I heard Adam Egret stopped working under the queens borough bridge due to concerns over the corona virus, what a shame. Nice to see you here also :D From another speed cuber/ norm macdonald fan
@@juliannmnnnm well they do at least do the same things they do in real they're just a lot more forgiving in terms of negative side effects so you often end up able to just max settings out for extra grip and then not get extra tyre wear 🤣
Well yes, but actually no. There is a online race with real racing drivers also from F1 and some pro gamers planned. They are planning on playing F1 2019 so there actually is a F1 race tommorow with some F1 drivers.
After RBR ran 4.5° at Spa some years ago and they nad some troubles, FIA stepped in and Pirelli now prescribes how much can you have at any track. The same as the pressure.
@@ntst22 Silverstone 13 was even worse: on top of super-low pressures, the teams were putting the rear tyres backwards of the rotational direction. It was because it caused them to get to temp quicker.
Yes, they do. I wrote a longer comment about how the camber thrust is more than just a "small bonus", it is a big effect, and higher negative camber can result in increased cornering forces even when your camber is large enough to reduce the contact patch. It doesn't work for all cars and tyre constructions, but for some, camber thrust can be better than max contact patch. But the tyre durability and tyre wear goes to hell really quickly at the extremes.
You cannot even imagine how GOOD this video is. To put this into some sort of context, just know that I'm 26 years old, I've been into cars since I was like 3 years old, I've been into Sim Racing since a lot of years, but I'm understanding how to tune my car in Racing Sims just now. And all of that (which is a huge step for me, cause I was not capable to even understand the changes the car will suffer from fine tunning the car setup) thanks to this videos you make. Awesome work, as always, have a great day.
@@tehgusbus2716 suggestion from a fellow who did some setups. Change one thing at a time into extreme options and see what feels different. For example, get your spring forces to maximum and try out some laps. Get them to minimum and do a few more laps. You will see how it compares to the default settings. You can also progressively return to the default to feel when a change is too much =) Toe is the hardest to get a feel for if you are not particularly fast, like in my case, not as much speed as I would like 😅
Great series of videos. Clear, easy to follow presentation. As someone who's getting started on F1 sim racing, this really helps me understand how to set up parameters. Thank you!
Stuart, the center of weight of the car doesn't shift under braking/acceleration or cornering; it is in the same place all the time. What you refer to as "load transfer" or "weight transfer" really is a moment of force (torque) generated around the axis of the center of gravity, due to the car's inertia (resistance to change its motion). The position of the center of gravity remains in the same place, otherwise, the moment of force (torque or load transfer) couldn't exist, because there would be no distance between the center of gravity and the exerted force to generate it (the torque). Other than that, keep the good work. I love your videos.
A positive caster also help with camber gain during cornering effectively reduce the need for extreme static camber setup and camber gain through up and down movement of a double A arms.
I love these videos that explain the forces at play during racing. Helps me understand more about racing sims, and real life driving. Although the forces are probably less extreme for the type of cars I race in sims and irl... Hopefully someday, with the knowledge I gain from here and other sources, I'll improve with tuning and setting up cars for the sim world and in real life. Thanks Chain Bear for making these educational and entertaining videos. I really appreciate it.
@@DCtropical Front plate is also mandatory where I live (Hungary - EU-member), but I only see this with the rear plate, and only if the bumper is broken. If the front bumper is broken however, then the plate is simply being put away, not behind the windshield. These cars are either resting in garages or heading to a service, the owner in the meantime praying to not get caught by the police.
@@Petidani0330 EU is probably more strict with plates than America or the people are stupider here and put it illegally behind the windshield. But I'm fortunate enough to live in a state that doesn't require a front plate, just back.
Thank you Stu for explaining how to properly set up (i.e. rotate) the tyres along the y-Axis (Camber) and z-Axis (Toe). As we live in 3D space, I thought that it would be helpful to explain what happens if you set up the tyres along the third axis: If you set up the tyres so they rotate towards the front of the car and along the x-axis, you make the car go forward. If you set up the tyres to turn towards the rear of the car, you make the car go backwards. - Thanks for coming to my TED talk.
I SERIOUSLY needed a video like this! I've been p[laying Gran Turismo for years, and I have NEVER been given a clear understanding of how camber is used, how it helps or how I should set it up for racing. THIS, on the other hand, explains EVERYTHING! Thank you, mate! You're a legend! Does this mean you'll now be talking about the caster angle next? (The combined angle of both toe and camber?)
Every time I watch one of Ur videos I’m surprised at how well U explain very technical subjects with ease by using simple (although very time consuming) graphics that really helps comprehension, at least for me. The school systems could learn a few things from U. Thanks for another great video on an easy, yet difficult to explain topic.
