The flat spin scene wasn't done with an actual F14, it's a model shot. However, they did have legendary stunt pilot Art Scholl perform a flat spin for the shots of the spinning sky. Sadly he was killed after his plane wouldn't recover from the spin, hence why the movie is dedicated to him.
I just learned about this recently. I’m glad you mentioned it here; he should be known and remembered. Apparently he was quite a wonderful pilot. Unfortunately, it’s too easy to forget/overlook the people behind the scenes whose talent contributes so much to the movies we love.
@@Joreel Actually....case 1 carrier landings have them fly right by the tower starboard side each trip around counter clockwise, going wide on the port side in case they are able to line up and land.. At a prescribed 350 knots, if memory serves. It is completely normal.
Actually at 1:11 he’s totally right in saying “Cougar and Merlin AND Maverick and Goose”. There’s no need for a comma as Cougar and Merlin is one team and Maverick and Goose another. There aren’t 4 fighter jets in the air. There are only 2, Cougar and Merlin AND Maverick and Goose.
I’ve been searching for this comment. He’s describing them based on the seating of their jets. How did he not realize that when the following scene shows that?! Lol
CinemaSins mislabels Goose as a "co-pilot" for some time. He's the Radio Intercept Officer. The flat spin was done by the special effects team using a model. Fun fact: Jamie Hyneman of Mythbusters fame was on the effects team.
Isn’t that the model Jett that we see hanging above them for the first few seasons of myth busters? I think it either comes from top gun or the sum of all fears
@@bsgtrekfan88 That one is from Top Gun but iirc that's one of the planes shot down in the finale. I don't know if they were reusing the model or if it's a different model just for that shot.
I always thought that Maverick forgave Iceman a little TOO easily for inadvertently causing the accident that killed Goose, even though Iceman apologised. HISHE has a hilarious skit pointing this out!
Did Iceman cause it, though? Maverick could have just realized he wasn't going to get a fair shot at Viper and withdrawn, thus preventing Ice's jetwash from taking him out in the first place. There's too many improbables here to place blame.
@@nolanboles8492 No actually I think Ice DID kinda cause it. Maverick instructed him to pull off high right and he went left…I believe. I was Top Gun crazy when it came out. I seem to remember he went the wrong way or the A-4 changed direction at the same time…If I am wrong please forgive me.
@@nolanboles8492 Yes, Iceman had fallen out of the pocket to properly attack Viper. In training when you have a wingman, protocol is for the Wingman to come in behind and take the place of the lead plane, as they have the ability to properly line up. Iceman had lost his shot, and should have been beholden to Maverick’s calls to move out of position, instead he tried to re-engage, and the jet wash caused Mavericks engines to not have any oxygen for a few seconds, and they failed one before the other, which is what caused the flat spin. TLDR, very much Iceman’s fault.
Going to respond to a lot of these, but #97 is tragic. The flat spin sequence was very real, and unfortunately the stunt pilot Art Scholl died while performing the stunt (Not the specific one from the film). As he was doing one of the many instances of the move, he lost control and was never able to recover. He was quoted as saying "I have a problem, I have a real problem" just before he crashed into the ocean. You see the film dedicated to him at the end of the credits. RIP-
True, and he was flying his Pitts Special, filming the scene. Speculated he became disorientated or had a mechanical problem. His body was never found.
Yeah. Hate to have to say it, but I wish that the camera footage was crappy CGI or something other than a live shot. If it had been, then Scholl wouldn't have died. Obviously there's no way to know beforehand, of course, and Scholl thought he could pull it off, so it's not like the movie personnel are to blame, but it's still sad.
Also, there's history of the SAME thing happened to Goose as in real life. It has been documented in real life flat-spin F-14, where pilots injured or died because of collision with the canopy during ejection. And F-14 has a history of flat-spins.
Because of watching this channel for a few years now, I can't help but instinctively say "roll credits" if the title is said at any point during the movie
1:09 The way that the aviators were named always made perfect sense to me because an F-14 has a pilot and a RIO (radar intercept officer), which means that he is stating the two teams, each one with two aviators, thus "Cougar and Merlin (in plane 1) & Maverick and Goose (in plane 2)."
16:25 that's actually an extremely common occurrence after a crash or tragic incident. The logic is the longer you let the pilot dwell the harder it is for them to get back up in the air at all. That happened to my grandpa both times he got shot down in Vietnam.
It's a easier way to release your anger of losing your friend by wanting to kill every enemy jet you see. The hate and anger makes you focus and become a better jockey.
Yep, the saying "get back on the horse" comes from exactly this. When I broke my wrist, I got back on immediately and had no issue riding thereafter. When I fell another time, I didn't get back on immediately and had to start back at basics five years later because I'd psyched myself up about it so much in the intervening years.
@@lizzieperlizzie I was in a school bus accident on a stormy day during a side trip at our school's Science Camp and some of the other kids didn't want to get on the bus that came to get us. I told myself "Well, it's the only way to get back to camp because I'm NOT walking."
You forgot to sin goose using a Polaroid camera with a flash against not 1 but 2 sets of cockpit glass (his and the MIG) thus the pic would probably just be a whiteout.
Both the Russian and American jets were designed with special Polaroid compliant cockpit glass as that was the most effective way for each country to spy on each other. I though everyone knew that
Fun fact: Given all the military laws Maverick broke in this movie, if it had happened during war time, he could’ve gotten the death penalty. I’m not kidding.
Just disobeying a single direct order is enough for the death penalty in the military during war time. From the Legal Eagle video. They very much would have been technically in war time for a period. And at the very least he'd get 3-4 years in the brig, and be dishonourably discharged
I just rewatched this after many years in anticipating of finally seeing Top Gun Maverick tomorrow. While the flying action pretty good, I found myself kind of struck at the rather shallowness of the story. Easily the most likable character to me is Goose. Additionally, I find Iceman's attitude/body language not really matching his criticism of Maverick. Iceman doesn't like Maverick for being a reckless hotshot, which is perfectly fair, but the vibe I get from Iceman is also of a too cocky hotshot, rather than a no-nonsense professional.
I rewatched it recently after watching TG Maverick. I agree about Goose, I was surprised by how likeable the character was, specially compared to the others. It also struck me how Iceman is always mentioned as this great pilot and the #1 and all, but the one time we see him in action during the Top Gun school he is ineffective and virtually causes the accident that kills Goose. The movie should have been a fierce competition between him and Maverick, but we never get that.
I attended Top Gun when I was active duty - not as a pilot but as Supply Chain. The Pilots basically go there to learn how to become flight instructors. They are indeed some of the best the fleet has to offer, and at that point in their career its about teaching them to pass on those skills.
Did alot of guys have a choice between being test pilots or going instructor? Or was that a whole diffrent deal? I dealt with P-3s and those pilots I always felt like they wanted to be fighter pilots but weren't good enough so many had chips on their shoulders.
@@evilcartmensolo7198 I think the majority were set to be instructors, but there were def test pilots for some of the more advanced aircraft - for instance I was in when the F-35 was beginning trials, so a lucky few got to practice carrier field landing.
Is that about the time they go from flying high-performance jets to flying an office chair? Like, maybe their eyesight and reflexes aren't what they used to be, but their knowledge and experience are still useful? 🙂
@@BennyLlama39 hahaha exactly - all in all it was a really fun experience - for the most part the pilots weren't pricks since they were away from their normal command and could just act normal again.
I used to stay there when we'd visit family in SD (AF usually doesn't have bases in places that aren't deserts or plains so we go to Navy/MC bases). I loved that base.
_Over the Top_ was probably pitched as _”Top Gun_ on 18 wheels” 🛞🛞🛞🛞🛞🛞🛞🛞🛞🛞🛞 *I feel like Michael Bay un-ironically thinks both movies are prequels to his Transformers movies*
Yes, great movie. I didn't realize that Cinrmasins hadn't done this movie already. I thought he'd done all of the big name 80s and 90s movies a while ago now
Fun Fact: Ally Sheedy was offered the role of Charlie, but she turned it down, thinking that nobody would want to see a movie about fighter pilots. She reportedly regretted this decision later on.
I literally just wrote a huge explanation and then saw this comment. Also the Rio did have a Polaroid on board and took a picture of the mig which you can still find. There’s also a picture of a Rio reading a f14 magazine mid flight that he took with a Polaroid
The Sin counter would be a lot less if CS knew what Goose's job actually was, LOL. He is a RIO, Radar Intercept Officer, and it is his job to handle comms and radar so the pilot can focus on, well, flying the damn plane. RIO's don't even need pilot qualifications as there are no controls in their area to fly the plane anyway.
@@lukereyes6266 in the backseat of an F-15E yes the WSO can take control of the aircraft. But the backseat of an F-14 at least the early models such as the ones shown in top gun do not have a set of controls in the backseat for the RIO. So they would not be able to fly the plane. The stick in the back is for radar controls.
@@lukereyes6266 Michael is right , that’s why Merlin was getting so nervous when Cougar lost it.. he was unable to do anything from his seat and if cougar did not snap out if it would have been a passenger on a death flight.
