MESH TAPE VS PAPER TAPE!!!!!!!
ฝัง
- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 12 ก.ย. 2024
- WILL THE WAR NEVER END?!!!!! Let's dive into the bloody online battle of MESH VS PAPER!!!!
Tools I use often:
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Drywall knives:
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4" amzn.to/32OHlw3
6" amzn.to/2LwP1x5
10" amzn.to/2QbLbOp (This one will rust if you leave it wet but feels nice to use)
10" amzn.to/3056fcU (This one is stainless. Stiffer, more expensive but won't rust)
Mud Pan with Grip!! (This is the BOMB! You will thank me!)
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Tin Snips GOOD QUALITY!! amzn.to/2LzlOBv
Drywall Tape Holder!! amzn.to/32Udhzd
Paint Mixer for mud!! amzn.to/303fX0q
Full size mixer!! amzn.to/2LYrMLe
Mixing Drill (just in case)!! amzn.to/2O2oQ2P
Hawk and Trowels
13 inch hawk:
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13 inch trowels:
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12 inch trowels:
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14 inch trowels:
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Auto tools
If you don't want to think, here is the whole kit (Columbia is great quality too!) amzn.to/2UwPUae
Mud tubes and applicator:
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Flushers
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Handle adjustable
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or fixed handle amzn.to/2DrNt2O
Corner roller (head only, you may need another handle)
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amzn.to/2XpuNZ8 (better quality)
Mesh plus hot mud is adequate, Iv taped thousands of house this way with little issue with cracking . Blown paper is the only issue I hear about in the uk. The other consideration is profile of joints , mesh is lower profile so you don’t have to build out the butt joint to 3 feet lol
I don’t put mesh in the corners but plasters do and have been for years so it’s not a issue either, you fold mesh over a corner and flush hot mud over it ..it can’t blow it won’t crack within Normal conditions.
Honestly in Europe and in the uk we use mesh on just about every new build house, I live in one and there’s no cracking . In my whole working life Iv only ever seen mesh crack under extreme weather/environmental conditions so propane burners etc Iv seen many many paper tape blow outs, it’s the number one complaint in finished homes here.
What we really want is a fiber reinforced hot mud that removes the need for a base tape all together.. another note, may hot muds are filler finish compounds designed for diy market to be sandable and are not suitable as a base coat over mesh.
You have to know and understand intended function of any product and use them appropriately.
Houses in the UK are predominantly masonry. Very little movement unless there is an extreme incident. Houses in the U.S. are stick framed with 2x4 walls. Racking and settling are the most common issue. Paper tape is the number one choice here. Mesh tape will show a crack in a butt joint even if it is something as simple as low interior humidity. Plastering is virtually nonexistent in the U.S.
oltedders the largest builder in the uk ( persimmon) has been using timber frames for a good few years now. Block build moves plenty when the lightweight blocks are saturated when the roof goes on. There’s far more moisture in traditional build when they are rushed.
Still neither seem to crack much.
@@tomsavage6886
Good to know. I've never seen any pro dry wall contractors use mesh tape. Pretty much a DYI option here. Thanks for your input.
@@oltedders agreed
When the Flash isn't saving Central City, he's drywalling.
Just what I was thinking.
Glad I am not the only one who sees the resemblance.
I knew it I knew it I just couldn't figure it out 😂
Mud, Barry, mud.
He looks like if Steve O got into putting up drywall instead of running through it
Vancouver Carpenter, you are a class act. You are a breath of fresh air. In all my 35 years ( retired now ) in drywall, drywallers were known tax cheats in the underground economy and low life beer drinking drunks.
You have good advice for all the homeowners. Keep the good work up and make a video about it.
'drywallers were known tax cheats in the underground economy and low life beer drinking drunks'...Okay, you mean other than the hard-working, responsible ones that took pride in their work and themselves...??
Mesh is useful for more than small patches. It will save a home owner thousand if an upstairs tub or shower leaks. The smallest amount of water would cause paper tape on the ceiling below to fail, leaving a blister (often quite long) that would have to be removed and repaired often requiring matching texture or a complete retexture ( at least in my area). While with the mesh tape application you will see discoloring along the joint as an indicator that something went wrong. The plumbing issue can be resolved and after the ceiling below has thoroughly dried it can be resealed with a good primer and repainted with no repair needed to the drywall itself . Follow these tips when working with mesh tape. 1. Prep the joint surface to remove any broken or torn paper. This can be done as you are applying the tape just by looking ahead for any imperfections. 2. Use a small (3") knife to "wipe" it on. Similar to wiping down paper tape only you can start from the end rather than the middle. A small knife will stay down in the recesses of flats nicely and will get quite sharp to aid in step one. 3. Squeeze mud through the mesh in a similar fashion of how you would run your knife blade parallel to the joint when hand taping with paper tape. This encases the mesh in quick-set similar to when a concrete worker uses a hook to pull up on the wire mesh while pouring. This step can be thought of as pre-loading the joint before following through with the normal application of the bed coat. Finish the rest as per a normal paper tape job. I should say I'm on board with paper tape in corners and the use of quick set. However, I don't see any issue with using mesh tape and lightweight compound in non joint areas such as tabbinng around wall penetrations or small holes such as remove Romex for temp lighting. These instances are often high up in areas of indirect lighting where "Done is good."