It would be a much more complicated and in-depth video, but I'd really like to see one that ties al these subjects together -- camber, toe, suspension, wing setups, etc. It's cool to know how each one works individually, but it would be fun to learn how they all work together or against each other.
Great overall, though I thought there'd be a mention of racing somewhere like Monaco - given the road camber there is pretty extreme, how do F1 teams respond to that? Might they even need *positive* camber to get around sections like the run down to Mirabeau from Casino Square?
Positive camber is reserved only for oval on the left side tires. Given the nature of Monaco and how little tires wear I'd think that you'd see more negative camber than less.
One of the absolute best TH-cam channels out there, educational and fun! Great work and explanation on a really interesting topic. Love f1 and these explanations make it even cooler. 👍🏽👍🏽
Camber also reduces rolling resistance on straights as less rubber hits the road. With the angle you can also manage the temperature between corners. 4:15 shows why your tyres start to wear at the shoulders in normal cars - provided right pressure and a non-granny driving style...
I thought camber just had a very small effect on F1, so didn't really see the need for this video BUT WOW was I wrong Super interesting video and so simplified so I can actually understand I really love your videos dude💜💛
Well informed video well done :) One thing i think you forgot to mention is camber change due to caster when steering :P But lot more info in this than i expected when i saw the video title. Also worth mentioning we are highly likely to see a lot lower cambers when they start running 18" rims as the lower the tyre profile, less "rubber roll over" effect occurs which reduces the need to compensate for it using camber
@@RotchildFrancoisJr Its consequence of the same thing actually. Because of caster, the contact patch moves forward and backwards as you steer the wheels, with that the car changes its roll slightly. Caster essentially makes sure that the axis around which the wheels steer meets the ground in front of the contact patch
Interesting, you covered a few things I hadn't thought off before. Next, could you cover the relationship between caster angle and camber angle. I'm trying to get my head round how more caster induces more camber.
Can teams try out DAS system focusing on camber rather than toe? Pull for positive camber and push for negative camber. Something that can be adjusted based on the dynamics of the track. I believe a neutral camber can give higher top speed on straight line and a negative camber can give higher cornering speed.
4:56 - more important than rubber-elasticity generated force is that tire with axis not paralel to ground works on smaller radius inside than outside (in fact localy at contact ponits, and this is also from elasticity) and behaves like roling cone - rolling not straigth, but on arc. The same effect is more visible on race bikes where heel (similar to camber) angle is very high and the drivers use turning bar almost nothing. At higher speeds they also use drift to turn - but in slow corners - they don't. You can easily check it on bicycle flat corners technique (MTB) wher you turn by heeling bicycla more than turning bar. This is cone effect
Wow that was brilliant, this was the first clip of your’s I’ve watched as was a TH-cam suggestion. Always wondered about this as when I used to dabble in R/C cars you could change the camber and I wondered why. Good work on the clear presentation of this.
Brilliant video and by far the best explanation of tyre camber I've seen. One thing I would like to see (perhaps it's not allowed) is could you then relate these camber settings to specific tracks? Eg Silverstone. Would you set a car up predominantly for Maggotts, Beckett's and Chapel or for the two straights?
6:24 the direction of arrows are wrong. If you're trying to imply that acceleration and deceleration transfers to the tarmac by percentage, use horizontal arrow for acceleration at the center of mass and show that the car will rotate about the rear tyres which induces moment to the center of mass, countering its weight and downforce, and decreasing the load at the front tyres. In F=ma, the direction of the acceleration is the direction of the force. that why in deceleration, since the center of mass is between the tyres, it will generate a moment about the front tyres.. accelerating, rear tyres generate moment at com.. braking, com generates moment at front tyres.
This comment is sponsored by Skillshare. Skillshare is a series of unskippable advertising segments BECAUSE TH-cam DOESN'T ALREADY CARRY ENOUGH ADVERTS so please continue to sit there listening to me talk about Skillshare after skipping several adverts to get here so thankyou to Skillshare without whom this comment would not be possible. Great video, Chainbear.
I've been binge watching your videos recently and it never gets bored. Would love if you post a live commentary with technical details during live or recorded F1 race.
Wow, I thought i knew camber but this video showed me all the different situations where it might not be beneficial, like the braking, as well as suspension setups affecting camber gain. Thanks chain bear!
Man you are killing it, this hjelps so much to setup cars in ACC for example. Do you mind doing a video possibly on preload differential ? I'm struggling to understand what preload and preload differential do
One may arrange camber of left and right tyres differently for clockwise and counter-clockwise circuits differently. Similarly, a mechanical system can be put in place for optimization depending on the direction of the wheel or lateral acceleration without software.
One piece of information that you should mention is camber gain/loss due to steering when the wheels have caster. This alleviates the problem you mentioned with the inside tire in a turn.
