It's less that Hans is a terrible twist villain; it's that he was so in-the-background compared to the duke that it felt like a heel-turn at 11:59pm. As a sociopathic villain, he works. But it feels wrong to call him a good twist villain. I'd say he's average in that regard.
And yet, doing so turned that into a trope. Shrek did it better, poking fun at fairy tales, but now that EVERYONE wants to do it? It’s tired, boring and LAAAAAMMMMEEE. 😤👎👎👎👎👎🛑🛑🛑🛑🛑
Honestly I think giving him a very slightly more pompous and smug vibe when he’s not with Anna would’ve been good to give him a more “two-faced” feeling, without making it SUPER obvious that he was overtly evil
This is a great analysis of hans. I've never liked him as a twist villain but you bring up intriguing points I'd never considered before. Now feel like he had the makings of a really good twist villain with just some iffy execution
As a kid, I was able to pinpoint subconsciously that he had to be the bad guy in a show(because of Anna going on her bizarre crusade with a snowman guy and a guy with a moose and by that logic her main character team was pretty much filled) But watching this video makes me see how much of a decently written guy he is really
It is surprising how little recognition you are getting for these videos. They are all really well written, good editing and audio, and great concepts. It feels like I'm watching a video from someone with millions of subs. I can see you going places man. Keep up the good work.
I enjoyed the twist at the time, but looking back on it, I would've preferred him as a good guy since the duke could've easily filled his villain role.
He was just so much a background character, to the point it kind of feels like before the twist but after his whole inside story with Anna, they throw him into scenes because they forgot he existed and then they throw him in to be there, and to tell weasel Town to sod off
My daughter is obsessed with Frozen so I've watched it countless times. A little detail I noticed in the scene the chandelier falls on Elsa, is just before Hans pushes the crossbow away from Elsa he glances up at the chandelier and even as he pushed it away it looks like he was deliberately aiming it. My theory is that he intentionally did that to make it seem like he tried to save Elsa but kill her at the same time.
I think in a way the animation in his body language and his tone of voice were quite obvious signs that he was up to no good. I feel like they could've made those aspects a bit more subtle, although it's a movie mainly aimed at kids so that's probably why he's very expressive. They could also get away with that by saying that Hans was just copying Anna's energy, to make himself more approachable for her. That would explain why he would just jump into a musical segment with her right off the bat. It's simple but effective! Great vid! I didn't really think much about his role when I first watched the movie, this made me want to rewatch it.
I feel like Hans should’ve been the antagonist, but not a villain. I feel that he should’ve kissed Anna, and the kiss doesn’t work so in order to save her and save Arendelle he decides to kill Elsa.
11:20, a point against the Theory, i'm pretty sure at the end of the film, someone mentions how Han's will be punished once he returns home, so his status is atleast recognized as legitimate.
yeah, a royal's genealagy and title would be easy to check. they kept track of that stuff, so hans couldn't be a nobody that just dressed well to marry a queen. his title would come up at the wedding
Finally someone made a video about how good of a twist villian he realy is. I kid you not, there are a lot of people on the internet who claim he is a terrible villian (in the sense that he is badly written), and they put him in the same package as proffesor Calahan fro Big Hero 6 who actually was pretty trash.
What doesn't make sense about him being a villain is the dock scene is the little smile he have while no one but the audience was there to see it. It makes no sense to do
Like everyone else parroting this same talking point for the last decade or so, just because _you_ haven't figured it out, doesn't mean there _isn't_ a reason. He literally explains it in the movie. When he first gets to Arendelle, he finds out that Elsa is frigid, and essentially a dead end, and he's wasted the trip. _Then_ he bumps into Anna and she's so -DTF- I mean, get married, that he's actually genuinely smiling because he can proceed with his plan after all. It's not for anyone's gain, except possibly his own? At least it's not for the audience, who is invisible to him... he's not Deadpool.
@@Wendy_O._Koopa The problem is the kind of smile he had on his face. There wasn't a hint of scheming or plotting in that smile, instead it looked more like the classic "This gal is cute/interesting" smile.
While I was shocked when Hans revealed his true side, I've always felt there was something off with him. Particularly during the song Love is an open door. Where he sings the line, "I've been serching my whole life to find my own place." The camera pan around, and the shot is the town of Arrendel.
He wasn’t even originally meant to be a twist villain or even a villain in the first place. I guarantee it and if I’m wrong then they suck at their job. They just decided to make him one after 90% of the movie was written. He wanted both the princesses dead yet he saved Elsa from the crossbow bolt, tried to prevent her from becoming a monster by killing the duke’s henchmen. With Anna he went looking for Anna and Elsa after she didn’t return after a couple days after going after her sister.
@@Wendy_O._Koopa 'foreshadowing' is giving the writers wayy too much credit lol 😭 it didn't make sense bc he had his chance to just let Elsa be killed, which was part of his plan, which didn't even make sense to begin with bc having both the sisters killed off (while telling the people him and Anna said their wedding vows as she was dying...??) wouldn't even make him ruler of the kingdom. the throne would have been passed on to some cousin of Elsa or something. at least if Anna survived he would have had some status, being married to the queen. but whatever, this movie was never that deep, Disney was just having their twist villain phase where they think a classic evil villain with a clear consistent motive and plan through and through is no longer good enough and they have to do it the 'smart' subversive way. jokes on them, now they've forgotten how to write a classic villain even if they're trying to.
