Dormmamu wasn't affected by the Time Stone, which was actually a weakness in this particular case. Strange was resetting himself, but Dormmamu was unfazed by the stone. He was just annoyed into submission.
@@oliwierkosmowski6645 Dormmamu wasn't affected by it. Like he said that was the problem. Strange didn't put him in a timeloop, he put himself in a timeloop. Dormmamu probably would not have perceived the timeloop if he were the one being looped.
In the comics, the One Above All is considered the highest power and is theorized that it serves as a stand in for the writers who truly control everything, just like KEVIN does in She Hulk
It also works as a retroactive idea to canonize every Stan Lee cameo into One Above All or a representative figure of it, hence his presence in every movie up until Endgame
No, He's literally the God in tha MCU. Their version of Yahweh from the Hebrew Bible. He is No stand-in. Bruh, in the Future just Speak on things You know instead of things You're ignorant of.
@@EmperorPilaf04 I like that idea too, but the scene of him hanging with the other Watchers at the end of Guardians 2 kinda puts the kabash on that. Though...you could argue that he's a watcher who's so dedicated to his role that he keeps his human appearance even when making his reports. Both work.
I love how mat pat is like an English teacher, taking something that was just to make you laugh or cry a bit and making a full on theory or reference to something.
I feel like the question of ‘does the MCU have true gods’ is more complicated than what Matpats saying because back in Greek time irl they had gods that could be captured and even crippled (see Hephaestus) and they were still considered gods eventhough they were fallible. Matpats definition of a god is more like the god of the Abrahamic religions, an omnipotent, omnipresent and omniscient being.
The reason why he resorted to an omnipotent being is because the 'gods' that weren't omnipotent and killable, say themselves that they aren't gods, but rather really powerful mortals. So an omnipotent being is a satisfying conclusion to what a god means in the MCU. It's completely fine if you disagree, but I think it's a good conclusion to come to. Now it is true that I have already subscribed to this type of thinking a few years back, that The One Above All/Creators of Marvel leading the narratives of these stories are the only ones that could be considered true gods. But I didn't think about how the audience influencing the MCU could also be considered "gods" over the MCU, which is an interesting conclusion I haven't thought about. Overall I really like this video. But I would like it if you respond so we could have a longer discussion. (Or if anyone else wants to respond)
Yeah that's right, I personally have a ranking system for this sort of thing GOD ( abrahamic = top) then God's and then there's god's and then demigods and avatars of spirits
Yeah, gods killed each other a lot and some just don’t stay dead or it was just an avatar of themselves, but I think this video was interesting. All powerful gods fighting with philosophy is what you get left with once a character becomes the one to rule and control everything and is just basically fighting themselves, from a certain perspective. If “god” gave away his power would he no longer be God?
@@rrose9161 gonna quote a small passage, "In 2 Kings 3, Moab was a vassal to Israel, and it decided to rebel against Israel. (v. 4-5) Israel, Judah, and Edom decide to strike back. They stop by the prophet Elisha to get Yahweh's word on whether they will be victorious. Elisha prophecies that "(Yahweh) will also deliver Moab into your hands. You will overthrow every fortified city and every major town." (v. 18-19) This appears to be the case, and every major city is destroyed except Kir Hareseth, or "Fortified City of Dirt." Over and over, Moab is defeated. But, suddenly, in verse 27, the Moabite king sacrifices his own child, and "divine wrath" fell on Israel, causing them to retreat. The Hebrew word there, קֶצֶף, is exclusively used in Classical Hebrew to describe the wrath of a deity. But which deity? Certainly not Yahweh. Why would he respond to a Moabite human sacrifice, break his own prophecy of victory, and force his own armies into retreat? Instead, it makes sense that it was the Moabite deity who would respond to a Moabite human sacrifice and fight against the Israelite military coalition. We also have a Moabite stele with this exact scenario inscribed, paralleling 2 Kings 3: "Omri was king of Israel, and oppressed Moab during many days, and Chemosh was angry with his aggressions... and I took from it the vessels of Jehovah, and offered them before Chemosh... And the king of Israel fortified Jahaz, and occupied it, when he made war against me, and Chemosh drove him out before me." This parallel is clear. in 2 Kings 3, Yahweh's prophecy of victory is a failure, and a Moabite god's wrath drives Israel into retreat. In the Moabite Inscription, Chemosh's wrath ends in Yahweh's defeat and the fleeing of Israel. Yahweh is not some sort of omnipotent being in much of the Bible. He is one of many gods, and he is a god that can be beaten."
Thank you for talking about Jack "the king" Kerby. He created Glactus, Thanos, Darkside, the source wall, and so much more for Marvel and DC. Much respect sir. He died not knowing any of his work would get such appeal and recognition as it has today.
@Deanna L. Newton Thats because Stan is. thief who beat down the King. He stole, and stole and took. All Kirby did was give. While Stan took everything.
I like how the idea of our desires for stories create universes. Something that could go nicely, or badly. One of a similar but less of an actual film that explores this is Re:Creators.
I think in the case of Gorr, the definition of "gods" was "those recognized as gods". After all, "god" is a vague enough word even when we look at existing religions. The power of their gods are all over the place. Does that mean that some religions don't have proper gods? Or does it simply mean that a god is a being that people recognize as a god? Personally, I think it's better for the MCU to keep the definition of "god" vague, both because it would make it easier for them to have "gods" in their stories and because it would avoid antagonizing some religion whose god(s) don't match whatever definition the MCU decides on.
That’s what I’m thinking as well. A “god” is a perspective term. Imagine a being who could control the weather. To us, that would be a god. To a civilization that has been able to terraform planets and control their climate and weather patterns for millennia if not eons, that same character would be akin to just another one of their own kind.
@@logandelacruz2152 Kinda like that famous Arthur C. Clarke quote: "Any sufficiently advanced technology is indistinguishable from magic." To those who do not possess the power to, say, read minds, one who CAN would be indistinguishable from a god, simply because they can do something we cannot. It's kinda why Superman works so well as a concept; he's not a god: to his own kind, were Krypton to never have been destroyed, he'd likely have lived his life as just an average Joe Schmoe, but to us Earth people, he is as a god because he possesses powers the likes of which us mere mortal men do not.
