Equipment Review: The Best Copper Skillets
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 18 พ.ย. 2022
- These beautiful, heat-responsive, pricey pans have a long history in fine cooking, but do they have a place in home kitchens today?
Buy All-Clad Copper Skillet: cooks.io/3UbbrEt
Buy Hestan CopperBond Skillet: cooks.io/3UfjIYf
Read our full review: cooks.io/3NqvIUn
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I wrote an email to America's Test Kitchen last month about their disgraceful copper skillets review/advertorial for multi-clad pan manufacturers; they basically told me to kick rocks. So I thought I'd share my detailed objections here, mainly so I didn't feel I wasted an hour emailing into the void 😂
Hi, I'm a longtime subscriber, but the copper skillets review has basically killed my belief in CI/ATK as an objective reviewer. Four major issues:
1. It's obvious your tester melted the tin on purpose to eliminate tinned copper from recommendations. Butter is the giveaway - it's literally impossible to melt tin while browning butter, browned butter is done between about 300F and butter's smoke point of 350F, well under tin's melting point of 450F. No home cook with any experience would take beurre noisette to that temp.
The claim that the tester "melted the tin while browning butter" honestly needs a retraction. They melted it while severely burning butter, which is an important distinction, and isn't a useful test if you assume your audience are halfway competent and attentive home cooks.
2. You didn't address tin's stick-resistance or how well it develops and deglazes fond with meat, which is a huge part of the appeal of tinned copper. In fact you arbitrarily eliminated the tinned skillet from some of the tests, claiming tinned copper can't be used at high enough temperatures to brown chicken skin or under the broiler. That's complete nonsense, and both of those claims also should be retracted and tested.
At no point will a tin-lined copper skillet's surface get near 450F while browning chicken skin. The sweet spot for the Maillard reaction is in the low 300s. Meat is mostly water, so it acts as a heat sink and regulates the pan's temperature; evaporative action of course also cools the tin, unless you burn the chicken to a crisp like your tester did with the butter. Similarly under a broiler, a tin-lined pan reasonably filled with "wet" food like macaroni and cheese or a traditional au gratin preparation is constantly being cooled by the food, which of course can't exceed 212F.
Tinned copper has always been used to brown meat and to broil, and most users of tinned copper will tell you it's the obvious choice over sticky stainless for delicate proteins like skin-on chicken and fish, as well as anytime you're browning meat and then deglazing the fond for a pan sauce. Because solid copper is more responsive than other heavy pans (contrary to your bizarre and indefensible claim that adding less conductive aluminum layers "turbocharges" copper's responsiveness), it's easier to avoid burning your fond while sweating aromatics before deglazing, and to control the reduction of shallow liquids, than in a heavy clad construction or another non-responsive but stick-resistant pan like cast iron or heavy carbon steel. And beyond ease of use, I think if you actually performed the tests, you would find the way tin develops and deglazes fond actually does result in better pan sauces than stainless.
3. You made some major claims about thermal properties of metals that sound lifted directly from All Clad and other cookware manufacturers' marketing around 5-7 ply constructions, with no scientific basis. Your explanation about how stainless steel helps heat spread laterally is something All Clad made up to justify charging more money for less conductive aluminum in D5 than in D3. It's nonsense, heat doesn't conduct through metal directionally.
Maybe even more ridiculous is the claim that adding less conductive aluminum layers to copper "turbocharges" copper's responsiveness to heat. Aluminum is half as conductive as copper (assuming pure Al -- actually less than half for the alloys used in clad cookware). The only way to make a given sheet of copper more responsive would be to thin it (remove some metal or stretch it in forming). Adding more metal will always make a pan less responsive, even if it were a more conductive metal like silver; adding aluminum or steel slows copper's heat response considerably. This claim obviously needs a retraction.
4. Your thermal image testing is meaningless, it looks like you were using pans that have vastly different specific heat capacity (All Clad Copper Core is only about 1.7mm thick, vs a very heavy 3mm copper pan) and didn't control for it, treating them as though they should preheat about the same rate. It would make more sense to compare a tinned copper pan in the 2mm range to the other skillets you tested, or to heat the tinned pan for longer on lower heat.
I won't list the affiliate links to clad products in video description as an issue since you disclose those in the review, although I do think they hurt your credibility, since CI/ATK is supposed to be an objective source supported by subscribers and not advertisers.
I don't think the review was tilted to goose All Clad and Hestan affiliate commissions though; my sense is it's intended to flatter the sensibilities of your readership, who you assume take All Clad marketing at face value, and see copper core products as aspirational and solid copper as impractical. It may very well be so for the masses, but your audience deserves an objective, nuanced look at the pros and cons of different copper configurations, not this dumbed-down and deeply unserious work.
Sincerely,
Donn Fresard
Totally agree! Thanks for speaking up!
