The Plan Is To Make You Permanently Poorer | Aaron Meets Gary Stevenson
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 8 ต.ค. 2022
- In 2011, while working as a City trader, Gary Stevenson (@garyseconomics) joined the ultra rich with a single bonus cheque. Not long after he was named one of Citibank’s highest performing traders worldwide. Stevenson made millions for his employer by betting on one thing: that the British and American economies would fail to recover from the global financial crisis, that inequality would only get worse and living standards would stagnate. That made him rich, but miserable. Which is why Gary would later leave his job to campaign on inequality.
In this interview he discusses his personal story - from studying at the LSE to the working culture of one of the world’s biggest banks - to what the economics of the 2020s will look like, and how the plan is to destroy the middle class.
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"if you give the rich money, they are going to buy your mum's house" i think has to be the most concise summary of the past 50 years i have ever seen
They seem to enjoy the privilege of selecting the names that appear on a Ballot.
Democracy appears to have been sold to the highest bidder a long time ago.
Yep, that hit hard. Reality check, the rentier class is screwing us over.
Your mother does value her house more than the amount of the proposal? She's not selling...
this is capitalism but no one is ready to give up the tit
@@uncletrashero We as a society need to be very careful how we deal with this problem over the next few years. The last thing we need is for disillusioned people to start listening to the marxists.
I am into my seventies, desperately poor and getting poorer. All of a sudden, two young men having what seems a friendly conversation are giving me a completely luminous education. I can't thank you enough. I stumbled here quite accidentally, don't even know your names yet,but believe me, I will. Young economist, you're brilliant. Young interviewer, please bring him back. I am recommending this chanel to my children and their friends.
Yes do that
My only criticism is that they talk about the homeowners getting hurt by the rise interest rates to give the rich more money but not how covid, inflation and energy costs have hit small and medium businesses too who even less protected from energy price hikes than households are; all of us will suffer when only the corporate monopolies (who have been making record profits in that time) are left standing...
@The violinist
Perhaps small businesses should be the next topic.
Like the original poster I’ve stumbled across this and it has been such an eye opener.
I have believed for a long time now the system is bust, but to have it explained in such a way that I understood it was amazing by this guy.
We cannot go on like this, something has to change.
@@fiddledotgoth Small business is ***d every time there is a crisis. It's built into capitalism. Unfortunately in the past this is the group that has backed fascism hoping that low wages and crushed trade unions will save them. Will that happen again ?
Wow this interview is making me depressed 😔.
"You need to have a systemic ability to take money away from rich people"
Well, no wonder we don't hear more of this guy on mainstream media.
They will always find a way to evade taxes, won't they...
It’s almost like we have taxes, but we refuse to actually tax those with wealth..
@@D-X-rt5qdthen we rescind their right to do business in our country. I’m ready to have a nation that strong arms business owners, not the other way around. Humanity has created trillions in wealth and yet it hasn’t been seen by the majority.
@@EroticInferno Sure, do you think that this gives the initiative to other nations such as China? Meaning they will have more power on the global scale.
@@D-X-rt5qdright, cause our current system of installing despots with CIA coups, and reverse taxing the rich, has stifled China so effectively? Maybe look at what's been done in relation to the outcome you're hoping for? Capitalism breeds widespread misery. We are literally taught to be misers to survive this economy.
The ultimate base problem with housing started when people started looking at a house as an "asset" instead of a HOME.
Xi Xinping said this, himself - "houses are for living in, not for speculation". And something like 90% of their population owns their home.
I think they're onto something there.
@@borbo23 China has a huge housing market bubble with whole towns standing empty. Now in the Eastern Europe countries people usually own their homes.
@@borbo23 Good lord, please don't put me and that authoritarian psychopath in the same sentence. *shudders* His statement is just proof that a broken clock is right twice a day.
The real problem lies in that the vast majority want it to be both.
You can get a very cheap and affordable home all over the world quite easily but people, especially younger people, have an obsession with living in the London, Sydney, New York or Paris type places because that's where property is an asset rather than just a home. Even more compounded that we in the younger generation feel entitled to live in the same area of these asset cities as where our parents spent 40 years to get to. If you buy in a smaller place your asset will barely move in value but it will be a perfectly adequate home.
@@lesbo37 the problem if you are working in London or New York, you have to live there, or you'd spend your life traveling to work and back.
There is nothing the rich fear more than a smart educated working class person speaking facts and the truth to people....
He's part of the rich. He made his millions.
That's very naïve of you to say. Everyone benefits from the working class being more educated. We're all on this planet together and an educated man produces more in any given economy.
Bitcoin
Most of the "rich" actually don't think about the poor or middle class as much as people would like to think, they're dealing with their problems just like everybody else. That they're "scared" of a smart, educated working class is a myth people like to believe to make themselves feel better, because the majority of what we consider rich are self-made -- they came from a smart, educated poor/working class.
@@jacobmorris3295 That's also naive...if the masses were educated enough to understand how and why most of them are being screwed they'd figure out a way to organize and transcend capitalism....which capitalists most certainly do not want.
"rich kids will buy your mum's house"
Total clarity.
I’m an American of 29 years and this is the first time I’ve heard someone actually get what I’ve been trying to explain to people about how wealth disparity works and the crisis of housing consolidation.
Thank you for this video I feel far less insane now.
In particular the distinction that you can’t just increase the deficit without parallel taxes on the wealthy.
UK culture boiled down is basically wealth disparity. I'm English.
War is a racquet
Written in the 1930s by a highly decorated US General
Always follow the money....
The media are big business owned by billionaires
Their customers are big business too
The middle class & working class public are
Being robbed ,misled, used & abused
All Men are Created Equal..................Right?
@@danielhutchinson6604you may be fortunate. However this is a credit based economy and its not easy to get credit and the interest is outrageous. Let alone the ridiculous down payment
for some reason i started crying when Gary was describing his Dad and how he worked for decades without making near as much money as Gary made in a bonus. He went on to talk about how bad that felt - when he considered the inequity involved. It was a clear illustration of how most people are good, but some small percentage of the population can take advantage of everyone else in society, adopt the necessary power structure, and get away with it. It must have been the conflicting emotions of anger and empathy i felt.
This is rare to see amongst the wealthy that have distanced them selves from their minds and their pockets. Empathy can not be bought but taught
When I was 6 a teacher explained to us how the waste system functioned. When she explained that most waste just ended up in a landfill I immediately asked her what would happen when we run out of space. She said that there wasn’t really an answer to that question. That was the day I realized that the people who are charged to run our societies have no clue and are generally not concerned with systems sustainability. The economy is no different.