I always imagined that Stan Lee's cameos in the movies was him playing himself as the one above all. I honestly didn't think to question what qualified as a god in the MCU.
the fact that he didn't talk about The Watcher. The Watcher is probably one of the closest godlike beings we can see in Marvel, he is multiversal, and is the hand that guides the hands , despite Infinity Ultron beating him, the Watcher had a plan, like he planned it all from the very start
I think Rocket surviving is James Gunn’s decision since becoming the leader of the new Guardians team is a better ending for the character than him dying after only getting to do things in flashbacks for the entire movie.
reminds me of in the terry pratchet book mort, that death confirms everone is correct in thier view of the afterlife, and that this has terrifying implications.
I feel like the closest we get to seeing a god in the MCU is in "What if?" and the watchers, only thing more powerful is whatever gave the watchers their power
James Gunn confirmed in an interview that he originally DID plan for Gamora to die in Vol. 2, but felt it wasn't right for the story, but he was all for her death in Inifnity War. So no, her death wouldn't have changed where he wanted to take these characters
Yeah, I don't recall Gunn having a problem with Disney/Marvel Studios having control over his story like other directors did. His beef with them seemed to been solely about the whole firing nonsense.
James Gunn actually said in an interview that he wanted Gamora to die in Guardians 2 but it made more sense for Yondu to die and that he was happy she was killed off because new Gamora fits the tone of guardians 3
What Matt and the team says is true. The Audience has a lot of power over these movies. Like look at the first Sonic movie, people showed visual disgust his design so the creators pulled the movie's release date so they could fix sonic. Now with the live action movie I believe it's late to come out, well because of a lot of stuff, but because they had to redesign flounder and possibly some of Ariel's animal companions.
I am a bit surprised that you didn’t include Oatu, The Watcher, on your list. He is canonical to the MCU. In many ways, if Kirby and Feige are The One Above All, then we are typical of The Watcher, ever present and spectating and with reality-altering power, though never allowed to take part.
Things might change depending on what happens in What If Season 2. In the comics, Uatu is one member of a species of Watchers, and something tells me they'll not be entirely happy that Uatu broke the vow of non-interference. Edit: I just remembered that we see some other Watchers hanging out with Stan Lee in Guardians Vol 2, so there is a race of Watchers in the MCU!
@thesausageman5388 I'm not sure. In the comics, there is The One Above All, who sometimes takes the form of Jack Kirby, and he once mentioned a collaborator who might be Stan Lee. That said, it's possible Stan in the MCU was a mortal agent working with the Watchers. Uatu and Nick Fury were revealed to have worked with each other for a while back in the comics.
About the confusion between Thena and Minerva: they could be two very similar gods who humans got confused between in the translation between Greek to Roman mythology, this resulted in them becoming the same god in the eyes of humans despite them being different individuals in reality
What about the assertion that Minerva was an adaptation or another persona of Athena? Myths, legends and beliefs could have been translated or adapted into local retellings. For some reason, some franchises loosely based off of historical, mythical and legendary beings use technicalities to argue that B is just that country's version of A from this country.
My theory is mildly taken from the American Gods book, that gods are created from the collective will of those who believe in them. So one could say that perhaps when the Roman empire assimilated Greek goddess Athena and renamed her Minerva, enough people believed in her that she came into being.
@@tbm275 that was my thought too. And if that's the case, then there could also be an actual Athena as well, as Thena inspired the Athena that people worshipped, which caused her to come into existence
If I'm not mistaken, that's what actually happened. The Romans had their own pantheon but then kinda absorbed the Greek pantheon and fusing the gods. The Roman Minerva was more of an arts and crafts goddess and ended up syncronosing with Athena, who had similar domains.
Hey, don't forget that Mordo mentioned the Living Tribunal, which is the judge of the multiverse. There is only one. Also, not sure how they're doing Eternity and his siblings. In the comics, there was only one of each of them also as they were anthro-personifications of multiversal constants
I think it was implied at some point that Eternity and some others (Infinity, Death, and maybe Oblivion) created the Infinity Stones? I'll have to double-check, but Guardians Vol 1 hinted at their involvement via a mural at the intro's temple. TV Tropes probably has more info.
Yknow, even though this was a meta ending: "We are the Gods," MatPat did end up giving a hierarchy to all the characters and their relative powers in the MCU
I guess I missed the part that defines gods as things that can't die. Even in Norse Mythology the gods are able to die as that is kind of the whole deal with the Ragnarok. MCU gods do seem to be as powerful as that. I kinda figured god is defined not by power level or immortality but as beings that are powered by worship and faith in them. Granted by this definition the Asgardians seem like they are still disqualified, but that does seem to be how Bast and the Egyptian gods operate.
One thing to point out is technically the Ancestorial Plains and The Duewot are still afterlives. Tarwaret explains the duewot is just "An" afterlife. There are several versions based on the beliefs and religions of the person, and gives the ancestorial plains as an example. Technically, Valhala would be another afterlife for those in the Norse belief. In most cases, its in the eyes of the believer, and I guess in this case for Rocket, there is no Known afterlife probably cuz he doesn't believe in the religious afterlife or something, but he DOES have "An" afterlife
it feels like they are place holder afterlifes, that for some characters and in some ways you can bring people back to life like we saw in endgame. And if they don't have any way to return then they're taken off the board forever.
I could not contain my excitement when you used the One Above All panel from the Immortal Hulk run. It is my single favorite depiction of him apart from mayyyybe his appearance in Ultimates
I’d say that “Kevin” is just an alias for The One Above All, in fact I’d say in that emotional scene with Rocket it’s not his long departed fellow test subjects speaking to him but The One Above All as well, telling him about how they gave him a purpose.
Basically a real God is a figure of someone who does not account to appear physically in the world to not be seen but still exists somewhere out in the world who may be watching.
13:50 “If you can’t answer important questions about your own universe, if you keep putting out stories that no one wants, if you can’t get your act together and actually put out films that have heart and soul, the audience is going to lose interest. They’re going to leave these characters behind for something better.” Now this is the best moral quote I’ve ever heard. And man this really hits hard❤😢
audiences will eat and consume any old trash and an example is most of the movies and novels out there.have you noticed how all these things reinforce human thoughts
Digging into the philosophy of stories and our relationships with them is becoming a popular tend nowadays, which is pretty cool! There’s a web novel that does it well, using it’s characters as commentary on the relationship between the protagonist, the author, and the reader. It even comments on the same cycle of creating content for the consumer and the worth of the characters if there’s no audience, even alluding to long, drawn out storylines to milk out profit (although for them it’s just survival). Super fun concept to explore! And the video was awesome as usual!
Apparently Kevin actually talked James Gunn out of killing Gamora in Vol. 2. So Kevin didn't force her to die; he actually prolonged her life to have her die in Infinity War rather than in Vol. 2 where she was originally intended to die.