I completely agree with you, and can no longer trust ATK as a source for accurate or unbiased reviews. I'm grateful that at least the people who watch and listen to your channel are at least knowledgeable. I really believe that they (ATK) need to issue an apology, and probably need to ask that testing staff member who somehow melting tin while browning butter, to try to do it in front of an audience... It's amazing that they would put such a blatant lie as part of their review. I thought ATK know a little bit about the science behind this stuff, but clearly their testers have gotten copper cookware to perform in a way that no one else ever has. Until that time, this should be a pretty good lesson in how a supposedly unbiased team loses the trust of their followers.
I just started doing research in the cookware world a few days ago in order to rid my kitchen of teflon. In doing so, I have also seen several other videos done by Americas Test Kitchen that seemed to push the All-Clad banner over all the other brands. This one made it even more obvious to me days into my research. I have always loved the copper look of pots and pans since I was a kid and am now considering spending thousands of dollars on a set. I was hoping to gain some knowledge from this video, only to have it fall vastly short of my expectations... Not much discussion of any other brand outside of a quick comment or two on the Mauviel brand, but did not reference nor compare their newest line of M'6. It is 6 layers, 2.7mm thick with stainless steel handles, oven safe to 600 degrees and works with every type of burner (gas, electric, induction, halogen and more). I found this line to be the most promising for me at this time. Again, I was hoping to be introduced to a few more brands as alternative options... I greatly appreciate your vast knowledge and your no nonsense ability to discuss their review. Thanks
This is legit criticism. Well said.
I would also add that this was an all clad commercial.
In Pakistan, my mother’s kitchen was full of handmade copper cookware. Our neighbor used to make them. We’d hear the hammering sound in the distance. Different times.
what a lovely memory to share
You were blessed!✌🏻
Lots of good memories indeed. People used to care for and respect each other back in the days. My mother was a science and mathematics teacher. With the little salary she received, she used to purchase and distribute stationary to pupils who couldn’t afford it and buy decent clothes for Eid (equivalent to Christmas) for the neighbors who were very poor.
@@mtnx7 Many years ago I learned The Five Pillars of Islam and that zakat (alms or charity) was a core belief. Your mother was truly a blessed woman.
Two questions:
1) Do you remember if they had a thick bottom, or did it not matter?
2) There's often tomato in South Asian food. Tomato is acidic. Did your mother take any special precautions, or was it not a problem? One might imagine that the acidity will cause pitting in the material.
I have two sizes of Falk sauciers and love them. I use them every day even for boiling eggs. I bought them for their cooking performance not the cosmetics of shiny copper exteriors. I only remove burnt-on grease from the exteriors, not the warmly-colored patina. The satin texture of the stainless steel exterior cleans easily and is no more sticky than a mirror-finished stainless steel. Barkeeper's Friend is great for removing the occasional stubborn bits or stains from the interior. Falk offers cast iron or hollow stainless steel handles, I have the latter and the remain cool on a gas stove except near the pan. Falk also has an induction capable, 3-ply line.
“You don’t need a copper skillet, but you want one” so true, gold
I have the All Clad Copper Core 14 piece set and it's been a game changer in the kitchen. I've primarily used D3 and it's been fantastic, but the Copper Core is worth every cent. It cooks faster, more evenly, and that makes a huge difference when cooking large quantities in the 12" and 14" pans. You don't get hot spots, it cooks very evenly, especially out at the edges of the pans.
All clad copper is incredible.
I have about 12 copper pieces, all stainless lined. I fixed the slow to cool down by installing a copper counter top on my work island. If the pan gets too hot I turn around and set it on the counter top - the copper pulls away that heat in seconds.
That's a really cool idea! Thanks
I have about 10 or 11 french copper pieces and I just love them.
ever have an issue with the tin like shown? melting
@@hwilcox I don't heat the tin up to max. Copper with tin or stainless clad doesn't need to be heated to highest degrees because it cooks so eventually so cooks quicker because of no hotspots.
What is the best French copper brand to buy?
I have a full set of Mauviel 2mm thick Cuprinox Style copper cookware (it's thicker than the 1.5 mm, has a slight flare at the top for pouring, and was discontinued in 2008 or so thanks to the economic conditions at the time. For all that cookware (I bought way too much) I mostly use Wright's on my Mauviel copper, but I've also noticed when I make bechamel sauce and it overflows down the side and I leave it to dry before getting around to cleaning it, it cleans the tarnish on that area dramatically before I rinse it and start actively cleaning, so consider making a flour paste and trying that before using something like Wright's and possibly avoid a lot of elbow grease if you haven't cleaned your copper pan in awhile.
Richard Olney’s copper cleaner recipe: “…a paste made of a couple of cups of marble dust, an egg white, about ¾ cup of flour, 1/3 cup vinegar, and a handful of salt, may be prepared and kept indefinitely in a sealed container.”
I own and use daily the bronze handled version of the Mauviel. OK, I never polish it because it is a tool to perform a task and appearance isn't important to me. Like a cast iron skillet, I consider it "character".
