I’m a gentile, living in the UK, chronically aware of antisemitism. Whenever it seems appropriate, I point out, to whoever might be able to listen, that “the Jews” are not Israel. Even Israel is not the Jews. Netanyahu is not the Jews or Israel. The situation is a lot more complicated. The average Jew in America or anywhere, is no more responsible for what is happening in Gaza than my neighbours, who may or may not be Jewish , they are people. It’s politics and greed in tooth and claw, just as it’s always been. Thanks, Al for a great programme, as always.
@@teresaparnham9780 and mine, and we are helping the Palestinians,as is yours. In times of war the truth is kept hidden. We’ll only find out what’s going on long after this episode is done, when it’s deemed “safe”. You can be sure that you and I know a tiny fraction of what’s happening thousands of miles away. We are hearing what it suits someone to tell us. Take care of those around you and don’t bring a conflict, you know little about and can do even less about, home. Send aid, give money, pray , but don’t attack innocent people nearby just because a hate monger has stuck a label on to them. That’s all I’m saying.
@@23cutemonkey even the Wash Post makes a point that starvation is occurring in Gaza. What's nuanced about that? In this 2024 election Americans won't have a chance to vote for a candidate with a different policy. All candidates espouse war. There are no opposing views. That being the case we are not governed, we are ruled. It's like we live in a corporation not a political entity. I saw a video of a woman throwing coffee on a man wearing a Arab scarf. Just one example. Tensions are high. Emotions are high. I fear that soon people won't be using the name israelis but will be saying 'Jews' That will be the end of civil Discourse.
Hey! I'm not a Jew and I listen to your podcast. I am listening to this one. Anti-seminism is wrong. So is the same thing for other groups. I guess they don't have a specific word for that. First they came for the socialists, and I did not speak out- Because I was not a socialist. Then they came for the trade unionists, and I did not speak out- Because I was not a trade unionist. Then they came for the Jews, and I did not speak out- Because I was not a Jew. Then they came for me-and there was no one left to speak for me. We all need to worry about all the anti people.
Thank you 🙏🏽 (Just technically the word is, “antisemitism”, no hyphen. It makes a differences, as the anti people love to say that other people are Semites and it’s not just about Jewish people. Boy, how I wish that were true, but the word was created by a Jew hater specifically to legitimize the hatred of Jews. As if he needed a word…..)
It’s great to know I wasn’t the only one who couldn’t take their eyes off Mike Johnson all evening. The clapping what he thought was just below camera view was precious. Langford mouthing “It’s true, it’s true” was great. Biden was spectacular at the SOTU.
I'm 70 years old and from Cleveland, OH. I had a lot of Jewish friends in my lifetime. Some of them were very close. I could never understand antisemitism. To me, it makes no sense. So while in college, I took a course on the Israeli Palestinian struggle. I had a Jewish professor and the class was made up with Christians, Jews and Muslims. The discussions were, at times, quite lively. However, there was no hate. The professor we had was wonderful. He was able to direct students towards historical facts, and explain how complicated this all is. (At least, we learned the definition of Zionism.) I now live in Nashville. OMG. Antisemitism is alive and well here. People often receive flyers about how evil Jews are. It makes me sick because no one calls them out. I don't know what we do when we're living in today's environment. It scares me.
Your university days were, like mine, before social media and the growth of radical islamism in the Islamic world. Although we've always had a "Middle East Crisis", it's so much worse now.
@lucibjlb I'm from Scotland but I know a lot of folks from Nashville and from the South in general. My experience is that their culture is one of the friendliest in the world, just like Scotland. It pains me to hear of people there handing out anti-semitic flyers. I have Jewish family in the South too, so I do take it personally.
Thing that frustrates me is ; don't they teach classical philosophy on campuses anymore ? I mean all these conflicts have already been fought, won, lost, argued over for thousands of years ! The answers are right there in very thorough expensive libraries just a short walk across the quad. But no, too difficult. Let's wallow in the stupid & once again start from there.
@@jessd4048To which are you referring ? Philosophy has nothing to offer ? Or students today are in fact well versed in the classics & thus understand the full ramifications of chanting antisemitic slogans & other hate speech ? Or my last inference that we're doomed to repeat past mistakes if we don't learn from them ?
@@YABBAHEY1 the nonsense is the presupposition that the priors *you are operating from* are the only or the best ones. This is the fundamental breakdown, having this discussion today is as disparate in fundamental values as it was arguing with a segregationist in 1965- in this analogy *you* are the segregationist assuming the world you were born into & the assumptions your frameworks were built upon are the only valid ones gleaned from classical and biblical understandings, meanwhile a generation born after saw through those appalling frameworks and understood that they would NEVER adopt beliefs of that kind. The premises, the priors, you lionize are not unknown to those who reject them, they are rejected because they are insufficient, immoral, parochial and unjust. These ‘young people’ can furnish you your arguments, they’ve read the books too- it’s not that they ‘don’t understand’ it’s that they reject whole cloth as insufficient anything that rhymes with colonialism, with empire, with a class of people who are rendered disposable savages- these antique belief are anathema to the multicultural, multiracial, egalitarian values which have replaced the racist ‘liberal centrism’ beloved of the culturally narcissistic post war boomers and their generational neighbours. In this conversation the gravest crime is how unidirectional the narrative has been. It’s an appalling cope because at the end of the day the nice-racist ‘liberal centre’ cannot win unless it is cheating.
@@YABBAHEY1 my original reply was of course deleted. There is no point in engaging when the moral force of the arguments are sanitized and denuded by algorithmic fiat. If a person wants to talk about the ‘classical philosophical debates which settled’ the morally corrosive force of settler-colonialism it will have to be on another, braver platform.
From my Irish famine immigrant perspective it comes down to are you supportive of Apartheid or do you oppose Apartheid. It has little to do with antisemitism, it is frustration of 57 years of Occupation. Crimes against humanity are crimes against humanity, the current Israeli government is practicing ethnic cleansing. Where do you want all the displaced Gazans to finally end up.
Fvck the pope and Fvck the IRA with respect, We stand with Israel and we DO not negotiate with terrorists. Did you see the videos of the attacks that happened as a gift on Putin's birthday? maybe this isn't about the British this time.
Antisemitism is extremely varied and multifaceted depending on politics, historical period, nation, time, place, social class and to some extent industry. For example, antisemitism in the banking industry kept “Jewish banks” out of much prime international lending in the 1920 because they had also been big financial supporters of Germany, prior to 1918. The Bank of England Board of Governors was full of anti-semites as was JP Morgan. In the 1930s the British upper class was very fascism-friendly. In recent years the political right in the US has been highly critical of institutions who consider boycotts of Israel. And yet, the 1970’s when the US economy was on the skids and the Middle East was awash in petrodollars, US corporations, from banks to architectural and engineering firms were “hiding” their Jewish employees connections to Israel in order to do business with Gulf states…all done very quietly. Within my own family I have seen a significant feelings of alienation from Israel. I have observed that American “secular” Jews have a particular antipathy towards ultra-orthodox Jews, to a degree that I just don’t see among Gentiles. The rise of political influence by the ultra-religious in Israel over the past 2 decades has been extremely disturbing to my Jewish family members. Interestingly, the “golden age” referenced here somewhat corresponds to the period of time when Israeli politics was most influenced by people with European secular left-wing roots. Those days are probably over.
Al, I love ya, but if I criticized the pension policy change in France, would you call me a Francophobe? No, that'd be silly. If I criticized China over it's lax enforcement of International intellectual property rights would you call me a Sinophobe? No, that's silly. If I criticize the government of Israel's policy towards settlements in the West BAnk and the Gazan g*nocid* I'm suddenly an anti-Semite?! How does that make sense?
I think the difference is between criticizing the government and power in Israel vs holding a Jewish high school student in contempt for the actions of that government over which they have no say or control. Lumping a people together whether Jewish, Palestinian, Mexican, black, white, or indigenous and holding them responsible for the sins of a few is wrong. Each of those individuals is a person to be respected and protected from harassment and hate unless that individual shows themself to not deserve it. I hold Netanyao and his far right cabinet responsible for the genocide in Gaza in the same way I hold Putin responsible for the destruction in Ukraine. But that doesn't make every Jew or Russian a conspirator.
There are definitely people (esp Netanyahu and his extreme right supporters) who shut down international criticism by conflating being anti-far-right-wing-Israeli-policies with being anti-Semitic. Irony is, even most Israelis dislike Netanyahu and want him gone, as the huge protests in Israel over judicial reform last summer showed. The majority of Jewish Americans also oppose Netanyahu’s policies too. The fact that some right wing Israelis use “anti-Semitism” rebuttals in bad faith doesn’t mean there aren’t problematic levels of anti-Semitism here in the U.S. that seriously affect Jewish Americans.
We've been in the US since 1655. 134 years longer than the US has been here, in fact. What can we do to end antisemitism? -Use the words hate and bigotry like everyone else. -Stop the never forget the 6 million and one people of the Holocaust and start to never forget the 66 million people who died during and fighting authoritarianism. -We need to become right-sized. We are .02% of the world population. Nobody should know about us. Yet, we have outdone everyone in doing well. Gratitude is good. -Fight all hate and bigotry, especially that of our own people.
The professor who said he was elated by October 7th and later apologized after learning the scope of the massacre, was Norman Finkelstein. Finkelstein is, like myself, the son of Holocaust survivors. His parents survived the Death Camps. He rightly regarded Gaza as a massive concentration camp, and he initially celebrated October as a successful revolt of the prisoners of a concentration camp. I was named for my paternal grandfather, who perished in the Warsaw Ghetto. When I learned about what had been happening to the people of Gaza, even before October 7th, I thought of the Warsaw Ghetto. I, as a Jew can only feel betrayed, angry and ashamed by this fascist regime of what claims to be a Jewish State.
Thank you. I've always loved Al Franken. ALWAYS. But on this issue he has obviously not understood the complexity of issues. His simplistic evaluation is a huge disappointment. He's obviously been steeped in propaganda from birth? He knows what he believes. He hasn't listened to others for a broader understanding? He should walk a mile in a Palestinians shoes. I'm from Minnesota too. Antisemitism doesn't even exist compared to anti Palestinian prejudice. Any ARAB. Wow. I'm glad AL didn't run as President. But you are a breath of non-ignorance. 👍 ❤️
@@rezrunnercl I don't think he said something so outlandish, he was interviewing someone who wrote an article about what Jewish students are experiencing in grade school. I don't think it's propaganda to express concern. There has been such an increase in attacks against Jewish people in the US, a synagogue was protested yesterday, it feels like the world is holding all jews responsible for another country.
@jacobvandijk2184 It's not a pretty world right now. America is divided. The world is divided. Words fly. I'm not saying that's a good thing. No kids or people should be insulted. My problem comes with the super thin skin of some Israeli people, as if they suffer from this so much more than others. Or their suffering is more important than any other. Less seems always more to some. Perceived "offense" is used as a weapon for some. " I only know my own experience. Places are different. I never saw antisimitism growing up. A LOT OF ARAB HATE. But that never counts. People don't even notice. It's normal. A LOT OF NATIVE AMERICAN discrimination. But that doesn't count either... right? It's normal for them to be "lesser." But had anyone been prejudiced toward an Israeli person... that would be a big-big-big- deal. But now, with a genocide happening, there will be feelings expressed. If people support their country committing genocide, there will be a price, like there was with the German people. What's going on now is not about being Jewish. Few people care what religion people choose. It's about justice. It's about racist ideologies like "White Christian Nationalism" and "Zionism."" If people ascribe to a racist ideology , there will be rightious pushback. No one has the right to never be insulted. And Zionists need to look at how insulting their ideology is to others. It is not Judiasm. It's a racist political invention.
That makes sense if you ignore the fact that post 9/11, the US reacted pretty much exactly the same then as Israel is now. The US isn't some moral high ground, it's actions are just as pointlessly violent towards the civilian populations in the Middle East.
Perhaps had Israel not devolved into an apartheid state, Hamas wouldn’t have supporters. If they had the rights of sabras, their existence would be unnecessary.
