I only just realized this but another part of the Forney's flexibility was because they could place their driving wheels entirely in front of the firebox. 4-4-0's couldn't do this because it would lead to horrible rocking and swaying at speeds, so the firebox was usually placed in between the driving axles, which naturally spread apart the driving wheels from each other. With a Forney you could place them as close as you physically could!
Dang. There is SO much new information in this video. I can now look at train locomotives and distinguish certain unique differences...and, you know, appreciate them better! I love how beefy and yet fine-lined vintage trains (and structures in general, really) used to be. I'm not saying there aren't impressive and elegant structures today. Each time period creates statements that become timeless. But, O, those vintage trains. I'm so glad people have cared enough for us to experience them today. Because I have been blown away and inspired by old locomotives I've been privileged to experience within my lifetime....Disneyland included.
Forneys really just make you smile when you see them. They're such cute little locos yet they can give some Americans a run for their money! I think I've heard of 2-4-4T Forneys out-preforming a few Prairies.
That would not surprise me in the slightest, the weight distribution plays a big role there, too much weight is spread across a Prairie's leading and trailing trucks, it can make them rather light on their feet seeing as their already rather small to begin with. One of my local railroads, Conway Scenic, they used to have two steamers in their early years, a 0-6-0, 7470, and a 2-6-2, 108, and there's a 3% grade coming into No. Conway yard. As trains became more popular, 4 cars were used, and 108 would be notorious for slipping and stalling, not able to make it up the hill if the conditions weren't just right. Meanwhile here's good ol' 7470, capable of hoofin' a 5 car train up the 3% with no problem, you can imagine which of the two is still on the roster today.
Very nice to see a full video about these fantastic little engines. Forneys are definitely my favorite steam locomotive too, I've actually designed my own for my model railroad.
Alex, the research you do for your videos is so encompassing. I love vintage steam, but this vid filled in some gaps for me. Thanks for the time and hard work you put into your videos.
Alex, very informative and detailed video. Thanks for all the time you spend on research, editing and writing the script. Overall, a very enjoyable watch.....
Very nice Alex! Interestingly, while it doesn’t appear so, the Fred Gurley and the Ward Kimball are built to the exact same specifications. The Gurley, however, has that large fully-enclosed cab.
They both even have the same Baldwin catalog number! The Kimball even had its smokebox door cast from the original Gurley pattern. When Preston made our drawings of the Kimball, we just started with the drawing of the Gurley that we already had.
As of 2024, there are currently 6 Forney locomotives based in Maine: Sandy River #5/ SR&RL #6/ Kennebec Central #4/ WW&F #9 0-4-4 Built: 1891 Operational as WW&F #9 in Alna, ME Monson #3/ Edaville #3 0-4-4 Built: 1912 Operational as Edaville #3 in Carver, MA Monson #4/ Edaville #4 0-4-4 Built: 1918 Non operational, stored at WW&F B&SR #7/ B&H #7/ Edaville #7 “Fred Richardson” 2-4-4 Built: 1913 Operational as B&SR #7 in Portland, ME B&SR #8/ B&H #8/ Edaville #8 “F Nelson Blount” 2-4-4 Built: 1924 Non Operational, stored at WW&F Plantation #5/ Edaville #5/ WW&F #10 0-4-4 Built: 1904 Non operational, stored at WW&F
Interesting note is the improved/offshoots of the Forney design. For example the Disneyland Forney's are technically no longer Forney's due to the addition the single pilot axle as the 2-4-4 is actually called a "Boston" type. There was a larger and more powerful design of the Forney called a "Super Forney" which was a 0-6-4. Also the early Forney designs by Matthias Forney were actually designed to run bunker first which is why we see examples of 0-4-4's with cowcatchers on the rear instead of the front.
These trains remind me of the tiny ones that where used in Wales for various jobs. They are so small you often think there is no way, but they do. I've ridden some of them, the views are amazing. They are sometimes referred to as the great little trains of Wales
The forneys are original was 2 ft narrow gauge,The W&W&F Ry,use forneys all the time. And the Maine narrow gauge museum has a couple of forneys are outside frame. They were used at Edaville railroad is in carver mass.