Very nice video. But as I remember camber of wheels changes also with steering lock. But it's mostly consideration in drifting cars when opposite lock adds positive camber to outside tire.
Just wanted to note that camber thrust is more than just a small added bonus. Many racing tyres (width and construction does play a part) can actually generate more lateral force with camber high enough to lift the outside of the tyre off the ground even during cornering. Or worded slightly differently, the camber thrust from having more camber can (at least on some racing tyres) give you more lateral grip than having the whole contact patch touching the ground during cornering. This however comes with massive implications to tyre wear, tyre reliability (sudden catastrophic failure before you'd expect it from visible wear), temperature control, and so on. F1 cars would likely run more negative camber during at least during qualifying, but Pirelli specifically has a "max safe camber" spec for their tyres, like they have a "minimum safe pressure" that the teams should not exceed. Some series see a lot more camber than others, the Michelin spec for Porsche Supercup cars had at one point -4.5 degrees as the normal *starting* camber for the tyres, and you could put more on them. The power levels, speeds and loads are much lower in that series than in Formula 1, and the tyre construction is vastly different, so same specs don't apply. Even GT3 is moving to over -4 degrees of camber on many cars these days, when years back they mostly hung around in the -2 to -3 range. A racer I talked to mentioned how they'd experimented with running up to -6 degrees of negative camber, and were still seeing some gains in cornering, but the tyre wear was insane, and the effects on braking were also huge. And in series where you have a strictly limited number of tyre sets for the weekend (varies between series, but common ones I've seen for GT3 include 3 to 5 sets of tyres for the whole weekend, which usually includes 1 or 2 already worn sets from a previous meet, so more like 2 to 4 sets of fresh tyres for practice, qualifying and a 2+ hour race...) you REALLY don't want to ruin a complete set of tyres for the sake of a single lap.
Do you have some actual data of the influence of camber and toe on tire management ? I don't follow F1 but I'm a long time subscriber of yours, which says a lot about the quality of your youtube channel :) keep up the good work.
Great video. But you really should also do one on caster. Toe, camber, caster, Ackerman, bump steer (aka bump toe) etc... all work together, especially in the front end of a car and all effect each other as well.
Is there a mechanism that can change the camber on the fly like how you can change propeller pitch on aircrafts? something that give negative camber in turns but "feathers" the camber to neutral in straights?
If I’m not mistaken F1 also use a lot of negative camber at fast tracks like Monza to help reduce drag with a smaller contact patch they gain a few more MPH at full chat.
For suspensions that increase negative camber with more weight on the wheel, is it allowed to connect the camber of front and rear tires such that any increase in tendency towards negative camber in the front will be countered by a decrease in tendency towards negative camber in the rear and vice versa?
Why do people say that a larger contact patch gives more grip? Friction is only dependent on the coefficient of friction and the perpendicular reaction force, area doesn't affect it. So doesn't contact area only affect overheating and wear?
Looking forward to the video on caster angle, seeing you try to explain "dynamic camber" during cornering will be a treat. Combining static camber with the dynamic camber effects from camber gain on suspension travel and caster (more negative camber on the outside wheel and more positive camber on the inside wheel when wheels are turned) is a fun thing to try and explain to people. A car starting with -3 degrees of camber on the front left and right might well end up with -4.5 on the outside and -1 on the inside during cornering. =)
Good video, when you speak about camber gain, is that not why "complex" suspensions like double wishbone ones are used? So suspension travel doesn´t affect camber. I am speaking about street cars, don´t know if on F1 is different
If you want to see some cars that have an incredible amount of camber on the front end, y’all should look at Dirt Latemodels. Static camber is usually around 7-9 degrees on the right front if I’m not mistaken, and the camber gain is 10+ on the right front. Incredible how those cars work!
allow active suspension (auto camber & toe) setting esp the 2021+ cars are slower - it'd balance that to some level, improves tyre life w/o any downside.
I'd like to see a video where you bring all the different factors together. It's one thing showing camber on a vehicle that is turning but with the wheels still pointing straight ahead however I'd love to see how well you can explain static caster angles dynamically increasing camber angles on turn in.... I know it will be hard to describe but that's why I want to see you do it, if anyone can it's you.
I hope that no one else would have brought this up, but just in case; There is a benefit in having negative camber on a straight - being that the contact patch is smaller, it produces less mechanical drag in the car, increasing speeds. It's not uncommon to see high negative camber in sportscar racing as a result even on the rear tyres -- more mechanical grip in the corners and faster on the straights. It's just the edginess under braking (and increased tyre wear obviously) that stops them running silly levels of camber.