How sad, as a Baby Boomer, now 71, to see where this country has gone. And in the age of computers, Wi-Fi and social media… Everything escalates so quickly with almost no valid information. There is no question that Netanyahu is a nightmare. And what has gone on between Israel and Palestine has been way way too long. It needs to be resolved. And the current mess in Gaza , humanitarian, needs to be strongly, supported by Israel. But the fallout in the US for American Jews is unthinkable to me. the that our youngest people know so little about Jewish history inside and outside of this country is unforgivable. Because we don’t teach history in the public schools. Not to the extent that is needed. The Jewish population in this country has blessed America deeply. As with all groups, there are the bad as well as the good. But America has overwhelmingly thrived because of its Jewish citizens. And some of my closest friends, indeed are Jewish. They are some of the most delightful people in my life in all respects. I don’t know if I will live long enough to see this country turnaround back to some of the common sense and groundedness. I grew up with in the 50s. Nothing is perfect. And great strides were made in the 60s and 70s. Never have I thought things would end up as they have now….. struggling for the very soul of this nation…💔💔💔
You have to teach history at home, while you parenting your children, and not be an absentee parent. Having 3-5 children in average household could help as well
@NJIT22 teaching history at home to your children is obviously needed in all homes regardless of how well they are taught in school, but I don't understand why you think it is important for parents to have 3-5 children. .. how would that make a difference?
@@NJIT22 that would depend on exactly what those parents are teaching. Homeschooling has its own issues. While, not perfect I was taught AP History in high school. But even that was limited as the teacher only covered up to the end of World War 1. Would parents even know enough to be able to cover American History adequately. Where would they get the textbooks. The newer textbooks are extremely biased in favor of whitewashing American history.
One problem is that even concerned individuals like you are perpetuating false information. Most of us Israelis would vote Netanyahu out again today, if elections were to be called. But as far as the Hamas war is concerned, there is no daylight between him and other candidates. Our goal is to eliminate Hamas and release hostages while minimizing civilian casualties (which the Palestinians, keeping with their tradition, inflate - I know, having worked with their "statistics" frequently). But your analysis of the American situation is spot on. And the common factor of the last half of the 20th century was a focus on a search for truth, science, and striving for a colorblind, merit-based society, with the elite universities' leading the charge. This focus helped Jews. America has moved toward tribalism and identity-based systems. And when America moves in this direction, led by the elite universities and institutions into which Jews had been accepted, but exacerbated by Obama and Trump, Jews are disproportionately hurt. If America doesn't either move on from these institutions or change them , then indeed the future of America is bleak and the future of American Jewry is even bleaker.
@@malcolmainspan5036 I think anyone remotely paying attention to Israel knows Netanyahu is deeply unpopular but that certainly hasn’t stopped him. And a sizable portion of the Israelis are unhappy with how Palestine has been handled. But it continues. Just as the increasing authoritarian right wing encroaches in the US. Agreed… our universities are a mess and desperately need a reset. The intensity about the Palestinian bombings, starvation is justified but simplistic in its understanding. Younger people rarely have full context like understanding even why Israel was settled/created in 1948.
Al and Frank, as one of the "few " gentiles who listen every Sunday, let me thank you for talking about this very complicated subject. And after reading some of the rest of the comments, I think I'll just keep my big shiksa yap shut beyond that.
What's your next argument, that it didn't start October 7th but 75 years ago? So you are aware the Arabs were quite clear that they intended to commit a genocide against the indigenous Jews, as they did in Hebron in 1929.
35:44 sick of hearing this canard of Olmert's "most generous offer". Really shows Foer's (surprising, and disappointing) ignorance about this episode in history. Olmert was already a lame duck as a result of his legal troubles and thus had no way of upholding Israel's end of the bargain. The Bush Administration and members of Olmert's government (Tzipi Livni, Olmert's expected successor) did not commit to supporting the agreement. Netanyahu announced at the time that he would not honor the agreement if signed. It's ridiculous to blame the Palestinians for not taking a deal that didn't even have a chance to begin with. Foer laments that people don't appreciate the nuances in the history of the conflict. Perhaps he should engage with the nuances himself before complaining about the shortcomings of others.
some do, some don’t. some support, some add corrections, some add historical context… do you also wonder about the people uploading false information? the chances that an arab nation will be treated fairly in an english language news article are approaching zero. so, articles about arab people are likely to attract more than the average number of corrections. i suspect that the christians have not “forgiven” arabs from moving into jerusalem when the roman’s kicked out the jews. when you decide to dictate terms of what you will or will not accept with an empire that barely recognizes your existence, you might get kicked out. the diaspora was some gentle treatment by the romans considering the jews insulted their gods. and then they became muslim, which really upsets christians. the depth of the prejudice against arabs is impressive. so no, i don’t wonder about people who correct even al franken if they present misleading information. i applaud them. ☮️ ❤️
@@patrickmaline4258 There are too many mistakes in your comment to make it acceptable. Some serious research needs to be done by nearly everyone on this post..
For me Jews are among the people I admire the most. Incredible how much Jewish people contributed to our society trough culture and art... Stay strong, I'm sure at the end Jews will save the world ❤
Al, if you really want your audience and Americans to understand what the real problem is, interview Dr. Einat Wilf, a left-wing peace camp Israeli and read her book “The War of Return”
@@deeznutz8320 look at the stats for attacks on minorities in the US. Jews are 1-2% of US population. Attacks on Jews are disproportionate. Plus, equating Jews to wealth…that’s antisemitism. Maybe take another look at your understanding of minorities, h*te etc
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Not going to talk about persecution of palestinians by the likud government. Doesnt play well al. We look on america and its relationship with jewish people as anomolous at the best of times. Ask britain about its history with israel.
As far as pro Palestinian rallies right after Oct 7th, the Israelis shut off water and electricity almost immediately. Many people could see what was starting to happen.
@@MrAbuYaz And they shut off that 9%. They barely get enough so 9% shut off with electricity shut off is enough to start shortages. A large percentage of the population was getting substandard water before Oct 7th.
@@elliota.1063 looking to find something to complain about in the aftermath of the slaughter reveals pent up hostility. Not a word about atrocities committed by his darlings. If you don't see it, you're not experienced.
@@MrAbuYaz Well, cutting off necessities for life to a captive population IS a war crime. It's not as if it's a war crime--but not if Israel does it. The killings of over 30,000 people, 2/3 of them women and children is a war crime as well. As is not allowing food aid, leading to hundreds of thousands on the brink of starving to death. These are just facts, and anyone remotely in touch with their humanity wouldn't support that. There's nothing hateful at all in pointing these things out; not pointing them out would be more a sign of hate...
Lack of in depth analysis on the root causes for the existence and actions of Hamas. But great coverage of the unfair treatment of Jews. Quite disappoint as I expected more from Mr. Franken.
The root causes of Hamas are Islam and non believers “occupying” any portion of what was Dar Al Islam (the world of Islam ). Is it ignorance, naiveté or fear of being branded Islamophobic that prevents discussion of that ?
Just finished listening to this episode as well as read Foer's article. I've said this before, I love Al when it comes to the domestic issues/politics but when it comes to Israel and Palestinians he has a major blind spot. Even way before Oct 7th, Al has said, (paraphrasing here), the Palestinians are to blame for their position in life, (I believe that was either in the Lt. Col. Vindman or David Miller podcast). Isn't that like blaming a rape victim for being raped? Al's listeners would be better served by having 2 people from opposing sides to give their viewpoints. That's the exact same problem I've seen with schools such as Columbia and Harvard, none of the Ivies encouraged a debate on this issue or discussion in an open forum. All I saw were professors, administrators and donors trying to shutdown any opposition to the war. Shutdown freedom of speech. Remember the Vietnam War, were students on college campuses quite then? Listening to Al and Foer speak unchallenged it just comes across as soft propaganda. Is antisemitism on the rise, probably but how much is due to the war. How did Americans react or treat German Americans or Japanese Americans during WWII? I'm not saying any of it is or was right but there is a history of this happening in our country during periods of war. (Ever see any of Dr. Seuss's war propaganda works, especially the stuff that pertained to the Japanese: "The Honorable 5th Column... Waiting for a signal from home.) If Dr. Seuss can justify doing it, what's that mean for the rest of the country? I've seen several protests and yet to see any real violence, crazy yelling by both sides for sure but nothing more than that. Lastly I totally disagree with Foer on the 1 State or 2 State Solution, it's not complicated, people like Foer want to make it complicated but it's not. You either demand all people have equal rights or you just divide the land and resources up with an even 50/50 split. The world just forces one or the other. If an international body could create Israel out of thin air then it can do it again to resolve the Palestine / Israel issue. chicagoreader.com/blogs/the-scurrilous-cartoons-of-dr-seuss/
The Palestinians have squandered billions of dollars in aid to build rockets and tunnels. They indoctrinate their youth at home and in school with teaching hatred towards the Jews and martyrdom via destroying them. The Hamas Charter is vile with genocidal intent as is the Pay for Slay policy by the Palestinian authority. They, like Arafat in the year 2000 and 2001 turned down great peace deals because he like Abbas refuses to believe that Israel has the right to exist and greatly screwed the Palestinian people by digging their heals in the sand. The Palestinians never miss an opportunity to miss an opportunity. You falsely believe that if Israel were super nice that the Palestinians would be in return. Every concession that Israel has ever made, was followed by terrorism and just a stepping stone by the Palestinians in their mission of total obliteration of Israel.
Thanks, Frank & Al, for the clarity! As soon as it came up, I wondered, " _Can_ you scare the Bejeezus out of a jew?" The answer: yes, was promptly settled.
I've listened to this now halfway, never hitting the key issues ("it's complex"). . .admittedly not black-and-white, but 12 minutes these days is the limit for the average listener. If you havent made a key point by then, and you haven't at 25 minutes, this podcast imo will have more of an opposite effect than what was intended. Always aim at the general audience, not the studious intellectual.
I understand Franken asking about pre/post bombing dates, but what other country, especially a small country surrounded by neighbors dedicated to their destruction, should not work to return hostages and destroy the attackers? Am Yisrael Chai.
May I also add that city councils opining on foreign policy is not something new. I recall Bernie Sanders as the mayor of Burlington Vermont holding hearings on US policy in Central America.
I think that for the sake of balance, you should invite someone like Norman Finkelstein or Miko Peled, a son of an IDF General who helped win the ‘67 war, on your podcast. They might open up new perspectives on what is happening in the region and why.
1991: Medical College of Virginia (now VCU School of Medicine), in Richmond, Virginia (with library next door to the White House of the Confederacy -- now a museum), still had a "Jewish quote", such that, in a city with 8 synagogue congregations, one of them among the oldest in the U.S., and a medical school class of roughly 170 students, had only 5 Jews -- and at least 6 Iranian immigrants. Of course, this limit on the number of Jews allowed into the medical school class was a secret.
Yes, at MCV they even found a well shaft of bodies full of Africans that had been experimented on. And yet today who is it terrorizing African America? oh right... right-wing zionist thugs who want to terrorize them for daring to empathize with the plight of occupied Palestine
mike johnson's facial and body language: I could just see the gears in his head grinding along, only clapping twice, nodding in agreement a few times, but mostly shaking his head in disagreement(opposite plans).Then his body language, sitting straight upright, sinking a little here and there.
As a Leftist, I feel relieved that Foer was unable to find real examples of anti-Semitism on the Left, despite saying again and again that there are lots. This is this generation’s Vietnam. Whose side are you on?
I am a 'leftist' myself and I hear antisemitism from my compatriots all the time. It IS true the the far left has become antisemitic. You don't see this? Hmm... (I am not Jewish)
Since when is being disgusted with Israel antisemitism? We fought a war in afaganistan and Iraq so Israel didn’t have to share the holy land with Muslims we send 4 billion a year to Israel why? Since when did Israel become a state of the United States. Thanks Al for valuing Israel over the usa.
It's geopolitical, people fear if the US stops backing Israel, they will ally themselves with Russia. That could create a whole new set of problems. It's a catch-22 situation.
I hate that when people talk about Charlottesville, they don’t mention Heather Heyer, they just quote Trump. I’m sure Trump is anti- Semitic but that day, he was just distracting with his both sides comment.
If Israel had not responded the way it has after the attack on 10/7, I seriously doubt if Foer would have written this piece. I believe the attack itself -- in its brutality -- would have had the impact of increasing sympathy towards Jewish people -- much the way people of the world sympathized with Americans following 9/11 -- until the USA went on its military rampages.
