent higher ups (it never was). This story is pretty common so I can see where Carell might have gotten the building blocks for Michael.
I have had a pretty rocky relationship with therapy and unprocessed traumas, and this episode - Toby's tone and words, Michael's reflexive reactions - triggered me a lot. That was the last thing I expected from such an easy comforting show. Just so interesting how brains and relationships work
my favorite bit in the entire series is Creed’s blog. “Even for the internet its…. pretty shocking” i dont know why but sometimes one joke just resonates with someone
I think Toby wanting validation is completely... validated... here. Aside from talking about being a juror in the Scranton Strangler trial, this is the most excited we ever see him. He has a degree in Social Work, and I get the feeling it's the first time he's ever gotten to use it. Likely something he acquired as a formality of being in human resources, but it's something he's always been proud of and hasn't been relevant until now. Kind of an unspoken parallel in the episode to the Office Administrator. Toby's not a psychiatrist, but he took some job mandated training and gets to pretend that he is here.
I've only watched the Office once, last year, so I'm still new to the show to some degree. This analysis of Michael and Toby's relationship makes everything make sense now😱😱 really amazing video!!! I've watching all your Office recap videos so far, and it's even more fun than watching the show itself!
Let's face it, Dwight's red hands weren't beet juice, they were proof that he's the real Scranton Strangler. Well, he's the Scranton Strangler to his chickens, anyway.
Really great video man, just discovered this video. Thanks to the algorithm haha ✌🏼 Well done :) The Office is such an important part of my life, I really enjoy binging videos like this one!
I just found your channel! Loving it! Feeling the need to let you know, though, that up until now I was misunderstanding the intro to your Ratings segment to mean that you hated every episode. The way the stars go back to 'One Star' with Michael saying "this is the worst" before getting into your actual rating is confusing to newer viewers (me). I get it now, but I wanted to share my experience.
0:24 No character could have gotten away with this line in season 3 or before, not even Andy or Packer. Your explanation of the corporate sandbox was really good though, I hadn't thought of it that way.
I am in shock by the 3 out of 5!!! Having watched everyone of your episode reviews! I was totally thinking we were going towards a five out of five on this one! Lol because just like every scene and every word of dialogue had such great deep meaning to it. I love and respect all your reviews. I just was definitely expecting higher than three! Lol ;)
4:38 On this note. I own my own Smoke shop have it running for 5 years now. There's this One customer that has always been there since day 1 friendly guy, real charismatic and a great mind for the product, stayed with me One or twice a week talking business, coffee, lunch, life and everything in between and I gotta be honest I don't know when exactly did he became my employee but all I know is he's been my right hand man for about 2 years now.
With his harsh views of divorce, I'm glad that Michael never married Jan because he would have stuck by her no matter what. Jan probably would have cheated and had him raise someone else's kid and he would have fallen in love with any baby that he thought was his until he found out. Even then he probably would have stayed and still been a dad to the kid because he wouldn't want them to feel like how he felt. I'm sure the baby shower episode says a lot about how he is, what he wanted, and what his future could have been; I think he still had love for the baby but it wasn't the same as fatherly love since the baby wasn't his and Jan was doing everything she could to hurt him. Plus, he ended up realizing what he wanted and who with, he didn't feel the overwhelming feeling of wanting to protect the baby as a father and be her father and it shows how he dodged a bullet. Astrid could have still been someone else's kid if him and Jan was still together but married, but he wouldn't divorce Jan over it. If anything, Jan would have left him to be with the kid's dad and be the one wanting a divorce.
Comedy truly does come from a sad and dark place. Thats what makes Michael Scott such a deep character. His jokey attitude comes from a place where he is too afraid to show himself to others bc of his childhood trauma.
The “Say that I’m lying or say I have the job” hits too real for me. One of my responsibility is charging departments for workshops they sign up for. If you don’t remove yourself from the roster within a certain time period, you will get charged whether you show or not. We had someone not show up (despite a reminder going out 1 week prior and 1 day before the workshop) and get charged for it. They tried to get out of it and lied and said they “thought the unenrolled”. However, I’m a systems admin and have definitively turned off the option to unenroll from all courses with chargebacks. They have to email us directly to unenroll. This person doubled down and sent screenshots of the “button they pressed”, which was not an “unenroll” button. It was a “add to playlist” button. What’s worse, their manager came in to back their employee up and when we showed them definitive evidence that what they were claiming was not possible, it was dropped because “we’d be calling them liars” if we pressed it any further. I was livid.