James Gunn has said tha (t he didn't mind that they killed off Gamora too much. When writing GOTG2 he was originally planning the death that Peter grows from to be Gamora, but then realised it made more sense if it was Yondu. Later when Infinity War was being written, the Russos contacted him saying they were thinking of killing her off, and wanted to know if that was something he could work with. He said he was fine with it as it let him rework a bunch of the scrapped ideas from before. He kinda got to have his cake and eat it too (he got two cakes)
I gotta say though, seeing Rocket die only to be told he still has a purpose breaks me down. I felt his pain and disappointment in the theatre, man. I feel the same. Let’s just say I’ve had unhealthy tendencies since I was 5 so I’m constantly being told the same, to keep fighting and remain strong to fulfill my purpose. All I really want to do is rest but I have nothing but work ahead of me. I hope it’s all worth it in the end. Keep fighting my beautiful friends, your life has a lot of meaning. I don’t want to lose any of you for no reason. You have the strength to push forward, I believe in you!
You might Steven Universe, a superhero cartoon that has a non-depressive nihilistic tone. The title character's arc partially involves learning that his existence has no purpose and that doesn't exist solely to help others.
You missed the meaning of the scene, Lylla calls him, her little racon, and Rocket realizes it's an illusion, get's mad, and says I'm not a raccoon. The point being it was Rocket himself telling his conscience what he needed to hear. The grass is not greener on the other side, it is greenest where you water it.
@@Byronic19134 I think that’s a rather nihilistic way to look at it in the BEST possible way. I’m not gonna discuss afterlives with you because neither of us is gonna change the others mind but I agree 100% with the statement that life doesn’t get better, you MAKE it better. You are WISE my friend. Take good care of yourself, I like you
The Kirby pencil thing isn't just in marvel comics, I remember there being a Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles Book/story where Donatello met a guy named Kirby who drew things into reality (armoured power arms, portals/gateways to alternate dimensions, and creatures) with a pencil with a fancy rock tied to it.
One more being that you haven't mentioned is Stan Lee. He has been in the MCU nearly always (in the past), he was watching everything. Pretty sure he was a god too
Normally, in the comics, all of the cosmic beings are aware of the hierarchy, but in the cinematic universe it seems they’re completely isolated! All off on their own corners of the universe just doing their own thing. And eventually, they learn the hard way when they’re encroaching on another persons territory!
There also was a mini theory saying that Rocket was going to die, based off of the posters given in preparation to the movie. If you pay attention, the posters tend to single out Rocket in a sort of afterlike feel.
Hey Mat, I've always wondered why in Tinkerbell The Pirate Fairy, why Captain Hook could understand Zarina, but everyone else had to be told the orders from Hook. Maybe its theory worthy?
Matpat wasn't only give us a theory of MCU for us, but also a letter to Marvel Studios as a representative for us, Marvel fans...Thank you for your time and effort
I take a stance mentioned in the flatland movie, there are the "gods" but once you see things on their level, you realize they have their own "gods", and so on
It's a very interesting perspective, although a bit meta. The audience's reactions and feedback can influence the direction of the MCU, such as which characters get their own films or TV shows, which storylines are explored, and even how certain characters are portrayed. In this sense, the audience has a kind of "creative control" over the MCU, similar to how gods in many mythologies have control over the world and its inhabitants. Furthermore, the act of watching a film or TV show is a bit like looking into another universe where the audience members are all-knowing observers, able to see and know things that even the characters in the story do not. This is similar to the concept of omniscience, which is often associated with godhood. So yes, from a certain point of view, you could argue that we, the consumers, are the true gods of the MCU.
The Athena/Minerva case is a deeply complicated one, but it seems safe to say that Minerva is not originally Athena, but a goddess (very) strongly influenced by her throughout the course of the Roman History. I suggest more research on the topic for anyone interested, It's a fascinating matter
One thing I like about kang is that he is forcing us to once again ask if the good guys are really good. Like if their existence is breaking apart the universe because of the actions they have been taking.
Matt, you've got that wrong with the Dormmamu being affected by the stones. Strange used it on himself, so it works in the Dark Dimension, but does not effect Dormmamu himself (as far as we've seen)
That’s what I kept saying to myself lmaoo, he got that part all they way wrong. Strange used the stones on himself and persuaded Dormammu to leave by annoying him. But Dormammu wasn’t affected
Except that Dormmamu clearly was effected, they both kept experiencing the same event over and over but with the memory of it happening. It's most evident in the first loop when Dormmamu actually starts to repeat his line before realizing he's repeating it.
Dormmamu was affected though. He literally controls the dark dimension, and since the dimension can be bounded by time, so can he. He only bargains with strange because he couldn't do anything against him. If he could, Strange would stay dead after the first time he was killed, or dormmamu would just break out of the loop. I think he has a little control over it, as he can remember stuff after a loop, but not outright break it.
Agree. It didn't affect Dormammu. It was just irritating as an ant that keeps coming back to life only to be killed again and again, but it still comes back! You'd easily take the deal to not destroy its anthill in order for it to leave.
Firing Gunn for that time was probably one of the biggest fumbles by Disney/Marvel but a huge pick up for DC, I'm really looking forward to what James can do with the DCEU as I've always been a far bigger DC fan than Marvel.
11:06 I love how the writers couldn’t be bothered to think of a full acronym for Kevin’s name (and let’s face it, Knowledge probably took *way* to long to come up with) so they just had She-Hulk interrupt him 😂
I don't think "The hands that guide the hands" refers to that, that meant clearly the free will of Rocket. Plus, James Gunn has said in interviews that he wasn't bothered by the death of Gamora in Infinity War, in fact, the Russo Brothers consulted him about it to check if it was okay with him and he actually liked the idea because he wanted a loss for the group to deal with in the third movie, so the loss of Gamora was perfect for that. Actually, James Gunn produced Infinity War and wrote some of the dialogues for the movie, he was pretty involved with it
I remember in the justice league series Lex Luther delved beyond the dimensional barrier to adquire the antilife equation and what he saw on the other side was the force that kept his universe alive... the audience watching the show
I’ve always been told that everyone serves someone. Even people at the top have to please those beneath them. This video really exemplifies this concept acting on the MCU.
Let's not forget that another afterlife plane exists in Love and Thunder, Valhalla. Is this simply another dimension souls/beings transition to that is completely separate to the MCU as we know it, whereby beings can eventually return to the MCU. Kind of like a "you go here for now, and we'll bring you back when it's necessary" concept, or purely just an easter egg to show it didn't end all that badly for Heimdal and Jane?