His major gripe with Goose's role though, was not its official function, but the fact that Maverick chose to disregard his suggestions and pleads so often and so completely. You want to have a highly efficient team manning these aircrafts, but here it was one pilot and one casual passenger.
11:09 The breaking of the hard deck was a violation of the rules of the school, disobeying the Tower for the flyby is major safety violation that is a Federal crime and the pilot can lose their flight certification, so yeah, the Flyby was the bigger deal.
15:12 This is an actual bar in downtown San Diego called the Kansas City BBQ. So the Kansas flag makes sense, although it should probably have the Missouri flag.
Glad I'm not the only one about to sin his sin. I remember driving by this place all the time from the 32nd St Naval Base into downtown seeing the Top Gun neon lights in the window.
@@x5992 I attempted to go there twice when I was living in LI in SD, and walked out both times. Place was a mess and the staff had no interest in cleaning, so we left
9:57 - If you listen to the entire debriefing, Viper tells Maverick that Jester had lost visual on Maverick & Goose and called "No Joy" before dropping below the hard deck. That's not an uncommon practice in training scenarios with multiple aircraft as a way to protect pilot safety so two aircraft don't inadvertently collide because one pilot lost sight of another. Since Viper doesn't dispute Jester's claim, it's almost certain that he was either listening to the comm traffic during the hop, or he heard a recording of it between the end of the hop and the debriefing. What I always took away from this scene is the Jester knew Maverick was a better pilot, and he lied about losing visual just so he could drop below the hard deck and end the hop without officially losing to Maverick. EDIT: I never understood the bit where Maverick "quits." He can't quit...he was ordered to attend Top Gun. By leaving Top Gun he was AWOL and should have been arrested and thrown in the brig.
@@missolympiabinewski Oh, definitely. Him going AWOL is just the one that really stood out for me, even when I watched the film as a kid in the late '80s. I had an uncle (by marriage) go AWOL in the early '80s because he didn't want to go on his remote assignment to Alaska for about a year without his family. He decided he'd just take off. Hitched rides back to Indiana and came wandering down the driveway at my grandparents' house on Thanksgiving. The MPs showed up about an hour later looking for him. He was arrested and eventually slapped with a dishonorable discharge. Dude was a cook and had been in the Army for about 15 years. Lost his pension and had a hell of a time finding work for the rest of his life. And all of my dad's brothers (this uncle married one of my dad's sisters) called him AWOL for the rest of his life. So that's why I was always puzzled by Maverick going AWOL ave not being arrested.
@@agent_skully I'm well aware an officer can resign their commission. Maverick clearly didn't since he left the base immediately and didn't lose his flight status. He was most definitely AWOL.
Don't know how many pounds equals one-seventh of a tank, but in aviation, you typically want to be overhead your intended landing location with enough fuel to make it to an alternate airport (Not sure how that works with carriers) or at least, enough fuel to make more than one landing attempt. That fuel also serves to provide loiter time overhead in case there is something happening on the field that delays landing for a short time. Bingo fuel equals the amount needed to return home plus the pre-calculated amount left in the tank once wheels down. These numbers vary by theater, command, threat matrix, airframe, pilot judgement, etc. This is all calculated and put out at the pre-flight brief long before asses connect to seat cushions. TLDR: You don't ever run an airplane down to "empty."
His math is wrong for the Tomcat anyway. The gauge shows 2200lbs and the F14 with two tanks has 21000lbs of fuel... so call it a tenth of the total fuel. Made worse by the F14 fuel system trapping 300-500lbs of fuel on the tanks. So his 2200lbs is like 1900lbs of you are optimistic. Given a burn rate of 5500lbs/hr per engine at low altitude and he's got a pretty short amount of flight time left.
I love this movie, I was going to be a fighter pilot but just as I was going to the recruiter, I found out I had type 1 diabetes. I wanted to fly Tomcats but shortly there after I found out they retired it. Also, I am surprised you did not sin the MiG-28 not existing, in fact in the first class sequence Charlie actually spills the beans on what planes they do use, F-14, F-5 (which is the actual MiG-28), and A-4 (used in the school by the teachers).
Same bud same and I hadn't even seen top gun yet I spent 2 years in jrotc for the extra credit out of basic but end of sophomore year I found our diabetes is a nope
3:03 There's actually a minimum amount of fuel you can have before landing, depending on the aircraft, at a certain amount of fuel left you have to declare low fuel and if you expect to have around 5% of fuel left by the expected time of arrival you have to declare emergency fuel, this is so that airports and Carriers can determine who needs to land in what order so that planes don't start falling out of the sky waiting to land, you do not want to go below that low fuel amount, its extremally dangerous. So yea they don't have enough fuel for that. *Ding* Cinimasins sin counter:1
@@micahphilson yea at the time they had enough fuel to get back but they would of been really low and thats without the extra time it would take to help get the other guy back, i forget his name, I didn’t do the math I’m just going off what Jeremy said about them being 250 miles away from the carrier and them having 200 something miles of fuel left. I also don’t know the fuel specific limit for low fuel/emergency fuel for the jet I only know it for a cessna lol
@@SPFLDAngler people still can’t understand a joke that also relays interesting information to others that might not know it, based on context from a video? Yikes
@@owlkage7700 Jokes are meant to be funny. A lot of the technical shit cinemasins tries to nitpick isn't funny on this occasion - it comes off as ignorant and stupid.
2:18 Yes, because it's not his personal camera; he's not "allowed" to have it, he's *instructed* to have it. It's part of his job to take photos of foreign planes they might encounter for intel purposes. After landing, he needs to hand over the camera and the photos specifically for the reason you mention (secrecy).
The pilots receive the notification of the crisis situation from Viper only one minute after graduating from Top Gun. Not even ten minutes before or ten minutes after. Wow, that's perfect timing! lol.
I came here for one sin in particular and it wasn't mentioned, it has ALWAYS bugged me. We know the movie takes place in the summer (because it's mentioned that Goose died on July 29th). Maverick is supposed to meet Charlie for their dinner date at 5:30. When he pulls up to the house, the sun is setting on the Pacific, so it must be around 7:45ish (two hours late, Maverick?!!!). Anyway, they eat and talk and then he leaves and as he drives away the sun is still setting!! Was he there for 24 hours?! Aside from the many sins you pointed out, this one has always bothered me, lol :)
3:07 He's all shaken up and yet lands without incident. Almost like... they train for that hundreds of times so it's muscle memory, and there's some small leeway in case problems arise, and even if he's distracted he's a professional (one of the top in the Navy even), and incidents during landing are pretty rare for good reason...
It isn't that he's just shaken up. His aircraft was pitching and yawing to such a degree that it's a statistical improbability his tailhook could have actually caught the wire. And even if it did catch the wire (which, yes, it did), there's no way he wasn't smacking a wing on the deck. (For those unaware, carrier decks are obviously incredibly short landing strips. When carrier-based aircraft land, they have what are called tailhooks... literally a hook at the tail of the aircraft. These hooks catch arresting wires, four of which are strung across the beginning of the landing strip. If you fail to catch the wire, the pilot has to do a missed approach and try to get the jet back up in the air, or they're likely going over the side unless they are already at such low speed that they can stop the aircraft without the assistance. At least, that's my limited knowledge on it, any NAS pilots or deck crew reading this feel free to correct me if I'm wildly off base.)
@@rcslyman8929 The landing areas aren't as short as you'd think -- 500 feet or about a football field and a half (including endzones). If you hit the #4 wire (aka "sissy wire" or "COD wire"), you've got plenty of room. Hit the #3 wire (competent pilots), not so much. Only the best aim for the #2 wire (fighter pilots). But... if you grab the #1 wire, you stop with you nose looking over the edge into the drink, so you're either a shitty pilot, a lucky pilot, or a psychopath who did it on purpose.
@@samuelperezgarcia you don't know what muscle memory is? it means that you've done something enough times that you don't even have to think about it to do it, an example would be playing an instrument; I play guitar, and there's a few solos that I played enough to be able to play them with my eyes closed and while thinking about something else. It also applies to things like driving or typing on a keyboard. Here's the wikipedia page about it if you want to read more: en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Muscle_memory#:~:text=Muscle%20memory%20is%20a%20form,used%20synonymously%20with%20motor%20learning.
@@johnpauljones9310 Some incorrect things about the carriers wires here. The wires are number 1-4 starting from the trap closest to the stern. The #1 means you're too low and are close to hitting the deck, while the #2 wire is the optimum one to trap on. The #2 and #4 wire are acceptable, but naval aviators need to consistently trap third to be promoted.
The top admirals and Secretary of the Navy got what they wanted. The rest of the USN was very disappointed in how procedures, rules, and regulations were casually violated.
I did join the Navy not too long after the film was released (about 4 years). But I would say Hunt For Red October had more of an impact for me. Oh, and Hot Shots. :-)
0:20 Objection to the sin here. The purpose is to sufficiently sharpen the skills of the top 1% so that they can return to their squadrons and teach their fellow pilots. That's kind of what we did with great success in WWII, we rotated our best pilots back to the US to train the newer pilots so that we had a larger pool of capable pilots.
The pain of hearing Co-pilot instead of RIO (Radar Intercept officer), if you research the technical aspects of the aircraft you can at least get that right.
