A record high number of new condos are going unsold in the GTA: Urbanation
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 5 ก.พ. 2024
- Toronto area new-condo sales in 2023 were at their lowest since 2008, that's according to Shaun Hildebrand, president of Urbanation. He warns that a slump in construction activity in 2023 also paints a grim picture for supply down the line.
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Word of advice, STOP BUILDING MILLION DOLLAR CONDOS THAT NOBODY CAN AFFORD
Because so many people overpaid for homes even while loan rates were low, I believe there will be a housing catastrophe because these people are in debt. If housing costs continue to drop and, for whatever reason, they can no longer afford the property and it goes into foreclosure, they have no equity since, even if they try to sell, they will not make any money. I believe that many individuals will experience this, especially given the impending mass layoffs and rapidly rising living expenses.
I advise you to invest in stocks to balance out your real estate, Even the worst recessions offer wonderful buying opportunities in the markets if you're cautious. Volatility can also result in excellent short-term buy and sell opportunities. This is not financial advice, but buy now because cash is definitely not king right now!
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Because they're bloody over priced !! ...Stop normalizing theses prices !!!
The gross margin for the building is around 20%, and it could be easily eaten away by interest costs if there is any delay in the projects, you just have no idea how much does the land, labor and materials cost, most importantly, how crazy is the development charge for a single unit? Do you know how many builders are going through receivership lately? The only winner is the government.
Today's prices are not much higher - if at all - then why i was selling condos in toronto from 00-08. They are normal for a big urban city.
Plus rip-off maintenance fees
@@jzou1030 20% of the gross price. The Investment is not 100% of the sale price. So the profit margin for the developer is huge. like 500% of the investment. And no "costs" dont account for this rise in price. Outside of GTA / Vancouver the sale prices for even new construction while facing the same "costs ' is a 1/4 -1/5 of what the prices are in GTA. The costs ( Material /labor) are the same except for Land cost. So the " high cost" is just an excuse developers are making.
@@jzou1030 Interest costs did not stop all the suburban subdivisions being built in the 90s and early 2000s. The problem is government/taxes, not interest rates. If anything interest rates are still way too low and accommodative, since they are lower than inflation
What about $1200 condo fees on top of mortgages?? Fees are insane
Those condo fees include insurance since it’s a shared infrastructure. Some heat costs are also usually included as well as a future maintenance levy.
@@systemera2902 NO future maint levy is included. Be prepared to may 100-200 more every year and 15,000 -20,000 one time levy every 10 years.
If you can’t afford to pay a $1200 in condo fees, you can neither afford to rent nor buy a unit that has $1200 in condo fees. Conversely you also probably can’t afford to rent nor buy a comparable house.
1200 fee would be on a 1700 sqft condo
People arent you tired of these rich liars manipulative deception? Even if they lower the prices they will never lower the fee costs . its a way to trap your investments. Be smart?? When they get you to buy , then the next 3 years No jobs. Are you going to ask them to pay the fees for you? Or is it that you like a temporal status on their books?
The pricing is out of control. Literal shoebox units now cost over $500K. Its insanity. Salaries aren't going up, but Realtors and Condo Developers are under this false impression that buyers are flush with cash. Nope!!!
No way people dont want a shoebox in the sky for a milli?
Experts confused about why no one is buying luxury property 20 times their income.
Luxury is thr most misused word these days
Anything with a roof is considered luxury to many these days.
Yeah, policy maker's favorite line is that "its a privilege" @@gcc8584
Condo prices should only be $300k at most
239k at the most.
You should’ve bought when it was $300K.
You have to pay the materials, the soft cost work, the labour and management and the costs have not stayed the same. I know new condos must conform to an environmental standard that gets tougher, every revision. This is why you see solar panels and roof gardens, to offset the carbon footprint and that puts the price up on the remaining condos. Curious as to what you think the cost to make a condo is, say 120 units.
Real estate pricing by fiat. What could go wrong?! /s
Absolutely
Its not just about housing availability that the politicians keep waffling about...its also about 'affordability'
Affordability is key. The houses and land are available without a doubt
Owning has not been 'affordable' for 20+ years in the GTA. Nothing we can do about it except hope they go unsold and prices drop or people start abandoning older units in disrepeair selling them off cheap.
