Exposing HIDDEN Truths About Lithium
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 20 ต.ค. 2024
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I love my lithiums. I run an AGM for starting/electronics but my trolling motor is on lithiums, I can run days on them before charging. Some of the lakes I fish are electric only and I can put around on the TM all day long without issue. By switching to lithiums I dropped something like 70 lbs out of my boat which is huge, the boat handles better now and picked up speed
I don’t see how you can call it a hoax. Maybe marketing. But the performance of a lithium battery vastly out matches lead sure there are some downsides and it doesn’t fit every application. For 36 V trolling motor you definitely want lithium.
I think he meant to say myths. Maybe myth busting? Because he did just explain rather thoroughly that the lithium battery is superior to lead. In particular that Epoch lithium battery.
at what temperature
Yeah, agreed, there are still a lot of people out there that believe that the price of a lithium compared to a lead acid battery is just a hoax and the advantages aren't really there.
Trying to reach those and help people understand more about lithium and that there are differences between the make ups, the uses, etc. like you said
I just bought a LiFePo as a stand-alone power bank to run my chartplotter/fish finder and VHF radio and an auxiliary USB charging port. I just finished installing everything and it is primo and done right. Much better than what you'd find on Boeing assembly line.
One does things/projects much differently with a few years of experience and much more time on my now retired hands. Needless to say, it is a much better installation than when I installed 8-track stereo tape players and Jensen coaxial speakers in my baja-bug or V.W. Squareback back in the glory days of the late 1970s.
Anyways, great video as usual and I appreciate your wholesome, good natured, squared-away manner, decorum and delivery of information. You will go far young man.
Lol yeah, we always make things look better when we have the time and are committed to the project! Congrats and love to hear about the successful project, I'm sure you're loving and enjoying it now!
Thank you for sharing this. In my observations older lead acid starting batteries don’t tolerate complete discharge very well compared with deep cycle type. I’ve seen quite a few older starting batteries fail after just a few discharge cycles.
That's literally the definition of deep cycle.😊
Buy a Merc 4 stroke and don't worry about it. I've been running Lithium ion for going on 3 years with no problems. But anyways, great video and info! Tks. PS: you forgot the outro.
He’s never done an outro 😂
Great info on using LFP for an engine start battery. I would probably stick to lead acid for now for starting on any larger motor. On a trolling motor the LFP really works much better than lead acid.
Great info as always. I looked at the discharge cycles a few years ago and it looks like they have gotten better for sure. It's still cheaper for me to buy a lead acid battery every 4 years than buy a lithium ion battery every 12 years. Plus I don't need to figure out how to get the yamaha 115 to charge them without issue.
You glossed over the main benefit of lithium batteries, which is their ability to put out massive amounts of amps continuously, and then suck a load back in quickly. On a boat, this means you can run an induction cooker, the wife can use her hair dryer, you can use power hungry tools like compressors etc etc you can’t do that with lead acid.
Yeah, the tech is awesome. Tons of companies now using lithium to the point where some companies are phasing out putting generators in their boats and using Lithiums and converters to run the AC & water heaters and what not. Awesome stuff!
@@BornAgainBoating yeah it makes sense with the absorption rate lithium provides. Run your electrical appliances off the lithium battery bank and top up when you are on the move with high output alternators on your engines. Add solar if you want. Not for all applications but for sportsboats it’s compelling.
The different lithium chemistries vary widely in this ability. Lithium Polymer (LiPo) has the highest current ratings but is also prone to catching on fire. Drones and rc aircraft use LiPo because of the extraordinary high power capacity and ability to deliver enormous amps; that's why your typical emergency starter battery is LiPo. 200 amps in the palm of your hand! Amazing. But it is dang near also an incendiary device.
LiFePo4 batteries are much more stable, have about half the power density and do not deliver as many sustained amps. House backup batteries are usually LiFePo4 (Lithium Iron Phosphate) having ten times the service life of LiPo, are much safer, but must also be physically larger for any given capacity in amp-hours.
👍Thank you for this overview. The battle for batteries (or energy storage and charging) is about to heat up (pardon the pun) as demand for electric powered boats increases. This topic is relevant and dynamic as more suppliers deliver their solutions and WILL muddy the waters with marketing messaging. So much appreciate your matter-of-fact coverage of Lithium batteries. Kudos from The Green Boater community.
Fantastic info. As of now I'll still stick with my AGM Odyssey batteries. They generally last me about 5 to 6 years with proper maintenance and have been extremely reliable.
Will Prouse, You have Done it Again!!