You mean at any moment Goose, NOR Merlin couldn't just grab the stick and fly with their firm forward view of the back of the pilot's seat? PREPOSTEROUS!!!
My friend is a retired Naval Aviator. He loves Top Gun but says Maverick would have been given a Court Martial and dismissed long before he gets to Top Gun.
14:48 The RIO (Goose's position) isn't actually intended for Dogfighting per-se. The F-14 is a long range interceptor and the RIO (Radar Intercept Officer) operates the powerful long range Radar used by the F-14, but it only faces forward, so once in a close in maneuvering fight, Goose is doing pretty much what he is supposed to do: a second pair of eyes to help Maverick.
"And she is a contractor so you DO NOT salute her." Yeah, no kidding. Even the most junior enlisted member knows you don't salute civilians. Literally, no one has ever said, "Remember, you don't salute contractors."
@@jasonblalock4429 I think it was just intended as a goofball way of passing on military etiquette to us civilians. He did say pay attention because the pentagon listens to her.
@@jasonblalock4429 it was probably less about that than Hollywood just assuming people in the 80s were really stupid or ignorant when it comes to military protocols, customs and courteseys.
1:02 Combat Direction Center (CDC) on the USS Enterprise looks very similar to what the movie depicted. I've been on many ships as an OS and while they can't show the exact CDC they represented it as best they could.
@@jeremya-k4196 I can understand the sin though, if you didn't work in CIC or CDC it would look kind of fake. On newer ships they are a little more spaced out with more advanced tech but for the 80s that was about as fancy as it got.
A bit about the F14 fuel gauge... it shows ~2200lbs of fuel. The F14, with two drop tanks, has about 21000lbs of fuel on board. F14 fuel gauges were notoriously inaccurate and to make things worse, between 300 and 500lbs of gas is trapped in the tanks due to the fuel pickup design. So 2200lbs is actually closer to 1900lbs of gas being optimistic. The TF30 engines on the F14A consume, at thrust set for max range, about 2700lbs of gas per hour EACH at 33k feet. This rises to about 5500-6000lbs per hour (EACH) at a few thousand feet of altitude. A normal Case I recovery of an F14A will consume about 3000lbs of gas in the stack and pattern depending on where they are in cyclic ops... a straight into the commence maybe half that. IRL, both jets are well below the safe fuel required to land on the boat and would have been forced to the recovery tanker before attempting a landing. Usually about 3000lbs is considered safe and gives you an attempt or two before having to hit the tanker for more gas.
One sin you missed: On their first hop, Jester tells the trainees that "the aircraft you are flying against are smaller, faster and more manoeuvrable, just like the enemy MiGs." While the A4 is certainly smaller than the F14, it is actually slower.
Hey, I just wanted to mention your sin @ 15:08 - I was a Marine, and even on Marine bases, in Marine barracks, in mess halls, PX stations, wherever you go related to those military establishments, I ALWAYS saw those poster advertisements EVERYWHERE. Even though they're in the Navy, it's perfectly normal to see those posters everywhere... even in locker rooms where it makes no sense.
When I was an F15 crew chief I used to give the aircrew a disposable camera to take some pics for me. So maybe yeah he could have a Polaroid camera with him 🤷
From 1984 to 1988 I was an exchange instructor (US Army) serving with Landing Force Training Command, Pacific (LFTC, PAC), Coronado, California. We taught Sailors and Marines Close Air Support (CAS) and Forward Observation (FO) for Naval Gunfire, artillery, and mortars. No one wore dress uniforms to the officer clubs until this movie was released. After that many of the Naval pilots and REOs showed up looking like French admirals. It only lasted for a week or two, but the rest of us had a good laugh at their expense
You're dead right about the hard deck being a bullshit reason for Maverick to lose. As you said the Jester technically crashed his plane within the rules of the game
I actually think the fact Jester chickened out to avoid a loss and then blamed it on the rookie is a realistic character thing to do in the chain of command, where winning is everything.
I saw this movie inappropriately early, at 8 or 9 years old. My dad had the vhs and watched it a lot. Must’ve been right when the vhs was available over here. You did a great job sinning it. The Bonus round was on point. It’s like an ad for Aviators, after being one for the Navy first.
I saw it on it's release in 1986, at the drive in. The 2 of us girls in one car, the boys in the other. Absolutely loved it. Now it's so cheesy that I could slap it on a cracker for dinner and have leftovers for breakfast (still love it though)
As somewhere else on TH-cam an actual F-14 RIO commented that what CinemaSins says is ‘ Impossible ‘ is actually Impossible not because planes can’t do that , but because planes can’t do that with the vertical stabilizers ( that’s the tail to those not into airporn ) STICKING INTO THE FUSELAGE of another aircraft , which is what would happen if you had a mug and a tomcat that close to each other with one is inverted, to quote iceman ahhBULLSHITchew ! Same RIO also said ‘ Base Security! Some idiot is riding a motorcycle down the taxiway! ‘
12:01 - This segment proves Sinny is indeed a character in his/her/its own right. And also that Sinny is a pervert. And I couldn't stop laughing for a full minute. So one sin off for Sinny's awesomeness. (-1 and reverse-ding)
12:07: It’s very odd watching the cinemasins guy refer to the movie sin counter as “Sinny” when he accidentally removes various sins and eventually resins them!
21:30: The nostalgia of the 1965 “Thunderbirds” puppet tv show with its countdown and blastoff intro brings me back some flashbacks and memories of how obsessed I was with that show from a decade and a half ago!
@CinemaSins i think you forgot that the "enemy migs" were being piloted by Iranian pilots. This is in fact totally accurate as at the time we were using them in real life as Top Gun instructors. When he said they would be flying against the best pilots in the world, that was correct.
The enemy pilots were all Topgun instructors, but none were actually Iranian. Also......they don't let Iranian pilots be real Topgun instructors. That has never happened.
@16:25 its not bad to encourage him back on a plane. It might help him to separate the trauma from his job/passion. Not right for everyone but its worth a shot.
I’m only at Sin 50 & this is already one of my favorite Cinema Sins video. Thank you for these videos. Nothing like a good laugh after work. You are the best!
Also goose does have a purpose he operates the big ass AWG-9 radar that sits in the radome of the tomcat the plane is combat in effective without him because maverick can't manipulate the radar and the workload for using it is high enough that goose is needed
A few things: - The radar monitors in the combat information center of the carrier are real. -You need a lot of fuel to land on an aircraft carrier, enough to be able to take off if your tailhook doesn't catch the arresting wire Hilarious CinemaSins video tho
You'd think they would launch a KA-6 or KA-3 and give him some juice, but in the situation happening in the movie, cougar probably could not have pulled off a mid air refueling anyway
This is a really sinful (but enjoyable, at least on the first viewing) movie, especially for someone with military and aviation experience. It has been thoroughly sinned on other channels and sites, but Cinema Sins still caught several sins that I haven't seen noted elsewhere. BUT Cinema Sins also had a lot of inaccurate sins that a small amount of research would have prevented.
One thing that has ALWAYS driven me crazy is how Maverick's rank keeps changing on his uniforms. I'm thinking he's an O-4, oh wait, he's an O-3...O-4 in this scene? O-3 again...grrrr. Fun fact: they do the same thing in "A Few Good Men"
I miss when this channel pointed out plot holes, forgotten camera equipment, unrealistic scenarios, etc. instead of bagging on movies for having competing personalities in it claiming they're sexually attracted to each other and stuff like that. Ive noticed more and more comments like this recently
@@Stackali The planes existence wasn't classified but there were absolutely classified components in that cockpit. Probably still are even 15 years after its out of service and never will be until 100 years after the USA is sure Iran's F-14s (seized in the revolution) are rust and dust. Just to keep them and the Russians a little unsure what may be missing. Classified info is all about mind games like that. Also a big ass camera would be a safety hazard and there's gonna be precious few places to even put it.
Yeah I chuckled at that. I knew a guy that built a replica Tomcat cockpit around his computer to play his flight simulator games. Can't have been all THAT classified.
There’s been plenty published of the cockpit layouts and instruments in the F-14 (and just about every other contemporary fighter in service), so it’s not much of a secret. The issue the US has with Iran and its Tomcat fleet is fears that parts taken from retired US F-14s could somehow end up in Iranian hands to keep their fleet airworthy. As for no cameras in the cockpit, former F-14 RIO Dave “Bio” Baranek would disagree, with several books he’s published with loads of photos he took over the course of his career in the backseat of an F-14. He’s mentioned the only time he was told not to take any photos was when he went up against captured MiGs as part of the Constant Peg program at Tonopah Test Range, which made sense since that program was highly classified at the time, and he left his camera on the ground for those hops.
@@Stackali Right, the cockpits themselves wouldn't be classified because they're all pretty standard. What is classified is a plane's exact capabilities, which of course isn't something you would likely see in a photo.
Goose is not Maverick's co-pilot. He's his RIO (Radar Intercept Officer). Come on, Cinemasins. This movie has only been out for 36 years. I do totally agree with the sin on throwing Goose's dog tags. That would be something that you may want to give to his widow or his son.