Seeing this typed out is the saddest, yet probably truest, thing I’ve seen all year 😢
Nobody answered Alice's Question at the Mad Hatters Party when she asked why they kept moving round to another free seat when one place setting was trashed.
Just before covid, I attended a public meeting called by our local council refuse dept. Intended to encourage us to recycle, it turned out to be an exercise in self-justification by the bone-idle director of that dept. He tried to play the environmental card, but pressure from the audience eventually forced him to admit that - despite separate bins and collections - 75% of everything collected still goes to landfill.
Along with the fact that everything depends on growth... in a pretty much finitely resourced system.
Well, few things last forever. "Sustainability" was nothing you had to care about before the industrial revolution, as there were not enough humans to cause meaningful amounts of damage, let alone permanently. Even in 1800, less than one billion people lived on earth! In 1900, there were only two billion people on earth. Today, we are approaching ten billion people! That is the real problem.
Humans typically did not have to think about a larger span of time than a decade at most. Historically, burrying waste somewhere or throwing it on the trash-heap was a perfectly reasonable strategy. It does not work as well as it did since the numbers of humans multiplied by the factor of 10 and since we have esoteric things like plastics or plutonium.
love that Stevenson guy. My first degree was in economics (I ended up as a lawyer) and I frequently recall a welfare economics seminar which a sociology student attended. She was eventually removed from the class because she repeatedly raged at how the economic models we were presented with bore no relation to the real lives of working class people. She kept challenging the value of the models if they did not reflect the real live of people and was considered 'naive' or 'stupid' and ultimately disruptive. Good on you Stevenson that you are dedicating your time to explaining how people are duped by economic theory.
It appears both you and the moral, brave student, should might be good at political speaking. Create a channel.
This was exactly my experience with a business management HND in the 1970s, they were force feeding us all neo-liberal economics which was quite obviously deeply flawed and to a political end. Now we can see where this brain washing; selling us market concepts that don't stack up, can lead. Eventually I couldn't stomach any more from the system and dropped out to campaign for worthwhile social change advancing Gay Liberation. I know which cause has brought the greatest improvement in the human condition.
What happened to her afterwards? She is extremely based.
Sounds a bit like my masters at Oxford
Finally arts students have their day!
This definitely confirms what I already knew, which is that economics is much more of a belief system than it is a science. Great episode
well yeah ur saying obvious stuff, have you ever heard of 'thinking like an economist'? Economists have to go off assumptions and is therefore a social science not natural.
Got to have faith in gold oil and drugs
@@tby1431 "Social science" isn't scientific either.
thats my point@@wilhelmvonn9619
The precursor to economics is philosophy. Your early economists were philosophers.
His explanation of money as a tool to negotiate resource distribution between people, rather than as a resource in itself, is brilliant.
But at the same time he doesn't understand crypto. If he believes that money is rubber-banding then how does he not get that a limited supply of coins or in case of tokens that have unlimited supply the constant supply based on predefined rules, is not a legit store of value? I understand he is opposed to the gambling aspect of trading crypto. Volatility can eat you up both ways and there are no complex instruments like a volatility index to hedge against big market moves, that makes this asset class somewhat more dangerous. I also think that more tangible assets like housing should be prioritized but if you actually take him by his word and see that all asset classes have risen after the pandemic () then what about crypto? Isn't it wise to invest in an asset class that seems to be largely unaffected from macroeconomics and world events?
@@dang7824 Crypto is worthless for more practical grounded reasons, in my opinion. The abstract concept was very appealing, but the reality is hamstrung by: incredibly low adoption rates, extremely high operating costs, extreme systemic inefficiency, high and variable transaction costs, unreliability, volatility of value, hoarding instincts superceding actual spending and use, obscure technological gatekeeping (the vast majority of people will never access or use crypto currencies due to this), and excessive competition further reducing adoption and stability (there are now so many CCs that settling on one to use for practical purposes is basically impossible for the wider markets). All of these practical hurdles to widespread adoption mean that CCs don't actually get used much and are only suitable to highly niche applications, which in the long run means they actually have little practical value - they're more akin to funbucks or an in-game currency, but for those niche applications. The list of applications is actually dwindling, too, as ordinary material businesses experiment with them and conclude that they aren't competitive or optimal in the real world. Every company that tries CCs and then bails on the idea further erodes any perception of real-world relevance, and I think what we're seeing now is basically a slow-motion death spiral for the entire CC concept.
The crypto industry is a glance at globalization, we know the current system is flawed, and I also know that the crypto space is evolving much faster, the talented people are in fact working on a new financial system. Fiat is dead.
@MinusMedley The supposed success of crypto is nowhere in evidence besides heavily illegal international activities like drugs and human trafficking. Based on the past few years we have no reason to assume it will ever be used by anyone other than criminals.
It should be obvious, though.
Gary Stevenson. Novara media introduced him to me in the last week. Certainly THE most impressive social and political commentary I have ever heard, and I'm not normally given to hyperbole. He's right in that idiots are running the country and the talent and clever people are sidelined and redirected into gambling on the idiocy, so they get enough money to keep them happy.
People like him should be running our country, but being intelligent he will probably avoid it like the plague.
Same in a lot of big cooperations. In the form of daft ideas that destroy the company then they leave and do it somewhere else. Madness.
Gary Stevenson mentioned the Russell Brand Newsnight interview he did with failed economist Evan Davis, and where Davis produced a graph in an attempt to discredit what Russell Brand's points he was making, and Russell was making the most excellent points about capitalism and why we need a revolution. Russell was correct to mention that he did not need to see a graph which had nothing in common with his lived experiences in dealing with the E15 mums, who were all facing eviction, and a protest and campaign to keep them in their homes. Russell was a real comrade with ordinary working people at that time, and has done several documentaries exposing what was going on behind the scenes in order to disenfranchise the working class. Also what Russell was saying that anyone from either side of politics can produce a graph in order to support their beliefs, just like anyone from either side of the political divide can produce an opinion poll to support their beliefs, and we all know, there are many ways in which opinion polls can be manipulated in order to support the narrative that the company, or political party want to put out to the public. I think it is time for us all to get rid of the use of opinion polls, because it is obvious we have many reasons to disbelieve them. I think this was a very impressive interview by Russell Brand, and his views are what are driving people to protest all across the country, and, in fact, it is Russell Brand who I credit as being the first public figure to point out the truth to people of what was going on behind the scenes in politics, and who revealed the close relationship between some Labour MPs, the Blairites and the Tories.
