I've gone too deep into Helldivers 2, at first I read "Malevolence arc" as "Malevalon Creek". Though, Grievous would probably fit in pretty well with the Automatons (Formerly known as the Cyborgs) considering they're not 100% machinery either. He might actually like commanding them better than the droids lol!
@@mandalorianhunter1ObiWan: Im the master of Defense!! Palpatine *blank face* , shoots web of lighting and obiwan flies hundreds of meters back with a shock
Obi-Wan really reminds me of that quote by Confucius: "The superior man is distressed by the limitations of his ability; he is not distressed by the fact that men do not recognize the ability that he has."
@ Ah, so common sense makes one 13 years of age now, does it? Such... Innovative leaps of logic, you're seemingly as... *Cough* "Intelligent", as the claim you're defending ^^
@ No, I was (apparently) letting the both of you prove mine ^^ That all of you base your takes purely off of emotional grandstanding nonsense, that has no basis in reality. You don't give a shit if your claims hold water, you just want to sound like you know what you're talking about. Not to actually have clue about it... Or really any worthwhile point whatsoever... Basically: I was saying that he is what you are, and what has been the problem since the start - You're all just full of hot air, and not much else! Or to put it in a way that most ppl might understand: You're seemingly here for clicks and attention, you don't care if you're actually right. PS. Altough my original point was more about having ppl put things into a more realistic perspective specifically. But you both proved that more than that might be needed.
People sometimes think that Grevious was weakened. But he’s always been the same character. On Hypori, he only engaged the Jedi after destroying their fleet and decimating their troops and (smartly) retreated from the LAAT with twin repeating turrets and missiles. Likewise in his lair, after he was almost captured by Kit Fisto and company , he retreated until all the Clones were slain. His goal has always been to fight another day, even if it means leaving a fleeting or army behind. Because as talented a duelist as he was, his greatest weapon was psychological warfare.
@@bernardoayres1139 yeah, he literally explains how getting in their heads you can fight against Jedi. For if grievous tried to fight a Jedi with a clear mind to focus on the force, he doesn’t truly stand a chance.
The thing is that on TCW: He kills a single jedi He barely wins any fights agaisnt jedis He sucks as a general and is always shown getting is ass kicked
@@novkorova2774 Not an untrue observation. But at the same time, he mostly went up against Kenobi (who won or survived because he’s Obi-Wan) or went up against characters with plot armor like Ashoka and Kit Fisto. In addition, TCW was made to be largely more… family friendly. We never saw anything like the Battles of Jablim or Boz Pity.
What's interesting is that, in a lot of ways, Grievous's CW depiction is stronger in some areas than his 2003 depiction, but weaker in other areas. CW Grievous is substantially more durable (dude gets flung around by the force and facetanks explosions which he shrugs off), while 2003 Grievous is a glass cannon who avoids taking any damage. CW Grievous is slower in exchange for being a tank while 2003 Grievous is very agile in exchange for having paper durability. Their fighting styles are similar (heavy use of kicks in tandem with their sabers) and their tactics are similarly unorthodox, but CW Grievous has the misfortune of always fighting plot-armored Obi-Won while 2003 Grievous got to bully non-protagonist characters.
Grievous has always shined as a type of guerilla warfare style threat. He excels when his opposition is off balance and they need to constantly adapt to his unorthodox fighting styles, cybernetic physiology, and just plain brutality. He targets the weakest opponents to force stronger ones to focus on trying to save them (or damaging their morale when they fail), he goads and taunts to play on their mental state, and he collect trophies specifically to garner a reputation for impressive kills. All this (minus the cybernetics) is exactly what he learned of warfare on his home planet when he was still known as Qymaen jai Shelaal, defending his people from interplanetary invaders and slavers. Use fear, strike the weakest targets to build momentum, never let honor get in the way of victory against an opponent who (as far as you know) has no honor, etc
But on a serious note, the writing in the novelization was so good. Hands down one of my all time favorite novels in all of Star Wars, old and new canon. The part about when Kenobi falls into the force was such a beautiful section, I wish more of the novels had that feeling.
Even better: it's like Matt Stover was given the script for the film, read it, then said "I can fix this." The infamous scene of Anakin being denied the rank of Master is a big one, as we know why it was so important. Unlike that film, where Anakin wants the title out of ego, in the book, it could be his best chance to save Padmé.
@@Drako2k0 Windu was inferior in dueling he could only ever beat him with range advantage and the fact GG couldnt move in both fights they had First fight he was literally stuck in place and damn well nearly killed Windu and second fight he had to keep the chancellor from getting grabbed or brought back with the force
@@invictus6176 Windu won. and the fact he won makes the statement "No other jedi could defeat grievous" objectively false. You saying "he only won because of this this and this is all irrelevent. Windu defeated Grievous, instantaneously I might add.
This breakdown of Obi-Wan really made me appreciate Luke's character more in the original trilogy. It's cool to see how Luke actually had a lot of the same ideals of Obi-Wan coupled with the urges that came from his Skywalker blood.
@@thislink1519but so was anakin😭 obi wan was literally both of their masters so wouldn’t both anakin n luke be the same amount? obviously luke took more of obi wans style than anakin
...this kinda just made me realize that both of them wanted to rush through their training. Anakin because he felt like he was being underestimated, and Luke because he was actually fighting a war and people needed help immediately
BY FAR THE BEST ESSAY ON OBI WAN I'VE EVER SEEN Love the emphasis you make on how the Soresu defines Obi Wan's character to perfection, & I can't think on a better quote than: _Obi Wan wasn't a perfect Jedi but it SURE was the best one for its time & circumstances_
Always kind of annoyed me when people claimed that Anakin or Mace Windu could beat grevious, even though their fighting styles were ones Grievous would likely been able to adapt to, and how it was specifically stated that Obi-Wan's defensive style was the only thing which could counteract Grievous.
@@CreatorofSecks because people massively low ball grievous due to him not having the force (yet praise boba and jango for killing jedi) and him being all over the place in terms of how he is written as a character.
the only other one i ever bring up who can do it is our boi Kit-fisto. my clonewars brain will not let me forget that episode. "lair of grievous" was great.
In the micro-series, Mace Windu encountered General Grevious and used the force to crush his chest, so I believe he could easily have gone 1v1 with Grevious
they could they would have to just over power ver Grevious which they can buddy nice try. plus even if they dont they can just orce crush his heart even thoug that is a cheap trick. But I guarantee you they can batter through Grevious' attacks
@@chadbrad8100 its not exactly the jedi way to go for a straight away go for a lethal attack and while mace/anakin are less jedi than obi wan and yoda but despite that they still dont straight away go for the kill. Do you think grievous is just going to stand there and allow himself to get his heart crushed?
Imo the biggest reason Kenobi could stand up to Grievous while many other Jedi failed? It's that Kenobi can get into Grievous' head. Kenobi plays mind games with Grievous while every other Jedi we've seen Grievous face has always been too serious. They all acted the same in front of Grievous except Kenobi.
@@thisisiampie6946 Grievous has combated many styles and defeated everyone except a Vapaad user, which is why Mace won't fight him. Grievous could certainly defeat Kenobi's style, but it's the mind games. Watch all of Grievous' duels versus other Jedi. They all do the bravado, stoic "I will not fall to you" thing and then look how Kenobi approaches Grievous. He messes with him.
@@DukeCondorhe jumps down from above, and announces his presence. The ultimate troll power move. Like imagine this guy who maybe could of tried to jump you and take you by surprise instead just says “hello there (I’m here to personally ruin your day)”
I think you need to listen to Yoda in ESB when tells Luke that a Jedi must have a serious mind. Obi-Wan had a sense of humor, but that doesn't mean he didn't take himself too seriously as a Jedi. Kit Fisto had a similar sense of humor as Obi-Wan, but guess what? He was one of the Jedi that Grievous defeated and almost killed during the Clone Wars. Same goes for Ahsoka.