Great Video. Fantastic. You are the Best.
I would like to share my experiences with Lithium Batteries, but, I am a Hard Working Independent Professional BoatBuider & have to Run Out the Door to go to work.
I’ll be BACK !😁
Will Prouse is going to roast this video.
Like previous comments, I use a lithium for trolling and AGM on my motor and house for charging from the outboard with a Blue Seas charging relay set up. I also purchased a different charger for the lithium battery that will also work for other batteries being how lithium charges differently and is an investment well worth keeping in good condition. The length of time lithium last is amazing and the interesting thing that I found is if you run out of juice and let it cool off you can actually get some more use of charge time. Never had that happen with the deep cell batteries I used to use.
Best thing I EVER put on my boat was my 150ah lithium for only $450. Lifepo4 is safe. Works great starting/charging from my verado 350
AGM
Epoch, that's the brand I bought for my RV house battery. 300 amp hr to replace two 100 amp deep cycle lead acids.
They make a phenomenal battery!
Wow!! I learned a lot about lithium batteries 🤯!! Still trying to process the doggie on that pony ride and how it relates, but funny nonetheless.. Lol 😂😅
I had to go lithium for my trolling motor because the single 36 Volt cut the weight and space by 2/3. Being able to make 3 trips on one charge and checking the charge with my phone is a bonus. If we ever see -4 Fahrenheit where I live, it will be like the movie “Day After Tomorrow”
Thanks for your first hand experience and reporting. I for one, appreciate it.
Lol yeah I honestly can't remember the last time we put a new trolling motor install in a boat and didn't use a Lithium set up :)
@@BornAgainBoating knocking out some serious TH-cam comments on this rainy Tuesday I see!
@ericdavi1231 Lol yeah, thank you for all the input! Love it, and yeah, just passing the 5 hour mark of comments lol but it's a good thing :)
Put one of them bad boys in your boat on fourth of July and you Will have one hell of a Fountain!
You don't use Leadacid in laptops, you don't use lithium as a starter battery... I thought this would be a real world comparison , like service batteries or trolling motor bateries where you can use both types.
Those videos are coming, we're putting these batteries in a new restoration project and converting from lead acid to lithium for boat the engine and the trolling motor ;)
1 - Use a regular lead battery to run your boat. 2 - Use lithium for your 24/36V trolling motors. Who would ever use a lithium to start the boat?
Anyone paying $1000.00 for a battery isn't keeping up on the market.
I have a lead duel purpose for starting, and two lifepo4 for the trolling motor.
Great set up!
Only issue i have with lithium is that if the BMS has a fault, your battery doesnt work.
LTO batteries are worth looking at if you DIY, no BMS and can run off a alternator
Yeah, that's true, and they have to be built to withstand the abuse of the marine environment. With all the pounding of the water, haven't looked at LTO's, but that sounds super interesting if you can run off the alternator and not have a risk of damaging it!
There's so many make ups, now I gotta learn the pros and cons of Lithium Titanium Oxide batteries lol
Awesome video! It’s -14 this morning where I live and I use AGM’s. Awesome info.
Thank you lol -14 ouch! That's rough!
I carried my R/C helicopter batteries in an ammo box! great information!
Paranoid
Great Idea
A few points. There is a temperature issue with Lead Acid batteries. The freezing point of the electrolyte solution is dependent on the state of charge. At 100% SOC the freezing point is -70C, at 50% SOC the freezing point is -20C, and at 0% SOC the freezing point is OC. If your Lead Acid battery freezes, the internal plates will get damage and ruin the battery. Also there is significant differences between the different Lithium chemistries. The LiFePO4 batteries have a lower charge capacity, but are far safer and very difficult to cause a thermal run away with them. The Lithium Ion chemistries, found in many laptops, cars, etc have a higher charge capacity, but are capable of thermal run away and fires.
Thank you, great comment and information! Super useful!
ok, so what was the bad part about the lithium batteries ? :) i can also add that if you are using 36v trolling motor with lithium battery and share it with lets say 2 boats - u can easily move 1 battery from one to another setup quickly instead of doing it with 3 batteries, plus you can easier find spot for 1 battery than 3 of them.
I'd argue pretty much any auxiliary battery should should run through a DC charge controller. Not sure why anyone would bother with Lithium for a starting battery. There's a reason no car manufacturer does it....
And what is that reason?
Another good video love the content. I work on boats frequently and I was wondering if I could run an engine on a stand or a boat with the batteries removed by hooking up my jump pack directly to the battery cables of the engine. Makes it easy because you dont need to haul a heavy battery around. My question is will the jump pack mess up the ECU or other electronics in the engine because of its high amperage or is it safe for the engine? Thanks!