2:30 Fuel efficiency varies even more wildly in fighters than in cars, but it's like the difference between cruising at highway speeds and racing on a track.
Also, that flash you used on the Polaroid completely hid the MiG from the picture. You just took a picture of the flash reflecting on the canopy of your jet.
5:30: CinemaSins incorrectly identifies the naval flight officers, commonly known as weapon systems officers, as co-pilots. Although WSO's can perform some co-pilot functions, they are not naval aviators. *DING*
@@nolanboles8492 When the McDonnell-Douglas F4 Phantom II was in service, that was what they were called; more recently the term has morphed into WSO. Depending on aircraft type, they can also be referred to as combat systems officers (CSO's).
Did you just sinned Danger Zone????? HIGHWAY TO THE DANGER ZONE!!!!! That song is awesome!!!!!!!! I’m sooooo ready for Top Gun Maverick, just got my and Dad tickets yesterday, and we are seeing it on Sunday at 2:30pm!!!!!
The flat spin scene wasn't done with an actual F14, it's a model shot. However, they did have legendary stunt pilot Art Scholl perform a flat spin for the shots of the spinning sky. Sadly he was killed after his plane wouldn't recover from the spin, hence why the movie is dedicated to him.
That's so sad.
I just learned about this recently. I’m glad you mentioned it here; he should be known and remembered. Apparently he was quite a wonderful pilot. Unfortunately, it’s too easy to forget/overlook the people behind the scenes whose talent contributes so much to the movies we love.
All these years later and I had no idea about this until I read your post.
Goose IRL.
Damn, so he died in the exact way the character dies in the movie, and not even for actual footage of the stunt?! That's the worst way to go out.
As a sailor who has been on aircraft carriers, I can confirm that Danger zone is playing constantly.
And if a fighter pilot buzzed the bridge like Maverick did, they'd be grounded and torn a new one the size of Texas.
@@Joreel
Actually....case 1 carrier landings have them fly right by the tower starboard side each trip around counter clockwise, going wide on the port side in case they are able to line up and land.. At a prescribed 350 knots, if memory serves.
It is completely normal.
Dude what was your rate and what carrier? My hubs was a bird farm sailor too. CVN 74
The danger of insanity...
@@The.Artistic.Squirrel USS Nimitz and USS George HW Bush
Actually at 1:11 he’s totally right in saying “Cougar and Merlin AND Maverick and Goose”. There’s no need for a comma as Cougar and Merlin is one team and Maverick and Goose another. There aren’t 4 fighter jets in the air. There are only 2, Cougar and Merlin AND Maverick and Goose.
Gonna nitpick a sin here: The Navy guy saying "Cougar and Merlin and Maverick and Goose" is grammatically correct.
I’ve been searching for this comment. He’s describing them based on the seating of their jets. How did he not realize that when the following scene shows that?! Lol
And CS called that sailor a soldier lol.
Every guy in the movie is a Navy guy. That particular Navy guy is a fighter controller.
I was also going to say this...I must be as sad as you!
Not if you believe in the Oxford comma :p
Ice’s bite response to Maverick’s “I am dangerous” is truly absurd, but truly iconic as well.
It’s the cinematic equivalent to that old saying ‘anything too stupid to say is better sung’
I fucking die laughing at that part every time
Well I think it’s hot!
CinemaSins mislabels Goose as a "co-pilot" for some time. He's the Radio Intercept Officer.
The flat spin was done by the special effects team using a model. Fun fact: Jamie Hyneman of Mythbusters fame was on the effects team.
*Radar Intercept Officer*
Isn’t that the model Jett that we see hanging above them for the first few seasons of myth busters? I think it either comes from top gun or the sum of all fears
Cool.
@@bsgtrekfan88 That one is from Top Gun but iirc that's one of the planes shot down in the finale. I don't know if they were reusing the model or if it's a different model just for that shot.
That is a pretty interesting fact, but fun???
I always thought that Maverick forgave Iceman a little TOO easily for inadvertently causing the accident that killed Goose, even though Iceman apologised. HISHE has a hilarious skit pointing this out!
Did Iceman cause it, though? Maverick could have just realized he wasn't going to get a fair shot at Viper and withdrawn, thus preventing Ice's jetwash from taking him out in the first place. There's too many improbables here to place blame.
@@nolanboles8492 No actually I think Ice DID kinda cause it. Maverick instructed him to pull off high right and he went left…I believe. I was Top Gun crazy when it came out.
I seem to remember he went the wrong way or the A-4 changed direction at the same time…If I am wrong please forgive me.
@@josebrown5961 yup. ice man did pull off the wrong way.
@@nolanboles8492 Yes, Iceman had fallen out of the pocket to properly attack Viper. In training when you have a wingman, protocol is for the Wingman to come in behind and take the place of the lead plane, as they have the ability to properly line up. Iceman had lost his shot, and should have been beholden to Maverick’s calls to move out of position, instead he tried to re-engage, and the jet wash caused Mavericks engines to not have any oxygen for a few seconds, and they failed one before the other, which is what caused the flat spin. TLDR, very much Iceman’s fault.
Nah, Because Iceman didn't intend for it happen. They were rivals yes, but still on the same team
Going to respond to a lot of these, but #97 is tragic. The flat spin sequence was very real, and unfortunately the stunt pilot Art Scholl died while performing the stunt (Not the specific one from the film). As he was doing one of the many instances of the move, he lost control and was never able to recover. He was quoted as saying "I have a problem, I have a real problem" just before he crashed into the ocean. You see the film dedicated to him at the end of the credits. RIP-
True, and he was flying his Pitts Special, filming the scene. Speculated he became disorientated or had a mechanical problem. His body was never found.
Life is dangerous
Yeah. Hate to have to say it, but I wish that the camera footage was crappy CGI or something other than a live shot. If it had been, then Scholl wouldn't have died. Obviously there's no way to know beforehand, of course, and Scholl thought he could pull it off, so it's not like the movie personnel are to blame, but it's still sad.
Also, there's history of the SAME thing happened to Goose as in real life. It has been documented in real life flat-spin F-14, where pilots injured or died because of collision with the canopy during ejection. And F-14 has a history of flat-spins.
Jesus wept!
Because of watching this channel for a few years now, I can't help but instinctively say "roll credits" if the title is said at any point during the movie
same here
Me too
Missed sin: the waitress never brings the water that Charlie ordered.
1:09 The way that the aviators were named always made perfect sense to me because an F-14 has a pilot and a RIO (radar intercept officer), which means that he is stating the two teams, each one with two aviators, thus "Cougar and Merlin (in plane 1) & Maverick and Goose (in plane 2)."
@@GhostWatcher2024 So, he should have said, "Cougar and Merlin comma Maverick and Goose"? Lol.
thanks for the def of RIO. I had always thought they were saying Rear (the guy who sat in the rear seat. LOL)
@@kevind814
Sometimes they do say rear, as in rear seat. But the movie never showed why they have him.
@@kevind814 Today they are known as WSO or Weapons Systems Officer. (pronounce the abbreviation as Wizzo).
@@icecold9511 The movie repeatedly had RIOs giving info on radar contacts.
16:25 that's actually an extremely common occurrence after a crash or tragic incident. The logic is the longer you let the pilot dwell the harder it is for them to get back up in the air at all. That happened to my grandpa both times he got shot down in Vietnam.
It's a easier way to release your anger of losing your friend by wanting to kill every enemy jet you see. The hate and anger makes you focus and become a better jockey.
Was gonna come down to say the exact same thing. Also really common with race car drivers when they have a big crash.
Yep, the saying "get back on the horse" comes from exactly this. When I broke my wrist, I got back on immediately and had no issue riding thereafter. When I fell another time, I didn't get back on immediately and had to start back at basics five years later because I'd psyched myself up about it so much in the intervening years.
@@lizzieperlizzie I was in a school bus accident on a stormy day during a side trip at our school's Science Camp and some of the other kids didn't want to get on the bus that came to get us. I told myself "Well, it's the only way to get back to camp because I'm NOT walking."
@@MrMJmusicLover "The hate and anger makes you focus " Palpatine is that you?
You forgot to sin goose using a Polaroid camera with a flash against not 1 but 2 sets of cockpit glass (his and the MIG) thus the pic would probably just be a whiteout.
I was wondering this too!!
Both the Russian and American jets were designed with special Polaroid compliant cockpit glass as that was the most effective way for each country to spy on each other. I though everyone knew that
And THAT’s the reason he doesn’t show the photo
Navy issue Uber polarized strobmaton 7000
Fun fact: Given all the military laws Maverick broke in this movie, if it had happened during war time, he could’ve gotten the death penalty.
I’m not kidding.
Just disobeying a single direct order is enough for the death penalty in the military during war time.
From the Legal Eagle video. They very much would have been technically in war time for a period.
And at the very least he'd get 3-4 years in the brig, and be dishonourably discharged
@@Canadian_Zac Yep, that was my source as well.
From what I understand, simply buzzing the tower is more than enough to get one grounded permanently.