The clip you show of Toby telling Michael about his parents divorce says a lot. Toby was wanted by both of his parents after they split up. He was loved, where as Michael's dad wanted nothing to do with him. Michael also has the same reaction when DeAngelo says the same thing about his parents divorce and wanting him to choose between them
I'm going to say the Toby thing is purely a benefit to the writer to write a relatively 'easy' bit. Michael isn't disproportionately aggressive to Stanley or Meredith when it came to destruction of the family unit meaning just because Toby got a divorce, it wouldn't be the catalyst to why Michael hates him. I think the dichotomy was really just down to being a writers' aide rather than having any intrinsic meaning. I'm so glad the writers didn't push growth between Michael and Toby and this episode fell massively flat as far as trying to establish a relationship when Michael realised his conversation was out of necessity rather than friendship. Novak definitely knew the comedic value of having Michaels' hatred of Toby being shallow added a factor of humour that wouldn't happen if he befriended everyone. There was an authentic moment between them but was quickly crushed. Great writing, great bit.
I looked exactly like little michael in my days, until i came to live with grandma, and she let me do whatever i wanted so my hair went straight to todd howard mode and my clothes were whatever i wanted, so thanks grandma for saving me from being THIS.
Michael also displays his narcissistic inability to imagine that anyone (in this case the pitcher) might make a decision that involves taking a back seat for the good of the team.
When my wife and I saw this episode, we each had different reactions to Pam. My wife is a rule-follower, so she hated that Pam lied and tricked her way into a position that didn't even exist. I think I'm more cynical, so I saw it as Pam seizing an opportunity to forge her own path by using corporate bureaucracy against itself for her own benefit. This version of Pam was far from the version we first saw in the early seasons where she was stuck in a perpetual engagement because she didn't want to rock the boat with Roy.
someone at my old job did this exact thing, made her own position with way more pay and the company realized there wqs actually a need for this position and voila she promoted herself
Pam- spends a whole episode trying to get a slight job advancement by filling a needed role and just barely gets it. Robert California- goes to FL to demand he be made CEO and gets it no problem .
I am sure alot of people will disagree with this take but I find what really makes a good salesman is being at least somewhat comfortable with fucking people over? Salespeople have to know that they are often selling someone something they don’t actually need like 90 percent of the time in order to get commission.
He's the boss who wants to be your buddy turned up to 11. But while he may be obnoxious and completely lacking in self-awareness, he's also damn good at what he does.
Funny enough I never see anyone mention it in mainstream conversation. People love to point at her cheating and getting “bitchier” over the years before this.
Looking back at this I always wish Michael hadn't noticed what Toby was up to, and gotten the help he needed.
GROWTH ISNT FUNNY. nah i completely agree with you
It’d be interesting fs
I think the show deals very poorly with Michael's mental issues which are deep seated. They just marry him off as a solution to mental problems
You realise this is not real eh?
@@Roberttttttttt Nooooooo?! Really?! No one realised that!
Excellent analysis. I agree with everything you said about Michael. I always found it interesting the way Micheal seemed to project his own negative emotions onto Toby as an allegory for his own unresolved issues. I've also always thought that Micheal attacks Toby bc Toby represents what Micheal is afraid to become, a divorced man with no friends and a child he rarely sees. On the flip side, I've always viewed Ryan as a conduit through which Micheal projects his own grandiose beliefs of himself. Basically, I think Micheal sees (what he believes to be) his good qualities in Ryan (looks, ambition, social skills, etc). That's why Michael is so irrational when it comes to both Toby and Ryan, one represents everything Micheal dislikes about himself and the other represents the things Michael wants to have. I suppose a similar argument could be made for why Michael would hang out with someone like Todd Packard. Yeah Packard is a jerk but he's also confident, funny, and does well with women. Perhaps Micheal believes that if he hangs out with Packard enough some of those things will rub off on him. That's what she said
Damn, great take
Incredibly said, agreed
There's some layers under Michael's personality that are shown firsthand regarding Michael's need to fit in and be liked but hating Toby really feels like a comedic device for the writer because it's irrational. What is said directly on the show is that initially the dislike came from Michael thinking Toby was trying to prevent him from being 'himself' rather than some inner turmoil of abandonment issues and making Toby the face of it. That seems so far reaching. The explanation of the hatred came directly from Michael. He tries to create 'fun' and Toby tries to destroy it. That was the explanation for the audience. Anyway, following is what I wrote separately that disagreed with Mulverine's take.