Done it a few times with a Li-jump pack on a Suzuki 140HP without any issues. Furthermore, I ended up with a Hybrid LiFePO4/Super capacitor starter and that gave me the best of both worlds - brilliant starting and extra house capacity at a fraction of the weight.
I've now got twin Merc 225's with a DC/DC charging circuit and Braille LiFePO4 Batteries - all warranted by Merc.
I think we just answered this earlier today?
@@BornAgainBoating Yes you did thank you. Meant to put the comment here first lol thats why there are 2.
@maverickmisenko7234 no worries, lol that's good, comment multiple place cause I might not see it lol, for context I've been going through comments for 7 hours so far today, so sometimes they get buried, so it's all good :) multiple isn't bad lol
So can you use regular battery for your engine and lithium for the house battery's? Maybe set up some solor on top of the hardtop charge them up.
Sure, or you can even use a DC to DC on the run charger with an ACR to maintain it without having to mess with anything
Yes, search for Renogy DCC 50a Charger
@@BornAgainBoatingGreat advice! DC-DC chargers aren't very complicated, they are easy to install.
Lead battery life: 5 years. Price 200 dollars
Lithium battery life: 15 years (if you don't shock it or let it rust and it catches fire). Price 2000 dollars
If you have finished elementary school, you can do this.
Thank you great information I have a mercury with a stator and I installed a lithium and it melted the connector on the stator I replaced the connector and installed a AGM for starter battery now all of fine stators charging system does not do great with lithium batteries
Ouch :( yeah, it can be problematic
At this point, 12 volt 100 amp hour liFePo 4 batteries are priced under $300. These latest lithium batteries are ultra compact and excellent for energy storage from solar in RV and boat applications.
AGM for me thanks
Which part was the hoax though ? Just the thumbnail ?
You might be surprised at the amount of people there are that still believe buying a lithium battery is a hoax and that they are unsafe and that they are just over priced, how can you reach and educate them if you don't try?
Absolutely, once again a large segment of humanity not capable of critical thinking. I installed a 4s2p LiFePO4 with 2x bms’s to replace 4x. 6V lead acid and they are a leap ahead in all parameters. 12mths running now with zero problems. ❤ them.
I meant that you go on to spell out all the reasons why they are awesome, meaning they are not a hoax. And the thumbnail says, “The lithium hoax!” Instead of something like ,”the truth about lithium” or something that’s all. And again, just bashing the thumbnail which feels like getting someone to watch it based off false pretenses. The video was great ! I actually learned something: I’m way up north and I like to go winter camping once a year. I walk in a cpap battery which use for 3 nights. I was very concerned about the cold weather ruining my new awesome lightweight super powerful lifpo battery and I sorta built a little insulator for it using hand warmers to keep it warm while I made the hike in to the site. Well looking at some of the manufacturers specs I see there , maybe it’s ok if I allow the battery to get cold during transport, which eases my mind and would be a heck of a lot easier.
Probably should run this by Will Prowse. I don’t see the Hoax you refer to.
Yeah this guy doesn't know what he's talking about.
We only use Lithium batteries for our Trolling Motor installs, we buy from a reputable company that has tested to military and NASA requirements, we only install one specific brand and will not install a Lithium battery that a customer brings to us. The Lithium batteries are lightweight, take up less space and have more charge cycles. We also use a specific charger to assure optimal charging conditions. All of our customers are very please with the battery but they are expensive
It's the cheap batteries that get dangerous, we use a ton of Lithiums too!
I'll stick with the lead acid thank you.
this video is so good! thank you for doing the research. Possible to make similar video but for using LiFe / lithium for trolling motor?
Thank you, and yup! We'll be using these batteries in a boat here in the next month or two, not sure when the videos will be finished, but there will be an entire trolling motor with the wiring as well as the install of the lithium in the boat video!
This is one of the best video ever explaining the difference between these two types of batteries and it is really complicated for a normal person understanding there was a beautiful straightforward differences appear for the viewers so thank you very much very interesting subject that’s why we have so many complicating electric control unit as a continue monitoring system for the lithium battery Great job For search all this information present it in one video
Thank you! Surprisingly there are still a ton of people out there that still think lithium's are super dangerous and aren't worth the price, hopefully this can help educate them that otherwise wouldn't ever give it a second thought :)
Great information and video 👍🏻
Thanks 👍
I have a 2022 F115 and a 2016 T9.9XPHB kicker that is electric start and tilt. I have read the 9.9 has an unregulated 6A charging system and it is time to replace my battery. Most AGM or lithium batteries state max charge voltage is 14.7 and the kicker puts out about 15v into a full battery at trolling speeds. I understand there is no amperage there, but am concerned it will cook an AGM over time or shut off a lithium in the BMS. (I really want to go lithium) In the owners manual it states that the charging circuit is optional? There should be no issue charging off the 115 as it is under that 14.7 limit. Has anyone had to complete or disable the charging feature on their little motors?