To paraphrase Gideon Levy, a veteran journalist for Ha'aretz, "There may have been more brutal and cruel occupations in history, but NEVER one where the occupier tried to present itself to the world as the victim."
Among other things, the world was told about "mass rapes" and "forty beheaded babies," aka "atrocity propaganda." Journalists have investigated these claims and found them to be without merit. Most of the killings in the kibbutzim occurred late in the day on the 7th -- as the IDF rained down fire from tanks and helicopter gunships. The initial death count was quickly revised downward by 200 -- when it was confirmed that that many Hamas fighters were killed and burned beyond recognition from that fire. Most of those fighters were in the proximity of Israeli citizens -- and the fire took them out too.
@@yabits Israel is NOT an occupier by real international lawyers. Hear Natasha Hausdorf. The law of Uti possidetis juris. Israelis should have Gaza+WB+Israel according to this law because the last real borders that was officially recognized included ALL three for Israelis!
you mean the one that found credible evidence of sexual violence being cared on not just by a few teenage hamas insurgents on Oct 7th, but on a MASS scale EVERY day in Israeli gulags? The ones where children as young as SEVEN years old are taken and imprisoned for their whole lives. And this is to say nothing of what the "settlers" do to kids and women...
Excerpts from Zionism’s Jewish Nostalgia Trap: A Rebuttal of Franklin Foer March 12, 2024 By Benjamin Balthaser "As many American Jews are casting about for historical metaphors as Zionism’s colonial and violent nature can no longer be concealed, Foer reaches back into a myth of American Jewish life as to say, it is not we who have a problem, it is all of America. Nostalgia as a mode, to cite the literary critic Frederic Jameson, is one outside of history, rendering historical time as flat, seamless, inside the immediacy of the present. Foer’s evocation of Yiddish is precisely this form of saccharine nostalgic haze: an incoherent mashup of Jewish leftists, anti-Zionists, cosmopolitanists and then also, nationalists, racists, and colonialists, as if these have any more common than exemplary Russians Tsar Nicholas the Second and Vladimir Lenin. Foer is right in one regard: a certain era of Jewish American history is over, or at least, is concluding, that is not separate but rather a part of a certain crisis writ large of American liberalism. And indeed, this is perhaps what Foer actually mourns: that his affiliation with American liberalism and an apartheid state are now shown, in full view, for both its contradictions and its continuities. As much as liberalism has been a strong current of American Jewish life, its hegemony was always in dialogue with other strains of both radicalism and reaction, and it has only been by the violent power of states that the former was earlier suppressed and the latter is on the warpath. The liberalism that Foer evokes has, in its earlier moments of crisis, aligned with an imperial state even over the interests of other Jews, whether covering over Roosevelt and Truman’s barring of Holocaust refugees or siding with the American Jewish Committee in its support for the Rosenbergs’ execution. The vital center was never vital, and its hegemony could only be secured by the silencing and erasure of the radical left, and the absorption of the radical right. Whatever the future of American Jewry may be, I will take the activists marching for Palestine over Foer’s over-the-counter-culture schmaltz. Benjamin Balthaser is Associate Professor of English at Indiana University at South Bend
I am shocked that Mr. Foer equates pro-Palestinian stance in the Gaza of war with anti-Semitism. I'm quite certain that most of the people protesting in the Bay area to end the war on the people of Gaza was not anti-Semitic, they were anti-israel bombing and killing Palestinians. And even Mr Franken here said he was shocked at this. Americans know that this has been going on for decades and that Israel's thumb on Palestine is responsible for the reaction of October 7th. The first day of all this was not October 7th. Israel has been perpetrating crimes against the Palestinians for decades and even into this war continue horrible instances of violence against Palestinians in the West Bank. So the equation of being anti-Israeli government's policy against Palestinians and anti-Semitism is just disgusting. Of course people are going to become anti-Semitic because of Israel's actions because Israel is a religious country. It's a religious state. It's almost required to be Jewish just to live there or at least to live there as an equal citizen. It becomes a self-fulfilling prophecy that people who are against Israel are anti-Semitic. This is because of the actions of the Israeli government.
You both need to read Anti-Judaism: The Western Tradition and an excellent book with the off-putting title People Love Dead Jews by Dara Horn. Please have them both on your podcast.
Who the term Semite may refer to is neither here nor there. What I object to is the conflation of antisemitism and anti Zionism. Semites are a people, whereas Zionism is an ideology, and in my opinion it is a pernicious and racist ideology which is not in any way a part of Judaism. As a Jew, I would not want to live in a Jewish State any more than I would want to live as a Muslim in an Islamic state or were I a White Christian, would I want to live in a White Christian state. An ideology is an ideology, whether or not there’s a religious component that attaches itself to it or is even central to it.
The "non Hamas" were the ones who knew and kept quiet as Hamas terrorists were making tunnels and bringing in weapons into the tunnels. Sorry, not sorry. Am Israel Chai 💙
Lovely! An aunt died before I was born has a beautiful Madonna watching over her. The fingers have broken off and it needs cleaning. Plan to give her a shine 75 years later.
@@PFA...At this rate every race in America is turning against Jews. Jews can easily prevent this by changing their behavior, but they instead blame everyone else.
I'm a Jew, and we have Biden now, and I am worried that if he stays in office there will be pogroms in the US, and our borders in the US will continue to be insecure. You are lucky you have DeSantis. --shalom from a Republican Jew
What you really mean, BUT are not honest enough to say, is: Opposition to Israel and USA support of Israel, is rising ever so slightly in parts of the USA liberal community. And I know why, and I hate it, but I'm going to pretend not to know why but be outraged over it anyway.
It requires to be widely explained that post WWI British rampant double dealing in Palestine created pretty much all the problems and conflicts in the region to this day. Oh, and kinda the French and alot from Jordan after the wars in the 60s. Just sayin'...
If you want 2 states over here then I suggest you make aliyah and live in my town. We are right on the border with Samaria. There is a large aggressive Pal town right across the road. I would like to see your face when you see them paragliding over the wall.
Actually, the name "Foer" would be the English spelling of the German name "Fõr", which is pronounced much differently (to the German-speaking ear) than "4".
Ashkenazim is a very special group, they went from the worst Holocaust to the top of the world in economic, political, cultural, technological and scientific endeavors. Is it the end of cycle!
RadwanAbu, Jealous and wish to see it end? or Admire it? All the proPalestinian people may result in destroying a hard working Jewish scientist who could find a cure for cancer, or some other great thing for the world!
A gentle reminder that Palestinians are Semites. So how on earth can a critique of one group of Semites abhorrent treatment of another group of Semites be somehow construed as “antisemitism?”
The term "antisemitism" was created to specifically describe "the hatred of Jews". Your comment is similar to the bizarre thinking from the American Right-wing that "Nazis were leftwing because the name includes "Socialism", ignoring the fact that Hitler was a fascist, and therefore the furthest right. Etymology isn't literal, it's historical.
@@bethgriesauer3825 The term was coined in the 19th century by a european who was talking about all semites, but there were no arabs in any quantity living in Europe at the time. If they were, it would certainly comprise them as well. The claim by zionists that it only applies to Jews is just another double standard that Israel employs to conflate zionism with anti semitism. Palestinians have a much stronger genetic claim to the land than european Ashkenazi Jews that led the colonial conquest of the land and are the rulers today. It's probably why you need a court order to get a DNA test in Israel, and if you have the results already, its illegal to disclose those results. Look at the definition of Semitic and it clearly includes Arabs, who still speak a Semitic language. Hitler knew exactly what he was doing putting Socialism in the moniker, he was trying to gain the most support from the German people who were very sympathetic to socialism at the time. Their leaders of the failed Weimar Republic allowed the economy to crater and wiped out generations of savings.
@@bethgriesauer3825 I’ll try once more: The term was coined in 19th century Europe during a time when there were no great numbers of Arabs living there. If there were they would have been persecuted and scapegoated just the same. The etymology of the word Semite includes people who speak a semitic language. Arabs are Semites. Palestinians are semitic. The attempt to discredit the term is unfortunate, as Palestinians have a stronger genetic claim to the land than the Ashkenazi Jews who led the zionist movement and are now the government of Israel. It’s probably for this reason that it requires a court order in Israel to get a DNA test, and if you already have the results of one, its illegal to publicly disclose this. When the term “Socialist” appeared in the Nazi moniker, it was deliberate attempt by the Nazis to appeal to the German people who were amenable to the term, as the previous Weimar Republic wiped out generations of savings leaving the majority of the hard working citizens destitute. Hitler was democratically elected and forced fascism on the populace by a series of “emergency” acts.
Did you know that israel controls land, sea and air access to Gaza and built a wall around it. Sounds like a ghetto to me. But I guess everything started Oct 7th.
Did you know that Gaza borders also with Egypt? Yes, you are right about Israel controlling sea and air, but would you leave your country borders open to Al Kaeda or the Taliban?
Did you know that almost as soon as Israel withdrew troops from and dismantled settlements in Gaza in 2005, Hamas was voted into power. Do you think any country would simply accept having a death cult bent on its destruction run the country bordering it?
@@albertowachsman They have an agreement and israel controls what goes in and what goes out. So egypt is complicit in the ghettoization. There's a difference to closing your border and a blockade of a country.
And why does Egypt do that? Could it be that they don't want to let Hamas export their terror to Egypt? I ask you again, would you let Hamas be free to come and go as they please in your country? @@kingblondie7075
The root causes of Hamas are Islam and non believers “occupying” any portion of what was Dar Al Islam (the world of Islam ). Is it lack of understanding of what apartheid ideology is, ignorance, naiveté or fear of being branded Islamophobic that prevents focus on that ? History did not indeed begin on October 7, nor did it begin in 1882 with the Arab opposition to the presence of foreigners in territories controlled by Islam, certainly of persecuted Jews returning to their homeland.
A Jew was marooned alone on a deserted island at sea for many years. He built two temples. When he was found he was asked: “Why did you build two temples?” He replied: “Well, this one here is where I worship. That one over there I don’t get along with.”
The timing of this particular program is offensive. There is famine in Gaza at this time. Famine. One hundred percent man-made famine. Can you address that instead? Please?
HUNDREDS of trucks are entering Gaza. It is not incumbent upon Israel to distribute. Hamas is confiscating the supplies. I haven't seen starving people...just the opposite...obesity there.
Old woman of Irish/English heritage here. Antisemitic thought blaming members of the Jewish religion, residents of Israel, or any ethnicity based in the Middle East is STUPID, and reeks of isolationism. Citizens of the United States are Americans first. They may additionally identify as being part of a specific racial, religious, or geographical group, but they are all Americans. What HAMAS did to Israel is unforgiveable and had to be addressed. The majority of Palestinians are not allied with HAMAS. Whether an American supports the Israeli response, or the HAMAS invasion of Israel, the US citizens who can trace their ancestors to the Middle East are not responsible for the invasion, the respinse, or the atrocities committed by both countries. Christians, Jews, and Muslims all pray to the same God, and we act like insecure jealous children to each other.
"The majority of Palestinians are not allied with HAMAS" only if you ignore the polls which clearly show that the majority of palestinians support hamas and what happened on 10/7
you say "anti-zionist and anti-semitic' in the video description but just admit it Al-- you don't see any difference between those things.. in your mind Judaism is no longer a religious tradition; it is a national identity- and one that demands absolute obedience, conformity, bloodlust, and zealous devotion to Dear Leader Bibi, King Yahu II.
Although there are several strands of Zionism, it is simply the idea that Jews have a right to live in their ancestral homeland. Our claim on the land is not exclusive, nor need it and the aspirations of the Palestinian people be mutually exclusive. Neither of us is going anywhere, and we have to coexist. It's when protesters of Israel's policies call themselves "anti-Zionist" that we have a problem with. At best, it reflects ignorance on their part. At worst, it reflects a desire to deny Jews a homeland, which looking at the past 2000 years of Jewish history should lead any reasonable person to support.
Al's favorite talking point: "Isn't it sort of anti-Semitic that people were raising the alarm before the genocide started rather than waiting until it was over?"
