I like how CGB brought up the concept of "traction". It is very easy to understand card advantage and somewhat easy to understand tempo, but traction is kind of the nexus of these two things. There's raw card advantage, but with modern magic you have a lot of activated abilities and continuous effects that build up advantages and/or otherwise force an opponent to play in a manner that does not allow for them to optimally deploy their resources. Effectively it shaves down any raw card advantage an opponent has if they feel forced to play a creature into a planeswalker minus that will remove it just to slow that planeswalker from an ultimate. Planeswalkers are the best example of this, but any type of permanent or strategy that induces your opponent to deploy their resources in a suboptimal manner (i.e. getting less than full value) could be viewed as gaining traction. I think this is different than straight tempo which effectively is about killing your opponent before they can deploy a game ending threat... In the games we saw here, CGB was grinding out his opponents, but generally doing so with fewer cards in his hand. It was the tag teaming of planeswalkers and recursive sagas that generated the incremental value needed for the drawn out games.
This is a great explaination imo. I think Mtg decks can be divided into 4 categories, depending on how the proactive/reactive and tempo/value categories are paired together: proactive+tempo = aggro, reactive+tempo = tempo, proactive+value = ramp, reactive+value = control. That said, some cards in current Magic are so powerful that these boundaries can get pretty mixed up sometimes.
I was tortured to boredom by a 200 card weird muldrotha wish claw talisman hot potato deck that had a turn 26 curse of overwhelming splendor and had loops with Tamiyo, Wrenn and Seven and inscription tablets. It was so horrible.
Proliferating or removing the ghostform counters doesn't affect the ability Kaya gives the creature. It's just a reminder counter. It also of course counts for things like modified, but you won't affect the ability to create more or less spirits when the creature dies or is exiled.
@@TheStanishStudios thats from kaya using her ability 3 times, the ghostform counters themselves are not what gives the spirit so proliferating them wont make more but multiple uses of her ability will. Even if the counters are removed the trigger will still happen if the creature dies or gets exiled
Also, important to note, as someone who played this commander... A whole lot. The ghostform counters themselves do nothing (except to modify a creature or protect from something like heartless act)(and probably mostly as reminder for paper players) removing the counter does bot remove the ability bestowed by the +1
I played Kaya when she got promoted to hell queue. One day I was slaughtering silly little tribal decks, and killing every commander that ever hit the field. Then the next, I sat with wrath of God and day of judgement in hand while staring down a Niv Reborn.
There is a satisfaction in knowing that, somewhere across the vastness of this planet, there is someone screaming at their screen from the frustration that this deck is causing them. And That why I miss my standard deck from last year. Kaya was a big player in it. SO much exile, I loved it. Might have to try her in brawl like this, tho maybe with a few minor tweaks to fit my wildcard budget.
I think I remember trying Kaya back before she rotated and getting hell queue decks, it doesn't feel fair trying to play a 5-mana orzhov planeswalker into blue decks left and right.
Kaya was my favorite commander in standard brawl, and in my opinion one of the strongest in that rotation, so it doesn't surprise me that she hits the hell queue in historic. She also has the most fun and most viable ultimate.
Yeah, her ult was crazy in standard for me. Had a game where I hit it 3 times, it was an exile/board wipe deck. I just kept rotating my holy trinity of planeswalkers. Kaya, Wandering Emperor and Professor Onyx.
There were also a few cases where you could have plussed Kaya onto a token. You obviously don't get the token in your hand but you do create the spirit when tokens are killed/exiled.
Not to be mean but proliferating the ghostform counters does nothing. The counter is only a reminder and has no meaning. That's why you get the effect even if vorinclex prevents you from putting a counter on your creatures when you +1 on it.
+1: Put a ghostform counter on up to one target nontoken creature. It gains "When this creature dies or is put into exile, return it to its owner's hand and create a 1/1 white Spirit creature token with flying." Ghost form counter is independent of the spirits.
I'll proliferate the ghostform counter if there's something else to proliferate because A: opponent doesn't necessarily know that B: the counters are still counter even though they don't make spirits. There are a few cards that care about presence of counters or number of counters, such as Luxior. Which is a card I do play in my Kaya deck :D
Hey, just wondering because I don’t keep up with the historic meta, but is vraskas contempt not still a good card? It’s on theme and can deal with both creatures and planes walkers. Maybe it’s been owed crept since but seems like an obvious inclusion to me
I played a completely Janky Gargos deck and i constantly got against hell queue commander. Pretty sure when the commander is underplayed you got matched randomly.
I built Sarulf Realm Eater with a similar theme, would be interesting to see a creature based version of this strategy. Definitely not hell queue like Kaya though 😅
"the typical hell queue of..." at 15 minutes discussion. Is there a place where I can learn about how cards are decided at these levels, it's seems like CGB is saying it's common knowledge that MTGA puts you at advantages/disadvantages depending on your deck.
