A car park straddling over a motorway?!? Pure madness! Fortunately common sense has since prevailed and people realised that motorways can pull double duty and also function as perfectly functional car parks in their own right.
there are a few places where you find car parks or other buildings on top of highways; Thus the car park at Stuttgart Airport is built across highway 8
As a Leeds denizen, I soon learned to travel in the right hand lane when going west - east along the A58M. Not one but two joining slip roads going around a corner. Double jeopardy!
If memory serves (I've not driven round there for about a 10 years but used to be a regular) there is also a speed camera at the end of the second one I think.
I used to commute back that way, joining at the first slip road and you always had to get across immediately to get out of the way of the 2nd slip road. that sucked.
As someone who drives this regularly, I feel you missed the most spicy stuff by going northbound - if you go in that direction you'll encounter such delights as "double slip road surprise" and "mystery bonus road"
And don't forget unexplained roadworks that satnavs can't cope with. In fact Leeds Council must have some spare money considering the amount of roadworks happening. Just what are they doing on the M621? It says "improvements" but they don't appear to be doing anything. At least the barrier replacements on the M1 finished, they were fun, weren't they...
I'm not certain, because the transition point is unclear, but I suspect the double slip road surprise could well be coming with that crowning achievement which is the A64(M).
@@ncot_tech Leeds decided to improve the road network, have new under road services and install all those cycle paths ...at the same time. well done Leeds. BTW, wellington Street is now closed, don't come off the A58 expecting to get to the railway station ... not happening.
Growing up, me and my sister would always shout BIG TUNNEL when going through the Woodhouse tunnel. The game was to shout it for as long as you could, and try and be shouting for the whole length of the tunnel. Whenever I drive through that tunnel now the memory makes me smile
I used to live in Leeds. Just off the A58(M) where it is the A58, the Armley gyratory is the lynchpin of the road network. A collision here can bring the city to a halt.
the hospital is Leeds General Infirmary, which used to be in the city centre, near the railway station (on Infirmary Road) the new wings, Jubilee and Clarendon, were built about the same time as the motorway, and both have easy access to junctions on the motorway, meaning that ambulances can get around the Leeds area very quickly
I used to hate going through the A58M tunnel to exit onto the A61 Northbound. The short slip road was easy to miss, with the inevitable Mercs and Audi's blasting up the inside.
Actually, Mercs are not that bad at all. Most are reasonably-driven. You will find that Kia are the worst brand for bad drivers that think they are above everyone else (even though they are in the worst-designed, ugliest cars in history)
Hard to believe it now that Leeds had great civic pride in calling itself the 'Motorway City of the Seventies', they also constructed an elevated pedestrian “skywalk” to separate pedestrians from motor traffic.
out of all UK cities, it got furthest towards actually completing its urban motorway network; the only missing part was the link between M621 junction 3 and the end of the Inner Ring Road (which was eventually built, to a lower standard, as part of A61, connecting to junction 4 instead - it couldn't take the original route because Crown Point shopping centre had been built right in the way)
@@rileybanks1191having pedestrianated through Leeds for 30 years there has not been any problems as a pedestrian since the early 2000s and the pedestrianisation of Briggate and surrounding roads. Of course for people with disabilities the hayday would have been the late 90s when through traffic was stopped but blue badge parking remained.
Wood house Lane car park IS in the city centre! It’s literally a 2 minute walk to the Merrion Centre. A number of streets were demolished to build the tunnels.
My grandfather's family was from Leeds, and as a young boy I grew up in the 1970s visiting Leeds almost every week with him (and my gran). He'd sometimes drive along the A64M and A58M "under the tunnels" as an alternative route back home (made a change from the dreary A61/Hunslet road) back to the M1. It was even better near Christmas time, as the Christmas lights in Leeds city centre were magical - and just one turnoff from the A58M. Wonderful times. Your video just brought all this back to me after nearly 50 years.
Just noticed in the jeopardy section there is a really battered overhead road sign for the international pool, built right next to the motorway in the brutalist style in the 1960’s, it was a 50m pool but not 50m and a bit that was required to accommodate timing pads for competition. Knocked down 15 years ago, and for most of the intervening period a car park, the site is finally being developed - yet another two high rise buildings and a bit of grass.
Well that makes me feel old. When I was choosing which university to go to, the international pool was one of the main selling points they mentioned at Leeds, along with the Red Route (Europe's second-longest corridor, supposedly) and if I recall correctly, a very long Student Union bar that ran straight through a wooden 'wall' and across the small adjacent newsagent/tuck shop counter. Seems like the only thing they didn't build needlessly enormous was the swimming pool, which was about a quarter-inch too small with the timing pads installed.
The A58(M) is silly. No reasonably proportioned slip roads, jeopardy around every bend, no hardshoulder, no services, lots of rear-end smashes, no refuge in the tunnel if someone breaks down.... I will say, in its defense, that travelling through it at night does feel like you're in a computer game.
It's awkward and weird if you've never driven it before, but out of any major city, it's one of very few that I actually consider it viable to drive in/through the centre. It's a pretty practical layout when you're used to it.
Road planning history, Post apocalyptic infra structure, Brutalist Architecture, Graffiti Galleries, Wetlands from the air. You have outdone yourself Sir! Cheers
So when an electric car fire takes place in Woodhouse lane car park, not only might it close the car park, it may also close the motorway, great result.
Recent car park fires I have seen have been started by internal combustion engines aided by diesel vehicles which spread fire along the ground and modern plastic fuel tanks. Plastic fuel tanks, great idea...
I used to visit my brother in Leeds when he lived there many years ago Those tunnel slip roads were mental at any time of day. Thankfully I was also mental at playing Touring Car PC driving games at the time, so I managed to navigate those tunnels without incident But I'm sure some people close their eyes and just pray when entering that area
As someone who drives into and (thankfully) out of Leeds occasionally but not regularly, I don't think I've ever done it the same way twice. It's like the city planners dropped a bowl of noodles on their original map, and have been endlessly stirring them ever since.