@@nicolakirton2252 It's a shame he's joined the "right-wing anti-vax opinions for clicks" grift.
Until we have a fairer voting system the political system will be controlled by big money.
I can second that! He's only been on Novara a couple of times but I really like Gary's straight-up, no BS approach...
Gary crystallizes what a lot of us suspect but cannot fully articulate. He is brilliant to listen to because he is knowledgeable, educated, but still down to earth.
Just what I was thinking
I disagree I think ,he articulates it well,Well enough for me to understand how economics is inequality...
I was thinking exactly the same thing.
his grasp on buying property is a little weird to say the least...well he does acknowledge that a LOT of people simply cannot afford to. my own opinion hes just a trader who lucked out and his economics is dodgy in places to say the least
@@danteshydratshirt2360 please elaborate
Yanis Varoufakis also claims that Capitalism is over, and we are living in a time of Techo-Feudalism; great interview, good stuff!
Yanis is a smart Man.
Yannis Varoufakis and Grace Blakely are two of my favorite 'economists' Gary just joined the trifecta for me. Every economy is doing the same out-of-touch and shady business. America is in the same sinking boat. We desperately need economic revolution yesterday!
"listen, you need to have the systemic ability to take wealth away from rich people, because there is a massive systemic force to give wealth to rich people"
massive truth
Why not simply abandon the Wealthy Folks use of Capital as a measure of Value?
A friend of mine, born in 1935 to a poor background (although he passed his 11 plus his parents couldn’t afford to send him to the grammar school) eventually studied economics at York university. He saw how flawed what he was taught was and he always referred to the economics orthodoxy as ‘capitalist mythology”.
Capitalism died in 1890. And after the failure of the soviet union Europe and the rest of the world adopted the fascists style of socialism witch is government control of the free market. Government corporate collusion
Theory vs. Practice. You can read all the business and economics books you want , but you have to apply and yield the results to empirically assimilate knowledge through firsthand experience.
Brilliant 😂
@@mandalahigherplanes9044 Using big words without explaining anything, nice. That's what the big dogs do in politics.
@@mandalahigherplanes9044riddle me this. If you base your currency on a limited resource what is going to eventually happen?
This is just brilliant. I've emailed my local MP, Anthony Magnall, Conservative, asking him to watch this video and then meet me to tell me what he thinks and what should be done ... . I'm not naive enough to think anything useful will come of that, but for me it's worth the effort. I've also shared the link with lots of friends.
Vote out the anti-denocracy conservatives
@@smileyp4535 if you really believe that Labour would be any different you're delusional and part of the problem
Tell em to watch ZEITGEIST
@@Google_Does_Evil_Now oh you'll definitely know all there is to know bout our system and how it'd be easily fixed
Good idea about contacting MPs and arranging a chat after they've seen it.
this is one of the best interviews. Ive studied economics and human geography for years and can tell you what hes saying about the assets being anchored in space being a huge barrier to elite transnational fleeing is true. Taxing wealth , assets of the uber rich is an incredibly smart plan to combat income inequality.
"I was fluffing pillows at DFS" - best line i've ever heard
This guys a legend, one moment he sounds like any random bloke off the street
A friend of mine who studied Economics in Germany had basically the same experience with the dean of economics at his university. The dean hold a lecture and at the end of it he stated that everything he just said would be correct if we were in normal times but we would be in extraordinary times for ten years now. This to me has been absoloutely unbelievable. How can you tell your students that it is not your model that is wrong, it is the reality?
Why not? The powerfull can manipulate the perspective on reality with their media.That happens in so called socialist and so called capitalist systems.
Because we are at the very end of the cycle and in order to make a qualitative transfer to a new cycle we have to develop a new model (in my opinion both economical and social).
And by that time it will be not easy for us.
@@vasyav92 I welcome it with open arms if it means my children can enjoy the next golden age.
I remember Econ 101 I asked prof to confirm or deny that actually the natural world -land material labor- is the source underlying all the wealth tracked in macroecon tables and charts and he said ‘no, value comes from marginal increase in utility from creative ppl applying their creativity to the raw material’ and it was just so obviously bullshit I couldn’t figure what to do with that except leave. Check out Alf hornborg The Power of the Machine or whatever he’s writing now to turn the whole thing on its head, something I found later
@@vasyav92'The cycle' is also just a model from the past....
I was just listening to Akala’s Fire in the Booth and there’s a line that goes: “if we understood economics we’d know money is a means to get wealth, not the wealth itself”. I always assumed that was a kind of high-minded idealistic thing about the only purpose of money being to buy you free time that you can spend improving your mind or whatever. Gary Stevenson has just helped me understand that it’s literally true.
Great interview.
I own a library that definitely costs more than your chain
Akala is sick, good taste.
People we like like things we like. Liked.
Best decision I made in life when I was 26, at the start of the 80s was to buy my 1st house even though the mortgage interest rate was a whopping 15.9%. I could barely afford the monthly repayments but through a lot of stuggle & sacrifice and making do without curtains & furniture for many months slowly made progress on the property ladder. Several decades later and making the right moves up the property ladder it seems like a breeze. I can well imagine a 26yo today in 2023 trying to get a foot on the property ladder would be much harder, nigh on impossible given that salaries haven’t kept pace with the rich getting richer each year. This is what inflation does. Biggest lesson learned in life was to understand in depth the real meaning of money and how for centuries, private bankers have exercised control over governments and us the people in participating in their ponzi scheme. Gary is absolutely correct when he says we must do our due diligence.
Leaving aside the 15.9% interest rate for the moment, what was the house price to gross annual salary multiple back then, in your case?
@@matthewhook3375 At that time the building societies would only lend a maximum of 3.5 or in rare cases 4 times my salary and 1 times my wife’s but of course she was a housewife so I could only afford a cheap terraced house in a small town, 45min commute from the town I worked in. The house price was £13,500 and of course we had the stamp duty and conveyancing costs on top.
@@majkollalo preaching to the choir sir/ma'am. I notice he's not incline to answer my question... I'd far sooner be paying 15.9% interest on a house that cost 2x my salary than paying 6-7% on a house that costs fucking 10x salary. You are quite correct - it's totally fucked. There needs to be a massive programme of social housing construction, on the scale that was done in the post-war period. This runaway train has to be stopped.