Thank you for explaining the 4-4-0 wheel configuration in simple terms. You are articulate and all your videos are a pleasure to watch and informative. I’ve sub and look forward to future presentations.
@@pinchy08 The first 2 locos for Disneyland were built new. The castings even have Disneyland on them. The locos for DisneyWorld are rebuilt plantation engines.
Actually the Disney World locomotives once hauled sugar cane in Mexico. 2 4-6-0s, 1 2-6-0, and 1 4-4-0. Even though a 5th locomotive was purchased, it was deemed in rough shape to restore. However its smokestack was salvaged and used on 4-4-0 #4.
This is my second comment since my first one is gone for some reason. I said in my first comment, great excellent video 😎👍. Then said to search Honesdale,pa. It is the birthplace of the American Railroad. They have lots of history and a working replica of the Stourbridge Lion, the first ever made locomotive.
Alex, it finally caught traction. The difference between the engines C.K. Holiday and E.P. Ripley (4-4-0), and the 2-4-4(0) Forney engines. I get it now now.
Such a well-done and detailed vid. It’s so cool to hear the both the history and technics of this engine. The ingenuity of the design was amazing! Dang, now I want one for my train layout 😁
Alex, my ON30 Forney has been a little temperamental as I’ve been using it for my layouts 3 coach passenger train. It was running inconsistently and stalling. My layout is not 100% level, so I thought the Forney was just not suited to it and almost gave up. I decided to try and pull my 9 car freight train with it and wow, it works flawlessly! The little giant seems to thrive under more weight and it’s amazing that Bachmann was able to translate that realism into actual operation!
"Thumbs Up" 480 Mastodon... Now I want a Forney. I have two O-4-4 aftershave decanters. Not the same as an electric I can put on rails and power up... I'm not sure I could safely still use the liquid contents of these as power scents, if I have any sense to add my own two cents... John
There's another type of locomotive that's similar to the Forney, and that's the Engerth locomotive, the difference being the part that has the bunker is articulated as well as having its own supportive truck, where as the Forney is just a supportive truck. I very much like the look of these types of locos, Genf, a Swiss example of the Engerth, is probably one of my favorite locomotives
By the way Alex do you think you could do a video covering the Glover machine works out of Marietta Georgia? They built steam locomotives for a very brief time and I think only six or seven of them still exist. I know the plant in Marietta survived until 1995 and when they went to go tear it down they went in and salvaged as many blueprints, Patterns, parts and machines as they could as well as apparently two or three locomotives that were still inside the plant after 90 years
Alex I know there were Narrow Gauge forney steam locomotives, but have there been any standard gauge forney steam locomotives. That ran on standard gauge track ?
Yes, in fact most of the photographs of Forneys that I showed in this video were all standard gauge Forneys. Even the elevated railway Forneys were standard gauge. And the Rogue River Valley Railway also used standard gauge Forneys. There were far more standard guage Forneys manufactured, than there were narrow gauge.
Matthew Forney,also wrote the Catachism of the Locomotive,which eventually became the Locomotive and Car Builders Encyclopedias! That was a prodigious exercise in what had become the Railroad Engineers,go to publications! Thank you 😇 😊!
While the 0-4-4T was a dependable configuration in the US, the same couldn't be said for the UK who found only _one_ use of it. To the British, the 0-4-4T only found usage as a suburban tank engine with examples dating back to the 1870s. These were mainly built exclusively as side tanks (much like the engine at 4:20, which is a USATC S100 0-6-0T built during WWII for use in Europe, which last I heard that two Yugoslavian-built copies are still being used today in Bosnia) and sometimes even a heavier front bufferbeam as a way of putting the most weight on the driving wheels. British 0-4-4Ts were used on suburban trains and many had pretty long lives, many even lasting into the 1960s under British Railways. Today, six 0-4-4Ts are preserved (1x CR 439, 1x SE&CR H, 2x LSWR M7s, 1x Met E and 1x LSWR O2) with a brand new NER O (LNER G5) under construction. 0-4-4Ts were also used on the 1ft 11.5in gauge Ffestiniog Railway in Wales but as "Single Fairlies" (or "Mason Bogie" in the US, but the Brits would say otherwise because "we created it").
