I read somewhere that in the lore of early magic, lands are your planeswalkers connections to places you have been, drawing upon that memory and connections made there in those natures to generate the power for your spells. Hence why special lands and locations create power in their own way.
Yeah I didn't think that this topic needed a 14 minute video as this is the reason. The game of magic in lore is two planeswalkers having a duel, using the mana of the worlds to fuel their conjurations (creatures), spells, and their ability to communicate and call upon other walkers for aid (the planeswalker cards)
@@matthewstorm4135 I'm quite sure it came up frequently in the earliest publications, especially the Armada books. 'Distant Planes' has a whole short story that is nothing but a duel between two planeswalkers, where they conjure up creatures based on the kind of soil they stand on, if i recall correctly.
Another thing I would like to add about mountains and red. Just looking at a mountain, if you’re adventurous enough, just invokes the feeling of wanting to climb and conquer it. Looking at them makes u wanna go up them, just so u can look from the top down at everything and say to yourself “yea, I did it”. I feel like that goes into passion and being adventerous. It’s also a huge challenge to climb a mountain, something that only those with huge fire in their bellies can conquer.
The way I understood the reasoning behind blue being islands and red being mountains was that theyre the two most elementally bound colors Blue is water and air Red is earth and fire So it makes a lot of sense that those lands were chosen because the island evokes a windy ocean breeze where water and air meet while mountains are the earthen result of the fire within the world itself.
I have actually mapped the Five colors of the color pie to the Five Elements of Chinese lore (as well as the five "verbs" and fifteen "nouns" of Ars Magica).
@@carlosalbuquerque22, That's the mapping that I used. For Ars Magica Green is Creo/Herbam/Animal; Red Muto/Ignem/Vim; Black Perdo/Terram/Corpus; White Intellego/Aurum/Mentem; and Blue Rego/Aquam/Imaginem.
I believe that Swamps have more to do with black mana than just collective imagination. Swamps are formed from ponds and other shallow bodies of water. Vegetation grows around the body of water. As these plants die and decay, they lower the water level, eventually becoming a swamp. Swamps are built on death and decay, and if that isn't a black mana thing, I don't know what is.
That's also how forests work too, just without the pools of stagnant water. The leaves fall from the trees in the autumn, decompose, and becomes the nutrients for the tree later as well as help keep the moisture that does fall to the forest floor from evaporating off. I think it is a modern sensibility too, because when you consider our fairy tales, the children who venture off into the dark places of the world aren't wandering into the swamp to get to grandmother's house, they're going into the forests. Our relationship to forests has changed over time to see them as less dangerous and more tranquil, but our concepts of swamps which are more inhospitable have not.
@@anthonydelfino6171 A forest is not land created by the death of trees. A forest is the same a a plain but with trees on it. A swamp is a pond that has been drained of it's water by nearby plants, but many plants that start to grow there are killed by the rise in water. It is nature at war with itself.
In terms of black mana and swamps, I'll take a look at amorality and ambition, and compare those aspects to our irl swamps and marshes. They tend to be places that despite stagnant waters and often poor soil, they tend to be rather beautiful and vibrant. However, that merely shows that black *is* a positive color as much as any other mana. Things like plants choking out light and space for competition happens, insect larvae predate upon eachother and tadpoles, and even parasites turn other animals into vectors and easy prey for their purposes. I think the biggest example of black mana in swamps would be venus fly traps, which rely on eating insects due to lack of nitrogen in soils of the area, and only really out compete by taking advantage of wildfires that they can withstand. Amorality and ambition in that, making opportunity out of bad situations. However this all still allows these places to be safe havens for some, such as nesting birds or manatees which have no competition and no predation. Our swamps are still black mana, but they are the good sides of such. As for the lands themselves, both swamps and mountains are typically the most difficult places for any kind of city or proper large civilization, mountains from quakes, cold, steep faces, and thin air (sometimes eruptions), swamps because anything too heavy will *sink* and be swallowed. As for blue, simply our history is full of island people taking like fish to water with naval navigation and island hopping exploration. If that isn't an example of blue curiosity and willingness to explore what's next or what's ahead, I don't know what would be. And not just people, but animals and plants only arrive through either exploration or isolated with lands themselves separating outward and in a way exploring themselves (or erupting out of the unknown waters)
Something about Swamps that many tend to miss out on. Is that many times the bogs and swamps have a weird particle suspension that change the way buoyancy works on us. So people will be treading water and just sink and be unable to get back out. It becomes an easy story to tell of evil things that kill people in the swamps when people just disappear.
People don't understand the natural beauty of the darker side of nature. I love autumn because it's the beginning of the cycle of decay. Death that will cause new life.
@@owa8609 True, but it is exemplified far more often with swamps and wetlands. Besides "all nature is like that" and "just green with extra steps" is essentially another way to just say every land card should be green anyways. Plus even green *mana* is different from nature, in that it's laid out destiny/purpose and a veneration of the old, which swamps and wetlands can easily shift and change while forests, if left to their devices, can last centuries, consisting of multiple dens, hollows, and nests that animals return to year after year
There's actually practical symbolism in how Black's approach to ambition (all the non-Green colors are ambitious to an extent; Black is just defined by its selfishness) is extremely risky. By traversing through a swamp, one takes a huge risk from what's there with the quicksand, wildlife, and diseases. In the darkness of a swamp ("the dark" can also mean anything mysterious; they're usually avoided, so most people don't know how to navigate them), everyone navigating them is alone because they can't be mapped like forests can. Because of this, swamps require one's internal logic, which may-or-may-not save him or her. Black mana is the same way because to use it is to risk, if not guarantee, being consumed by it. And even then, some may even consider the payoffs not worth the risk. What separates the forest from the swamp is not only how the former is not always as dangerous and can be mapped but also from how the trees hold in soil, similar to how Green values keeping the natural order together.
It's modern sensibilities and shared cultural understandings that I think decided the lands (as well as their simplicity, mountain is more broad and universally relatable than volcano) But as a counterpoint, imagine the game being made 600 years ago. The color for black mana probably would have been the forest. The forests were seen as wild and dangerous places where the darker forces lived. This is why you have tales like Hansel and Gretel where the forest houses the witch that wants to eat children. Our thoughts toward certain land types and how we as humans relate to them has changed over time. Also it's always funny to hear the perspective of the Rocky Mountains from others. My family moved to the west when I was around 10 years old from a more open and flat part of the world. And rather than feeling a sense of stability, I always felt them to be oppressing and stifling. They dominated the horizon in every direction I looked and cut off my ability to see the world beyond them. Ideas completely at odds with the ideas of red mana, which is why to me they've always felt like the wrong land type to represent the color... but I'm hard pressed to think of any kind of land more broadly understood and easily identifiable that could be used (except maybe deserts, but I can see where that might be too visually similar to plains, and if considered probably was decided against)
Honestly it's very cool to hear how the same feature can be perceived in different ways depending on the context of the person. It does make the discussion tricky but an interesting one
Here's my reasoning: each color is a respective element channeled through a landscape white- the sunlight gleaming over a vast plain/ field red- the dynamic energy of fire and earth, essentially tectonic/ thermal energy Blue- water, either in the sky or in the ocean/ rivers below green- the fertile energy of life through forested areas- full of the primal energies of life black- swamps are places of life, but thrive off of decay- leading to foul smells that are invocative of a zombie, many are often enclosed by surrounding trees depending on geography, so they can be often depicted as gloomy, dark, festering places of rot so essentially you have the light element, fire/earth element, the water/air element, the plant/life (Gaia? element) and the dark/ decay element in terms of in universe, we have: order, aggression, wisdom, life and death
Great vid! For Islands, I would add that Blue is the color of control and perfection, and it can come off as cold or distant its pursuit of these things. The phrase “no man is an island” comes to mind here, which refers to the connection between humans and how isolation does us no good. Based on this assertion, Blue is arguably the most like an island out of all the colors.
I feel like you could have related swamps to real life more. They're land areas seen unsuitable for settlement which paradoxically make them ideal to those who find settlements unsuitable. Swamps harbor the societal outcast
Another thing that I think may have influenced the creation of the mountains is that, if we better associate red/fire with volcanos, then that would have been the first being selected, but since the volcano erupting is more of an action it would be better portrayed as a Sorcery/Instant, leaving the spot for the inactive form of a volcano as a land, a mountain
In some of the early novels, mana was the memoy of the land. I think it was "The Dark" that mentions the codifying of the colors of mana and what they are. There is even a point where a mage has to cast a spell that will save the protagonist. The description stuck with me for years. "She recalled an island with black volcanic sand and clear blue waters. She remembered the warmth of the fires as she played with the others. She shed a a tear as she knew what had to be done. Cast the spell and poured into it that memory." There is even a point where the main character realizes why a spell that needed to be cast at a specific place was because he was drawing on the wrong mana. The place used to be bogs and flooded fields. That is when he realizes that he should be calling on black mana. Thus mana was memory of the land.
For black mana, Wastes would work just as well as Swamps. Many swamp's arts are this rotten, mostly non-alive landscape which lends itself nicely to be called a waste land. However, swamps come more naturally in the real world then wastes, as those typically get overgrown rather quickly.
Wastelands conjure images of a barren, waterless, lifeless place A swamp is full of life because it's wet and watery. Water + biomass = decay, which is very much black to me.
Another connection with Islands could be the ancient Greek City states, small nations on an island or coast limited by their size which allowed for direct democracy and gave rise to some of the most famous philosophers. Coastal cities in general tend to be diverse and take in a lot of different ideas due to trade and migration.
Something that fascinates me about lands in Magic is how in real world cultures that exist in those places, their color identities often do not line up with those civilizations. Green I feel being perhaps the only exception, pervading not only its own biome but also the oft nearby swamps and most especially isolated islands. This is most true of white and red, often being exact opposites. Plains cultures are often portrayed as wild and free, dancing around campfires, changing migration paths as nessecary, etc. Whereas mountain cultures are often rigid and strict to enable their survival in those harsh environs. What's more idyllic of a monowhite civilization than the Incan Empire? All this is to say that a comment you made here on swamps led to me considering how cultures of one color might exist within the environment of another's mana source, and I got some revelations and cool ideas from it.
i've lived in Washington State for the last 2 years, you can absolutely see the inspiration for MtG in the landscape here. Especially in the spring and summer, I feel like I'm living in a 5 color deck.
someone once said to me that the connection between islands and blue's philosophy is *flow*. the flow of water, the flow of time, the flow of the game itself, etc
Awesome video thank you for sharing :) lands are one of my favorite aspects of magic strangely enough so hearing a deeper take on them aside from one is green/blue is kind of refreshing
The lore of mtg has inspired me to write a poem, as a basis of my new saga I am writing, and I would be happy to share.. The Colorless, Shadeless, and Lightless matter, the Neutral start of Everything; The Grey Lies in Wait. And from The Grey, Arose The Great, White, Illuminous Light... From The White Thirst to Expose the Order of All that Is, seeking Structure in answers of Unity now lost to the Grey, Light shines down to Reveal Structure of Mysterious Form, Undefined, Masking Secrets in Brilliant Blue... From The Blue, Light discovers Perfection in Progress. Each Discovery Feeding a Desire that Inspired more, Ideas Awaken and yearn to Manifest Realities. Gradually, the Light fades in it's pursuit, Diven Deeper within Seas of Mystery Unbound. Far from the Light's Last Inspiration, Mysteries Obscured once more as the Wonders of Blue Deepen into Ominous Black... From The Black Lack of Lumination, Liquid Dreams are Frozen Dry; Absolute Only in their Own Presence. Devoid of the Sight of any other, Heat becomes their only Reality lost in Icey Stagnance; The only Reality yet siphoned by the Lonely Abyss. Nearly absent, but faintly ignited Deep within the Heart of the Void, Heat yet remains. Heat Magnifies as Pressure Intensifies; Burning with Passion, Expanding, Glowing Evermore Red... From The Red, Searing Fires of Chaos formed Ashen Stone from Values once Opposed. From the Pressures sprang forth Land, Rich with Black Soil, Married with Blue Waters, now basking in the renewed Wake of the Great White Lumination. From this History Fathomed, Nature Manifested and Sprouted Forth a Living, Green Body... From The Green, Unparalleled Strength Flourishes. Fueled by a Burning Red Desire to survive, Pressured by Willful Greed birthed from Black and Sightless times of Shadow, Divined Deep within the Heart of Mysterious Waters Blue and full of Wonders, Revealed through Spectres of Valiant White Light, the Living Green becomes Enlightened with Age. Rising, Growing, Living, Fading. Returning once more to the Light, Long Watching from Above, Shining Ever Brighter. Seeking a History long Forgotten... And just outside that Violet Force of Influence, Forever Expanding Outward, The Grey Lies in Wait. Waiting from afar to be Tainted by the Royal Color of Influence. Returning from within, in the absence of Influence itself..