Honestly this is a bit like how Tolkien viewed his writing. As God created us in His image, so we create fiction in our own image and through writing it is the closest we can get to experiencing what God experiences.
Has anyone else noticed this about Wanda? Her powers kinda sucked in infinity war, and where much better in end game, Wanda vision, and multiverse of madness. The reason for her increase in strength was probably from her loss of vision, her sorrow was such that it unlocked a wild part of her that hadn’t been seen before. I doubt even she new her full power in infinity war. The question is, are her powers fueled by sorrow? and if so, how unstoppable could she be if she lost everything?
Team MatPats Theories are always so well made, interesting and "convincing that i would love to see them become true. How well-made can a Game or Movie be if it doesn´t confirm at least Parts of MatPats Theories?
I always like to imagine that we as an audience, if we are ever depicted in ant media, we'd be be shown as this endless void filled with eyes, forever watching, learning, and allowing the creation of these "Kevin's" to exist or die.
In the comics we actually have to very different versions of Eternity. So you have the Universal Eternity which would be unique to each universe but you also have the Multiversal Eternity which is just a step below The Living Tribunal who is basically the right hand of The One Above All (who also has a "Hulk" form called the One Below All, basically the devil).
Funny enough Matpat didn’t go over the living tribunal who is visible on screen for a second when Doctor and America Chavez are going through the different universes in multiverse of madness
not in terms of the MCU yet, but in the comics, I think I'd like to nominate mephisto as a true god doctor strange once destroyed his entire universe by accident, but mephisto and his nether world remained completely unharmed. He was just annoyed that there weren't more souls to be fed into the nether.
I am writing a long running series myself, and this video was a good reminder to run my own story through the grinder and decide what is and what isn't technically a god. Who calls themselves a god but is at the end of the day just a very strong mortal? And who IS in fact an immortal god who can't be beaten by anything.
Love the theory great work but Minerva the Roman goddess is very different from Athena the Roman's adapted Greek characters in some ways but Minerva is much different than her Greek counterpart I also wouldn't put to much thought into it because they probably didn't plan that out regardless I completely agree with almost everything in this theory
Honestly that's a pretty good answer. Also MatPat can you talk about how Adam the Warlock has a yellow stone embedded in his head and is completely gold, like how vision has a red stone and is completely red? Or how does Drax know how to speak the language of the children the High Evolutionary made??
I don’t think the high evolutionary made the children, I think he took them and was experimenting/using them to make the “perfect” species. Maybe I misunderstood though. So I think they just speak a language that they probably spoke on drax’s planet or something like that
Have you heard the stone carver? Good story and it basically is about how there is no top. A stone can stop a strong wind that will blow a human to oblivion, but a human (with the right tools) can destroy the same stone. There is no food chain, but in fact a food net. Rock paper scissors lizard Spock... It all depends on who they are going against.
I don't wanna be that person but my greek mythology hyperfixation is taking the reigns on this one. Minerva, while yes technically the roman version of Athena, is different in that Minerva is not a war goddess. The romans had a plethera of war gods and so didn't need Athena to be one when they romanized her. So, technically, the two could exist separately as they are not so similar as to be interchangeable
Portfolios aren't a one-to-one function, even in D&D; plus, in the ancient world, there was a lot of 'localization' when it came to deities' names, specially across trade routes (cf. how Thoth became 'Hermes'). So yeah, 'Minerva' is just another name for 'Athena', really.
Dude. I just felt awful by Lylla's and her friend's death. And apart from tte cideo. Sadly my theory is that she didn't survided nor was she revived. But that at least she went to heaven along with the others in the afterlife. I wish she had had more chances to appear on screen, and alive, on the future. Yet, what the movie gave us was such an emotional conclusion.
Dormmamu wasn't affected by the Time Stone, which was actually a weakness in this particular case. Strange was resetting himself, but Dormmamu was unfazed by the stone. He was just annoyed into submission.
Strange still Strap him in a time Pardox so Dormmamu still was affected by it
@@oliwierkosmowski6645 Dormmamu wasn't affected by it. Like he said that was the problem. Strange didn't put him in a timeloop, he put himself in a timeloop. Dormmamu probably would not have perceived the timeloop if he were the one being looped.
He had no control over time
I'm pretty sure that the point was that Dormmamu couldn't escape the time loop even if he wanted to.
@@greywolf7577 true man
At the rate MatPat produces theories somebody needs to dig deeper and come up with a theory to how he can do that
Lol
He has a good team. Theory solved.
th-cam.com/video/vgADXefQRdQ/w-d-xo.html
@@AzA609 yes
I agree,I am 50th like
In the comics, the One Above All is considered the highest power and is theorized that it serves as a stand in for the writers who truly control everything, just like KEVIN does in She Hulk
It also works as a retroactive idea to canonize every Stan Lee cameo into One Above All or a representative figure of it, hence his presence in every movie up until Endgame
I prefer the theory that Stan Lee is a Watcher
That's... literally what he said in the video
No, He's literally the God in tha MCU. Their version of Yahweh from the Hebrew Bible. He is No stand-in. Bruh, in the Future just Speak on things You know instead of things You're ignorant of.
@@EmperorPilaf04 I like that idea too, but the scene of him hanging with the other Watchers at the end of Guardians 2 kinda puts the kabash on that. Though...you could argue that he's a watcher who's so dedicated to his role that he keeps his human appearance even when making his reports. Both work.
I love how mat pat is like an English teacher, taking something that was just to make you laugh or cry a bit and making a full on theory or reference to something.
he would've been an amazing teacher if he had chosen a different career path honestly
I feel like the question of ‘does the MCU have true gods’ is more complicated than what Matpats saying because back in Greek time irl they had gods that could be captured and even crippled (see Hephaestus) and they were still considered gods eventhough they were fallible. Matpats definition of a god is more like the god of the Abrahamic religions, an omnipotent, omnipresent and omniscient being.