When you say they were used as a "suburban" tank engine, I'm not sure what you mean by that...was it used the same way as a light rail system through suburban neighborhoods and towns?
@@AlextheHistorian In UK circles, "suburban" refers to commuter or branch line passenger work. These workings require a powerful locomotive with good acceleration. Engines like the Adams Radial (an 4-4-2T), the Terrier (the famous 0-6-0T like class member Stepney) and Gresley N2 (an 0-6-2T) were built for this role.
@@AlextheHistorian Suburban service is commuter service. The Illinois Central operated suburban service or commuter service in Chicago. That line was electrified and is still in use. I photographed one of the IC suburban engines in North Peoria, IL in 1966 at Vonachins Junction Restaurant. It had been built by Rogers Locomotive Works.
4:26 - That locomotive is not a Porter, but rather a USATC 'S100' class (still a good video regardless). If memory serves, the S100s were built during World War 2, with most of them being exported to Europe and Asia. At least one is still preserved in the US, at that's Granite Rock number 10.
These Forney Locomotives have more design appeal than modern trains, so I hope they make electric-powered variants of these models to make environmentally friendly trains without sacrificing their look factor.
Don't need to be nitpickiy but Tractive effort isn't at all related to the weight on the drivers, it only relates to the cylinder bore, stroke and wheel diameter as well as boiler pressure. Adhesion and weight distribution are the only things that the number of drivers changes. So more wheels means you can have more Tractive effort without slipping but doesn't give you any more power.
the original WW&F ran from 1895 to 1933 & the new one started in 1989 the Santa Fe in the SF&D RR was dropped on September 30, 1974 when their sponsorship ended
When it comes to the history of the WW&F Ry, the history is a bit more nuanced then that. The Wiscasset, Waterville and Farmington Railway was formed in 1907 and was a running company until 1940 when the company went dormant...but technically it never abandoned, so in 1985 they were able to get the company back on its feet and continue running it as the WW&F Ry. This information is available on the museum's website, a link for it is provided in the description of the video. And yes you're correct, the Santa Fe company dropped its sponsorship in 1974, though I'm sure that was just a fun fact you were adding in, and not necessarily correcting.
2-6-6-2 and tank engine 2-6-6-2t 1905 design was rated for 9% grades. Most surviving of the type, the tourist railroads have a hard time keeping weight behind the locomotives.
"Porter" is not a description of a variety of locomotive. It's the name of a company that built locomotives. They usually built small 0-4-0 industrial locomotives.
I understand, but the 0-4-0 became synonymous with the phrase "Porter Style". It's the same reason today why people call facial tissues "Kleenex" even if that's not the brand they are specifically referencing.
The locomotive at 5:55 is not a forney- it is a mason bogie, the difference is the mason bogies had driving wheels on an articulated frame, hence why the firebox is so far behind the power truck. I believe the only mason bogie still in operation today is at greenfield village.
@@AlextheHistorian the difference is the forney locomotives driving wheels are in a rigid frame, the mason bogie's are not, the driving wheels are on a power truck and can swivel to negotiate tighter turns. The mason bogie is similar to a fairlie locomotive. I brought up the far back firebox placement because it allows the power truck to swivel in front of it.
11:23 yeahhhh not to be that guy but it's pretty much expected for a model train to haul like 15 cars some thing impressive for a model train is like 30 cars
I completely disagree. Even in model railroads, the type of engine you have can play a part in how many cars it hauls based on the weight of the engine and the amount of friction the wheels have against the rails, any model railroader can confirm they have weak engines and they have strong ones. For instance. In addition to having a Forney, I also have a 4-4-0 and it can only pull 4 passenger cars or 6 freight, nothing more or the wheels slip. It's physics.