Plains - Things are wide open and clear to see, exposed relatively directly to light for greater portions of the day, with less shadows, denying sneakiness and thus encouraging ideas of honor, without natural fortifications like rivers and mountains, people must protect themselves by building their own, and have the opportunity to do so cultivating many plants in the fields, things are even and simple and exposed to direct light, encouraging ideas of purity and purification. Many of the most noticeable creatures of the plains are herd or pack animals, herds that feed on the grasses and pack hunters that team up to isolate and take down individuals from the herds, creatures for whom survival involves teamwork and numbers. Island - Islands have restricted access and difficulties in reaching them, boating to them often requires ingenuity and deliberation of fixing flaws of ship-construction of worthy vessels and skills in navigation, either by the stars over long distances or around various hazards like reefs and cliffs or predicting the weather to avoid going out in the storms. Their natural fortification of surrounding waters provides protection that grants time to think, yet access to the waterways also tends to make trade cheaper over greater distances and thus creates a meeting point of knowledge and ideas and goods to experiment with. The relatively small size and isolation of islands means plants and animals introduced to them can transform them and take them over quite quickly if it is advantageous to them, and the isolation often encourages evolutionary changes once cut off from mainland populations, and behavioral changes when exposed to different sets of food sources. Survival on islands often requires adapting to the dangers of the nearby waters, more direct exposure to storms, the cycles of the tides, restrictions on coming and going that may force flexibility in behavior and diet. Birds that fly to avoid danger and are relatively intelligent animals are often some of the first animal colonizers of islands not from the waters themselves. The waters surrounding the islands have currents and other patterns, creatures often navigate in 3 dimensions when they fly or swim, unlike land animals, creating wider strategic and tactical opportunities and additional dangers that must be dealt with by various means. Swamp - The less active water-flow of swamps are more prone to being less clean and safe to drink than the flowing water of rivers and some lakes, the still waters are often breeding grounds for things like blood-sucking and disease spreading mosquitos, and the humid environment is often a place that easily encourages the spread of fungi, which often behave in key roles for decomposition, the many separated pools, many of which are surrounded and sometimes covered with plant-life or are quite murky and various forms of plant-life cover over much of the nearby land provides plenty of cover for opportunistic ambush hunters, while in some cases decomposition is encouraged in swamps, in other places, like tar pits or hypoxic environments or places with unusual acidity there may be preservation instead, preserving corpses beyond normal time-spans, often in disgusting states, creating association with the undead. Blooms of swamp gasses can produce will-o-the-wisps which are known for being mistaken for spirits or malevolent fey. People of the swamps often have to be very careful to avoid their various dangers and know how to navigate them and survive the dangers, and even then, swamp populations are still often more prone to suffering things like mosquito spread diseases, yet the dangers often also provide opportunities to those who would take advantage of them. Mountain - Volcanos, mudslides, rockslides, avalanches, dangers on mountains can be sudden and compound upon themselves, those with strength and agility in the form of climbing skills often find themselves in advantageous positions, adaptation to the thin air at high altitudes often leaves one at advantage athletically when descending down, the natural fortifications of the mountain are also often chosen for shelter from violent threats, yet are often chosen by those who expect such threats, and give opportunities to be less hesitant to provoke such threats from such a relatively safe position. Even without more sudden sources of violence, some forms of volcanos are simply regularly active, and water sources flowing down mountains often form waterfalls in places or violent rapids, exposed rocks can be carved and chipped at creatively to create statues and art pieces relatively simply that tend to last quite a while. Many creatures of the mountains are known to be hardy and scrappy, ready for danger both in the giving and taking of it and navigating dangerous cliffsides where a fall could mean death, taking risks for their own prosperity and relative safety vs. less climbing capable threats. Forest - Trees themselves are known for their size compared to many other plants, and their growth over time, they can often sustain large and complex ecosystems full of a variety of competing life-forms. To live in a forest is to know it's dangers and opportunities, what must be watched out for and might surprise you at any moment around the next tree, and what can be eaten while avoiding trying to eat what isn't good for you or is outright poisonous, this knowledge must be passed down, forming traditions, and to live in a forest long term without changing it to a plains or something else often requires relatively strict rules and traditions for sapient civilization capable life, in order to avoid over-logging or otherwise destroying the forest, and survive without plains farms of grain (or swamp for some types of rice).
You do realize that this is basically MTG astrology. You just invented meaning. You can easily switch the lands. White mountains would be "like a wall that protects and stands against the winds." Red islands could be "like the relentless attack of the waves, always hitting, suddenly get angry with a tempestuous fury shooting lightning from the sky"
Another couple of things that could be added about islands are isolation and discovery. Being in the middle of the sea/ocean means that they are the places you reach after sailing into the sea, possibly in seeking the possibilities beyond it, of a new (personally) undiscovered land. At the same time, they are separated from larger bodies of land, contained in their own little space.
for swamps/black, I think it's important to realize that there are historical reasons for the negative associations with the biome. without modern medicine, pest control and sanitation it was genuinely unhealthy to be around them.
My friend once came up with an idea for mixed land. A platow being white and red, or a jungle being black and green. I still think about that idea sometimes.
@@whisperingsage89 I don't mean guildgates or the ones that make you pay 2 life to enter untapped. I mean lands that come into play untapped and count as 2 different lands like a plains mountain land that's just a plains/mountain.
There’s also colorless mana and its wastes and while it wasent the orginal 5 basic lands it symbolism of a wasteland devoid of any color or identity comepletelt empty. And yet with that empty space one could bring color to it and imprint upon it kinda how the philosophy of colorless mana works in dicetrys video about colorless mana functioning like a color in terms of philosophy and such. Idk if what I’m saying is 100% accurate as I hold a rather basic understanding of this game but the lore and philosophy has been fasinating to look at for me.
Swamps have always felt like the biggest stretch for me. If I was making the game over, I would’ve made black mana come from Caves. Anything subterranean.
I’ve been thinking the next Other Media you should do is Colors of Yugioh characters, since that series was what probably led us all to Magic in the first place
Wow. I am impressed by the video. I thought lands only fit due to elemental similarity. Forest is green, because it has a lot of vegetation. It is like the element earth, or more specifically wood. Mountain is red, because it has volcanoes. It is like the element fire. Island is blue, because it is surrounded by water. It is like the water element. Plains is white, because it has light yellow grasses. Grass is usually green, but it does turn yellow during harvest. The yellow is like the light element. Swamp is black, because it has dark murky water. Yet DiceTry went beyond these simple associations. He connected the lands on a philosophical level. I am a DiceTry fan. Yet I am very impressed. Bravo. I have some things to say on the specifics. There is a great point of plains being the center of agriculture and civilization. Plains have the richest soil, and so they are the best for farming, which is the essential foundation of civilization. I talked about this in a social post on the DiceTry channel not too long ago. I have noticed the most recent posts were for lands. Maybe they were things leading up to this video. I think plains can go deeper. Primates usually live in the jungle, which is a kind of forest. Humans are different because they have evolved to live in grasslands instead. They walk on two feet. That helps them move on land, instead of trees. The upright stance lets humans see over grass better. Humans switched diet to rely more on grains. That is due to living in the grasslands, and taking advantage of the food source it does have. Maybe this evolution leads to the positive view of planes as a safe place. It is the place of order, society and all that jazz. Come to think of it, the Disney movie Bambi is the only time I have seen with a negative depiction of plains. This environment is specifically a meadow. The movie is from the deer perspective. The forest is depicted as a lovely home and safe haven. The plains is depicted as a dangerous and unnerving place. The scary scenes involving man tend to take place here. This makes sense in context because deer lives in the forest. So they would view the forest as nicer. Bambi's mom explains that the meadow is more dangerous because there are no trees or bushes to hide in. Being out in the open makes deer more vulnerable to hunters. That is an unusual take on the plains. It is a little like agoraphobia.
It is interesting how the water is relaxing and so leads to deep contemplation. Fish are important too. They have such graceful movements when they swim. Watching fish makes people relaxed. So both water and fish can relax the viewer. Doctors do have a bad reputation of being scary, even though it is their job to help people. Some operations are sometimes painful like shots. Dentists are the doctors with the worse reputation. They know about it too. So what dentists often do is have a fish tank in their clinic. The patients can watch the fish in the waiting room. Then that calms them down. It lowers the anxiety of visiting the dentist. Even the Disney Pixar movie Finding Nemo gets this right. A big part of the movie is Nemo being imprisoned on land. He tries to find a way to escape to the ocean. Nemo isn't in any kind of fish tank. He actually stays in one that is in a dentist clinic. Swamps have a bad reputation. So it is easy to link it to the color of cards with the spooky imagery. Swamps in real life are not nearly as bad as media makes it out to be. They are rich ecosystems. I appreciate this video bringing it up. I wonder if there is an underlying biological reason for an aversion to swamps. There is one thing that can't be denied. Swamp water is disgusting. It is all murky. It stinks. A human is better off drinking fresh water from a river. The risk of getting a waterborne disease would be much higher in a swamp than a river. Swamps would have other nasty stuff like parasites and mosquitos. That probably makes humans in general have an aversion to swamps. Death is an important theme in black. A lot of black creatures are undead. The mechanics focus on the discard pile, which is called a graveyard. Perhaps swamp fits because its murky water stinks like a corpse. Looking back, I think a better name for this land is bog. There are different kinds of wetlands. A swamp is a rich wetland dominated by trees. Bog is a very unusual wetland. Unlike other wetlands, it is poor in life. The water is so stagnat, it doesn't get much oxygen. So stuff doesn't grow very well. There are even plants that eat bugs. That makes up for the solid being so bad. The harsh area fits the ruthlessness of black. There is more. Because of the harsh environment, bodies don't rot very well. So they end up being preserved. That leads to big bodies. These are human mummies found in bogs. This video has a Lord of the Rings reference. That place is called the Dead Marshes. However I think it is a misnomer. It is filled with dead preserved bodies of some ancient war. So this would be the Dead Bogs. Only bogs can preserve bodies like that. One material produced in bog is peat. Peat is dead and preserved vegetation. When it gets fossilized, it turns to coal. Bogs are special for preserving the dead. I think this fits black very well. Black is all about reusing the dead. I can easily picture it reanimating bog bodies into some kind of undead creature. It would be a mummy, a zombie or something like that. The recycling does happen in real life. Wood is the main original fuel to make fire. However peat and coal can be used instead.