My ‘favourite’ bit is where the A61 goes through the railway arches next to the bus station and the West Yorkshire Playhouse; it’s genuinely difficult to explain and describe through which arch one should drive through to either cross the Aire via Duke Street, towards St James’s or onto Kirkgate.
Jeopardy was coming out of the Woodhouse Lane Car Park on to the A58(M), then taking the RIGHTHAND Motorway exit off the A64(M) on to North Street ! (The slip roads actually overlap now !)
I spent 4 years going back and forth to "Jimmy's" (St James' hospital) so the A58(M)/A64(M) I know only too well ! Watch out for the speed camera in the dip at the bottom of the A64.
@@richardmosley4549 I was lucky. The first time I went that way to Jimmy's I wasn't familiar with the road and knew I had to turn left somewhere at the bottom of York Road, so I wasn't moving quickly & spotted the sneakily sited camera.
The construction is very much like the old A102(M) going down through Hackney to the Blackwall Tunnel... including a tunnel with lane changes in it. And a puddle at the bottom that always freezes in cold weather. On a bend. With diesel in the mix for good measure. It was horrible at m'way speeds but I don't think it's a motorway any more though, they changed it and slapped on a lower speed limit. Also that car park seems like a really good idea if, and only if, there was a frequent bus to and from the city centre. I bet they forgot about that bit.
As a Leeds resident who navigates part of the A58(M) more regularly than I'm comfortable with, I'm surprised you didn't mention the Armley gyratory and the insanity there that somehow seems to mostly work.
@@papalegba6796My brother in law did that feat. Mind you, that was a few years ago and I'd like to think the traffic wasn't as bad. Either that or he and you have a guardian Angel!
Knowing that you have often included historic railways I thought that you might have included the roundhouses (one full one half) that are next to the Armley gyratory which arguably is the western end of the A58M. Both are listed.
Hard to argue that Armley Gyratory is the western end of the A58M when the motorway actually ends a quarter of a mile away, but yes, would have been nice to see the roundhouses
During my time working in IT for Speedyhire in the noughties, I drove over 120,000 miles around the UK and Ireland and I can categorically say the A58M was the worse road of all of them. I'd get a call to visit a depot in Leeds and I'd think, it'd be better to take off and nuke the site from orbit. It's the only way to be sure. Thanks for reminding me that my life is demonstrably better today. :)
Looks like a classic example of a large road intended to help the residents that actually cuts a community in pieces and just ends up adding noise and pollution. That car park reminds me of the 'L' stations here in Chicago placed in the center of a highway. Thanks for the vid.
Excellent video in my neck of the woods, Jon, thank you for showcasing this rather drab city and making it seem almost interesting! I do have a small nit or two to pick and I'm not sure who'd agree, but the car park at the end seems pretty well-placed (at least now) given the sheer number of university buildings and other colleges around that area, not to mention the Leeds City Council building just a short walk away to the South. Once you get to the LCC building and the arena, you're actually at the Merrion Centre shopping area which has a Morrisons and a lot of interesting local history though it is now a shell of its former glory, and it's the top end of Leeds' shopping area. This leads me to the other little nit to pick which is your placement of the Town Centre sign on the satellite image, I would have put it further North and perhaps a little to the East. It's over the train station and all the shops and businesses are to the North and East of it with office parks to the West and South (including Asda's HQ!) But those are two very minor little quibbles and certainly don't detract from the quality of your video, they're just observations from someone who lives in Leeds.
@@AutoShenanigans Perhaps, just as someone who lives in Leeds I thought I could maybe add a little local perspective. Certainly not a criticism of you or your video :) Thank you for the reply!
"concrete wonderland with high wall on either side and post apocalyptic looking bridges with rusty signage"..... OH YES the much loved THREADS vibe you'll find here in the north. Great vid thank you.
I used to work above one of those junctions. Crashes every day or so. The only way to join really is to hit 40mph and hold your nerve. be ready to brake or accelerate. DO NOT stop at the end of the slip road! Oh, and look forwards and backwards at the same time...
I get on the a58 via the 'danger tunnel' each morning and don't find it to bad. Only thing to remember is to join and then try get into the right lane straight away to create space for people joining at the next junction 20 metres up the road
Looks like St Aidans RSPB nature reserve at the end. It’s a bit of a hike from Woodhouse Lane car park… Also, the story I heard a long time ago was the tunnels on the A58(M) were built without proper ventilation on the grounds that it wouldn’t need any thanks to the constant, steady flow of traffic through the tunnel. As it leads to the Armley Gyratory, that seems extraordinarily optimistic.
@@ScottBrown1The channel Adventure Me has a whole video on the river breaking its bank at what is now St Aidans and flooding the mine, and the story of it becoming the nature reserve. I think the excavator gets a mention if I remember rightly.
My son was at uni in Leeds and it was always horrible driving to wherever he was staying. We used that car park on his graduation day (Leeds Arena?) and it is truly unpleasant; probably count yourself lucky that you couldn’t stop. There are many nice things about Leeds as a city but it’s road system is not one of them.
Couple of things, the tunnel held the record as the longest unventilated road tunnel in the European Union for many years. Also if anyone has a copy of "Traffic In Towns" HMSO 1963, I'd have a look at the plans for Leeds. The M1 would have gone straight up through the middle, onwards to Harrogate, and who knows the M62 could have come into Leeds, and Leeds would have had a huge inner city junction too, an interesting "what if". I'd also mention the generating station for the Hospital and University partly straddles the tunnels too.
Was the Buchanan Report (Traffic in Towns) pro or anti road building? Not always easy to understand. I’ll have to actually read my old paperback copy…. (Before my time, but with the Beeching Report pretty seminal).
Years ago I used took Headingley Lane slip road, joining A58M for just about 50 yds, leaving by right lane slip road to North St. Only motorway in UK allowing such madness. In an old Renault 4 it took some focus. Soundtrack: Desmond Dekker& Israelites (oo-oo me ears are alight)
I used that car park just the other week when I went to the First Direct Arena, it was only 5 minutes away by foot. I thought it was amusing that I entered it from the Motorway on the ground floor but exited on something like the 5th or 6th floor.