Fun Fact: the old piaggio ape and other old fiats (and probably many other old cars) had positive camber, so that when the vehicle was loaded, it gained more traction and distribuited the weight more evenly. (so if you're willing to race your old piaggio ape in the ancient town street of Italy, make sure you're fully loaded for maximum traction)
Question related to DAS. Does it only changes toe?, shouldn't it be also affecting caster? Does F1/FIA consider that part of the general suspension setup or not?
Great video! I would love to see if you could add practical examples of tracks where different camber/toe settings would be used (e.g. a Monaco set up vs. a Monza set up?)
Wouldn't it be possible to add some linkage to the steering system, causing the wheel to camber in when turned? Like, when you go down a straight, no camber. When turned, camber.
At the 7:21 minute mark, he should have mentioned, on oval track racing, the inside tire is set to a positive camber and that was EVIDENT of the yellow car, at that time frame in the video. As I recall, they didn't start doing this until the early 90s. I do remember asking myself, why DON'T [they] and then, the very next year, seeing IT!
Being a novice in F1, joining only last year, I had failed to notice that F1 cars actually turn, thank you Chain Bear!
Yes, I had the same realization!
Wait, they TURN???!!!111!!11111!
What did you think they just magically turn
@@Crazy_killer-qm8ju it was a joke, mr crazy killer 1112
@Crazy_killer 1112 r/wooosh
“As observant fans may have noticed, F1 cars make turns”
As an observant F1 fan, I can confirm that I too have noticed the cars do make turns.
As a non-observant non F1 fan, this did brought my attention to fact that F1 cars do make turns.
Wtf that's impossible
Sorry everyone i call BS. More fake news spreads to F1. When will we hit bottom.
As observant fans may have noticed, cars accelerate
2015: Mercedes begins to dominate
2020: Mercedes adds dual axis steering
2025: Mercedes adds tri axis steering
I heard Adam Egret stopped working under the queens borough bridge due to concerns over the corona virus, what a shame.
Nice to see you here also :D
From another speed cuber/ norm macdonald fan
@@johannsebastianbach3411 too bad I had just saved up an extra 15 bucks
*2014
2030: Mercedes discovers the fourth dimension
@@23nine 😂😂
As a casual Motorsport fan, these videos really help me understand and appreciate the sport. Well done.
Haas mechanics watching this video: WRITE THAT DOWN, WRITE THAT DOWN!!!
Imagine they’re yelling each other
Ádám Ürmös 🤣🤣
Who smacked my Door!!!!
Lmao
Today it would be the same joke but with Ferrari.
This definitely helps with my knowledge in terms of setups in the F1 games.
Wait until he discusses caster.
Hello, saw you from Ben's stream ahha
@@daylight5085 isnt caster the setting that affects camber gain which he already discussed in this video?
lol no it doesnt, f1 games are really far from simulating anything
@@juliannmnnnm well they do at least do the same things they do in real they're just a lot more forgiving in terms of negative side effects so you often end up able to just max settings out for extra grip and then not get extra tyre wear 🤣
Well, theres no f1 this weekend so this is definitely the next next thing
Well yes, but actually no. There is a online race with real racing drivers also from F1 and some pro gamers planned. They are planning on playing F1 2019 so there actually is a F1 race tommorow with some F1 drivers.
haifishtime is it on twitch? I’m guessing it’s Lando and Verstappen
@@haifishtime ye is there a stream?
@@xavierrodriguez2463 twitch.tv/veloce_esports I think
@@haifishtime where can we watch it?
Hey Chainbear - doesn't the FIA or Perelli govern the amount of camber the teams are allowed to run?
After RBR ran 4.5° at Spa some years ago and they nad some troubles, FIA stepped in and Pirelli now prescribes how much can you have at any track. The same as the pressure.
@@dimitarvenedikov wasn it 2013 Silverstone when they had like 5 blowouts bc of extreme camber and tire pressures?
@@zwartvalk2738 on behalf of Rob, I bow in absolute honour🙇🏽♂️
@@ntst22 Silverstone 13 was even worse: on top of super-low pressures, the teams were putting the rear tyres backwards of the rotational direction. It was because it caused them to get to temp quicker.
Yes, they do. I wrote a longer comment about how the camber thrust is more than just a "small bonus", it is a big effect, and higher negative camber can result in increased cornering forces even when your camber is large enough to reduce the contact patch. It doesn't work for all cars and tyre constructions, but for some, camber thrust can be better than max contact patch. But the tyre durability and tyre wear goes to hell really quickly at the extremes.
You cannot even imagine how GOOD this video is. To put this into some sort of context, just know that I'm 26 years old, I've been into cars since I was like 3 years old, I've been into Sim Racing since a lot of years, but I'm understanding how to tune my car in Racing Sims just now. And all of that (which is a huge step for me, cause I was not capable to even understand the changes the car will suffer from fine tunning the car setup) thanks to this videos you make. Awesome work, as always, have a great day.