I just rewatched this after many years in anticipating of finally seeing Top Gun Maverick tomorrow. While the flying action pretty good, I found myself kind of struck at the rather shallowness of the story. Easily the most likable character to me is Goose. Additionally, I find Iceman's attitude/body language not really matching his criticism of Maverick. Iceman doesn't like Maverick for being a reckless hotshot, which is perfectly fair, but the vibe I get from Iceman is also of a too cocky hotshot, rather than a no-nonsense professional.
I rewatched it recently after watching TG Maverick. I agree about Goose, I was surprised by how likeable the character was, specially compared to the others. It also struck me how Iceman is always mentioned as this great pilot and the #1 and all, but the one time we see him in action during the Top Gun school he is ineffective and virtually causes the accident that kills Goose. The movie should have been a fierce competition between him and Maverick, but we never get that.
@@samuelperezgarcia Yeah I agree, there isn't much of a rivalry between Iceman and Maverick that is apparently set up.
Its Top Gun. You're not supposed to analyze it, you're supposed to just enjoy the hell out of it.
I attended Top Gun when I was active duty - not as a pilot but as Supply Chain. The Pilots basically go there to learn how to become flight instructors. They are indeed some of the best the fleet has to offer, and at that point in their career its about teaching them to pass on those skills.
Did alot of guys have a choice between being test pilots or going instructor? Or was that a whole diffrent deal? I dealt with P-3s and those pilots I always felt like they wanted to be fighter pilots but weren't good enough so many had chips on their shoulders.
@@evilcartmensolo7198 I think the majority were set to be instructors, but there were def test pilots for some of the more advanced aircraft - for instance I was in when the F-35 was beginning trials, so a lucky few got to practice carrier field landing.
Is that about the time they go from flying high-performance jets to flying an office chair? Like, maybe their eyesight and reflexes aren't what they used to be, but their knowledge and experience are still useful? 🙂
@@BennyLlama39 hahaha exactly - all in all it was a really fun experience - for the most part the pilots weren't pricks since they were away from their normal command and could just act normal again.
I used to stay there when we'd visit family in SD (AF usually doesn't have bases in places that aren't deserts or plains so we go to Navy/MC bases). I loved that base.
One of my favorite 80s movies. Realistic? Not a bit. Fun and entertaining? 100%
_Over the Top_ was probably pitched as _”Top Gun_ on 18 wheels”
🛞🛞🛞🛞🛞🛞🛞🛞🛞🛞🛞
*I feel like Michael Bay un-ironically thinks both movies are prequels to his Transformers movies*
@@iamskippy I luv Over the Top too. You can basically count me in for some cheesy 80s movies.
Yes, great movie. I didn't realize that Cinrmasins hadn't done this movie already. I thought he'd done all of the big name 80s and 90s movies a while ago now
@@iamskippy why would anyone think they're prequels to Transformers?? 🤔
At least it is more realistic than CGI plot armour mustang.
Fun Fact: Ally Sheedy was offered the role of Charlie, but she turned it down, thinking that nobody would want to see a movie about fighter pilots. She reportedly regretted this decision later on.
I bet. Dumb move on her part.
Fun Fact Number 2: Matthew Modine was offered the Maverick role, but turned it down because he didn't agree with the pro-military stance of the film.
The fact that I had to Google her supports her reported regret.
Non fact number 3 : Andy Dick was offered the role of Iceman
She would’ve been a better choice. That’s unfortunate.
Goose’s laugh after Iceman’s comment about the plaque for the alternates will never not be funny easily one of the greatest laughs ever
Fun fact, the scene where Maverick flips off the Mig pilots is based off of a true story that happened off the coast of Libya.
I literally just wrote a huge explanation and then saw this comment. Also the Rio did have a Polaroid on board and took a picture of the mig which you can still find. There’s also a picture of a Rio reading a f14 magazine mid flight that he took with a Polaroid
Except the scene as shot was physically impossible. The vertical stabilizers from the F-14 would have impacted the F-5 (er, MiG 28).
The Sin counter would be a lot less if CS knew what Goose's job actually was, LOL. He is a RIO, Radar Intercept Officer, and it is his job to handle comms and radar so the pilot can focus on, well, flying the damn plane. RIO's don't even need pilot qualifications as there are no controls in their area to fly the plane anyway.
@@athirkell Wow, got some extra time on your hands have you? I mean you must have if you had the time to harass me over a simple comment :D
Actually there are controls and the RIO or WSO depending on what you refer, CAN take control in emergency situations, but it's rare
@@lukereyes6266 in the backseat of an F-15E yes the WSO can take control of the aircraft. But the backseat of an F-14 at least the early models such as the ones shown in top gun do not have a set of controls in the backseat for the RIO. So they would not be able to fly the plane. The stick in the back is for radar controls.
@@lukereyes6266 Michael is right , that’s why Merlin was getting so nervous when Cougar lost it.. he was unable to do anything from his seat and if cougar did not snap out if it would have been a passenger on a death flight.
His major gripe with Goose's role though, was not its official function, but the fact that Maverick chose to disregard his suggestions and pleads so often and so completely. You want to have a highly efficient team manning these aircrafts, but here it was one pilot and one casual passenger.
11:09 The breaking of the hard deck was a violation of the rules of the school, disobeying the Tower for the flyby is major safety violation that is a Federal crime and the pilot can lose their flight certification, so yeah, the Flyby was the bigger deal.
Especially if "the pattern is full."
Note that the last flyby of the carrier tower, if done correctly, is standard case 1 recovery.
@@icecold9511 the pattern is full? I'm hard of hearing and for years.......I thought it was..... Negative Ghost rider, the pattern is closed. 🤔😅
Srisly guys - it's a movie. it was done _deliberately_.
The breaking of the hard deck.
I want to know what the fudge plane can fly below the hard deck.
@@OldSkullInn it’s a plane that can also function as a bulldozer.
15:12 This is an actual bar in downtown San Diego called the Kansas City BBQ. So the Kansas flag makes sense, although it should probably have the Missouri flag.
Glad I'm not the only one about to sin his sin. I remember driving by this place all the time from the 32nd St Naval Base into downtown seeing the Top Gun neon lights in the window.
Yep. Once, back when I worked downtown, my department had lunch there. I’ve never been a bbq fan, but lots of people love the place. 🍗 🍖 🍗
100%. so glad somebody else was thinking that, too
@@x5992 I attempted to go there twice when I was living in LI in SD, and walked out both times. Place was a mess and the staff had no interest in cleaning, so we left
The Kansas side is where the good BBQ is.
9:57 - If you listen to the entire debriefing, Viper tells Maverick that Jester had lost visual on Maverick & Goose and called "No Joy" before dropping below the hard deck. That's not an uncommon practice in training scenarios with multiple aircraft as a way to protect pilot safety so two aircraft don't inadvertently collide because one pilot lost sight of another. Since Viper doesn't dispute Jester's claim, it's almost certain that he was either listening to the comm traffic during the hop, or he heard a recording of it between the end of the hop and the debriefing. What I always took away from this scene is the Jester knew Maverick was a better pilot, and he lied about losing visual just so he could drop below the hard deck and end the hop without officially losing to Maverick.
EDIT: I never understood the bit where Maverick "quits." He can't quit...he was ordered to attend Top Gun. By leaving Top Gun he was AWOL and should have been arrested and thrown in the brig.
To be fair there's like a dozen times Maverick should have been arrested and thrown in the brig. He's weirdly immune from legal consequences.
@@missolympiabinewski Oh, definitely. Him going AWOL is just the one that really stood out for me, even when I watched the film as a kid in the late '80s. I had an uncle (by marriage) go AWOL in the early '80s because he didn't want to go on his remote assignment to Alaska for about a year without his family. He decided he'd just take off. Hitched rides back to Indiana and came wandering down the driveway at my grandparents' house on Thanksgiving. The MPs showed up about an hour later looking for him. He was arrested and eventually slapped with a dishonorable discharge. Dude was a cook and had been in the Army for about 15 years. Lost his pension and had a hell of a time finding work for the rest of his life. And all of my dad's brothers (this uncle married one of my dad's sisters) called him AWOL for the rest of his life. So that's why I was always puzzled by Maverick going AWOL ave not being arrested.
They certainly can’t force you to fly, but you sure just can’t get on a plane and just leave the navy if you”quit”
@@frocat5163 Maverick is a Lt. (officer.) Depending on how long he's been in, he can resign his commission.
@@agent_skully I'm well aware an officer can resign their commission. Maverick clearly didn't since he left the base immediately and didn't lose his flight status. He was most definitely AWOL.
This makes me want to watch "Hot Shots" again.
Same. That movie was hilarious! XD
@@cartooncritique6625 Yep, it's one of the best parody movies ever made!
Never seen it but I'd like to check it out. I wonder if it's streaming anywhere.
@@loganbigmo The sequel is good too. "Hot Shots: Part Deux" is a parody of Rambo movies.
Same! :D
"Talk to me Goose."
You ignored every thing he ever said in the copilot seat when he was alive
Not really, Maverick listened to Goose, they were best buds.
RIO, not a co-pilot
Technically that's correct, since Goose never said a single thing in the copilot seat.
@@Harv72b lol well played. Can’t say anything from the co-pilot’s seat if the F-14 doesn’t have a co-pilot seat.