I'm going to say the Toby thing is purely a benefit to the writer to write a relatively 'easy' bit. Michael isn't disproportionately aggressive to Stanley or Meredith when it came to destruction of the family unit meaning just because Toby got a divorce, it wouldn't be the catalyst to why Michael hates him. I think the dichotomy was really just down to being a writers' aide rather than having any intrinsic meaning. I'm so glad the writers didn't push growth between Michael and Toby and this episode fell massively flat as far as trying to establish a relationship when Michael realised his conversation was out of necessity rather than friendship. Novak definitely knew the comedic value of having Michaels' hatred of Toby being shallow added a factor of humour that wouldn't happen if he befriended everyone. There was an authentic moment between them but was quickly crushed. Great writing, great bit.
I'd just like to add, Michael has always liked Packer because despite being a jackass, Packer has always been loyal to Michael. He's not a good guy but their friendship makes Michael feel WANTED - Packer is one of few people in his life who in the long term never really rejected him.
Honestly I’ve always LOVED how Pam just went and changed he title like that. She is a great worker, sales just wasnt her thing but she was an asset to the office!
When you said "there's no shame in therapy, so with that..." I was expecting the classic Betterhelp sponsorship
Seen any of his new videos? Gulp
Also, as someone with a psych degree, your insight into why Michael is the way he is is pretty right on if you ask me. I have a friend who has more than a few Michael Scott mannerisms and he almost has the same background (father not in the picture, mom wasn’t around that much, never got much much praise or guidance because of that and had to learn social cues elsewhere). He also stayed in a management job he was good at much longer than he should have believing that his hard work would be noticed and commented upon by the incompetent higher ups (it never was). This story is pretty common so I can see where Carell might have gotten the building blocks for Michael.
I have had a pretty rocky relationship with therapy and unprocessed traumas, and this episode - Toby's tone and words, Michael's reflexive reactions - triggered me a lot. That was the last thing I expected from such an easy comforting show. Just so interesting how brains and relationships work
That disposable cameras joke is my mom’s favorite joke in the whole series
my favorite bit in the entire series is Creed’s blog. “Even for the internet its…. pretty shocking” i dont know why but sometimes one joke just resonates with someone
I’m sorry but two years and I feel obligated to say that your mother is my favorite
I think Toby wanting validation is completely... validated... here. Aside from talking about being a juror in the Scranton Strangler trial, this is the most excited we ever see him. He has a degree in Social Work, and I get the feeling it's the first time he's ever gotten to use it. Likely something he acquired as a formality of being in human resources, but it's something he's always been proud of and hasn't been relevant until now. Kind of an unspoken parallel in the episode to the Office Administrator. Toby's not a psychiatrist, but he took some job mandated training and gets to pretend that he is here.
I've only watched the Office once, last year, so I'm still new to the show to some degree. This analysis of Michael and Toby's relationship makes everything make sense now😱😱 really amazing video!!! I've watching all your Office recap videos so far, and it's even more fun than watching the show itself!
I don't really blame Pam for lying to get a higher pay and title.
Another great video. Thanks so much for all the time and effort you put into making these videos. Such a great analysis!
Therapeutically brilliant. For real. My husband and I love watching your videos!! Comparing Dwight to AI resetting itself made us laugh out loud.
Let's face it, Dwight's red hands weren't beet juice, they were proof that he's the real Scranton Strangler.
Well, he's the Scranton Strangler to his chickens, anyway.
That makes sense I never understood why he hated Toby so much
I've always loved Pam's arch in this episode, probably one of the best she's ever had.
That was the best insight to Michael I have ever heard! Michael Scott summed up perfectly in about 5 minutes at the end of this video!