4:40 I remember someone saying Anakin would be the perfect Padawan for qui Gon, and the more I think I feel ahsoka would've been better tailored towards obi wan
From the Wampas Lair podcast: STOVER: Well Mace is popularly considered to be the greatest lightsaber artist of his generation, although he thinks - as I mention in the book - that Obi-Wan might be better and he is. INTERVIEWER: I like that. STOVER: Yeah. INTERVIEWER: I definitely enjoyed that discussion and delving into why Obi-Wan is the only choice really to fight Grievous. STOVER: Right. INTERVIEWER: Vaapad is to counter Mace's weakness, Ataru is to counter Yoda's weakness with his seize and stature STOVER: (agrees) INTERVIEWER: Whereas Obi-Wan is just the Master of his chosen form and therefore has given him no weakness, it's just the complete... it is the form in its entirety. STOVER: (agrees)
Sometimes when one fighter relies so purely on brute force and greater physical prowess to win, the only counter is an airtight defence Being too aggressive will leave you open to attacks, they can tank these better than you due to physical superiority, and a counterattacking/punishing style wont work unless you can defend in the first place, which requires amazing technical skill It makes sence that the only member of the order suited to taking down grievous was someone as patient, precise and as technically sound as Kenobi was
I like how you touched on Grievous being an antithesis of the Jedi. Purely driven by pain, malice, and betrayal. No room left in him for forgiveness, love, or change. His trophies, once tools for good, either find their way into his hands to be tools of destruction, or left to be meaningless with no hands to wield them anymore. He hates himself for what he is, instead of looking inward and asking questions to find what matters to him. All that's left is ruin, and to cause ruination. But a Jedi is not these things. No better foil for evil than good. No better defense than a heart which seeks and does not harm.
I feel like Bruce Lee's famous quote "I fear not the man who has practiced 10 thousand kicks, but I fear the man who has practiced one kick ten thousand times" perfectly describes Obi-Wan and Soresu
Obi Wan was a menace in the plans of the Sith considering just unbeatable he appeared to be as the Clone Wars continued and especially as Sidious agents couldn’t seem to kill him.
Sheev actually got lucky his minions were so incompetent. We saw what happened when he thought Obi-Wan was killed and he would've become the Doom Slayer had he found out Sheev ordered the successful hit.
It's ironic (and a statement to how underrated he is) that the 1 sith apprentice Obi-Wan couldn't beat was the one that Darth Sidious considered "planned to be disposed of" (Darth Tyranus.) Even more so that he is the Master of his Master.
A good offense cannot penetrate a great defense though. Obi- Wan was like a deeply rooted tree in a hurricane. No matter how hard the wind blew, the tree stood where it was without bending or budging.
"'I have never understood why everyone is so determined to duel Grievous,' they say sharply. 'He is not Force-Sensitive; pick him up, flick the lightsabre controls, tug the hilts out of his hands and then compact him like a drinks’ can'" --"Fox in the Henhouse" on AO3
Obi-Wan is a human being, not a human doing. He is all those things…. But doesn’t define himself by any of them. He embraces his humanity, from flaws to virtues. Applying his strengths to whatever task is before him. In the universe of Star Wars: this is trusting the force to the point of complete surrender to it. Edit: thank you for reading my head canon lol.
May I just say, this channel is amazing because it's as if they read my mind about what videos I want! I love the amount of love Grievous my favourite character gets on this channel, thank you!
I think Grievous is a really underrated villain in Star Wars. People tend to think of him as a comedic villain who constantly gets bested. I think the Clone Wars did make him too much of a laughing stock, but it was still important to show his weakness and ridiculousness. I like Grievous because he is a being fully rejecting life in favor for technology. He exemplifies the belief that technology is infallible and it’s a solution for everything.
I forget where this came from, but I remember Grievous being so worried about Obi-Wan that he almost became convinced the Kaleesh pantheon created Kenobi as a champion destined to destroy him.
I absolutely hate the obviously AI image used at 11:55 it looks so ugly and soulless. Please do better to avoid such images if you are going to take images from google anyway!
If I could throw 20 punches in one second, I would step in the ring with a peak-fitness Mike Tyson and punch him into pulp .. failing that, I'd run like buggery!!
“He’s given depth by his relationships with other characters” actually, that’s pretty standard for characters in fiction. There’s a lot to learn about someone based on their interactions with other individuals.
..... didn't Kit Fisto come pretty damn close? I got the feeling he could've won but just Nope'd out since reporting back was more important. Depending on continuity Windu also bodied him at one point with Greivous having to run from that fight, and I'm pretty sure Plo Koon would've had a distinct advantage with Electric Judgement.
Yeah, kit fisto’s style counters anyone who uses multiple lightsabers out if he’s fighting multiple people. Since grievous is one guy with 4 lightsabers, kit fisto is the ultimate counter
Kit Fisto might have been able to, but he was on the defensive at that point. He was in enemy territory, Grievous might have still had back-up coming (as best as Kit could guess), and all of Fisto's team had been killed by then. The entirety of the mission rested on him at that point and risking it to takexdown Grievous would have been rash and if he were in the mental state to prioritize that, he likely would have died.
Star Wars duels are usually less a battle of DBZ-esque power levels, and more a game of "who's unique style counters who", and Obi-Wan's style is a perfect counter to Grievous'.
Obi-Wan truly was the most Jedi Jedi of all time, even in his last moments Also as a side note, 7:52 I believe this is AI art (his weirdly positioned legs, the fact he's wielding his saber and its holsted at the same time, the blade cutting into the thing in the sky when before it it has no breaks, the blade itself being slanted, Obi-Wan's face looking more like a chad filter than Obi-Wan, the folds on his robes, etc). You mention in your description that you try to credit artists when you can which is why I'm bringing it up, but sometimes a piece may have no source, because the source wasn't human to begin with
Think about being force sensitive like this; You walk into someone's living room and, without knowing there is bacon being cooked, you _can tell_ bacon is being cooked in the kitchen because you can _smell_ it despite not being able to _see_ it! Now, as a Jedi, you have a "sense of smell" capable of detecting: Future events Past events People's emotions Life forms and their general condition When a Jedi walks into the room, they can sense people like we sense bacon....and I would imagine different emotional states create different "smells" for a Jedi. To that end, fighting Greivous would be like working in a waste water treatment plant! "The smell! _OH GO-_ * nearly upchucks * _what is that!_ * points * _Is it moving!?_ *HOW IS IT ALIVE!?"* Meanwhile Obi-Wan is the waste water treatment employee of 10 years all nonchalantly like, "Trust me, it gets worse." * calmly removes torso sized snapping turtle from drain like it's nothing *
And Grievous used that fact to his benefit The feeling of him - "WHAT HAPPENED, _HOW IS THAT THING ALIVE,"_ before you ever see it! The feeling of what he plans for your future The feeling of his _anger_ so strong that it feels like it might actually burn you _through_ the force!
This video harkens back to all those years I was wrapped deep in the Star Wars lore and universe. It just makes me long for the old days of Star Wars . . . back when "Legacy" was the actual canon and the people who partook in creating for the series actually cared about it. Nostalgia is a special kind of pain.
I think the cyborg general(Grievous) took down many jedi 12 or way more, yet I don't know about hundreds of jedi(it's understandable if it's dozens yet I don't know), the general moves at the speed that everything to his rotating electro-drivers to his lightsabers disappear into a blur. 31:29 do you even consider if it's his body or his soul?
As great as a swordsman grievous was there was nothing he could do against someone using the force against him. And it especially doesn't help when he meets someone that's superior with a light saber than him like Obi-Wan.
This. Sure Obiwan might be his only Jedi match in lightsaber combat, but I'm pretty sure anyone with a decent proficiency of Force pull could disarm Grievous or Force stun him
@@MagustheseerThat's why his most successful attacks against Jedi happened in surprise ambushes or hit and run tactics. I also wonder if at least one Jedi tried to force-pull his weapons from him, but his cybernetically enhanced grip was too strong to pry open.
In all the sources I’ve checked, not one says Soresu is the most common. It was popular while other forms came into being but that Niman was the most common especially during the Clone Wars. Shi-Cho came in second vis-à-vis Niman in number of sources stating it was the most common (and it was the oldest). Not one I’ve been able to find states Soresu.
From what I know, Shi-Cho is the first taught to all Jedi initiates/younglings. Niman was the most common before the start of the Clone Wars, but fell out of favor when every single Niman user died on Geonosis.
@@HavocPrime8989 not every niman user, but yeah. The Jedi typically chose to switch to soresu, as it was the form considered best for defense and non-lethal combat. Both things they desperately wanted. Sad thing is, niman is potentially just as powerful. It’s just that most practitioners on Geonosis relied way too heavily on the force, neglecting the fundamentals of lightsaber combat. Masters of niman need both, like Exar kun
@@Wolfaydragoon Niman is potentially one of the best forms, but only if the practitioner has a firm mastery of the other forms. Cin Drallig and Exar Kun are prime examples of Niman masters. The problem was that most of the Niman practitioners were not lightsaber specialists and very rarely had real experience. The "Consular's form" was often learned before the Clone Wars by those who rarely practiced using their lightsaber. And that bit them in the rear when they needed it.
As best as I can tell, all three: Niman, Shii-Cho, and Soresu, are defensive forms. Niman seems to be very basic and easily blends into other styles, though it also serves as the base for the dual wielding defensive Jar'Kai style. Shii-cho and Soresu seem to be fairly similar, both heavily focused on the defensive basics of lightsaber combat, blocking other sabers and deflecting blaster fire. The only difference I seem to find is that Shii-Cho tends to be better against a barrage attack by multiple opponents while Soresu is superior against a single opponent, becoming less effective as the number of attacks increases. But while Grievous could increase his attack speed to try and overtake Soresu, that left him open.