@@soshi-805 Did you not watch the video? The way he has 12 brothers, the completely awkward way he sings his "duet" with Anna, the fact that nobody knows anything about him, his giving away stuff he didn't own to endear himself to the commoners. He actually missed some, like the way he looks at the chandelier and pretends to deflect the archer in order to save Elsa while also trying to kill her. I still have trouble believing nobody else saw at least _some_ of these on a first watch through; but I am _appalled_ that people persistently ignore them just to pretend that he was an eleventh hour change. I mean, it would at least have to be half-way through production, in order to change all his scenes to make him come off as a sociopath. Plus the whole final confrontation is with him, are people suggesting there just wasn't an ending? Or that the Duke of Weselton used to attack Elsa, and they spend millions of dollars reanimating it? In any case, giving Elsa and Anna a previously unmentioned cousin has nothing to do with him being a twist villain. Hans is still an idiot, but most villains are, I don't know what you were expecting.
@@Wendy_O._Koopa (an essay ahead bc Disney's sloppy twist writing really doesn't warrant this much retrospective hype and praise) his royalty background is acknowledged and confirmed on multiple occasions so yes, most definitely somebody knows something about him. he says it to Anna himself once the mask is off, and at the end he's deported to face punishment from his 12 brothers. the coronation and the party are events of royalty importance, they wouldn't let in commoners AND the royal family would even have had to study who the guests are to address them properly. 'giving away stuff he didn't own' yes bc he should've had soup shipped in from the Southern Isles instead...? if Hans' left in charge and just let people freeze and starve, bad or good he would've pissed Anna off lol. the chanderlier murder came out of nowhere bc his hands would've been clean if he'd just let it be. there were Arendelle guards present who could testify he 1, ordered that 'no harm is to come to the queen', 2, even attempted to talk her out of her (murderous) fit, and 3, didn't k!ll her! this is all to say, it's not that we missed the twist villain plot. it just feels forced and contrived and the twist unearned. it's more like an easy way out of the love triangle situation (bc there wasn't a good reason for Anna to ditch Hans for Kristoff) than a well set-up twist. if they had done it well they would've subtly shown his facade starting to crack as we see Anna and Kristoff bond (because by then the audience expect something must be off with Hans for the other 2 to end up together). but no, the writers wanted the movie to look smart, so Hans kept up the kind act in a very un-villain-like fashion. why encourage the queen to get her act together (twice!)?? if she gives up the crown (like she's already fully intent on!!) he's one step closer to, AND higher on the Arendelle royalty ladder. the glance up the chandelier could have worked, if it wasn't completely misaligned with his plan and true intentions like i said. and btw if the justification for his failure is that 'he's an idiot' (even though he's apparently cunning enough to 'fake save' Elsa for brownie points while also plotting for that crossbow shot to still 'accidentally' k!ll her... woah??) then yeah i think you ARE giving the writers way too much credit for having 'hinted at it all along' that he's a master manipulator.
@@soshi-805 *Kermit:* "Mmm. You know, it's amazing. You are 100% wrong. I mean, nothing you've said has been right." I'm not even sure what your rant about him being a real prince is about, that's my position. He wants to marry Anna so he's second in line instead of thirteenth. _Toon_ questioned it, but it has nothing to do with me. You've completely missed the point made about him giving away someone else's stuff. It looks shady AF. He's already raised several red flags by this point, this act should raise even more. Do people seriously think he's charismatic? As I've mentioned in this and other threads, I suspected Hans _almost_ immediately. I realized he was bad news ever since he said he was last in line after 12 brothers. Then they reinforced it with that intentionally awkward song. Unless you count thinking the kiss just wouldn't work, instead of him being quite _that_ cold hearted, there was no twist. We _did_ see his facade slowly crack, you're just refusing to acknowledge each and every instance, for some unknown reason. The chandelier scene hardly "comes out of nowhere," as it builds on all the previous shady stuff he's been up to. Also, it makes the onlookers think he's trying to save her, while also has the benefit of aiming the arrows at a _useful_ target. The guards weren't going to kill her aiming at her protective ice shield, he needed to get her from above. Of course, if he fails, there's still the backup plan of having her step down quietly. He _is_ a master manipulator, he knows exactly what to say to every one. Whether this is good writing, or he's just a Gary Stu is another story, and a very subjective one at that. Anyhow, *_you_* think his plan is dumb, and that's also subjective; but smart people do dumb things all the time. I don't know what world _you_ live in?
I was suspicious of Hans from the start. He was just too perfect. He gave me a vibe like Sebastián from Black Butler. Also, why would Hans abandon his own kingdom for another? Because he's the 13th son. It's my understanding that in noble and royal families, the eldest son and heir inherents everything and any younger sons are left with nothing. That's why younger sons must find their place in the world by themselves by either gaining a career through their own merits or (in Hans' case) marrying a prominent daughter and becoming a prince consort. In which case, he'd have to move in with his in-laws whether he liked it or not.
i was thinking that one of the main reasons Hans chose to betray Anna when he did was because he knew he had no true love for her and would be found out regardless. Maybe he had a well thought out plan that was interrupted buy the events that took place in the movie and as he decided to go with the flow thinking success was closer, he ended up losing because the sheer luck that put him in the position of power was actually bad luck that led to him losing it all.