Over half million dollars for a tiny shoe box plus monthly high maintenance fees
Young generation wants their dream home immediately, not how it works, you buy what you can and work your way up, EARN your dream home like every other generation did
Problem is the starter condo takes more of your income than the SFH ever did in the past.
yes condos should be 250-300 at most and low maintenance fees capped at 300$
Google condo frauds.
Real estate lawyers and sometimes even the property management companies are involved in Condo embezzlement.
Condo fee is too much!
Well...the prices of houses and condos are still way too high in this city...and not to mention the real estate agents, their percentage is way too high
What a HORRIBLE way to loo at life!! I was a senior developer at a real esate firm in 2000..when i saw how much real estate agents were making I BECAME a real estate agent and made a small fortune. I didn't point my finger and complain!! Go get yoru license..the money is insane and the job is soooooo much easier than coding..and more fun if you are outoing/sociable. Healthy too as you are always on the go physically.
@@stoneneils Net value added to society = 0. No skill, no special knowledge required. Profit off of other people's money. PURE scum, no conscience whatsoever. -Signed, an RCAF AERE w/ 21+ years in.
Shelter used to be a basic human need... now its a luxury...
And they still say we're spending more of our money not theirs to make it affordable..
It's almost like 1990 to 1992. The price of condos in Toronto dropped more than 30% to 50% from the peak. Everage House price were dropped around 30%.
Condo Presale prices are pretty crazy. Nobody can afford it. Maybe the developers should stop building luxury condos and focus on construction costs.
Lower presale prices will bring down land prices as well.
At almost $250,000 per UNIT city development fees and taxes, Plus tens of thousands in legal and other unnecessary costs to go through the permitting and entitlement process - you should direct your anger at city politicians! Ultimately, these costs must be recouped from buyers.
@@Spp235.yes city has been ever increasing fees etc and creating red tape for developers this increasing their costs. My question is where is the city spending all that extra money in the last decade? Increasing property taxes, more properties paying taxes going to upper management wages!
Every condo in GTA is luxury. If 300 square feet is luxury😂
@@l.c.3150Do you think whe a 300 unit condo tower goes up the city doesn't incur any new and extra ongoing expenses? Stop blaming politicains for everything. We live in a capitalist society which means stiff competition for nearly everything that isn't commoditized. You may be able to afford a condo but plenty of working people can. Your energy should be into yourslef not a poltiician..who would you blame anyways..the mayor whoever it is at the time of protect? lol very productve.
@@Spp235. Where did you get that number from? That sounds almost entirely made up, report from CP24 says an average new 1BR unit faces $52,000 in development charges in Toronto. Also what are these other "unnecessary costs" associated with permitting?
overpriced is an understatement these days lol.. like im not paying 400k+ to live in a closet sized shitbox in the sky
pre -const is overpriced , never buy those!
Waste of money.
Scam too
But there's a shortage of homes??? Hahaha. There never was a shortage, just speculators and investors taking advantage of 0% rates.
Truer words were never spoken
Condo’s are the biggest real estate scam. Stack shoebox’s on the same piece of land, and add-in fees.
How else do you propose Toronto house people? Last I checked there is no more space in the city.
Larger cities scale-up rather than scale-out for efficiency.
Valuable land you'd never be able to own yourself. Any structure/land has fees.
@@andrewmccoll1582Perhaps accept the fact that the city is overcrowded and live elsewhere. For those that cannot/will not, the price to pay is high. Of course there are many individual variables to consider.
@@Damazzzo I agree
800k for a measly 2 bedroom ....yeah right!
Reason for sales decline is simple …. Investors simply cannot afford to buy these units in bulk due to high interest rates. And the owner occupier cannot afford to buy because he does not qualify for financing … even for the smallest of units.
Investors can buy them.
They just don't have the confidence that they will be worth more in 5 years
@@user-vi8ci2bi6b or the confidence that they can rent them at a price which will cover all their costs of ownership.
Why would you EVER buy precon at $1500 per foot when you can get resale for $1000 per foot
@@Cutlerypotatoi was in the business in TO...sold real estate but would never buy a condo...it was the condo fees..they are completely out of your hands and they can double or triple if the building has issues.