Every time any leftist talks about Charlottesville they leave out the fact that the major issue that day revolved around attacking and tearing down expensive aesthetically important statues that had been erected by public acclaim and stood in public for generations, and there were historic preservationists who objected to that destructive effort in principle and in their cities. You can disagree where's why others think and feel the way they do, but to keep peddling the false assumption that objecting to destruction of public statues (whether or not the citizens have any understanding of the ideology that wants to wipe out these historical symbols) -- and to call mamy people racist bigots and anti-semites including Donald Trump is a big disservice to this country and to many of its people. The legacy media reporting on Charlottesville embodies one time when a sentence was really taken out of context in a way to change the meaning, and commentators like Franken just won't stop. The over-representation of Jews in radical and revolutionary political activism, and the viciousness and the glee demonstrated in advancing the politics of personal destruction by number of Jewish politicians -- and comedians for that matter -- is really pulling the rug out from under Americans who never imagined that they would or could entertain an anti-semitic thought or feeling. A few days ago I listened to an address by a prominent Jewish intellectual who maintained that the negative attention towards Jews comes from their propensity to choose more than any group to stand up against injustice. Whether or not that's statistically true or the whole story, I learned that self-congratulation over activism was part of what Jews are telling themselves, without nuance as to how they are standing up against perceived Injustice. There is a whole lot more targeted hate of all sorts in this country in the last 20 years than previously was being expressed, and it always seems to be link to being "anti-" something, AND those attitudes are not absent from Jews, whether they come by their Jewish character on the basis of religion or of lineage. Other historically stateless groups, such as Romani, a.k.a. gypsies, have also been persecuted, driven out of areas and attacked with murderous acts of violence, yet they don't seem to be drawing fire on the front lines of the culture wars and international ideological political battles in the ways that Jews are identified with in the US and elsewhere. Assimilated or not, there's little public perception that Romani are "anti" certain ideologies, politics, or social trends. Yet here in the same moment that I have learned for the first time that Al Franken is Jewish, I have learned that he is perpetrating the name calling and hate created by the public "narrative" about who was there in Charlottesville and what was said. Maybe some activists reap what they sow; maybe those who are perfectly willing to create and perpetrate social injustice in their search for justice ought to think twice about simultaneously acting the oppressor and playing the victim card WHILE making a big deal about identifying as Jewish. It's as if the tragedy of the Holocaust and the long history of anti-semitism is being used as permission to weaponize speech and censorship to disarm and then greviously wound political opponents. Of course not all Jews, secular or religious, are proudly functioning as political and cultural attack dogs, and to imply as much is a gross generalization, and obviously not helpful. However, membership in a group that has been historically victimized does not give a free pass to members of that group to seek leadership as aggressors. The assumption of moral superiority maybe very reinforcing within any group, but it is seldom attractive or reassurimg to those over whom the group is asserting their upper hand -- while posturing as being superior.
Statues of Confederate leaders were erected as acts of bullying, decades after the Civil War. It is racist bullying that is (boo hoo) "part of our heritage"!
When we talk about Oslo, it takes place in this fantasy world where the power dynamics btw Palestine and Israel are relatively symmetric and US is a neutral. Even if we conceded that it was “complicated” (even though there is a video of Netanyahu saying he was going to use the vagueness of the accords to make sure it failed); the power dynamics are so skewed
At about the 24 min mark: the teach-ins didn't says "Jews" stole land. They spoke in terms of Israelis. You two are conflating the two things. You can be pro-Palestinian. You can even back the Hamas invasion of Oct 7th. These things do not make you anti-semitic. They can make you anti-Israel. But that's not the same thing.
You got to wonder why these people are hated so much! I mean they've been kicked out of 109 countries! You can't tell me it's just scapegoating! I don't really believe there's such thing as a scapegoat! I do believe everything happens for a reason!
There is a LOT of history that explains where antisemitic tropes come from and how they've evolved over time. If you cared enough to learn something that might change your opinion then you would do it. The information is very accessible and available, but it won't confirm your biases so you won't look it up
Scapegoating is quite common in everyday life. I’m sure you’ve come across situations like a boss at work screaming at a subordinate when the boss was the one at fault, or a parent taking out rage in physical abuse on a little kid. If people are this willing to displace blame onto others when the stakes are lower, imagine the desire to scapegoat when the stakes are the fate of an entire nation! And of course the people who are most defenseless are the ones used as scapegoats - they can’t fight back, whether due to retaliation (employee) or sheer size difference (child). A nationless ethnic and religious minority, one that historically didn’t have huge standing armies - that’s quite vulnerable. Also, the Western Christian tradition of anti-Semitism didn’t influence East Asian countries to such a severe degree, so anti-Semitism is hardly universal. A Chinese embassy official, Ho Feng Shan, risked his job and life to save thousands of Jews from Nazi-controlled Austria during WWII, by issuing them visas to travel to China. That’s the opposite of expulsion.
@@catc8927 yea well 109 country's is a lot! Then you got to think they must have really done some bad stuff to the Germans in order for the Germans to want to exterminate them! That can't be just a scapegoat! A scapegoat would be just kill a few leave the rest! But there is a lot of people that believe that that didn't even happen? Or the number is overexaggerated! And I do not believe these people all of them to be anti-Semitic! I mean denying something in history doesn't necessarily make you a racist! I don't think so anyway! Have a great day!
@@camg5949 I've looked up a lot of websites on why people hate Jews! I believe there are reasons and excuses! A excuse would be like the Jews control the media but there is 14 million Jews in the world and only six individuals control the media in the United States anyway! A reason would be there is bad statements about non Jews in the Talmud! I believe if there is bad statements in the Talmud that doesn't make you anti Semitic but just makes you anti racist! Plus what about all the racist Israelis they are behaving like Nazis a lot of them on national television's calling non Jews animals basically! There's a guy in the Israeli Knesset that is like a fascist like a Jewish Supremist! Does saying all that stuff make me anti Semitic
@@catc8927 They actually think they are gods chosen people! Chosen for what to kill 32000 women and children? They are far from that! Most jews are not Religious but still think they are chosen isn't that racism!
Stop talking about this group or that group, talk one about policies and strategies. no illegal occupation, religious moderation, defend from within, build alliances with nations. All humans on planet with nature.
To oppose apartheid is not anti-semitic. As long as American Jews support apartheid in Israel, it becomes harder to stay empathic to them as a group. If they want to pull their money outside of American tax dollars and support Israel, great, but we don't have to be complicit in genocide as a society. Support of Israel is is the same as supporting the Nation of Islam, because their ideas are the same as Israel, they just want it for Blacks without the apartheid part..
@@HoneyBadgersAreAwesome-9001 Stop the zionist propaganda. Netanyahu and all the zionist have taight your well. I grew up watching older Blacks yell racism at everything. I know the trick. The hate is the person who sees it and denies it. So are you a racist, zionist or a bigot or all the above?
Al in this moment, it seems extraordinary important for Jews to discuss the significant difference between Isreali Zionists and Jews who oppose Isreali Zionism. The "left" is not becoming antisemitic, we are anti Israel and anti oppression. Please invite a leftist Jew like Medea Benjamin to the program for a good discussion. Left wingers support folks like Medea and we support Jews who demand folks like you don't lump all Jews into the same bucket. Get out of your bubble!
I am kinda surprised that nothing is said about Evangelicals. My grandmother and my father (Northern Europeans) sent tens of thousands to support Israel. Evangelicals in Bradley County TN fly the flag of Israel… it would seem there ought to be equally loud rebukes toward the Evangelicals who have contributed toward all the steps that are commonly now decried about “the Jews”… in other words, it is also “the Evangelicals”
I’m a gentile, living in the UK, chronically aware of antisemitism. Whenever it seems appropriate, I point out, to whoever might be able to listen, that “the Jews” are not Israel. Even Israel is not the Jews. Netanyahu is not the Jews or Israel. The situation is a lot more complicated. The average Jew in America or anywhere, is no more responsible for what is happening in Gaza than my neighbours, who may or may not be Jewish , they are people. It’s politics and greed in tooth and claw, just as it’s always been.
Thanks, Al for a great programme, as always.
Sure, sure. But it's my government giving Israel the means to commit many many crimes.
@@teresaparnham9780 and mine, and we are helping the Palestinians,as is yours. In times of war the truth is kept hidden. We’ll only find out what’s going on long after this episode is done, when it’s deemed “safe”. You can be sure that you and I know a tiny fraction of what’s happening thousands of miles away. We are hearing what it suits someone to tell us. Take care of those around you and don’t bring a conflict, you know little about and can do even less about, home. Send aid, give money, pray , but don’t attack innocent people nearby just because a hate monger has stuck a label on to them. That’s all I’m saying.
@@23cutemonkeyIf only more people could understand nuance and complexity like you do …
@@23cutemonkey
Thank you for a sensible, well thought out comment. Calmer minds must prevail, we hope.
@@23cutemonkey even the Wash Post makes a point that starvation is occurring in Gaza. What's nuanced about that? In this 2024 election Americans won't have a chance to vote for a candidate with a different policy. All candidates espouse war. There are no opposing views. That being the case we are not governed, we are ruled. It's like we live in a corporation not a political entity.
I saw a video of a woman throwing coffee on a man wearing a Arab scarf. Just one example. Tensions are high. Emotions are high. I fear that soon people won't be using the name israelis but will be saying 'Jews' That will be the end of civil Discourse.
Hey! I'm not a Jew and I listen to your podcast. I am listening to this one.
Anti-seminism is wrong.
So is the same thing for other groups. I guess they don't have a specific word for that.
First they came for the socialists, and I did not speak out-
Because I was not a socialist.
Then they came for the trade unionists, and I did not speak out-
Because I was not a trade unionist.
Then they came for the Jews, and I did not speak out-
Because I was not a Jew.
Then they came for me-and there was no one left to speak for me.
We all need to worry about all the anti people.
Totally agree
Thank you 🙏🏽
(Just technically the word is, “antisemitism”, no hyphen. It makes a differences, as the anti people love to say that other people are Semites and it’s not just about Jewish people. Boy, how I wish that were true, but the word was created by a Jew hater specifically to legitimize the hatred of Jews. As if he needed a word…..)
@@OffbeatsMusic we’re all on the same side and all learning every day. I appreciate this insight
We need to worry about the anti people
So basically your group? Your the only ones that call themselves Gods chosen and committing genocide on natives
@@sharonconstan8234 💙
It’s great to know I wasn’t the only one who couldn’t take their eyes off Mike Johnson all evening. The clapping what he thought was just below camera view was precious. Langford mouthing “It’s true, it’s true” was great. Biden was spectacular at the SOTU.
Biden lost 105,000 uncommitted votes in Michigan because of the Genocide in Gaza...Israel is not what you believe it to be..
I'm 70 years old and from Cleveland, OH. I had a lot of Jewish friends in my lifetime. Some of them were very close. I could never understand antisemitism. To me, it makes no sense. So while in college, I took a course on the Israeli Palestinian struggle. I had a Jewish professor and the class was made up with Christians, Jews and Muslims. The discussions were, at times, quite lively. However, there was no hate. The professor we had was wonderful. He was able to direct students towards historical facts, and explain how complicated this all is. (At least, we learned the definition of Zionism.)
I now live in Nashville. OMG. Antisemitism is alive and well here. People often receive flyers about how evil Jews are. It makes me sick because no one calls them out. I don't know what we do when we're living in today's environment. It scares me.
Your university days were, like mine, before social media and the growth of radical islamism in the Islamic world. Although we've always had a "Middle East Crisis", it's so much worse now.
@lucibjlb I'm from Scotland but I know a lot of folks from Nashville and from the South in general. My experience is that their culture is one of the friendliest in the world, just like Scotland. It pains me to hear of people there handing out anti-semitic flyers. I have Jewish family in the South too, so I do take it personally.
You're either sadly decieved or you are full of shit.
@@bethgriesauer3825Israel supported those wars keep that in mind
it’s really not at all complicated.
Thing that frustrates me is ; don't they teach classical philosophy on campuses anymore ? I mean all these conflicts have already been fought, won, lost, argued over for thousands of years ! The answers are right there in very thorough expensive libraries just a short walk across the quad. But no, too difficult. Let's wallow in the stupid & once again start from there.
This point of view, is of course, absolute nonsense.