Thanks for that info :)
Lol dude if a leak you're pulling the drywall anyways. Wtd
As a home owner doing small repairs your videos are very helpful. I used to do way to much work. Seeing your work habits has saved me a ton of time. Also, I’m much more comfortable doing something then touching up when there is a goof and I don’t get hung up about it. Your drywall videos are the best on TH-cam for practical and fast drywall work. Thanks so much for sharing this. Oh, and if I’m needing a house done I see why a pro saves time and money! I figure pro’s find doing a small patch ends up pretty expensive, so your sharing saves little jobs you don’t really want to bid on, and you stay on the jobs that make sense. Good karma here.
I'm an "old" carpenter that also occasionally does small bits of drywall. Your advice is very helpful. I've tried to like mesh tape thinking there must be a significant advantage but one I never could find. I think I've had the same slightly used roll of mesh sitting in my shop for years. Every once in a while I'll take another stab at using it but always find it problematic. I figured it was just my lack of skill. Thanks, your videos are much appreciated even by a guy that has been working at this for years. You are also courageous for teaching to such an opinionated lot (as are carpenters, well, it's actually the whole world).
If you build fishing rods it's spectacular for mounting reel seats....wrap it on the bare rod blank until the desited diameter......slap some epoxy on it and slide the reel seat over....it seeps in beautifully...better than masking tape arbors ;)
+Tackle Advisors,
Lol, you beat me to it!
I was thinking that mesh works great for making reel seat bushings 🤔
Now I know why the basement I finished twenty years ago has tons of minor cracks...I used mesh everywhere...because I did not know any better. Thanks for sharing...
Even with hot mud it’s still vulnerable to cracking, I’ve seen drywall a year old crack from mesh and hot mud. I plain don’t use mesh period. Good to inform people that mesh tape is an inferior product. Thank you for your service!
I switched from tape to mesh and never looked back. Never had any of the cracking problems you talk about and I made a small tool to fit the mesh into corners perfectly. It all comes down to personal taste. I have shown people how to do their plaster, most of the time with tape they always get blisters, with mesh never a problem. I've been doing renovations for 35 years and my own home has mesh throughout and never had any issues with cracking.
I’m a pro and see cracking all the time from people using mesh as diy prob is they always use topping compound with it
You are crazy MF
That was great information for the DIY person. I’ve been using both and never knew the difference between them. Thanks Ben.
This is one of your better videos because it covers a single topic, gives explanation of the science and then most importantly, quick real world examples of how to apply what you taught, thanks!!
This guy definitely has a point ..but I have been doing painting for 10 years and some gyprock work ...never got a call back from customers complaining about cracks ..I prepare the joints well for my self because I'll be painting it ..if you do it right from a to z you have no worries at all ..multi purpose compound on mesh or paper is wrong ..use the one you mix it with water not premixed..wall corners definitely paper not mesh ..keep in mind if your not used to paper it could create air bubbles ..cheers
I love you man! I watch your videos WAAAAY too much....just did a small project ( baseboards) went south when previous installers glued everything down...ripped out chunks of my drywall! My son was helping me....and I’m like “ I got this!”.. fixed the drywall. Taped, textured and it’s like it never happened...my son was thinking his mom has mad drywall skills! I took the praise ( he’s 21...I need all those moments I can get) ...but here’s to you my friend, Ben. You made me look good! Kudos
hell yeah.. rock it, Cindy!
From what Ihave seeing in Aus, paper for corner, metal for protruding corner and mesh everything else.
i use paper for long spans and multiple joints etc. Mesh is used for quick fixes like small holes, gouges and imperfections. Since mesh is pliable you can sink it into the hole a bit. I think of it as mini rebar for joint compound. I never had any cracks or issues with my repairs
Hey Vancouver carpenter just wanted to say that your videos have been helpful and informative. Been fixing my own condo in vancouver, BC and these vids help. Much appreciated brother.
Wait...doesn't that make you the Vancouver carpenter?
I'm a drywaller in central Canada (Manitoba). I exclusively use mesh and swear by it. I also do not use nearly as loose mud as you use. I mix the mud but add no water at all and have great success. There are a few potential clients that want me to use paper (even though the examples of my work they saw was with mesh). I may take them up using your method of watering it down. Love your videos and will continue to experiment!!
You got it. There’s no debate among us drywall finishers. Paper tape with All Purpose. However, while I haven’t used it, I suspect Fiber Fuse is a good go between.
All the plasterers I see in NZ are now using a fibre tape that's kind of a random matt that absorbs plaster. The stuff is amazing. Way better than paper.