How about you try a white and black life gain/life drain deck? Whenever you gain life your opponent loses life. I've had a lot of luck with a deck like that lately, just don't know enough about mtg to really fine tune it
You probably need to do lessons on how and when Taking extra turns. I know I seen to many waisted extra turn spells to fear the major of them. Keep your hopes up. BWaHAHahahaha
Bro I have been playing allot of mtg arenas lately. Does anyone notice anything wierd about the draws? Particularly with lands? I’ve played multiple games where I crucible early and pull 20 basics out in blue/white.
Is there any evidence that the "hell queue" is something that is manually done? Seems more likely to be it would some sort of algorithm deciding matchups based on existing matchmaking data.
It is well known that if you play a powerful deck, you'll get matched with people who are playing powerful decks. One can test this claim simply by playing a low tier deck. Fun fact: if you build a (non-singleton) deck that has no more than 5 pairs of rare cards, you'll have a lot more fun on Arena from the diversity of opponent archetypes, without significantly compromising deck power (provided that you picked your 5 pairs of rares properly).
Day 12 of asking for a heart... I really do appreciate the content you make here. I don't know if you read this and honestly I don't care if you don't. I heard what you said about the TH-cam comments and it's really sad to hear. People just criticize and don't sit down and appreciate. Just wanted to be one of does extra persons that did. You got me to fall in love with this game. You're a great content creator and you honestly deserve better from this comments. Really regret not meeting in person in Dallas, definitely will try next time you come around.
'This is a control deck without counter spells' The first thing I did wenn I heart this was looking through his deck list for Mana Tith and getting very disepointed wenn I found it...🤨🥴
Don't be fooled by his videos. He gets more losses than you know. He only shows all the times he won. 3 matches he wins. Don't show the other 6 he lost. haha
![💀 MAKE THEM QUIT | Liliana of the Veil Historic Brawl [MTG Arena]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/0VafJGvY9SI/mqdefault.jpg)
![💀 MAKE THEM QUIT | Liliana of the Veil Historic Brawl [MTG Arena]](/img/tr.png)
As both a parent and MTG Arena player, I have never felt more seen than in this intro.
I like how CGB brought up the concept of "traction". It is very easy to understand card advantage and somewhat easy to understand tempo, but traction is kind of the nexus of these two things. There's raw card advantage, but with modern magic you have a lot of activated abilities and continuous effects that build up advantages and/or otherwise force an opponent to play in a manner that does not allow for them to optimally deploy their resources. Effectively it shaves down any raw card advantage an opponent has if they feel forced to play a creature into a planeswalker minus that will remove it just to slow that planeswalker from an ultimate. Planeswalkers are the best example of this, but any type of permanent or strategy that induces your opponent to deploy their resources in a suboptimal manner (i.e. getting less than full value) could be viewed as gaining traction. I think this is different than straight tempo which effectively is about killing your opponent before they can deploy a game ending threat... In the games we saw here, CGB was grinding out his opponents, but generally doing so with fewer cards in his hand. It was the tag teaming of planeswalkers and recursive sagas that generated the incremental value needed for the drawn out games.
This is a great explaination imo. I think Mtg decks can be divided into 4 categories, depending on how the proactive/reactive and tempo/value categories are paired together: proactive+tempo = aggro, reactive+tempo = tempo, proactive+value = ramp, reactive+value = control. That said, some cards in current Magic are so powerful that these boundaries can get pretty mixed up sometimes.
I do hope you'll consider making brawl content between standard plays. This month was a blast.
Big agree. I looked forward to every video!
Orzhov is TIGHT. Favorite color combo. Love it, thank you.
how many times has his niv triggered will never cease to be hilarious, truly cards dont matter when you have so much V A L U E
I love kaya the inexorable but her emblem goes so well with Karn's Temporal Sundering
Pure evil lmao
I was tortured to boredom by a 200 card weird muldrotha wish claw talisman hot potato deck that had a turn 26 curse of overwhelming splendor and had loops with Tamiyo, Wrenn and Seven and inscription tablets. It was so horrible.
*Primevals Glorious Rebirth: has entered chat.*
Best way to start 2023!!! I can never get enough of historic brawl but damn you going off bro!!
Proliferating or removing the ghostform counters doesn't affect the ability Kaya gives the creature. It's just a reminder counter. It also of course counts for things like modified, but you won't affect the ability to create more or less spirits when the creature dies or is exiled.
That’s incorrect, it does create more spirits.
Source: I’m playing against Kaya in Brawl and 3 counters created 3 spirit tokens.