The mountains are intriguing. DiceTry brings up a good point. Volcanoes are the obvious environment for fire. Even the first Pokemon games have the fire type gym leader live in a volcanic area. This is called Cinnabar Island. Volcanoes may be too specific though. So it is good to broaden out, and DiceTry gave a great explanation. Most mountain ranges came from volcanic activity. So they are still fiery and red in a sense. There is a trio of land, sea and sky. Land is like earth. Sea is like water. Sky is like Air. The Pokemon Hoenn legendaries follow this pattern. The Biblical creatures they are based on follows this pattern. Greek mythology has its main gods follow this pattern. These are Zeus, Posieden and Hades. I think there should be a fourth area to represent fire. I thought the mantle would be the best. That is the source of fiery volcanic eruptions. Mountains do fit in with that since they are made from volcanoes and mantle shifting. There are some mountain ranges that don't come from volcanoes. The major examples that come to my mind are the Himalayas and the Alps. However even those are still formed from the shifts of the mantle. So there is fire involved. It just doesn't come out. This is a case where both sides in the fault are made of land. So the land scrunches upwards without subduction, melting and volcanoes. Forests are great places for green. They are the places with the richest life even if it isn't ideal for humans. One of the major goals of environmentalists is saving the rainforest. That really helps link the forest land to the green value of nature and environmentalism. Two excellent movie examples of this are Fern Gully and James Cameron's Avatar. I thought it was funny that MTG focuses so hard on elves being green. That would fit wood elves specifically. Other elves would fit other colors. Light elves would be in white. Dark elves would be in black. So the total of elves would probably be Abzan colors. Even the remaining colors can be justified. Elves are shown to be very intelligent. That fits blue. Elves can be seen as being free in a sense. In DND, the original elf god was very free spirited. He used to shapeshift a lot. That would fit red. This video did bring up a good point. The elves in Lord of the Rings live in forests. So that makes wood elves prominent in MTG. This is kind of like this in World of Warcraft. There are two main kinds of elves. There are the night elves and the blood elves. They have major differences. However one thing that both have in common is that they live in forests. The blood elves are not environmentalist. However they still live in forest, so that fits.
Mana is used as a source of magic in games. MTG has an interesting take on it. This is where the source of magic is tied to the land. It reminds me of some kind of magic. Maybe this because magicians and Pagan often go hand in hand. Pagans are tied to the land and nature, because it is sacred to them. Perhaps magicians get their power, because they are blessed by the land. It is sort of like how priests and clerics get holy magic as a blessing from their deities. Magic power is done as a reward for devotion. Warlocks can work the same way except by a creepy patron. Maybe MTG can have lands involved with ley lines or something like that. The biggest example of a nature based magician for me is the shaman. They connect to the environments and animals. They make medicine wheels on the ground using stones. The shaman is the magician that fits green perfectly. That is something that would be connected to the land. The shaman is also the first magician and the first religious leader. Green is the color of both nature and tradition. The tradition is mainly due to the natural world before industrialization. Lord of the Rings really glorifies it, and it has an environmentalist theme. Yet there is another good reason for green to have tradition. The shamans are the ones with traditional magic. It is the foundation that all other magic and religion is based on. DiceTry did have an interesting video that blue isn't the only smart color. The argument is that all colors are smart due to multiple intelligences. I wonder if this can apply to all colors. I think green isn't the only color attached to the land and environment. This video on lands really gives me that impression. All colors have a connection to the environment. They just live in different kinds. Green is mainly limited to forests. I recently found another kind of resource. This is Vancian magic. DND uses spell slots instead of mana. It was inspired by the Dying Earth book by Jack Vance. I don't like the spell slot mechanic because it is too clunky. I am currently making a house rule to use mana in DND instead. However the flavor behind Vancian magic is very interesting. MTG is inspired by DND. I think the deck is a Vancian resource that is executed a lot better. I got to wonder. Were the MTG creators aware of Vancian magic, or was it just a coincidence? I do get interested by how the game was developed, and it is nice for DiceTry to get into it. Using cards seems abstract. Hover Vancian magic can explain what is going on. Most cards are specific spells with specific effects. Drawing a card is like preparing a spell. Playing a card is like using a spell. Discarding the card afterward is like forgetting the spell. The color that is the best at drawing extra cards is blue. Blue is also the card with the most intelligence, particularly book smarts. So it makes sense for blue to be good at card draw. A really intelligent person could study and memorize more spells. Then they can use the spells later. I wonder what DiceTry thinks of Vancian magic in MTG.
I too have thought about why these specific lands were chosen and I would argue that tundra would work better for black. Swamps are just forested wetlands which is ironic since forests represent an opposing color to black. Furthermore, tundras are cold and barren with comparatively little life which fits black's whole death theme in way. Additionally, tundras usually exist near or in the arctic circle where it is possible to have complete darkness all day, but yes also complete light depending on the time of year. And if you still like the rotting, fetid asthetic of swamps for black, tundras do get wet and muddy in the warmer months. Finally, tundras are destinct enough from icesheets allowing for normal tundras to be distinct from "snow covered tundras" for flavor and gameplay reasons. For these reasons I personally prefer tundras over swamps for generating black mana.
swamps are by definition a place where water "Collects" and facilitates certain growth right. by that understanding swamps become new biomes that possibly kill off a lot of the previous ones hence why you see a lot of dead trees and stuff. moisture in the air increasing likelihood for mushrooms and animals in the water... its a lot of uncertainty and a complex level of diversity. and so a space which is intimately connected between the lens of decay and life gives us a better sense of black as it is often about sacrifice to follow goals. i think the space of swamps in imagination as well leads them to not be the peaceful angelic image of a forest - that we would see cute deer running through, and other such peaceful wildlife. perhaps a few bards and people against trees playing a lute or whatever - an odd hunter/harvester or two. the swamp then by default becomes a space like islands do - a retreat from society. if forests are the linked space with plains for society. out in the fields and dipping into the forests (but never going too far from the plains) - then swamps are considered the furthest space away within those forests, where all that "water" collects right in that ultra ripened spot... its like an extreme focal point of everything spread wide across the forest itself while also being everything its not. so i see that as a means to going to that dark and sketchy uncertain feeling place because its a space you stake out for your own goals. just like red stakes out the mountaintop, and blue reaches out the ocean. one can find things ONLY available in the swamps while staying there - attain that special magic the swamps will provide, and they clearly must be one so dedicated to sacrifice their connection to humanity to do such a thing. we understand it explicitly by how it relates to a space for life, and the kind of life that gravitates toward it human or otherwise. jus my thoughts :)
Mountains is the place where dragons and dwarves live. Also it's a major landmark that makes for cool art, not occupied by another color. Red philosophy would be better represented by e.g. a river or a glade, but it wouldn't make for a suitable location for our beloved gobbos.
I have to wonder, though, if that was inspired the other way around. If they decided on the five biomes, then gave the creature types to the colors that would most likely inhabit those places. Like most the large sea monsters would have more in common with the energy and philosophies of green mana than with blue, but they get put onto blue because blue is the color of water-dwelling animals. Similarly a lot of dwarven societies would have more in common with white (which they've started to be shifted over to) than to red, but they make many dwarves red because they live in the mountains.
Its hard to undo the mental connection but black seems like a desert if you had to really give it a land. Very hostile and consuming of life. As someone who loves frogs, I spend alot of time in thriving swamps full of life.
Swamps are where disease and decay thrive, even in real life. Perhaps not directly tied to ambition, but it is tied to death even as they spring with life. It's also where interesting plants grow, poisonous or medical. The power over life and death.
just HAD to throw that clip from Never Ending Story in there didn’t you 😭😭 jokes aside, love the video and thanks for pouring so much effort into your analyses of the MTG universe- looking forward to more topics discussed in the future!!
With swamps you could argue that even though life thrives there, it is dangerous life that thrives there. Gators hiding in black water, leeches and mosquitoes, tigers in the brackish mangrove forests. Life thrives when it is ruthless and if you aren't prepared and ruthless, you will succumb to it.
From a historical perspective, mountains have always been in the fringes of civilization, or have stood nestled between them. Mountain dwellers had been considered wild by their more settled counterparts, and the steep inaccessible slopes became a refuge for those who opposed the yoke of laws and taxes, of kings and priests. Mountain folk have generally been more independent, harder to control or subjugate, often preserving distinct languages, religions, and customs to this very day.
I see Blue Islands as representing the untouchable playstyle of Blue. Historically, Islands have always been the place you Go to Tell other nations to leave you alone. And also the vast ocean makes you curious about what's out there and willing to come Up with ways to investigate.
My personal problem with it has always been the representation (or artworks) of lands that are multiple land types. For example, Naya to most is the jungle. Which kind of makes sense because green is the main color and we can imagine it flourishes. But if we look at the three basic land types, Naya might aswell be in germany. Temur (at least to me) is way more representative of Rainforets and places like Hawaii but most Temur cards dont capture this feeling at all (except maybe Omnath). I could go on but I think that Magic kind of has outlived the use for the kind of land its people inhabit is more focused on the philosophy of them.
My take on black mana and swamps as the opposite to white mana could be that it is more challenging to build civilization in a swamp (the sinking of the city of Venice, for example). Think of things sinking into mud and/or water to drown, fundations not being able to keep houses safe. Whilst swamps are full of life, as humans, we aren't geared/trained to traverse them so easily and many predators hide in them, like crocodiles. There's a lot of biological activity, but biological production requires ressources that can be found in the form of decomposition. The only reason why black mana seems to appear as grim, is because death appears as grim to most people, but a less grim take is that death is what sometimes enables new life.
One thing most people overlook about Black is that it uses everything it can get its hands on. It looks past superficial things like aesthetics or morality and instead focuses on utility... and everything has utility if you're daring enough to utilize it. Other colors look at a rotting corpse and see something boring, or sad, or peaceful... but Black sees potential. It sees a soldier or a food source or a way to demoralize its enemies. Where other colors see a graveyard, Black sees buried treasure. And where other colors see a swamp... Black sees a proving ground. An arena where only the most cunning, vicious, and resourceful survive. Wetlands also often serve as a sort of natural dumping ground or landfill; water flows downhill to low-lying areas, bringing with it detritus, debris, dregs, and dross, and the water itself provides a probiotic breeding ground for pests and poisons. All of these are unwanted by most people, but Black sees it all as resources. Waste Not (M15), after all.
An interesting note about swamps are actually considered evil in our culture not just fantasy. It was often where pagan rituals and sacrifices including human ones were made. The fantasy tropes are drawn from understanding of both pagan and Christians as dark and malevolent places. Especially considering the religious undertones of the early sets swamps are very fitting as black mana
I think Swamp was chosen because, based on depictions, it's the colloquial use of the word, in reference to either a bog or, more commonly, what is called a muskeg, and in some cases marshes and actual swamps and maybe a fen or two. Notably, actual swamps are the most lush of these, but "swamp" is used in the same way you might call a rabbit a "rodent". Technically wrong, but gets the idea across. "Muskeg" also doesn't roll off the tongue too well. Muskegs and bogs tend to be hostile environments. The soil is poor in nutrients and saturated, making it easy to sink into, and the water is acidic and lacking oxygen. The former, in particular, tends to be composed the most of dead matter, especially the dead trees we frequently see depicted. It's so hostile to life that even some of the few plants that grow there, namely venus fly traps and pitcher plants, end up turning to actively killing to survive. While rot is often associated with black, and admittedly the conditions lend themselves least to rot and can even *preserve* dead matter, I'd say the lingering corpses and refusal to return these vital nutrients back to the soil, as if hoarding this "wealth", is what makes muskegs, or "swamps", so black-aligned.