Mesh tape for flats using only - Hot mud (sheetrock - 90, 45, 20, 5) for 2 coats and final coat with premix
Paper tape for corners using pre mix on all 3 coats
I used nothing but mesh tape with all-purpose mud when I lived in northern Illinois, never had a crack, used the same when I moved to Las Vegas and close to half my joints cracked , tried mesh with hot mud, better but still some hairline cracks, now nothing but paper and no more cracks. So I would say environment plays a lot into the debate.
Nathan Burbach definitely , especially being closer to tectonic plates, those ripples are harder on the west cost than central
Nathan Burbach , you probably had more experience as you taped. Stuff in Illinois was cracking you just never noticed. Have to use set fast with mesh. Paper is for pros!
In Germany we usually use mesh and filler with fibre. Never have cracks. Of course climate is not like in Las Vegas, nowhere as Germany is small with basically just one climate zone lol. So I assume it must have something to do with specific climate zones. Otherwise I can't imagine why almost nobody ever uses paper. But I know you can buy paper in Germany. It's just that I never saw someone using it ever. And I worked couple of years on construction sites. On the other hand building with dry walls is not as common in Germany as in the US. One professional painter even bought US tools for dry wall works as he said US americans have the most experience with dry walls.
I love using the mesh tape and have had no issues to mention. Smooth mud finish and never an air bubble which I've seen done by so called pro drywall applicators
I agree with most of what was in video in regards to mesh tape. The higher stress areas can be adressed with a mesh tape I use that is at least twice as strong as the mesh tape you use in the video. Here's a GAME CHANGER: There is a SUPER STRENGTH mesh tape that I buy at the Home Depot that is wider and thicker and blows away the standard yellow or white mesh tape. The Best tape I'm talking about is like fiberglass mesh tape on steroids. It's Brown in color and wider then the normal mesh tape. I can guarantee that that The super mesh tape can be used on all those stress areas you mentioned with no issues of cracking. Personally myself I only do Drywall and Interior patching So for myself I never use the paper tape because I don't need it for the type of work I do. Now for a guy that does complete walls and rooms, the paper tape is faster to apply. I only use the super fiberglass tape on all my jobs now and I no longer use the standard white fiberglass mesh tape.
THank you. For years, I've wondered (but never asked) when to use paper and when to use mesh. Working on my home this time around, it occurred to me it might be important to find out. You've made it very clear. I thank you for your clear and concise examples.
For my skill level, which means I have done drywall many times over the years, but not as a profession, I have found that paper tape is great for corners. However, for long seams, and especially ceiling seams, the mesh tape has resulted in better results. It is easy to lay down just a bit too much mud on the seam and then the paper tape leaves a noticeable raised area. By comparison, when I used mesh tape, my result was well-blended and nearly invisible seams after shooting on texture. Now, I am not challenging the expert on his experience or opinion with paper tape. As for me, I just get better ceiling and wall seams with mesh.
I personally prefer the paper in 100% of the works. I never use mesh.
For ceiling use fibreglass, it s thin and barely visible, is soft to work with but way better than paper, tape to corners but something like tuff tape since you can press it without thinking of destroying it and there won t be any bubbling after 2 weeks...here in Europe we always put fiberglass on all joint except corners..
Thanks Ben. I’m a carpenter woodworker who really dislikes rock and mud. Probably because I’m so bad at it. I have even hired sheet rockers for small jobs that have done a worse job than me because of lack of confidence.
With all the fires near me, it has been impossible to find anyone to work so I have started to do my own mud. You have absolutely saved me.
Is there work out your way. Looking to head west. I’m a well balanced carpenter. Mostly interior renovations
HGTV needs to get this guy, can replace some of the other shows like love it or list it.
thats like the only good one
I work in earthquake country and our little company has been using mesh on the flats and paper in the corners for more than a few years now. We do take some extra time to prefill nearly all the joints with hot mud BEFORE we put down the mesh tape. This minimizes any hairline cracks. Good video. Thanks!
Great explanation. Over the years Ive used mesh for patches but now have my whole basement to mud, so started to try paper after watching your channel. Many thanks.
I'm a 60 yr old drywaller - with 40 yrs experience - this guy is correct &, good explanation !
well done!
Thank you for that tip. Looks like paper tape wins for me. As a DIY guy I’ve used mesh tap on lots of my jobs and couldn’t figure out why it doesn’t look good finished. It also don’t sand well, you have to be very careful or you end up seeing the mesh. Keep up the good work. 👍🏻
I'm a DIYer so thanks for sharing. I really like how you simply explain how and why you do something along with the amount of detail you impart.
About 5 min in, I wondered why you would ever use mesh, and by the end you addressed that very question. Excellent video, very informative! Thanks.
For a persistent crack I've used epoxy filler (thin bed) then feathered it out with drywall compound and it never came back, really quick fix.