I have a complete set of the All Clad copper core and love it! Yes, it was an incredible expense buying all of it but so worth it! It'll be passed down to future generations after I pass
The video I've been waiting for thank you
At 2:00, when you talk about how the stainless steel makes the pan cook more evenly - I think would rephrase that it would forces the pan to heat up more evenly (at the cost of taking the pan twice as long to heat up). I think this would hold true if you were toasting spices in the pan. But if you were to plop a large heat sink such as a chicken thigh down on that even, hot pan, I bet you'll find that the temperature gradients you'd develop across pan lining would be greater than in that of a tin-lined pan (both because the tin lining is thinner and because it's more conductive). So I don't think it would "cook" more evenly.
I'd also bet that this effect I'm talking about is minor, since it's really just the lining we're talking about.
Not worth the melting of tin. The only real option for the perfect temp cooking you're talking about would be silver lining, but then add a zero to the price:(
Thanks for referencing the all clad D3 and that it is much more worth it.
“Inner frugal New Englander”-loved this!
I originally got All-Clad because I saw the Made in USA / Handcrafted in the USA marker on the bottom. Always check if you want US-based, because a good amount of their stuff isn't
If I'm going to spend extra money on cookware, might as well get US-made stuff. I thought it was like other cookware until, er... I visited my parents, and I noticed a huge difference. They don't have All-Clad. The pans didn't heat up as fast and as evenly.
I even splurged once getting a stock pot via factory seconds later. I thought I was insane for getting it, but I never had a stock pot with side walls that thick. The heat was transferring very well
The All-Clad is made in Canonsburg Pennsylvania not too many miles from where I live. I can’t be sure if they still do this but I think once a year they invite the public into the manufacturing facility and offered for sale pots and pans that aren’t in perfect cosmetically. There’s usually a huge crowd waiting to get in. Hopefully they still do it.
@@yt650 If you get on their mailing list, they have factory seconds sales online. It might not be as cheap. I got a few pans from there, but you have to make sure it isn't the same price as the likes of Macy.
Bed, Bath, and Beyond with the 20% coupons is a great way to get premium cookware like All Clad. No idea if it always works. Bed, Bath, and Beyond inventory changes based on location, so if there's more than 1 in the area, try the more expensive part of your area.
In one case, I found it at TJ Maxx, and it had a scratch on the side. Worked just fine.
Oh yeah, sometimes Macy's has sales as well. Some Williams Sonoma will have a clearance area in the back. I bought some All Clad and Le Creuset for a great deal before
@@JoeStuffzAlt
Here is a tip for everyone. In my area specifically Pennsylvania there is an online auction group called “HiBid” All of the high end cookware from time to time shows up.
Some of the ovenware may not be in the color that you want but everything that I’ve seen has been in excellent condition and definitely I’ve purchased a few pans that were made by All-Clad. You might check in your area for online only auctions. I do have an advantage because a friend of mine does the us appraisals on all of the jewelry and so I know what auctions are coming up but they are listed online. All of the photographs in my area have been very good so you do know what you’re getting.
Primarily these are estate auctions and they’re getting rid of virtually everything. It’s not unusual for them to have 500 to 800 lots, a large could consist of one thing or five things. Check it out.
The expensive stock pot will serve you well and the more you use it the better it will perform
AMT has long been my go to for kitchen equipment recommendations. I purchased the All-Clad copper core a few years ago. It's excellent! But honestly, I I wish I had gone with your recommendation of purchasing the basic All-Clad cookware. Don't get me wrong, I love my All-Clad copper core cookware! I have about 20 pieces! Since I have been cooking with All-clad, cooking has been a joy and clean up a breeze! Thank you AMT!
I've got a complete set of the Copper Core too as well as a bunch of D3 stock pots and skillets, and the Copper Core is so much nicer to use. It's a little heavier, but it also has longer handles, open heat holes to dissipate heat from transferring down the handle, and an easier to clean polished exterior finish. You can't go wrong using D3 or D5, but I'd never give up my Copper Core to go back to all D3 again.
@@WS102 thanks for the insight. I guess the grass looks over greener on the other side!
I still have my mom and dads revere ware pots and pans. Maybe 15 pieces. . They bought them 60 years ago. Still in Perfect condition. It was expensive ….
I don't know if Revere Ware still exists, but when I was young, it was _definitely_ the bees knees.
Revere still exists, but it junk as far as I'm concerned. It's just thin steel with an even thinner copper wash. It has none of the characteristics of true copper cookware.
@@seikibrian8641 One of the first sauce pans I acquired was a revere ware. That was some fifty years ago. Works just fine.
I have pots that pour more reliably, with a better lip design, and all the lids are interchangeable.
@@seikibrian8641 well maybe it’s made that way now. What I have has stood the test of time and still looks perfect. All my mom and dad used. And I still use some of it as well…. Also have some le Creuset from them. In boxes still! Lol.