The reason why he resorted to an omnipotent being is because the 'gods' that weren't omnipotent and killable, say themselves that they aren't gods, but rather really powerful mortals. So an omnipotent being is a satisfying conclusion to what a god means in the MCU. It's completely fine if you disagree, but I think it's a good conclusion to come to. Now it is true that I have already subscribed to this type of thinking a few years back, that The One Above All/Creators of Marvel leading the narratives of these stories are the only ones that could be considered true gods. But I didn't think about how the audience influencing the MCU could also be considered "gods" over the MCU, which is an interesting conclusion I haven't thought about. Overall I really like this video. But I would like it if you respond so we could have a longer discussion. (Or if anyone else wants to respond)
Yeah that's right, I personally have a ranking system for this sort of thing GOD ( abrahamic = top) then God's and then there's god's and then demigods and avatars of spirits
Yeah, gods killed each other a lot and some just don’t stay dead or it was just an avatar of themselves, but I think this video was interesting. All powerful gods fighting with philosophy is what you get left with once a character becomes the one to rule and control everything and is just basically fighting themselves, from a certain perspective. If “god” gave away his power would he no longer be God?
yep
@@rrose9161 gonna quote a small passage,
"In 2 Kings 3, Moab was a vassal to Israel, and it decided to rebel against Israel. (v. 4-5) Israel, Judah, and Edom decide to strike back. They stop by the prophet Elisha to get Yahweh's word on whether they will be victorious. Elisha prophecies that "(Yahweh) will also deliver Moab into your hands. You will overthrow every fortified city and every major town." (v. 18-19)
This appears to be the case, and every major city is destroyed except Kir Hareseth, or "Fortified City of Dirt." Over and over, Moab is defeated. But, suddenly, in verse 27, the Moabite king sacrifices his own child, and "divine wrath" fell on Israel, causing them to retreat. The Hebrew word there, קֶצֶף, is exclusively used in Classical Hebrew to describe the wrath of a deity. But which deity?
Certainly not Yahweh. Why would he respond to a Moabite human sacrifice, break his own prophecy of victory, and force his own armies into retreat? Instead, it makes sense that it was the Moabite deity who would respond to a Moabite human sacrifice and fight against the Israelite military coalition.
We also have a Moabite stele with this exact scenario inscribed, paralleling 2 Kings 3: "Omri was king of Israel, and oppressed Moab during many days, and Chemosh was angry with his aggressions... and I took from it the vessels of Jehovah, and offered them before Chemosh... And the king of Israel fortified Jahaz, and occupied it, when he made war against me, and Chemosh drove him out before me."
This parallel is clear. in 2 Kings 3, Yahweh's prophecy of victory is a failure, and a Moabite god's wrath drives Israel into retreat. In the Moabite Inscription, Chemosh's wrath ends in Yahweh's defeat and the fleeing of Israel. Yahweh is not some sort of omnipotent being in much of the Bible. He is one of many gods, and he is a god that can be beaten."
Thank you for talking about Jack "the king" Kerby. He created Glactus, Thanos, Darkside, the source wall, and so much more for Marvel and DC. Much respect sir. He died not knowing any of his work would get such appeal and recognition as it has today.
Wait, he worked on Marvel AND DC? That's really cool
John kirby is also the namestake for kirby as he defended nintendo from illumination who sued them saying donkey kong is too close to to king kong
He died in the 90s if I’m right
@@Nobody_is_here_right_now Different guy, but still a very cool fact :)
@Deanna L. Newton Thats because Stan is. thief who beat down the King. He stole, and stole and took. All Kirby did was give. While Stan took everything.
Being told calmly by Matpat in just 15 mins that we’re basically the ones in control of the MCU is the most ridiculous yet wild thing I’ve ever seen.
"ridiculous yet wild" lmao
he's also saying that we are gods
Agree to disagree; I think Rocket Racoon could still kick all of our butts
I like how the idea of our desires for stories create universes. Something that could go nicely, or badly. One of a similar but less of an actual film that explores this is Re:Creators.
It's really mind blowing to me how Matpat even manages to produce such well structured theories at such a fast pace.
He got a team
He just does the supervising and voiceovers, he has a team as explain in “i sold my channel”
@@christophergalvez7447 a big one at that
He does have a pretty good team behind him. But yeah, still impressive
Agreed
I think in the case of Gorr, the definition of "gods" was "those recognized as gods". After all, "god" is a vague enough word even when we look at existing religions. The power of their gods are all over the place. Does that mean that some religions don't have proper gods? Or does it simply mean that a god is a being that people recognize as a god?
Personally, I think it's better for the MCU to keep the definition of "god" vague, both because it would make it easier for them to have "gods" in their stories and because it would avoid antagonizing some religion whose god(s) don't match whatever definition the MCU decides on.
i agree with this 100%
in reality, a god is rather simply an object of worship or devotion. that's why Money is often described as a god.
That’s what I’m thinking as well. A “god” is a perspective term. Imagine a being who could control the weather. To us, that would be a god. To a civilization that has been able to terraform planets and control their climate and weather patterns for millennia if not eons, that same character would be akin to just another one of their own kind.
@@logandelacruz2152 Kinda like that famous Arthur C. Clarke quote: "Any sufficiently advanced technology is indistinguishable from magic." To those who do not possess the power to, say, read minds, one who CAN would be indistinguishable from a god, simply because they can do something we cannot. It's kinda why Superman works so well as a concept; he's not a god: to his own kind, were Krypton to never have been destroyed, he'd likely have lived his life as just an average Joe Schmoe, but to us Earth people, he is as a god because he possesses powers the likes of which us mere mortal men do not.
I am not reading all that
I always imagined that Stan Lee's cameos in the movies was him playing himself as the one above all. I honestly didn't think to question what qualified as a god in the MCU.
the fact that he didn't talk about The Watcher. The Watcher is probably one of the closest godlike beings we can see in Marvel, he is multiversal, and is the hand that guides the hands , despite Infinity Ultron beating him, the Watcher had a plan, like he planned it all from the very start
Yes, why was he left out? He is a being beyond the pantheons, and other beings from series were covered.
@@lorikeetrainwing The comics explain it. He is simply old, one of the oldest races. He isn't actually powerful, but he has a lot of powerful stuff.
The Watcher is very much killable
He also said it himself that he's not a god.
The watcher is not here to create or interfere, but just to watch.
It's not a stand-in for writers, but for readers
I think Rocket surviving is James Gunn’s decision since becoming the leader of the new Guardians team is a better ending for the character than him dying after only getting to do things in flashbacks for the entire movie.
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I'm surprised the whole main cast lived, happy it happened though
Yeah the whole plot of the movie kinda centered around saving him so it would be lame if he just died at the end anyway
@@shinyrayquaza9 Yeah, concluding each of their characters in meaningful way was much more impactful and satisfying than just killing them.
@@lilricebowl9731 yeah very true
The Hippo in Moonknight actually confirmed the afterlife and it varies with cultures...she even compliments the beauty of wakanda
@@Sariasunbeliefs are shaped by culture most of the time
reminds me of in the terry pratchet book mort, that death confirms everone is correct in thier view of the afterlife, and that this has terrifying implications.