@@matthewhook3375 I have operated Trains for several Years, this is not anything like a train, but it does have momentum.
It can be derailed by the abandonment of Capital.
@@majkollalo As Empires struggle to overcome the Resources that sustain their treasuries, we notice that the Humans they were supposed to serve are the victims.
Look at Ukraine, like a scrap of meat tossed to the Greed of Empires.
The Vikings, Mongols, Persians, Turks, Greeks, Romans, Brits, French and Germans ravaged the area for many centuries between Baltic and Black Sea.
The US Empire now attempts to attack the Russian empire, just as all the other scion of the Romans appear to do.
The US economy is the victim as the arrogant thought that a powerful nation can take as they desire from any source they see.
The Empire is dying, what shall remain?
Can we abandon Capitalism now?
This is one of the most interesting and 'enjoyable' videos I have ever seen on TH-cam. Many thanks to both of you, it's really made me think. From an A-Level Economics teacher - I will recommend this to all of my students.
After Econ Class in 1970, we discussed the potential effects of accepting the Fiat Dollar.
We assumed Americans were not that stupid.
Look at the US Economy now?
I’m so glad I stumbled on this video. My mate bought a house in 2014 for $175.000 now it’s worth well over $1/2 million. I don’t really understand this it’s just a box sitting on a piece of land producing nothing. Working class people that work their asses off (he does that too BTW) can’t even get a loan to buy a house. It’s completely insane. Thank you from the USA.
There's nothing like doing a survey of society by spending an hour at a Walmart looking around at everything without judging it.
At $1.25 is the average plastic jug of water for sale.
Next to it is a special bottle for $4 and the only ingredient listed is Himalayan salt.
As usual the chief selling feature on the label is clear:
Alkalinizing
The value of something is what culture determines it to be.
Technically it's more difficult more refined and more pure to make white table sugar granulated than it is to make cocaine found on the street. A poor person in Afghanistan gets a few hundred bucks for a basketball size chunk of opium that will be worth hundreds of thousands of dollars after it leaves his country as heroin in Europe us and places like Australia.
The pirates and royalty in Rich themselves this way at the expense of their victims and we're supposed to admire and aspire towards these kind.
I bought my own house last year in July. I'm still totally on board with house prices going down
Well yeah they can’t get a loan if the banks don’t think they’re going to get their money back. Once upon a time we were so ready to leave our parents house and we probably lived on a peace of land with our entire extended family and community. Now we just throw ourselves to the wind with debt. Even taking out a loan to buy a 200k house is debt. It’s money you don’t have. Most people shouldnt pay over 70k for property. Prob should stop pushing kids out at 18. Let them work and help with bills until they can afford their own.
It’s gotta crash at some point
@@Madasin_Paine As opposed to what? Define how socialism would be better than Capitalism. I'm sure the 2 million migrants we have been getting every year since 2020 and the 1 million every year since 1990 would love to hear it, since they fled socialist nations to come here.
I'm university educated, studying for a PhD, and I didn't understand half this stuff until Gary explained it to me. 100% get him back on Novara when you can, he's a true asset (pun intended)
Surely this just depends on what you're studying. My field is completely unrelated to economics so of course I don't know much economics.
@@pinklemonade8320 That's probably fair - my field is closely tied to economics though. We learn about how economics affects policy and vice versa, what wealth gaps do and how to interpret them. Lots of social stats. But it's wading through dense theory. Academics will tend to use long words when short ones would do!
@BillyFreethought I think to be honest it's because the economics I've learnt are all separated from real people. It's all policy, markets, cause and effect. Not much about what happens on the ground...!
@@vis7139 Here's some short words that those in power ought to really take to heart, - "People can only be pushed so far" and "we still know where the pitch forks are".
That says a lot about your actual education then.
WOW!!! The economist seriously needs to be elevated, cause he speaks for the people!!! This is the second interview I have seen on your channel and both have been the best I have seen in the last 3 years. Thank you so much! How can we support your channel and how can we the people get behind the economist to elevate his voice .
These two are fantastic together. I am watching this a year later and find it fascinating. I do miss Garry’s Economics videos.
A rare occasion where a person of relatively unique standing not only wants to share their experience, but also advise on what happens next. We have to be truly grateful to people like Gary for their minds and also their morals.
Consider that if we didn't live in the age of the internet we most likely would never have even been privy to this.
30% of American Millennials now identify as "Communist." A storm is coming. Eat the Rich.
The reward of investing oneself into one's career deeply is to learn all about it from light to dark.
I've always been receptive to people tell me what they think deeply about their work.
It doesn't not only is this about humanizing but it shows the interrelatedness and out of at least self-preservation and often likely more virtuous aspirations we find camaraderie and shared purpose and this is felt it needs to be controlled absolutely.
It takes arrogant educated people with computers to actually think they can outsmart millions of years of evolution will and purpose while seeing themselves outside of it.
When people realize how wrong they were things like shame and contempt isolate people and it's by opening up about what we do and who we are that we save all of us.
If the last 3 years teach us anything is that exaggerating the annual pandemic is enough to railroad everything that matters economically.
And if people think that most of what they have coincides with those economics there are essentially entrained entrapped and enslaved by it.
When when people talk about something and get it right they're past the halfway point in solving the problem together and dissenting opinions from polar ends are like seasoning and enrich the odds when they are included in the balance.
To take the long tails of society and label them as having disorders and drugging them and treating them differently is akin to being a disease itself and this is a great epidemic world.
Where is all the successful news that empowers people especially when learned after bitter national experiences‽
If the repetitive take-home message is to buy their product and to do what they tell you and await them and not actually how you can empower yourself as billions of others have recently and you know public service has failed you. Corporate service shares more than half the blame. And the common public the rest.
The worthwhile solutions that are peaceful and successful are obvious.
It has been a pleasure listening to him.
Most of his former colleagues will keep this to themselves an instead try to make it sound as if it is the other people who are not working hard enough or who are not smart enough.
I am an electronics engineer ,senior level and I can not afford a house.
I go to view houses and I see taattered ,dirty places and then the price on them and I start to wonder what is going on?
I am asking myself, if I can not afford a house as an engineer with what passes for middleclass salary, what is going to happen to teachers, diner ladies, school janitors, checkout staffs at super markets,etc?