These videos really helps understand how to setup cars in racing games, thank you
Have you done any set ups? I'm kind of intimidated to do it on pc2
Well no not really, I’m still bad at setting up cars but this helps
@@tehgusbus2716 suggestion from a fellow who did some setups.
Change one thing at a time into extreme options and see what feels different.
For example, get your spring forces to maximum and try out some laps. Get them to minimum and do a few more laps.
You will see how it compares to the default settings. You can also progressively return to the default to feel when a change is too much =)
Toe is the hardest to get a feel for if you are not particularly fast, like in my case, not as much speed as I would like 😅
Great series of videos. Clear, easy to follow presentation. As someone who's getting started on F1 sim racing, this really helps me understand how to set up parameters. Thank you!
Secretly all the riced out Honda Civics are actually racing gods just waiting to be provoked!
Dan lmao
Brz frs gt86 feels bad
But they usually put all the negative camber in the rear, making it look even more stupid.
@@Sk1ds87 alil front camber can help you on drag racing .a lil rear camber instead can help you in cornering A LITTLE
@@Sk1ds87 they making negativ like they want hit 90 angle turn over 200km/h
Yes, every time Chain Bear upload a video I can get a faster lap time in F1 2019
Stuart, the center of weight of the car doesn't shift under braking/acceleration or cornering; it is in the same place all the time. What you refer to as "load transfer" or "weight transfer" really is a moment of force (torque) generated around the axis of the center of gravity, due to the car's inertia (resistance to change its motion). The position of the center of gravity remains in the same place, otherwise, the moment of force (torque or load transfer) couldn't exist, because there would be no distance between the center of gravity and the exerted force to generate it (the torque).
Other than that, keep the good work. I love your videos.
Vicente Revuelta thank you for explaining this because I noticed this in the video but I don’t feel like explaining it for people lol.
inb4 mercedes comes out with a system to change the camber during race
Soviet Doge *toe
@@lonsos1 bruh
Jeff Louis bruh u stupid
TAS: Triple Axis Steering. Same as TAS (Tool Assisted Speedrun). Coincidence? I think not.
Louis Hamilton Pushes the steering wheel down lmao
A positive caster also help with camber gain during cornering effectively reduce the need for extreme static camber setup and camber gain through up and down movement of a double A arms.
I love these videos that explain the forces at play during racing. Helps me understand more about racing sims, and real life driving. Although the forces are probably less extreme for the type of cars I race in sims and irl... Hopefully someday, with the knowledge I gain from here and other sources, I'll improve with tuning and setting up cars for the sim world and in real life. Thanks Chain Bear for making these educational and entertaining videos. I really appreciate it.
Perfect! Make one about caster and toe in-out, and different suspension settings to increase corner speed / stability
He covered toe already
I will Search this video so, tnx mate!
@@matheuscarissimi3189 It's the video from a few weeks ago, covering the Mercedes DAS system
Caster though would be a good add to this series.
8:17 made me think of Sebastian Buemi's wheels off moment in China 2010.
An excellent description of the mechanical process without getting too foggy with the details, very well done
Bro, I f*cking love your videos explaining every single technical detail. Thanks for making them, huge thumbs up for you!
The production quality of these videos just boggle my mind, keep it up man!
So thats why I see cars on the street with -30° of camber, makes sense
Probably the same people who think that taking the number plate off the front of the car and putting it in their windscreen makes them look cool 🙄
@@Jimplaysdrums I've never seen such thing in my life, where do you live?
@@Petidani0330 its a pretty common thing in places that require a front plate. I've seen it many times in California
@@DCtropical Front plate is also mandatory where I live (Hungary - EU-member), but I only see this with the rear plate, and only if the bumper is broken.
If the front bumper is broken however, then the plate is simply being put away, not behind the windshield. These cars are either resting in garages or heading to a service, the owner in the meantime praying to not get caught by the police.
@@Petidani0330 EU is probably more strict with plates than America or the people are stupider here and put it illegally behind the windshield. But I'm fortunate enough to live in a state that doesn't require a front plate, just back.
Thank you Stu for explaining how to properly set up (i.e. rotate) the tyres along the y-Axis (Camber) and z-Axis (Toe). As we live in 3D space, I thought that it would be helpful to explain what happens if you set up the tyres along the third axis: If you set up the tyres so they rotate towards the front of the car and along the x-axis, you make the car go forward. If you set up the tyres to turn towards the rear of the car, you make the car go backwards.
- Thanks for coming to my TED talk.
I have always respected suspension designers, now I have a new appreciation for their skill..
Your videos are pure gold... Detailed but not too much...