I got some alternate views on why the lands are with said color. So red is a lot about passion even to the point of not thinking too far ahead, think charging 1/1s, and to me that is mountain climbing. People see mountains like mount Everest as a challenge that they were desperate to overcome but it has caused the downfall of many who tried. Also theoretical mountains with trying to over come a great challenge. Even looking at fantasy what is the destination of frodo from the start of the journey? Mount doom. So mountains do fit red plus was able to still do volcanos but wasn't just volcanos. Islands fit the endless wonderment, looking out to the sea and wondering what is out there which drives people to create and discover what is out there. That wonderment gained better ships so people could go out and discover that initial question of what else is out there. Which fits blue's curiosity, inventflness, and the mysteries not solved yet. Swamps I know a lot of because I live in one and they do fit a lot of black. First off it is visually spooky and when you try going through it you will have challenges from being stuck in the mud to having to do big steps just to make it across, it isn't a path many would choose if they had other options. But life still exist in swamps with things adapting to it. Yeah there are some animals that people normally associate with scary beast like alligators and snakes but there is also harmless turtles, birds only focused on fish, and crustaceans such as crawfish and crab. Same goes for people. Yeah people of the swamp will probably have to hunt more than be able to forage like the forest or have plains for farming but it is about survival. Having to do something less ideal as growing plant life or searching for it, you have to kill animals so you continue on. Which I think fits black well. Because black isn't evil despite looking it, sometimes you just have to do less ideal choices to survive.
I live in the black swamp area of Ohio. It's a literal swamp that was bulldozed and converted into farmland. The soil is fertile and rich for growing food, and my small community is a nice, peaceful place... But beneath the surface, there is something sinister about this land. Every time it rains, the mud and mosquitoes return. Disease runs rampant, and a gloomy atmosphere hangs over us. It feels like the land is trying to swallow us up and reclaim what we took from it. Meanwhile, In the shadows of each neighborhood, the young and the desperate consume drugs and ruin their bodies. Swamps have a dark and strange effect on humanity.
Swamps are considered places of death and decay in fantasy media for a reason -- they're basically considered wastelands that's difficult to build in and breed disease through mosquitoes and trenchfoot. They're humid and unpleasant to trek through. Almost every soldier embarked in conquering southern Florida in American history wrote negatively of the experience and thought trying to acquire the land from the natives was a complete waste of time for these reasons. And, honestly, they probably are right, as I don't think we should be draining wetlands just to build generic resorts and suburban landscapes. It's been resulting in billions of dollars of damage every time a hurricane goes through. Islands also show up in "A Midsummer's Night Dream" as Prospero's place of exile, and he's notably a wizard. Likewise, the vale of the Lotus Eaters took place on an island too. Like an isolated pocket of reality from the real world. I'd probably say islands are also places of isolation for hermits and the like. People who metaphorically live on an island isolated from others, which fits blue's lofty and isolated perspective on reality. It really does seem like the perfect place for a cloistered academic to hide away to contemplate magic, which is more or less what Tolaria is in MTG lore.
Personally I see it as all the potential energy of a location that could be collected/used in one day/turn, Planes have the light & warmth of the sun and fields of grains, Islands have the flow of the water & the creatures that swim within it, Swamps have the decay fueling the growth of other plants, Red... Yes the volcanos speak for themselves, as well as Green's forests, and given that green is the highest ramp of the colors should say it for itself. It's the non-colored that are more interesting, they are cities, ruins or lands where not even the dead dwell (Bazaar of Baghdad, Scorched Ruins & Field of the Dead)... Or places so obscure that not even the colors have gone there (Sheltered Valley, Winding Canyons & Rath's Edge). It is the Multicolored that build off of each other in order to make it unique, while the original dule-lands work fine i feel that the Tempest cycle fits better as representatives for there identities. Salt Flats was alive but are now dead feels more B/W than Scrublands, Skyshroud Forest while feeling more like a B/G instead of U/G is more inspired than just a Tropical Island, and Underground Sea... It's does not feel like a Black card but Rootwater Depths gives me that feeling of drowning in a inky black abyss. As for Three-Color... Well the Homelands cycle isn't all that inspired and does not give off it's colors values but instead the civilizations cultures, Invasion's are better but they still feal lacking with Irrigation Ditch & Tinder Farm, yes they represent there colors but they feel mondain & uninspired. Of course Alara & Tarkir did it best but they were designed for that, but the old Lair cycle would benefit from flavor text. There are no Four-color so no-ccomment... But if there was it would feel to cluttered, as if the Colors were fighting for control of the land instead of being mixed together. (A interesting Idea but not good for gameplay, and also..) Five-color exists as the upmost, the non legendary legendary lands. A place that cannot exist but does.... (Also update Rhystic Cave, Cave of Temptation & Gemstone Caverns to be the Cave subtype you cowered!) (And Oasis a Desert...)
Red is also, in opposition to white's plains, freedom. Mountains have long been a refuge for cultures outside of the control of the lowland (plains) civilizations.
Just as everyone here leaps to “defend” black mana and swamps as these things that have beauty and safety despite their trappings, so too can you look at the negative aspects of colors and get a strong evocation of the elements and the lands. Using red as an easier example; everyone can agree that wildfire is akin to passion, or volcanoes erupt, and these things echo Reds mechanics like “Haste” which in virtue theory is the opposite of “Caution”. You also see creatures like “Capricious Effrit” embodying the untamed and often self-destructive nature of red. The most interesting connection for me though, has to be the “negative” of the plains. The moment this video said “plains are where humans staked their claim and society was born”. I IMMEDIATELY agreed and without a beat thought “sure it is what produces food for the most (white weenie anyone) it’s also the thing we war over more than anything else.” Look at the number of human soldiers and knights, just a quick mental accounting tells me that there are more white soldier sub-types than any other color, and despite the almost implicit pairing of white with nobility and virtue, I defy anyone here to think of a sentence than means the same, using a different type of land: “and there upon that field clashed the mighty armies…” it will always be field, plain, hill…in our collective imagination, there is never a large scale war happening in a mountainside…that’s just not part of its identity. Thought the contra to a neat addition to your discussion; may your hands be flush with mana, but not flooded!
ive thought for ages that swamps should've been deserts, hard places where only the most cunning and ambitious survive the idea of an amorality in black is also much more fleshed out, since stranded i a dessert you might have to do some fucked upshit to simply survive
Interestingly I've thought red should be deserts... but that's also because my relationship to mountains is more one of feeling stifled and oppressed by their presence, feelings that are the anthesis of red.
There are some concepts that are under-represented in the cards lately. Let's face it: card design has gotten lazy. Black isn't just supposed to be the color of deception and death and evil; it's also supposed to be the color of ambition, personal achievement, and competition. Swamps do literally represent the ideas of life thriving at the expense of other life and drawing resources from decay. It isn't meant to be a contradiction that the result is something beautiful; that's a function of modern designers not thinking about it as much as Richard Garfield did. Similarly, red isn't just supposed to be the color of aggression, fire, passion, and chaos. It's also the color of rock or stone, of personal freedom, and down-to-earth simplicity. It's supposed to be the color of pioneers just as much as pyromancers. Swamps and mountains are both more literally appropriate than the modern game demonstrates. P.S. I can't be the only one annoyed by the fact that a lot of the modern basics don't even represent the literal biomes properly in their art. A modern swamp is a generic purple landscape. A modern island is a blue landscape with water running through it, or sometimes a cliff face with water running down it. Most basics are now just different-colored plains and forests with different land types arbitrarily assigned to them, and a lot of cards are the color they are because we're *told* they are, not because they accurately represent the color they're printed in.
I would question some of your conclusions of Deeper Meaning, given how so many who play Magic do not necessarily share those cultural values. The images of those lands is born though experiences of popular culture, and North American popular culture at that. A masai herdsman made familiar with the concept of the Color Pie could have very different things to say ("forests are associated with Death, because Big Cats can leap down from anywhere - perfect for Black") while a river-culture might associate Islanda with home, safety and family - a green value. Not that what you said is wrong - many of the players of the game would make similar associations with Richard Garfield's choices -but that's due to the pervasiveness of American popular culture being globalized (and the MtG crowd being wealthy enough to afford the game) than necessarily a Universal Human Truth (tm)
This is a great point and something I thought about after watching my video again. It's true I'm purely thinking of the cultural influences from a North American perspective and the whole narrative can shift depending on where you are from. It's something I will be aware of going forward
@@DiceTry You're aware of it! And I don't think any of us expect perfection. It's just something to be mindful of. The color pie (like so many of these narrative or character frameworks) can feel universal. It's easy to think so, especially once you start using them in explanatory ways. It's just important to remember that (in all Grand Theories about things) to leave room for potential alternatives approaches. It's really hard to get into the mindset of someone outside our cultural milieu though! I did a BIG stretch in even reaching for those two example cultures (I don't even think "river culture" is the right term TBH). And frankly, your answers work well in a broad way - MtG is a Pop Culture property, and conveys many Pop culture ideas within it's own unique ideosyncracies. It's not bad that you explained it as such - your answer does seem to 'fit' each basic land overall. it's just important to have a a little epistemic humility and remember even a great explanation is not always gonna be a Universal Absolute in regards to themes of culture or art.
As a general rule and as a matter of respect, it is customary to call someone with a Ph.D. "doctor." i.e., "Dr. Garfield." Please consider this when discussing someone by their first name in the future.
White sun magic plain solar. Blue mind magic island vacation. Black death magic swamp fossil. Red fire magic mountain mine. Green nature magic forest resource.
Ngl I feel this channel is under subbed the way the content is made to the philosophical thought it brings when covering these topics I find it odd it has only 24k users or so.
This is a really interesting topic and I would love to watch the video. However, that way of speaking with pauses after every few words and the pronounciation that makes it sound like struggling to complete a word (something that many video essays do) make the video unwatchable. I stopped watching after only a minute. I don't want to sound like I am attacking the video and being super negative, just consider it as feedback.
9:47 - completely disagree. It;s very inhuman way to look at a swamp. Historically swamps for humans were one of the most dangerous places to walk through, where wrong step could mean drowning, everything is poisonous and/or venomous, where one cannot grow food as the trees shadow eternally the watery graves of many who walked this land before or build a home as it will be swallowed by land itself, a place from which the illnesses come from. For a human swamp is the death as a location. That's why in the tales of old the swamp is the place were witches, monsters and demons live.
I read somewhere that in the lore of early magic, lands are your planeswalkers connections to places you have been, drawing upon that memory and connections made there in those natures to generate the power for your spells. Hence why special lands and locations create power in their own way.
That's such an lovely way of viewing the magic. I love it !
@@nerium5552 i can't take credit for it as it was written somewhere a long time ago from an old article for magic
Yeah I didn't think that this topic needed a 14 minute video as this is the reason. The game of magic in lore is two planeswalkers having a duel, using the mana of the worlds to fuel their conjurations (creatures), spells, and their ability to communicate and call upon other walkers for aid (the planeswalker cards)
I recall reading this as well, but don’t recall where. It was an older printed source, that is as much as I can recall.
@@matthewstorm4135 I'm quite sure it came up frequently in the earliest publications, especially the Armada books. 'Distant Planes' has a whole short story that is nothing but a duel between two planeswalkers, where they conjure up creatures based on the kind of soil they stand on, if i recall correctly.
Another thing I would like to add about mountains and red. Just looking at a mountain, if you’re adventurous enough, just invokes the feeling of wanting to climb and conquer it. Looking at them makes u wanna go up them, just so u can look from the top down at everything and say to yourself “yea, I did it”. I feel like that goes into passion and being adventerous. It’s also a huge challenge to climb a mountain, something that only those with huge fire in their bellies can conquer.
And such could also be the sea, but I get what you mean
The way I understood the reasoning behind blue being islands and red being mountains was that theyre the two most elementally bound colors
Blue is water and air
Red is earth and fire
So it makes a lot of sense that those lands were chosen because the island evokes a windy ocean breeze where water and air meet while mountains are the earthen result of the fire within the world itself.
I have actually mapped the Five colors of the color pie to the Five Elements of Chinese lore (as well as the five "verbs" and fifteen "nouns" of Ars Magica).