@@TheStanishStudios thats from kaya using her ability 3 times, the ghostform counters themselves are not what gives the spirit so proliferating them wont make more but multiple uses of her ability will. Even if the counters are removed the trigger will still happen if the creature dies or gets exiled
Also, important to note, as someone who played this commander... A whole lot. The ghostform counters themselves do nothing (except to modify a creature or protect from something like heartless act)(and probably mostly as reminder for paper players) removing the counter does bot remove the ability bestowed by the +1
WHATTT
Ah, like the enlightened counter from Book of Exalted Deeds.
That Niv-Misset game was epic! Riveting!!
Good God, seeing Kaya grind that Uro into dust was sooooo satisfying. Wow, counter tribal!? How imaginative!
Hahahaha I loved the Project Runway reference. That was unexpectedly hilarious.
I look forward to your videos every day 😊
35:47 "And the only thing they can do is rebuke"
Ask and you shall receive...
They never don't have it 🤣🤣
CGB: Win without using counter spells!
Mana Tithe: Am I a joke to you?!?
I've been playing Kaya for months in Hell Queue, but my version runs a lot more creatures. She's a lot of fun, glad to see you cover this!
I played Kaya when she got promoted to hell queue. One day I was slaughtering silly little tribal decks, and killing every commander that ever hit the field. Then the next, I sat with wrath of God and day of judgement in hand while staring down a Niv Reborn.
There is a satisfaction in knowing that, somewhere across the vastness of this planet, there is someone screaming at their screen from the frustration that this deck is causing them. And That why I miss my standard deck from last year. Kaya was a big player in it. SO much exile, I loved it. Might have to try her in brawl like this, tho maybe with a few minor tweaks to fit my wildcard budget.
Most notably, the ghostform counter does d*ck all. It just serves as a reminder of the ability gained from Kaya. Proliferating them does nothing.
However you can double up on the abilities
“The Inexorable Nonsense” goes HARD
Cgb: no counterspells in this deck
Mana tithe: Am I joke to you?
I think I remember trying Kaya back before she rotated and getting hell queue decks, it doesn't feel fair trying to play a 5-mana orzhov planeswalker into blue decks left and right.
This was some super entertaining control, didnt know orzhov had it in it. Great deck.
Truly a sweet treat with these games!
Thanks CGB. That was a fun one.
Ah yes, the return of Blood Money, CGB's Special
Man Kaya's been the arch nemesis of my Niv Parun deck
Oh man
Seeing Uro AND Niv getting turned into paste feels great
This was a good one
Kaya was my favorite commander in standard brawl, and in my opinion one of the strongest in that rotation, so it doesn't surprise me that she hits the hell queue in historic. She also has the most fun and most viable ultimate.
Yeah, her ult was crazy in standard for me. Had a game where I hit it 3 times, it was an exile/board wipe deck. I just kept rotating my holy trinity of planeswalkers. Kaya, Wandering Emperor and Professor Onyx.
Playing against you would make me rage quit because of the 20 seconds of overthinking on every play.
There were also a few cases where you could have plussed Kaya onto a token. You obviously don't get the token in your hand but you do create the spirit when tokens are killed/exiled.
It says non token on the +1
“Put a ghostform counter on up to one target nontoken creature”
I felt this intro. That was funny. xD
Nice win over that oppressive Uro deck.
If I wanted to add the new Kaya from ONE, what should be replaced?
Crew says that it becomes a creature until end of turn so it should always turn back into an artifact at the end step
Uro is such a greedy deck lol Glad to see it struggle
That emblem can be so fun. Sadly u need green or blue for that to be even better
Have you done a discard commander yet?
As a man with NO children, I play arena because I enjoy telling grown men NO over a card game. Feels good.
During bridge time in standard Kaya was the go to counter, my personal favorite counter for bridge was jacob tho
Kaya!! The scariest planeswalker in MTG.
All I can think of is Scotty going "I like this ship!" But it's deck instead of ship. I'm a dork
this is a brutal deck!
Confessional: My favorite kinda deck
Minal damage, maximum control with leeching
Not to be mean but proliferating the ghostform counters does nothing. The counter is only a reminder and has no meaning. That's why you get the effect even if vorinclex prevents you from putting a counter on your creatures when you +1 on it.
wrong you still get multiple spirits with multiple counters..
+1: Put a ghostform counter on up to one target nontoken creature. It gains "When this creature dies or is put into exile, return it to its owner's hand and create a 1/1 white Spirit creature token with flying."
Ghost form counter is independent of the spirits.
@@maxkorner3382 If you +1 multiple times on a creature you do get multiple spirits that is correct but proliferating the counters has no effect
@@maxkorner3382 No, you get multiple spirits with multiple Kaya +1 activations.