So's Sheffield, Manchester and Liverpool. Leeds is pretty bad though you get finally through a set of lights after waiting through 2 or 3 changes only to have to stop a few meters on at another set.
Great video! I always wondered what year the Inner Ring Road as it’s known was first built. I remember going in school trips in the late 70s and early 80s to the NRM in York and to Harewood House. We passed through Leeds and they’ve A58 (M) tunnels and they’ve not changed at all since then; apart from the lighting.
I watched the clock being lowered onto the YEP building via helicopter from Telephone House which you can see to the left of the Westgate roundabout. My dad worked for PO Telephones #goodolddays
I use the Woodhouse lane car park regularly, it used to be the cheapest car park in Leeds because of the distance from the centre. Since the First Direct Arena was built it's no longer the cheapest. Such an easy car park to get to when coming into Leeds from the Headingley side.
An excellent video John, about an 'excellent' motorway. It's terrifying to enter it from any of the slip roads: you come down the ramp blind at 50mph, then have to make a split-second decision on whether to continue or brake as you get last second visibility of the traffic in lane 1. I believe the whole motorway has a 50mph speed limit as an attempt to counter the very short slip roads. Interestingly, my brother in law got a ticket as a learner for continuing from the A64 on to the A58M motorway, his supervising dad also got a ticket for aiding and abetting 🙂
Rumour has it, that the LGI's Clarendon wing, that sits atop the tunnel, also extends beneath it via service corridors...., also of note that said tunnels are a little lower than the norm.. this has led to somewhat taller loads getting stuck, for quite some time, there was a long scrape in the roof of the eastbound tunnel, where an excavator 'left it's mark' . . . .
Woodhouse Lane Car Park has that amazing slip road which leaves it more than halfway up, and takes traffic back down the side of it. So even if you're on one of the lower levels, it's best to go *up* a few levels to leave it - especially if you're Skipton-bound.
I will now forever call that sliproad ‘Jeopardy point’ whenever some fecker suddenly appears next to me wanting to merge into my lane and causing me to mildly soil my pants.. which happens a lot in my line of work. Thanks Jon 😊
Great video as always Jon. Woodhouse Tunnel was where I took my Sierra Sapphire RS Cosworth in the early 90s on the day I'd had a 4" diameter exhaust system fitted in order to drive through with all of the windows down (during my 'hooligan' days 😆). Sounded fantastic 🤩🔊🔊🔊. That was when it was just the A64 of course 😉
20 years later but that's where I regularly took my saxo VTS after I had it decatted and fitted with a full stainless system 😅 Can do a full run right up to elland road and then back again for more fun. 😊
In order to get to this other tunnel from the A58 you have to leave the A58 (which otherwise leads you straight to the A58(M)) onto the A65 northbound, then immediately turn right on the roundabout, which is the A58, leading you onto the A65 southbound which, as you leave the roundabout, becomes the A58 again. And who said Leeds city road planners didn't know what they were doing?
Fun fact: my cam belt snapped as I was coming off the A58M at Woodhouse Lane. It was damned inconvenient, but in fairness Citroen did replace the entire engine under warranty. So not all bad.
I used to park in Woodhouse Lane Car park before I went to my old work space. After 8am, no chance of a spot. look forward to the A64M with the other half 😂😂.
2:11 And what about that block of flats surrounded by road!!! It must be so noisy living there and trying to walk out the front door to a dangerous crossing
Another good video - thanks for posting! It seems odd to me that in Yorkshire we have the A58M and in Lancashire the M58. Admitedly the two are miles apart but you would have thought that someone would have chosen a different number for one of them?
Motorways often take the number of the A road they were built to replace. I'm not certain but it looks like the M58 could have been designed to give M6 southbound traffic a better route to Liverpool than turning off at Ashton in Makerfield and taking the A58 which was probably the original main route. Like the M62 providing a better transpennine route than the A62, so taking that number.
Multi storey car parks on motorways would be so good for car sharing/car pooling. So many times I need to meet colleagues for an onward journey - we could all just meet up on the motorway, park and take one car for the rest of the journey.
Great video, some great memories. My Dad worked for the Evening Post, in the late 70s, the teatime sister of the Yorkshire Post, so I went in a few times, and enjoyed the hot chocolate from the vending machine (I was a kid, don't judge me!). The building may have been iconic, but it was essentially just another brutalist monstrosity (although it's never going to be as reviled as City House, above the station...) Couple of interesting points to have a think about... The day before the A58(M) opened, members of the public were invited to walk along its length. There are photos of families having an outing strolling along the road inside the tunnel just north of the Westgate junction. And, on a darker note, the car park that straddles the road on Woodhouse Lane was always a popular choice for people to end their lives by suicide (I knew one of them). I remember walking home from town one day and seeing a splash of red and thinking it was bizarre that someone would throw paint down the side. When I got home and saw the local news, I realised it wasn't paint.
Come off it, the Woodhouse Lane car park is on the north edge of the city centre. You showed that it's about a mile from the south edge. It's like 5-10 min walk from all the major shopping streets: very convenient!
I know nothing about nor have ever been to Leeds, but the Yorkshire Post building seems to be heritage worthy. It looks like it could have been repurposed. Why on earth was it demolished?
the building, and the paper were both S***e.... you could have cured the buildings concrete and design issues, dealing with the pathetic advertising rag that was the Yorkshire Evening post, however, was ( is) still a problem.
I don't know if I've got some sort of specifically Leeds related blind spot, but I find the roads and M-ways of Leeds incredibly bewildering! I try to plan a route on the map but it just looks impossible! I'm normally quite good at navigating, but not in Leeds!
Before the Woodhouse tunnel was opened to traffic the council and construction company held a lavish meal in the tunnel with long tables and chairs and waiter service for very special invited guests and some of the local people who had been displaced from their houses when they were demolished to enable the construction to go ahead
Lol, I wonder if the guys building the tunnel were invited. It always strikes me as an insult when new buildings have an 'openning' event with drinks and buns for all the new staff etc. but the guys who just spent 2 years building the thing from nothing up don't even get an invite and what treatment would they get if they were invited and actually turned up? 😂
You missed the most confusing part for people not familiar with this road. If you're travelling in the opposite direction and you merge under this car park the slip runs off and back on again. It panics all visitors ("oh I've missed my turn") and causes a lot of hasty moving over.