But islands are mountains. I would say most formed from volvanism
@@LeeCarlson I'm curious. I kinda of mapped them myself too: Wood/Green, Fire/Red, Earth/Black, Metal/White and Water/Blue
@@carlosalbuquerque22, That's the mapping that I used. For Ars Magica Green is Creo/Herbam/Animal; Red Muto/Ignem/Vim; Black Perdo/Terram/Corpus; White Intellego/Aurum/Mentem; and Blue Rego/Aquam/Imaginem.
I believe that Swamps have more to do with black mana than just collective imagination. Swamps are formed from ponds and other shallow bodies of water. Vegetation grows around the body of water. As these plants die and decay, they lower the water level, eventually becoming a swamp. Swamps are built on death and decay, and if that isn't a black mana thing, I don't know what is.
That's also how forests work too, just without the pools of stagnant water. The leaves fall from the trees in the autumn, decompose, and becomes the nutrients for the tree later as well as help keep the moisture that does fall to the forest floor from evaporating off.
I think it is a modern sensibility too, because when you consider our fairy tales, the children who venture off into the dark places of the world aren't wandering into the swamp to get to grandmother's house, they're going into the forests. Our relationship to forests has changed over time to see them as less dangerous and more tranquil, but our concepts of swamps which are more inhospitable have not.
When I think of swamps in magic, the kind that comes to my mind is peat bogs, characterized by the lack of decompositio
I think crocodiles survived extensiones because their biome Is based partially on decaing organice matter
@@anthonydelfino6171 Guess that's why forests share graveyard mechanics with black.
@@anthonydelfino6171 A forest is not land created by the death of trees. A forest is the same a a plain but with trees on it.
A swamp is a pond that has been drained of it's water by nearby plants, but many plants that start to grow there are killed by the rise in water.
It is nature at war with itself.
In terms of black mana and swamps, I'll take a look at amorality and ambition, and compare those aspects to our irl swamps and marshes. They tend to be places that despite stagnant waters and often poor soil, they tend to be rather beautiful and vibrant. However, that merely shows that black *is* a positive color as much as any other mana. Things like plants choking out light and space for competition happens, insect larvae predate upon eachother and tadpoles, and even parasites turn other animals into vectors and easy prey for their purposes. I think the biggest example of black mana in swamps would be venus fly traps, which rely on eating insects due to lack of nitrogen in soils of the area, and only really out compete by taking advantage of wildfires that they can withstand. Amorality and ambition in that, making opportunity out of bad situations. However this all still allows these places to be safe havens for some, such as nesting birds or manatees which have no competition and no predation. Our swamps are still black mana, but they are the good sides of such. As for the lands themselves, both swamps and mountains are typically the most difficult places for any kind of city or proper large civilization, mountains from quakes, cold, steep faces, and thin air (sometimes eruptions), swamps because anything too heavy will *sink* and be swallowed.
As for blue, simply our history is full of island people taking like fish to water with naval navigation and island hopping exploration. If that isn't an example of blue curiosity and willingness to explore what's next or what's ahead, I don't know what would be. And not just people, but animals and plants only arrive through either exploration or isolated with lands themselves separating outward and in a way exploring themselves (or erupting out of the unknown waters)
Something about Swamps that many tend to miss out on. Is that many times the bogs and swamps have a weird particle suspension that change the way buoyancy works on us. So people will be treading water and just sink and be unable to get back out. It becomes an easy story to tell of evil things that kill people in the swamps when people just disappear.
People don't understand the natural beauty of the darker side of nature. I love autumn because it's the beginning of the cycle of decay. Death that will cause new life.
That's literally all nature. That's just green with extra steps.
@@owa8609 True, but it is exemplified far more often with swamps and wetlands. Besides "all nature is like that" and "just green with extra steps" is essentially another way to just say every land card should be green anyways. Plus even green *mana* is different from nature, in that it's laid out destiny/purpose and a veneration of the old, which swamps and wetlands can easily shift and change while forests, if left to their devices, can last centuries, consisting of multiple dens, hollows, and nests that animals return to year after year
There's actually practical symbolism in how Black's approach to ambition (all the non-Green colors are ambitious to an extent; Black is just defined by its selfishness) is extremely risky.
By traversing through a swamp, one takes a huge risk from what's there with the quicksand, wildlife, and diseases. In the darkness of a swamp ("the dark" can also mean anything mysterious; they're usually avoided, so most people don't know how to navigate them), everyone navigating them is alone because they can't be mapped like forests can. Because of this, swamps require one's internal logic, which may-or-may-not save him or her. Black mana is the same way because to use it is to risk, if not guarantee, being consumed by it. And even then, some may even consider the payoffs not worth the risk.
What separates the forest from the swamp is not only how the former is not always as dangerous and can be mapped but also from how the trees hold in soil, similar to how Green values keeping the natural order together.
It's modern sensibilities and shared cultural understandings that I think decided the lands (as well as their simplicity, mountain is more broad and universally relatable than volcano) But as a counterpoint, imagine the game being made 600 years ago. The color for black mana probably would have been the forest. The forests were seen as wild and dangerous places where the darker forces lived. This is why you have tales like Hansel and Gretel where the forest houses the witch that wants to eat children. Our thoughts toward certain land types and how we as humans relate to them has changed over time.
Also it's always funny to hear the perspective of the Rocky Mountains from others. My family moved to the west when I was around 10 years old from a more open and flat part of the world. And rather than feeling a sense of stability, I always felt them to be oppressing and stifling. They dominated the horizon in every direction I looked and cut off my ability to see the world beyond them. Ideas completely at odds with the ideas of red mana, which is why to me they've always felt like the wrong land type to represent the color... but I'm hard pressed to think of any kind of land more broadly understood and easily identifiable that could be used (except maybe deserts, but I can see where that might be too visually similar to plains, and if considered probably was decided against)
Honestly it's very cool to hear how the same feature can be perceived in different ways depending on the context of the person. It does make the discussion tricky but an interesting one
Here's my reasoning:
each color is a respective element channeled through a landscape
white- the sunlight gleaming over a vast plain/ field
red- the dynamic energy of fire and earth, essentially tectonic/ thermal energy
Blue- water, either in the sky or in the ocean/ rivers below
green- the fertile energy of life through forested areas- full of the primal energies of life
black- swamps are places of life, but thrive off of decay- leading to foul smells that are invocative of a zombie, many are often enclosed by surrounding trees depending on geography, so they can be often depicted as gloomy, dark, festering places of rot
so essentially you have the light element, fire/earth element, the water/air element, the plant/life (Gaia? element) and the dark/ decay element
in terms of in universe, we have: order, aggression, wisdom, life and death
Great vid! For Islands, I would add that Blue is the color of control and perfection, and it can come off as cold or distant its pursuit of these things. The phrase “no man is an island” comes to mind here, which refers to the connection between humans and how isolation does us no good. Based on this assertion, Blue is arguably the most like an island out of all the colors.
I feel like you could have related swamps to real life more. They're land areas seen unsuitable for settlement which paradoxically make them ideal to those who find settlements unsuitable. Swamps harbor the societal outcast
Another thing that I think may have influenced the creation of the mountains is that, if we better associate red/fire with volcanos, then that would have been the first being selected, but since the volcano erupting is more of an action it would be better portrayed as a Sorcery/Instant, leaving the spot for the inactive form of a volcano as a land, a mountain
You should do a video on what iconography could replace a skull for black mana.
In some of the early novels, mana was the memoy of the land. I think it was "The Dark" that mentions the codifying of the colors of mana and what they are. There is even a point where a mage has to cast a spell that will save the protagonist. The description stuck with me for years. "She recalled an island with black volcanic sand and clear blue waters. She remembered the warmth of the fires as she played with the others. She shed a a tear as she knew what had to be done. Cast the spell and poured into it that memory." There is even a point where the main character realizes why a spell that needed to be cast at a specific place was because he was drawing on the wrong mana. The place used to be bogs and flooded fields. That is when he realizes that he should be calling on black mana. Thus mana was memory of the land.
For black mana, Wastes would work just as well as Swamps. Many swamp's arts are this rotten, mostly non-alive landscape which lends itself nicely to be called a waste land. However, swamps come more naturally in the real world then wastes, as those typically get overgrown rather quickly.
Wastelands conjure images of a barren, waterless, lifeless place
A swamp is full of life because it's wet and watery. Water + biomass = decay, which is very much black to me.
Another connection with Islands could be the ancient Greek City states, small nations on an island or coast limited by their size which allowed for direct democracy and gave rise to some of the most famous philosophers. Coastal cities in general tend to be diverse and take in a lot of different ideas due to trade and migration.
Oh that's a cool idea.
Something that fascinates me about lands in Magic is how in real world cultures that exist in those places, their color identities often do not line up with those civilizations. Green I feel being perhaps the only exception, pervading not only its own biome but also the oft nearby swamps and most especially isolated islands.
This is most true of white and red, often being exact opposites. Plains cultures are often portrayed as wild and free, dancing around campfires, changing migration paths as nessecary, etc. Whereas mountain cultures are often rigid and strict to enable their survival in those harsh environs. What's more idyllic of a monowhite civilization than the Incan Empire?
All this is to say that a comment you made here on swamps led to me considering how cultures of one color might exist within the environment of another's mana source, and I got some revelations and cool ideas from it.
i've lived in Washington State for the last 2 years, you can absolutely see the inspiration for MtG in the landscape here. Especially in the spring and summer, I feel like I'm living in a 5 color deck.
someone once said to me that the connection between islands and blue's philosophy is *flow*. the flow of water, the flow of time, the flow of the game itself, etc
I like that
Awesome video thank you for sharing :) lands are one of my favorite aspects of magic strangely enough so hearing a deeper take on them aside from one is green/blue is kind of refreshing
Honestly it just got deeper the more I read and thought about it.
The lore of mtg has inspired me to write a poem, as a basis of my new saga I am writing, and I would be happy to share..
The Colorless, Shadeless, and Lightless matter, the Neutral start of Everything; The Grey Lies in Wait.
And from The Grey, Arose The Great, White, Illuminous Light...
From The White Thirst to Expose the Order of All that Is, seeking Structure in answers of Unity now lost to the Grey, Light shines down to Reveal Structure of Mysterious Form, Undefined, Masking Secrets in Brilliant Blue...
From The Blue, Light discovers Perfection in Progress. Each Discovery Feeding a Desire that Inspired more, Ideas Awaken and yearn to Manifest Realities. Gradually, the Light fades in it's pursuit, Diven Deeper within Seas of Mystery Unbound. Far from the Light's Last Inspiration, Mysteries Obscured once more as the Wonders of Blue Deepen into Ominous Black...
From The Black Lack of Lumination, Liquid Dreams are Frozen Dry; Absolute Only in their Own Presence. Devoid of the Sight of any other, Heat becomes their only Reality lost in Icey Stagnance; The only Reality yet siphoned by the Lonely Abyss. Nearly absent, but faintly ignited Deep within the Heart of the Void, Heat yet remains. Heat Magnifies as Pressure Intensifies; Burning with Passion, Expanding, Glowing Evermore Red...
From The Red, Searing Fires of Chaos formed Ashen Stone from Values once Opposed. From the Pressures sprang forth Land, Rich with Black Soil, Married with Blue Waters, now basking in the renewed Wake of the Great White Lumination. From this History Fathomed, Nature Manifested and Sprouted Forth a Living, Green Body...
From The Green, Unparalleled Strength Flourishes. Fueled by a Burning Red Desire to survive, Pressured by Willful Greed birthed from Black and Sightless times of Shadow, Divined Deep within the Heart of Mysterious Waters Blue and full of Wonders, Revealed through Spectres of Valiant White Light, the Living Green becomes Enlightened with Age. Rising, Growing, Living, Fading. Returning once more to the Light, Long Watching from Above, Shining Ever Brighter. Seeking a History long Forgotten...