@@Sariasun the main character in moon knight believes his guardian deity is basically his room mate
And then there is Valhalla
I feel like the closest we get to seeing a god in the MCU is in "What if?" and the watchers, only thing more powerful is whatever gave the watchers their power
James Gunn confirmed in an interview that he originally DID plan for Gamora to die in Vol. 2, but felt it wasn't right for the story, but he was all for her death in Inifnity War. So no, her death wouldn't have changed where he wanted to take these characters
Yeah, I don't recall Gunn having a problem with Disney/Marvel Studios having control over his story like other directors did. His beef with them seemed to been solely about the whole firing nonsense.
Ye she was initially going to die instead of Yondu
@@CouchSpud91 He doesn't even have a beef with them lol
James Gunn actually said in an interview that he wanted Gamora to die in Guardians 2 but it made more sense for Yondu to die and that he was happy she was killed off because new Gamora fits the tone of guardians 3
I have actually given up on keeping up with all the lore, and I just watch the good movies and Matpat's summaries
The "lore" is nonsense anyways
@@ZiggyZamboon yeah it used to make sence and would be reletivly easy to keep track of but now its just crazy
same dude
The lore isn't that complicated
What Matt and the team says is true. The Audience has a lot of power over these movies. Like look at the first Sonic movie, people showed visual disgust his design so the creators pulled the movie's release date so they could fix sonic. Now with the live action movie I believe it's late to come out, well because of a lot of stuff, but because they had to redesign flounder and possibly some of Ariel's animal companions.
I am a bit surprised that you didn’t include Oatu, The Watcher, on your list. He is canonical to the MCU. In many ways, if Kirby and Feige are The One Above All, then we are typical of The Watcher, ever present and spectating and with reality-altering power, though never allowed to take part.
I completely agree
it's Uatu, but I think that he swore a vow not to interact, and Kevin sure did interact
Things might change depending on what happens in What If Season 2. In the comics, Uatu is one member of a species of Watchers, and something tells me they'll not be entirely happy that Uatu broke the vow of non-interference.
Edit: I just remembered that we see some other Watchers hanging out with Stan Lee in Guardians Vol 2, so there is a race of Watchers in the MCU!
@@johnnygyro2295does that not make Stan Lee a God?
@thesausageman5388
I'm not sure. In the comics, there is The One Above All, who sometimes takes the form of Jack Kirby, and he once mentioned a collaborator who might be Stan Lee. That said, it's possible Stan in the MCU was a mortal agent working with the Watchers. Uatu and Nick Fury were revealed to have worked with each other for a while back in the comics.
About the confusion between Thena and Minerva: they could be two very similar gods who humans got confused between in the translation between Greek to Roman mythology, this resulted in them becoming the same god in the eyes of humans despite them being different individuals in reality
What about the assertion that Minerva was an adaptation or another persona of Athena?
Myths, legends and beliefs could have been translated or adapted into local retellings. For some reason, some franchises loosely based off of historical, mythical and legendary beings use technicalities to argue that B is just that country's version of A from this country.
My theory is mildly taken from the American Gods book, that gods are created from the collective will of those who believe in them. So one could say that perhaps when the Roman empire assimilated Greek goddess Athena and renamed her Minerva, enough people believed in her that she came into being.
@@tbm275 that was my thought too. And if that's the case, then there could also be an actual Athena as well, as Thena inspired the Athena that people worshipped, which caused her to come into existence
@@MQzzz.3140 my theory is that when Thena introduced herself to the greeks she went “my name? uhhh Thena” and then bam athena
If I'm not mistaken, that's what actually happened. The Romans had their own pantheon but then kinda absorbed the Greek pantheon and fusing the gods.
The Roman Minerva was more of an arts and crafts goddess and ended up syncronosing with Athena, who had similar domains.
I love to imagine that the humans in the Greek era was like:
“That’s icarus, and that’s Athena”
And they just pronounced her name wrong
Hey, don't forget that Mordo mentioned the Living Tribunal, which is the judge of the multiverse. There is only one.
Also, not sure how they're doing Eternity and his siblings. In the comics, there was only one of each of them also as they were anthro-personifications of multiversal constants
I think it was implied at some point that Eternity and some others (Infinity, Death, and maybe Oblivion) created the Infinity Stones? I'll have to double-check, but Guardians Vol 1 hinted at their involvement via a mural at the intro's temple. TV Tropes probably has more info.
Yknow, even though this was a meta ending: "We are the Gods," MatPat did end up giving a hierarchy to all the characters and their relative powers in the MCU
I guess I missed the part that defines gods as things that can't die. Even in Norse Mythology the gods are able to die as that is kind of the whole deal with the Ragnarok. MCU gods do seem to be as powerful as that. I kinda figured god is defined not by power level or immortality but as beings that are powered by worship and faith in them. Granted by this definition the Asgardians seem like they are still disqualified, but that does seem to be how Bast and the Egyptian gods operate.
I think he doesn't define them as gods because they themselves don't
In a way Thanos might aswell be the MCU's God of balance
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I think he means God and not god if you see the difference
I was thinking of gods as beings who have ultimate control over some aspect of reality like Greek gods.
One thing to point out is technically the Ancestorial Plains and The Duewot are still afterlives. Tarwaret explains the duewot is just "An" afterlife. There are several versions based on the beliefs and religions of the person, and gives the ancestorial plains as an example. Technically, Valhala would be another afterlife for those in the Norse belief. In most cases, its in the eyes of the believer, and I guess in this case for Rocket, there is no Known afterlife probably cuz he doesn't believe in the religious afterlife or something, but he DOES have "An" afterlife
This!
it feels like they are place holder afterlifes, that for some characters and in some ways you can bring people back to life like we saw in endgame. And if they don't have any way to return then they're taken off the board forever.
This should get pinned!!
Rocket does believe in a religious afterlife. He may not be Christian but his worldview told through lylla is closest to christianity
I could not contain my excitement when you used the One Above All panel from the Immortal Hulk run. It is my single favorite depiction of him apart from mayyyybe his appearance in Ultimates
I’d say that “Kevin” is just an alias for The One Above All, in fact I’d say in that emotional scene with Rocket it’s not his long departed fellow test subjects speaking to him but The One Above All as well, telling him about how they gave him a purpose.
Rocket' heaven scene was so gut wrenching. Also the fact that he was ready to accept death, and move on to the Afterlife...
Not yet.