I'll proliferate the ghostform counter if there's something else to proliferate because
A: opponent doesn't necessarily know that
B: the counters are still counter even though they don't make spirits. There are a few cards that care about presence of counters or number of counters, such as Luxior. Which is a card I do play in my Kaya deck :D
Regarding the queue you got into, i think planeswalkers are elevated a tier. i have an uncommon 3mv pw and it runs into hell queue on occasion.
Hey, just wondering because I don’t keep up with the historic meta, but is vraskas contempt not still a good card? It’s on theme and can deal with both creatures and planes walkers. Maybe it’s been owed crept since but seems like an obvious inclusion to me
Power crept*
33:48 Sweet, thanks CGB. What did I win?
I played a completely Janky Gargos deck and i constantly got against hell queue commander. Pretty sure when the commander is underplayed you got matched randomly.
Pushing the ultimate on kaya
Also: let's put the ghost counter on heart
😭
That was nerve wrecking to watch 😅
I'd like to see what you could make with Kroxa as the commander
I built Sarulf Realm Eater with a similar theme, would be interesting to see a creature based version of this strategy. Definitely not hell queue like Kaya though 😅
"the typical hell queue of..." at 15 minutes discussion. Is there a place where I can learn about how cards are decided at these levels, it's seems like CGB is saying it's common knowledge that MTGA puts you at advantages/disadvantages depending on your deck.
How about you try a white and black life gain/life drain deck? Whenever you gain life your opponent loses life. I've had a lot of luck with a deck like that lately, just don't know enough about mtg to really fine tune it
Would love to see you play Jan chaos crafter.
I have vraska deck that does simular playsyle.
They probably promoted Kaya to Hell Queue because Blood Money was so good for a month or so.
How do you know what queue you're in?
the elderspell would be great in this deck
Should’ve waited for phyrexian kaya. The new kaya seems even tougher. Drain each turn, draw. Cgb would be laughing the whole time
It'll be coming. No way CGB passes up making a HB deck for her.
You probably need to do lessons on how and when Taking extra turns. I know I seen to many waisted extra turn spells to fear the major of them. Keep your hopes up. BWaHAHahahaha
Bro I have been playing allot of mtg arenas lately. Does anyone notice anything wierd about the draws? Particularly with lands? I’ve played multiple games where I crucible early and pull 20 basics out in blue/white.
Yeah, Kaya is broken as a commander. I figured it out early. Ramp, ult Kaya, then run legendary everything.
I will say, I miss Ugin for this deck. Just -7 every turn until your opponent's cry
YOO taking advantage of being early, when do we get to see mommy Marwyn??
33:50 What did I win?
Is there any evidence that the "hell queue" is something that is manually done? Seems more likely to be it would some sort of algorithm deciding matchups based on existing matchmaking data.
It is well known that if you play a powerful deck, you'll get matched with people who are playing powerful decks. One can test this claim simply by playing a low tier deck. Fun fact: if you build a (non-singleton) deck that has no more than 5 pairs of rare cards, you'll have a lot more fun on Arena from the diversity of opponent archetypes, without significantly compromising deck power (provided that you picked your 5 pairs of rares properly).
Kaya nagandaya
I've missed this Kaya ever since the blood money days! Definitely want to try out this deck 🖤🤍
Sadly the brawl videos streak will be over soon
Yeah, I look forward for a few standard videos ofc because early brewing is cool, but damn this Historic Brawl vacation was awesome.
Man, the new prerelease is too expensive
I made it most of the way through the intro before I quit the video? I think I did well
you submitted 0 for kaya's ghostform counter even though you created a free 2/2 zombie using liliana right after. misplay.
KAYAYAYAYAYAYAYAYAYAYAYA
Kayak
*and pepper
No counters, this makes Mana Tithe sad
Should have waited till February for black history month and played the deck then
Day 12 of asking for a heart...
I really do appreciate the content you make here. I don't know if you read this and honestly I don't care if you don't. I heard what you said about the TH-cam comments and it's really sad to hear. People just criticize and don't sit down and appreciate. Just wanted to be one of does extra persons that did.
You got me to fall in love with this game. You're a great content creator and you honestly deserve better from this comments. Really regret not meeting in person in Dallas, definitely will try next time you come around.
💛 for what it's worth yo!
Ive played so much 5 mana kaya hb its so much fun, but i hate paradox engine
'This is a control deck without counter spells' The first thing I did wenn I heart this was looking through his deck list for Mana Tith and getting very disepointed wenn I found it...🤨🥴
Uro/Counter Tribal? Lame...
Don't be fooled by his videos. He gets more losses than you know. He only shows all the times he won. 3 matches he wins. Don't show the other 6 he lost. haha
first :)