@@jessd4048To which are you referring ? Philosophy has nothing to offer ? Or students today are in fact well versed in the classics & thus understand the full ramifications of chanting antisemitic slogans & other hate speech ? Or my last inference that we're doomed to repeat past mistakes if we don't learn from them ?
@@YABBAHEY1 the nonsense is the presupposition that the priors *you are operating from* are the only or the best ones. This is the fundamental breakdown, having this discussion today is as disparate in fundamental values as it was arguing with a segregationist in 1965- in this analogy *you* are the segregationist assuming the world you were born into & the assumptions your frameworks were built upon are the only valid ones gleaned from classical and biblical understandings, meanwhile a generation born after saw through those appalling frameworks and understood that they would NEVER adopt beliefs of that kind. The premises, the priors, you lionize are not unknown to those who reject them, they are rejected because they are insufficient, immoral, parochial and unjust.
These ‘young people’ can furnish you your arguments, they’ve read the books too- it’s not that they ‘don’t understand’ it’s that they reject whole cloth as insufficient anything that rhymes with colonialism, with empire, with a class of people who are rendered disposable savages- these antique belief are anathema to the multicultural, multiracial, egalitarian values which have replaced the racist ‘liberal centrism’ beloved of the culturally narcissistic post war boomers and their generational neighbours.
In this conversation the gravest crime is how unidirectional the narrative has been. It’s an appalling cope because at the end of the day the nice-racist ‘liberal centre’ cannot win unless it is cheating.
Think I see what you mean
@@YABBAHEY1 my original reply was of course deleted. There is no point in engaging when the moral force of the arguments are sanitized and denuded by algorithmic fiat. If a person wants to talk about the ‘classical philosophical debates which settled’ the morally corrosive force of settler-colonialism it will have to be on another, braver platform.
From my Irish famine immigrant perspective it comes down to are you supportive of Apartheid or do you oppose Apartheid. It has little to do with antisemitism, it is frustration of 57 years of Occupation. Crimes against humanity are crimes against humanity, the current Israeli government is practicing ethnic cleansing. Where do you want all the displaced Gazans to finally end up.
As a Cherokee. I'm certain it will be on my ancestoral land
And I will assume your ancestors ended up in what is now Oklahoma.
You will see that the New American Port about to be built at GAZA is about Oil and Gas in Palestinian Waters...
Fvck the pope and Fvck the IRA
with respect,
We stand with Israel and we DO not negotiate with terrorists. Did you see the videos of the attacks that happened as a gift on Putin's birthday? maybe this isn't about the British this time.
You want to know what ethnic cleaning really looks like? Study the history of your own religion - starting with the crusades.
Antisemitism is extremely varied and multifaceted depending on politics, historical period, nation, time, place, social class and to some extent industry.
For example, antisemitism in the banking industry kept “Jewish banks” out of much prime international lending in the 1920 because they had also been big financial supporters of Germany, prior to 1918. The Bank of England Board of Governors was full of anti-semites as was JP Morgan. In the 1930s the British upper class was very fascism-friendly.
In recent years the political right in the US has been highly critical of institutions who consider boycotts of Israel. And yet, the 1970’s when the US economy was on the skids and the Middle East was awash in petrodollars, US corporations, from banks to architectural and engineering firms were “hiding” their Jewish employees connections to Israel in order to do business with Gulf states…all done very quietly.
Within my own family I have seen a significant feelings of alienation from Israel. I have observed that American “secular” Jews have a particular antipathy towards ultra-orthodox Jews, to a degree that I just don’t see among Gentiles. The rise of political influence by the ultra-religious in Israel over the past 2 decades has been extremely disturbing to my Jewish family members. Interestingly, the “golden age” referenced here somewhat corresponds to the period of time when Israeli politics was most influenced by people with European secular left-wing roots. Those days are probably over.
Al, I love ya, but if I criticized the pension policy change in France, would you call me a Francophobe? No, that'd be silly. If I criticized China over it's lax enforcement of International intellectual property rights would you call me a Sinophobe? No, that's silly. If I criticize the government of Israel's policy towards settlements in the West BAnk and the Gazan g*nocid* I'm suddenly an anti-Semite?! How does that make sense?
You have missed the point of this. Al, himself, dislikes Netanyahu. Did you miss that?
I think the difference is between criticizing the government and power in Israel vs holding a Jewish high school student in contempt for the actions of that government over which they have no say or control.
Lumping a people together whether Jewish, Palestinian, Mexican, black, white, or indigenous and holding them responsible for the sins of a few is wrong. Each of those individuals is a person to be respected and protected from harassment and hate unless that individual shows themself to not deserve it.
I hold Netanyao and his far right cabinet responsible for the genocide in Gaza in the same way I hold Putin responsible for the destruction in Ukraine. But that doesn't make every Jew or Russian a conspirator.
There are definitely people (esp Netanyahu and his extreme right supporters) who shut down international criticism by conflating being anti-far-right-wing-Israeli-policies with being anti-Semitic.
Irony is, even most Israelis dislike Netanyahu and want him gone, as the huge protests in Israel over judicial reform last summer showed. The majority of Jewish Americans also oppose Netanyahu’s policies too.
The fact that some right wing Israelis use “anti-Semitism” rebuttals in bad faith doesn’t mean there aren’t problematic levels of anti-Semitism here in the U.S. that seriously affect Jewish Americans.
Greg Abbot tossed my salad!@@richardcox7926
If I think Hamas genocidal ideology is inspired by Islam am I an Islamophobe ?
Criticism is NOT antisemitism. Israel is NOT a religion. Tikkun olam.🕊️🕊️🕊️
Spoken like someone with true Israel derangement syndrome
It's a military dictatorship.
@GreenCanvasInteriorscape they are a liberal jew with the democratic party as their religion.
We've been in the US since 1655. 134 years longer than the US has been here, in fact.
What can we do to end antisemitism?
-Use the words hate and bigotry like everyone else.
-Stop the never forget the 6 million and one people of the Holocaust and start to never forget the 66 million people who died during and fighting authoritarianism.
-We need to become right-sized. We are .02% of the world population. Nobody should know about us. Yet, we have outdone everyone in doing well. Gratitude is good.
-Fight all hate and bigotry, especially that of our own people.
The professor who said he was elated by October 7th and later apologized after learning the scope of the massacre, was Norman Finkelstein.
Finkelstein is, like myself, the son of Holocaust survivors. His parents survived the Death Camps.
He rightly regarded Gaza as a massive concentration camp, and he initially celebrated October as a successful revolt of the prisoners of a concentration camp.
I was named for my paternal grandfather, who perished in the Warsaw Ghetto. When I learned about what had been happening to the people of Gaza, even before October 7th, I thought of the Warsaw Ghetto.
I, as a Jew can only feel betrayed, angry and ashamed by this fascist regime of what claims to be a Jewish State.
Nice try. They are still never going to love you for being the "As a Jew".
Before 10/7 I might have agreed. Israel is now looking much more like my backup plan if things in USA get any worse.
Thank you. I've always loved Al Franken. ALWAYS. But on this issue he has obviously not understood the complexity of issues. His simplistic evaluation is a huge disappointment. He's obviously been steeped in propaganda from birth? He knows what he believes. He hasn't listened to others for a broader understanding? He should walk a mile in a Palestinians shoes. I'm from Minnesota too. Antisemitism doesn't even exist compared to anti Palestinian prejudice. Any ARAB. Wow. I'm glad AL didn't run as President. But you are a breath of non-ignorance. 👍 ❤️
@@rezrunnercl I don't think he said something so outlandish, he was interviewing someone who wrote an article about what Jewish students are experiencing in grade school. I don't think it's propaganda to express concern. There has been such an increase in attacks against Jewish people in the US, a synagogue was protested yesterday, it feels like the world is holding all jews responsible for another country.
@jacobvandijk2184 It's not a pretty world right now. America is divided. The world is divided. Words fly. I'm not saying that's a good thing. No kids or people should be insulted. My problem comes with the super thin skin of some Israeli people, as if they suffer from this so much more than others. Or their suffering is more important than any other. Less seems always more to some. Perceived "offense" is used as a weapon for some. " I only know my own experience. Places are different. I never saw antisimitism growing up. A LOT OF ARAB HATE. But that never counts. People don't even notice. It's normal. A LOT OF NATIVE AMERICAN discrimination. But that doesn't count either... right?
It's normal for them to be "lesser." But had anyone been prejudiced toward an Israeli person... that would be a big-big-big- deal. But now, with a genocide happening, there will be feelings expressed. If people support their country committing genocide, there will be a price, like there was with the German people. What's going on now is not about being Jewish. Few people care what religion people choose. It's about justice. It's about racist ideologies like "White Christian Nationalism" and "Zionism."" If people ascribe to a racist ideology , there will be rightious pushback. No one has the right to never be insulted. And Zionists need to look at how insulting their ideology is to others. It is not Judiasm. It's a racist political invention.
Thanks Al. It's not Sunday without you.
See joke above.
Is the golden age of American Jews ending, or is the grace period for Israel in American society ending?
that country is seriously burning thought its credit.
The grace period is ending and rightfully so.
@@NathanCroucheroh it’s already torched
That makes sense if you ignore the fact that post 9/11, the US reacted pretty much exactly the same then as Israel is now. The US isn't some moral high ground, it's actions are just as pointlessly violent towards the civilian populations in the Middle East.
@@mtns340Many on the left, myself included, criticized America’s response to 9/11 as well. That didn’t mean I was anti-American though.
As a Sabra i am opposed to the continued existence of Hamas and its supporters.
Am Israel Chai 💙
Perhaps had Israel not devolved into an apartheid state, Hamas wouldn’t have supporters. If they had the rights of sabras, their existence would be unnecessary.
How about you look inward instead and see how Israeli actions have created the circumstances for Hamas existing in the first place.
@@AdonisMediaProductionsdon’t be naive
@Isabel-oq3vf How is the alternative to that going?
By the end of President Biden's speech, ' Moses' looked sad & deflated.
You mean Bogus Moses.
@@MorrisDugan Has there ever been a real one?
@@tschorsch 500,000,000,000 matzos can't be wrong! (I'm counting back from the very first Passover seder. Your mileage may vary. :)
There is no evidence for 1.8m Hebrews in ancient Egypt. Moses is fiction.
@@MorrisDugan
So amusing.
How sad, as a Baby Boomer, now 71, to see where this country has gone. And in the age of computers, Wi-Fi and social media… Everything escalates so quickly with almost no valid information.
There is no question that Netanyahu is a nightmare. And what has gone on between Israel and Palestine has been way way too long. It needs to be resolved. And the current mess in Gaza , humanitarian, needs to be strongly, supported by Israel.
But the fallout in the US for American Jews is unthinkable to me. the that our youngest people know so little about Jewish history inside and outside of this country is unforgivable. Because we don’t teach history in the public schools. Not to the extent that is needed.
The Jewish population in this country has blessed America deeply. As with all groups, there are the bad as well as the good. But America has overwhelmingly thrived because of its Jewish citizens. And some of my closest friends, indeed are Jewish. They are some of the most delightful people in my life in all respects.
I don’t know if I will live long enough to see this country turnaround back to some of the common sense and groundedness. I grew up with in the 50s. Nothing is perfect. And great strides were made in the 60s and 70s. Never have I thought things would end up as they have now….. struggling for the very soul of this nation…💔💔💔
You have to teach history at home, while you parenting your children, and not be an absentee parent. Having 3-5 children in average household could help as well
@NJIT22 teaching history at home to your children is obviously needed in all homes regardless of how well they are taught in school, but I don't understand why you think it is important for parents to have 3-5 children. .. how would that make a difference?
@@NJIT22 that would depend on exactly what those parents are teaching. Homeschooling has its own issues.
While, not perfect I was taught AP History in high school. But even that was limited as the teacher only covered up to the end of World War 1.
Would parents even know enough to be able to cover American History adequately. Where would they get the textbooks. The newer textbooks are extremely biased in favor of whitewashing American history.