This professional in depth explanation for DIY enthusiast is what I was looking for through the internet for past few days :) Thanks!
good stuff! I'm doing my very first sheet rocking / mudding project right now! I'm using all your videos as my ONLY source of information!! so far, I'm very happy with the results.. thanks!!!
In France, mesh tape for plaster dry walls is forbiden. 100% paper tape. Mesh tape is used for Fermacell dry walls.
Ben. I love your vids. You are the only person to point out the fact and the possible problem with paper tape and hot mud. I had a hole behind a bathroom mirror that needed patched. I covered it with hot mud and paper tape. An hour later I noticed that the tape had raised up of the wall a little bit.
Thanks for the great vids. Can't walt to see you do something different besides drywall
This is a great explanation, thank you! I am fixing a popcorn ceiling that mesh tape was used and there is multiple cracks. I appreciate this video.
I'm a drywall finisher with about 40 years of experience in residential, and commercial construction. You are correct when you say paper tape wins hands down. Rule #1...I only use mesh on metal framing, and NEVER on wood...wood warps and equals cracks. Rule #2...I also don't use mesh on butt joints. I do lots of work in the casinos in Atlantic City, and most of the time the jobs that I'm doing have to be completed in a day, and mesh tape and Durabond fast setting joint compound make that possible. The advantage of using mesh is that you don't have to embed the tape in mud and wait for the tape to dry before applying your first coat upon the tape. Essentially, you have the job approximately 1/2 complete in just a little more time than it takes to apply one coat to the job! So, as you can see, it's a great timesaver. As far as using fast setting compound, that is also correct, but I only use brown bag Durabond when I use mesh. The reason for this is that the brown bag product is much harder after drying than other joint compounds. That translates into less cracks for longer periods of time. So remember even though it's fast setting compound, avoid using Durabond EZ Sand, or other lightweight fast setting joint compounds as they are softer when they dry...they can be easily scratched and crack easily also. Working with quick setting compound is tricky, even for pros who use it all the time, so make sure you will benefit from using it before you attempt it, and good luck to all you brave souls out there...
This is the only explanation that kinda makes sense. Having said that, i have used the mesh with the ap mud and have never had a problem. Granted, I am not a profession dry wall guy but i have done it dozens of times on poorly constructed homes.
Also, the corner thing is really not an issue, I have been using an inside corner tool and it is much easier, saves me a lot of time, and produces a good corner.
I do need to start using quick dry and none shrink muds for the first coat thu. That will speed things up a lot.
So is the paper tape effectively forming a floating patch, and able to hide cracking and separation as a result of it maintaining a veneer of sorts on the surface?
I am a handy landlord and I use both. Paper most of time. Mesh will give strength in some area, or a compound situation, Compound = 2 or more materials and when combined is stronger than just one material. It is like adding rebar to concrete. In a pinch, I can use window bug screen.
I've been a professional drywaller for 20 years. Paper tape is superior for inside corners (and mainly because mesh tends to break when trying to get a tight corner) but mesh tape (especially the newer Extra Strength Fibatape) with quickset (hot mud) is every bit as strong as paper. The key is that you should never use any premixed mud for the first coat.
I have been led to believe that mesh is better for ceilings and paper is better for walls. This is because the mesh has triangular shapes in between to hold better with gravity pulling down and structures moving side to side. Isn’t this the reason for the mesh?
In automotive, there is a "sidewalk guarantee", once you cross the sidewalk, no warranty. lol
I am moving away from paper tape I have a few rolls and when they are finished I am never going back. Hot mud with mesh tape will never bubble, crack or peel. I only use 5, 20 and 90 minute mud I am done with all premixed mud
Mesh tape is also mold/mildew resistant unlike paper tape.
I'm a beginner, by hot mud do you mean mixed with hot water?
@@JMoore4291 No, hot mud is self setting mud that is mixed from a bag it is a dry powder that is mixed with cold water...sets in 5, 20, 45 or 90 min. sold at any supplier or big box store
@@mazzg1966 ahh, I have some of that myself. 20, 45 and 90 minute
@@JMoore4291 No. Hot mud is mud you mix yourself, usually 5, 20, 45 or 90 minute mud. It dries mainly by chemical reaction, not so much water evaporation as with premixed mud..
One nice thing about mesh , no bubbles under the tape and i only use the mesh on horizontal factory edge runs and yes quick set mud first coat . Great vid thanks !
That was probably the best explanation of tapes I’ve ever seen. Mind blown. I have had mesh tape crack before, along a whole butt joint.