It scares the hell out of me.
Gary should be on TV every night with an economic analysis after the news: like the weather forecast. He's utterly brilliant.
Wait, tv?! Why would the owners of media let a truth-teller on?!
@@theresabarzee1463yeah, they don't want to scare the sheep.
This guy is so absolutely bang on about this. We all need to hear this! Share this with everyone you know!
I became physically compromised in my 40's, saw the writing on the wall about my future prospects, paid off all debts, bought remote property and built a debt- free, off grid home. It's all paid for, just a little tiny place, but I can live within my means, on my meager income.
I don't have £12,000, but I do have that value invested in an asset which frees me from rent, makes electricity from sunlight, and grows a little food in the garden. Produce your own value, get things that free you from the system. It's still possible to build from nothing, Outside of the Corporate and Urban systems. Cities are locked out, but are not the whole world.
Nature can consume a lot of the Off Grid Homes in Western USA.
The things that Humans can contribute to Society,
are not measured by Capital.
I wanted to do same found land under 10k was afraid government would remove my caravan. The land is obviously not actually yours. One’s with planning run into hundreds thousands to millions . How you do it bud?
'They were playing the numbers, I was playing the game'
Brilliant quote!
Harvey Specter stuff
You are willing become my wife?!
Maybe this is why the world is in such a mess- too many rich people's kids in the top jobs! Enjoyed listening to a down to earth young man.
OR - MAYBE if you start with a pie of 10 slices, & piss 9 of 10 slices up the wall in 100 years to accumulate wealth, we shall run out of pie??
The planet is the pie. The economy is a self-destruct system. But I get that you need some rich white guy to swagger these words to you to enable their validity.
this isn't the problem. it's just the tip of the iceberg. the decoupling of the financial economy from the real economy due to central bank policy is the root cause. read Michael Hudson
Rich people's kids don't have jobs: they own your buildings and collect your rent, they own stakes in companies and expect returns without any real value put in.
The world is a "mess" because of greed.. Did we forget???????? "power corrupts, Absolute power, corrupts absolutely" period..
It's been this way for millennia
I love this channel... i just found you through the Matt Kennard interview. This style of exasperated no bs, de-complicated messaging... it gives me hope in my 50s.
He's anxious he cant stop touching his face ... this isnt easy for him, much respect brothers ❤
Edit: watching this in the last quarter of 2023 and house prices are still climbing: Right again m8
Loved this! Very clear exposition of the problems we face. The USA is going through the same thing. I highly recommend this.
As Empires lose the power to exploit,
the costs increase.
The end of Empires is never dignified.
Wasnt the USA going through the same thing long time ago? I am thinking van life for many not by choice?
@@colinl5985 In 1967 the USA was so short on Cash,
the War on Poverty was cancelled.
Mike Mansfield was forced to inform His Predecessor,
that appropriation's were unavailable by Congress,
due to a high level of spending to insure the Brown Bros of Houston
got paid for contractor work in Military Infrastructure projects
in Southeast Asia.
The Brown Bros did finance a serious amount of LBJ's political carieer.
Paybacks appear to be required in American Electoral Industry society.....
Now the NATO Guys appear to be incapable of finding Ammo to send to Kyiv.
The appearance of suspicious activity that indicates the presence of corruption,
now seems evident as the Audits once again point to missing Trillions of funds
in the Pentagon Books.....
Economic War is Hell.
Former LSE graduate here from a council estate, coal mining background who ended up in a City law firm as a corporate lawyer. Quite a while back.... "do we take people from state schools these days" said one Partner on hearing about me. Basically mate you had a bullshit job, like me, and saw it for what it was. Good effort and keep up the good work. Venceremos ✊
But doesn't smashing the system that gave you that opportunity to flourish seem ironic?
Whats the alternative? Everyone is entirely equal irrespective of their desires, their drive to succeed or their intellectual capcities to help in improving mankinds lot?
"Men not having the same capabilities, if they are free, they will not be equal, and if they are equal, then they are not free."
Sounds a lot like cheering on your own ensalvement and eventual premature demise.
At least the eventual schadenfreude should make it all worthwhile.
@@blueanodized I'm not proposing to "smash" any systems my friend; I simply made a point about the lack of equal opportunities. My opportunity to flourish as you say arose because I'd previously served in an elite branch of the armed forces (now that WAS a meritocracy) and city law firms like that sort of thing. That alone highlights the issue.
Without that I wouldn't have had a look in yet it was a job that I took to and could do standing on my head; it really wasn't that difficult and I can think of plenty of people from a similar background to me that would have done it better. My reference to a bullshit job refers to the David Graeber essay/book. It was a job where you could survive, and maybe flourish, by playing the system and saying the right things - a bit like Gary's view (and mine) of most academic economists. No real consequences for getting things wrong.
Thanks for taking time to read my comment and to offer your own thoughts. I have no proposals for utopia; I simply believe in a fairer society.
@@blueanodized Google Reductio ad absurdum.
@@blueanodized you have it backwards. The system which elevates us(those few who are elevated) is what will doom us. The need for increasing growth with increasing efficiency demands and continuously increasing population or increasingly brutal exploitation of labor and probably both. Anything else and capital accumulation slows down and the system will fight that like you fight to breathe. We get to have it good and those that don't are the threat if we step out of line even as we are ground harder and harder each year. There is nothing ironic about knowing the difference between comfort and security.
What does it mean to be free in that quote? To buy a yacht while others can't even afford an apartment with their own toilet. Silly poets and economists should work real jobs and see how free their actual skill makes them.
@@blueanodized Yes, smash the system, it’s dogshit and it isn’t working and it’s very clear to anyone that can understand the world
Something i have been saying to many people over the years. the middle class aspire to be the wealthiest class, the poorest just want to be able to live, and have their needs taken care of, the wealthiest want to keep everyone poor including the middle class, and always try to blame the poorest for the problems they make; until the middle class realise they are also being hurt, otherwise they just flip flop between blaming the poor or agreeing with them and voting according to their level of comfort.
That's why we need to Tax the individual wealth and disconnect personal wealth from business wealth, to stop them from contaminating one with the other! As for the property buying. there is the other options which is harder and that is to regulate, cap prices, create public housing and stop the capital owners from holding all the property and inflating it!
We read news in the media that doom and gloom is coming and we just accept it, doom and gloom doesn’t always have to be coming, I’ve read numerous success stories of people that are pulling off tremendous gains of up to $250K within weeks in this crazy market and I just want to learn how to achieve such figures.