I SERIOUSLY needed a video like this!
I've been p[laying Gran Turismo for years, and I have NEVER been given a clear understanding of how camber is used, how it helps or how I should set it up for racing.
THIS, on the other hand, explains EVERYTHING!
Thank you, mate! You're a legend!
Does this mean you'll now be talking about the caster angle next? (The combined angle of both toe and camber?)
Every time I watch one of Ur videos I’m surprised at how well U explain very technical subjects with ease by using simple (although very time consuming) graphics that really helps comprehension, at least for me.
The school systems could learn a few things from U. Thanks for another great video on an easy, yet difficult to explain topic.
I absolutely love these in-depth, technical videos! Next best thing to Australia this weekend
I love your technical terms, tyres being "smushed" is one of my favourites.
Share this video with haas, they need it
It would be a much more complicated and in-depth video, but I'd really like to see one that ties al these subjects together -- camber, toe, suspension, wing setups, etc. It's cool to know how each one works individually, but it would be fun to learn how they all work together or against each other.
Very comprehensive, this is more than they taught me in automotive school
Great overall, though I thought there'd be a mention of racing somewhere like Monaco - given the road camber there is pretty extreme, how do F1 teams respond to that? Might they even need *positive* camber to get around sections like the run down to Mirabeau from Casino Square?
Positive camber on wheels is almost never useful. Track camber might affect the ideal setup slightly but not that much.
@@ando_lmao Only in off road vehicles is positive camber wanted. And only on front tires at that.
Positive camber is reserved only for oval on the left side tires. Given the nature of Monaco and how little tires wear I'd think that you'd see more negative camber than less.
@Raghav Varma Yes. Forgot
@Raghav Varma a little bit of negative camber in the front is good for drag .camber on the rear is for cornering .
You never seize to amaze me. Absolutely all i needed to know in a short 9 min long video. Will def use this info when simracing.
One of the absolute best TH-cam channels out there, educational and fun! Great work and explanation on a really interesting topic. Love f1 and these explanations make it even cooler. 👍🏽👍🏽
Camber also reduces rolling resistance on straights as less rubber hits the road. With the angle you can also manage the temperature between corners.
4:15 shows why your tyres start to wear at the shoulders in normal cars - provided right pressure and a non-granny driving style...
Videos like this are great for me because it helps me do my tune setups for the time trials in FM 2
I thought camber just had a very small effect on F1, so didn't really see the need for this video BUT WOW was I wrong
Super interesting video and so simplified so I can actually understand
I really love your videos dude💜💛
There is a lot more to camber than I realized. As always, thanks for the great and informative videos!
I binged watched this channel the other day. I am now technical director at Haas.
Another great presentation on a complex area that you made understandable to the common fan....Thanks
Man I've been waiting to learn something about this for a long time! Thank you! 😊 😊 😊
How about that 2019 season review now we have a two month delay? 😉
I don't even race cars nor am I a gear head but this was an incredibly informative video! Kudos!
Well informed video well done :) One thing i think you forgot to mention is camber change due to caster when steering :P But lot more info in this than i expected when i saw the video title.
Also worth mentioning we are highly likely to see a lot lower cambers when they start running 18" rims as the lower the tyre profile, less "rubber roll over" effect occurs which reduces the need to compensate for it using camber
Mikee CZ Is that like when you put full steering lock on a Go Kart and one of the sides gets lower? (Sorry if this doesn’t make sense lol)
@@RotchildFrancoisJr Its consequence of the same thing actually. Because of caster, the contact patch moves forward and backwards as you steer the wheels, with that the car changes its roll slightly. Caster essentially makes sure that the axis around which the wheels steer meets the ground in front of the contact patch
Thanks to Chaibear, I can finally properly tune my cars on Gran Turismo 4
Awesome video. As a novice in such areas, I found it easy to follow and really interesting.
best video on youtube have seen on camber so far.
Interesting, you covered a few things I hadn't thought off before. Next, could you cover the relationship between caster angle and camber angle. I'm trying to get my head round how more caster induces more camber.
Can teams try out DAS system focusing on camber rather than toe? Pull for positive camber and push for negative camber. Something that can be adjusted based on the dynamics of the track. I believe a neutral camber can give higher top speed on straight line and a negative camber can give higher cornering speed.
4:56 - more important than rubber-elasticity generated force is that tire with axis not paralel to ground works on smaller radius inside than outside (in fact localy at contact ponits, and this is also from elasticity) and behaves like roling cone - rolling not straigth, but on arc. The same effect is more visible on race bikes where heel (similar to camber) angle is very high and the drivers use turning bar almost nothing. At higher speeds they also use drift to turn - but in slow corners - they don't. You can easily check it on bicycle flat corners technique (MTB) wher you turn by heeling bicycla more than turning bar. This is cone effect
Wow that was brilliant, this was the first clip of your’s I’ve watched as was a TH-cam suggestion. Always wondered about this as when I used to dabble in R/C cars you could change the camber and I wondered why. Good work on the clear presentation of this.