One problem is that even concerned individuals like you are perpetuating false information. Most of us Israelis would vote Netanyahu out again today, if elections were to be called. But as far as the Hamas war is concerned, there is no daylight between him and other candidates. Our goal is to eliminate Hamas and release hostages while minimizing civilian casualties (which the Palestinians, keeping with their tradition, inflate - I know, having worked with their "statistics" frequently). But your analysis of the American situation is spot on. And the common factor of the last half of the 20th century was a focus on a search for truth, science, and striving for a colorblind, merit-based society, with the elite universities' leading the charge. This focus helped Jews. America has moved toward tribalism and identity-based systems. And when America moves in this direction, led by the elite universities and institutions into which Jews had been accepted, but exacerbated by Obama and Trump, Jews are disproportionately hurt. If America doesn't either move on from these institutions or change them , then indeed the future of America is bleak and the future of American Jewry is even bleaker.
@@malcolmainspan5036 I think anyone remotely paying attention to Israel knows Netanyahu is deeply unpopular but that certainly hasn’t stopped him. And a sizable portion of the Israelis are unhappy with how Palestine has been handled. But it continues. Just as the increasing authoritarian right wing encroaches in the US.
Agreed… our universities are a mess and desperately need a reset. The intensity about the Palestinian bombings, starvation is justified but simplistic in its understanding. Younger people rarely have full context like understanding even why Israel was settled/created in 1948.
Al and Frank, as one of the "few " gentiles who listen every Sunday, let me thank you for talking about this very complicated subject. And after reading some of the rest of the comments, I think I'll just keep my big shiksa yap shut beyond that.
😂
I'm another non- Jewish observer, but have always grown up around Hebrew families in my community.
What's your next argument, that it didn't start October 7th but 75 years ago?
So you are aware the Arabs were quite clear that they intended to commit a genocide against the indigenous Jews, as they did in Hebron in 1929.
35:44 sick of hearing this canard of Olmert's "most generous offer". Really shows Foer's (surprising, and disappointing) ignorance about this episode in history. Olmert was already a lame duck as a result of his legal troubles and thus had no way of upholding Israel's end of the bargain. The Bush Administration and members of Olmert's government (Tzipi Livni, Olmert's expected successor) did not commit to supporting the agreement. Netanyahu announced at the time that he would not honor the agreement if signed. It's ridiculous to blame the Palestinians for not taking a deal that didn't even have a chance to begin with.
Foer laments that people don't appreciate the nuances in the history of the conflict. Perhaps he should engage with the nuances himself before complaining about the shortcomings of others.
boom
Isn't it a wonder why respondants choose to tear others down?
some do, some don’t. some support, some add corrections, some add historical context…
do you also wonder about the people uploading false information?
the chances that an arab nation will be treated fairly in an english language news article are approaching zero. so, articles about arab people are likely to attract more than the average number of corrections. i suspect that the christians have not “forgiven” arabs from moving into jerusalem when the roman’s kicked out the jews. when you decide to dictate terms of what you will or will not accept with an empire that barely recognizes your existence, you might get kicked out. the diaspora was some gentle treatment by the romans considering the jews insulted their gods. and then they became muslim, which really upsets christians. the depth of the prejudice against arabs is impressive.
so no, i don’t wonder about people who correct even al franken if they present misleading information. i applaud them. ☮️ ❤️
Before 10/07 We now know why Hamas shot their missiles when Netanyahu was PM
@@patrickmaline4258
There are too many mistakes in your comment to make it acceptable. Some serious research needs to be done by nearly everyone on this post..
For me Jews are among the people I admire the most.
Incredible how much Jewish people contributed to our society trough culture and art... Stay strong, I'm sure at the end Jews will save the world ❤
Although, it will be black women who save America at the ballot box in November.
Yeah Gay marriage Abortion . Hate speech laws Pornography Mass Immigration open borders . Thanks Jews
Jesus and all the apostles were jews! If you are a christian think about it! That should be debated
Al, if you really want your audience and Americans to understand what the real problem is, interview Dr. Einat Wilf, a left-wing peace camp Israeli and read her book “The War of Return”
Has Al interviewed any israelis who are not afflicted with netanyahu derangement syndrome?
Everyone has underestimated Joe no matter their age. If I'd of known any of my Gpa's I'd of hoped they would of acted like Joe.
"Golden Age"? Since when are Jews so optimistic? Maybe "Not as Bad as It Could Be Age."
Hahaha ❤
Being the richest demographic yet have the privilege of opressed minorities
Yeah so opressed
@@deeznutz8320 look at the stats for attacks on minorities in the US. Jews are 1-2% of US population. Attacks on Jews are disproportionate. Plus, equating Jews to wealth…that’s antisemitism. Maybe take another look at your understanding of minorities, h*te etc
an interesting but very flawed conversation
Could not agree with you more!
These 2 dont know what is happening there.
And you do??
@@tamiewert808yep. They didnt even bring up the court case that countries in.
And nine of the American Jewish Nobel laureates graduated from my high school. (Of course, I am not one of the them.) 😇
I am sorry for your failure. ❤😊
But then, are you Jewish?
Funny! 😁 😂
I'm going to guess the school is in NY. Maybe it was the one where Feynman went - Far Rockaway High School.
Its a nepotism fest
Al, we need you back in Congress! In the meantime, everyone can help Congress price climate pollution with Carbon Fee and Dividend with a CBAM. See CFD Movement for more.
It is too late.
@@richardcox7926 - are you one of the people who have been saying AGW wasn't a serious problem for the last three decades? You're wrong again. Every 0.1°C of warming matters, and we're headed for +3.3°C on our current path but explore policy options with MIT's En-ROADS climate policy simulator to see the ways we can hold warming below 1.5°C this century. Then learn about Carbon Fee and Dividend, which will push a high carbon price around the world, getting us halfway to that goal.
Not going to talk about persecution of palestinians by the likud government. Doesnt play well al. We look on america and its relationship with jewish people as anomolous at the best of times. Ask britain about its history with israel.
That we should have to go through this bullshit again! Did we learn nothing from hitler's reign of terror?
The Fascists come under the banner of anti Fascism.
As far as pro Palestinian rallies right after Oct 7th, the Israelis shut off water and electricity almost immediately. Many people could see what was starting to happen.
9% of their water. You might wish to learn more details before allowing your hatred to show.
@@MrAbuYaz And they shut off that 9%. They barely get enough so 9% shut off with electricity shut off is enough to start shortages. A large percentage of the population was getting substandard water before Oct 7th.
Where is the hatred in his comment?@@MrAbuYaz
@@elliota.1063 looking to find something to complain about in the aftermath of the slaughter reveals pent up hostility. Not a word about atrocities committed by his darlings. If you don't see it, you're not experienced.
@@MrAbuYaz Well, cutting off necessities for life to a captive population IS a war crime. It's not as if it's a war crime--but not if Israel does it.
The killings of over 30,000 people, 2/3 of them women and children is a war crime as well. As is not allowing food aid, leading to hundreds of thousands on the brink of starving to death.
These are just facts, and anyone remotely in touch with their humanity wouldn't support that. There's nothing hateful at all in pointing these things out; not pointing them out would be more a sign of hate...
Lack of in depth analysis on the root causes for the existence and actions of Hamas. But great coverage of the unfair treatment of Jews. Quite disappoint as I expected more from Mr. Franken.
The root causes of Hamas are Islam and non believers “occupying” any portion of what was Dar Al Islam (the world of Islam ). Is it ignorance, naiveté or fear of being branded Islamophobic that prevents discussion of that ?
He's a shallow puddle, why did you expect more?
Just finished listening to this episode as well as read Foer's article. I've said this before, I love Al when it comes to the domestic issues/politics but when it comes to Israel and Palestinians he has a major blind spot. Even way before Oct 7th, Al has said, (paraphrasing here), the Palestinians are to blame for their position in life, (I believe that was either in the Lt. Col. Vindman or David Miller podcast). Isn't that like blaming a rape victim for being raped? Al's listeners would be better served by having 2 people from opposing sides to give their viewpoints. That's the exact same problem I've seen with schools such as Columbia and Harvard, none of the Ivies encouraged a debate on this issue or discussion in an open forum. All I saw were professors, administrators and donors trying to shutdown any opposition to the war. Shutdown freedom of speech. Remember the Vietnam War, were students on college campuses quite then? Listening to Al and Foer speak unchallenged it just comes across as soft propaganda. Is antisemitism on the rise, probably but how much is due to the war. How did Americans react or treat German Americans or Japanese Americans during WWII? I'm not saying any of it is or was right but there is a history of this happening in our country during periods of war. (Ever see any of Dr. Seuss's war propaganda works, especially the stuff that pertained to the Japanese: "The Honorable 5th Column... Waiting for a signal from home.) If Dr. Seuss can justify doing it, what's that mean for the rest of the country? I've seen several protests and yet to see any real violence, crazy yelling by both sides for sure but nothing more than that. Lastly I totally disagree with Foer on the 1 State or 2 State Solution, it's not complicated, people like Foer want to make it complicated but it's not. You either demand all people have equal rights or you just divide the land and resources up with an even 50/50 split. The world just forces one or the other. If an international body could create Israel out of thin air then it can do it again to resolve the Palestine / Israel issue.
chicagoreader.com/blogs/the-scurrilous-cartoons-of-dr-seuss/
The Palestinians have squandered billions of dollars in aid to build rockets and tunnels. They indoctrinate their youth at home and in school with teaching hatred towards the Jews and martyrdom via destroying them. The Hamas Charter is vile with genocidal intent as is the Pay for Slay policy by the Palestinian authority. They, like Arafat in the year 2000 and 2001 turned down great peace deals because he like Abbas refuses to believe that Israel has the right to exist and greatly screwed the Palestinian people by digging their heals in the sand. The Palestinians never miss an opportunity to miss an opportunity. You falsely believe that if Israel were super nice that the Palestinians would be in return. Every concession that Israel has ever made, was followed by terrorism and just a stepping stone by the Palestinians in their mission of total obliteration of Israel.
About damn time. If this is what their blessings are then I'll pass!
Thanks, Frank & Al, for the clarity!
As soon as it came up, I wondered, " _Can_ you scare the Bejeezus out of a jew?"
The answer: yes, was promptly settled.
I've listened to this now halfway, never hitting the key issues ("it's complex"). . .admittedly not black-and-white, but 12 minutes these days is the limit for the average listener. If you havent made a key point by then, and you haven't at 25 minutes, this podcast imo will have more of an opposite effect than what was intended.
Always aim at the general audience, not the studious intellectual.
I understand Franken asking about pre/post bombing dates, but what other country, especially a small country surrounded by neighbors dedicated to their destruction, should not work to return hostages and destroy the attackers? Am Yisrael Chai.
May I also add that city councils opining on foreign policy is not something new. I recall Bernie Sanders as the mayor of Burlington Vermont holding hearings on US policy in Central America.
Which led directly to our present border problem. We brought it on ourselves when Reagan won over Carter.
I think that for the sake of balance, you should invite someone like Norman Finkelstein or Miko Peled, a son of an IDF General who helped win the ‘67 war, on your podcast. They might open up new perspectives on what is happening in the region and why.
1991: Medical College of Virginia (now VCU School of Medicine), in Richmond, Virginia (with library next door to the White House of the Confederacy -- now a museum), still had a "Jewish quote", such that, in a city with 8 synagogue congregations, one of them among the oldest in the U.S., and a medical school class of roughly 170 students, had only 5 Jews -- and at least 6 Iranian immigrants. Of course, this limit on the number of Jews allowed into the medical school class was a secret.
We live in a time of secrets.
Yes, at MCV they even found a well shaft of bodies full of Africans that had been experimented on. And yet today who is it terrorizing African America? oh right... right-wing zionist thugs who want to terrorize them for daring to empathize with the plight of occupied Palestine
Senator Al Frank, you are a national treasure.
No wonder Foer’s son thinks Biden’s got it.
mike johnson's facial and body language: I could just see the gears
in his head grinding along, only clapping twice, nodding in agreement a few times, but mostly shaking his head
in disagreement(opposite plans).Then
his body language, sitting straight upright, sinking a little here and there.
I didn’t know you had a Podcast Al‼️Glad to Listen ‼️❣️
It sounds like you both are upset that the narrative of Palestinians are finally being told.
frank foer -- very insightful person.
Being against genocide is not anti - Semitic
Keep telling yourself that as you watch mobs March through the streets and blockade neighborhoods in Canada and destroy stores across the world
As a Leftist, I feel relieved that Foer was unable to find real examples of anti-Semitism on the Left, despite saying again and again that there are lots.