Ha ha! I frequently used to shout at people changing lanes in a state of panic! “Stay in your blooming lane!” Mind you, like you said, it’s not obvious. I usually take the left hand lane as it means you buy more time to plan your merge… 😂
You should do secrets of the Cypriot motorways, they’re built to similar(ish) standards and as this is your job you could probably claim the tax back on a summer holiday 😁👍
I always pass the danger tunnel slip road in lane 2 because of the amount of accidents I've seen. The amount of spazzmanger passing it in lane 1 and at stupid speeds is mind-blowing, they either don't know the area or are just donkeydumb 🤦🏻♂️
Ah, my old neck of the woods. The A58M has one of those delightful exit ramps from the outside lane shenanigans, which are thankfully rare! That Jeopardy slip road is great, especially at peak times when no b@stard will ever yield or merge in turn. The best way to approach it is to just shut your eyes and hope for the best. [Disclaimer: not really] I once tried to use the Westgate car park and missed the entry slip road. It took me 99 years to go around the ridiculously complicated one way system to get to it. The exit from that car park is off the top floor, which is entertaining! Weeeeeee………..
I have never successfully driven to the Woodhouse Lane car park. I've tried, oh I've tried, but I always end up taking a mis-step somewhere and usually get redirected back on to the A58M. I think it's protected by Douglas Adams' SEP field.
This has to be the most intense stretch of motorway I’ve ever driven. I remember driving it for the first time when I was a student in Leeds, and what a nightmare it was. It was like nothing I’d ever experienced before. Inevitably missed my exit. However after a number of years you got used to it, and you became a nutter like everyone else. 🤣
A car park straddling over a motorway?!? Pure madness! Fortunately common sense has since prevailed and people realised that motorways can pull double duty and also function as perfectly functional car parks in their own right.
The A58M is generally a car park between 4pm and 6pm most weekdays
Yeah motorways are car parks but regards to common sense prevails i wouldn't go that far mate, motorists and common sense never happens
there are a few places where you find car parks or other buildings on top of highways; Thus the car park at Stuttgart Airport is built across highway 8
Someone drove into the rear of my car on the JEOPARDY section. Well named.
I bet they were an illegal immigrant with no insurance huh?
@@samholdsworth420 It happened years ago and he was fully insured
As a Leeds denizen, I soon learned to travel in the right hand lane when going west - east along the A58M. Not one but two joining slip roads going around a corner. Double jeopardy!
Same here 😁
If memory serves (I've not driven round there for about a 10 years but used to be a regular) there is also a speed camera at the end of the second one I think.
I used to commute back that way, joining at the first slip road and you always had to get across immediately to get out of the way of the 2nd slip road. that sucked.
Glad you managed to get the best bit of Leeds within shot. Many don't realise that it takes many skilled man hours to get that post apocalyptic look.
As someone who drives this regularly, I feel you missed the most spicy stuff by going northbound - if you go in that direction you'll encounter such delights as "double slip road surprise" and "mystery bonus road"
And don't forget unexplained roadworks that satnavs can't cope with. In fact Leeds Council must have some spare money considering the amount of roadworks happening. Just what are they doing on the M621? It says "improvements" but they don't appear to be doing anything. At least the barrier replacements on the M1 finished, they were fun, weren't they...
I'm not certain, because the transition point is unclear, but I suspect the double slip road surprise could well be coming with that crowning achievement which is the A64(M).
@@ncot_tech The M621 ‘improvement’ is a 2 year project
@@ncot_tech Leeds decided to improve the road network, have new under road services and install all those cycle paths ...at the same time.
well done Leeds.
BTW, wellington Street is now closed, don't come off the A58 expecting to get to the railway station ... not happening.
Growing up, me and my sister would always shout BIG TUNNEL when going through the Woodhouse tunnel. The game was to shout it for as long as you could, and try and be shouting for the whole length of the tunnel. Whenever I drive through that tunnel now the memory makes me smile
I used to live in Leeds. Just off the A58(M) where it is the A58, the Armley gyratory is the lynchpin of the road network. A collision here can bring the city to a halt.
Yeah it's astounding just how much the gyratory can ruin your day 😂
the hospital is Leeds General Infirmary, which used to be in the city centre, near the railway station (on Infirmary Road)
the new wings, Jubilee and Clarendon, were built about the same time as the motorway, and both have easy access to junctions on the motorway, meaning that ambulances can get around the Leeds area very quickly
Nobody in a vehicle can get around Leeds quickly. It's a nightmare.
@@dopiaza2006
*_"Nobody in a vehicle can get around Leeds quickly."_*
Ambulances have special privileges, you berk!
{:o:O:}
@@ansfridaeyowulfsdottir8095 It doesn't matter what privileges you have when leeds council have created traffic jams everywhere.
I used to hate going through the A58M tunnel to exit onto the A61 Northbound. The short slip road was easy to miss, with the inevitable Mercs and Audi's blasting up the inside.
Why is it always an Audi? Question. Are you a wanker so buy an Audi or buy an Audi and become a wanker?
Joining the A58M is way worse than getting off it!
Why is is always Mercs and Audis (and BMWs)? 😆
Actually, Mercs are not that bad at all. Most are reasonably-driven. You will find that Kia are the worst brand for bad drivers that think they are above everyone else (even though they are in the worst-designed, ugliest cars in history)
Hard to believe it now that Leeds had great civic pride in calling itself the 'Motorway City of the Seventies', they also constructed an elevated pedestrian “skywalk” to separate pedestrians from motor traffic.
out of all UK cities, it got furthest towards actually completing its urban motorway network; the only missing part was the link between M621 junction 3 and the end of the Inner Ring Road (which was eventually built, to a lower standard, as part of A61, connecting to junction 4 instead - it couldn't take the original route because Crown Point shopping centre had been built right in the way)
And now Leeds hates motorists!