It was all there, yes. It is detected when you no longer believe in Disney's "romantic" love. But, like you said, We let it go because we're already used to that narrative, and we know what to expect. My only complaint is in the reveal. He went from being a narcissist to a classic one dimensional villain, instead of keeping the mask on, like a narcissist would, even if he is more than revealed and catched on.
Most of the facts about Hans manipulation are true, but you mixed up sociopathy with psychopathy most of the time. As a true psychopath Hans wouldn`t have bothered with trying to win over the people of Arendelle with the charity or treating Anna decently. Most of his displayed trait fit more in the narcissist/sociopath-category. Also some of your stuff, just shows, that you didn`t do much research into the era ( 1840 ! ) Frozen is set in. Arendelle is a Kingdom, not just some town with a seaside-view. The duke of weselton wears gloves. The father of Anna and Elsa wore gloves. It was part of the (military-inspired ) parade-uniform most men wore at that time. Arguing that sideburn wouldn`t have been the trend is also wrong. Beside Christof ( who was raised by trolls and not veryinclined following/caring about being fashionable ) , most male ( background ) characters in the story have them too! Narcissist are very concscious about trends, since it is an important part for their deceptive mask and using the Halo-effect, by primping themself to please the eyes of others. Hans being just a con-artist is a nice THEORY, but that is it. He wouldn`t have been able to enter the ball as a commoner and claiming to be a prince, since all the people there would have been educated to recognize their fellow noble peers or the royals of other countries. Especially for Anna and Elsa it would have been a very important part of their education, since it is also connected with searching marriage-partners later.
Everything he does up to the reveal is actually objectively good, imo. He could have let Elsa get shot, and the only person standing in the way of him getting married to Ana would be gone, he could have let let Elsa kill the guard, and let people turn against her, he carried her down a mountain, and he stood guard in her cell because people wanted to kill Elsa. All things he could have NOT done to make his plan smoother
The persistent armchair diagnosing of sociopathy and use of "sociopath" and "narcissism" as interchangeable words is highly off-putting, and stigmatizing. There's no reason to diagnose a fictional character with a real disorder, and then proceed to spend the entire video throwing around the label when a person can manipulate others without it being tied to a personality disorder that stems from trauma. No idea if the creator of this is going to see this comment, or be receptive to it at all, but I'll comment it regardless, because personality disorders are regularly thrown around by people who know nothing about them. Like I said before, it's possible for a person to manipulate and harm others without it automatically meaning they're a narcissist or they're a "socio/psychopath", which are two different diagnoses, and it benefits nobody to stigmatize these disorders (NPD and ASPD), because it makes it harder for people who know what they're doing is wrong and want help to actually seek help if a majority of people in the world think they're hopeless and destined to be manipulators, or worse, criminals. Going as far as to contribute details like his nose to Hans being a sociopath was insane to me, and it really shows a lack of knowledge surrounding cluster B personality disorders and a lack of awareness when it comes to something as serious as a disorder like ASPD or NPD. There was another comment I saw that went into the details of why Hans was presented the way he was presented when it came to what he wore, and it's all the more proof that the creator did a limited amount of research and seems weirdly determined to pin a real diagnosis on a fictional character. There was really no reason for it, and a villain can be a villain without being a narcissist or a "sociopath". Hopefully this can be a reminder to stop demonizing personality disorders and attributing them automatically to people who do bad things. ASPD and NPD are not synonymous with being a criminal, or even being a bad person. It's possible to be diagnosed with either of those disorders and to be working on yourself in therapy to deal with trauma responses that lead you to manipulate others, whether intentionally or not. Another note, a lack of empathy is not inherently a bad thing. Many autistic people lack empathy, and that doesn't automatically make them a bad person. Empathy is the ability to understand and share another person's feelings and emotions. There's nothing inherently wrong with lacking this ability based on how your brain works, despite what many people might say, and again, a lack of empathy can stem from trauma. Yes, it can be helpful to be empathetic, but lacking it doesn't mean you're automatically a bad person who doesn't care about other people.