This is this generation’s Vietnam. Whose side are you on?
I'm on the side of civilians.
I am a 'leftist' myself and I hear antisemitism from my compatriots all the time. It IS true the the far left has become antisemitic. You don't see this? Hmm...
(I am not Jewish)
@@MahkyVmedia1 Me too. I’m on the side of them living, and also having the vote - all of them.
Since when is being disgusted with Israel antisemitism? We fought a war in afaganistan and Iraq so Israel didn’t have to share the holy land with Muslims we send 4 billion a year to Israel why? Since when did Israel become a state of the United States. Thanks Al for valuing Israel over the usa.
It's geopolitical, people fear if the US stops backing Israel, they will ally themselves with Russia. That could create a whole new set of problems. It's a catch-22 situation.
You fought the war in Iraq and Afghanistan for Israel ?
You are divorced from reality regarding Israel. Get a grip man! Israel is defending itself against Iranian backed genocidal fanatics.
I hate that when people talk about Charlottesville, they don’t mention Heather Heyer, they just quote Trump. I’m sure Trump is anti- Semitic but that day, he was just distracting with his both sides comment.
More propaganda!!
Its shameful that our country must tolerate this behavior...I have never understood this bias, in our country or in any other country.
If Israel had not responded the way it has after the attack on 10/7, I seriously doubt if Foer would have written this piece. I believe the attack itself -- in its brutality -- would have had the impact of increasing sympathy towards Jewish people -- much the way people of the world sympathized with Americans following 9/11 -- until the USA went on its military rampages.
To paraphrase Gideon Levy, a veteran journalist for Ha'aretz, "There may have been more brutal and cruel occupations in history, but NEVER one where the occupier tried to present itself to the world as the victim."
Among other things, the world was told about "mass rapes" and "forty beheaded babies," aka "atrocity propaganda." Journalists have investigated these claims and found them to be without merit. Most of the killings in the kibbutzim occurred late in the day on the 7th -- as the IDF rained down fire from tanks and helicopter gunships.
The initial death count was quickly revised downward by 200 -- when it was confirmed that that many Hamas fighters were killed and burned beyond recognition from that fire. Most of those fighters were in the proximity of Israeli citizens -- and the fire took them out too.
@@yabits Israel is NOT an occupier by real international lawyers. Hear Natasha Hausdorf. The law of Uti possidetis juris. Israelis should have Gaza+WB+Israel according to this law because the last real borders that was officially recognized included ALL three for Israelis!
Luv ya, Al, but it's about freakin' time you addressed this issue head on. Seriously, you're later than the Women's committee at the UN!
you mean the one that found credible evidence of sexual violence being cared on not just by a few teenage hamas insurgents on Oct 7th, but on a MASS scale EVERY day in Israeli gulags? The ones where children as young as SEVEN years old are taken and imprisoned for their whole lives. And this is to say nothing of what the "settlers" do to kids and women...
Israel has acted so appallingly that people are repulsed by the bigotry on display.
It is a matter of separation of church and state.
It's the government, not the people. The government is bad in the country of Israel.
Keep up the good work of truth telling!
Excerpts from Zionism’s Jewish Nostalgia Trap: A Rebuttal of Franklin Foer
March 12, 2024 By Benjamin Balthaser
"As many American Jews are casting about for historical metaphors as Zionism’s colonial and violent nature can no longer be concealed, Foer reaches back into a myth of American Jewish life as to say, it is not we who have a problem, it is all of America. Nostalgia as a mode, to cite the literary critic Frederic Jameson, is one outside of history, rendering historical time as flat, seamless, inside the immediacy of the present. Foer’s evocation of Yiddish is precisely this form of saccharine nostalgic haze: an incoherent mashup of Jewish leftists, anti-Zionists, cosmopolitanists and then also, nationalists, racists, and colonialists, as if these have any more common than exemplary Russians Tsar Nicholas the Second and Vladimir Lenin.
Foer is right in one regard: a certain era of Jewish American history is over, or at least, is concluding, that is not separate but rather a part of a certain crisis writ large of American liberalism. And indeed, this is perhaps what Foer actually mourns: that his affiliation with American liberalism and an apartheid state are now shown, in full view, for both its contradictions and its continuities. As much as liberalism has been a strong current of American Jewish life, its hegemony was always in dialogue with other strains of both radicalism and reaction, and it has only been by the violent power of states that the former was earlier suppressed and the latter is on the warpath. The liberalism that Foer evokes has, in its earlier moments of crisis, aligned with an imperial state even over the interests of other Jews, whether covering over Roosevelt and Truman’s barring of Holocaust refugees or siding with the American Jewish Committee in its support for the Rosenbergs’ execution. The vital center was never vital, and its hegemony could only be secured by the silencing and erasure of the radical left, and the absorption of the radical right. Whatever the future of American Jewry may be, I will take the activists marching for Palestine over Foer’s over-the-counter-culture schmaltz.
Benjamin Balthaser is Associate Professor of English at Indiana University at South Bend
an english professor who is also an historical revisionist
im shocked
I am shocked that Mr. Foer equates pro-Palestinian stance in the Gaza of war with anti-Semitism. I'm quite certain that most of the people protesting in the Bay area to end the war on the people of Gaza was not anti-Semitic, they were anti-israel bombing and killing Palestinians. And even Mr Franken here said he was shocked at this. Americans know that this has been going on for decades and that Israel's thumb on Palestine is responsible for the reaction of October 7th. The first day of all this was not October 7th. Israel has been perpetrating crimes against the Palestinians for decades and even into this war continue horrible instances of violence against Palestinians in the West Bank. So the equation of being anti-Israeli government's policy against Palestinians and anti-Semitism is just disgusting. Of course people are going to become anti-Semitic because of Israel's actions because Israel is a religious country. It's a religious state. It's almost required to be Jewish just to live there or at least to live there as an equal citizen. It becomes a self-fulfilling prophecy that people who are against Israel are anti-Semitic. This is because of the actions of the Israeli government.
Love this Channel. Go Mr. Franken.
I disagree.
Are you defending israel or likud.
Elan Pappe, Avi Schloam, Gideon Levy, Norman Finkelstein, Jeffrey Sachs, John Mearshimer . . .
You both need to read Anti-Judaism: The Western Tradition and an excellent book with the off-putting title People Love Dead Jews by Dara Horn. Please have them both on your podcast.
Who the term Semite may refer to is neither here nor there. What I object to is the conflation of antisemitism and anti Zionism. Semites are a people, whereas Zionism is an ideology, and in my opinion it is a pernicious and racist ideology which is not in any way a part of Judaism.
As a Jew, I would not want to live in a Jewish State any more than I would want to live as a Muslim in an Islamic state or were I a White Christian, would I want to live in a White Christian state.
An ideology is an ideology, whether or not there’s a religious component that attaches itself to it or is even central to it.
how do you discriminate between hamas and nonhamas?
Non Hamas would resist and fight Hamas . (which is/was impossible). But it is the central question everyone should be asking.
hamas is irrelevant at the moment.
@@eddenoy321 since i have not yet resisted hamas am i hamas? how could i resist from Thailand?
@@herbdesson6843then you should have no say on what goes on in a country not your own and about which you obviously know very little.
The "non Hamas" were the ones who knew and kept quiet as Hamas terrorists were making tunnels and bringing in weapons into the tunnels. Sorry, not sorry. Am Israel Chai 💙
Good morning all
No justification for murder? Like war?
Lovely! An aunt died before I was born has a beautiful Madonna watching over her. The fingers have broken off and it needs cleaning. Plan to give her a shine 75 years later.
I’m a Jew. I’m so worried that if Trump gets elected, there might be pogroms here in Boca Raton.
@@PFA...At this rate every race in America is turning against Jews. Jews can easily prevent this by changing their behavior, but they instead blame everyone else.
I'm a Jew, and we have Biden now, and I am worried that if he stays in office there will be pogroms in the US, and our borders in the US will continue to be insecure. You are lucky you have DeSantis. --shalom from a Republican Jew
The documentary Hollywoodism talks about how Jewish studio heads helped create our conception of what being an American is.
Why are so many americans living illegally in the west bank.
What you really mean, BUT are not honest enough to say, is: Opposition to Israel and USA support of Israel, is rising ever so slightly in parts of the USA liberal community. And I know why, and I hate it, but I'm going to pretend not to know why but be outraged over it anyway.
Re: menorah thrown into the sea, that’s what they want to do to the Jews.
Racism and bigotry are internalized by observing the behavior of family and religious communities.
Your guest is way too biased towards Zionism. Sad.
Maybe you should do your research. Olmert was prime minister with the Kadima party. He left Likud with Sharon over the disengagement.
Love how Al says "Annie-Semitism."
It requires to be widely explained that post WWI British rampant double dealing in Palestine created pretty much all the problems and conflicts in the region to this day.
Oh, and kinda the French and alot from Jordan after the wars in the 60s.
Just sayin'...
Just commenting 😊
This is true. The problem was invented by the British.
Oh, there a few Arabic countries in the group, too.
@sarahhearn-vonfoerster7401 everyone was pretty much getting along peacefully until Asquith started double dealing them all and creating conflicts.
Rothschild gave himself Palestine invented and bankrolled the Nazis and been controlling the goy ever since but not for long...
Great podcast
If you want 2 states over here then I suggest you make aliyah and live in my town. We are right on the border with Samaria. There is a large aggressive Pal town right across the road. I would like to see your face when you see them paragliding over the wall.
Actually, the name "Foer" would be the English spelling of the German name "Fõr", which is pronounced much differently (to the German-speaking ear) than "4".
Ashkenazim is a very special group, they went from the worst Holocaust to the top of the world in economic, political, cultural, technological and scientific endeavors. Is it the end of cycle!
Sincerely hope not.
RadwanAbu, Jealous and wish to see it end? or Admire it? All the proPalestinian people may result in destroying a hard working Jewish scientist who could find a cure for cancer, or some other great thing for the world!
A gentle reminder that Palestinians are Semites. So how on earth can a critique of one group of Semites abhorrent treatment of another group of Semites be somehow construed as “antisemitism?”
The term "antisemitism" was created to specifically describe "the hatred of Jews". Your comment is similar to the bizarre thinking from the American Right-wing that "Nazis were leftwing because the name includes "Socialism", ignoring the fact that Hitler was a fascist, and therefore the furthest right.
Etymology isn't literal, it's historical.
@@bethgriesauer3825 The term was coined in the 19th century by a european who was talking about all semites, but there were no arabs in any quantity living in Europe at the time. If they were, it would certainly comprise them as well. The claim by zionists that it only applies to Jews is just another double standard that Israel employs to conflate zionism with anti semitism. Palestinians have a much stronger genetic claim to the land than european Ashkenazi Jews that led the colonial conquest of the land and are the rulers today. It's probably why you need a court order to get a DNA test in Israel, and if you have the results already, its illegal to disclose those results.
Look at the definition of Semitic and it clearly includes Arabs, who still speak a Semitic language.
Hitler knew exactly what he was doing putting Socialism in the moniker, he was trying to gain the most support from the German people who were very sympathetic to socialism at the time. Their leaders of the failed Weimar Republic allowed the economy to crater and wiped out generations of savings.
@@bethgriesauer3825 My polite response was promptly scrubbed. I now know this chanel is a sham
@@JoeBeThere That's a shame. I'd be interested in your response.
@@bethgriesauer3825 I’ll try once more: The term was coined in 19th century Europe during a time when there were no great numbers of Arabs living there. If there were they would have been persecuted and scapegoated just the same. The etymology of the word Semite includes people who speak a semitic language. Arabs are Semites. Palestinians are semitic. The attempt to discredit the term is unfortunate, as Palestinians have a stronger genetic claim to the land than the Ashkenazi Jews who led the zionist movement and are now the government of Israel. It’s probably for this reason that it requires a court order in Israel to get a DNA test, and if you already have the results of one, its illegal to publicly disclose this.
When the term “Socialist” appeared in the Nazi moniker, it was deliberate attempt by the Nazis to appeal to the German people who were amenable to the term, as the previous Weimar Republic wiped out generations of savings leaving the majority of the hard working citizens destitute. Hitler was democratically elected and forced fascism on the populace by a series of “emergency” acts.