Both my Forney and 4-4-0 are On30. I also used to work with HO scale, I had a 4-4-0 that could pull 4 cars, and an SD-40 that could pull less than 20 cars Before I had HO, I had N scale. I had an Atlas 4-4-0 that could pull about 4 cars maybe 5 if they were lightweight. And a 2-8-2 that could pull 14 cars. In every scale, On30, HO, and N, the 4-4-0 always pulled no more than 4-6 cars, that's because the engine doesn't weigh as much to provide enough friction to the wheels, and because it has to haul a tender behind it. In HO and N, the power unit was the tender with an axle that turned the locomotive wheels, but in On3O, the locomotive is the power unit and has the majority weight.
@@AlextheHistorian Usually until around 2014 Bachmann retooled the ho 4-4-0 because the old version was tender drive and had an unreliable drive shaft mechanism so worst casenario that 4-4-0 had a pancake motor that wasn't really good
The WW&F No. 9 is there only currently operating locomotive, but they are building another 2-4-4T, No. 11. They also have No. 8 but that one is currently not operating. She really needs a new paint job
I only just realized this but another part of the Forney's flexibility was because they could place their driving wheels entirely in front of the firebox. 4-4-0's couldn't do this because it would lead to horrible rocking and swaying at speeds, so the firebox was usually placed in between the driving axles, which naturally spread apart the driving wheels from each other. With a Forney you could place them as close as you physically could!
Very astute observation! I didn't even realize that either
Forneys are amazing indeed! Love this video! In fact I actually love Forney #6 starting at 6:35.
Dang. There is SO much new information in this video. I can now look at train locomotives and distinguish certain unique differences...and, you know, appreciate them better! I love how beefy and yet fine-lined vintage trains (and structures in general, really) used to be. I'm not saying there aren't impressive and elegant structures today. Each time period creates statements that become timeless. But, O, those vintage trains. I'm so glad people have cared enough for us to experience them today. Because I have been blown away and inspired by old locomotives I've been privileged to experience within my lifetime....Disneyland included.
Forneys really just make you smile when you see them. They're such cute little locos yet they can give some Americans a run for their money! I think I've heard of 2-4-4T Forneys out-preforming a few Prairies.
That would not surprise me in the slightest, the weight distribution plays a big role there, too much weight is spread across a Prairie's leading and trailing trucks, it can make them rather light on their feet seeing as their already rather small to begin with. One of my local railroads, Conway Scenic, they used to have two steamers in their early years, a 0-6-0, 7470, and a 2-6-2, 108, and there's a 3% grade coming into No. Conway yard. As trains became more popular, 4 cars were used, and 108 would be notorious for slipping and stalling, not able to make it up the hill if the conditions weren't just right. Meanwhile here's good ol' 7470, capable of hoofin' a 5 car train up the 3% with no problem, you can imagine which of the two is still on the roster today.
The WW&F is building a new Fornney
Amazing video! Best subject! Forneys are the BEST!
Aw sweet- thanks so much, Alex! Love these trains and all the footage from Disneyalnd 😍
Very nice to see a full video about these fantastic little engines. Forneys are definitely my favorite steam locomotive too, I've actually designed my own for my model railroad.
Alex, I thoroughly enjoyed this video! I learned a lot and the way it is written and edited made learning extra fun. Very well done. Thank you!
Thanks!
Thank you Alex,
very helpful for me and my layout ideas.
I've been playing a bunch of Railroads Online recently and have been itching for content. This really helped satisfy that itch lol
I love how there’s a famous porters in her original configuration. Before she got buffers and side tanks!
Good work once again! I liked the technical aspects of how these trains worked and why.
Bend Oregon, here. Very informative, Thanks
I always learn something new from your videos. Thanks Alex
You're welcome!
Alex! Fabulous video!! Thank you for this!
Always love learning new information about the history of railroading. Thanks for the great vid!
Alex, the research you do for your videos is so encompassing. I love vintage steam, but this vid filled in some gaps for me. Thanks for the time and hard work you put into your videos.