Hi Ben firstly thank you so much for all of your videos they are incredibly detailed in ALL of the best ways! You are a gifted teacher!! I highly respect your knowledge and the incredible skills that you are so graciously sharing with us on here. You are entertaining while also being full of so many vital tips! For weeks and weeks I have hyperfocused on absorbing everything you have to say about drywalling, lol I even have a little notebook that I write all of your tips in as I watch your videos for me to reference back to while renovating so I don't forget anything important(I have adhd). I'm currently working on my husbands office which is a mix of freshly hung sheets (10mm) and older painted drywall (9.5mm) with every different type of joint possible all needing to be taped and majority needing floating out (think like a mix of your nasty reno video series mixed with your settlement crack video, your mud framing videos and add james and the giant patch), there was some rusted metal beading on the outside corners where the bottom of the skylight shaft meets the ceiling (we have a new roof now so the historical water ingress issue is sorted) that I ripped out, there was a crack either side of the skylight opening coming from the edge of the shaft where the ceiling boards meet (from poorly planned drywall cutting/hanging by a previous owner) the ceiling crack either side also had no tape on it when I sanded it back to check, no supportive framing behind the cracked drywall between joists (I went up into the roof and added blocking/dwangs) behind the seams and discovered it was poorly laminated (due to age now flexible ) original horsehair plaster, plus the room has multiple sources of light coming in at different angles and times of the day (window+skylight+door) so floating it out well and skimming will be essential to make it not look like a dogs breakfast. I love to study the next steps in my reno before jumping in so it is more likely to be successful and I'd rather not have to pull out my poorly laid tape or corner bead out (so your videos have absolutely saved me!!!!) My house is nearly 100yrs old (in New Zealand) and I'm trying to do as much of it myself as possible so your videos have been absolutely invaluable to me!!! IMO you are the gold standard 👑🏆for drywall knowledge and skill and I'm so grateful you choose to share that with the world - Thank you so so much!! ❤
Any chance you could PLEASE do a video with your opinions on these products and/or doing a comparison video of Strait-Flex Crack-Tape/Tuff tape VS Fibafuse Tapes? Please 🙏I know you don't like the Fibafuse because its super itchy and I have only seen you do a few videos that use either brands products (I know paper tape is THE WAY majority of the time) but I have a few bits in this office reno and also other parts of the house that I think may call for them and because I'm in a super small country and the only places to ask opinions about this as a DIYer are either online forums (which I don't know how much I can trust the commenters opinions - there are a lot of cowboys here) or talk to the sales rep who just wants to sell me the product. You are the only one I trust to ask about this! I hope you see this 🤞I know its an older video 🤞
Sending you all the good vibes from NZ 🥝🥝
I like mesh tape on butt joints because it can be sanded almost flat; paper tape needs to be mudded on both sides, so there is always an embarrassing bulge to blend-in. Mesh is also good for an "irreparable" fault line that's so busy that it makes paper tape bubble up or peel; you just paint on a few layers of mesh and skim the mud over it when it dries. Mesh might also be better near the ocean or in a bathroom; I've seen houses on the coast in which half the paper-taped joints are curling and peeling. Finally, if you use mesh on a corner, for whatever reason, just make sure that one panel goes all the way into the corner and the other gets all the tape, so that the corner itself is the fault line; I can't imagine trying to fold mesh the way paper is folded.
On corners I only use mesh if I have a large gap to fill with mud and need the extra support.
PC No agreed that mesh is fine on but joints if you know what your doing. In fact it will ultimately be a stronger bond in temperamental conditions with less initial bulge to feather out.
Homeowner here with lots of drywall to patch. (Not quite as much as the Frankenstein walls you are stitching together.) I used exclusively mesh bc it does stick easily. You convinced me to try paper and it has been easy to use, at least for me, and it is much more forgiving. Well, that and the other tips @ wall prep, sanding, tools, etc.
Torsional an shear strength... you're not making up words dude that's a perfect description.
Longitudinal shear
Yes but both are not relevant to what happens after mud is applied.
As he said it I came across your comment
@@jessespencer9810 Exactly. He is using words and talking as they they are some dry, structural components. Basically just saying what he feels but using technical words to make it sounds like he has some scientifically tested reasoning behind what he is making up.
You're a born teacher...with great knowledge & experience base to draw from and pass on!
I have over 30 years of drywall finishing experience. When mesh tape came out, we used it in some cases, but none of us liked it and we quit using it. I have never found any type of drywall finishing that would require mesh tape. You mentioned that mesh should be used with quickset powdered mud, not true. 2-3 good coats on mesh is sufficient. As I stated, I never use mesh tape. Paper tape is the best tape to use. The key factor is putting enough mud on the joints and in the recessed edges to fill them in and then wipe down the tape from the center to the ends. But the secret is this: allow the mud and tape to dry overnight before applying the next mud coats. Float the joints after they are dry, with a bed coat, using an 8" knife. The following day, use a 10" knife to float a skim coat. That should be enough, but if the joints seem to need another coat, slim a 3rd coat again with a 10" knife or a 12".
Thank you for this helpful information. Much appreciated.
Thank you! I've been doing a full remodel, I've only ever used paper, but I saw a short video where someone was using mesh, and got curious. I've had ZERO problems with my paper tape, I guess I'll still be sticking with the tried and true!
all of your videos are absolutely killer. thanks for posting them!