I guess that's part of what made him a "Maverick"
Don't know how many pounds equals one-seventh of a tank, but in aviation, you typically want to be overhead your intended landing location with enough fuel to make it to an alternate airport (Not sure how that works with carriers) or at least, enough fuel to make more than one landing attempt. That fuel also serves to provide loiter time overhead in case there is something happening on the field that delays landing for a short time. Bingo fuel equals the amount needed to return home plus the pre-calculated amount left in the tank once wheels down. These numbers vary by theater, command, threat matrix, airframe, pilot judgement, etc. This is all calculated and put out at the pre-flight brief long before asses connect to seat cushions.
TLDR: You don't ever run an airplane down to "empty."
On top of that, there likely would have been a tanker option airborne for Maverick to access.
His math is wrong for the Tomcat anyway. The gauge shows 2200lbs and the F14 with two tanks has 21000lbs of fuel... so call it a tenth of the total fuel. Made worse by the F14 fuel system trapping 300-500lbs of fuel on the tanks. So his 2200lbs is like 1900lbs of you are optimistic.
Given a burn rate of 5500lbs/hr per engine at low altitude and he's got a pretty short amount of flight time left.
The Movie makes no mention of a refueling aircraft supporting either airplane after both Pilots make known their fuel status. 5 points
6:30
“How many wingmen does Tom Cruise need anyway?”
More than the amount of Mission Impossible movies he made.
Gotta get those scientology referrals to get on the spaceship
I believe the correct answer to your question is, "yes".
you. are. everywhere what
@@Wolfencreek enough
How tf can you have 300k subs and only 1 vid 😂
Don’t you ever…Disrespect K Loggins *Danger Zone* !!!!!!
If anything that song should take off at least 20 sins lol 😂 😂😂😂
I love this movie, I was going to be a fighter pilot but just as I was going to the recruiter, I found out I had type 1 diabetes. I wanted to fly Tomcats but shortly there after I found out they retired it. Also, I am surprised you did not sin the MiG-28 not existing, in fact in the first class sequence Charlie actually spills the beans on what planes they do use, F-14, F-5 (which is the actual MiG-28), and A-4 (used in the school by the teachers).
Yes, MiG only uses odd numbers to designate their designs, hence MiG 27, MiG 29, and so on. Never a MiG 28.
One of the squadrons I flew the E with was the last squadron to take up the Tomcat in 2006 at that point VF-31 after 2006 to present VFA-31
Same bud same and I hadn't even seen top gun yet I spent 2 years in jrotc for the extra credit out of basic but end of sophomore year I found our diabetes is a nope
3:03 There's actually a minimum amount of fuel you can have before landing, depending on the aircraft, at a certain amount of fuel left you have to declare low fuel and if you expect to have around 5% of fuel left by the expected time of arrival you have to declare emergency fuel, this is so that airports and Carriers can determine who needs to land in what order so that planes don't start falling out of the sky waiting to land, you do not want to go below that low fuel amount, its extremally dangerous. So yea they don't have enough fuel for that.
*Ding*
Cinimasins sin counter:1
His counter was way higher than that in this one. It's a real nitpicky one, and about a topic he has no experience with.
@@micahphilson yea at the time they had enough fuel to get back but they would of been really low and thats without the extra time it would take to help get the other guy back, i forget his name, I didn’t do the math I’m just going off what Jeremy said about them being 250 miles away from the carrier and them having 200 something miles of fuel left. I also don’t know the fuel specific limit for low fuel/emergency fuel for the jet I only know it for a cessna lol
People still nitpick cinemasins?… that’s so pathetic.. it’s like how can you not understand how this channel works?..
@@SPFLDAngler people still can’t understand a joke that also relays interesting information to others that might not know it, based on context from a video? Yikes
@@owlkage7700 Jokes are meant to be funny. A lot of the technical shit cinemasins tries to nitpick isn't funny on this occasion - it comes off as ignorant and stupid.
Fun fact: nearly every pilot I know, myself included, has participated in badly signing You’ve Lost That Loving Feeling in a bar.
Perhaps, but only after seeing this lame movie.
Was she impressed you knew sign??
@@tcanders123 I bet you’re extremely fun at parties
@@tcanders123 If by lame you mean, "totally freakin' awesome", you'd be right.
@@maryroberts8787 did they crash and burn, or…?
2:18 Yes, because it's not his personal camera; he's not "allowed" to have it, he's *instructed* to have it. It's part of his job to take photos of foreign planes they might encounter for intel purposes. After landing, he needs to hand over the camera and the photos specifically for the reason you mention (secrecy).
I'm pretty sure they don't use a Polaroid camera.
I know Air Force F-15 guys get polaroids of Soviet Bears. I guess they have a place to strap the camera in.
Also explains why he’s not carrying the photo around with him later when Maverick is bragging about his inverted dive and nobody believes him
Odd. I was told by a USN F-4 RIO that they were issued small 35MM cameras for that purpose.
@@davidhoffman1278
Yeah. A Polaroid is a lousy camera. It isn't as if they need an instant print.
The pilots receive the notification of the crisis situation from Viper only one minute after graduating from Top Gun. Not even ten minutes before or ten minutes after. Wow, that's perfect timing! lol.
I came here for one sin in particular and it wasn't mentioned, it has ALWAYS bugged me. We know the movie takes place in the summer (because it's mentioned that Goose died on July 29th). Maverick is supposed to meet Charlie for their dinner date at 5:30. When he pulls up to the house, the sun is setting on the Pacific, so it must be around 7:45ish (two hours late, Maverick?!!!). Anyway, they eat and talk and then he leaves and as he drives away the sun is still setting!! Was he there for 24 hours?! Aside from the many sins you pointed out, this one has always bothered me, lol :)
"Shouldn't 3 o'clock be on his right?"
Finally, a worthy sin.
Not if he was... inverted! 😅
And also why she wrote 5:30 meaning A.M. and not 17:30 !!!
3:07 He's all shaken up and yet lands without incident. Almost like... they train for that hundreds of times so it's muscle memory, and there's some small leeway in case problems arise, and even if he's distracted he's a professional (one of the top in the Navy even), and incidents during landing are pretty rare for good reason...
It isn't that he's just shaken up. His aircraft was pitching and yawing to such a degree that it's a statistical improbability his tailhook could have actually caught the wire. And even if it did catch the wire (which, yes, it did), there's no way he wasn't smacking a wing on the deck.
(For those unaware, carrier decks are obviously incredibly short landing strips. When carrier-based aircraft land, they have what are called tailhooks... literally a hook at the tail of the aircraft. These hooks catch arresting wires, four of which are strung across the beginning of the landing strip. If you fail to catch the wire, the pilot has to do a missed approach and try to get the jet back up in the air, or they're likely going over the side unless they are already at such low speed that they can stop the aircraft without the assistance. At least, that's my limited knowledge on it, any NAS pilots or deck crew reading this feel free to correct me if I'm wildly off base.)
@@rcslyman8929 The landing areas aren't as short as you'd think -- 500 feet or about a football field and a half (including endzones). If you hit the #4 wire (aka "sissy wire" or "COD wire"), you've got plenty of room. Hit the #3 wire (competent pilots), not so much. Only the best aim for the #2 wire (fighter pilots). But... if you grab the #1 wire, you stop with you nose looking over the edge into the drink, so you're either a shitty pilot, a lucky pilot, or a psychopath who did it on purpose.
Muscles don't have "memory", although your point is understood.
@@samuelperezgarcia you don't know what muscle memory is? it means that you've done something enough times that you don't even have to think about it to do it, an example would be playing an instrument; I play guitar, and there's a few solos that I played enough to be able to play them with my eyes closed and while thinking about something else. It also applies to things like driving or typing on a keyboard. Here's the wikipedia page about it if you want to read more: en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Muscle_memory#:~:text=Muscle%20memory%20is%20a%20form,used%20synonymously%20with%20motor%20learning.
@@johnpauljones9310 Some incorrect things about the carriers wires here. The wires are number 1-4 starting from the trap closest to the stern. The #1 means you're too low and are close to hitting the deck, while the #2 wire is the optimum one to trap on. The #2 and #4 wire are acceptable, but naval aviators need to consistently trap third to be promoted.
The Navy got what they wanted. A multi, multi million dollar recruiting ad.
They had recruiters in the cinema lobbies when the film made its orginal run.
Yea how many wanted to fly and ended up swabbing a deck😀
I remember Bobcat Goldthwait had a joke about TOP GUN getting lots of kids to join the Navy.
They are having recruiters take potential recruits to see the new movie.
The top admirals and Secretary of the Navy got what they wanted. The rest of the USN was very disappointed in how procedures, rules, and regulations were casually violated.
I did join the Navy not too long after the film was released (about 4 years). But I would say Hunt For Red October had more of an impact for me. Oh, and Hot Shots. :-)
Speaking of product placement, the ensign(?) walking by outside the office, after Maverick's flyby, is carrying a PEPSI logo tray.
Well spotted
0:20 Objection to the sin here. The purpose is to sufficiently sharpen the skills of the top 1% so that they can return to their squadrons and teach their fellow pilots. That's kind of what we did with great success in WWII, we rotated our best pilots back to the US to train the newer pilots so that we had a larger pool of capable pilots.