And just outside that Violet Force of Influence, Forever Expanding Outward, The Grey Lies in Wait. Waiting from afar to be Tainted by the Royal Color of Influence. Returning from within, in the absence of Influence itself..
A: beautiful
B: I am subscribing to you
@@pokegard Thank you!
@@tsbackhus you’re welcome
Plains - Things are wide open and clear to see, exposed relatively directly to light for greater portions of the day, with less shadows, denying sneakiness and thus encouraging ideas of honor, without natural fortifications like rivers and mountains, people must protect themselves by building their own, and have the opportunity to do so cultivating many plants in the fields, things are even and simple and exposed to direct light, encouraging ideas of purity and purification. Many of the most noticeable creatures of the plains are herd or pack animals, herds that feed on the grasses and pack hunters that team up to isolate and take down individuals from the herds, creatures for whom survival involves teamwork and numbers.
Island - Islands have restricted access and difficulties in reaching them, boating to them often requires ingenuity and deliberation of fixing flaws of ship-construction of worthy vessels and skills in navigation, either by the stars over long distances or around various hazards like reefs and cliffs or predicting the weather to avoid going out in the storms. Their natural fortification of surrounding waters provides protection that grants time to think, yet access to the waterways also tends to make trade cheaper over greater distances and thus creates a meeting point of knowledge and ideas and goods to experiment with. The relatively small size and isolation of islands means plants and animals introduced to them can transform them and take them over quite quickly if it is advantageous to them, and the isolation often encourages evolutionary changes once cut off from mainland populations, and behavioral changes when exposed to different sets of food sources. Survival on islands often requires adapting to the dangers of the nearby waters, more direct exposure to storms, the cycles of the tides, restrictions on coming and going that may force flexibility in behavior and diet. Birds that fly to avoid danger and are relatively intelligent animals are often some of the first animal colonizers of islands not from the waters themselves. The waters surrounding the islands have currents and other patterns, creatures often navigate in 3 dimensions when they fly or swim, unlike land animals, creating wider strategic and tactical opportunities and additional dangers that must be dealt with by various means.
Swamp - The less active water-flow of swamps are more prone to being less clean and safe to drink than the flowing water of rivers and some lakes, the still waters are often breeding grounds for things like blood-sucking and disease spreading mosquitos, and the humid environment is often a place that easily encourages the spread of fungi, which often behave in key roles for decomposition, the many separated pools, many of which are surrounded and sometimes covered with plant-life or are quite murky and various forms of plant-life cover over much of the nearby land provides plenty of cover for opportunistic ambush hunters, while in some cases decomposition is encouraged in swamps, in other places, like tar pits or hypoxic environments or places with unusual acidity there may be preservation instead, preserving corpses beyond normal time-spans, often in disgusting states, creating association with the undead. Blooms of swamp gasses can produce will-o-the-wisps which are known for being mistaken for spirits or malevolent fey. People of the swamps often have to be very careful to avoid their various dangers and know how to navigate them and survive the dangers, and even then, swamp populations are still often more prone to suffering things like mosquito spread diseases, yet the dangers often also provide opportunities to those who would take advantage of them.
Mountain - Volcanos, mudslides, rockslides, avalanches, dangers on mountains can be sudden and compound upon themselves, those with strength and agility in the form of climbing skills often find themselves in advantageous positions, adaptation to the thin air at high altitudes often leaves one at advantage athletically when descending down, the natural fortifications of the mountain are also often chosen for shelter from violent threats, yet are often chosen by those who expect such threats, and give opportunities to be less hesitant to provoke such threats from such a relatively safe position. Even without more sudden sources of violence, some forms of volcanos are simply regularly active, and water sources flowing down mountains often form waterfalls in places or violent rapids, exposed rocks can be carved and chipped at creatively to create statues and art pieces relatively simply that tend to last quite a while. Many creatures of the mountains are known to be hardy and scrappy, ready for danger both in the giving and taking of it and navigating dangerous cliffsides where a fall could mean death, taking risks for their own prosperity and relative safety vs. less climbing capable threats.
Forest - Trees themselves are known for their size compared to many other plants, and their growth over time, they can often sustain large and complex ecosystems full of a variety of competing life-forms. To live in a forest is to know it's dangers and opportunities, what must be watched out for and might surprise you at any moment around the next tree, and what can be eaten while avoiding trying to eat what isn't good for you or is outright poisonous, this knowledge must be passed down, forming traditions, and to live in a forest long term without changing it to a plains or something else often requires relatively strict rules and traditions for sapient civilization capable life, in order to avoid over-logging or otherwise destroying the forest, and survive without plains farms of grain (or swamp for some types of rice).
You do realize that this is basically MTG astrology. You just invented meaning. You can easily switch the lands. White mountains would be "like a wall that protects and stands against the winds." Red islands could be "like the relentless attack of the waves, always hitting, suddenly get angry with a tempestuous fury shooting lightning from the sky"
Another couple of things that could be added about islands are isolation and discovery. Being in the middle of the sea/ocean means that they are the places you reach after sailing into the sea, possibly in seeking the possibilities beyond it, of a new (personally) undiscovered land. At the same time, they are separated from larger bodies of land, contained in their own little space.
for swamps/black, I think it's important to realize that there are historical reasons for the negative associations with the biome. without modern medicine, pest control and sanitation it was genuinely unhealthy to be around them.
I think Desert not being a basic land type is.. kinda weird. I think they've shaped humanity quite a bit.
Can you do a video discussing colors in activation costs that are not in casting cost?
Ooh that's a good one, will note the idea
My friend once came up with an idea for mixed land. A platow being white and red, or a jungle being black and green. I still think about that idea sometimes.
Or like an island in the tropics that's blue and green?? Or an island with a volcano that's blue and red?? That would be pretty cool!!
Dual lands very much are a thing in magic
@@whisperingsage89 I don't mean guildgates or the ones that make you pay 2 life to enter untapped. I mean lands that come into play untapped and count as 2 different lands like a plains mountain land that's just a plains/mountain.
Platow is plateau
@CleazyMane-ef2cg I think the original dual lands are like that such as tropical island. Comes in untapped . Makes blue and green
There’s also colorless mana and its wastes and while it wasent the orginal 5 basic lands it symbolism of a wasteland devoid of any color or identity comepletelt empty. And yet with that empty space one could bring color to it and imprint upon it kinda how the philosophy of colorless mana works in dicetrys video about colorless mana functioning like a color in terms of philosophy and such. Idk if what I’m saying is 100% accurate as I hold a rather basic understanding of this game but the lore and philosophy has been fasinating to look at for me.
Swamps have always felt like the biggest stretch for me. If I was making the game over, I would’ve made black mana come from Caves. Anything subterranean.
I’ve been thinking the next Other Media you should do is Colors of Yugioh characters, since that series was what probably led us all to Magic in the first place
Wow. I am impressed by the video. I thought lands only fit due to elemental similarity. Forest is green, because it has a lot of vegetation. It is like the element earth, or more specifically wood. Mountain is red, because it has volcanoes. It is like the element fire. Island is blue, because it is surrounded by water. It is like the water element. Plains is white, because it has light yellow grasses. Grass is usually green, but it does turn yellow during harvest. The yellow is like the light element. Swamp is black, because it has dark murky water. Yet DiceTry went beyond these simple associations. He connected the lands on a philosophical level. I am a DiceTry fan. Yet I am very impressed. Bravo.
I have some things to say on the specifics. There is a great point of plains being the center of agriculture and civilization. Plains have the richest soil, and so they are the best for farming, which is the essential foundation of civilization. I talked about this in a social post on the DiceTry channel not too long ago. I have noticed the most recent posts were for lands. Maybe they were things leading up to this video. I think plains can go deeper. Primates usually live in the jungle, which is a kind of forest. Humans are different because they have evolved to live in grasslands instead. They walk on two feet. That helps them move on land, instead of trees. The upright stance lets humans see over grass better. Humans switched diet to rely more on grains. That is due to living in the grasslands, and taking advantage of the food source it does have. Maybe this evolution leads to the positive view of planes as a safe place. It is the place of order, society and all that jazz. Come to think of it, the Disney movie Bambi is the only time I have seen with a negative depiction of plains. This environment is specifically a meadow. The movie is from the deer perspective. The forest is depicted as a lovely home and safe haven. The plains is depicted as a dangerous and unnerving place. The scary scenes involving man tend to take place here. This makes sense in context because deer lives in the forest. So they would view the forest as nicer. Bambi's mom explains that the meadow is more dangerous because there are no trees or bushes to hide in. Being out in the open makes deer more vulnerable to hunters. That is an unusual take on the plains. It is a little like agoraphobia.
It is interesting how the water is relaxing and so leads to deep contemplation. Fish are important too. They have such graceful movements when they swim. Watching fish makes people relaxed. So both water and fish can relax the viewer. Doctors do have a bad reputation of being scary, even though it is their job to help people. Some operations are sometimes painful like shots. Dentists are the doctors with the worse reputation. They know about it too. So what dentists often do is have a fish tank in their clinic. The patients can watch the fish in the waiting room. Then that calms them down. It lowers the anxiety of visiting the dentist. Even the Disney Pixar movie Finding Nemo gets this right. A big part of the movie is Nemo being imprisoned on land. He tries to find a way to escape to the ocean. Nemo isn't in any kind of fish tank. He actually stays in one that is in a dentist clinic.
Swamps have a bad reputation. So it is easy to link it to the color of cards with the spooky imagery. Swamps in real life are not nearly as bad as media makes it out to be. They are rich ecosystems. I appreciate this video bringing it up. I wonder if there is an underlying biological reason for an aversion to swamps. There is one thing that can't be denied. Swamp water is disgusting. It is all murky. It stinks. A human is better off drinking fresh water from a river. The risk of getting a waterborne disease would be much higher in a swamp than a river. Swamps would have other nasty stuff like parasites and mosquitos. That probably makes humans in general have an aversion to swamps. Death is an important theme in black. A lot of black creatures are undead. The mechanics focus on the discard pile, which is called a graveyard. Perhaps swamp fits because its murky water stinks like a corpse. Looking back, I think a better name for this land is bog. There are different kinds of wetlands. A swamp is a rich wetland dominated by trees. Bog is a very unusual wetland. Unlike other wetlands, it is poor in life. The water is so stagnat, it doesn't get much oxygen. So stuff doesn't grow very well. There are even plants that eat bugs. That makes up for the solid being so bad. The harsh area fits the ruthlessness of black. There is more. Because of the harsh environment, bodies don't rot very well. So they end up being preserved. That leads to big bodies. These are human mummies found in bogs. This video has a Lord of the Rings reference. That place is called the Dead Marshes. However I think it is a misnomer. It is filled with dead preserved bodies of some ancient war. So this would be the Dead Bogs. Only bogs can preserve bodies like that. One material produced in bog is peat. Peat is dead and preserved vegetation. When it gets fossilized, it turns to coal. Bogs are special for preserving the dead. I think this fits black very well. Black is all about reusing the dead. I can easily picture it reanimating bog bodies into some kind of undead creature. It would be a mummy, a zombie or something like that. The recycling does happen in real life. Wood is the main original fuel to make fire. However peat and coal can be used instead.