@josephperez2004 Shii-Cho isn't particularly defensive. It evolved out of regular swordsmanship adapted for lightsaber combat. It's a foundation for every other form. Because most of it uses wide sweeps, it is great for fending off multiple opponents, but can falter against a singular focused duelist. Weak against Makashi. Soresu is defensive and designed to face blaster wielding foes. This is why it gained a lot of favor as blaster users became more common than lightsaber wielding opponents. However, it lacks a decisive attack, and focuses more on wearing down and outlasting opponents. Niman blends most of forms I-V. If the foundation in the other forms is shallow, it is rather basic, having no real weakness, but no great strengths either. However, if someone masters all the previous forms, then incorporates Niman to blend them, it becomes devastating. Toss in some Force attacks and/or some Jar Kai, and you have the reason Exar Kun gave the Jedi nightmares.
By the time of Revenge of the Sith, I’d say that Yoda, Mace Windu and Anakin are all definitely powerful enough to beat Grievous because they are on a tier of power above the other Jedi, but excluding them and ofc Obi-Wan, other council members could win but it’s not certain
😳Wow! This is by far the best and most insightful character analysis of obi-wan I’ve ever seen, and I usually find him to be a forgettable character in most circumstances. Seriously, thank you for this! 🙏🏻
Man this channel never misses on character analysis video's. It's always a treat and they never disappoint. That goes for all video's of this channel tho. Much love from a long time viewer.
Everyone discounting Mace or Kit is wild. Kit Fisto and Mace LITERALLY have the feats to back this up. Not even in a power scaling kind of way but in a "basically alteady did it" kind of way. Obi-wan was definitely the one who did it, but as many times as characters put Grievous in the hands of mere fate I simply don't beleive he's the only POSSIBLE one. There's plenty Grievous can counter, but I'm not taking the word of the Jedi that good ole Obi is the most capable or pure for this task. They are blind, foolish, and all dead in the end. Why would I trust their analysis here?
Kit actually puts Grievous on the ropes with SHII-CHO. As a refresher, that's Form I. The basic form. The progenitor form from which all other more advanced forms stem, and which every Jedi ever is expected to be competent in, but still badly outdated by modern standards. And Fisto pins the Jedi-killer and would have scored a clean kill if not for the MagnaGuards. And then, despite Form I's weakness in single combat, he lasts the longest of the cannon fodder against Palpatine, actually defending himself for a few seconds before falling.
Though I have rewatched & considered, I lack the words to concisely state how profound this video is. Suffice to say, it is a fine addition to my lore collection. Thank you, Geetsly's Team, for your service to the galaxy. The Force will be with you, always. o7
Obi Wan being humble and willing to learn even from his student is very evident in the clone wars. Sometimes he puts his foot down, but he’s also surprisingly willing to trust his student to go off on suicidal tasks and cover for him, or go along with an insane plan to hope for a better outcome. The pair cover each others weaknesses really well as characters, both in universe and in a narrative sense as well, and Obi Wan’s willingness to learn from his student makes this work really well as he shows genuine development from it.
@@master_chef7807 god A.I. art sucks why dont they just use some actual images of Grievous off google or bing like they have for years? why would he even put this in the video if it looks that bad?
Obi Wan is literally the most OP Star Wars character: He defeated/bested (and for some killed): Maul, Durge, Assaj Ventress, General Grevious, Darth Vader,
When Obi-Wan told Luke his father was betrayed by Darth Vader, he didn't necessarily lie; he had just - at that point - came to the conclusion 'Anakin' was truly gone. His line of "From a certain point of view" is his own. But you also have to keep in mind the father-son bond with Luke was what ultimately pulled him from the dark side.
Its easy to forget with the ROTS film's and TCW show's rather underwhelming portrayal of the character that in old legends lore Grievous could stalemate MACE WINDU in pure lightsaber combat, and in the battle of Coruscant stomped a rested Shaak Ti with the help of two other experienced jedi masters who were operating at full strength (unlike the Hypori fight),
Well, this video has convinced me that it's actually fitting that people unfamiliar with Star Wars have mistaken pictures of Obi Wan as depictions of White Jesus.
Simple answer: grievous is actually that good and sorisu is the perfect counter to him, so goo that it makes up for the difference in power between Obi-wan and the strongest jedi(yoda, windu and anakin) By the way the reason anakin lost to obiwan on mustafar is he was severely nerfed emotionally after killing padme
Kit Fisto could have finished him were it not for thu intervention of half a dozen Magnaguards. Grievous just coudn't keep up with the wild unpreditability of Fisto' form 1 or the calm precision of Kenobi. Obi-Wan was also "the one that got away" who constantly frustrated Grievous. He was never caught in the trappings of fear, surprise, or intimidation that Grievous relied on.
The only Jedi? Are we forgetting Mace Windu faced, and beat grievous within mere seconds of engaging him like it was nothing? Just immediately force crushed his torso without hesitation.
Very well made presentation, and i do not even like star wars very much, watched the whole video with interest because of how interesting you made it. Now i know more about star wars! Thank you.
Obi-Wan always felt to me as the definition of best intentions. Whenever he was trying to be the one to stop the evil in the galaxy he seemed to make a mistake that he didnt know was a mistake until later down the line. His closeness to his own humanity was his only weakness and that is what makes him a good character. Personally, the original trilogy version doesn't do him justice now a days as Clone Wars Obi-Wan seems to come off as a true Jedi but he seems to default to the old ways of the council that caused the rise of the empire by the time Luke arrives.
Its important to remember, legends Grievous arguably had been crippled by getting his organs force-crushed by mother-f***ing Mace Windu. In old legends canon, the cough only happened after that, meaning he was using his organs in his chest. It would be very strange to argue he was at full strength. especially since Grievous decided to call off all the droids when he never had issues wearing jedi out before (Hypori comes to mind...) which suggests he wasn't thinking straight (the agony of your organs being crushed would tend to do that). In "canon", TCW Grievous always coughed, and never meaningfully threatened jedi masters and council members in a pure 1-on-1, and in that show only ever was portrayed as able to dominate a Jedi utterly when engaging padawans. Its also important to note how in the ROTS film, if you pay careful attention to the choreography, Grievous politely never actually attacks Obiwan with all four blades simultaneously, or just misses with no chance of any hitting. The choreography for Grievous is frankly terrible in the film, which stands out in stark contrast compared to the Obiwan/Anakin duel in the same movie (that latter duel having some of the BEST choreography in the franchise).