You're welcome!
Alex, very informative and detailed video. Thanks for all the time you spend on research, editing and writing the script. Overall, a very enjoyable watch.....
Thank you!
@@AlextheHistorian Sorry about the short comment but I'm rebuilding a doorway.....
Thats alright Mike, I dont hold expectations to commentators!
The Little Engine that Could book version was based on those Foreneys except she’s a 4-2-4t Locomotive.
Very nice Alex!
Interestingly, while it doesn’t appear so, the Fred Gurley and the Ward Kimball are built to the exact same specifications. The Gurley, however, has that large fully-enclosed cab.
Thats strange I thought Kimballs boiler was 3 inches smaller in diameter, and the overall length was a foot or two shorter.
They both even have the same Baldwin catalog number! The Kimball even had its smokebox door cast from the original Gurley pattern. When Preston made our drawings of the Kimball, we just started with the drawing of the Gurley that we already had.
Thanks for using my videos in yours!
You took really amazing footage!
As of 2024, there are currently 6 Forney locomotives based in Maine:
Sandy River #5/ SR&RL #6/ Kennebec Central #4/ WW&F #9
0-4-4
Built: 1891
Operational as WW&F #9 in Alna, ME
Monson #3/ Edaville #3
0-4-4
Built: 1912
Operational as Edaville #3 in Carver, MA
Monson #4/ Edaville #4
0-4-4
Built: 1918
Non operational, stored at WW&F
B&SR #7/ B&H #7/ Edaville #7 “Fred Richardson”
2-4-4
Built: 1913
Operational as B&SR #7 in Portland, ME
B&SR #8/ B&H #8/ Edaville #8 “F Nelson Blount”
2-4-4
Built: 1924
Non Operational, stored at WW&F
Plantation #5/ Edaville #5/ WW&F #10
0-4-4
Built: 1904
Non operational, stored at WW&F
I love small steam locomotives.
Well done thanks FRED GURLEY is my favorite engine also.
YAY!! Fred!!
Interesting note is the improved/offshoots of the Forney design.
For example the Disneyland Forney's are technically no longer Forney's due to the addition the single pilot axle as the 2-4-4 is actually called a "Boston" type.
There was a larger and more powerful design of the Forney called a "Super Forney" which was a 0-6-4.
Also the early Forney designs by Matthias Forney were actually designed to run bunker first which is why we see examples of 0-4-4's with cowcatchers on the rear instead of the front.
I've never heard of these, so thanks 👍👍
Awesome!! Great video
Thank you!
These trains remind me of the tiny ones that where used in Wales for various jobs. They are so small you often think there is no way, but they do. I've ridden some of them, the views are amazing. They are sometimes referred to as the great little trains of Wales
The Maine 2-footers were inspired by the Festiniog Rwy. in Wales.
Might want to go down to Massachusetts and Maine respectively if you want to see more of them
The forneys are original was 2 ft narrow gauge,The W&W&F Ry,use forneys all the time. And the Maine narrow gauge museum has a couple of forneys are outside frame. They were used at Edaville railroad is in carver mass.
0:51 that one of my favorite engines Sierra 28, ps very good video Alex.
Thank you for explaining the 4-4-0 wheel configuration in simple terms. You are articulate and all your videos are a pleasure to watch and informative. I’ve sub and look forward to future presentations.
Thanks!
We got a Forney loco being rebuilt at the Brecon Mountain Railway in Wales. Engine number 4, it will be.
Alex I love the forney steam locomotives, they're very interesting and one of the littlest steam locomotives in America
Great video. Forneys are definitely locomotives that many people sleep on. Could you potentially do a video on the Disney World railroad next?
Unfortunately I won't be making any videos of the Disney World Railroad.
I don’t know why, but he doesn’t like Disney World in Florida as much as Disneyland in California.
@@pinchy08 The first 2 locos for Disneyland were built new. The castings even have Disneyland on them. The locos for DisneyWorld are rebuilt plantation engines.