@@stoneneils We almost bought a condo townhouse then found a freehold unit at a similar price. That was 20 years ago. I think condo fees would have increased more than realty tax over that time period.
I live near Calgary and have been paying my mortgage for almost 20 years and thanks to the new interest rates have another 22 years to go. I was thinking about selling when my kids move out over the next few years and buying a condo, getting rid of the mortgage. The prices have gone up so much over the past year that is no longer possible. I would have to have a $150,000 mortgage. Then I looked at condo fees. When they start at $650 a month, it means there is no advantage to moving. That is why seniors are not downsizing. There is no advantage to it anymore.
You’re going to end up paying 30k In interest a year and only $2000 on the principal lol good luck
Who will buy your condos for 600k. Paying in peanuts where people could afford condos under 300k. Big gap between Earning and Purchasing power. This will keep on dropping until it comes to 300k which is also expensive I guess !
Where do I begin...
- It's overpriced
- condo fee every month
- less privacy
- high interest rate
- getting tinier
- cheaper quality material
Yeah sherlock no wonder ppl aren't buying
The prices are over the top and you don't get much, crazy and greedy market.
Noone can afford to buy these condos!! The condo fees alone are insane.
Preconstruction was great years ago when prices were in the rise. There appears to be less future growth to justify high prices.
Once your in a condo thr maintenance fees gobble up a lot of money.
Should have figured out when they approved the developers to keep building luxury condos. What did they do the census for ? What type of housing is most needed ?? What's the percentage of the population who can afford the ever-rising property prices ??
This trend needs to go up and up. Government needs to understand aint no one can afford these prices except foreigners but continue banning foreigners from buying. Only those that aquired a Canadian citizenship should be allowed to buy not some schlub getting their PR, thats not enough
Not so quick. I worked in TO for a real-estate investment firm..we were all Canadian. Everyone still hated our guts for buying up allt the units then turning around and selling them at a profit...or renting them out devaluing the budiling. In one building i had 120 units so anything i voted for at the board meetings was passed. Those people wanted to kill me literally.
Toronto has low quality of construction, all costs are passed to the buyers not the case in some provinces and Toronto is a city of highways , cars , pollution built for pollution not health and family
Over priced cmon greedy developers and realtors time for a major correction DA!🙈
Jee maybe prices are too expensive? I've noticed these days new and preconstruction units are more expensive then a resale. Why would anyone pay more for something that quite frankly are likely to be of poorer quality?
That is what I ask myself everytime I hear someone receive food by Uber-eats. For 1/3 the prices they could be eating real steak or salmon full meal with a massive dessert with two beers. Instead they get a tiny little salty burger, 40 skinny fries and coke full of ice. Yay lol.
You are paying for a future value property so it is priced in that will go higher.
also the layouts are absolute garbage. Who wants a 3 bedroom 800 sq ft units???
These garbage layouts are mostly concentrated in the GTA and Ontario. Why would you buy a condo where the main entrance leads you into the kitchen sink. Why are closets now called a Den or Office. Why do so many units have 2 washrooms for a 500 square foot space.
People with 250k + yearly family incomes are not buying a condo. Management side haven’t figure it out how to make condo feasible for next wave of residents who don’t want to buy a 1.4 million house. Keep condo 350k, investors lose money lose money who cares.
Condo Fees are a JOKE ! absolute THEFT
If you have to borrow more than 80% of the money needed to buy something, you're not an investor.
Wdym lol
It's all about the return over your defined timeframe
The rich get rich on credit not cash...
@@mrscruff66 Actually the rich get rich on richer's people venture capital investments where there is nothing to pay back if it doesn't work out.
Lol totally opposite of how investing works.
Demand evaporated like our hopes and dreams did.
The government killed the demand !!!
Condo's are only for renting out or a single person. Not for growing families. So stop building boxes...we are not china or hong kong. Houses not condo's
A home isnt an investment anymore. People are smarter than that.
They are bad investments. Especially 1 bedrooms.
3k mortgage, 600 condo fees, 250 in property tax. After all that you might bring in 2500 in rent.