Litium also dont like to be drained this greatly reduces the battery life and sometimes even breaks them if you drain it under power ,that said ive seen a few lithium fires and would never put it in a location that is not fire proof
So I watched a 12:24 infomercial for Epoch batteries? Did I miss anything? 🤠👍
Yeh, you did miss a lot. And your cynical attitude is abrasive.
You didn't mention the Puekert effect lead-acid batteries have.
Lighter, last longer, more useable capacity for the same form factor….LFP is the only chemistry one should use on your boat.
WOW... Excellent
Thank you!
Just don’t use them for starter batter not worth the cost …trolling motor different story
Well said, thank you
Thank you!
Excellent and informative video!
Thank you!
New types of batteries are coming to market every year now. There is already one car for sale in China that uses sodium batteries
Yeah the tech is definitely coming around, the solid state, sodium, graphite, and tons of other things, though they each have their own like pros and cons and some stuff that needs to be figured out. But for sure, make a new thing and try it and see what happens, that's how we get better stuff :)
@@BornAgainBoating Each one might find it's own use. For example car batteries need to be energy dense to reduce weight but grid scale and home batteries don't.
I definitely see the issues. Lithium plays very nice with my 9.9 batteryless efi tohatsu
With this new battery technology will lead acid batteries start disappearing?
No
I don't think so, battery technology is probably pretty close to how the industry's are changing based on technology and usability. Like going from 2-Strokes to 4-Strokes, and now the push from 4-Strokes to Electric or other alternative fuel systems and propulsion. We'll see how the tech goes, like the obstacles with sodium, solid state, graphite, and other make ups. We'll see :) lol
perfect for house and trolling motors
If only you were this critical of those garbage bully netting lights you made.
simple the other batteries die too quickly
Very informative video, thank you!
Thank you!
Lithium is just as cheap as flooded... so why buy flooded?
not hidden. people just have their head in the sand about most things still.
Great information!
Thank you!
Very informative
Thank you!
Solod info - both chemistries have there usefulness.
OMG 3:50 seconds LMAO!
Nobody should use lithium batteries as a start battery. If so, they'd be in our vehicles.
The hoax is that there is no converter built in your epoch battery !
I've used deep cycle, lead acid batteries for years. I know how to charge, store and use them to maximize their performance. I resisted switching to lithium for a long time. Once the battery technology, BMS safeguards and the price came down I started using lithium batteries more. When there is a choice I pick LiPo now. Your video had a clear bias. You exaggerated the liabilities with lithium and ignored many comparative short comings of lead acid. Both require special care at times. Neither is ideal for every application. In any case where LiPo is a reasonable option they will usually perform better and be a superior value over time.
Life batteries don’t melt down
Tell this to the suckers buying EV 😅
I will continue to use lead acid batteries I don’t care how efficient they are nope
The max voltage you can charge a lead acid battery is around 14.5v and in the neighborhood of around 15amps, when charging safely. A LiFePo4 battery can handle up to 90 amps of charge, safely. Let's say you have solar panels (or a beefy alternator) and need to recharge your battery quickly. If you have LiFePo4, you will take advantage of all of the solar charge available that day. For lead acid, you will not be able to use all of the available solar power, as the battery cannot handle that much power at once. Faster charging is a huge benefit for users of LiFePo4 batteries and a more complete and efficient capturing of power, not to mention the availability of fresh charges without having to wait.
Take a breath
You can prevent all the loading and voltage issues by putting the LiFePO in parallel to the lead acid cranking battery. This hybrid will prolong the life of your lead acid battery and give you more capacity by adding the LiFePO. This is how its done in RVs.
Do you have a link to some more information on this? Curious about this system. Thanks.
You should go back and do more research.
Which part was incorrect?
They are great for my golf cart that I keep away from everything. My $475,000 boat? Hell NO! Lead acid forever.
Dc to dc converter
.wrong try dc to dc charger move on to something your info is bs
Lot of disinformation here… seriously …
Now you did it. You went from lithium batteries to opening a can of worms 🪱 😂.
Lol :)