Actually the Disney World locomotives once hauled sugar cane in Mexico. 2 4-6-0s, 1 2-6-0, and 1 4-4-0. Even though a 5th locomotive was purchased, it was deemed in rough shape to restore. However its smokestack was salvaged and used on 4-4-0 #4.
The Forneys were mostly used for the elevated train lines of the cities of New York City, Brooklyn and Chicago and Sioux City.
Yes indeed, I mentioned that in the video
This is my second comment since my first one is gone for some reason. I said in my first comment, great excellent video 😎👍. Then said to search Honesdale,pa. It is the birthplace of the American Railroad. They have lots of history and a working replica of the Stourbridge Lion, the first ever made locomotive.
Makes me want to get into railroading. I have the old model trains that belonged to a model my dad built in our basement when I was a teenager.
Alex, it finally caught traction. The difference between the engines C.K. Holiday and E.P. Ripley (4-4-0), and the 2-4-4(0) Forney engines. I get it now now.
Such a well-done and detailed vid. It’s so cool to hear the both the history and technics of this engine. The ingenuity of the design was amazing! Dang, now I want one for my train layout 😁
Lol I probably would have made a good car salesman
@@AlextheHistorian Believe it or not, my late father's father was a Dodge Motor Car salesman in the 1920s in Havana,Cuba. He was bi lingual as am I.
Very interesting history! Well done. Thanks for sharing!
Alex, my ON30 Forney has been a little temperamental as I’ve been using it for my layouts 3 coach passenger train. It was running inconsistently and stalling. My layout is not 100% level, so I thought the Forney was just not suited to it and almost gave up. I decided to try and pull my 9 car freight train with it and wow, it works flawlessly! The little giant seems to thrive under more weight and it’s amazing that Bachmann was able to translate that realism into actual operation!
Wunderful video ❤
Thank you!
Cool video and even snuck a little disneyland history in there!
Had to! Lol
"Thumbs Up" 480 Mastodon... Now I want a Forney. I have two O-4-4 aftershave decanters. Not the same as an electric I can put on rails and power up... I'm not sure I could safely still use the liquid contents of these as power scents, if I have any sense to add my own two cents... John
The Civil War Union Military Railroad is interesting.
There's another type of locomotive that's similar to the Forney, and that's the Engerth locomotive, the difference being the part that has the bunker is articulated as well as having its own supportive truck, where as the Forney is just a supportive truck. I very much like the look of these types of locos, Genf, a Swiss example of the Engerth, is probably one of my favorite locomotives
Very interesting and informative!
Thanks!
I know almost next to nothing about trains. Thanks for the info 🙂
By the way Alex do you think you could do a video covering the Glover machine works out of Marietta Georgia?
They built steam locomotives for a very brief time and I think only six or seven of them still exist.
I know the plant in Marietta survived until 1995 and when they went to go tear it down they went in and salvaged as many blueprints, Patterns, parts and machines as they could as well as apparently two or three locomotives that were still inside the plant after 90 years
Thank you for yet another good video I learned a lot of new things from it
Thanks Nicolai!
Do you have any other upcoming videos discussing other steam locomotives by wheel arrangement? Do the 4-4-0 next.
Definitely!
Alex I know there were Narrow Gauge forney steam locomotives, but have there been any standard gauge forney steam locomotives. That ran on standard gauge track ?
Yes, in fact most of the photographs of Forneys that I showed in this video were all standard gauge Forneys. Even the elevated railway Forneys were standard gauge. And the Rogue River Valley Railway also used standard gauge Forneys. There were far more standard guage Forneys manufactured, than there were narrow gauge.
@@AlextheHistorian True! The El stations in NYC and in Brooklyn which the was it's own city had narrow platforms to fit in the streets.
Wow, for passenger count, that's like the same as a dream liner
The 0-4-4s, and 2-4-4s are really cool, then the DSP&P came and there were the 2-6-6s, and 2-8-6s
Matthew Forney,also wrote the Catachism of the Locomotive,which eventually became the Locomotive and Car Builders Encyclopedias! That was a prodigious exercise in what had become the Railroad Engineers,go to publications! Thank you 😇 😊!