Basically a real God is a figure of someone who does not account to appear physically in the world to not be seen but still exists somewhere out in the world who may be watching.
At least 236 people have seen the movie and not liked this comment
God damnit, I’m on mobile and this was the top comment.
13:50 “If you can’t answer important questions about your own universe, if you keep putting out stories that no one wants, if you can’t get your act together and actually put out films that have heart and soul, the audience is going to lose interest. They’re going to leave these characters behind for something better.”
Now this is the best moral quote I’ve ever heard. And man this really hits hard❤😢
audiences will eat and consume any old trash and an example is most of the movies and novels out there.have you noticed how all these things reinforce human thoughts
Digging into the philosophy of stories and our relationships with them is becoming a popular tend nowadays, which is pretty cool! There’s a web novel that does it well, using it’s characters as commentary on the relationship between the protagonist, the author, and the reader. It even comments on the same cycle of creating content for the consumer and the worth of the characters if there’s no audience, even alluding to long, drawn out storylines to milk out profit (although for them it’s just survival). Super fun concept to explore!
And the video was awesome as usual!
It's always a Good day when Matpat uploads
Bruh, I alr got bots lol
@@StenMKII I am so tired of these fricking bots.
@@StenMKII Just fire your charging handle at them, that should scare them off
Okay please be quiet, you don’t need to comment on every single video you watch 🙄
I also agreed.
Apparently Kevin actually talked James Gunn out of killing Gamora in Vol. 2. So Kevin didn't force her to die; he actually prolonged her life to have her die in Infinity War rather than in Vol. 2 where she was originally intended to die.
Matt's theories are more inspiring than Netflix's Cleopatra show
Le
That's low bar
@@MegaPokefan97 fr😂
It's kinda hard to not be more inspiring than Netflix's Cleopatra... for obvious reasons.
why is that bad
i haven’t watched it
James Gunn has said tha (t he didn't mind that they killed off Gamora too much. When writing GOTG2 he was originally planning the death that Peter grows from to be Gamora, but then realised it made more sense if it was Yondu. Later when Infinity War was being written, the Russos contacted him saying they were thinking of killing her off, and wanted to know if that was something he could work with. He said he was fine with it as it let him rework a bunch of the scrapped ideas from before. He kinda got to have his cake and eat it too (he got two cakes)
The fact that matpat said a "simple question" already tells me there is gonna be chaos
I gotta say though, seeing Rocket die only to be told he still has a purpose breaks me down. I felt his pain and disappointment in the theatre, man. I feel the same. Let’s just say I’ve had unhealthy tendencies since I was 5 so I’m constantly being told the same, to keep fighting and remain strong to fulfill my purpose. All I really want to do is rest but I have nothing but work ahead of me. I hope it’s all worth it in the end. Keep fighting my beautiful friends, your life has a lot of meaning. I don’t want to lose any of you for no reason. You have the strength to push forward, I believe in you!
You might Steven Universe, a superhero cartoon that has a non-depressive nihilistic tone. The title character's arc partially involves learning that his existence has no purpose and that doesn't exist solely to help others.
@@greenamber9827 seems cutesy enough. I might just check it out. I need a good distraction, thanks
Much love back to you, as you gave it to someone who needed it like me.
Thank you.
You missed the meaning of the scene, Lylla calls him, her little racon, and Rocket realizes it's an illusion, get's mad, and says I'm not a raccoon.
The point being it was Rocket himself telling his conscience what he needed to hear. The grass is not greener on the other side, it is greenest where you water it.
@@Byronic19134 I think that’s a rather nihilistic way to look at it in the BEST possible way. I’m not gonna discuss afterlives with you because neither of us is gonna change the others mind but I agree 100% with the statement that life doesn’t get better, you MAKE it better. You are WISE my friend. Take good care of yourself, I like you
It’s kinda crazy that the best way to confirm matpat’s theory the mcu would have to end with “and it was all a dream”
Like Mario Bros. 2? Please - don't give them ideas 😆
The Kirby pencil thing isn't just in marvel comics, I remember there being a Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles Book/story where Donatello met a guy named Kirby who drew things into reality (armoured power arms, portals/gateways to alternate dimensions, and creatures) with a pencil with a fancy rock tied to it.
I remember when the 2K3 show's retold that story one episode for a Jack Kriby tribute. Mike Pollock, aka Eggman, voiced Kirby.
"Maybe we should have established what God's are before going with that plot line" hits so hard.
One more being that you haven't mentioned is Stan Lee. He has been in the MCU nearly always (in the past), he was watching everything. Pretty sure he was a god too
Hes a watcher
Normally, in the comics, all of the cosmic beings are aware of the hierarchy, but in the cinematic universe it seems they’re completely isolated! All off on their own corners of the universe just doing their own thing. And eventually, they learn the hard way when they’re encroaching on another persons territory!
“They aren’t gods, they are just powerful entities” -Rick Riordan in one of the magnus chase books
There also was a mini theory saying that Rocket was going to die, based off of the posters given in preparation to the movie. If you pay attention, the posters tend to single out Rocket in a sort of afterlike feel.
matpats speed of making videos is astonishing and i abosolutly love everytime he uploads
its ridiculus right? every like 2 days I see like 10 more mat pat videos
Probably cause he doesn’t come up with all this one his own…he has a team of writers so it makes it easier for him just to record lol
Hey Mat, I've always wondered why in Tinkerbell The Pirate Fairy, why Captain Hook could understand Zarina, but everyone else had to be told the orders from Hook. Maybe its theory worthy?
Its always a good day when The Film Theorists uploads.
Matpat wasn't only give us a theory of MCU for us, but also a letter to Marvel Studios as a representative for us, Marvel fans...Thank you for your time and effort
This guy NEEDS to do a series of unfortunate events
My favorite part of this was when matpat said “it’s theory time” and then theorized all over the audience
How and why is this meme still ALIVE!!!
Wow bro so funny 😐😐😐😐
I want to be rasict but I don't know you're race
Oh god the Hans Niemann meme is spreading everywhere
What you mean he sead its Theorin time
Only a matter of time till we see MatPat cameo as a multiverse superhero...Theory-Man!!!
No way, Mozart watches Film Theory! Love your symphonies btw.
I take a stance mentioned in the flatland movie, there are the "gods" but once you see things on their level, you realize they have their own "gods", and so on
I'm so happy with GotG 3! Marvel needed this😅
13:40 dannnnggg “they might be the hands guiding the hands, but we are the ones watching” that’s deep. Loved the video!
It's a very interesting perspective, although a bit meta.