I love Fiba Fuse. It's a glass mat drywall tape. The mud bonds with it. It's very easy to float out. All tapes have their best applications. 👍
ben is the man!
i look for dude to have some kinda tv show in the near future - that is he and his team: credit his camera/sound man & editor for sure!
Very informative. Thank you. I've gone back to the shop to swap all-purpose mud for quick-set mud on mesh for a ceiling patch that has been secured with wooden battens and screws.
00:24 mesh tape is also better when you do reno and want to use 20min mud. And also when the new drywall is not perfectly flush with the existing drywall and there is a great chance of bubbles and wrinkles. Mesh tape conforms better to uneven surfaces
thats why you prefill and learn how to float spackle
Thanks for taking the time to put these videos together! Currently doing drywall repairs after a contractor re-pipe on the house. Started out doing small repair jobs as an Apt. manager in the 90's. Still using a pretty basic kit of 3 knives and just upgraded to a tin mud pan to avoid plastic chunks in the finish. Again, thanks so much for making this information available!
Just to add that mesh tape won't make it in hot places, hot countries let's say. Here in Portugal everyone uses paper tape because mesh tape cracks in about 50% of the situations. In turn it can be used for small repairs or small lengths without any problems. Good luck everyone.
Little added tip here. If you do use mesh tape for repairs......I don't....make a habit of storing the unused portion of the roll into a ziplock bag. This will greatly help in keeping the roll at the right moisture level. Otherwise the glue part of the roll will dry out eventually, because , ....it is a mesh, so the glue on that mesh remains exposed throughout the diameter of that roll.....And, the same surely applies when you use the masking machine for texture purposes. Just remove the masking tape from the machine and store it in a plastic bag....or it WILL dry out...that's why the tape is sold all wrapped up in plastic ...to begin with
I never knew😊
20 seconds in, correct, no debate paper tape rules, better fill, try folding mesh tape for a corner, it sucks.
It's fine for small job or patch.
This expert says paper too.👍 and mesh self adhesive wouldn't work in Ames taping systems. (Bazooka).
Notime ForFakeNews I’ve seen mesh under a skimmed wall a lot, in corners etc as well. But if you’re not skimming, I would stick to paper every day of the week.
Ive spent 15 years in commercial construction (Maine,USA) and the drywall contractor ALWAYS used mesh with quick setting mud as was specified by the engineer. I asked the engineer about it and he responded that mesh was specified with quickset mud and paper was specified for air drying pre-mixed joint compound. Ultimately it comes down to what the manufacturer of each product specifies.
As always, a perfect explanation.
Thank you so so much for this and other vids.
I have a 95 YO home that I have done a lot of reno to. Many jobs were not able to be done with the "it's all gotta go" (you know who) philosophy. To expensive being the main reason. As such I have had to do a lot of Blending from Drywall to plaster over wood lathe. LOTS OF FUN! :( Mesh has seemed to be the best solution for these joints as there is never an even thickness to blend. So I became comfortable with mesh. After doing an ACTUAL "it's all gotta go" (almost all) on the kitchen thanks to your videos I managed two pretty good amateur 45 degree vertical drywall joints from floor to ceiling. Sold on paper now. For sure mesh still has a place but less so for sure.
I disagree. I've been taping for 20 years now. Like you mentioned, as long as you use mesh with a quick setting material (sheetrock 90, durabond) you will have no issues. And whether you are using paper or mesh you should be pre filling with a quick set material anyways. I have seen thousands of cracks in my day and 90% of them are from paper tape. The ONLY reason you will not see pros use it very often is cost. Paper is a fraction of the cost of mesh. And if your a professional taper you are more then likely working for a drywall/taping company and there is no way they will spend the money on mesh.
Your science is correct. Mesh tape is strong in tension and will buckle when air-dry mud cures. When quick-dry mud expands, it pre-tensions the mesh and makes it strong. Cracking is an issue that will arise when the joint moves. Before I watched this video, I was a mesh tape guy, but you have changed my mind.
If your not into tailgate warranties, you should try tail light warranties they're even quicker. As soon as you see my tail lights turn on the warranty is up. lol
That's the proper way of saying it.
Years ago I bought a Lada with a tail light warranty:)
That's hilarious!
Hey bro I just came across your Channel I'm a professional painter 25 years in own my own company and what you said in this video is a hundred 100% correct almost word-for-word how you explained it, if you go on the USG information website they will tell you the scientific reasons why the paper is stronger and better in many ways over the mesh tape. You did a good explaining it.
I like your videos.
New subscriber.
Ken
Thanks Ken. I have painting content coming soon. I will welcome your experience in the comments👍
Best place for mesh tape I've found is behind ceramic tile on cement board.