Kinda hard to make nice looking choreography with a machine that has four arms. Especially when comparing to two guys with swords i can see them having a hard time with it
The reason obi wan chose soresu was due to how qui gon died. Qui Gon used ataru and trained obi wan in it as well the weakness of ataru was you needed to finish the fight quickly as it tired you out and obi wan got a front row seat to this issue in the phantom menace, that's when he switched styles as his focus
Your thumbnail of multiple Obi-Wans was my original thought of how the Clone Wars was. There were multiple clones of Obi-Wan and other Jedi fighting each other. Wasn't even a Droid army lol
In Clone Wars, Kit Fisto also defeated Grevious in a 1v1 but instead of finishing him off, he decided to leave and escape as everyone he came with were killed by Grevious, (Kit Fisto is also my favorite Jedi)
Obi-Wan was truly one of the best Jedi around. He was compassionate, had a great sense of humor, and he showed how Jedi could have friends and even a loved one without falling to the dark side, not by rejecting emotions like so Jedi tried, but by understanding, he had them and controlling them. And he did all just by being himself, never trying to be anything else. He knew he couldn't be Qui-Gon, Anakin, Mace, Yoda, Shaak Ti, and so on, if he tried he would only fail, and as Yoda once said, "Do or do not there is no try." This line, much like the Jedi Code itself is often misinterpreted, as its being taken a little too literally, saying you shouldn't practice and put effort into things because that requires trying, and like the Jedi you must strive for balance between the literal and the metaphorical. Jedi are all about practice, meditation, and improvement, that requires effort and trying, what Yoda says and Obi-Wan represents as one of the greatest Jedi is understanding what one can do and what they can't do. Obi-Wan can't be like all those other Jedi I mentioned, but he can be himself and be the best version of himself by improving, trying, and learning even as a Master, since as we see with him and Anakin or Anakin and Ahsoka, the student teaches the master just as much as the master teaches the student. That's why he could beat Grievous, because he didn't give into fear and try to be something he's not by fighting on Grevious's terms, he just had to be himself and play to his own strengths as a Jedi not try to play to some else's strengths. Also a factor in his victory was his understanding and bond with he Force. When it comes to the Force many, even some Jedi, struggle with trusting it completely. As letting something else control you could take away you're own autonomy, stripping away you're free will, and whose to say this other force in control of you has your best intentions at heart and isn't just going to sacrifice you and leave you high and dry. These are all valid concerns, of course, but when it comes to the Force itself, and by extension the Jedi that wield it at least the good ones, this is not there intent. Despite it being called the Force, it doesn't try to force people to do things they don't want to do, everyone has free will and a choice, and if the Force or the Jedi took that away from people then they would be no different then the Sith and the Dark Side which is the ones who take away people's free will and subjugate them to terrible things, which is why the Jedi and the Force itself tries to oppose them to protect the people, because the Force itself and the Jedi, at least those that don't lose there way, want life to thrive, they want people to be safe and happy and live their free lives, as long as what they do doesn't cause too much trouble for other people and take away other peoples own free will. That's why the Jedi don't take Force-Sensative babies away from their parents unless the parents willingly agree and why they allow Jedi to leave the order, because everyone deserves to have free will and choice, and they shouldn't force their ways onto other people, pun intended. The Force is to act as a guide to the Jedi, never taking away their free will, simply sharing its knowledge and hoping they will make the right choices in life for themselves and the galaxy. And you don't even have to be fully aligned with the views of the Force and the Jedi to be on the good side and help the galaxy, I mean just look at characters like good natured Bounty Hunters like Sugi, or Mandalorians like Din, Bo, and Sabine, sure they all have their own selfish desires and want to be happy but there still decent and good people who help the galaxy and do more good then bad. Many Clones like those int he 212th that served with Obi-Wan were also like this. As long as you're doing decent in the galaxy and not causing to much trouble for others, the Force will let it slide. But the Sith and the Dark Side is never satisfied, so it just keeps hurting the people and the galaxy, until their is no choice but to stop it and destroy it because it's abused it's free will to cause so much harm and pain. Grievous is another example of this with all the suffering he caused, which is why he had to be stopped. There were still many great Jedi left during the time of The Clone Wars, like Obi-Wan, Plo Koon, and even some of the problematic ones like Anakin and Mace still did a lot of good and helped a lot of people, showing there was still hope for he Jedi Order and the Galactic Republic. As the Revenge of the Sith novilzaion mentioned the Clone Wars was the end of the age of heroes, but it saved its best two for last Obi-Wan and Anakin. There were many heroes in the Clone Wars, and while they all either died or had to go into hiding when the war ended, they still did a lot of good before the dark times. And there was no better hero or Jedi during this time then Obi-Wan himself. Truly, no Jedi could reach the High Ground of heights Obi-Wan did, again pun intended.
Among other things Obi-Wan is a fine example of what I see as the paradox of simplicity, there are few thing more complicated then the really simple for there is no simple way for the complexities of reality to interact with it
Whats funny is that I never think of Obi-Wan as a powerful jedi. He is so unassuming, yet if you look at his actual deeds, he is one of the greatest jedi.
TLDR: obi wan practices a rare defensive saber style that excels in dealing with multiple threats at once (threats like all of grievous's sabers coming at him from all angles at once)
In the EU continuity, this may actually be true and is implied in the novels. Almost everytime someone gets the upper hand on Grievous it has an explanation that still favors him overall, like both of his encounters with Mace.
Anakin did. In a deleted alternate version of the start of Revenge of the Sith, Anakin and Obiwan get separated in grievous' ship. After anakin defeats dooku alone, he faces against grievous and according to the script literally effortlessy beats grievous and he flees and anakin calls him a coward
@@AFlyingEwok nah, dooku being an old man and specialising in a form thats main weakness is bad defence against power hits, dooku had strict instructions from dooku to hold back against abakin as the goal was to turn him to the dark side. Anakin isnt physically overpowering grievous
So, I have a vague memory as a child from back to 2008-2009 when Star Wars the Clone Wars series aired. I don´t know if it is lost media because any video talking about Grievous I´ve seen don´t mention it, but I remember reading in the Grievous page of the official site of the series that when he was a Khaleesh warlord he used to dream to become a jedi or something like that, but never could sense the force. Probably it was some light changes to the character lore preparing for the decanonization of legends. But I think that was a really cool aspect of the character, like a new layer of its origin, he was a tool across Jedi-Sith ideology between, a victim of world in war, but in the deepest part of him, the disappointment of what he could never be, therefore the thing he most especifically would want to defeat. Someone remember reading something like that about him?
Due to Grievous' numerous war crimes, Obi-Wan was able to use the moral high ground against him
He has the high ground in every way
The most forbidden art
And he didn't even listen to Grievous' thesis first.
THIS is the one!
Grievous: I fear no Jedi, but that one
Obi Wan: Hello There
Grievous: He Scares Me
Underrated comment. 🏆 for you, friend.
lmao
@ghowell13 how is this under rated, people have said this SINCE like 2005
And darth maul defeated him in 2 seconds
Grievous (Malevolence arc) , “Hello there.”
Obi-Wan, “I’m going to write that down for future use.”
I've gone too deep into Helldivers 2, at first I read "Malevolence arc" as "Malevalon Creek". Though, Grievous would probably fit in pretty well with the Automatons (Formerly known as the Cyborgs) considering they're not 100% machinery either. He might actually like commanding them better than the droids lol!
@@Bluerockpiewell done bro now they’re gonna add Droideka style bots to the game and we’re all screwed
@@Azzie420 Wait what? Did they announce it or something?
Palpatine: Why can't you kill him?!
Grievous: Why don't you fight him yourself?!
@@TSInfiMa-r6z *palpatine zaps Obi-wan*
Palpatine: Now was that so hard?
@@mandalorianhunter1EXACTLY 😂😂
@@FriendlyBatDoom Anakin: Noooooo!!!!
@@mandalorianhunter1 There's a chance Palps does it too openly, so Yoda and Mace come after him.
@@mandalorianhunter1ObiWan: Im the master of Defense!!
Palpatine *blank face* , shoots web of lighting and obiwan flies hundreds of meters back with a shock
Obi-Wan really reminds me of that quote by Confucius:
"The superior man is distressed by the limitations of his ability; he is not distressed by the fact that men do not recognize the ability that he has."
Plenty of cripples must be quite superior then.
@astarothnyarlathotep3815 You're the most intelligent 13 year old in the comment section, congratulations
@ Ah, so common sense makes one 13 years of age now, does it? Such... Innovative leaps of logic, you're seemingly as... *Cough* "Intelligent", as the claim you're defending ^^
@astarothnyarlathotep3815 were you trying to prove his point?
@ No, I was (apparently) letting the both of you prove mine ^^ That all of you base your takes purely off of emotional grandstanding nonsense, that has no basis in reality.
You don't give a shit if your claims hold water, you just want to sound like you know what you're talking about. Not to actually have clue about it... Or really any worthwhile point whatsoever...
Basically: I was saying that he is what you are, and what has been the problem since the start - You're all just full of hot air, and not much else!
Or to put it in a way that most ppl might understand:
You're seemingly here for clicks and attention, you don't care if you're actually right.
PS. Altough my original point was more about having ppl put things into a more realistic perspective specifically. But you both proved that more than that might be needed.
Seeing Obi-Wan meditate in a cave is better than slightly revealing Plagueis has been gooning in a cave.
The goon-counter must be revealed! I must know how much more I have to edge before I can become a sigma!
How does the audience know Plagueis is evil without him gooning? Have him pull an episode 9 and proclaim "I am all the Sith hehehehehe"?
Wut 😂
Did you ever hear the tragedy of Darth Gooner The Wise?
Sure but… at least acolyte was good and tried to tell a story… instead of gooning for a rehash of Obiwan vs Vader…
People sometimes think that Grevious was weakened. But he’s always been the same character. On Hypori, he only engaged the Jedi after destroying their fleet and decimating their troops and (smartly) retreated from the LAAT with twin repeating turrets and missiles. Likewise in his lair, after he was almost captured by Kit Fisto and company , he retreated until all the Clones were slain. His goal has always been to fight another day, even if it means leaving a fleeting or army behind. Because as talented a duelist as he was, his greatest weapon was psychological warfare.
@@bernardoayres1139 yeah, he literally explains how getting in their heads you can fight against Jedi. For if grievous tried to fight a Jedi with a clear mind to focus on the force, he doesn’t truly stand a chance.
The thing is that on TCW:
He kills a single jedi
He barely wins any fights agaisnt jedis
He sucks as a general and is always shown getting is ass kicked
@@novkorova2774 Not an untrue observation. But at the same time, he mostly went up against Kenobi (who won or survived because he’s Obi-Wan) or went up against characters with plot armor like Ashoka and Kit Fisto. In addition, TCW was made to be largely more… family friendly. We never saw anything like the Battles of Jablim or Boz Pity.