@@eddiefniii It's always been made that way. My mom got her set in the 1950s. It worked fine for the kind of cooking she did; mostly heating up canned vegetables and such. I saw how it was made when my dad fell asleep in front of the TV while steaming a bun and boiled a pot dry; it warped, and the copper wash melted off in places so I could see that it was just a thin plating, not a real structural member. The copper on Revere Ware is for looking, not for cooking. Revere Ware would work exactly the same without the "copper bottom."
Just bought the all clad stainless
Problem solved, life's too short, ty!
I have Falk, Bourgeat (now "Matfer Bourgeat") and love them both. The Bourgeat is my favorite but I bought mine in the early 90's so it was not quite as crazy pricey as they are now. I do love the brushed copper look of the Falk. Both are superb. I am so glad to see Mauviel FINALLY bring back real cast iron handles. Their iron forge burned down about 7-8 years ago and they were scrambling to find a substitution for the cast iron handles, coming up with cast stainless with this awful black finish that imitated the cast iron. Of course, they still had bronze and brass handles as well, but many folks prefer that beautiful wrought iron gray look. I am glad to see they have them back, albeit with a slightly different handle shape. The new copper core stuff is really great. Falk has that as well. Great video, as always.
Their copper in each pan is reduced now.
You can use copper core on induction flat cooktop and I like it.
good reviews
Would love a video on heating a pan to proper temp and maintaining it throughout cooking .....
I have the Kirkland 5-ply copper core set which is a close clone of All-Clad 5-ply copper. I've found it to be a great affordable alternative to the expensive All-Clad set.
if I didn't own what I do now, I would strongly consider these. they look very familiar 😀
I wouldn’t be surprised if All-Clad made the Kirkland set. Coming from the wholesale business, and I don’t care whether it’s potato chips or pots and pans, these companies need to be able to run and produce every day. It’s very possible that they change the design ever slightly and perhaps cause the price to drop as well. I would think that if something would sell in Walmart or target for example for $100 I would imagine they probably pay around 16 or $17 for that item. When you’re buying hundreds if not thousands of pots and pans, they’re not looking for someone to clone a brand they go right to the manufacturer and make a deal. I know of a number of products made by the major manufacturers that sell in Walmart and the difference is the namebrand and the advertising and that advertising usually represents about 10% of the price you pay.
@@yt650 agreed. I've worked retail for more than 30 years. I've learned how to spot who is making the generic house brand. if you are in a grocery store and like a name brand look at the packaging of the house or generic brand. if the box or bottle is the same (not printing) it's very likely made by the name brand you like.
@@leephillips2837
Absolutely. Also confirmed by manufacturer representatives to me personally, although not lately I’m talking at least 10 years ago.
I would avoid the Kirkland set specifically because it's limited to a 400F oven heat. If you cook on the stove and transfer pans to the oven, that's a big limitation. The All Clad is rated for 600F in the oven. That means it's also more resistant to damage at stove top temperatures. The All Clad isn't cheap, but it's definitely worth the price. You get what you pay for.
so glad to see that the investment I made in my All-Clad copper-core scored well. I've loved them since the first test pan I purchased, I was impressed. I've also cooked with the Mauviel and couldn't tell the difference.
Can you do a review of the all-glad g5 pan with the graphite core. Would love to know how it compares to the tried and proven d3 or copper core
Hi!!
I know bare copper is the best to make Dulce de leche, as it doesn't stick to it and it's safe coz there's no abrasive ingredients in it. This being said, you think a stainless steel lined pot would be good to make Dulce de leche??
Wonderful talking points. Great video. Thank you.
What about the Hestan CopperBond?
I have many copper pots and pans and generally agree with this video. One major advantage to the tin-lined copper, though, is that it's more naturally non stick than stainless steel. I enjoy having stainless steel-lined copper for ease of use and I enjoy having tin-lined copper for performance + history.
Does thickness of 5mm of copper matter? In regards to mauviel copper pan since they recently reduced the amount of copper (but kept the same price).
2.3mm copper with 0.2mm stainless is the most balanced thickness, not too fast, not too slow, not too heavy.
Wasn’t nickel used as a coating ? , would that be better than tin ?
Thanks for the review , All-Clad would be my choice
Wasn't ATK's whole thing supposed to be that they don't accept advertising? Or is that only the magazine? Because the affiliate links to All Clad and Hestan products in the video description provide the same disincentive to review the products objectively as traditional ads. The whole video reads like advertorial for clad cookware, between the dubious claims about how adding less conductive metals to copper improves performance and the tester melting the tin obviously on purpose (browned butter would be black and badly smoking by the time you hit tin's melting point of 450F).
No wallflowers here- let 'em color up !!
I have bought 3 of them...but on reaching home found black discolouration on the steel coating inside.
Is it oxidising or poor quality steel
Any tips to remove the black discolouration would be helpful 😊
I know this is kind of late, but try barkeepers friend? If you bought them used (don’t know if you did), try boiling water in it and using a spatula or something like it to try to clean it away. Really hope this helps! Be well..