My dad did mandatory military training in Italy, 1991. He was doing paratroop training and top gun was the only movie that would be played at the bar.
Poor you
Sigonella by chance? Probably ate in the chow hall together.
The pain of hearing Co-pilot instead of RIO (Radar Intercept officer), if you research the technical aspects of the aircraft you can at least get that right.
Yeah, I'm not even a Navy man and I had to avoid yelling at the screen every time he said co-pilot. They even use the term RIO in the movie!
You mean at any moment Goose, NOR Merlin couldn't just grab the stick and fly with their firm forward view of the back of the pilot's seat?
PREPOSTEROUS!!!
Only time co-pilot is exceptable is in a support or transport plane.
I'm pretty sure they even use the correct term IN the movie. Cinemasins got really lazy with this movie lol
Cinema Sins don't do no stinkin' research.
Missed an opportunity to put Archer Saying “Danger Zone” in the outtakes
Yea I kinda thought they would have Maverick and Kelly M. be Archer and Lana…or Laaaanaaa!
th-cam.com/video/kyAn3fSs8_A/w-d-xo.html
LANA! LANA! LAAAAAAAAAANAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA!!!
th-cam.com/video/d3D7Y_ycSms/w-d-xo.html
LAAAAAAAAAANAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA
Lana: What
Danger Zone!!!
My friend is a retired Naval Aviator. He loves Top Gun but says Maverick would have been given a Court Martial and dismissed long before he gets to Top Gun.
And? Several other countries also have an air force. It probably wouldn't be the end of his duty.
@@mariuszmiroslaw2290 How would he join if he was in Leavenworth?
14:48 The RIO (Goose's position) isn't actually intended for Dogfighting per-se. The F-14 is a long range interceptor and the RIO (Radar Intercept Officer) operates the powerful long range Radar used by the F-14, but it only faces forward, so once in a close in maneuvering fight, Goose is doing pretty much what he is supposed to do: a second pair of eyes to help Maverick.
True but it's entertaining to hear his role minimized
"And she is a contractor so you DO NOT salute her." Yeah, no kidding. Even the most junior enlisted member knows you don't salute civilians. Literally, no one has ever said, "Remember, you don't salute contractors."
Sure, but they couldn't risk letting the audience think that the woman has any real power. It was the 80s, after all.
@@jasonblalock4429
I think it was just intended as a goofball way of passing on military etiquette to us civilians. He did say pay attention because the pentagon listens to her.
@@jasonblalock4429 it was probably less about that than Hollywood just assuming people in the 80s were really stupid or ignorant when it comes to military protocols, customs and courteseys.
@@jasonblalock4429 as i miss spell courtesies
You do salute civilians who are in the chain of command, though. Not applicable in this situation, but still.
The officer in the back seat is the “RIO” radar intercept operator, and he does not have a set of controls to fly the plane from the back seat.
Best me to the punch
They guy in front drives, the guy in back kills people.
@@DeliveryMcGee and keeps the guy in front, alive
@@christopherandersch1299 Well, it's really more keeping both of them alive, because aircrews are basically married couples.
@@DeliveryMcGee in F4 phantoms they were called "gib's" or Guy In Back
1:02 Combat Direction Center (CDC) on the USS Enterprise looks very similar to what the movie depicted. I've been on many ships as an OS and while they can't show the exact CDC they represented it as best they could.
Fun fact, the carrier in the movie is USS Enterprise
Agree, air control/catcc also looks similar. Rest of the video was a letdown, was really looking forward to CS roasting top gun, too.
Was looking for this.
Was based on a Navy ship that was built in the 70s and looked very similar to what is in Top Gun
@@jeremya-k4196 I can understand the sin though, if you didn't work in CIC or CDC it would look kind of fake. On newer ships they are a little more spaced out with more advanced tech but for the 80s that was about as fancy as it got.
@@battleship6177 exactly why I mentioned it :)
A bit about the F14 fuel gauge... it shows ~2200lbs of fuel.
The F14, with two drop tanks, has about 21000lbs of fuel on board. F14 fuel gauges were notoriously inaccurate and to make things worse, between 300 and 500lbs of gas is trapped in the tanks due to the fuel pickup design.
So 2200lbs is actually closer to 1900lbs of gas being optimistic. The TF30 engines on the F14A consume, at thrust set for max range, about 2700lbs of gas per hour EACH at 33k feet. This rises to about 5500-6000lbs per hour (EACH) at a few thousand feet of altitude.
A normal Case I recovery of an F14A will consume about 3000lbs of gas in the stack and pattern depending on where they are in cyclic ops... a straight into the commence maybe half that. IRL, both jets are well below the safe fuel required to land on the boat and would have been forced to the recovery tanker before attempting a landing. Usually about 3000lbs is considered safe and gives you an attempt or two before having to hit the tanker for more gas.
Therefore allowing them both to land without taking on ⛽️ should be a huge sin
One sin you missed: On their first hop, Jester tells the trainees that "the aircraft you are flying against are smaller, faster and more manoeuvrable, just like the enemy MiGs." While the A4 is certainly smaller than the F14, it is actually slower.
Yeah almost everything is slower than the f14 except the f15, mig25/31 and SR-71
Named my Son Jesta after this movie, woo woo
Hey, I just wanted to mention your sin @ 15:08 - I was a Marine, and even on Marine bases, in Marine barracks, in mess halls, PX stations, wherever you go related to those military establishments, I ALWAYS saw those poster advertisements EVERYWHERE. Even though they're in the Navy, it's perfectly normal to see those posters everywhere... even in locker rooms where it makes no sense.
In the words of Archer: "Danger Zone"
More accurately: LAAAANNNNNAAA,
danger zone
Lana call Kenny Loggins cuz you're in the Danger Zone
You mean K -Log…
When I was an F15 crew chief I used to give the aircrew a disposable camera to take some pics for me. So maybe yeah he could have a Polaroid camera with him 🤷
From 1984 to 1988 I was an exchange instructor (US Army) serving with Landing Force Training Command, Pacific (LFTC, PAC), Coronado, California. We taught Sailors and Marines Close Air Support (CAS) and Forward Observation (FO) for Naval Gunfire, artillery, and mortars. No one wore dress uniforms to the officer clubs until this movie was released. After that many of the Naval pilots and REOs showed up looking like French admirals. It only lasted for a week or two, but the rest of us had a good laugh at their expense
Minus five thousand sins for being one of the best channels on TH-cam
Best active pilots in the US Navy. Also the fact that every Navy man sings along implies many a sailor has tried this.
Now sin Iron Eagle!
There is NOTHING wrong with Iron Eagle!!! It is PERFECT!!! I'll fight you to the death!!!
You're dead right about the hard deck being a bullshit reason for Maverick to lose. As you said the Jester technically crashed his plane within the rules of the game
I actually think the fact Jester chickened out to avoid a loss and then blamed it on the rookie is a realistic character thing to do in the chain of command, where winning is everything.
@@RettMikhal Civil servant... always looking to cover their own asses.
@@Cyril29a See the movie was trying to prepare us for real life and we didn't listen.
@@RettMikhal IT'S A FQN MOVIE!
Jester is a cheat and a coward. He saw he was going to lose and essentially went to the Safety Zone to avoid it, like a 3rd Grader in a game of tag.
"I CAN'T get it up for 'Danger Zone,' man."
This is literally the first time I've ever actually been angry at Jeremy.
I was thinking he would take a sin off. Maybe like 5. I’m sinning him for this.
Normally I defend Jeremy's bullshit.... but this is a bridge too far.
Danger Zone rocks. Next then you know he'll say he doesn't like Eye of the Tiger.
Sheer blasphemy, I tell you. The first soundtrack I ever had was Top Gun. Jeremy want to get checked for ED if he can't get it up for Danger Zone.
Awful song. Always an awful song.
Fun Fact: Cruise had never drove a motorcycle before this movie and learned in a parking lot. They didn't even let him drive on set, it was on a rig.
Then he pulls up on a Harley in Days of Thunder lol
"Um... Jerry O'Connell, Scream 2, 1997" best line and reference, love it
I saw this movie inappropriately early, at 8 or 9 years old. My dad had the vhs and watched it a lot. Must’ve been right when the vhs was available over here.
You did a great job sinning it.
The Bonus round was on point. It’s like an ad for Aviators, after being one for the Navy first.
Ditto, I grew up watching this movie, and while it's cheesy as heck, it has a very likable charm to it.
And now they're overpriced pieces of garbage made in sweatshops.
Saw it when I was 6...but then again I grew up in Europe, we're less fuzzy about what's appropriate and what isn't.
I saw it on it's release in 1986, at the drive in. The 2 of us girls in one car, the boys in the other. Absolutely loved it. Now it's so cheesy that I could slap it on a cracker for dinner and have leftovers for breakfast (still love it though)
Inappropriate? Lol wut. I saw it in theatre the year it came out, I was 8 and my 13 year old sister was alone with me.
As somewhere else on TH-cam an actual F-14 RIO commented that what CinemaSins says is ‘ Impossible ‘ is actually Impossible not because planes can’t do that , but because planes can’t do that with the vertical stabilizers ( that’s the tail to those not into airporn ) STICKING INTO THE FUSELAGE of another aircraft , which is what would happen if you had a mug and a tomcat that close to each other with one is inverted, to quote iceman ahhBULLSHITchew !