Since the crash, I've been in the red. I’m playing the long term game, so I'm not too worried but Jim Cramer mentioned there are still a lot of great opportunities, though stocks has been down a lot. I also heard news of a guy that made $250k from about $110k since the crash and I would really look to know how to go about this.
There are actually a lot of ways to make high yields in a crisis, but such trades are best done under the supervision of Financial advisor.
Thats true, I've been getting assisted by a FA for almost a year now, I started out with less than $200K and I'm just $19,000 short of half a million in profit.
Impressive can you share more info?
When ‘Carol Vivian Constable’ is trading, there's no nonsense and no excuses. She wins the trade and you win. Take the loss, I promise she'll take one with you.
Gary you need to come back again. I echo most of the comments here especially the lady in her 70,s. I am close to retiring this interview was really informative, thought provoking as well as the bonus, entertaining. Thank you Aaron and Gary
I’ve learned more about economics listening to this than in my entire life. Gary is a true working class hero; what a gem 🎉
Absolutely 💯
Same. This cannot just stay here.
Agreed.
you guys have been smashing it with the guests you’ve had on the channel the past couple of months, loving it
Gary is a breath of fresh air. Thank you for your honesty and insight into our topsy, turvy, divisive world of those that have and those that have not. How they make the poor poorer and the rich richer is so true.
How is the air cleaner now that an investment banker is able to fleece regular folks just by riding hard on an accent?
Best you tube I have ever seen. It crystallises so much of what I have suspected but never heard articulated before. I implore the trader guy to stand for politics and change things. We need smart honest principled people like him so so badly.
Not often I actually stop everything I'm doing to listen to every word spoken in an interview. Completely glued to this one. So much truth spat here. Sensational video, thanks to Novara for introducing me to this dude!
"Truth spat" You need to drop that sort of language if you want to make money
I am in total shock. This is arguably the most impressive video on that I have ever watched on TH-cam. I am bowled over by the sheer intelligence and reasoning so effortlessly displayed. As a complete ignoramus, I can only stand in the sidelines and cheer.
Right? I feel the same
@bina nocht same
I don't think that's what Gary Stevenson wants you to feel. I think he wants you to feel empowered. Because a lot of his main points here are not super-technical or incredibly complex. And he explains the unusual journey that he went on that led him to this level of understanding.
Listen to his call to action.
Can you make your content accessible by formatting the auto captioning into closed captioning? It is extremely hard to enjoy your content having to keep concentration on the auto captioning and not be able to see your content properly sadly, it’s also why most of us don’t subscribed.
Exactly.
What isn't mentioned here is that council housing up to the 1970s was a natural brake on private house prices. Since Thatcher sold off council houses rents and house prices have exploded, housing should never be see as an asset, but a good place to live in, as long as people dream of owning a home, they immediately create demand for price increases. Housing must be seen as a right and in the future we should provide housing free, which would stop all speculation at a stroke.
Gary is right. Throw the economics textbooks in the bin. Fix the tax system. Introduce a land tax. But fix the broken money first. Fiat paper currency is dead. We need a sound money system backed by a neutral reserve asset.
I've never been interested in the world of finance and economics because I don't understand how it works, but Gary explained it all in a way that I understand , so I'm grateful to him for that and for telling us about the inequality and how we (the poor)are ignorant about how system works and is always set up to keep the wealthy rich and the poor trapped in poverty . Fascinating story thank you.
Ewe huemans should be aware that ewe are as such for allowing it...that system is not needed.....
Meanwhile the poor vote Conservative! The manipulation is deeper than most people realise. The lack of depth in discussion about economics just annoys the heck of me. Also the co-opting of Labour into the mess. Technocratic and no depth.
There is a reason he says throw out our textbook if your want to learn Economics. It is fake maths surrounded by manipulation.
@@deborahcurtis1385 Except it's a uniparty really, if you vote the other side, you'll get a different flavor of fuckery, because ultimately, all parties work for to the ultra rich, that's the catch
@@deborahcurtis1385 A lack of Money does not equal a lack of knowledge.
Your generalizations may seem accurate, but the exceptions can shake the foundations.
"As a trader you don't make money just by being right, you make money by being right specifically when other people are wrong."
One of the best interviews I've ever seen. This guy is a sniper. He knows the game front and back.
Gary you really laid out the essential problem- we have a system for giving money to the rich, but no system for taking it back. That is the issue in a nutshell, and it is easily understandable for the masses. Spread the word.
TAXES COF COF, the problem is that the system is centralized, central banks print money to give to the corporations in order to, "invest in tecnology"
Capitalism is the default mode of humanity, its freedom to trade with each other.
You are poorer because the gov wants you poor, not the "rich"
American, here, and I think this is globally applicable. Brilliant. This is connecting dots I've been trying to connect for years. Everyone on earth needs to see this.
It is utterly transfixing to listen to someone speak the truth and make sense of the world that is deliberately kept from us. Great iv Aaron, thank you Gary. Off to start my Novara subscription.
I couldn't agree more with all of this. I've been saying for 15 years what the issue is. My fav analogy has been , where's your wealth gone? It didn't go to mars, how can we all be poorer?
The problem with this is it's nigh on impossible to get people to listen to you and persuade them. Be honest, how many of your mates can you send this video to that will actually watch it? I have just one or two. So, were only preaching to the converted. The real battle is getting this content and ideas into the mainstream. You don't find this even in the guardian, let alone the rest of mainstream.
I will never understand people that don't take an interest in what's happening to our country. You want to scream , wake up!!!!
It's an extremely difficult task ahead to change course. It'd be easy to give up, but that's not an option.
This is a terrific interview. It's right on the mark for explaining what's really going on in our economy.
I love Gary's passionate righteous indignation at the iniquitous nature of the establishments economic choices.
That's what I like to see, that's how people feel .
This guy is genuinely brilliant.
He has a point and the huge irony is it will destroy capitalism, western stability and the Conservative Party. Money is accumulating unproductively in a tiny minority rather than being invested in the nation's productive growth.
Best episode of any podcast in every country ever!!!
Wow, This is one of the most concise and informative talks I’ve heard on macroeconomics. I took several economics classes during college and and there is a kind of “don’t look behind the curtain” attitude in many of them.