I have 1 All clad copper core and 1 copper lined with stainless steel Mauviel. Love them both but a little high maintenance. I don’t think either one of them cook any better than my 5 ply All Clad. I also have 2 Demeyer pans. Even heating and cooking but the balance in the handle is horrible on those so they don’t come out of the drawer often.
What wasn't good about the balance of the Demeyer pans? Also, which line? Atlantis, Proline, Industry, etc.?
@@markm.3740 Atlantis. When you need to pour something out of it such as a sauce it just has terrible balance because the pan is so heavy and the design of the handle makes it so the pan wants to twist and it’s easy to loose control of the pan. Takes a strong arm, wrist and back. My All clad and the Mauviel are much easier to pour from. The Atlantis saucier is a powerhouse on the gas stove but it is hard to maneuver.
@@user-ch7mn1kj4b Thanks for responding. That helps me with the decision to go with All Clad Copper Core set, which I've ordered tonight. I've got the 11" & 12.5" De Buyer Mineral B Pro carbon steel pans (which I love to cook with), but they are too heavy for my wife to easily use. The Atlantis 12" pan is a full pound heavier than the De Buyer 12.5". For reference, the handles on De Buyer Mineral B Pro pans are also not great for the same reason's you mentioned on the Demeyer pans. Thanks again & happy cooking!
@@markm.3740 You’re going to love cooking with the copper core. I love copper because you can turn the heat down and not roast yourself while cooking because it’s so responsive. Good choice. Happy cooking to you too!
On screen "Mauviel copper core 5-ply bonded"... transcript says "this pan is made of copper with a thin lining of stainless steel." So, how many layers is it, 2 or 5? I feel like I'm missing something obvious, and I don't see a purchase link.
Yeah, which Mauviel pan is it exactly?
Can you drop your link for the commercial polish?
Wrights polish? It's easily available just about anywhere. Bed, Bath, & Beyond has carried it. My Mom always kept Wrights silver and copper polish in the cupboard and as I said, it's easily available. Likely also at Target too.
@@johnhpalmer6098 thanks
Found a Hestan skillet and saucepan for $110 immediately took 2
Yes but Mauviel copper what? 150, 200, 250 , m3, m6, Heritage ...
What thickness is the copper and design of all these pans? this video actually forms more questions than answers when it comes to copper.
150 series is 1.5mm // 200 series is 2.0mm // M6 is 2.7mm I was not interested in the other lines, so I don't know. Also, the others are not traditional kitchen line ups or are stainless steel/nonstick. I had to go to Mauviel website in France and translate French to English, in order to figure that much out... which I have been up all night doing. Eyeing the M'6 line as it is the thickest (less likely to warp and hopefully last longer). It just happens to be their newest lineup and the most expensive. I will wait for a major sale, of course... I am also in the early stages of researching copper pans so this could easily change as I figure it all out.
@@madmaxbdw I've been in a copper for a little while I would suggest at least 2mm copper (90%copper / 10%stainless lined)
Secondary copper options imho would be tri-ply (copper/aluminum/stainless steel w/copper being external) or copper core pans w/ copper in the middle in 3 or 5 ply variances. With multi-ply copper I would suggest at least a 1.5 copper thickness layer of the 3 / 5 ply.
@@roospike So ultimately, Mauviel M'6 maybe out or at least until I can find out what the ratio's (thickness) is determined. Mauviel's Heritage line, 200 series meets what you stated. I love the copper exterior and have ultimately (presently) determined I will be dropping some dimes... I have found Matfer Bourgeat has a nearly pure copper line at the 2.6mm range. Any brand recommendations that meet your criteria with the copper exterior I like. No need to repeat what was in the video. Appreciate all....
Can anyone recommend a good company to re-tin pans? I have a French hand-hammered copper pan that I love for candy making but the tin has worn very thin. Would sure like to see it brought back to its former glory.
I haven’t used them but planning to when it’s time to re tin. I found east coast tinning on the Duparqet website.
Southwest Hand Tinning and Rocky Mountain Retinning are the best retinners in the US
Do you assume consistency across each type? (ie. do you test more than one pan, or do you assume one pan is representative of the quality of all of the pans of a given manufacturer?)
Does anyone know if a copper pan will cool down more quickly than steel or aluminum on an electric range?
Yes, but also the rate at which the cooktop cools down will impact the speed unless the pan is removed from the heat source.
Copper heats up and cools down faster than aluminum and stainless steel. And in that order. The more copper the faster the temperature will change in either direction. My research stated it reacts 15X faster than aluminum and 25X faster then stainless steel. As I am typing this I realize that is what was stated in the video above.... And I also agree with the first guys comment. I have a glass top (electric) and I would imagine an open electric burner would cool down faster than mine....
Apart from not induction friendly, thin copper skillets (like Mauviel 150) also curls easily, so using them on flattops isn’t the best idea
Food sticks to stainless steel. The tin lining makes copper cookware non-stick.