Same RIO also said ‘ Base Security! Some idiot is riding a motorcycle down the taxiway! ‘
I believe I watched that video.
But a tomcat has twin tails and the fake mig had one which would fit inside them.
It’s still BS but physically possible.
@@GhostWatcher2024 Ward Carroll th-cam.com/video/55aNs81oYSY/w-d-xo.html
*(that's the tail to those not into air porn)
*aircraft,
12:01 - This segment proves Sinny is indeed a character in his/her/its own right. And also that Sinny is a pervert. And I couldn't stop laughing for a full minute. So one sin off for Sinny's awesomeness. (-1 and reverse-ding)
at least sinny didnt break
@ Krizwatcher LOL
@@cmdraftbrn you mean like in Home Alone 2? 😂😂😂
@@danielleking262 poor sinny
OK That Real Genius joke is probably one of my favorites the channel has made. Really fun movie that just doesn't get enough recognition.
12:07: It’s very odd watching the cinemasins guy refer to the movie sin counter as “Sinny” when he accidentally removes various sins and eventually resins them!
the bar in san diego has a kansas flag because it's called "kansas city barbecue" aka "the kansas city grill". it's a real place.
The sad thing about those "fake looking screens" is that a lot of ships haven't upgraded much past when the movie was made 😂
All the wokeness in these videos is really turning my off to this channel. I loved cinema sins but it’s just not the same anymore…
21:30: The nostalgia of the 1965 “Thunderbirds” puppet tv show with its countdown and blastoff intro brings me back some flashbacks and memories of how obsessed I was with that show from a decade and a half ago!
15:09 This bar in San Diego is actually called "Kansas City barbeque". Which explains the Kansas flag.
@CinemaSins i think you forgot that the "enemy migs" were being piloted by Iranian pilots. This is in fact totally accurate as at the time we were using them in real life as Top Gun instructors. When he said they would be flying against the best pilots in the world, that was correct.
The enemy pilots were all Topgun instructors, but none were actually Iranian. Also......they don't let Iranian pilots be real Topgun instructors. That has never happened.
@16:25 its not bad to encourage him back on a plane. It might help him to separate the trauma from his job/passion. Not right for everyone but its worth a shot.
Sin on you Jeremy. We don’t say ‘hours’ after 1600 in the Navy. We simply say “Pass another beer.”
spitting FACTS
I haven’t seen cinema sims in years but seems like the quality has depreciated a fair amount lol
I’m only at Sin 50 & this is already one of my favorite Cinema Sins video. Thank you for these videos. Nothing like a good laugh after work. You are the best!
Literally just watched this movie for the first time a few days ago and already can’t wait for the new one. Couldn’t imagine waiting 36 years 😂
To be honest, who saw the first one, wasn't waiting for a sequel.
I want to buy a seat in the theaters for my deceased father. That's how big of an impact Top Gun has on me. Or, I'm a weirdo. Both I think....
I haven’t been waiting 36 years, I did other stuff in the meantime.
Same! I heard the new one coming out is really good and finally decided to watch the original 3 days ago. Great timing!
Haha I watched it for the first time a month ago, can't wait for the 2nd one
Also goose does have a purpose he operates the big ass AWG-9 radar that sits in the radome of the tomcat the plane is combat in effective without him because maverick can't manipulate the radar and the workload for using it is high enough that goose is needed
A few things:
- The radar monitors in the combat information center of the carrier are real.
-You need a lot of fuel to land on an aircraft carrier, enough to be able to take off if your tailhook doesn't catch the arresting wire
Hilarious CinemaSins video tho
Yeah, they got unprecedented access to the Navy for this film, so I guess much of the shots are 'real' in and around the carrier.
You'd think they would launch a KA-6 or KA-3 and give him some juice, but in the situation happening in the movie, cougar probably could not have pulled off a mid air refueling anyway
19:41, did they give him a box to stand on?
The rear seater is the RIO - Radar Intercept Officer. Not a "copilot." Also, sailors are warfighters, but they aren't "soldiers."
This is a really sinful (but enjoyable, at least on the first viewing) movie, especially for someone with military and aviation experience. It has been thoroughly sinned on other channels and sites, but Cinema Sins still caught several sins that I haven't seen noted elsewhere. BUT Cinema Sins also had a lot of inaccurate sins that a small amount of research would have prevented.
One thing that has ALWAYS driven me crazy is how Maverick's rank keeps changing on his uniforms. I'm thinking he's an O-4, oh wait, he's an O-3...O-4 in this scene? O-3 again...grrrr. Fun fact: they do the same thing in "A Few Good Men"
I just watched this movie and wondered if there was a Cinema Sins for it. You read my mind Jeremy
Goose is the Weapons Officer. He monitors the radar, weapons systems radio, aircraft systems, etc. HE isn't a "Co-pilot"
Yes but back then they were called Radar Intercept Officers
Top Gun has 133 sins and Jurassic world fallen Kingdom has 132 sins. 👏
03:32 "I'd like to bust your butt, but I can't!" Pretty much sums up the whole movie, really.
Also.... said no CO ever.
Crazy gay but wont just say it 😂
The bar owners are from Kansas. They have a bunch of royals and chiefs stuff hanging up in there. So actually not a sin👀
The bar was/is Kansas City BBQ.
I miss when this channel pointed out plot holes, forgotten camera equipment, unrealistic scenarios, etc. instead of bagging on movies for having competing personalities in it claiming they're sexually attracted to each other and stuff like that. Ive noticed more and more comments like this recently
I miss when people realized this is a comedy channel poking fun at movies
I gotta say, the Thunderbirds thing at the end is genius. Respect.
I just love how he didn't sin the MiG-28.
2:18 - Yes, pilots can bring almost anything they want, including cameras, and the F-14 cockpit was never that classified....
when he said classified, i was like this isn't a sr-71 blackbird, its a f-14
@@Stackali The planes existence wasn't classified but there were absolutely classified components in that cockpit. Probably still are even 15 years after its out of service and never will be until 100 years after the USA is sure Iran's F-14s (seized in the revolution) are rust and dust. Just to keep them and the Russians a little unsure what may be missing.
Classified info is all about mind games like that.
Also a big ass camera would be a safety hazard and there's gonna be precious few places to even put it.
Yeah I chuckled at that. I knew a guy that built a replica Tomcat cockpit around his computer to play his flight simulator games. Can't have been all THAT classified.
There’s been plenty published of the cockpit layouts and instruments in the F-14 (and just about every other contemporary fighter in service), so it’s not much of a secret. The issue the US has with Iran and its Tomcat fleet is fears that parts taken from retired US F-14s could somehow end up in Iranian hands to keep their fleet airworthy.
As for no cameras in the cockpit, former F-14 RIO Dave “Bio” Baranek would disagree, with several books he’s published with loads of photos he took over the course of his career in the backseat of an F-14. He’s mentioned the only time he was told not to take any photos was when he went up against captured MiGs as part of the Constant Peg program at Tonopah Test Range, which made sense since that program was highly classified at the time, and he left his camera on the ground for those hops.
@@Stackali Right, the cockpits themselves wouldn't be classified because they're all pretty standard. What is classified is a plane's exact capabilities, which of course isn't something you would likely see in a photo.
I own Top Gun on dvd. Watched in prep for the sequel. This movie is a power ride. Can’t wait to see Top Gun 2
According to the MPAA, you don't own it. You own a license to view it.
Goose is not Maverick's co-pilot. He's his RIO (Radar Intercept Officer). Come on, Cinemasins. This movie has only been out for 36 years.
I do totally agree with the sin on throwing Goose's dog tags. That would be something that you may want to give to his widow or his son.
2:30 Fuel efficiency varies even more wildly in fighters than in cars, but it's like the difference between cruising at highway speeds and racing on a track.
This has to be the funniest one of these videos I've seen. Great job!
Also, that flash you used on the Polaroid completely hid the MiG from the picture. You just took a picture of the flash reflecting on the canopy of your jet.
Not if he had the navy issued Uber polarized strobmatron 7000
5:30: CinemaSins incorrectly identifies the naval flight officers, commonly known as weapon systems officers, as co-pilots. Although WSO's can perform some co-pilot functions, they are not naval aviators. *DING*
In the movie their referred to as RIOs, or Radar Intercept Officers, which was apparently their designation up until fairly recently?
@@nolanboles8492 When the McDonnell-Douglas F4 Phantom II was in service, that was what they were called; more recently the term has morphed into WSO. Depending on aircraft type, they can also be referred to as combat systems officers (CSO's).
I’m going to need CW Lemoine to react to this
Mover and Gonky did a 2 part review of Top Gun.
Great movie. CinemaSins Classic. Can you do Top Gun 2?
Did you just sinned Danger Zone????? HIGHWAY TO THE DANGER ZONE!!!!! That song is awesome!!!!!!!! I’m sooooo ready for Top Gun Maverick, just got my and Dad tickets yesterday, and we are seeing it on Sunday at 2:30pm!!!!!