Did you know that israel controls land, sea and air access to Gaza and built a wall around it. Sounds like a ghetto to me. But I guess everything started Oct 7th.
Did you know that Gaza borders also with Egypt? Yes, you are right about Israel controlling sea and air, but would you leave your country borders open to Al Kaeda or the Taliban?
Did you know that almost as soon as Israel withdrew troops from and dismantled settlements in Gaza in 2005, Hamas was voted into power. Do you think any country would simply accept having a death cult bent on its destruction run the country bordering it?
@@albertowachsman They have an agreement and israel controls what goes in and what goes out. So egypt is complicit in the ghettoization. There's a difference to closing your border and a blockade of a country.
And why does Egypt do that? Could it be that they don't want to let Hamas export their terror to Egypt? I ask you again, would you let Hamas be free to come and go as they please in your country? @@kingblondie7075
The root causes of Hamas are Islam and non believers “occupying” any portion of what was Dar Al Islam (the world of Islam ). Is it lack of understanding of what apartheid ideology is, ignorance, naiveté or fear of being branded Islamophobic that prevents focus on that ? History did not indeed begin on October 7, nor did it begin in 1882 with the Arab opposition to the presence of foreigners in territories controlled by Islam, certainly of persecuted Jews returning to their homeland.
A Jew was marooned alone on a deserted island at sea for many years. He built two temples. When he was found he was asked: “Why did you build two temples?” He replied: “Well, this one here is where I worship. That one over there I don’t get along with.”
The timing of this particular program is offensive. There is famine in Gaza at this time. Famine. One hundred percent man-made famine. Can you address that instead? Please?
Yes please address this in your next Sunday episode. Al.
Can you tell Hamas to address the “famine” by releasing the hostages?
HUNDREDS of trucks are entering Gaza. It is not incumbent upon Israel to distribute. Hamas is confiscating the supplies. I haven't seen starving people...just the opposite...obesity there.
Old woman of Irish/English heritage here. Antisemitic thought blaming members of the Jewish religion, residents of Israel, or any ethnicity based in the Middle East is STUPID, and reeks of isolationism. Citizens of the United States are Americans first. They may additionally identify as being part of a specific racial, religious, or geographical group, but they are all Americans. What HAMAS did to Israel is unforgiveable and had to be addressed. The majority of Palestinians are not allied with HAMAS. Whether an American supports the Israeli response, or the HAMAS invasion of Israel, the US citizens who can trace their ancestors to the Middle East are not responsible for the invasion, the respinse, or the atrocities committed by both countries. Christians, Jews, and Muslims all pray to the same God, and we act like insecure jealous children to each other.
"The majority of Palestinians are not allied with HAMAS"
only if you ignore the polls which clearly show that the majority of palestinians support hamas and what happened on 10/7
@@lesweizman388 Thoughts and prayers
@@gailjordan9250 reality sux.....it wont when israel takes back all of judea and samaria and sends the arabs packing to jordan
KAHANE CHAI
Ask an islamist!
@@stephenbloch-wb8ef ATM found chained to truck in Chambers county.
you say "anti-zionist and anti-semitic' in the video description but just admit it Al-- you don't see any difference between those things.. in your mind Judaism is no longer a religious tradition; it is a national identity- and one that demands absolute obedience, conformity, bloodlust, and zealous devotion to Dear Leader Bibi, King Yahu II.
Although there are several strands of Zionism, it is simply the idea that Jews have a right to live in their ancestral homeland. Our claim on the land is not exclusive, nor need it and the aspirations of the Palestinian people be mutually exclusive. Neither of us is going anywhere, and we have to coexist.
It's when protesters of Israel's policies call themselves "anti-Zionist" that we have a problem with. At best, it reflects ignorance on their part. At worst, it reflects a desire to deny Jews a homeland, which looking at the past 2000 years of Jewish history should lead any reasonable person to support.
This guy can't pronounce the letter "L". I hear this all the time, so many educated males (it always seems to males) can't pronounce "L". Not sure why
❤
Al's favorite talking point: "Isn't it sort of anti-Semitic that people were raising the alarm before the genocide started rather than waiting until it was over?"
Every time any leftist talks about Charlottesville they leave out the fact that the major issue that day revolved around attacking and tearing down expensive aesthetically important statues that had been erected by public acclaim and stood in public for generations, and there were historic preservationists who objected to that destructive effort in principle and in their cities.
You can disagree where's why others think and feel the way they do, but to keep peddling the false assumption that objecting to destruction of public statues (whether or not the citizens have any understanding of the ideology that wants to wipe out these historical symbols) -- and to call mamy people racist bigots and anti-semites including Donald Trump is a big disservice to this country and to many of its people.
The legacy media reporting on Charlottesville embodies one time when a sentence was really taken out of context in a way to change the meaning, and commentators like Franken just won't stop.
The over-representation of Jews in radical and revolutionary political activism, and the viciousness and the glee demonstrated in advancing the politics of personal destruction by number of Jewish politicians -- and comedians for that matter -- is really pulling the rug out from under Americans who never imagined that they would or could entertain an anti-semitic thought or feeling.
A few days ago I listened to an address by a prominent Jewish intellectual who maintained that the negative attention towards Jews comes from their propensity to choose more than any group to stand up against injustice. Whether or not that's statistically true or the whole story, I learned that self-congratulation over activism was part of what Jews are telling themselves, without nuance as to how they are standing up against perceived Injustice.
There is a whole lot more targeted hate of all sorts in this country in the last 20 years than previously was being expressed, and it always seems to be link to being "anti-" something, AND those attitudes are not absent from Jews, whether they come by their Jewish character on the basis of religion or of lineage.
Other historically stateless groups, such as Romani, a.k.a. gypsies, have also been persecuted, driven out of areas and attacked with murderous acts of violence, yet they don't seem to be drawing fire on the front lines of the culture wars and international ideological political battles in the ways that Jews are identified with in the US and elsewhere. Assimilated or not, there's little public perception that Romani are "anti" certain ideologies, politics, or social trends.
Yet here in the same moment that I have learned for the first time that Al Franken is Jewish, I have learned that he is perpetrating the name calling and hate created by the public "narrative" about who was there in Charlottesville and what was said. Maybe some activists reap what they sow; maybe those who are perfectly willing to create and perpetrate social injustice in their search for justice ought to think twice about simultaneously acting the oppressor and playing the victim card WHILE making a big deal about identifying as Jewish.
It's as if the tragedy of the Holocaust and the long history of anti-semitism is being used as permission to weaponize speech and censorship to disarm and then greviously wound political opponents.
Of course not all Jews, secular or religious, are proudly functioning as political and cultural attack dogs, and to imply as much is a gross generalization, and obviously not helpful.
However, membership in a group that has been historically victimized does not give a free pass to members of that group to seek leadership as aggressors. The assumption of moral superiority maybe very reinforcing within any group, but it is seldom attractive or reassurimg to those over whom the group is asserting their upper hand -- while posturing as being superior.
Statues of Confederate leaders were erected as acts of bullying, decades after the Civil War.
It is racist bullying that is (boo hoo) "part of our heritage"!
When we talk about Oslo, it takes place in this fantasy world where the power dynamics btw Palestine and Israel are relatively symmetric and US is a neutral.
Even if we conceded that it was “complicated” (even though there is a video of Netanyahu saying he was going to use the vagueness of the accords to make sure it failed); the power dynamics are so skewed
At about the 24 min mark: the teach-ins didn't says "Jews" stole land. They spoke in terms of Israelis. You two are conflating the two things. You can be pro-Palestinian. You can even back the Hamas invasion of Oct 7th. These things do not make you anti-semitic. They can make you anti-Israel. But that's not the same thing.
@Josh-9001 What the hell are you talking about? I'm not advocating the death of anyone. That's a horrible thing to say.
@@edacelis Backing the Hamas invasion of Oct 7 is Disgusting.
@@keepussafeUSA Backing 75 years of Israeli genocide and occupation is disgusting.
You got to wonder why these people are hated so much! I mean they've been kicked out of 109 countries! You can't tell me it's just scapegoating! I don't really believe there's such thing as a scapegoat! I do believe everything happens for a reason!
There is a LOT of history that explains where antisemitic tropes come from and how they've evolved over time. If you cared enough to learn something that might change your opinion then you would do it. The information is very accessible and available, but it won't confirm your biases so you won't look it up
Scapegoating is quite common in everyday life. I’m sure you’ve come across situations like a boss at work screaming at a subordinate when the boss was the one at fault, or a parent taking out rage in physical abuse on a little kid.
If people are this willing to displace blame onto others when the stakes are lower, imagine the desire to scapegoat when the stakes are the fate of an entire nation!
And of course the people who are most defenseless are the ones used as scapegoats - they can’t fight back, whether due to retaliation (employee) or sheer size difference (child). A nationless ethnic and religious minority, one that historically didn’t have huge standing armies - that’s quite vulnerable.
Also, the Western Christian tradition of anti-Semitism didn’t influence East Asian countries to such a severe degree, so anti-Semitism is hardly universal. A Chinese embassy official, Ho Feng Shan, risked his job and life to save thousands of Jews from Nazi-controlled Austria during WWII, by issuing them visas to travel to China. That’s the opposite of expulsion.
@@catc8927 yea well 109 country's is a lot! Then you got to think they must have really done some bad stuff to the Germans in order for the Germans to want to exterminate them! That can't be just a scapegoat! A scapegoat would be just kill a few leave the rest! But there is a lot of people that believe that that didn't even happen? Or the number is overexaggerated! And I do not believe these people all of them to be anti-Semitic! I mean denying something in history doesn't necessarily make you a racist! I don't think so anyway! Have a great day!
@@camg5949 I've looked up a lot of websites on why people hate Jews! I believe there are reasons and excuses! A excuse would be like the Jews control the media but there is 14 million Jews in the world and only six individuals control the media in the United States anyway! A reason would be there is bad statements about non Jews in the Talmud! I believe if there is bad statements in the Talmud that doesn't make you anti Semitic but just makes you anti racist! Plus what about all the racist Israelis they are behaving like Nazis a lot of them on national television's calling non Jews animals basically! There's a guy in the Israeli Knesset that is like a fascist like a Jewish Supremist! Does saying all that stuff make me anti Semitic
@@catc8927 They actually think they are gods chosen people! Chosen for what to kill 32000 women and children? They are far from that! Most jews are not Religious but still think they are chosen isn't that racism!
SOTU: Mike Johnson looked to me like he was struggling with chronic gas and constipation.
“What me worry?” Mike?
Stop talking about this group or that group, talk one about policies and strategies. no illegal occupation, religious moderation, defend from within, build alliances with nations. All humans on planet with nature.
To oppose apartheid is not anti-semitic. As long as American Jews support apartheid in Israel, it becomes harder to stay empathic to them as a group. If they want to pull their money outside of American tax dollars and support Israel, great, but we don't have to be complicit in genocide as a society. Support of Israel is is the same as supporting the Nation of Islam, because their ideas are the same as Israel, they just want it for Blacks without the apartheid part..
@@HoneyBadgersAreAwesome-9001 Stop the zionist propaganda. Netanyahu and all the zionist have taight your well. I grew up watching older Blacks yell racism at everything. I know the trick.
The hate is the person who sees it and denies it. So are you a racist, zionist or a bigot or all the above?
That is a black mark against the history of Connecticut.
What crap!
Al in this moment, it seems extraordinary important for Jews to discuss the significant difference between Isreali Zionists and Jews who oppose Isreali Zionism. The "left" is not becoming antisemitic, we are anti Israel and anti oppression. Please invite a leftist Jew like Medea Benjamin to the program for a good discussion.
Left wingers support folks like Medea and we support Jews who demand folks like you don't lump all Jews into the same bucket.
Get out of your bubble!
I am kinda surprised that nothing is said about Evangelicals. My grandmother and my father (Northern Europeans) sent tens of thousands to support Israel. Evangelicals in Bradley County TN fly the flag of Israel… it would seem there ought to be equally loud rebukes toward the Evangelicals who have contributed toward all the steps that are commonly now decried about “the Jews”… in other words, it is also “the Evangelicals”
That was it… Evangelicals who support Zionism
thank you Evangelicals. I appreciate you. shalom.