This is probably your best investigstion ever it makes a lot of sense seeing how Michael acts
GOOD JOB
Yes!!!! Another video. Another fantastic listen👌
Really great video man, just discovered this video. Thanks to the algorithm haha ✌🏼 Well done :) The Office is such an important part of my life, I really enjoy binging videos like this one!
I just found your channel! Loving it! Feeling the need to let you know, though, that up until now I was misunderstanding the intro to your Ratings segment to mean that you hated every episode. The way the stars go back to 'One Star' with Michael saying "this is the worst" before getting into your actual rating is confusing to newer viewers (me). I get it now, but I wanted to share my experience.
Toby is the only character who's so close to helping or understanding Michael
0:24 No character could have gotten away with this line in season 3 or before, not even Andy or Packer.
Your explanation of the corporate sandbox was really good though, I hadn't thought of it that way.
I am in shock by the 3 out of 5!!! Having watched everyone of your episode reviews! I was totally thinking we were going towards a five out of five on this one! Lol because just like every scene and every word of dialogue had such great deep meaning to it. I love and respect all your reviews. I just was definitely expecting higher than three! Lol ;)
I think I’ve found a new youtube channel😍 very refreshing now that I’ve binged the whole show for the bazillionth time🤣
Carell's "if you don't know a Michael Scott, you are the Michael Scott" hits different after that Deeper Meaning...
Then I guess I am Michael Scott
I can confirm that I do not know a manager that sexually harasses their employees.
@@twocanplay7976 I did. FTP, but I digress.
I loved this episode of the office. Loved your perspective on it
4:38
On this note.
I own my own Smoke shop have it running for 5 years now. There's this One customer that has always been there since day 1 friendly guy, real charismatic and a great mind for the product, stayed with me One or twice a week talking business, coffee, lunch, life and everything in between and I gotta be honest I don't know when exactly did he became my employee but all I know is he's been my right hand man for about 2 years now.
With his harsh views of divorce, I'm glad that Michael never married Jan because he would have stuck by her no matter what. Jan probably would have cheated and had him raise someone else's kid and he would have fallen in love with any baby that he thought was his until he found out. Even then he probably would have stayed and still been a dad to the kid because he wouldn't want them to feel like how he felt.
I'm sure the baby shower episode says a lot about how he is, what he wanted, and what his future could have been; I think he still had love for the baby but it wasn't the same as fatherly love since the baby wasn't his and Jan was doing everything she could to hurt him. Plus, he ended up realizing what he wanted and who with, he didn't feel the overwhelming feeling of wanting to protect the baby as a father and be her father and it shows how he dodged a bullet. Astrid could have still been someone else's kid if him and Jan was still together but married, but he wouldn't divorce Jan over it. If anything, Jan would have left him to be with the kid's dad and be the one wanting a divorce.
This is a cool character analysis
This is one of my favourite episodes in the series, especially post season 5.
I wanna add that I always thought that Jeff respecting the manager played a role in Michael valuing his manager position so much.
Comedy truly does come from a sad and dark place. Thats what makes Michael Scott such a deep character. His jokey attitude comes from a place where he is too afraid to show himself to others bc of his childhood trauma.
The “Say that I’m lying or say I have the job” hits too real for me.
One of my responsibility is charging departments for workshops they sign up for. If you don’t remove yourself from the roster within a certain time period, you will get charged whether you show or not. We had someone not show up (despite a reminder going out 1 week prior and 1 day before the workshop) and get charged for it. They tried to get out of it and lied and said they “thought the unenrolled”. However, I’m a systems admin and have definitively turned off the option to unenroll from all courses with chargebacks. They have to email us directly to unenroll. This person doubled down and sent screenshots of the “button they pressed”, which was not an “unenroll” button. It was a “add to playlist” button. What’s worse, their manager came in to back their employee up and when we showed them definitive evidence that what they were claiming was not possible, it was dropped because “we’d be calling them liars” if we pressed it any further. I was livid.
I'm an office fan and a juggalo, so it was very awesome to see the ICP poster in this episode.
You never mentioned my favorite quote from this episode!
"I'm glad Michael's getting help. He has a lot of issues, and he's stupid."