The mountains are intriguing. DiceTry brings up a good point. Volcanoes are the obvious environment for fire. Even the first Pokemon games have the fire type gym leader live in a volcanic area. This is called Cinnabar Island. Volcanoes may be too specific though. So it is good to broaden out, and DiceTry gave a great explanation. Most mountain ranges came from volcanic activity. So they are still fiery and red in a sense. There is a trio of land, sea and sky. Land is like earth. Sea is like water. Sky is like Air. The Pokemon Hoenn legendaries follow this pattern. The Biblical creatures they are based on follows this pattern. Greek mythology has its main gods follow this pattern. These are Zeus, Posieden and Hades. I think there should be a fourth area to represent fire. I thought the mantle would be the best. That is the source of fiery volcanic eruptions. Mountains do fit in with that since they are made from volcanoes and mantle shifting. There are some mountain ranges that don't come from volcanoes. The major examples that come to my mind are the Himalayas and the Alps. However even those are still formed from the shifts of the mantle. So there is fire involved. It just doesn't come out. This is a case where both sides in the fault are made of land. So the land scrunches upwards without subduction, melting and volcanoes.
Forests are great places for green. They are the places with the richest life even if it isn't ideal for humans. One of the major goals of environmentalists is saving the rainforest. That really helps link the forest land to the green value of nature and environmentalism. Two excellent movie examples of this are Fern Gully and James Cameron's Avatar. I thought it was funny that MTG focuses so hard on elves being green. That would fit wood elves specifically. Other elves would fit other colors. Light elves would be in white. Dark elves would be in black. So the total of elves would probably be Abzan colors. Even the remaining colors can be justified. Elves are shown to be very intelligent. That fits blue. Elves can be seen as being free in a sense. In DND, the original elf god was very free spirited. He used to shapeshift a lot. That would fit red. This video did bring up a good point. The elves in Lord of the Rings live in forests. So that makes wood elves prominent in MTG. This is kind of like this in World of Warcraft. There are two main kinds of elves. There are the night elves and the blood elves. They have major differences. However one thing that both have in common is that they live in forests. The blood elves are not environmentalist. However they still live in forest, so that fits.
Mana is used as a source of magic in games. MTG has an interesting take on it. This is where the source of magic is tied to the land. It reminds me of some kind of magic. Maybe this because magicians and Pagan often go hand in hand. Pagans are tied to the land and nature, because it is sacred to them. Perhaps magicians get their power, because they are blessed by the land. It is sort of like how priests and clerics get holy magic as a blessing from their deities. Magic power is done as a reward for devotion. Warlocks can work the same way except by a creepy patron. Maybe MTG can have lands involved with ley lines or something like that. The biggest example of a nature based magician for me is the shaman. They connect to the environments and animals. They make medicine wheels on the ground using stones. The shaman is the magician that fits green perfectly. That is something that would be connected to the land. The shaman is also the first magician and the first religious leader. Green is the color of both nature and tradition. The tradition is mainly due to the natural world before industrialization. Lord of the Rings really glorifies it, and it has an environmentalist theme. Yet there is another good reason for green to have tradition. The shamans are the ones with traditional magic. It is the foundation that all other magic and religion is based on. DiceTry did have an interesting video that blue isn't the only smart color. The argument is that all colors are smart due to multiple intelligences. I wonder if this can apply to all colors. I think green isn't the only color attached to the land and environment. This video on lands really gives me that impression. All colors have a connection to the environment. They just live in different kinds. Green is mainly limited to forests.
I recently found another kind of resource. This is Vancian magic. DND uses spell slots instead of mana. It was inspired by the Dying Earth book by Jack Vance. I don't like the spell slot mechanic because it is too clunky. I am currently making a house rule to use mana in DND instead. However the flavor behind Vancian magic is very interesting. MTG is inspired by DND. I think the deck is a Vancian resource that is executed a lot better. I got to wonder. Were the MTG creators aware of Vancian magic, or was it just a coincidence? I do get interested by how the game was developed, and it is nice for DiceTry to get into it. Using cards seems abstract. Hover Vancian magic can explain what is going on. Most cards are specific spells with specific effects. Drawing a card is like preparing a spell. Playing a card is like using a spell. Discarding the card afterward is like forgetting the spell. The color that is the best at drawing extra cards is blue. Blue is also the card with the most intelligence, particularly book smarts. So it makes sense for blue to be good at card draw. A really intelligent person could study and memorize more spells. Then they can use the spells later. I wonder what DiceTry thinks of Vancian magic in MTG.
I too have thought about why these specific lands were chosen and I would argue that tundra would work better for black. Swamps are just forested wetlands which is ironic since forests represent an opposing color to black. Furthermore, tundras are cold and barren with comparatively little life which fits black's whole death theme in way. Additionally, tundras usually exist near or in the arctic circle where it is possible to have complete darkness all day, but yes also complete light depending on the time of year. And if you still like the rotting, fetid asthetic of swamps for black, tundras do get wet and muddy in the warmer months. Finally, tundras are destinct enough from icesheets allowing for normal tundras to be distinct from "snow covered tundras" for flavor and gameplay reasons. For these reasons I personally prefer tundras over swamps for generating black mana.
swamps are by definition a place where water "Collects" and facilitates certain growth right. by that understanding swamps become new biomes that possibly kill off a lot of the previous ones hence why you see a lot of dead trees and stuff. moisture in the air increasing likelihood for mushrooms and animals in the water... its a lot of uncertainty and a complex level of diversity. and so a space which is intimately connected between the lens of decay and life gives us a better sense of black as it is often about sacrifice to follow goals.
i think the space of swamps in imagination as well leads them to not be the peaceful angelic image of a forest - that we would see cute deer running through, and other such peaceful wildlife. perhaps a few bards and people against trees playing a lute or whatever - an odd hunter/harvester or two. the swamp then by default becomes a space like islands do - a retreat from society. if forests are the linked space with plains for society. out in the fields and dipping into the forests (but never going too far from the plains) - then swamps are considered the furthest space away within those forests, where all that "water" collects right in that ultra ripened spot... its like an extreme focal point of everything spread wide across the forest itself while also being everything its not. so i see that as a means to going to that dark and sketchy uncertain feeling place because its a space you stake out for your own goals. just like red stakes out the mountaintop, and blue reaches out the ocean. one can find things ONLY available in the swamps while staying there - attain that special magic the swamps will provide, and they clearly must be one so dedicated to sacrifice their connection to humanity to do such a thing. we understand it explicitly by how it relates to a space for life, and the kind of life that gravitates toward it human or otherwise.
jus my thoughts :)
Great job!!! That's what makes MTG GREAT. The game can be so complex behind the scenes, but yet so simple to execute. 12:25pm
100%
I always thought it was because blue was associated with water. As are islands.
Honestly that's probably why he chose islands, but I like to Believe it was something deeper.
@@DiceTry People do like to overcomplicate things. But that's what keeps nerds like us interesting... .P
@@AngelusNielson Blue behavior, isn't it ?
@@Scarycrow89 Nah blue is clever. (I tesae, I tease.)
Mountains is the place where dragons and dwarves live. Also it's a major landmark that makes for cool art, not occupied by another color. Red philosophy would be better represented by e.g. a river or a glade, but it wouldn't make for a suitable location for our beloved gobbos.
I have to wonder, though, if that was inspired the other way around. If they decided on the five biomes, then gave the creature types to the colors that would most likely inhabit those places. Like most the large sea monsters would have more in common with the energy and philosophies of green mana than with blue, but they get put onto blue because blue is the color of water-dwelling animals. Similarly a lot of dwarven societies would have more in common with white (which they've started to be shifted over to) than to red, but they make many dwarves red because they live in the mountains.
Its hard to undo the mental connection but black seems like a desert if you had to really give it a land. Very hostile and consuming of life.
As someone who loves frogs, I spend alot of time in thriving swamps full of life.
I agree. I think a desert is a great alternative as it facilitates Blacks identity and philosophy quite well
Literal lightning in a bottle, and I've said this before: Richard has been chasing that high every single day since.
Recently moved to an island... Grew up near the Rockies.. are you on van isle too??
Love your work either way!
Yea Van Isle represent👊
Swamps are where disease and decay thrive, even in real life. Perhaps not directly tied to ambition, but it is tied to death even as they spring with life.
It's also where interesting plants grow, poisonous or medical. The power over life and death.
just HAD to throw that clip from Never Ending Story in there didn’t you 😭😭
jokes aside, love the video and thanks for pouring so much effort into your analyses of the MTG universe- looking forward to more topics discussed in the future!!
With swamps you could argue that even though life thrives there, it is dangerous life that thrives there. Gators hiding in black water, leeches and mosquitoes, tigers in the brackish mangrove forests. Life thrives when it is ruthless and if you aren't prepared and ruthless, you will succumb to it.
Swamps are the biome of tranquility and solitude, Shrek just wants to be left alone.
When I talk about your channel I call it Rhystic Studies Jr. and I mean that as a sincere compliment.
From a historical perspective, mountains have always been in the fringes of civilization, or have stood nestled between them. Mountain dwellers had been considered wild by their more settled counterparts, and the steep inaccessible slopes became a refuge for those who opposed the yoke of laws and taxes, of kings and priests. Mountain folk have generally been more independent, harder to control or subjugate, often preserving distinct languages, religions, and customs to this very day.
I see Blue Islands as representing the untouchable playstyle of Blue.
Historically, Islands have always been the place you Go to Tell other nations to leave you alone.
And also the vast ocean makes you curious about what's out there and willing to come Up with ways to investigate.
My personal problem with it has always been the representation (or artworks) of lands that are multiple land types. For example, Naya to most is the jungle. Which kind of makes sense because green is the main color and we can imagine it flourishes. But if we look at the three basic land types, Naya might aswell be in germany. Temur (at least to me) is way more representative of Rainforets and places like Hawaii but most Temur cards dont capture this feeling at all (except maybe Omnath). I could go on but I think that Magic kind of has outlived the use for the kind of land its people inhabit is more focused on the philosophy of them.
Furthermore, Mountains are actually surprisingly unstable things on a micro level.
I think that caves, tunnels or other underground locations would work well as a basic land for Black.
My take on black mana and swamps as the opposite to white mana could be that it is more challenging to build civilization in a swamp (the sinking of the city of Venice, for example). Think of things sinking into mud and/or water to drown, fundations not being able to keep houses safe. Whilst swamps are full of life, as humans, we aren't geared/trained to traverse them so easily and many predators hide in them, like crocodiles. There's a lot of biological activity, but biological production requires ressources that can be found in the form of decomposition. The only reason why black mana seems to appear as grim, is because death appears as grim to most people, but a less grim take is that death is what sometimes enables new life.
One thing most people overlook about Black is that it uses everything it can get its hands on. It looks past superficial things like aesthetics or morality and instead focuses on utility... and everything has utility if you're daring enough to utilize it.
Other colors look at a rotting corpse and see something boring, or sad, or peaceful... but Black sees potential. It sees a soldier or a food source or a way to demoralize its enemies. Where other colors see a graveyard, Black sees buried treasure. And where other colors see a swamp... Black sees a proving ground. An arena where only the most cunning, vicious, and resourceful survive.
Wetlands also often serve as a sort of natural dumping ground or landfill; water flows downhill to low-lying areas, bringing with it detritus, debris, dregs, and dross, and the water itself provides a probiotic breeding ground for pests and poisons. All of these are unwanted by most people, but Black sees it all as resources.
Waste Not (M15), after all.
An interesting note about swamps are actually considered evil in our culture not just fantasy. It was often where pagan rituals and sacrifices including human ones were made. The fantasy tropes are drawn from understanding of both pagan and Christians as dark and malevolent places. Especially considering the religious undertones of the early sets swamps are very fitting as black mana
I think Swamp was chosen because, based on depictions, it's the colloquial use of the word, in reference to either a bog or, more commonly, what is called a muskeg, and in some cases marshes and actual swamps and maybe a fen or two. Notably, actual swamps are the most lush of these, but "swamp" is used in the same way you might call a rabbit a "rodent". Technically wrong, but gets the idea across. "Muskeg" also doesn't roll off the tongue too well.