The trifecta of the plutocracy is interest inflation and taxes to insidiously acquire all the creative wealth and perceived wealth possible exponentially well while the victims forget and the perpetrators build upon their knowledge.
Look at the value of the data mind by the Black rocks and Google's of the world.
See how they and real estate developer types benefited so much from the tax cuts anticipating a huge wealth transfer rather than changing the tax laws to compensate and to keep things more equal and meritocratic rather than reward greed and punish virtue.
I've never heard of Gary Stevenson or Novara Media before just now, but damn, Gary perfectly explains so many things that I felt were systematic consequences of things that society at large just seems to ignore or not talk about during the past few years.
Excellent podcast, thank you. It nearly made me cry from frustration. I can’t bear that rich are getting richer at the expense of the poor.
I have seen myself how journalists can be incompetent but we don’t realize it till we check data ourselves.
If you work hard, your boss will buy a Ferrari and next year if you work even harder he will get himself a yacht
Not incompetent. Dependent upon access to policy makers making media in on the game.
I've actually observed during my internships that some journalists are simply incompetent. Hopefully, that's not the case for most of them. Most journalists wouldn't write anything too controversial for fear of losing their jobs. It takes courage to be an excellent journalist, and too few people are strong enough. It's partly understandable because we all want to live in peace, but it's also disappointing.
The fact that Media depend on Politics for 20% of revenue is a clue.
Money is power.
Your videos are well done but it would be super helpful to have time stamps identifying key topics.
More and more every day I'm realising that the idea that we all live in the same world is wrong.
There are people who will never, ever understand each other's circumstances, and most won't ever even try. This man is a miracle and he needs to keep talking.
No, we do not all reside in the same world. Not all ll.
@@playriter3535You aren't rich!
Why were you that sheltered? Did you used to read at all growing up?
@@penderyn8794 I'm not sure what you mean
Thank you so much for educating us about the economy. Through the help of my parents I bought a unit in Brisbane Australia 8 months ago. Every month the interest payments have gone up $100. Many people here have had to sell their houses.
I had worked all this out. I am pleased there are some young people that have worked the scam out. Also unlimited immigration is a problem.
Definitely sharing this with my lot. As a homeowner (finally) and a hard working Asian immigrant from Afghanistan, this is a completely different take and an eye opener to a lot of people in my community who have this deluded dream that equality definitely exists in this country. This podcast goes to show what a myth equality really is in a capitalist society. God bless you both gents.
👍
I find a lot of more recently arrived immigrants don't really understand just how bad life has almost always been for the working class in Europe. It's always been a feudal system and still is.
I recommend reading "The Ragged Trousered Philanthropists" , "The Road to Wigan Pier" and "The Condition of the Working Class in England" to gain more insight into what life was like for the 99% in the UK.
Some, but not all, immigrants do not appreciate that the society we have today, with workers rights and the NHS and pensions, not to mention universal suffrage, were only gained by a ferocious struggle by the native working class against the aristocracy and the industrialists.
We are rapidly back sliding to becoming the sweatshop of the world, with appalling living conditions and no health care.
who stated we had equality? who would want equality? why is equality good? what do you even mean by equality? equality is bs
@@James_36 -- Equality doesn't mean everyone having the same amount of money and property. Equality means everyone having a guaranteed living wage and access to the most basic necessities of life. If you think that is "BS", I've nothing more to say to you.
@@leftykeys6944 it is BS, because you are factually wrong, even other left wing ideologues will tell you how wrong you are
It’s pretty much like the board games from our childhoods. At first you compete for what’s unclaimed and then you take what others have.
Yes, that is exactly what life is: a combination of Monopoly and Risk. Financial power and military power. The laws of the land are the rule book which tell you how to play the game. Those laws tell you where to live to avoid tax, which businesses to invest in and get Government grants etc. The rules are very specific. They tell you which industries pay decent wages, they tell you you need to be married before you have kids, they tell you exactly how to win the game. Some read the rules and play the game as it's intended, others want to play a different game, even though there is no other game to play.
I love to hear more people speaking openly about what’s going on. His common background with many of the channel viewers will certainly be helpful to them. Great vid.
Best explanations of wealth inequality, reason for taxation on wealth, and other economy topics given by Steven in this particular video. Aaron was really helpful at drawing out the information. Thanks to you both for your time.
Gary is the first person I have ever heard to speak sense in economics...he gets it...I wish a few millions more had his level of comprehension and analysis.
Why do you keep sending me strange comments!
Gary Stevenson is absolutely brilliant, so glad you had him on, I try to listen to him as much as I can. Thank you so much
Thank God there is the CC option!!! This English is so hard to understand!! And the postcast is so interesting!
Our British Robin Hood, spoke out and basically highlighting mostly not only for the Britain's public but rather the entire world situationship. I honestly luv ppl speaking out even though it might have costed him his job. 👍 Spot on mate.
Units never change, Kilos, Meters, and Miles so why do we accept playing with value of money when it's certainly a scam ran by banker's.
Gary seems like a person you could have great conversations with for hours, he has so much confidence, knowledge, and passion for the subjects he dabbles in.
One of the most thrilling, chilling interviews I have ever listened to.
What Gary Stevenson so succinctly explains here is was something I spent 10 years of my life trying to explain to my local towns folk back in 1992. Every weekend I would walk around my the town centre with a placard saying "stop profit over people" - yes 1992. If someone bothered to ask me why I was doing this I would try to explain that; if people did not wake up soon, the way the country was heading then the future would ensure the slow eradication of the middle classes and the total wipeout of the poorer working class. No one wanted to know and I was laughed at and ridiculed. In the end I emigrated. Now, over 30 odd years later, all my friends in the UK phone me telling me all I used to "go on about" is now coming true. Apathy is just as destructive as war.
You moved to Oz? The developed world everywhere is the same.
@@monkmodemalik8225 No not Australia.
The country I moved to has one of the lowest crime rates on the planet. In my town the crime was so low they reduced the police station to 3 days a week. 3 years later it was closed down completely because the police had nothing to do. We have first class health care which is free, the lowest wage is £18 per hour with most jobs finishing at 3pm. Everyone has 8 weeks paid holiday and a good pension. The elderly are treated like first class citizens with the care homes like palaces. The nurses who work at the care homes are among the highest paid jobs and are highly respected. The elderly are seen as; if it were not for them we would not be here so they deserve t be treated well in their later years. The sick and the disabled have the best care I have ever seen. All the public transport runs efficiently and some of them loo brand new even after 20 years of use. I could go on but I think I made my point.