This makes me look at the writers as genius
4:30 there was a Seinfeld episode where George did just that
My personal favorite. 👏🏼
The clip you show of Toby telling Michael about his parents divorce says a lot. Toby was wanted by both of his parents after they split up. He was loved, where as Michael's dad wanted nothing to do with him.
Michael also has the same reaction when DeAngelo says the same thing about his parents divorce and wanting him to choose between them
i saw the michael and Jan gif at 5:47 but i did like seen Pam get one over on Gabe
Love that episode. Pam is finally doing something that doesn't include being Jim's love intrest. It has been far too long.
Ryan’s “analysis” is pretty accurate 🎯
I'm going to say the Toby thing is purely a benefit to the writer to write a relatively 'easy' bit. Michael isn't disproportionately aggressive to Stanley or Meredith when it came to destruction of the family unit meaning just because Toby got a divorce, it wouldn't be the catalyst to why Michael hates him. I think the dichotomy was really just down to being a writers' aide rather than having any intrinsic meaning. I'm so glad the writers didn't push growth between Michael and Toby and this episode fell massively flat as far as trying to establish a relationship when Michael realised his conversation was out of necessity rather than friendship. Novak definitely knew the comedic value of having Michaels' hatred of Toby being shallow added a factor of humour that wouldn't happen if he befriended everyone. There was an authentic moment between them but was quickly crushed. Great writing, great bit.
I looked exactly like little michael in my days, until i came to live with grandma, and she let me do whatever i wanted so my hair went straight to todd howard mode and my clothes were whatever i wanted, so thanks grandma for saving me from being THIS.
Fancy Chris in a button down!
Good video - thanks!
First business shirt I’ve bought since the pandemic!
Excellent deeper meaning
Michael also displays his narcissistic inability to imagine that anyone (in this case the pitcher) might make a decision that involves taking a back seat for the good of the team.
Perfect lazy Sunday afternoon viewing 🍻
I’m jealous of the lazy Sunday! Mowing and packing for a business trip today
@@Mulverine grass is still pretty lazy here too
When my wife and I saw this episode, we each had different reactions to Pam. My wife is a rule-follower, so she hated that Pam lied and tricked her way into a position that didn't even exist. I think I'm more cynical, so I saw it as Pam seizing an opportunity to forge her own path by using corporate bureaucracy against itself for her own benefit. This version of Pam was far from the version we first saw in the early seasons where she was stuck in a perpetual engagement because she didn't want to rock the boat with Roy.
someone at my old job did this exact thing, made her own position with way more pay and the company realized there wqs actually a need for this position and voila she promoted herself
Pam- spends a whole episode trying to get a slight job advancement by filling a needed role and just barely gets it.
Robert California- goes to FL to demand he be made CEO and gets it no problem .
I am sure alot of people will disagree with this take but I find what really makes a good salesman is being at least somewhat comfortable with fucking people over? Salespeople have to know that they are often selling someone something they don’t actually need like 90 percent of the time in order to get commission.
Being a good salesman pretty much comes down to being a sociopath
He's the boss who wants to be your buddy turned up to 11. But while he may be obnoxious and completely lacking in self-awareness, he's also damn good at what he does.
I've never thought abt the fact that Michael's triggered by any distant father figure.
not to that extreme level but I can understand where Micheal is coming from. no matter how despicable he is I just can't hate him
Young Michael at the wedding looks like PeeWee Herman.
Cold open: 3/5
Episode: 4/5
I don’t think it’s fair to say Pam “lies cheats and steals” that’s just ridiculous
This one was a filler. Felt like 3 b plots.
Seeing this video and another one that you make about Pam got me thinking... How torturing watch the office must be for people that Hate pam AHHAHAHA
Michael is the way he is because that’s how it was written
Pam was so insufferable.
Michael Scott pissed me off so much. He was selfish a lot.
I was they are narcissistic
Pam “forging her destiny” sealed the deal on my hatred of her
Hey aren’t you Jackson Galaxy the cat guy?
I think this episode is the reason people hate Pam so much. As empathetic as you can possibly be for her, what she did here was inarguably unethical.
I didn’t really touch on the hate Pam gets for this. Yeah, you’re right it’s a pretty clear ethical violation.
Funny enough I never see anyone mention it in mainstream conversation. People love to point at her cheating and getting “bitchier” over the years before this.