What's interesting is that, in a lot of ways, Grievous's CW depiction is stronger in some areas than his 2003 depiction, but weaker in other areas. CW Grievous is substantially more durable (dude gets flung around by the force and facetanks explosions which he shrugs off), while 2003 Grievous is a glass cannon who avoids taking any damage. CW Grievous is slower in exchange for being a tank while 2003 Grievous is very agile in exchange for having paper durability. Their fighting styles are similar (heavy use of kicks in tandem with their sabers) and their tactics are similarly unorthodox, but CW Grievous has the misfortune of always fighting plot-armored Obi-Won while 2003 Grievous got to bully non-protagonist characters.
Grievous has always shined as a type of guerilla warfare style threat. He excels when his opposition is off balance and they need to constantly adapt to his unorthodox fighting styles, cybernetic physiology, and just plain brutality. He targets the weakest opponents to force stronger ones to focus on trying to save them (or damaging their morale when they fail), he goads and taunts to play on their mental state, and he collect trophies specifically to garner a reputation for impressive kills.
All this (minus the cybernetics) is exactly what he learned of warfare on his home planet when he was still known as Qymaen jai Shelaal, defending his people from interplanetary invaders and slavers. Use fear, strike the weakest targets to build momentum, never let honor get in the way of victory against an opponent who (as far as you know) has no honor, etc
Windu: "You are the perfect fighter against Grievous."
Kenobi *tries to fistfight a robot
Chad
But on a serious note, the writing in the novelization was so good. Hands down one of my all time favorite novels in all of Star Wars, old and new canon. The part about when Kenobi falls into the force was such a beautiful section, I wish more of the novels had that feeling.
It's just so fucking good, I don't feel immature calling it my favorite piece of fiction ever, reading it just makes me feel so damn good
I read it as a kid and I loved it. I can't believe the novelization of a movie is so good
Even better: it's like Matt Stover was given the script for the film, read it, then said "I can fix this." The infamous scene of Anakin being denied the rank of Master is a big one, as we know why it was so important. Unlike that film, where Anakin wants the title out of ego, in the book, it could be his best chance to save Padmé.
@@Cailus3542and that still proves that he didn’t deserve the rank of master.
Even when the movies come first, it seems like the books are still better.
I remember having a blast reading through the Ep1-3 novelizations.
No other Jedi could defeat Grievous, but in Lego Star Wars the Complete Saga, Cody can using explosive blaster bolts!
Cody also charges at Grievous and gets pimp-slapped by his saber.
Mace Windu raises an eyebrow
"If it's one thing we clones know, it's how to deal with a jedi"
@@Drako2k0 Windu was inferior in dueling he could only ever beat him with range advantage and the fact GG couldnt move in both fights they had
First fight he was literally stuck in place and damn well nearly killed Windu and second fight he had to keep the chancellor from getting grabbed or brought back with the force
@@invictus6176 Windu won. and the fact he won makes the statement "No other jedi could defeat grievous" objectively false.
You saying "he only won because of this this and this is all irrelevent. Windu defeated Grievous, instantaneously I might add.
This breakdown of Obi-Wan really made me appreciate Luke's character more in the original trilogy. It's cool to see how Luke actually had a lot of the same ideals of Obi-Wan coupled with the urges that came from his Skywalker blood.
He's half chivalrous Knight and half hot-blooded prodigious protagonist
@@thislink1519but so was anakin😭 obi wan was literally both of their masters so wouldn’t both anakin n luke be the same amount? obviously luke took more of obi wans style than anakin
@rileylagerstrom9843 Anakin was like "Nah, I'ma do my own thing"
...this kinda just made me realize that both of them wanted to rush through their training. Anakin because he felt like he was being underestimated, and Luke because he was actually fighting a war and people needed help immediately
BY FAR THE BEST ESSAY ON OBI WAN I'VE EVER SEEN
Love the emphasis you make on how the Soresu defines Obi Wan's character to perfection, & I can't think on a better quote than:
_Obi Wan wasn't a perfect Jedi but it SURE was the best one for its time & circumstances_
Always kind of annoyed me when people claimed that Anakin or Mace Windu could beat grevious, even though their fighting styles were ones Grievous would likely been able to adapt to, and how it was specifically stated that Obi-Wan's defensive style was the only thing which could counteract Grievous.
@@CreatorofSecks because people massively low ball grievous due to him not having the force (yet praise boba and jango for killing jedi) and him being all over the place in terms of how he is written as a character.
the only other one i ever bring up who can do it is our boi Kit-fisto. my clonewars brain will not let me forget that episode. "lair of grievous" was great.
In the micro-series, Mace Windu encountered General Grevious and used the force to crush his chest, so I believe he could easily have gone 1v1 with Grevious
they could they would have to just over power ver Grevious which they can buddy nice try. plus even if they dont they can just orce crush his heart even thoug that is a cheap trick. But I guarantee you they can batter through Grevious' attacks
@@chadbrad8100 its not exactly the jedi way to go for a straight away go for a lethal attack and while mace/anakin are less jedi than obi wan and yoda but despite that they still dont straight away go for the kill. Do you think grievous is just going to stand there and allow himself to get his heart crushed?
Imo the biggest reason Kenobi could stand up to Grievous while many other Jedi failed? It's that Kenobi can get into Grievous' head. Kenobi plays mind games with Grievous while every other Jedi we've seen Grievous face has always been too serious. They all acted the same in front of Grievous except Kenobi.
I feel he just had the chances because of how defensive his style is. He can chat all he wants and he knows he not getting hit
@@thisisiampie6946 Grievous has combated many styles and defeated everyone except a Vapaad user, which is why Mace won't fight him.
Grievous could certainly defeat Kenobi's style, but it's the mind games. Watch all of Grievous' duels versus other Jedi. They all do the bravado, stoic "I will not fall to you" thing and then look how Kenobi approaches Grievous. He messes with him.
@@DukeCondorhe jumps down from above, and announces his presence.
The ultimate troll power move.
Like imagine this guy who maybe could of tried to jump you and take you by surprise instead just says “hello there (I’m here to personally ruin your day)”
I think you need to listen to Yoda in ESB when tells Luke that a Jedi must have a serious mind. Obi-Wan had a sense of humor, but that doesn't mean he didn't take himself too seriously as a Jedi. Kit Fisto had a similar sense of humor as Obi-Wan, but guess what? He was one of the Jedi that Grievous defeated and almost killed during the Clone Wars. Same goes for Ahsoka.
@@decepticonxhunter4850 You remembering wrong? Fisto had chased Grievous from his castle also Grievous killed Fisto's former apprentice
22:45
"It allows the user to concentrate on the fundamentals of lightsaber combat..."
Me: And thats not dying!
4:40 I remember someone saying Anakin would be the perfect Padawan for qui Gon, and the more I think I feel ahsoka would've been better tailored towards obi wan
From the Wampas Lair podcast:
STOVER: Well Mace is popularly considered to be the greatest lightsaber artist of his generation, although he thinks - as I mention in the book - that Obi-Wan might be better and he is.
INTERVIEWER: I like that.
STOVER: Yeah.
INTERVIEWER: I definitely enjoyed that discussion and delving into why Obi-Wan is the only choice really to fight Grievous.
STOVER: Right.
INTERVIEWER: Vaapad is to counter Mace's weakness, Ataru is to counter Yoda's weakness with his seize and stature
STOVER: (agrees)
INTERVIEWER: Whereas Obi-Wan is just the Master of his chosen form and therefore has given him no weakness, it's just the complete... it is the form in its entirety.
STOVER: (agrees)
(Agrees)
literally cap
Right
@gustav1585 lmaooo goid how be ye?????????????????????
Nahhhh das crazy.
Why every cool villain has a beef with the GOAT? Maul, Grievous, even Sidius (he hid that well)
And Vader, the original Star Wars villain.
Sometimes when one fighter relies so purely on brute force and greater physical prowess to win, the only counter is an airtight defence
Being too aggressive will leave you open to attacks, they can tank these better than you due to physical superiority, and a counterattacking/punishing style wont work unless you can defend in the first place, which requires amazing technical skill
It makes sence that the only member of the order suited to taking down grievous was someone as patient, precise and as technically sound as Kenobi was
I like how you touched on Grievous being an antithesis of the Jedi.
Purely driven by pain, malice, and betrayal. No room left in him for forgiveness, love, or change. His trophies, once tools for good, either find their way into his hands to be tools of destruction, or left to be meaningless with no hands to wield them anymore. He hates himself for what he is, instead of looking inward and asking questions to find what matters to him. All that's left is ruin, and to cause ruination.