According to the laws of succession regardless if he married the queen or the princess he is not a candidate to take the thrown. He is not of the royal line. His children with Anna could assume the throne but not him
I enjoy your videos! Keep them coming I binge watch them lol 💯 Also I heard you talked about Hans sideburns & it being in the Middle Ages, yes you’re right in the Middle Ages they weren’t stylish, however in the 1800s they were very stylish, especially with the kind of hats the guards are wearing & the attire the officials, citizens & Hans is wearing. Also online it states that Frozen takes place in the 1800s, When I heard you say “in the Middle Ages” I was like “huh?” lol you’re right on everything else it I just wanted to let you know that. For me at least I study/ied history a lot so their attire & side burns gave it away for me 😂 Enjoy your work tho! 💯 💪🏼
12:50 ehhh.. A: disney logic. Singing is only acknowledged by those participating in it B: she wasn't walking. Girl was running. Up till now most of this vids making sense. Just pointing out that one flaw
Is he a bad written villain? Yes, he is so badly written even little kids point it out. One look at a history book can explain why he makes no sense as a villain (the duke makes more sense in many ways), even if that was not the case his backstory will tell you why (his brothers would have confiscated the kingdom). But the biggest is that the one who wrote the script for frozen is a well known man hater. All you got to do is look at all of Jennifer lees works, they all follow the same pattern of women good, men bad or men stupid or both. This is especially shown in wish where she tried to make Magnifico the bad guy but instead made him the only one who is good while everybody else is selfish. (Also Hans originally was meant to be a good guy but Jennifer Lee and Disney changed it cause they wanted to make sure Elsa and Anna were pictured as the good guys…. When let’s face it, they are not… in fact they are easily some of the worst role models out there for little girls)
Exactly. Jennifer Lee was the Kathleen Kennedy of Disney Animation Studios. She cares more about pushing an agenda than telling a good story with likeable and memorable characters. She's not an artist at all. Instead, she's an activist masquerading as such. It's beyond baffling how Frozen & Frozen 2, both woke movies, managed to do so well worldwide, while the other ones that she had direct involvement on such as A Wrinkle in Time, Strange World, and Wish bombed and rightfully so. She had proven herself to be highly-incapable of making and writing high-quality films. Now she's directing Frozen 3 & Frozen 4 with the third movie coming out on Thanksgiving Day 2027. She'll continue to push feminist and misandrist propaganda in both future Frozen films just like she did with the last two.
He has to have been telling the truth because, in the scene where he leaves on it to die, he is admitting to the truth about himself. Why would he keep up his act about having brothers then?
You should do Bushmaster from the Luke Cage Netflix series imo he's truly one of Marvels best yet underused and under appreciated live action adaptation of a villain
not necessarily either disney or dream works, but I would like you to look at Shogo Makishima from season 1 of Psycho-Pass. The dude is, probably the best written villain in anime
It was clear he will be villain from the start from what I remember, though he felt underdeveloped and forgotten for most of the movie. Couldn't call him good twist villain at all. Personally would either have exaggerated his personality in some way and maybe show more of him in some way or would have gone for double twist
What's all this "we missed it," business? I've been saying this since the movie came out. I knew he was marrying her to become prince since the minute he mentioned his 12 brothers. I figured the "twist" was gonna be him trying to kill Elsa, not Anna... but he _technically_ ended up doing both, so I was still right. Anyhow, thanks for finally making a video explaining most of the points of foreshadowing, it's too bad most people will ignore it, but at least it won't be your fault.
Feedback: I think in points. I am a logical thinker, so if you can give me three Things to do to write a good twist villain, that would be great. Love your vids!
That smile he has when he is under the boat in the water. Doesn't make sense he is alone no one sees this but the audience. It's completely out of place. Crazy people always drop their masks when they're alone or think people can't see them. He comes off as badly written because of that in my opinion.
And yet his idiotic fanbase want him back with a crappy redemption cause they care about is his looks. I can’t wait for Frozen “3”’s ACTUAL New Villain!
He's not a sociopath, he's a psychopath. Trevor Phillips is a sociopath. A psychopath is incapable of feeling any love or empathy. Sociopaths are able to feel love and empathy for at least a few people, albeit still quite capable of killing others easier than the average person. A psychopath is a lot better at blending in with society and passing themselves off as a normal person. A sociopath is more likely to act erratically and be noticed. Every time you've described a trait about sociopaths, they've actually fit psychopaths better. The Professional discusses the topic frequently in regards to Trevor Phillips, Claude, and Catalina. He has a degree in law enforcement and took at least one course in criminal psychology. Great video, though.
Prince Hans and Chelsea van Der zee could have been written a little better like Hans could have been a ally and Chelsea mother Narrissa could have been the villain instead of Chelsea!
It's less that Hans is a terrible twist villain; it's that he was so in-the-background compared to the duke that it felt like a heel-turn at 11:59pm.
As a sociopathic villain, he works. But it feels wrong to call him a good twist villain. I'd say he's average in that regard.
Agree, he's a well written sociopath but not a well written villain
I knew he was the bad written villain when he decided to engage with Anna the day they met.
Really? Disney hadn't really done twist villains up to that point. I thought they were like Prince Edward and Gisele.
Frozen released to subvert the usual tropes from Walt Disney.
And yet, doing so turned that into a trope. Shrek did it better, poking fun at fairy tales, but now that EVERYONE wants to do it? It’s tired, boring and LAAAAAMMMMEEE. 😤👎👎👎👎👎🛑🛑🛑🛑🛑
What does one have to do with the other tho
Honestly I think giving him a very slightly more pompous and smug vibe when he’s not with Anna would’ve been good to give him a more “two-faced” feeling, without making it SUPER obvious that he was overtly evil
This is a great analysis of hans. I've never liked him as a twist villain but you bring up intriguing points I'd never considered before. Now feel like he had the makings of a really good twist villain with just some iffy execution
I laughed so hard when Anna punched Hans into the water.
As a kid, I was able to pinpoint subconsciously that he had to be the bad guy in a show(because of Anna going on her bizarre crusade with a snowman guy and a guy with a moose and by that logic her main character team was pretty much filled)
But watching this video makes me see how much of a decently written guy he is really
It is surprising how little recognition you are getting for these videos. They are all really well written, good editing and audio, and great concepts. It feels like I'm watching a video from someone with millions of subs. I can see you going places man. Keep up the good work.