I've never been to early here 😌 I just waited for Chain Bear to explain this.
Brilliant video and by far the best explanation of tyre camber I've seen. One thing I would like to see (perhaps it's not allowed) is could you then relate these camber settings to specific tracks? Eg Silverstone. Would you set a car up predominantly for Maggotts, Beckett's and Chapel or for the two straights?
Very detailed yet effective and concise description of this topic. Very nice video.
6:24 the direction of arrows are wrong. If you're trying to imply that acceleration and deceleration transfers to the tarmac by percentage, use horizontal arrow for acceleration at the center of mass and show that the car will rotate about the rear tyres which induces moment to the center of mass, countering its weight and downforce, and decreasing the load at the front tyres. In F=ma, the direction of the acceleration is the direction of the force. that why in deceleration, since the center of mass is between the tyres, it will generate a moment about the front tyres.. accelerating, rear tyres generate moment at com.. braking, com generates moment at front tyres.
This comment is sponsored by Skillshare. Skillshare is a series of unskippable advertising segments BECAUSE TH-cam DOESN'T ALREADY CARRY ENOUGH ADVERTS so please continue to sit there listening to me talk about Skillshare after skipping several adverts to get here so thankyou to Skillshare without whom this comment would not be possible.
Great video, Chainbear.
I've been binge watching your videos recently and it never gets bored. Would love if you post a live commentary with technical details during live or recorded F1 race.
Wow, I thought i knew camber but this video showed me all the different situations where it might not be beneficial, like the braking, as well as suspension setups affecting camber gain. Thanks chain bear!
Man you are killing it, this hjelps so much to setup cars in ACC for example.
Do you mind doing a video possibly on preload differential ? I'm struggling to understand what preload and preload differential do
i’m not even a fan of F1, i just love your editing style
One may arrange camber of left and right tyres differently for clockwise and counter-clockwise circuits differently.
Similarly, a mechanical system can be put in place for optimization depending on the direction of the wheel or lateral acceleration without software.
This is the best explanation of camber I've seen
Would it be possible to make a video about driving in the wet, explaining the cause of spins or understeering, and the different trajectories?
Thank you for the info. I had lots of difficulties to fogure that out. I only race OVAL. This info will help me out very much. Thanks again!!!!!
dude your channel is under rated !
One piece of information that you should mention is camber gain/loss due to steering when the wheels have caster. This alleviates the problem you mentioned with the inside tire in a turn.
Very nice video. But as I remember camber of wheels changes also with steering lock. But it's mostly consideration in drifting cars when opposite lock adds positive camber to outside tire.
*Honda Civics in the future:*
-90⁰ camber for hover mode.
Just wanted to note that camber thrust is more than just a small added bonus. Many racing tyres (width and construction does play a part) can actually generate more lateral force with camber high enough to lift the outside of the tyre off the ground even during cornering. Or worded slightly differently, the camber thrust from having more camber can (at least on some racing tyres) give you more lateral grip than having the whole contact patch touching the ground during cornering.
This however comes with massive implications to tyre wear, tyre reliability (sudden catastrophic failure before you'd expect it from visible wear), temperature control, and so on. F1 cars would likely run more negative camber during at least during qualifying, but Pirelli specifically has a "max safe camber" spec for their tyres, like they have a "minimum safe pressure" that the teams should not exceed.
Some series see a lot more camber than others, the Michelin spec for Porsche Supercup cars had at one point -4.5 degrees as the normal *starting* camber for the tyres, and you could put more on them. The power levels, speeds and loads are much lower in that series than in Formula 1, and the tyre construction is vastly different, so same specs don't apply. Even GT3 is moving to over -4 degrees of camber on many cars these days, when years back they mostly hung around in the -2 to -3 range. A racer I talked to mentioned how they'd experimented with running up to -6 degrees of negative camber, and were still seeing some gains in cornering, but the tyre wear was insane, and the effects on braking were also huge. And in series where you have a strictly limited number of tyre sets for the weekend (varies between series, but common ones I've seen for GT3 include 3 to 5 sets of tyres for the whole weekend, which usually includes 1 or 2 already worn sets from a previous meet, so more like 2 to 4 sets of fresh tyres for practice, qualifying and a 2+ hour race...) you REALLY don't want to ruin a complete set of tyres for the sake of a single lap.
Do you have some actual data of the influence of camber and toe on tire management ? I don't follow F1 but I'm a long time subscriber of yours, which says a lot about the quality of your youtube channel :) keep up the good work.