Muskegs and bogs tend to be hostile environments. The soil is poor in nutrients and saturated, making it easy to sink into, and the water is acidic and lacking oxygen. The former, in particular, tends to be composed the most of dead matter, especially the dead trees we frequently see depicted. It's so hostile to life that even some of the few plants that grow there, namely venus fly traps and pitcher plants, end up turning to actively killing to survive. While rot is often associated with black, and admittedly the conditions lend themselves least to rot and can even *preserve* dead matter, I'd say the lingering corpses and refusal to return these vital nutrients back to the soil, as if hoarding this "wealth", is what makes muskegs, or "swamps", so black-aligned.
I got some alternate views on why the lands are with said color. So red is a lot about passion even to the point of not thinking too far ahead, think charging 1/1s, and to me that is mountain climbing. People see mountains like mount Everest as a challenge that they were desperate to overcome but it has caused the downfall of many who tried. Also theoretical mountains with trying to over come a great challenge. Even looking at fantasy what is the destination of frodo from the start of the journey? Mount doom. So mountains do fit red plus was able to still do volcanos but wasn't just volcanos. Islands fit the endless wonderment, looking out to the sea and wondering what is out there which drives people to create and discover what is out there. That wonderment gained better ships so people could go out and discover that initial question of what else is out there. Which fits blue's curiosity, inventflness, and the mysteries not solved yet. Swamps I know a lot of because I live in one and they do fit a lot of black. First off it is visually spooky and when you try going through it you will have challenges from being stuck in the mud to having to do big steps just to make it across, it isn't a path many would choose if they had other options. But life still exist in swamps with things adapting to it. Yeah there are some animals that people normally associate with scary beast like alligators and snakes but there is also harmless turtles, birds only focused on fish, and crustaceans such as crawfish and crab. Same goes for people. Yeah people of the swamp will probably have to hunt more than be able to forage like the forest or have plains for farming but it is about survival. Having to do something less ideal as growing plant life or searching for it, you have to kill animals so you continue on. Which I think fits black well. Because black isn't evil despite looking it, sometimes you just have to do less ideal choices to survive.
In regards to Blue & Islands, in Irish myth I remember there being 4 island cities of wisdom
Really cool! I asked myself this before, and your video is a great answer.
Very interesting and very sick video. Love this channel!
I live in the black swamp area of Ohio. It's a literal swamp that was bulldozed and converted into farmland. The soil is fertile and rich for growing food, and my small community is a nice, peaceful place...
But beneath the surface, there is something sinister about this land. Every time it rains, the mud and mosquitoes return. Disease runs rampant, and a gloomy atmosphere hangs over us. It feels like the land is trying to swallow us up and reclaim what we took from it.
Meanwhile, In the shadows of each neighborhood, the young and the desperate consume drugs and ruin their bodies. Swamps have a dark and strange effect on humanity.
Swamps are considered places of death and decay in fantasy media for a reason -- they're basically considered wastelands that's difficult to build in and breed disease through mosquitoes and trenchfoot. They're humid and unpleasant to trek through. Almost every soldier embarked in conquering southern Florida in American history wrote negatively of the experience and thought trying to acquire the land from the natives was a complete waste of time for these reasons. And, honestly, they probably are right, as I don't think we should be draining wetlands just to build generic resorts and suburban landscapes. It's been resulting in billions of dollars of damage every time a hurricane goes through.
Islands also show up in "A Midsummer's Night Dream" as Prospero's place of exile, and he's notably a wizard. Likewise, the vale of the Lotus Eaters took place on an island too. Like an isolated pocket of reality from the real world. I'd probably say islands are also places of isolation for hermits and the like. People who metaphorically live on an island isolated from others, which fits blue's lofty and isolated perspective on reality. It really does seem like the perfect place for a cloistered academic to hide away to contemplate magic, which is more or less what Tolaria is in MTG lore.
Personally I see it as all the potential energy of a location that could be collected/used in one day/turn, Planes have the light & warmth of the sun and fields of grains, Islands have the flow of the water & the creatures that swim within it, Swamps have the decay fueling the growth of other plants, Red... Yes the volcanos speak for themselves, as well as Green's forests, and given that green is the highest ramp of the colors should say it for itself.
It's the non-colored that are more interesting, they are cities, ruins or lands where not even the dead dwell (Bazaar of Baghdad, Scorched Ruins & Field of the Dead)... Or places so obscure that not even the colors have gone there (Sheltered Valley, Winding Canyons & Rath's Edge).
It is the Multicolored that build off of each other in order to make it unique, while the original dule-lands work fine i feel that the Tempest cycle fits better as representatives for there identities. Salt Flats was alive but are now dead feels more B/W than Scrublands, Skyshroud Forest while feeling more like a B/G instead of U/G is more inspired than just a Tropical Island, and Underground Sea... It's does not feel like a Black card but Rootwater Depths gives me that feeling of drowning in a inky black abyss.
As for Three-Color... Well the Homelands cycle isn't all that inspired and does not give off it's colors values but instead the civilizations cultures, Invasion's are better but they still feal lacking with Irrigation Ditch & Tinder Farm, yes they represent there colors but they feel mondain & uninspired. Of course Alara & Tarkir did it best but they were designed for that, but the old Lair cycle would benefit from flavor text.
There are no Four-color so no-ccomment... But if there was it would feel to cluttered, as if the Colors were fighting for control of the land instead of being mixed together. (A interesting Idea but not good for gameplay, and also..)
Five-color exists as the upmost, the non legendary legendary lands. A place that cannot exist but does....
(Also update Rhystic Cave, Cave of Temptation & Gemstone Caverns to be the Cave subtype you cowered!) (And Oasis a Desert...)
Red is also, in opposition to white's plains, freedom. Mountains have long been a refuge for cultures outside of the control of the lowland (plains) civilizations.
Just as everyone here leaps to “defend” black mana and swamps as these things that have beauty and safety despite their trappings, so too can you look at the negative aspects of colors and get a strong evocation of the elements and the lands. Using red as an easier example; everyone can agree that wildfire is akin to passion, or volcanoes erupt, and these things echo Reds mechanics like “Haste” which in virtue theory is the opposite of “Caution”. You also see creatures like “Capricious Effrit” embodying the untamed and often self-destructive nature of red.
The most interesting connection for me though, has to be the “negative” of the plains. The moment this video said “plains are where humans staked their claim and society was born”. I IMMEDIATELY agreed and without a beat thought “sure it is what produces food for the most (white weenie anyone) it’s also the thing we war over more than anything else.” Look at the number of human soldiers and knights, just a quick mental accounting tells me that there are more white soldier sub-types than any other color, and despite the almost implicit pairing of white with nobility and virtue, I defy anyone here to think of a sentence than means the same, using a different type of land: “and there upon that field clashed the mighty armies…” it will always be field, plain, hill…in our collective imagination, there is never a large scale war happening in a mountainside…that’s just not part of its identity. Thought the contra to a neat addition to your discussion; may your hands be flush with mana, but not flooded!
If not swamp, I imagine desert would be a good representation for black mana.
ive thought for ages that swamps should've been deserts, hard places where only the most cunning and ambitious survive the idea of an amorality in black is also much more fleshed out, since stranded i a dessert you might have to do some fucked upshit to simply survive
Interestingly I've thought red should be deserts... but that's also because my relationship to mountains is more one of feeling stifled and oppressed by their presence, feelings that are the anthesis of red.
I like to think red and blue alined humans represent our drive to explore and discover.
Great vidéo
Excellently realized.
I think that the main reason for mountains being red is their evershifting weather, storms, wind and lightning.
There are some concepts that are under-represented in the cards lately. Let's face it: card design has gotten lazy. Black isn't just supposed to be the color of deception and death and evil; it's also supposed to be the color of ambition, personal achievement, and competition. Swamps do literally represent the ideas of life thriving at the expense of other life and drawing resources from decay. It isn't meant to be a contradiction that the result is something beautiful; that's a function of modern designers not thinking about it as much as Richard Garfield did. Similarly, red isn't just supposed to be the color of aggression, fire, passion, and chaos. It's also the color of rock or stone, of personal freedom, and down-to-earth simplicity. It's supposed to be the color of pioneers just as much as pyromancers. Swamps and mountains are both more literally appropriate than the modern game demonstrates.
P.S. I can't be the only one annoyed by the fact that a lot of the modern basics don't even represent the literal biomes properly in their art. A modern swamp is a generic purple landscape. A modern island is a blue landscape with water running through it, or sometimes a cliff face with water running down it. Most basics are now just different-colored plains and forests with different land types arbitrarily assigned to them, and a lot of cards are the color they are because we're *told* they are, not because they accurately represent the color they're printed in.
Isn’t mountains the most metal thing ever
I would question some of your conclusions of Deeper Meaning, given how so many who play Magic do not necessarily share those cultural values. The images of those lands is born though experiences of popular culture, and North American popular culture at that.
A masai herdsman made familiar with the concept of the Color Pie could have very different things to say ("forests are associated with Death, because Big Cats can leap down from anywhere - perfect for Black") while a river-culture might associate Islanda with home, safety and family - a green value.
Not that what you said is wrong - many of the players of the game would make similar associations with Richard Garfield's choices -but that's due to the pervasiveness of American popular culture being globalized (and the MtG crowd being wealthy enough to afford the game) than necessarily a Universal Human Truth (tm)
This is a great point and something I thought about after watching my video again. It's true I'm purely thinking of the cultural influences from a North American perspective and the whole narrative can shift depending on where you are from. It's something I will be aware of going forward
@@DiceTry You're aware of it! And I don't think any of us expect perfection. It's just something to be mindful of. The color pie (like so many of these narrative or character frameworks) can feel universal. It's easy to think so, especially once you start using them in explanatory ways. It's just important to remember that (in all Grand Theories about things) to leave room for potential alternatives approaches.
It's really hard to get into the mindset of someone outside our cultural milieu though! I did a BIG stretch in even reaching for those two example cultures (I don't even think "river culture" is the right term TBH). And frankly, your answers work well in a broad way - MtG is a Pop Culture property, and conveys many Pop culture ideas within it's own unique ideosyncracies. It's not bad that you explained it as such - your answer does seem to 'fit' each basic land overall. it's just important to have a a little epistemic humility and remember even a great explanation is not always gonna be a Universal Absolute in regards to themes of culture or art.
Can't get enough
As a general rule and as a matter of respect, it is customary to call someone with a Ph.D. "doctor." i.e., "Dr. Garfield." Please consider this when discussing someone by their first name in the future.
White sun magic plain solar.
Blue mind magic island vacation.
Black death magic swamp fossil.
Red fire magic mountain mine.
Green nature magic forest resource.
Swamps host a lot of parasistic creatures people are araid of; like leeches and mosquitos.
What about Wastes though
Ngl I feel this channel is under subbed the way the content is made to the philosophical thought it brings when covering these topics I find it odd it has only 24k users or so.
I do find it weird that you're associating Blue with feelings. Seems un-Blue
This is a really interesting topic and I would love to watch the video. However, that way of speaking with pauses after every few words and the pronounciation that makes it sound like struggling to complete a word (something that many video essays do) make the video unwatchable. I stopped watching after only a minute. I don't want to sound like I am attacking the video and being super negative, just consider it as feedback.
That's fair, my style isn't for everyone but it does work for the many people who have subbed to the channel.
9:47 - completely disagree. It;s very inhuman way to look at a swamp. Historically swamps for humans were one of the most dangerous places to walk through, where wrong step could mean drowning, everything is poisonous and/or venomous, where one cannot grow food as the trees shadow eternally the watery graves of many who walked this land before or build a home as it will be swallowed by land itself, a place from which the illnesses come from. For a human swamp is the death as a location. That's why in the tales of old the swamp is the place were witches, monsters and demons live.