I enjoyed the twist at the time, but looking back on it, I would've preferred him as a good guy since the duke could've easily filled his villain role.
Totally agree. First time I watched I thought the duke was the villain, was confused when it ended up being Hans
Precisely
He was just so much a background character, to the point it kind of feels like before the twist but after his whole inside story with Anna, they throw him into scenes because they forgot he existed and then they throw him in to be there, and to tell weasel Town to sod off
I guess Anna had to... "Let Him Go." 😅
My daughter is obsessed with Frozen so I've watched it countless times. A little detail I noticed in the scene the chandelier falls on Elsa, is just before Hans pushes the crossbow away from Elsa he glances up at the chandelier and even as he pushed it away it looks like he was deliberately aiming it. My theory is that he intentionally did that to make it seem like he tried to save Elsa but kill her at the same time.
I was actually gonna bring that up to 😯
I think in a way the animation in his body language and his tone of voice were quite obvious signs that he was up to no good. I feel like they could've made those aspects a bit more subtle, although it's a movie mainly aimed at kids so that's probably why he's very expressive. They could also get away with that by saying that Hans was just copying Anna's energy, to make himself more approachable for her. That would explain why he would just jump into a musical segment with her right off the bat. It's simple but effective! Great vid! I didn't really think much about his role when I first watched the movie, this made me want to rewatch it.
I feel like Hans should’ve been the antagonist, but not a villain. I feel that he should’ve kissed Anna, and the kiss doesn’t work so in order to save her and save Arendelle he decides to kill Elsa.
11:20, a point against the Theory, i'm pretty sure at the end of the film, someone mentions how Han's will be punished once he returns home, so his status is atleast recognized as legitimate.
yeah, a royal's genealagy and title would be easy to check. they kept track of that stuff, so hans couldn't be a nobody that just dressed well to marry a queen. his title would come up at the wedding
Finally someone made a video about how good of a twist villian he realy is. I kid you not, there are a lot of people on the internet who claim he is a terrible villian (in the sense that he is badly written), and they put him in the same package as proffesor Calahan fro Big Hero 6 who actually was pretty trash.
What doesn't make sense about him being a villain is the dock scene is the little smile he have while no one but the audience was there to see it. It makes no sense to do
Like everyone else parroting this same talking point for the last decade or so, just because _you_ haven't figured it out, doesn't mean there _isn't_ a reason. He literally explains it in the movie. When he first gets to Arendelle, he finds out that Elsa is frigid, and essentially a dead end, and he's wasted the trip. _Then_ he bumps into Anna and she's so -DTF- I mean, get married, that he's actually genuinely smiling because he can proceed with his plan after all. It's not for anyone's gain, except possibly his own? At least it's not for the audience, who is invisible to him... he's not Deadpool.
Had a stroke reading this.
@@Wendy_O._Koopa The problem is the kind of smile he had on his face. There wasn't a hint of scheming or plotting in that smile, instead it looked more like the classic "This gal is cute/interesting" smile.
@@ArtiomSigma "Officer! The sociopath is displaying emotions in a slightly nonstandard way! Arrest this movie!"
He's not though. All he had to do was nothing and he rules as Anna's consort. He instead saves Elsa's life and puts his plan into motion after that.
While I was shocked when Hans revealed his true side, I've always felt there was something off with him. Particularly during the song Love is an open door. Where he sings the line, "I've been serching my whole life to find my own place." The camera pan around, and the shot is the town of Arrendel.
Wreck it Ralph is a perfect movie and I will never change my mindZ
He wasn’t even originally meant to be a twist villain or even a villain in the first place. I guarantee it and if I’m wrong then they suck at their job. They just decided to make him one after 90% of the movie was written. He wanted both the princesses dead yet he saved Elsa from the crossbow bolt, tried to prevent her from becoming a monster by killing the duke’s henchmen. With Anna he went looking for Anna and Elsa after she didn’t return after a couple days after going after her sister.
Maybe the problem was that we already knew that the princesses were going to save themselves, so it struck many of us as contrived. Unfair?
Ngl, the twist has already been laid out by one detail: Han's sideburn. Those are atrocious...
I’m not the only one who thinks he’s a good villain!
I'm gonna again propose to review Marlin from Finding Nemo as one of the best fathers in the animation history.
26:36 that wasn’t a push, that was a straight up knockout-of-a punch into the face 😂
1:29 it' still a dumb twist because, it came out of nowhere.
Or, you somehow missed all the foreshadowing, and you're projecting.
@@Wendy_O._Koopa 'foreshadowing' is giving the writers wayy too much credit lol 😭 it didn't make sense bc he had his chance to just let Elsa be killed, which was part of his plan, which didn't even make sense to begin with bc having both the sisters killed off (while telling the people him and Anna said their wedding vows as she was dying...??) wouldn't even make him ruler of the kingdom. the throne would have been passed on to some cousin of Elsa or something. at least if Anna survived he would have had some status, being married to the queen.
but whatever, this movie was never that deep, Disney was just having their twist villain phase where they think a classic evil villain with a clear consistent motive and plan through and through is no longer good enough and they have to do it the 'smart' subversive way. jokes on them, now they've forgotten how to write a classic villain even if they're trying to.