Even when the video has nothing to do to D3 you bring it up. Pretty tired of seeing all clad winning always even when not deserved at all ahahahah
Falk is the best copper cookware available. They are the only brand that doesn't use any aluminum in their products!
Outstanding video
Any commercial polish is going to abrade and thin the copper. Try a good coating of some katsup! Yes you read that right. The acidity will soften most tarnish with just some fingertip rubbing. Any will work, but I use non-corn syrup versions as likely slightly more acidic. BTW - good old fashioned auctions are a great place to find copper, just avoid made in Korea as it is more decor that workhorse. I have 20+ pieces of Viking and Revere steel lined copper and have not yet spent $300.
Also doesn't Made In have a stainless steel clad copper pan? Not sure how much it costs though
Can't believe y'all destroyed that tin-lined pan -- while melting butter! Tin lining is fantastic as long as you're not abusing it. Just keep the heat low and enjoy the wonderful nonstick surface.
Campbells tomatoe soup also cleans copper. 😄
I would like the test kitchen to assess energy efficiency of copper cookware versus the other material types. The superior conductivity of copper will decrease wasted heat. How much though?
Mauviel copper pans are awesome, and I love the look of patina, it adds more character imo. Make sure you go with cast iron handles, and stay away from bronze handle they are nightmares
@@randompersonontheinternet8790 they get way too hot shortly after cooking, bronze and brass are for looks, as beautiful as they are both are bad choice for handle material in my opinion comparing to stainless and cast iron. Also they will leave a metallic rusty smell on your hand, which is not ideal in the kitchen
What about silver lined copper cookware?
Demeyere Proline !
Back in the heyday of French copper cookware, many of the pieces tested here were considered table service copper. These were for presentation, and not serious food service. 3mm-4mm were what was used for actual food preparation, and nearly always with cast iron handles. At this thickness, the thermal energy present in copper begins to rival that of cast iron at searing temperatures too, and reduces hotspots even further. Go back to the late 19th century, and you will also find that pieces were made with thicker bottoms than the sidewalls, allowing the pan to better soak up the energy from the burner, something not found in ANY modern production pan. Lastly, Tin's ability to come close to Teflon in terms of it's nonstick ability is virtually unmentioned, and is a renewable nontoxic lining. Thinner modern pans can overheat easier, but thicker vintage pans don't suffer from this.
In short, ATK's lack of representing the best of the options, the vintage pieces, is both a value and performance oversight. Vintage pieces perform better, and cost a fraction of their new modern counterparts. Since they are not testing the ideal option, it makes complete sense that ATK came to a conclusion that the value vs performance on modern copper isn't justified compared to regular clad cookware.
The first part of your comment actually is a myth based on modern internet cooking enthusiasts' misreading of 1980s Mauviel catalogs meant for restaurants. In reality the vast majority of 19th and early 20th century French copper sold for home use was 2mm or less, the 3mm+ copper was almost exclusively sold to restaurants, hotels, dining cars, etc. Nobody would have thought to buy those pans for home use because home cooks don't have a restaurant brigade banging their pans around day-in, day-out. There is no record of "table service" being a classification for copper 2mm and under historically, other than marketing language in the Mauviel catalog, which we can take with a grain of salt as they were then specializing in extra thick copper and interested in upselling their most expensive pots to restaurants and wholesale customers.
I have revereware copper clad if you want to call it that pots and pans. They are stainless with copper bottoms to be accurate. My wife started buying them when she was 17 years old and that was 62 years ago. They are used every day and have been for all of those years. There is a screw missing here or there and there is a handle that is not in the best of shape but certainly usable. I’m not buying any of this really expensive stuff because I don’t need it. Too many times I’ve tried various things suggested by you folks, always good items and always expensive, I’ve decided to quit buying things I don’t need.
It's a pity the test kitchen isn't familiar with the equipment. You should know how to use tinned copper before you try cooking in it. Tin is far more nonstick than stainless and food will always taste better in it. It's not for nothing that most of the top chefs use tin lined copper.
Revere Ware had copper bottoms but stainless steel cookware and I still have my mother's cookware.
I use granitestone pans and pots and I love them. I never have issues with food sticking and they cook quite evenly.
I have copper-cored stainless steel and no it doesn't have any metals in it but copper and stainless. I still prefer my iron sets over anything else.
4:45 "my inner frugal New Englander" in case anyone else was wondering. I had to re-listen to that spot about 6 times before I figured it out.
I have a Demeyere and it blows All-Clad copper core out the water.
Josue, care to elaborate on your statement. I have been comparing Demeyere against All-Clad and others in their stainless steel line ups. Demeyere seem to work more like cast iron (heat up slowly, hold there heat and weigh more) verse All-Clad's line up. I think I should stay above a 2.5mm thickness to lessen my risk of warping my pans (investment). All though, I have beat the bottom back down with a wood block and hammer before :0) I am hoping to find a place where I can get my hands on both line ups and see, feel the differences. I am also realizing my cooking process has had to slow down as I have started using my cast iron and stainless steel skillets to cook, as I recently got rid of all my teflon. I am also wanting to purchase something that can be passed down the family line if they so choose to...