But a Jedi is not these things. No better foil for evil than good. No better defense than a heart which seeks and does not harm.
I feel like Bruce Lee's famous quote "I fear not the man who has practiced 10 thousand kicks, but I fear the man who has practiced one kick ten thousand times" perfectly describes Obi-Wan and Soresu
Obi Wan was a menace in the plans of the Sith considering just unbeatable he appeared to be as the Clone Wars continued and especially as Sidious agents couldn’t seem to kill him.
Sheev actually got lucky his minions were so incompetent. We saw what happened when he thought Obi-Wan was killed and he would've become the Doom Slayer had he found out Sheev ordered the successful hit.
@@AFlyingEwokWait, when did this happen exactly? I don't believe this happened in the clone wars.
@@smickothesmickest It happened in the Clone Wars show.
@@TheThreeHeadedDragon the Rako Hardeen part? I don't remember palpatine doing much besides influencing anakin at that part.
It's ironic (and a statement to how underrated he is) that the 1 sith apprentice Obi-Wan couldn't beat was the one that Darth Sidious considered "planned to be disposed of" (Darth Tyranus.) Even more so that he is the Master of his Master.
Sometimes a good defense is the best offense
Bingo
It works the other way around for Soresu users too
The best offense is a good defense
@@Momo-xs8mothat’s exactly what he said
A good offense cannot penetrate a great defense though. Obi- Wan was like a deeply rooted tree in a hurricane. No matter how hard the wind blew, the tree stood where it was without bending or budging.
But the best defense is always the greatest offense
Yoda to Obi-Wan at Qui-Gon's funeral pyre: "Hmph! Qui-Gon's defiance, I sense in you! Need that you do not!"
"General Kenobi. You are a bold one." - General Grevious
"'I have never understood why everyone is so determined to duel Grievous,' they say sharply. 'He is not Force-Sensitive; pick him up, flick the lightsabre controls, tug the hilts out of his hands and then compact him like a drinks’ can'" --"Fox in the Henhouse" on AO3
Windu: "Obi-Wan, I declare you to be *built different.*"
I can hear him saying this and I kind of hate it.
Obi-Wan is a human being, not a human doing. He is all those things…. But doesn’t define himself by any of them. He embraces his humanity, from flaws to virtues. Applying his strengths to whatever task is before him. In the universe of Star Wars: this is trusting the force to the point of complete surrender to it.
Edit: thank you for reading my head canon lol.
May I just say, this channel is amazing because it's as if they read my mind about what videos I want! I love the amount of love Grievous my favourite character gets on this channel, thank you!
I think Grievous is a really underrated villain in Star Wars. People tend to think of him as a comedic villain who constantly gets bested. I think the Clone Wars did make him too much of a laughing stock, but it was still important to show his weakness and ridiculousness. I like Grievous because he is a being fully rejecting life in favor for technology. He exemplifies the belief that technology is infallible and it’s a solution for everything.
@maxtermind5110 even that is a change tcw made, grievous didnt become what he is willingly originally. Filloni is a hack
Obi-Wan sure was good at making nemesises.
Maul, Grevious, Vader, yep he's good at making arch-enemies.
Nemeses is the plural form of nemesis
@@Andrea-nom nemes’nt
congrats, you have just elaborated what you by doing it @@Andrea-nom
I forget where this came from, but I remember Grievous being so worried about Obi-Wan that he almost became convinced the Kaleesh pantheon created Kenobi as a champion destined to destroy him.
6:17 "Do or do not, there is no try" -Yoda
I absolutely hate the obviously AI image used at 11:55 it looks so ugly and soulless. Please do better to avoid such images if you are going to take images from google anyway!
The one at 13:44 is also clearly ai. They all look so bad...
For a non force user he did pretty well.
If I could throw 20 punches in one second, I would step in the ring with a peak-fitness Mike Tyson and punch him into pulp .. failing that, I'd run like buggery!!
That he did. I think the way he died was perhaps a bit underhanded.
@cherrytonshawty9120
I thought it was uncivilised.
@@frenzalrhomb6919 lol
even better for a meatbag
Obi Wan Kenobi is the model example of what a Jedi should be.
If we’re talking about episode 3 or further I would generally agree. But Qui Gon would be my choice of the model Jedi 😊
“He’s given depth by his relationships with other characters” actually, that’s pretty standard for characters in fiction. There’s a lot to learn about someone based on their interactions with other individuals.
Everyone deserves a mentor like Obi-Wan.
Mace Windu crushed him with the Force and fucked up his lungs
Mace windu was the reason greivious had his cough and had grievious running.
..... didn't Kit Fisto come pretty damn close? I got the feeling he could've won but just Nope'd out since reporting back was more important. Depending on continuity Windu also bodied him at one point with Greivous having to run from that fight, and I'm pretty sure Plo Koon would've had a distinct advantage with Electric Judgement.
Yeah, kit fisto’s style counters anyone who uses multiple lightsabers out if he’s fighting multiple people. Since grievous is one guy with 4 lightsabers, kit fisto is the ultimate counter
Kit Fisto might have been able to, but he was on the defensive at that point. He was in enemy territory, Grievous might have still had back-up coming (as best as Kit could guess), and all of Fisto's team had been killed by then. The entirety of the mission rested on him at that point and risking it to takexdown Grievous would have been rash and if he were in the mental state to prioritize that, he likely would have died.
Star Wars duels are usually less a battle of DBZ-esque power levels, and more a game of "who's unique style counters who", and Obi-Wan's style is a perfect counter to Grievous'.
Obi-Wan truly was the most Jedi Jedi of all time, even in his last moments
Also as a side note, 7:52 I believe this is AI art (his weirdly positioned legs, the fact he's wielding his saber and its holsted at the same time, the blade cutting into the thing in the sky when before it it has no breaks, the blade itself being slanted, Obi-Wan's face looking more like a chad filter than Obi-Wan, the folds on his robes, etc). You mention in your description that you try to credit artists when you can which is why I'm bringing it up, but sometimes a piece may have no source, because the source wasn't human to begin with
Kit Fisto seemed like he was doing a pretty good job against Grievous
Idk why this wasn’t mentioned.
11:49 what in the ai generated heck is that???
Think about being force sensitive like this; You walk into someone's living room and, without knowing there is bacon being cooked, you _can tell_ bacon is being cooked in the kitchen because you can _smell_ it despite not being able to _see_ it!
Now, as a Jedi, you have a "sense of smell" capable of detecting:
Future events
Past events
People's emotions
Life forms and their general condition
When a Jedi walks into the room, they can sense people like we sense bacon....and I would imagine different emotional states create different "smells" for a Jedi.
To that end, fighting Greivous would be like working in a waste water treatment plant! "The smell! _OH GO-_ * nearly upchucks * _what is that!_ * points * _Is it moving!?_ *HOW IS IT ALIVE!?"*
Meanwhile Obi-Wan is the waste water treatment employee of 10 years all nonchalantly like, "Trust me, it gets worse." * calmly removes torso sized snapping turtle from drain like it's nothing *
And Grievous used that fact to his benefit
The feeling of him - "WHAT HAPPENED, _HOW IS THAT THING ALIVE,"_ before you ever see it!
The feeling of what he plans for your future
The feeling of his _anger_ so strong that it feels like it might actually burn you _through_ the force!
This video harkens back to all those years I was wrapped deep in the Star Wars lore and universe. It just makes me long for the old days of Star Wars . . . back when "Legacy" was the actual canon and the people who partook in creating for the series actually cared about it.
Nostalgia is a special kind of pain.
28:28 Grevious running and hiding like he always did, coward.
I think the cyborg general(Grievous) took down many jedi 12 or way more, yet I don't know about hundreds of jedi(it's understandable if it's dozens yet I don't know), the general moves at the speed that everything to his rotating electro-drivers to his lightsabers disappear into a blur. 31:29 do you even consider if it's his body or his soul?
12 or more…
As great as a swordsman grievous was there was nothing he could do against someone using the force against him. And it especially doesn't help when he meets someone that's superior with a light saber than him like Obi-Wan.
This. Sure Obiwan might be his only Jedi match in lightsaber combat, but I'm pretty sure anyone with a decent proficiency of Force pull could disarm Grievous or Force stun him
@@MagustheseerThat's why his most successful attacks against Jedi happened in surprise ambushes or hit and run tactics. I also wonder if at least one Jedi tried to force-pull his weapons from him, but his cybernetically enhanced grip was too strong to pry open.
In all the sources I’ve checked, not one says Soresu is the most common. It was popular while other forms came into being but that Niman was the most common especially during the Clone Wars. Shi-Cho came in second vis-à-vis Niman in number of sources stating it was the most common (and it was the oldest). Not one I’ve been able to find states Soresu.