@@soshi-805 Did you not watch the video? The way he has 12 brothers, the completely awkward way he sings his "duet" with Anna, the fact that nobody knows anything about him, his giving away stuff he didn't own to endear himself to the commoners. He actually missed some, like the way he looks at the chandelier and pretends to deflect the archer in order to save Elsa while also trying to kill her.
I still have trouble believing nobody else saw at least _some_ of these on a first watch through; but I am _appalled_ that people persistently ignore them just to pretend that he was an eleventh hour change. I mean, it would at least have to be half-way through production, in order to change all his scenes to make him come off as a sociopath. Plus the whole final confrontation is with him, are people suggesting there just wasn't an ending? Or that the Duke of Weselton used to attack Elsa, and they spend millions of dollars reanimating it?
In any case, giving Elsa and Anna a previously unmentioned cousin has nothing to do with him being a twist villain. Hans is still an idiot, but most villains are, I don't know what you were expecting.
@@Wendy_O._Koopa (an essay ahead bc Disney's sloppy twist writing really doesn't warrant this much retrospective hype and praise)
his royalty background is acknowledged and confirmed on multiple occasions so yes, most definitely somebody knows something about him. he says it to Anna himself once the mask is off, and at the end he's deported to face punishment from his 12 brothers. the coronation and the party are events of royalty importance, they wouldn't let in commoners AND the royal family would even have had to study who the guests are to address them properly.
'giving away stuff he didn't own' yes bc he should've had soup shipped in from the Southern Isles instead...? if Hans' left in charge and just let people freeze and starve, bad or good he would've pissed Anna off lol.
the chanderlier murder came out of nowhere bc his hands would've been clean if he'd just let it be. there were Arendelle guards present who could testify he 1, ordered that 'no harm is to come to the queen', 2, even attempted to talk her out of her (murderous) fit, and 3, didn't k!ll her!
this is all to say, it's not that we missed the twist villain plot. it just feels forced and contrived and the twist unearned. it's more like an easy way out of the love triangle situation (bc there wasn't a good reason for Anna to ditch Hans for Kristoff) than a well set-up twist.
if they had done it well they would've subtly shown his facade starting to crack as we see Anna and Kristoff bond (because by then the audience expect something must be off with Hans for the other 2 to end up together). but no, the writers wanted the movie to look smart, so Hans kept up the kind act in a very un-villain-like fashion. why encourage the queen to get her act together (twice!)?? if she gives up the crown (like she's already fully intent on!!) he's one step closer to, AND higher on the Arendelle royalty ladder. the glance up the chandelier could have worked, if it wasn't completely misaligned with his plan and true intentions like i said.
and btw if the justification for his failure is that 'he's an idiot' (even though he's apparently cunning enough to 'fake save' Elsa for brownie points while also plotting for that crossbow shot to still 'accidentally' k!ll her... woah??) then yeah i think you ARE giving the writers way too much credit for having 'hinted at it all along' that he's a master manipulator.
@@soshi-805 *Kermit:* "Mmm. You know, it's amazing. You are 100% wrong. I mean, nothing you've said has been right."
I'm not even sure what your rant about him being a real prince is about, that's my position. He wants to marry Anna so he's second in line instead of thirteenth. _Toon_ questioned it, but it has nothing to do with me.
You've completely missed the point made about him giving away someone else's stuff. It looks shady AF. He's already raised several red flags by this point, this act should raise even more. Do people seriously think he's charismatic? As I've mentioned in this and other threads, I suspected Hans _almost_ immediately. I realized he was bad news ever since he said he was last in line after 12 brothers. Then they reinforced it with that intentionally awkward song. Unless you count thinking the kiss just wouldn't work, instead of him being quite _that_ cold hearted, there was no twist.
We _did_ see his facade slowly crack, you're just refusing to acknowledge each and every instance, for some unknown reason. The chandelier scene hardly "comes out of nowhere," as it builds on all the previous shady stuff he's been up to. Also, it makes the onlookers think he's trying to save her, while also has the benefit of aiming the arrows at a _useful_ target. The guards weren't going to kill her aiming at her protective ice shield, he needed to get her from above. Of course, if he fails, there's still the backup plan of having her step down quietly.
He _is_ a master manipulator, he knows exactly what to say to every one. Whether this is good writing, or he's just a Gary Stu is another story, and a very subjective one at that. Anyhow, *_you_* think his plan is dumb, and that's also subjective; but smart people do dumb things all the time. I don't know what world _you_ live in?
I was suspicious of Hans from the start. He was just too perfect. He gave me a vibe like Sebastián from Black Butler.
Also, why would Hans abandon his own kingdom for another? Because he's the 13th son. It's my understanding that in noble and royal families, the eldest son and heir inherents everything and any younger sons are left with nothing. That's why younger sons must find their place in the world by themselves by either gaining a career through their own merits or (in Hans' case) marrying a prominent daughter and becoming a prince consort. In which case, he'd have to move in with his in-laws whether he liked it or not.
What's also interesting with Anna and Hans' song is that Hans agrees with EVERYTHING Anna says. He didn't give any input of his own, just agreeing.
i was thinking that one of the main reasons Hans chose to betray Anna when he did was because he knew he had no true love for her and would be found out regardless. Maybe he had a well thought out plan that was interrupted buy the events that took place in the movie and as he decided to go with the flow thinking success was closer, he ended up losing because the sheer luck that put him in the position of power was actually bad luck that led to him losing it all.