I love this video, you did a great job
Thank you!
@@AlextheHistorian you're welcome. Forneys are some of my favorite locomotives and I volunteer at a museum that has a few
While the 0-4-4T was a dependable configuration in the US, the same couldn't be said for the UK who found only _one_ use of it. To the British, the 0-4-4T only found usage as a suburban tank engine with examples dating back to the 1870s. These were mainly built exclusively as side tanks (much like the engine at 4:20, which is a USATC S100 0-6-0T built during WWII for use in Europe, which last I heard that two Yugoslavian-built copies are still being used today in Bosnia) and sometimes even a heavier front bufferbeam as a way of putting the most weight on the driving wheels. British 0-4-4Ts were used on suburban trains and many had pretty long lives, many even lasting into the 1960s under British Railways. Today, six 0-4-4Ts are preserved (1x CR 439, 1x SE&CR H, 2x LSWR M7s, 1x Met E and 1x LSWR O2) with a brand new NER O (LNER G5) under construction. 0-4-4Ts were also used on the 1ft 11.5in gauge Ffestiniog Railway in Wales but as "Single Fairlies" (or "Mason Bogie" in the US, but the Brits would say otherwise because "we created it").
When you say they were used as a "suburban" tank engine, I'm not sure what you mean by that...was it used the same way as a light rail system through suburban neighborhoods and towns?
@@AlextheHistorian In UK circles, "suburban" refers to commuter or branch line passenger work. These workings require a powerful locomotive with good acceleration. Engines like the Adams Radial (an 4-4-2T), the Terrier (the famous 0-6-0T like class member Stepney) and Gresley N2 (an 0-6-2T) were built for this role.
@@AlextheHistorian Suburban service is commuter service. The Illinois Central operated suburban service or commuter service in Chicago. That line was electrified and is still in use. I photographed one of the IC suburban engines in North Peoria, IL in 1966 at Vonachins Junction Restaurant. It had been built by Rogers Locomotive Works.
Awesome video! Gotta make one on the geared locomotives at some point!
I love Forney #1911 starting at 1:08 too!
Forney had a descendent who worked at Disneyland in the 90s. He pronounced his name For-nay.
As a forney myself I can confirm we have some advantages
4:26 - That locomotive is not a Porter, but rather a USATC 'S100' class (still a good video regardless). If memory serves, the S100s were built during World War 2, with most of them being exported to Europe and Asia. At least one is still preserved in the US, at that's Granite Rock number 10.
3:58 I wonder if the mine trains from big thunder mountain would be Forneys. This is what I imagine it to look like.
The ones from Big Thunder are Porter style saddle tank engines.
"Big Boy is the largest steam locomotive ever built"
Jawn Henry: "What am I, chopped liver?"
These Forney Locomotives have more design appeal than modern trains, so I hope they make electric-powered variants of these models to make environmentally friendly trains without sacrificing their look factor.
Don't need to be nitpickiy but Tractive effort isn't at all related to the weight on the drivers, it only relates to the cylinder bore, stroke and wheel diameter as well as boiler pressure. Adhesion and weight distribution are the only things that the number of drivers changes. So more wheels means you can have more Tractive effort without slipping but doesn't give you any more power.
I'm trying to explain things in a way that newbies can understand. If they want the nuanced information they can do research from there.
True. The formula is available online. It’s pretty straightforward and weight isn’t a variable.
Hi Alex. I have a couple of suggestions for you regarding the Queen Mary. . What is the best way to contact you please?
Hello Clive, email is best: alexthehistorian55@gmail.com
Thanks Alex. I sent u a test message so hopefully u receive it. 🙂
Imagine a video about the n&w 1218
You know the ward kimbell was preivously owned by cedar point right? It's name while working for the CP&LE was "Maud L."