@@youbencowell Good.
@@youbencowell you mean they made the city center usable for anyone that isn't a driver?
@@rileybanks1191having pedestrianated through Leeds for 30 years there has not been any problems as a pedestrian since the early 2000s and the pedestrianisation of Briggate and surrounding roads. Of course for people with disabilities the hayday would have been the late 90s when through traffic was stopped but blue badge parking remained.
Wood house Lane car park IS in the city centre! It’s literally a 2 minute walk to the Merrion Centre. A number of streets were demolished to build the tunnels.
My grandfather's family was from Leeds, and as a young boy I grew up in the 1970s visiting Leeds almost every week with him (and my gran). He'd sometimes drive along the A64M and A58M "under the tunnels" as an alternative route back home (made a change from the dreary A61/Hunslet road) back to the M1. It was even better near Christmas time, as the Christmas lights in Leeds city centre were magical - and just one turnoff from the A58M. Wonderful times. Your video just brought all this back to me after nearly 50 years.
Happy memories :)
"Things just happen" is an apt appraisal of the A58M.
I don't even like motorways or cars, I could just listen to John talk about pretty much anything and I'd listen
mind you, I have to play the video at 75% speed to catch everything he says. Not a complaint, it's just easier to listen to.
Just noticed in the jeopardy section there is a really battered overhead road sign for the international pool, built right next to the motorway in the brutalist style in the 1960’s, it was a 50m pool but not 50m and a bit that was required to accommodate timing pads for competition. Knocked down 15 years ago, and for most of the intervening period a car park, the site is finally being developed - yet another two high rise buildings and a bit of grass.
Well that makes me feel old. When I was choosing which university to go to, the international pool was one of the main selling points they mentioned at Leeds, along with the Red Route (Europe's second-longest corridor, supposedly) and if I recall correctly, a very long Student Union bar that ran straight through a wooden 'wall' and across the small adjacent newsagent/tuck shop counter. Seems like the only thing they didn't build needlessly enormous was the swimming pool, which was about a quarter-inch too small with the timing pads installed.
I didn't realise that the International Pool had gone.
The A58(M) is silly. No reasonably proportioned slip roads, jeopardy around every bend, no hardshoulder, no services, lots of rear-end smashes, no refuge in the tunnel if someone breaks down.... I will say, in its defense, that travelling through it at night does feel like you're in a computer game.
I used to go to Leeds for work, it was terrible to drive through, now I can understand a bit more of the problem.
At one point it was nicknamed Circle City because getting lost was easy..
It's awkward and weird if you've never driven it before, but out of any major city, it's one of very few that I actually consider it viable to drive in/through the centre. It's a pretty practical layout when you're used to it.
Road planning history, Post apocalyptic infra structure, Brutalist Architecture, Graffiti Galleries, Wetlands from the air. You have outdone yourself Sir! Cheers
Nice one, thanks for watching!
Which wetlands was it? I was thinking Rodley but I wasn’t sure?
So when an electric car fire takes place in Woodhouse lane car park, not only might it close the car park, it may also close the motorway, great result.
Recent car park fires I have seen have been started by internal combustion engines aided by diesel vehicles which spread fire along the ground and modern plastic fuel tanks.
Plastic fuel tanks, great idea...
I used to visit my brother in Leeds when he lived there many years ago
Those tunnel slip roads were mental at any time of day. Thankfully I was also mental at playing Touring Car PC driving games at the time, so I managed to navigate those tunnels without incident
But I'm sure some people close their eyes and just pray when entering that area
As someone who drives into and (thankfully) out of Leeds occasionally but not regularly, I don't think I've ever done it the same way twice. It's like the city planners dropped a bowl of noodles on their original map, and have been endlessly stirring them ever since.
The road layout is bizarre in places!
shit ... that spot on.
My ‘favourite’ bit is where the A61 goes through the railway arches next to the bus station and the West Yorkshire Playhouse; it’s genuinely difficult to explain and describe through which arch one should drive through to either cross the Aire via Duke Street, towards St James’s or onto Kirkgate.
Ha ! Last month I was driving out and followed my wife's instruction to use the 'left arch' "NO, NOT THAT ONE, THE OTHER LEFT ONE"...
Jeopardy was coming out of the Woodhouse Lane Car Park on to the A58(M), then taking the RIGHTHAND Motorway exit off the A64(M) on to North Street ! (The slip roads actually overlap now !)
I spent 4 years going back and forth to "Jimmy's" (St James' hospital) so the A58(M)/A64(M) I know only too well !
Watch out for the speed camera in the dip at the bottom of the A64.
That bastard camera got me once. Never again. If you happen to be behind some twat in a van doing about 28mpm near there, it's probably me.
@@richardmosley4549 I was lucky. The first time I went that way to Jimmy's I wasn't familiar with the road and knew I had to turn left somewhere at the bottom of York Road, so I wasn't moving quickly & spotted the sneakily sited camera.
So many memories of travelling the A58(M) to my Nanna’s. There was ALWAYS a single shoe on the entrance to the Woodhouse tunnel, ALWAYS, strange!
The construction is very much like the old A102(M) going down through Hackney to the Blackwall Tunnel... including a tunnel with lane changes in it. And a puddle at the bottom that always freezes in cold weather. On a bend. With diesel in the mix for good measure. It was horrible at m'way speeds but I don't think it's a motorway any more though, they changed it and slapped on a lower speed limit.
Also that car park seems like a really good idea if, and only if, there was a frequent bus to and from the city centre. I bet they forgot about that bit.
They should have a cable car.
@@paulsengupta971"weeeeeeeeeeeee" into the city centre 😂😂😂
It's actually only 5-10 min walk to the centre.
As a Leeds resident who navigates part of the A58(M) more regularly than I'm comfortable with, I'm surprised you didn't mention the Armley gyratory and the insanity there that somehow seems to mostly work.