Yea because it moves a lot and allows expansion between joints. Pretty much same tape that is used in drywall , I guess this guy makes sense since he is a pro, but I never had any problems with mesh
Thank you, I learned two important things. Mesh tape and covering the screws, compound. Over time….where I live, there is house movement. Living on a tropical island, Definitely need green board.
Nicely explained. I'm a fan of mesh, and I use it by choice. There's no chance of bubbles with mesh. Mesh however will twist and move if it hasn't stuck properly. Also it can deform if plastered over too vigorously. Also sanding can be a problem if the depth of the mud is insufficient.
Do you not use steel corners in Canada? We use both internal and external here in Australia.
Internal corners I've seen mostly paper, but exterior corners are almost always metal paper combo thing. He didn't talk about any of the exterior corners in this vid, I searched it on his page and he definitely uses then or exterior corners.
Came for guidance on drywall repair and then realized this was one of my favorite TH-cam skateboarders! Tips on carpentry and skateboarding!
5:50 I come for this.
Bro your channel is not only informational but great to watch awesome job.
Great video eh!
Many years ago when mesh tape was just invented I used that mesh tape thinking this will make taping our living room so much easier (however I did used paper in the corners)... Well every single flat joint has cracks going across it. I have to re-do ALL the joints in our living room.
From this experience I really don't like that mesh tape, I'll make sure to only use paper for everything from now on.
I just found your channel this evening and watched 3 so far, you know your stuff and explain things very well.
Thumbs up! 👍🏼from Ontario 🇨🇦eh :)
just wanna say thanks I've watched a few of your videos and each one helped a lot.Im rebuilding a old cottage on my property for my 22 year old autistic son . your drywall tips are gold! thanks again!
Please review the fiberglass tape...looks like paper but is woven fiberglass...It works best for me.
I have had great results with the fiberglass tape also...just use rubber gloves when handling!
I use both of the tapes but like Matt, I chose paper for corners and I don't like sanding with the mesh, you get to a point when sanding over mesh that it suddenly shows and it's a problem. Paper sands better.
I have been doing exclusively drywall repairs for the last 6 years and the few call backs I've had are from using paper. Virtually the opposite of what this guy is saying
I agree 100 I have been doing drywall and plaster repair for over 20yrs. I have yet to repair a properly or improperly done mesh joint. Mesh joints are only repaired because of MAJOR structural movement or because the just look like crap PERIOD.
I have been doing drywall and plaster repair for over 20yrs. I have yet to repair a properly or improperly done mesh joint. Mesh joints are only repaired because of MAJOR structural movement or because the just look like crap PERIOD.
Could depend on the imbedding mud. For example, the ONE time I used all-purpose..I got a callback, over some lifting tapes and cracks.
I always use Yellow Taping mud, we have SYNKO or Certainteed here, I tested both and found Certainteed to have the most glue/ adhesion. So that's what I use, no problems.
those people who have problems with mesh tape most likely used easy-sand hot mud 😂
Could it be that because mostly everyone uses paper so thats all you're seeing?
Great explanation and real world examples of the type of drywall application (especially if structural stress, or hot/cold). Thanks for sharing and not just covering the theoretical, but it's practical application (golden).
Can you do a video about using "paperless" fiberglass tapes like Fibafuse ??
Jamie I’ve had great luck with Fibafuse. Especially for quick patches
I'm a DIY'r that has done a few houses worth of taping over time and find that I get a lot more fuzz problems when applying and sanding with it than mesh or paper. I only use Perfect 90 type products in insider corners, not mesh, paper or fiber.
I am a DYIer since 1996 (over 25 years) & have always used mesh tape with regular (air dry) joint compound. Never have had any issues. Time is not an issue for me, which is money for professionals.
If the paper tape is not installed correctly (with thin layer of mud on the back), it can pop up.
Lastly, I don't apply mesh tape directly on the drywall but put a very thin coat of mud fist and embed the mesh tape. It takes couple of minutes extra per joint but that's not a problem for me.
The problem with drywall is that the joints are still there, we are just smearing compound over them. We really are not bonding the boards together.
Drywall compound is made from gypsum. Drywall compound is a "cementicious material" that, like concrete, is very weak in tension (and strong in compression). Like concrete, drywall compound cracks when it is exposed to tension without something in it to control the tension (In concrete, we use reinforcing steel (rebar) embedded into tensile zones of a concrete beam to take the tensile stresses. We use rebar in concrete to take the tensile stress because unlike concrete which is weak in tension (brittle), steel is very strong (elastic) in tension. So we form a "composite section" with rebar and concrete)
Similarly, cracks in drywall compound are caused by tensile stresses in the compound. These tensile stresses are caused by shrinkage - which naturally occurs when the compound dries, and by any movement in the drywall (like if it were attached to a timber beam say which will deflect under loading - which is again tension). Again, we are primarily dealing with tension in both cases. Other areas where we see cracking in drywall compound is at window and door corners where there may be movement occurring by nature of the opening, which again creates tension. (A good drywaller will never have a joint in the board located at a corner, he will always cut a sheet of drywall to go around the corner.)