The Sandwiches line in the song clued me in. there was no way he was going to say that.
It was all there, yes. It is detected when you no longer believe in Disney's "romantic" love. But, like you said, We let it go because we're already used to that narrative, and we know what to expect.
My only complaint is in the reveal. He went from being a narcissist to a classic one dimensional villain, instead of keeping the mask on, like a narcissist would, even if he is more than revealed and catched on.
Most of the facts about Hans manipulation are true, but you mixed up sociopathy with psychopathy most of the time. As a true psychopath Hans wouldn`t have bothered with trying to win over the people of Arendelle with the charity or treating Anna decently. Most of his displayed trait fit more in the narcissist/sociopath-category.
Also some of your stuff, just shows, that you didn`t do much research into the era ( 1840 ! ) Frozen is set in. Arendelle is a Kingdom, not just some town with a seaside-view. The duke of weselton wears gloves. The father of Anna and Elsa wore gloves. It was part of the (military-inspired ) parade-uniform most men wore at that time. Arguing that sideburn wouldn`t have been the trend is also wrong. Beside Christof ( who was raised by trolls and not veryinclined following/caring about being fashionable ) , most male ( background ) characters in the story have them too!
Narcissist are very concscious about trends, since it is an important part for their deceptive mask and using the Halo-effect, by primping themself to please the eyes of others.
Hans being just a con-artist is a nice THEORY, but that is it. He wouldn`t have been able to enter the ball as a commoner and claiming to be a prince, since all the people there would have been educated to recognize their fellow noble peers or the royals of other countries. Especially for Anna and Elsa it would have been a very important part of their education, since it is also connected with searching marriage-partners later.
Everything he does up to the reveal is actually objectively good, imo. He could have let Elsa get shot, and the only person standing in the way of him getting married to Ana would be gone, he could have let let Elsa kill the guard, and let people turn against her, he carried her down a mountain, and he stood guard in her cell because people wanted to kill Elsa. All things he could have NOT done to make his plan smoother
I noticed when he was selling all the kingdoms gold to get blankets
My sister told me he was evil before we saw the movie, so there was no surprise for me.
I saw the Twist Scene before seeing the full movie, and in the beginning I thought I must have misheard the name of the Twist villain
I wouldn't call him perfectly written, he's got his fair share of mistakes. But he is effective enough but there are many better than him.
The persistent armchair diagnosing of sociopathy and use of "sociopath" and "narcissism" as interchangeable words is highly off-putting, and stigmatizing. There's no reason to diagnose a fictional character with a real disorder, and then proceed to spend the entire video throwing around the label when a person can manipulate others without it being tied to a personality disorder that stems from trauma. No idea if the creator of this is going to see this comment, or be receptive to it at all, but I'll comment it regardless, because personality disorders are regularly thrown around by people who know nothing about them.
Like I said before, it's possible for a person to manipulate and harm others without it automatically meaning they're a narcissist or they're a "socio/psychopath", which are two different diagnoses, and it benefits nobody to stigmatize these disorders (NPD and ASPD), because it makes it harder for people who know what they're doing is wrong and want help to actually seek help if a majority of people in the world think they're hopeless and destined to be manipulators, or worse, criminals.
Going as far as to contribute details like his nose to Hans being a sociopath was insane to me, and it really shows a lack of knowledge surrounding cluster B personality disorders and a lack of awareness when it comes to something as serious as a disorder like ASPD or NPD.
There was another comment I saw that went into the details of why Hans was presented the way he was presented when it came to what he wore, and it's all the more proof that the creator did a limited amount of research and seems weirdly determined to pin a real diagnosis on a fictional character. There was really no reason for it, and a villain can be a villain without being a narcissist or a "sociopath".
Hopefully this can be a reminder to stop demonizing personality disorders and attributing them automatically to people who do bad things. ASPD and NPD are not synonymous with being a criminal, or even being a bad person. It's possible to be diagnosed with either of those disorders and to be working on yourself in therapy to deal with trauma responses that lead you to manipulate others, whether intentionally or not.
Another note, a lack of empathy is not inherently a bad thing. Many autistic people lack empathy, and that doesn't automatically make them a bad person. Empathy is the ability to understand and share another person's feelings and emotions. There's nothing inherently wrong with lacking this ability based on how your brain works, despite what many people might say, and again, a lack of empathy can stem from trauma. Yes, it can be helpful to be empathetic, but lacking it doesn't mean you're automatically a bad person who doesn't care about other people.
good comment
Great comment
According to the laws of succession regardless if he married the queen or the princess he is not a candidate to take the thrown. He is not of the royal line. His children with Anna could assume the throne but not him
he also sings over her in the love is an open door song and louder
I enjoy your videos! Keep them coming I binge watch them lol 💯
Also I heard you talked about Hans sideburns & it being in the Middle Ages, yes you’re right in the Middle Ages they weren’t stylish, however in the 1800s they were very stylish, especially with the kind of hats the guards are wearing & the attire the officials, citizens & Hans is wearing. Also online it states that Frozen takes place in the 1800s, When I heard you say “in the Middle Ages” I was like “huh?” lol you’re right on everything else it I just wanted to let you know that. For me at least I
study/ied history a lot so their attire & side burns gave it away for me 😂
Enjoy your work tho! 💯 💪🏼
12:50 ehhh..