I used to live in Hunslet and work in Bradford. This meant I enjoyed driving around the Armley gyratory twice a day. Such fun! 😂
Armley Gyratory is quarter of a mile from the A58M though, the motorway doesn't reach it, so guess that's why it doesn't get a mention
You should try cycling round it 😂
@@papalegba6796My brother in law did that feat. Mind you, that was a few years ago and I'd like to think the traffic wasn't as bad. Either that or he and you have a guardian Angel!
@@papalegba6796 nobody should try cycling around it. Do you really want to die so soon?
jeopardy indeed! I hate that junction - love these vids!
3:00 these signs are most likely oldest signs on motorway system to survive as they are original to 1967 opening
I've often thought that. I like those crusty old signs.
Well my Sunday is definitely complete now, a brand new Dr Who episode, and a Secrets of The Motorway episode.
Knowing that you have often included historic railways I thought that you might have included the roundhouses (one full one half) that are next to the Armley gyratory which arguably is the western end of the A58M. Both are listed.
Hard to argue that Armley Gyratory is the western end of the A58M when the motorway actually ends a quarter of a mile away, but yes, would have been nice to see the roundhouses
During my time working in IT for Speedyhire in the noughties, I drove over 120,000 miles around the UK and Ireland and I can categorically say the A58M was the worse road of all of them. I'd get a call to visit a depot in Leeds and I'd think, it'd be better to take off and nuke the site from orbit. It's the only way to be sure. Thanks for reminding me that my life is demonstrably better today. :)
Looks like a classic example of a large road intended to help the residents that actually cuts a community in pieces and just ends up adding noise and pollution. That car park reminds me of the 'L' stations here in Chicago placed in the center of a highway. Thanks for the vid.
Excellent video in my neck of the woods, Jon, thank you for showcasing this rather drab city and making it seem almost interesting!
I do have a small nit or two to pick and I'm not sure who'd agree, but the car park at the end seems pretty well-placed (at least now) given the sheer number of university buildings and other colleges around that area, not to mention the Leeds City Council building just a short walk away to the South. Once you get to the LCC building and the arena, you're actually at the Merrion Centre shopping area which has a Morrisons and a lot of interesting local history though it is now a shell of its former glory, and it's the top end of Leeds' shopping area. This leads me to the other little nit to pick which is your placement of the Town Centre sign on the satellite image, I would have put it further North and perhaps a little to the East. It's over the train station and all the shops and businesses are to the North and East of it with office parks to the West and South (including Asda's HQ!)
But those are two very minor little quibbles and certainly don't detract from the quality of your video, they're just observations from someone who lives in Leeds.
Yes, where he had the 'city centre' on the map was actually south of the train station.
Fair enough, I think I overestimated the distance to town centre.
@@AutoShenanigans Perhaps, just as someone who lives in Leeds I thought I could maybe add a little local perspective. Certainly not a criticism of you or your video :)
Thank you for the reply!
"concrete wonderland with high wall on either side and post apocalyptic looking bridges with rusty signage"..... OH YES the much loved THREADS vibe you'll find here in the north. Great vid thank you.
I used to work above one of those junctions. Crashes every day or so. The only way to join really is to hit 40mph and hold your nerve. be ready to brake or accelerate. DO NOT stop at the end of the slip road! Oh, and look forwards and backwards at the same time...
I get on the a58 via the 'danger tunnel' each morning and don't find it to bad. Only thing to remember is to join and then try get into the right lane straight away to create space for people joining at the next junction 20 metres up the road
It’s perfectly fine compared with what’s happened to the ‘loop’ road. It’s still signposted from by the YP tower but good luck following it.
As a former resident of Leeds, I got lost on that loop so many times! “I thought you knew Leeds!” Me: “So did I!”
Looks like St Aidans RSPB nature reserve at the end. It’s a bit of a hike from Woodhouse Lane car park…
Also, the story I heard a long time ago was the tunnels on the A58(M) were built without proper ventilation on the grounds that it wouldn’t need any thanks to the constant, steady flow of traffic through the tunnel. As it leads to the Armley Gyratory, that seems extraordinarily optimistic.
Constant steady flow of traffic? That's nice!
Too funny
Let's hope for a special video on that enormous excavator thing at St Aiden's
@@ScottBrown1The ‘Oddball’
@@ScottBrown1The channel Adventure Me has a whole video on the river breaking its bank at what is now St Aidans and flooding the mine, and the story of it becoming the nature reserve. I think the excavator gets a mention if I remember rightly.
12 min, nearly a thousand views, about vehicle infrastructure I've never driven on; genius art in Action. Thank you! [Jeopardy!]
It's only 5 min. What did you do for the extra 7 minutes?
Edit: I guess you meant posted 12 min ago at that time.
@@Species1571 I watched it 12 minutes after publication. Check the time references. ;)
I need to make it my life's mission to shout JEOPARDY! every time I drive that section of the motorway. 😂
Love the video, we went from Yorkshire TV, to Secrets of the Motorway, to Get Ready for ITV. What an amazing piece of music. Loved the episode too
I love the construction of your content. Well researched, well written and wittily presented.
"Jeopardy!" 😂
My son was at uni in Leeds and it was always horrible driving to wherever he was staying. We used that car park on his graduation day (Leeds Arena?) and it is truly unpleasant; probably count yourself lucky that you couldn’t stop. There are many nice things about Leeds as a city but it’s road system is not one of them.
That slip road to join Westerly at Wellington Street Junction is fun if you're in the right hand lane.
I have heard of double jeopardy, but that was on on another scale. Brilliant, inspirational, exemplary, these are words.
Couple of things, the tunnel held the record as the longest unventilated road tunnel in the European Union for many years. Also if anyone has a copy of "Traffic In Towns" HMSO 1963, I'd have a look at the plans for Leeds. The M1 would have gone straight up through the middle, onwards to Harrogate, and who knows the M62 could have come into Leeds, and Leeds would have had a huge inner city junction too, an interesting "what if".
I'd also mention the generating station for the Hospital and University partly straddles the tunnels too.
I've struggled to find those old motorway plans as yes, I'm lead to believe the M1 would have been very different!