From what I know, Shi-Cho is the first taught to all Jedi initiates/younglings. Niman was the most common before the start of the Clone Wars, but fell out of favor when every single Niman user died on Geonosis.
@@HavocPrime8989 not every niman user, but yeah. The Jedi typically chose to switch to soresu, as it was the form considered best for defense and non-lethal combat. Both things they desperately wanted.
Sad thing is, niman is potentially just as powerful. It’s just that most practitioners on Geonosis relied way too heavily on the force, neglecting the fundamentals of lightsaber combat. Masters of niman need both, like Exar kun
@@Wolfaydragoon Niman is potentially one of the best forms, but only if the practitioner has a firm mastery of the other forms. Cin Drallig and Exar Kun are prime examples of Niman masters.
The problem was that most of the Niman practitioners were not lightsaber specialists and very rarely had real experience. The "Consular's form" was often learned before the Clone Wars by those who rarely practiced using their lightsaber. And that bit them in the rear when they needed it.
As best as I can tell, all three: Niman, Shii-Cho, and Soresu, are defensive forms.
Niman seems to be very basic and easily blends into other styles, though it also serves as the base for the dual wielding defensive Jar'Kai style.
Shii-cho and Soresu seem to be fairly similar, both heavily focused on the defensive basics of lightsaber combat, blocking other sabers and deflecting blaster fire. The only difference I seem to find is that Shii-Cho tends to be better against a barrage attack by multiple opponents while Soresu is superior against a single opponent, becoming less effective as the number of attacks increases. But while Grievous could increase his attack speed to try and overtake Soresu, that left him open.
@josephperez2004 Shii-Cho isn't particularly defensive. It evolved out of regular swordsmanship adapted for lightsaber combat. It's a foundation for every other form. Because most of it uses wide sweeps, it is great for fending off multiple opponents, but can falter against a singular focused duelist. Weak against Makashi.
Soresu is defensive and designed to face blaster wielding foes. This is why it gained a lot of favor as blaster users became more common than lightsaber wielding opponents. However, it lacks a decisive attack, and focuses more on wearing down and outlasting opponents.
Niman blends most of forms I-V. If the foundation in the other forms is shallow, it is rather basic, having no real weakness, but no great strengths either. However, if someone masters all the previous forms, then incorporates Niman to blend them, it becomes devastating. Toss in some Force attacks and/or some Jar Kai, and you have the reason Exar Kun gave the Jedi nightmares.
Basically Obi-Wan is just a chill guy
By the time of Revenge of the Sith, I’d say that Yoda, Mace Windu and Anakin are all definitely powerful enough to beat Grievous because they are on a tier of power above the other Jedi, but excluding them and ofc Obi-Wan, other council members could win but it’s not certain
😳Wow! This is by far the best and most insightful character analysis of obi-wan I’ve ever seen, and I usually find him to be a forgettable character in most circumstances. Seriously, thank you for this! 🙏🏻
Before I watch the rest… I’m at 1:07. I think Kit Fisto could’ve beat his ass too. He definitely did in Clone Wars
I agree. I remember that episode 😂
Man this channel never misses on character analysis video's. It's always a treat and they never disappoint. That goes for all video's of this channel tho. Much love from a long time viewer.
Because of the high ground!
Everyone discounting Mace or Kit is wild.
Kit Fisto and Mace LITERALLY have the feats to back this up. Not even in a power scaling kind of way but in a "basically alteady did it" kind of way.
Obi-wan was definitely the one who did it, but as many times as characters put Grievous in the hands of mere fate I simply don't beleive he's the only POSSIBLE one.
There's plenty Grievous can counter, but I'm not taking the word of the Jedi that good ole Obi is the most capable or pure for this task. They are blind, foolish, and all dead in the end. Why would I trust their analysis here?
No-one is discounting them, most of the comments are people bringing them up
Kit actually puts Grievous on the ropes with SHII-CHO. As a refresher, that's Form I. The basic form. The progenitor form from which all other more advanced forms stem, and which every Jedi ever is expected to be competent in, but still badly outdated by modern standards.
And Fisto pins the Jedi-killer and would have scored a clean kill if not for the MagnaGuards. And then, despite Form I's weakness in single combat, he lasts the longest of the cannon fodder against Palpatine, actually defending himself for a few seconds before falling.
"and his form was like a cliff upon which the waves of the dark side would crash"
...and then I yote him into a balcony, lmao
- Dooku probably
Though I have rewatched & considered, I lack the words to concisely state how profound this video is. Suffice to say, it is a fine addition to my lore collection.
Thank you, Geetsly's Team, for your service to the galaxy. The Force will be with you, always. o7
I have always enjoyed your "military historian" approach to Star Wars, but I believe this video to be your crowning achievement!
Well done, my dude!
Obi Wan being humble and willing to learn even from his student is very evident in the clone wars. Sometimes he puts his foot down, but he’s also surprisingly willing to trust his student to go off on suicidal tasks and cover for him, or go along with an insane plan to hope for a better outcome. The pair cover each others weaknesses really well as characters, both in universe and in a narrative sense as well, and Obi Wan’s willingness to learn from his student makes this work really well as he shows genuine development from it.
27:17 what the hell is this thing?
A.I. crap
@@master_chef7807 god A.I. art sucks why dont they just use some actual images of Grievous off google or bing like they have for years? why would he even put this in the video if it looks that bad?
Obi Wan is literally the most OP Star Wars character:
He defeated/bested (and for some killed): Maul, Durge, Assaj Ventress, General Grevious, Darth Vader,
When Obi-Wan told Luke his father was betrayed by Darth Vader, he didn't necessarily lie; he had just - at that point - came to the conclusion 'Anakin' was truly gone. His line of "From a certain point of view" is his own. But you also have to keep in mind the father-son bond with Luke was what ultimately pulled him from the dark side.
Because Obi-Wan Kenobi has the High Ground over Grievous.
Actually he was below Grievous when he killed him. Just like when he defeated Anakin. His true power is not the high ground but the low ground.
@@rojaws1183He has mastered the high ground so thoroughly that it is always with him.
Stop with the aged cringe.
Its easy to forget with the ROTS film's and TCW show's rather underwhelming portrayal of the character that in old legends lore Grievous could stalemate MACE WINDU in pure lightsaber combat, and in the battle of Coruscant stomped a rested Shaak Ti with the help of two other experienced jedi masters who were operating at full strength (unlike the Hypori fight),
I really enjoyed this video. Crazy how you can still put out great videos despite Disney doing everything they can to destroy Star Wars
11:06 what good are fear and surprise without ruthless efficiency, an almost fanatical devotion to the pope, and nice red uniforms?
I find it hard to believe canon grievous could beat anyone
Well, this video has convinced me that it's actually fitting that people unfamiliar with Star Wars have mistaken pictures of Obi Wan as depictions of White Jesus.
Grievous is the unstoppable force while Obi-Wan Kenobi is the immovable object.
But Kenobi did stop him...
@@TheIrishRushin because Kenobi couldn't be moved.
Grevious was only unstoppable when it came to running away
Obi-wan is everones nemesis, grevious maul, vader, dooku.
Aanakin has force intelligence. Obi-Wan has force wisdom.
Simple answer: grievous is actually that good and sorisu is the perfect counter to him, so goo that it makes up for the difference in power between Obi-wan and the strongest jedi(yoda, windu and anakin)
By the way the reason anakin lost to obiwan on mustafar is he was severely nerfed emotionally after killing padme
This was a good one.
The explanation of Obi-wan, post intro, was great.
Kit Fisto could have finished him were it not for thu intervention of half a dozen Magnaguards. Grievous just coudn't keep up with the wild unpreditability of Fisto' form 1 or the calm precision of Kenobi. Obi-Wan was also "the one that got away" who constantly frustrated Grievous. He was never caught in the trappings of fear, surprise, or intimidation that Grievous relied on.
He’s my favorite Jedi. He may just be a side character, barely even that, but he’s just so damn cool!
Grievous is literally the embodiment of ‘Parry this, you filthy casual’!
Obi-Wan: "Let me solo him!"
The only Jedi? Are we forgetting Mace Windu faced, and beat grievous within mere seconds of engaging him like it was nothing? Just immediately force crushed his torso without hesitation.
Grevious biggest weakness is his asthma, bro cannot go 5 minutes without coughing his lungs out
God forbid someone threw tear gas at this man
I forgot how much I love the deep dives channel does. Merry Christmas
Really well thought out and narrated, thanks!
If Obi Wan was a common sight in the golden era, those Jedi were truly terrifying
hahaha the master kenobi relax? dang I thought he was the master of trolling!