Absolutely bananas content. All hail chain bair
Great video. But you really should also do one on caster. Toe, camber, caster, Ackerman, bump steer (aka bump toe) etc... all work together, especially in the front end of a car and all effect each other as well.
Is there a mechanism that can change the camber on the fly like how you can change propeller pitch on aircrafts? something that give negative camber in turns but "feathers" the camber to neutral in straights?
If I’m not mistaken F1 also use a lot of negative camber at fast tracks like Monza to help reduce drag with a smaller contact patch they gain a few more MPH at full chat.
I had noticed some turns actually! Wasn't sure if my tv was glitching or not, no one seemed to mention them.
For suspensions that increase negative camber with more weight on the wheel, is it allowed to connect the camber of front and rear tires such that any increase in tendency towards negative camber in the front will be countered by a decrease in tendency towards negative camber in the rear and vice versa?
( 7:04 ) Is that what happened to Marcus Ericsson at Monza in 2018?
Why do people say that a larger contact patch gives more grip? Friction is only dependent on the coefficient of friction and the perpendicular reaction force, area doesn't affect it. So doesn't contact area only affect overheating and wear?
Looking forward to the video on caster angle, seeing you try to explain "dynamic camber" during cornering will be a treat. Combining static camber with the dynamic camber effects from camber gain on suspension travel and caster (more negative camber on the outside wheel and more positive camber on the inside wheel when wheels are turned) is a fun thing to try and explain to people. A car starting with -3 degrees of camber on the front left and right might well end up with -4.5 on the outside and -1 on the inside during cornering. =)
Great article. Can you also make a video on why the front of an F1 car does not leave the ground during immense acceleration?
Whats with old (typically 50s) racing cars or single seaters having positive camber tho? That combined with skinny wheels seem unwieldy to drive...
Good video, when you speak about camber gain, is that not why "complex" suspensions like double wishbone ones are used? So suspension travel doesn´t affect camber. I am speaking about street cars, don´t know if on F1 is different
If you want to see some cars that have an incredible amount of camber on the front end, y’all should look at Dirt Latemodels. Static camber is usually around 7-9 degrees on the right front if I’m not mistaken, and the camber gain is 10+ on the right front. Incredible how those cars work!
allow active suspension (auto camber & toe) setting esp the 2021+ cars are slower - it'd balance that to some level, improves tyre life w/o any downside.
I'd like to see a video where you bring all the different factors together. It's one thing showing camber on a vehicle that is turning but with the wheels still pointing straight ahead however I'd love to see how well you can explain static caster angles dynamically increasing camber angles on turn in.... I know it will be hard to describe but that's why I want to see you do it, if anyone can it's you.
I hope that no one else would have brought this up, but just in case; There is a benefit in having negative camber on a straight - being that the contact patch is smaller, it produces less mechanical drag in the car, increasing speeds. It's not uncommon to see high negative camber in sportscar racing as a result even on the rear tyres -- more mechanical grip in the corners and faster on the straights. It's just the edginess under braking (and increased tyre wear obviously) that stops them running silly levels of camber.
Fun Fact: the old piaggio ape and other old fiats (and probably many other old cars) had positive camber, so that when the vehicle was loaded, it gained more traction and distribuited the weight more evenly.
(so if you're willing to race your old piaggio ape in the ancient town street of Italy, make sure you're fully loaded for maximum traction)
you should do a video on balancing caster and camber for an ideal track set up
Question related to DAS.
Does it only changes toe?, shouldn't it be also affecting caster?
Does F1/FIA consider that part of the general suspension setup or not?
stupid question, but why doesn't braking change the mode of suspension temporary to not allow camber gain while under braking?
Couldn't there be a way to create a 'camber differential' attached to the wishbone setup to work optimally through cornering?
Great video! I would love to see if you could add practical examples of tracks where different camber/toe settings would be used (e.g. a Monaco set up vs. a Monza set up?)
Is it possible and ideal for the driver to choose to have positive camber on one side and negative on the other side depending on the corner?
Wouldn't it be possible to add some linkage to the steering system, causing the wheel to camber in when turned? Like, when you go down a straight, no camber. When turned, camber.
Isn't that how it is with normal road cars (from factory)?
Another awesome video! Thanks for doing these, it's really fascinating and helping me to learn setting up cars on my sim racing games
would a dynamic camber system be allowed? (a system which sould change the Camber of the tyres depending on the situation)
Great video. The nuances are amazing.
At the 7:21 minute mark, he should have mentioned, on oval track racing, the inside tire is set to a positive camber and that was EVIDENT of the yellow car, at that time frame in the video. As I recall, they didn't start doing this until the early 90s. I do remember asking myself, why DON'T [they] and then, the very next year, seeing IT!