If you are looking to own. Why buy a 550 square foot coffin in the sky. It is way cheaper to rent until you can afford something more livable.
Uhhhhh ya think? When 2+2 doesn't equal 4... (aka salaries are no where close to required) renters need to qualify for a mortgage to rent... this idiocracy is finally coming to an end. What a shocker!!! The average person can't afford $1million for a 1 bedroom?!?!?!
Either home owners are losing some equity, or we are all dealing with inflation (wage-price spiral), or some combination of both (stagflation), there are no other ways around to fix affordability.
No private company will ever increase supply in the anticipation of price decrease. Permits are not homes. Developers are already scaling down their projects and firing workers because there is not enough demand at the current price level. So only government could increase supply in this situation.
learn words and then comment. lose/win. loose/tight.
Its wages. Condos haven't gone up in TO since the 00s....but salaries have probably gone down.
*losing
@@markhirstwood4190, thank you. Now it is fixed.
Housing in the gta and swont need to reduce by 50% to be affordable again...or jobs need to start paying close to double whats currently paid for many jobs that havent seen significamt raises in a decade
Correct. Listings are staying on the Mls forever. No buyers....
The cure for high prices is high prices.
Wondering if the government will spend 20milllion on consultants to figure out why.
No, it cost $35 million now.
Wait for the bubble bust.
We have condo projects in Niagara stalled and are flooded foundations or empty holes in the ground
Who tf wants to buy a condo for those prices? One must be truly insane if still willing to put money into it.
Over the past few years, you drive around Vancouver, you see empty lots. Guess what now? They are all building now. Why? Because they don't want to be the bag holder. I say good luck
Expect a 75% drop in inflation adjusted prices within a decade.
Oh. Too many condos?
about time.... things are stupid out there.
The people comparing Toronto to Evergrand understand neither real estate, nor Evergrand, nor Toronto.
Spot on😊
😊😊
No consequences for renters who do not pay rent. Condo investment with inflation is too high of risk.
With condo fee has high as 45% of your mortgage and then there is property tax. Property taxes for condominium is a rip off. Each unit pays the same property taxes as if you were in a single detached, where a condominium building will take up the space as 6 single detached home. Crooks.
have they tried to entice new buyers with a year supply of avocado toasts ?
People don't wanna spend their hard earned money just to pay back interest
They have overbuilt in Calgary too, newest development has turned into rentals....
GOOD
I’m just waiting to short the hell out of this market
Short at the top. Nothing to wait for.
How long have you been waiting?
@@XRealEstate777right
@@XRealEstate777 top was in already he shorted
How much of this is AirBnB? The condo associations are trying to keep them out.
True new condos are not selling. No demand of or them so the listings are just sitting on the market forever....
Lower the price. Duh
constantly amazed people are buying with these ugly square boxes and horrible construction...... can't wait to see how much upkeep there will be in twenty years
Priced themselves out of the market
A fall in pre-construction units is NOTHING compared to the disaster that is when a condo is started before the pandemic, built halfway and then the construction now halted because the developer has not sold enough units to have enough cash to pay for the condo completion. Without cash, they have to borrow, which at high interest rates, wipes out profits. In some very egregious cases, those who bought condos before the pandemic still have not moved in.
The price of condos in the Greater Toronto Area (GTA) is still high
Somene has to start losing money.
No pre-construction sales is actually bullish for the resale environment and proces overall - almost zero new supply.
Serves every developer right.
its because ppl are not willing to lower prices.... wake up folks, we ate not going back to near zero rates.. PRICES NEED TO GET SLASHED
They can't 😂. Most of them are holding on for dear life!
Whats the purpose of slashing prices. It will get sold sooner than later. No one wants to rent forever
@@babyjeero123 Just go to the bank and say "I don't want to rent forever" and you'll magically pass the mortgage stress test and qualify for a loan
Just because some cant afford it, doesnt mean no one can afford it
Would you happily buy a 5000 dollar cheeseburger just because you can afford it? bad deals are bad deals my friend....@@babyjeero123
yeah but then the realty cartels will stabilize the offer and consumers will not benefit from it.
Could this signal a top in the market?