I bought two orange/copper coated non-stick pans and cooked one egg without spray. The pans were returned the next day.
That's copper colored dye, not copper
I was hoping for a bit more in this testing although I don't know how I could justify a copper set. I have an old 8 piece Farberware set, 9 All-Clad pieces, 15 cast iron and 2 carbon steel . What am I doing even thinking about more tools? Crazy.
I guess it's because they are supposed to be the best. Still I would have liked less talking and more side by side cooking comparisons. I have the great All-Clad D3 skillet and would have liked to see it in direct competition with the Mauviel.
Shure, abrasive side of the sponge removes everything. And it's just so fast. In the remaining time one can earn the money to have it polished up again.
Yay!
Tin and copper is the best. It's not hard to avoid melting the tin. Tin is non reactive to food. It's the best.
My pansalways warp because I like to add cold water in the middle of the cooking process. I know it's a mistake but I warped so many pans
Copper skillets are copper with a tin lining. These are expensive stainless skillets. Thermal dynamics will never allow these to be more than just stainless steel skillets in copper clothing for people who have more money than sense.
$250 for a skillet? I don't think so. I don't have the skills (or the need) for something that heats up and cools down so quickly.
The pan responding quickly actually makes almost every cooking task easier, not harder
Mauviel M'Heritage
Which version?
@@corpsie-diytools38 Mauviel M'Heritage 250B 2.5 mm 11.8"
or what every size u like
You know what blows away copper in heat transferance? Silver. Some pans have a silver layer, and no one reviews them.. Even rarer, some pans are entirely silver and are unfortunately EXTREMELY over priced. an ounce of silver cost 20 dollars so you would expect the pan to be expensive, but these pans are inflated in value by more than 300%
Silver is only about 7% more conductive than copper
@@northcoastcopper Not a huge difference. I know the risk is fairly small, but one thing that bothers me about copper cookware/ food vessels, copper can poison people, some people have died from say, pickling things in copper vessels. Most copper fryin pans have silver or tin layers that are very very thin.. Plus I just like silver, old silver coins.. the charming ring silver has.. having a pan made of silver would be a sort of treasure. Not to mention the antimicrobial benefits of silver.. if any silver does get in the food there is the possibility of a benefit.
@@danielbrowniel Sure silver is beautiful, but silver toxicity also is technically possible, and both metals are antimicrobial. I think that one chubbyemu video has a lot of people vastly overestimating the risk of copper poisoning - of course pickling things for days in an unlined copper vessel is never recommended, but even then you need to already have Wilson's disease to get acute poisoning from the amounts of copper you would leach that way. A very thin lining on copper is completely safe to cook on. Consider that people use bare copper pots traditionally for polenta in Italy, pozole, carnitas, etc in Mexico, and to cook many of the most popular cheeses in western Europe (bare copper vats are actually required by EU law to produce DOP parmigiano reggiano, gruyere, etc) with no issues.
@@northcoastcopper That chubbyemu case was creepy. I didn't know about silver toxicity. I used to make silver water as a cold remedy, it probably works but it also taste really bad.. then there is that goofball that rubbed it on his skin and turned himself into a smurf.
Why was RevereWare not included? They have been around forever, bargain price and offer pans with copper clad bottoms
I would be willing to buy one or two All-clad copper core pans if they didn't have that ring of exposed copper. Surely that is eventually going to corrode if you don't take care of it, even if they say it is somehow dishwasher safe.
I want copper for the more even cooking, not looks so I'd rather give up showing off a tiny band of copper for durability.
I have had the All Clad copper set of pans and skillets for 15 years, they only patina not corrode. You could put them in the dishwasher but I never do, hand wash only.
Anything that has exposed copper when it comes to a utensil such as a pan, I clean that copper with the following system. Make sure it is dry, I spray the bottom of the pot with vinegar making it wet and then I shake table salt covering the bottom of the pot and sit it down for a minute. I use a sponge with Scotchbrite and it works wonderfully to restore it to the copper look.
@@seejay5364 Sure, I knew they would survive hand washing just fine, but dishwashing doesn't hurt their normal pans at all. And it probably wouldn't affect their copper core pans if they were totally sealed.
@@yt650 Yeah, I guess I just don't care about aesthetics much when it comes to pans. As long as it's an ergonomic, functional design and is durable, that is what matters. Exposed copper on a pan that is already stainless steel on both sides makes no sense other than to say "Look, it's a copper pan!". That sort of thing is fine but not if it introduces an unnecessary weak point. I'm sure you can't cover the whole thing in bar keeper's friend but you should be able to in a stainless clad pan, copper core or not.
The copper ring turns green, but it doesn't corrode; at least mine hasn't yet after 3 years.
you spent 4000 dollars on copper pans and you make 4 dollars Mac and cheese??