As you stated, the mesh is far superior to the paper in tension, but I will agree that the paper will obscure any cracks.
I'm strictly a DYI drywaller, but I've done a fair bit of it over the years. My personal preference is the mesh and I've never had a problem with it. I like it because as per my above logic, it controls the tension which leads to cracking. I have also done a pile of plaster repairs in old houses in Toronto where the original plaster is cracked. I clean out any loose plaster, apply some CGC drywall compound, lay the mesh over the crack and then feather out the compound over the old horse hair plaster. It works like a charm. It takes about 4 coats, sanding between coats with a trouble light to highlight any imperfections, but you'll never see that repair. (JMHO.)
You should checkout FibaFuse... it's fibreglass meshtape, it's better than both because it's denser than the mesh but soaks the normal mud all the way through, you can use it in a bazooka like paper... makes it super thin and you can sand it to nothing if you need to (can't sand paper tape). It's what I use, but what do I know, I'm not a pro.
I had to replace all the drywall in the lower level of my new split level house due to water damage while it was vacant. I used FibaFuse as I'm an amateur drywaller and have never had paper tape joints come out good. I was able to get everything nearly perfect in the initial coat using the green lid air dry mud. Skim coated after hitting high spots and even the butt joints are impossible to find. It embeds so well. My only problem was I didn't know about this stuff sooner.
Fibafuse is life. We just finished about 1000sqm of walls on a commercial development with it, I use it on all of my renos (mesh is still my go to for cornice repair however). It pretty much makes paper and mesh redundant for general drywall work.
I switched to FibreFuse also. I sometimes use the brown heavy duty fiberglass on butt seams, which doesn't rack like the yellow fiberglass, but I use FibreFuse on all corners. It is more porous than paper so you don't get bubbles like paper tape. I never use paper any more.
Wow, I just left basically same comment about Fiba Fuse. Stuff is amazing. I've been able to float out the edges with a single coat.
@@EhurtAfy I'm a Class A contractor and the only time i use it's with fibafuse * rolls joint with fibafuse * No but really I've done entire rehabs with this stuff and i love it .
Not sure why some of the commentators watch this if so they're going to do is argue... This was really useful. I like the high standard you work to. As a pro-amateur renovator (24 projects under my belt), finding your site has been fabulous. Thanks.
0:56 No, you are not making up words. I'm an engineer and shear strength is the proper term. (But I'm not so sure about torsional. That is something different.)
Bc his video was about semantics? Or was it about what type of tape to use?
Great explanations on the paper vs. mesh for do it yourselfers like me. I've always wanted to know the difference and I've always been told that there's really no difference. GREAT JOB on the explanation!!!
Would love to see Fibafuse tossed in the mix for review.
That stuff is great on patches, it lays super flat to the surface.
I've done 3 basements using the mesh tape and I've never had a problem with it. I like that you don't have to put a layer of mud down to embed the tape. Simply apply it and start the mudding process. Probably better for the amateur then the professional.
They should make a paper mesh tape combo. Same thickness just benefit of both.
but that just sounds like paper tape with extra steps...
Ever try paper plastic corner bead no nails
I'm an IT pro not a drywall pro but this has been my experience... If there's cracking then you're getting movement where you shouldn't be so there are structural or panel installation issues that need to be addressed. I make sure the framing is complete & solid, glue & screw every sheet of drywall, then mesh tape everywhere (yes, even the corners!). No issues with cracking on all four houses I've completed in the last 8 years but I know that's nothing compared to someone who does this as their primary occupation. But that's been my results anyway.
Lol, I always called it the “taillight warranty”.
Same idea.🤘
lol Mag Dump I was about to post the same thing... but then they're always a bit different in Canada. LOL just a friendly joke please people, don't get upset.
'Till the cheque clears warranty.
Straight to the point no unnecessary talking, helped me choose as well. thanks
Good Lord that's a LOT of patching in that room! Why didn't you just do a fresh drywall install?
Ur rite
Probably because anther trade went in after and made holes.... think of all scenarios :).
Probably will be covered with tile
Guy is 100% correct. I've been doing drywall repairs and taping for 20 years. Mesh is only to be used for patches. Any joints that will have movement might crack if mesh is used. Even mesh and hot mud cracks.
I have 15 years experience and my dad has 35 years and we use paper for corners and fibafuse for everything else we never ever use mesh that stuff is garbage. We live in northern Ontario canada
Indeed Luc ! Fibafuse and paper tape is the best combination for new drywall install and larger renos ! I think Fiber Mesh is OK for a DIY doing a little repair !
Solid system
I have used mesh tape in many and varied applications with no issue of cracking. The thicker amount of mud required to cover paper is also more labour intensive. Ultimately it's what works for you.
Tailgate warranty LOL 3:20
Thank you. I've done drywall off and on through the years. I just got my first job from a homeowner and that really helped clear some things up thank you