Was the Buchanan Report (Traffic in Towns) pro or anti road building? Not always easy to understand. I’ll have to actually read my old paperback copy…. (Before my time, but with the Beeching Report pretty seminal).
2:54
Seems to have the same concrete loveliness as the Coventry ring road.
Years ago I used took Headingley Lane slip road, joining A58M for just about 50 yds, leaving by right lane slip road to North St. Only motorway in UK allowing such madness. In an old Renault 4 it took some focus. Soundtrack: Desmond Dekker& Israelites (oo-oo me ears are alight)
At that point it’s the A64(M) just to add even more confusion!
Thanks
Cheers John. I use it every day I work.
When John says "enjoy the rest of your week" and it's exactly 11:59 pm on a Sunday. Dang!^^
I used that car park just the other week when I went to the First Direct Arena, it was only 5 minutes away by foot. I thought it was amusing that I entered it from the Motorway on the ground floor but exited on something like the 5th or 6th floor.
I deliver around Leeds quite often.
Their road network is abysmal.
The end.
So's Sheffield, Manchester and Liverpool. Leeds is pretty bad though you get finally through a set of lights after waiting through 2 or 3 changes only to have to stop a few meters on at another set.
Great video! I always wondered what year the Inner Ring Road as it’s known was first built. I remember going in school trips in the late 70s and early 80s to the NRM in York and to Harewood House. We passed through Leeds and they’ve A58 (M) tunnels and they’ve not changed at all since then; apart from the lighting.
Having been to Leeds many times, this 'motorway' always feels like a dual carriageway that's been painted blue.
Hello Uncle Jon 🙋♂I have had an average week, thanks for asking. I hope you had a good week 👍
I watched the clock being lowered onto the YEP building via helicopter from Telephone House which you can see to the left of the Westgate roundabout. My dad worked for PO Telephones #goodolddays
I use the Woodhouse lane car park regularly, it used to be the cheapest car park in Leeds because of the distance from the centre. Since the First Direct Arena was built it's no longer the cheapest. Such an easy car park to get to when coming into Leeds from the Headingley side.
I wish you a great week!
Thanks a lot mate hope you are well!
David Dunas will be happy. 1989s "Get Ready for ITV". Another £1 in his pocket
That's Lord Dundas of Blue Jeans and Fourscore to you.
Bum, bum, bum-bum.
An excellent video John, about an 'excellent' motorway. It's terrifying to enter it from any of the slip roads: you come down the ramp blind at 50mph, then have to make a split-second decision on whether to continue or brake as you get last second visibility of the traffic in lane 1. I believe the whole motorway has a 50mph speed limit as an attempt to counter the very short slip roads. Interestingly, my brother in law got a ticket as a learner for continuing from the A64 on to the A58M motorway, his supervising dad also got a ticket for aiding and abetting 🙂
It's a 40 mph limit - that may be your problem!
@@dopiaza2006 forgive me, it's a few years since I've been on that motorway 🙂 Perhaps it used to be 50 or, more likely, I mis-remembered it!
I was born in Yorkshire 1980 and i can just about remember that ITV splash screen, that was a dusty old memory wow.
Rumour has it, that the LGI's Clarendon wing, that sits atop the tunnel, also extends beneath it via service corridors...., also of note that said tunnels are a little lower than the norm.. this has led to somewhat taller loads getting stuck, for quite some time, there was a long scrape in the roof of the eastbound tunnel, where an excavator 'left it's mark' . . . .
Correct hence why the 1980s extension is going as its sinking
If you want to see truly dangerous motorway tunnels, go and have a look at the A167(M) through Newcastle.
Woodhouse Lane Car Park has that amazing slip road which leaves it more than halfway up, and takes traffic back down the side of it. So even if you're on one of the lower levels, it's best to go *up* a few levels to leave it - especially if you're Skipton-bound.
I will now forever call that sliproad ‘Jeopardy point’ whenever some fecker suddenly appears next to me wanting to merge into my lane and causing me to mildly soil my pants.. which happens a lot in my line of work. Thanks Jon 😊
Great video as always Jon. Woodhouse Tunnel was where I took my Sierra Sapphire RS Cosworth in the early 90s on the day I'd had a 4" diameter exhaust system fitted in order to drive through with all of the windows down (during my 'hooligan' days 😆). Sounded fantastic 🤩🔊🔊🔊. That was when it was just the A64 of course 😉
20 years later but that's where I regularly took my saxo VTS after I had it decatted and fitted with a full stainless system 😅
Can do a full run right up to elland road and then back again for more fun. 😊
In order to get to this other tunnel from the A58 you have to leave the A58 (which otherwise leads you straight to the A58(M)) onto the A65 northbound, then immediately turn right on the roundabout, which is the A58, leading you onto the A65 southbound which, as you leave the roundabout, becomes the A58 again.
And who said Leeds city road planners didn't know what they were doing?
Fun fact: my cam belt snapped as I was coming off the A58M at Woodhouse Lane. It was damned inconvenient, but in fairness Citroen did replace the entire engine under warranty. So not all bad.
I used to park in Woodhouse Lane Car park before I went to my old work space. After 8am, no chance of a spot. look forward to the A64M with the other half 😂😂.
2:11 And what about that block of flats surrounded by road!!! It must be so noisy living there and trying to walk out the front door to a dangerous crossing
Another good video - thanks for posting! It seems odd to me that in Yorkshire we have the A58M and in Lancashire the M58. Admitedly the two are miles apart but you would have thought that someone would have chosen a different number for one of them?
Motorways often take the number of the A road they were built to replace. I'm not certain but it looks like the M58 could have been designed to give M6 southbound traffic a better route to Liverpool than turning off at Ashton in Makerfield and taking the A58 which was probably the original main route. Like the M62 providing a better transpennine route than the A62, so taking that number.
Multi storey car parks on motorways would be so good for car sharing/car pooling. So many times I need to meet colleagues for an onward journey - we could all just meet up on the motorway, park and take one car for the rest of the journey.