Silver is vastly superior in heat conductivity, why is there no silver cookware?
It should be obvious. The price for silver is vastly higher than copper. That said, there are silver pans out there, they cost as much as ten grand each.
There is. Check out duparquet. It’s expensive though
The Lodge CRS12 12" Seasoned Carbon Steel Skillet sounds like a better choice as a workhorse.
Rice and ground beef chili sauce
Well… not quite the fastest. Silver is faster, and yes, here on TH-cam you can find videos from silversmiths in Istanbul who produces pots and pans from pure silver. You know, as oligarchs do.
I am big fan of AllClad, I have about 10 pieces and I am also Turkish and I happened to be in İstanbul now. I didnt know silver pots and pans. I will look into those.
@@ike7539 let us know what you find!
I think you forgot to say that you can't flip food in a straight sided pan, only a slope sided.
little disappointed in my all clad.... word of warning warranty is only for buyers in the USA. Imported a D3 and a few other bits from Amazon and Unfortunaly got a dud frypan... handle is coming off after 6 months ... great stuff when working but for anyone outside USA be careful...
It is very easy to re-line your copper cookware with tin.
I thought copper cookware was really only supposed to be a "workhorse" for a confectioner, not for cooking all types of foods. I am really kind of disappointed that this review didn't hire a confectioner or even make any candy to review that aspect of copper.
Does anyone use a skillet -- copper or otherwise -- for making candy? If they had been reviewing copper sauce pans, you might have had a point. They weren't.
I think you mistook this channel for Confectioner’s Test Kitchen
@@wc6046 I would totally watch an episode of confectioners test kitchen
They clearly used testers who were not trained as testers or cooks.
No induction for copper.
🤔
My first thumbs down for you guys. You spent 10x more time comparing the metals than the pans themselves. I'd like to know the thickness of the copper, how evenly & quickly they heat & cool-down vs each other. How easy is each one to clean? Price difference, which model? You guys completely dropped the ball on this video.
I think they look nice but I need my pan to go into the dishwasher 😂
Very confusing
Hello graphite!!! Cooking with a graphite pan. #Googleit
It's actually impossible for your tester to have melted tin while browning butter, it would be more accurate to say they did it while burning butter. Butter is browned by around 300F and smokes at 350, well under tin's melting point of 450F. Nobody who's paying attention will melt tin while cooking with butter in the pan. In addition, your explanation of how putting aluminum next to copper gives it a "turbocharge in responsiveness" is totally nonsensical, and the part about how a layer of steel forces heat to travel sideways is more nonsense lifted from All-Clad's PR talking points around 5-ply stainless.
I've been waiting a solid decade for these idiots to review copper and I certainly wasn't disappointed. The only true copper skillet here is from 'House Copper', it's $525. I have two. Not once have I ever had to worry about tin melting other than when I'm retinning my pans, which I've only had to do three times over 13 years of using my entire batterie. Copper has been lined with tin AND SILVER since we've humanity has been using them, Lisa. Lastly, I offer this - before they had their formulas for "stainless" steel (which contains nickel), they tried to manufacture copper pans with a permanent lining of nickel and people learned that nickel was toxic to them. Stainless steel contains nickel. How many here use non-stick pans? You know, that toxic coating that cannot be heated to high temps or the coating off gasses and gets into your food? Your kitchen needs three, and only three, types of cookware - tin lined copper (or silver for high heat sugar work, think crepes Suzette), carbon steel/cast iron and earthenware (or enameled iron). Bonus fact, their precious All-Clad is currently dealing with a class action lawsuit for their linings getting whisked away and into your foods from utensil use and dishwashing. Those defective pans that are of concern go all the way back to 2015 through today. So much for those thorough, not-at-all paid reviews.
i use a $20 nonstick wok that cooks everything - chinese, italian, steaks, whatever. And when it wears out after 6 months I just get another one. No fuss no muss.
sorry , All Clad handles are just awful. Deyemere deserves super consideration in the clad department as it's 7 ply with a copper core.
Silver heats faster than copper
Copper isn't the fastest. Silver is the fastest.
Up next: ATK’s favorite gold skillets.
@@wilydutch or platinum 🤣
Worst choices ever to be honest, were are the Falk, Mauviel 250 and Matfer Bourgeat? I don't think most would consider your choices copper pans at all.
??? One of each of those pans was included in the full review (link provided) and all were either recommended or highly recommended.
I usually love your recommendations, but I think the testers broke the first cardinal rule of new cookware..."Know thy pan." 😊. You can't expect a copper pan/skillet to perform like a stainless one. Had your testers taken the time to learn their skillet, the results would have been different. This is a very poor review to me, and it should be retested appropriately. How does a competent cook, ruin the tin lining while growing butter? Incompetent and you should be embarrassed. I would also suggest you take a look at your All-Clad bias. I love my All-Clad, but you're blinded by it.
Gee with copper at less than $4.00 a pound how could that possibly account for the absurdly high prices?