Sorry, but it is not the same everywhere.
@@adamatherton8562 I'd like to ask what country you emigrated to? as I have been trying for years to get out of the UK as I could see this coming.
@@betterlivingprosperity7927 Probably Suisse or Norway/Nordic’s going by the description.
@@adamatherton8562 You've moved to a richer country. Kind of undermining your point
If only we could have such honest & intelligent people in government & the civil service.
Not in this lifetime it seems.
You've explained this in such a way even I can understand. Thank you. I've always been for destroying all banks and money and going back to Neolithic style of living. People always want to buy my art as NFT and I say - does that buy dog food? No. You can pay me in actual money or dog food.
What you call 'actual money' is the reason you are poor. The reason you are getting poorer is extremely simple. Your money, the fiat currency that is backed by nothing, is losing its value exponentially. That is the core reason you are getting poorer. If you had taken all the money you earned and swapped it for gold since the 1970's, you would find that houses today are just one third of the price they were in the 1970's. Things are cheaper today if you hold good quality money. That is why people are moving to crypto, because gbp and the dollar are trending to zero due to money printing. NFTs are purchased using crypto can be transferred back into useless fiat currency if you desire. Bear in mind though, the Eth you get for your Nft will be worth 5-8 times as much in gbp terms by 2025, while your 'actual money' is losing its value at the rate of 25% each year.
He’s talking complete sense and explaining it very clearly
The new Labour Party took over from the wig part in the 19 century
The wig Partie was the free market Party (capitalist) main voter was worker and employees.Labour crush the wigs and became a socialist Party (misdirection) then divided worker and industrialist and the free market died. The tories was always against the free market because they were all aristocratic
Gary is fantastic. Always love when he’s on novara. His own channel is brilliant too
Cuts through the nonsense and explains the effects it really has.
Binged it today 😂
What's his channel called? His name? Can't currently look as watching.
Garyseconomics
@@annamann1425 Thanks!
Everyone should watch this. We are being educated for free!! Stop watsing time fighting with each other and worrying about frivolous and stupid things...this is the way the world works. Peole need to reel in their focus!! Wake up people!
So true!
Great interview and I have immense respect for both you and Gary. Keep up the great work. Knowledge is power.
Saw Gary smashing it on BBC Daily Politics making the elitist politicians squirm. Glad Novara did this. A great interview.
BBC is a scam
'Capitalism is Finished' Gary and Aaron - and so says Yanis Varoufakis - but according to Yanis we are now in Techno-Feudalism - concentration of economic power in a few private hands.
People are getting poorer and they are under the control of Oligarchs. We do need to get this message out there but the big question is how?
Majority of people don't watch political information like Novara Media.
I agree with Yanis Varoufakis because all shops and other economic outlets are moving their bricks and mortar online now. That is why there are virtually no shops on the High Street now.
Message is the same regardless of the specifics . Do you wait until the cupboards are completely empty or mere days before ? Sooner or later it will be time to eat .
I'm in my 60s and I've smiled all through this video😊 brilliant.
Been following Gary for a few years now, he speaks the truth with passion. Let's hope some of what he's saying sinks in somewhere.
Wow, thanks again Novara Media for getting this incredible guy back on. Great interview Aaron, and thanks Gary for being so open and honest.
Halfway through here and I just have to say that while indeed it seems that the elite ruling class is consolidating wealth more and more among themselves as they have also done in every other society through history, the fact that raw intellect can still break out of the social hierarchy chains is so heart warming to me and gives me hope for the future.
Very humble guy with a lot of integrity so he don't want to say but he felt guilty
Holy shit, I gotta thank the TH-cam algorithm for showing me this. Liked and subbed to both your channels. Thanks for this
Agreed
Even with ADD, I'm able to sit and listen to Gary for 90 minutes straight. I love that man so much.
I would love to see Martin Lewis on this show as well.
Yes. This. Same.
Perhaps hyperfocus.
Sorry but this guy remains a capitalist at heart and is therefore part of the problem not the solution. I'm autistic and only managed 25 minutes owing to this realisation.
@@Antraeus Yes, but the fact remains that this is the society we live in. Until that changes, which I'm all for, we should at least be doing a much better job of it than we currently are
@@_Raven_ Lord what hope is there? We are slaves and we should be extricating our minds from the Satanic Machine!
Excellent interview 🔥 One of the most honourable things about Gary Stevenson is that although he financially elevated himself out of his humble working class beginnings, he's using his knowledge and experience to champion the poor and expose the truth behind growing inequality. He hasn't succumbed to the 'well if I can do it, then why can't everyone else?' Thatcherism narrative. Thanks Novara another impressive guest. I can't pretend to know much about economics at all, but a man like Gary makes it interesting and relatable. I've now subscribed to his channel. 🙏
The problem we have is the current government is so pro-super rich not middle class. Taxing middle class and property owners to make people poor pushing the poorer to poorer. The richer get richer at the moment.
Brilliant. Eyes opened. I’ll need to listen to this a few times to fully get it. Admirable, smart man.
This is superb. The conversation they are having needs to be had all over the UK amongst everyone. How can the rich ever be trusted to make anything better when they just don't even notice when things are bad and getting worse.
Why is it their job to make anything better?
@@stuartfury3390 because they have all the power and are hoarding more and more of it for themselves? i mean, duh? how do you expect powerless people to make things better without taking some of that power back? do you have any comprehension of just how bad inequality has gotten?
If you don't want the responsibility that comes with controlling 90% of the wealth on the planet, maybe you should give up some of that wealth... Or there will inevitably be some form of revolution and the wealth/power will be taken back. History repeats.
@@powerbeard5653 What country do you live in?
It’s not that they haven’t noticed. The TORY party have done this by design, to transfer wealth from the working population to the already wealthy.
@AcidOllie I think they do notice. They just don’t care.
"It's like the kung fu movies where a hundred guys fight Bruce Lee one at a time."
What a great way of framing that concept, this guy is class 👌👌
This is an outstanding talk. I truly appreciate hearing real talk about this subject matter. Thank you so much for this gift. I am subscribing. ❤
Massive respect, cheers lads
Regards from Mexico
I hear myself frustratedly trying to explain to people that accepting the status quo is to lose a fight that they’re in whether they choose to be in it or not. Their complacency comes from not wanting to make things worse, while their complacency guarantees that things will get worse!