A: disney logic. Singing is only acknowledged by those participating in it
B: she wasn't walking. Girl was running.
Up till now most of this vids making sense. Just pointing out that one flaw
The only reason he would do that is if he made himself believe his Lie of a backstory.
His backstory is probably true. The best deceptions are often based on truth.
Is he a bad written villain? Yes, he is so badly written even little kids point it out.
One look at a history book can explain why he makes no sense as a villain (the duke makes more sense in many ways), even if that was not the case his backstory will tell you why (his brothers would have confiscated the kingdom).
But the biggest is that the one who wrote the script for frozen is a well known man hater. All you got to do is look at all of Jennifer lees works, they all follow the same pattern of women good, men bad or men stupid or both. This is especially shown in wish where she tried to make Magnifico the bad guy but instead made him the only one who is good while everybody else is selfish. (Also Hans originally was meant to be a good guy but Jennifer Lee and Disney changed it cause they wanted to make sure Elsa and Anna were pictured as the good guys…. When let’s face it, they are not… in fact they are easily some of the worst role models out there for little girls)
Exactly. Jennifer Lee was the Kathleen Kennedy of Disney Animation Studios. She cares more about pushing an agenda than telling a good story with likeable and memorable characters. She's not an artist at all. Instead, she's an activist masquerading as such. It's beyond baffling how Frozen & Frozen 2, both woke movies, managed to do so well worldwide, while the other ones that she had direct involvement on such as A Wrinkle in Time, Strange World, and Wish bombed and rightfully so. She had proven herself to be highly-incapable of making and writing high-quality films. Now she's directing Frozen 3 & Frozen 4 with the third movie coming out on Thanksgiving Day 2027. She'll continue to push feminist and misandrist propaganda in both future Frozen films just like she did with the last two.
@@1992disneyThe frozen movies are successful because of the music, that was all I heard people talking about back then.
@@Sparklecakes13 Yeah. Both that and the "subversion" of Disney Princess tropes, especially one about true love.
He has to have been telling the truth because, in the scene where he leaves on it to die, he is admitting to the truth about himself. Why would he keep up his act about having brothers then?
You should do Bushmaster from the Luke Cage Netflix series imo he's truly one of Marvels best yet underused and under appreciated live action adaptation of a villain
not necessarily either disney or dream works, but I would like you to look at Shogo Makishima from season 1 of Psycho-Pass.
The dude is, probably the best written villain in anime
It was clear he will be villain from the start from what I remember, though he felt underdeveloped and forgotten for most of the movie. Couldn't call him good twist villain at all. Personally would either have exaggerated his personality in some way and maybe show more of him in some way or would have gone for double twist
Can you do writings of other Disney Villains and what types they are?
What's all this "we missed it," business? I've been saying this since the movie came out. I knew he was marrying her to become prince since the minute he mentioned his 12 brothers. I figured the "twist" was gonna be him trying to kill Elsa, not Anna... but he _technically_ ended up doing both, so I was still right. Anyhow, thanks for finally making a video explaining most of the points of foreshadowing, it's too bad most people will ignore it, but at least it won't be your fault.
Feedback: I think in points. I am a logical thinker, so if you can give me three Things to do to write a good twist villain, that would be great. Love your vids!
I forgot he existed for a while in the movie
That smile he has when he is under the boat in the water. Doesn't make sense he is alone no one sees this but the audience. It's completely out of place. Crazy people always drop their masks when they're alone or think people can't see them. He comes off as badly written because of that in my opinion.
And yet his idiotic fanbase want him back with a crappy redemption cause they care about is his looks.
I can’t wait for Frozen “3”’s ACTUAL New Villain!
Omg you did it 💗
I was about to ask if you should have waited to post this on April Fools' but then you got past the intro.😂
He's not a sociopath, he's a psychopath.
Trevor Phillips is a sociopath.
A psychopath is incapable of feeling any love or empathy. Sociopaths are able to feel love and empathy for at least a few people, albeit still quite capable of killing others easier than the average person. A psychopath is a lot better at blending in with society and passing themselves off as a normal person. A sociopath is more likely to act erratically and be noticed. Every time you've described a trait about sociopaths, they've actually fit psychopaths better.
The Professional discusses the topic frequently in regards to Trevor Phillips, Claude, and Catalina. He has a degree in law enforcement and took at least one course in criminal psychology.
Great video, though.
Actually, psychopaths are marked by outbursts of anger. Sociopaths can't FEEL emotion. They're frozen. Toon is right.
Just to clarify can you do turbo the Snail villain
PLEASE MAKE A VIDEO ABOUT THE BEST DISNEY PRINCESS HEROINE! 😊💖👑
I doubt Frozen is meant to be as early AS the middle ages. More ancient regime/early modern times
Prince Hans and Chelsea van Der zee could have been written a little better like Hans could have been a ally and Chelsea mother Narrissa could have been the villain instead of Chelsea!
Ew gross, Frozen came out in 2013. I don't believe that.
ooo
Nope, it was a stupid twist.
Hans is a twist to kids, NOT adults!
This is a nothing burger video