Yes in my video about the history of the Disneyland Railroad I go into detail about all 5 engines.
the original WW&F ran from 1895 to 1933 & the new one started in 1989
the Santa Fe in the SF&D RR was dropped on September 30, 1974 when their sponsorship ended
When it comes to the history of the WW&F Ry, the history is a bit more nuanced then that. The Wiscasset, Waterville and Farmington Railway was formed in 1907 and was a running company until 1940 when the company went dormant...but technically it never abandoned, so in 1985 they were able to get the company back on its feet and continue running it as the WW&F Ry. This information is available on the museum's website, a link for it is provided in the description of the video.
And yes you're correct, the Santa Fe company dropped its sponsorship in 1974, though I'm sure that was just a fun fact you were adding in, and not necessarily correcting.
@@AlextheHistorian I hope the WW&F makes the track longer in the future too ;-)
2-6-6-2 and tank engine 2-6-6-2t 1905 design was rated for 9% grades. Most surviving of the type, the tourist railroads have a hard time keeping weight behind the locomotives.
3:31 water sat in a tank never heard of those
Amusement park sized locomotives.
"Porter" is not a description of a variety of locomotive. It's the name of a company that built locomotives. They usually built small 0-4-0 industrial locomotives.
I understand, but the 0-4-0 became synonymous with the phrase "Porter Style". It's the same reason today why people call facial tissues "Kleenex" even if that's not the brand they are specifically referencing.
The locomotive at 5:55 is not a forney- it is a mason bogie, the difference is the mason bogies had driving wheels on an articulated frame, hence why the firebox is so far behind the power truck. I believe the only mason bogie still in operation today is at greenfield village.
But Forney's also had a firebox far behind the driving wheels. I don't see the difference
@@AlextheHistorian the difference is the forney locomotives driving wheels are in a rigid frame, the mason bogie's are not, the driving wheels are on a power truck and can swivel to negotiate tighter turns. The mason bogie is similar to a fairlie locomotive. I brought up the far back firebox placement because it allows the power truck to swivel in front of it.
Oh ok, I see.
Not to be that girl but if a machine could be cute this one is! Nice video!
If you didn't know, the 1860s were the darkest decade during the 19th Century.
Fred and ward where built to the same blue prints so i think they are the same size
Fun fact the 4-8-8-4 big boy is not actually the biggest steam locomotive, and neither is the C&O 2-6-6-6 Allegheny
oh boy let me guess, yellowstone and pennsy S1?
11:23 yeahhhh not to be that guy but it's pretty much expected for a model train to haul like 15 cars some thing impressive for a model train is like 30 cars
I completely disagree. Even in model railroads, the type of engine you have can play a part in how many cars it hauls based on the weight of the engine and the amount of friction the wheels have against the rails, any model railroader can confirm they have weak engines and they have strong ones. For instance. In addition to having a Forney, I also have a 4-4-0 and it can only pull 4 passenger cars or 6 freight, nothing more or the wheels slip.
It's physics.
@@AlextheHistorianwhat scale was the 4-4-0
Both my Forney and 4-4-0 are On30.
I also used to work with HO scale, I had a 4-4-0 that could pull 4 cars, and an SD-40 that could pull less than 20 cars
Before I had HO, I had N scale. I had an Atlas 4-4-0 that could pull about 4 cars maybe 5 if they were lightweight. And a 2-8-2 that could pull 14 cars.
In every scale, On30, HO, and N, the 4-4-0 always pulled no more than 4-6 cars, that's because the engine doesn't weigh as much to provide enough friction to the wheels, and because it has to haul a tender behind it. In HO and N, the power unit was the tender with an axle that turned the locomotive wheels, but in On3O, the locomotive is the power unit and has the majority weight.
And was it an older model
@@AlextheHistorian Usually until around 2014 Bachmann retooled the ho 4-4-0 because the old version was tender drive and had an unreliable drive shaft mechanism so worst casenario that 4-4-0 had a pancake motor that wasn't really good
The WW&F No. 9 is there only currently operating locomotive, but they are building another 2-4-4T, No. 11. They also have No. 8 but that one is currently not operating. She really needs a new paint job
And Edavilll railroad in wareham Massachusetts s who also run them for cranberry harvest