The scary thing about peak real estate prices in Canada is that we all know it's not because new supply is plentiful.
So it would mean that demand is exhausted. That would portend a severe economic recession.
They should focus on affordable condos if they want to stay afloat.
The units would have to be literally 200 square feet. And YES I actually had one unit like that in Toronto...we rented it out for $900. There was one square area of 3x3 to stand, the rest was bed/fruniture/kitches etc. ..it was 180' floor plan officially. I don't know what it was purchased for but i wish i did.
Yes because of greedy prices.
New demand from where? With foreign buyers BANNED and cap on foreign students and hjgh interest rates!!!
Monthly :maintenance fee : 600
Hydro. : 100-120
Tax. :192
Internet. : 100
------ =
Monthly on Average: 1000 $$$
Without the mortgage cost : ????? +
Precon is dead. If you buy this garbage you will 100000% lose your money.
Builders change floorplan without telling buyers, charging outrageous fees for name changes and silly little non issue. Levy fees through the roof. And #1 not letting you sell your condo on MLS during occupancy. Many buyers are holding their property vacant until registration cause they don't want to be locked into a tenant who can't get kicked out
Also many of the presale condos that had been sold are not closing. BOC and the policy makers should reconginse that credit problem will emerge soon.
who would want to pay the massive occupancy fees!
Not surprising considering the average condo cost in gta is 700k+. Not too mention skyrocketing condo fees. The value for what they are asking just isn't there.
Down 45% pretty big pretty much 1/2. Would have to rise 82% next year just to get back to even!
idk i think they are trying to get people to pay these higher prices an lock it in a bit too. like our market is so unknown that they want to push a higher price just incase but people are looking at it differently
The government should put a cap on prices.
If all level of government should stop steal money from tax payer on housing. Housing problem will be solved by itself. All government related cost like regulations, permits, surcharges and delays probably account more than 50% of house cost.
Good
Condos are going to crash within the next 5 years. There’s only so long you can live in a 650 sq ft shoebox without going stir crazy. Single detached is king and it’s not being built in the GTA anymore, so folks, hang onto your detached homes for the best equity
650 square feet? Many units are much smaller than that. i'm in a 400 square foot apartment and honestly it only feels small when i have people over..so we go out. That's why we live downtown. To be out, not inside all the time.
No one gets to have affordable single detached anymore, because of sky-high government fees on developers, artificially low interest rates which have inflated away the value of peoples savings, and the greedy people who voted to create the greenbelt. This scheme , under the guise of being "green" , was a measure to artificially inflate the value of land in the GTA. You'll notice most of the people at those "save the greenbelt" rallies are all wealthy people with big single family homes. They got theirs and could care less about people entering the housing market.
There was more single detached being built back when rates were double digit in the late 80s and early 90s. The problem is government intervention in the free market (high fees, greenbelt) and artificially low interest rates.
@@stoneneilsYa out in the Cold or Underground Path in the company of homeless and druggies..Lol
@@junaidmohammed280huh? lol it sounds like a very funny comment but I wish I understood it. Oh wait..ok...no..i'm not american. Outside we have regular people, zombies only in one park east downtown. How come they can't stand up straight? :P I don't get that.
And rates are going higher. A mess.
A country that is corrupted completely in almost all perspective, what do you expect?
When you have to pay an arm and a leg to live in an overpriced cubicle, no wonder nobody is renting
Or could be the squatter rights? Move in bounce a check and never leave..key lock?
Yes, the government loves that they love the crime. That's coming in, and you can do that and get away with it. A good person gets pushed out of canada
People/families need 3-4 bedroom apartments without all the frills of a hotel, not overpriced condos..glad I got out at the peak
I don't understand this. There are money grabbing vultures at the top, setting these ridiculous prices. In turn, should not these be named as CONDOR apartments.
Build more new high-rise rental apartments. So we aren't charged rent plus condo fees.
What kind of sucker would buy a condo in GTA? I saw some with monthly maintenance payments of up to $800, which is what rent used to be there and will stay with you all your life and even raise.
Supply! Supply! Supply! Or... Profit, profit, profit...?
The builders are extremely wealthy.
How can there be no money in building but the people that build are super rich?