Great video, some great memories. My Dad worked for the Evening Post, in the late 70s, the teatime sister of the Yorkshire Post, so I went in a few times, and enjoyed the hot chocolate from the vending machine (I was a kid, don't judge me!). The building may have been iconic, but it was essentially just another brutalist monstrosity (although it's never going to be as reviled as City House, above the station...)
Couple of interesting points to have a think about...
The day before the A58(M) opened, members of the public were invited to walk along its length. There are photos of families having an outing strolling along the road inside the tunnel just north of the Westgate junction.
And, on a darker note, the car park that straddles the road on Woodhouse Lane was always a popular choice for people to end their lives by suicide (I knew one of them). I remember walking home from town one day and seeing a splash of red and thinking it was bizarre that someone would throw paint down the side. When I got home and saw the local news, I realised it wasn't paint.
Lovely to hear the ITV Yorkshire ident!
I was reminded of Glasgow M8 Junction 18-19
Firmly believe the signage on this motorway has never been replaced since it was first built. At least definitely not during my lifetime.
Yay! Perfectly timed check for new video 😍
And first as well
@@charlottelarimore9261 lol didn't realise.. an honour and one for the CV now lol 😀
Another fantastic episode Jon.
Come off it, the Woodhouse Lane car park is on the north edge of the city centre. You showed that it's about a mile from the south edge. It's like 5-10 min walk from all the major shopping streets: very convenient!
I know nothing about nor have ever been to Leeds, but the Yorkshire Post building seems to be heritage worthy. It looks like it could have been repurposed. Why on earth was it demolished?
Because someone took a backhander to allow it to be 'redeveloped' into expensive, unsafe flats nobody wants to live in.
The old building was also concrete cancered all to hell. But it was - just - savable, so yes, a few backhanders may have slipped under the table...😂
££££
the building, and the paper were both S***e.... you could have cured the buildings concrete and design issues, dealing with the pathetic advertising rag that was the Yorkshire Evening post, however, was ( is) still a problem.
I don't know if I've got some sort of specifically Leeds related blind spot, but I find the roads and M-ways of Leeds incredibly bewildering! I try to plan a route on the map but it just looks impossible! I'm normally quite good at navigating, but not in Leeds!
I'm the same going through Rouen though that is French France ! 😂
Not just you. I have a pretty good built-in compass, but Leeds f*cks it right up. Never done it the same way twice, it's a nightmare.
@@dave_h_8742 At least in France, they have those signposts that say 'Toutes Directions' that you can always follow!!!
Some routes look impossible because they are impossible
@@dave_h_8742I’ve never managed to find a good route through Rouen, not heading South and not heading back to Calais!
Damnit, now I will have to listen to that ITV song in full again...
JEOPARDY!
I have to commute to work on this road, including the approach from the A64/York Road. It's vile. Thanks Jon!
Before the Woodhouse tunnel was opened to traffic the council and construction company held a lavish meal in the tunnel with long tables and chairs and waiter service for very special invited guests and some of the local people who had been displaced from their houses when they were demolished to enable the construction to go ahead
Lol, I wonder if the guys building the tunnel were invited.
It always strikes me as an insult when new buildings have an 'openning' event with drinks and buns for all the new staff etc. but the guys who just spent 2 years building the thing from nothing up don't even get an invite and what treatment would they get if they were invited and actually turned up? 😂
looking forward to the A64(M) next week!
Perfect timing. My home town
You missed the most confusing part for people not familiar with this road. If you're travelling in the opposite direction and you merge under this car park the slip runs off and back on again. It panics all visitors ("oh I've missed my turn") and causes a lot of hasty moving over.
Haha, so common! Keeps the left lane nice and empty though for drivers like you and me.
Ha ha! I frequently used to shout at people changing lanes in a state of panic! “Stay in your blooming lane!” Mind you, like you said, it’s not obvious. I usually take the left hand lane as it means you buy more time to plan your merge… 😂
You should do secrets of the Cypriot motorways, they’re built to similar(ish) standards and as this is your job you could probably claim the tax back on a summer holiday 😁👍
The TV nerd in me is very happy 🤣
I always pass the danger tunnel slip road in lane 2 because of the amount of accidents I've seen. The amount of spazzmanger passing it in lane 1 and at stupid speeds is mind-blowing, they either don't know the area or are just donkeydumb 🤦🏻♂️
Ah, my old neck of the woods. The A58M has one of those delightful exit ramps from the outside lane shenanigans, which are thankfully rare! That Jeopardy slip road is great, especially at peak times when no b@stard will ever yield or merge in turn. The best way to approach it is to just shut your eyes and hope for the best. [Disclaimer: not really]
I once tried to use the Westgate car park and missed the entry slip road. It took me 99 years to go around the ridiculously complicated one way system to get to it. The exit from that car park is off the top floor, which is entertaining! Weeeeeee………..
😂 your observation is all too familiar to me too! 😁👍👊😎
The right-hand exit slip road is on the A64M, the next bit along. I'd imagine that will be next week's video
@@kingboy76 The A64 (with or without the “M”) is crying out for the Auto Shenanigans treatment! That’s one road I still use regularly. 😱😂
This is the best video I've ever seen about anything
Nice one John travelled thru they many times and many times a bump at jeopardy junction .!!🥃👏
I lived in Leeds for several years and came to Love the A58M, it enables you to cross the city extremely quickly.
I have never successfully driven to the Woodhouse Lane car park. I've tried, oh I've tried, but I always end up taking a mis-step somewhere and usually get redirected back on to the A58M. I think it's protected by Douglas Adams' SEP field.
This has to be the most intense stretch of motorway I’ve ever driven. I remember driving it for the first time when I was a student in Leeds, and what a nightmare it was. It was like nothing I’d ever experienced before. Inevitably missed my exit. However after a number of years you got used to it, and you became a nutter like everyone else. 🤣
My horrible grey office building sits atop that jeopardy tunnel 😂
Nice jazz hands!
*This.... is... Jeopardy!"* (I love that show even though I sporadically watch it anymore, especially after Alex's passing )