Very well made presentation, and i do not even like star wars very much, watched the whole video with interest because of how interesting you made it. Now i know more about star wars! Thank you.
Obi-Wan always felt to me as the definition of best intentions. Whenever he was trying to be the one to stop the evil in the galaxy he seemed to make a mistake that he didnt know was a mistake until later down the line. His closeness to his own humanity was his only weakness and that is what makes him a good character.
Personally, the original trilogy version doesn't do him justice now a days as Clone Wars Obi-Wan seems to come off as a true Jedi but he seems to default to the old ways of the council that caused the rise of the empire by the time Luke arrives.
Its important to remember, legends Grievous arguably had been crippled by getting his organs force-crushed by mother-f***ing Mace Windu. In old legends canon, the cough only happened after that, meaning he was using his organs in his chest. It would be very strange to argue he was at full strength.
especially since Grievous decided to call off all the droids when he never had issues wearing jedi out before (Hypori comes to mind...) which suggests he wasn't thinking straight (the agony of your organs being crushed would tend to do that).
In "canon", TCW Grievous always coughed, and never meaningfully threatened jedi masters and council members in a pure 1-on-1, and in that show only ever was portrayed as able to dominate a Jedi utterly when engaging padawans.
Its also important to note how in the ROTS film, if you pay careful attention to the choreography, Grievous politely never actually attacks Obiwan with all four blades simultaneously, or just misses with no chance of any hitting. The choreography for Grievous is frankly terrible in the film, which stands out in stark contrast compared to the Obiwan/Anakin duel in the same movie (that latter duel having some of the BEST choreography in the franchise).
Kinda hard to make nice looking choreography with a machine that has four arms. Especially when comparing to two guys with swords i can see them having a hard time with it
@@thisisiampie6946 probably true! but boy oh boy, did it not help the public perception of the guy one single bit.
The reason obi wan chose soresu was due to how qui gon died. Qui Gon used ataru and trained obi wan in it as well the weakness of ataru was you needed to finish the fight quickly as it tired you out and obi wan got a front row seat to this issue in the phantom menace, that's when he switched styles as his focus
Your thumbnail of multiple Obi-Wans was my original thought of how the Clone Wars was. There were multiple clones of Obi-Wan and other Jedi fighting each other. Wasn't even a Droid army lol
In Clone Wars, Kit Fisto also defeated Grevious in a 1v1 but instead of finishing him off, he decided to leave and escape as everyone he came with were killed by Grevious, (Kit Fisto is also my favorite Jedi)
I know this video is about Obi-Wan but the picture of Darth Maul at 21:38 goes so damn hard
Obi-Wan was truly one of the best Jedi around. He was compassionate, had a great sense of humor, and he showed how Jedi could have friends and even a loved one without falling to the dark side, not by rejecting emotions like so Jedi tried, but by understanding, he had them and controlling them. And he did all just by being himself, never trying to be anything else. He knew he couldn't be Qui-Gon, Anakin, Mace, Yoda, Shaak Ti, and so on, if he tried he would only fail, and as Yoda once said, "Do or do not there is no try." This line, much like the Jedi Code itself is often misinterpreted, as its being taken a little too literally, saying you shouldn't practice and put effort into things because that requires trying, and like the Jedi you must strive for balance between the literal and the metaphorical. Jedi are all about practice, meditation, and improvement, that requires effort and trying, what Yoda says and Obi-Wan represents as one of the greatest Jedi is understanding what one can do and what they can't do. Obi-Wan can't be like all those other Jedi I mentioned, but he can be himself and be the best version of himself by improving, trying, and learning even as a Master, since as we see with him and Anakin or Anakin and Ahsoka, the student teaches the master just as much as the master teaches the student. That's why he could beat Grievous, because he didn't give into fear and try to be something he's not by fighting on Grevious's terms, he just had to be himself and play to his own strengths as a Jedi not try to play to some else's strengths.
Also a factor in his victory was his understanding and bond with he Force. When it comes to the Force many, even some Jedi, struggle with trusting it completely. As letting something else control you could take away you're own autonomy, stripping away you're free will, and whose to say this other force in control of you has your best intentions at heart and isn't just going to sacrifice you and leave you high and dry. These are all valid concerns, of course, but when it comes to the Force itself, and by extension the Jedi that wield it at least the good ones, this is not there intent. Despite it being called the Force, it doesn't try to force people to do things they don't want to do, everyone has free will and a choice, and if the Force or the Jedi took that away from people then they would be no different then the Sith and the Dark Side which is the ones who take away people's free will and subjugate them to terrible things, which is why the Jedi and the Force itself tries to oppose them to protect the people, because the Force itself and the Jedi, at least those that don't lose there way, want life to thrive, they want people to be safe and happy and live their free lives, as long as what they do doesn't cause too much trouble for other people and take away other peoples own free will. That's why the Jedi don't take Force-Sensative babies away from their parents unless the parents willingly agree and why they allow Jedi to leave the order, because everyone deserves to have free will and choice, and they shouldn't force their ways onto other people, pun intended. The Force is to act as a guide to the Jedi, never taking away their free will, simply sharing its knowledge and hoping they will make the right choices in life for themselves and the galaxy. And you don't even have to be fully aligned with the views of the Force and the Jedi to be on the good side and help the galaxy, I mean just look at characters like good natured Bounty Hunters like Sugi, or Mandalorians like Din, Bo, and Sabine, sure they all have their own selfish desires and want to be happy but there still decent and good people who help the galaxy and do more good then bad. Many Clones like those int he 212th that served with Obi-Wan were also like this. As long as you're doing decent in the galaxy and not causing to much trouble for others, the Force will let it slide. But the Sith and the Dark Side is never satisfied, so it just keeps hurting the people and the galaxy, until their is no choice but to stop it and destroy it because it's abused it's free will to cause so much harm and pain. Grievous is another example of this with all the suffering he caused, which is why he had to be stopped.
There were still many great Jedi left during the time of The Clone Wars, like Obi-Wan, Plo Koon, and even some of the problematic ones like Anakin and Mace still did a lot of good and helped a lot of people, showing there was still hope for he Jedi Order and the Galactic Republic. As the Revenge of the Sith novilzaion mentioned the Clone Wars was the end of the age of heroes, but it saved its best two for last Obi-Wan and Anakin. There were many heroes in the Clone Wars, and while they all either died or had to go into hiding when the war ended, they still did a lot of good before the dark times. And there was no better hero or Jedi during this time then Obi-Wan himself. Truly, no Jedi could reach the High Ground of heights Obi-Wan did, again pun intended.
Among other things Obi-Wan is a fine example of what I see as the paradox of simplicity, there are few thing more complicated then the really simple for there is no simple way for the complexities of reality to interact with it
Whats funny is that I never think of Obi-Wan as a powerful jedi. He is so unassuming, yet if you look at his actual deeds, he is one of the greatest jedi.
TLDR: obi wan practices a rare defensive saber style that excels in dealing with multiple threats at once (threats like all of grievous's sabers coming at him from all angles at once)
Obi-Wan is the master of "Enough" before KEnough was a thing.
inb4 someone does a "Bratty Obi-Wan Needs Some CORRECTION 💢💢💢💢"
In the EU continuity, this may actually be true and is implied in the novels.
Almost everytime someone gets the upper hand on Grievous it has an explanation that still favors him overall, like both of his encounters with Mace.
Anakin did. In a deleted alternate version of the start of Revenge of the Sith, Anakin and Obiwan get separated in grievous' ship. After anakin defeats dooku alone, he faces against grievous and according to the script literally effortlessy beats grievous and he flees and anakin calls him a coward
So Anakin didnt then?
Deleted for a reason...
I think Anakin would've been able to overpower Grievous had he gotten angry enough like in his final duel with Dooku.
@@AFlyingEwok nah, dooku being an old man and specialising in a form thats main weakness is bad defence against power hits, dooku had strict instructions from dooku to hold back against abakin as the goal was to turn him to the dark side. Anakin isnt physically overpowering grievous
It's the classic sporting phrase, "a good defense is the best offense."
So, I have a vague memory as a child from back to 2008-2009 when Star Wars the Clone Wars series aired.
I don´t know if it is lost media because any video talking about Grievous I´ve seen don´t mention it, but I remember reading in the Grievous page of the official site of the series that when he was a Khaleesh warlord he used to dream to become a jedi or something like that, but never could sense the force.
Probably it was some light changes to the character lore preparing for the decanonization of legends.
But I think that was a really cool aspect of the character, like a new layer of its origin, he was a tool across Jedi-Sith ideology between, a victim of world in war, but in the deepest part of him, the disappointment of what he could never be, therefore the thing he most especifically would want to defeat.
Someone remember reading something like that about him?
Obi-wan took "kill them with kindness" to the extreme.