The audience's reactions and feedback can influence the direction of the MCU, such as which characters get their own films or TV shows, which storylines are explored, and even how certain characters are portrayed. In this sense, the audience has a kind of "creative control" over the MCU, similar to how gods in many mythologies have control over the world and its inhabitants.
Furthermore, the act of watching a film or TV show is a bit like looking into another universe where the audience members are all-knowing observers, able to see and know things that even the characters in the story do not. This is similar to the concept of omniscience, which is often associated with godhood.
So yes, from a certain point of view, you could argue that we, the consumers, are the true gods of the MCU.
Not gonna lie at 10:29 when they showed the walrus in a wheelchair I couldn't stop laughing for 3 minutes XD
Matt Walsh would be proud: we got both walrus and disabled checkboxes ticked on this one...
The Athena/Minerva case is a deeply complicated one, but it seems safe to say that Minerva is not originally Athena, but a goddess (very) strongly influenced by her throughout the course of the Roman History. I suggest more research on the topic for anyone interested, It's a fascinating matter
One thing I like about kang is that he is forcing us to once again ask if the good guys are really good.
Like if their existence is breaking apart the universe because of the actions they have been taking.
Matt, you've got that wrong with the Dormmamu being affected by the stones. Strange used it on himself, so it works in the Dark Dimension, but does not effect Dormmamu himself (as far as we've seen)
That’s what I kept saying to myself lmaoo, he got that part all they way wrong. Strange used the stones on himself and persuaded Dormammu to leave by annoying him. But Dormammu wasn’t affected
Except that Dormmamu clearly was effected, they both kept experiencing the same event over and over but with the memory of it happening. It's most evident in the first loop when Dormmamu actually starts to repeat his line before realizing he's repeating it.
Dormmamu was affected though. He literally controls the dark dimension, and since the dimension can be bounded by time, so can he. He only bargains with strange because he couldn't do anything against him. If he could, Strange would stay dead after the first time he was killed, or dormmamu would just break out of the loop. I think he has a little control over it, as he can remember stuff after a loop, but not outright break it.
Dormmmamu was absolutely affected. The entire point of the bargain was that Dormmamu was trapped in the loop and needed Dr Strange to release him.
Agree. It didn't affect Dormammu. It was just irritating as an ant that keeps coming back to life only to be killed again and again, but it still comes back! You'd easily take the deal to not destroy its anthill in order for it to leave.
There is little funnier than reading up on lore for a long running series and watching them constantly try to one up apocalyptic threats.
Firing Gunn for that time was probably one of the biggest fumbles by Disney/Marvel but a huge pick up for DC, I'm really looking forward to what James can do with the DCEU as I've always been a far bigger DC fan than Marvel.
the man got rid of the best super man and kept the worst flash.
@@GabeOrionVRwatch the man give Grant a role in grants (somewhat accurate words) “if they want to be the flash again, I’ll do it”
Question: at some point or time can you make another theory channel called the Book Theorists or something? It'd be really cool
11:06 I love how the writers couldn’t be bothered to think of a full acronym for Kevin’s name (and let’s face it, Knowledge probably took *way* to long to come up with) so they just had She-Hulk interrupt him 😂
🤣🤣🤣
Krill-Eating Viscerally Incompetent Nincompoop. I win by W.O., given I tried.
I don't think "The hands that guide the hands" refers to that, that meant clearly the free will of Rocket. Plus, James Gunn has said in interviews that he wasn't bothered by the death of Gamora in Infinity War, in fact, the Russo Brothers consulted him about it to check if it was okay with him and he actually liked the idea because he wanted a loss for the group to deal with in the third movie, so the loss of Gamora was perfect for that. Actually, James Gunn produced Infinity War and wrote some of the dialogues for the movie, he was pretty involved with it
This had more of a video essay feel to it, with the telltale Theorists delivery, and I'm here for it
Captain America gave us an answer to this way back in The Avengers:
“There’s only one God, ma’am, and I don’t think he dresses likes that.”
"Anyone can become a Devil or a God. All it takes is enough people who believe it to be true." Eren Krüger.
I remember in the justice league series Lex Luther delved beyond the dimensional barrier to adquire the antilife equation and what he saw on the other side was the force that kept his universe alive... the audience watching the show
That loop at 14:25 is exquisitely seamless.
Captain America literally said it. "There's only one God ma'am, and I'm pretty sure he doesn't dress like that."
12:40 Nah, James said specifically that he wanted all of them to survive the movie
I’ve always been told that everyone serves someone. Even people at the top have to please those beneath them. This video really exemplifies this concept acting on the MCU.
In Game of Thrones there are two famous phrases, "Valar Morghulis = All men must die" and "Valar Dohaeris = All men must serve"
Honestly, I feel like if Stan lee was still with us the would make him represent “the one above all”
5:30 That's her quoting Arthur C. Clarke. It's gotta be his most well-known quote, but it's so good I don't mind *everyone* uses it :D
Let's not forget that another afterlife plane exists in Love and Thunder, Valhalla. Is this simply another dimension souls/beings transition to that is completely separate to the MCU as we know it, whereby beings can eventually return to the MCU. Kind of like a "you go here for now, and we'll bring you back when it's necessary" concept, or purely just an easter egg to show it didn't end all that badly for Heimdal and Jane?
Honestly this is a bit like how Tolkien viewed his writing. As God created us in His image, so we create fiction in our own image and through writing it is the closest we can get to experiencing what God experiences.
Someone needs to study Matpat's ability to make a theory out of anything
@The FiIm Thoerists 🅥 Thank you for being a valued customer?
@The FiIm Thoerists 🅥 child, what is this sorry attempt?
@The Film Thoerists Fool you thought your shoddy spelling would fool us.But we are as not as foolish as you
Has anyone else noticed this about Wanda? Her powers kinda sucked in infinity war, and where much better in end game, Wanda vision, and multiverse of madness. The reason for her increase in strength was probably from her loss of vision, her sorrow was such that it unlocked a wild part of her that hadn’t been seen before. I doubt even she new her full power in infinity war. The question is, are her powers fueled by sorrow? and if so, how unstoppable could she be if she lost everything?
Finally, someone put my thoughts into words! Thank you Matt!!!!
I love how factually crrect you make your theories
Bot
Team MatPats Theories are always so well made, interesting and "convincing that i would love to see them become true. How well-made can a Game or Movie be if it doesn´t confirm at least Parts of MatPats Theories?
You know its going to be good right when MatPat uploads a video :>
You glazin rn lmao
I actually really like the conclusion of “it comes down to us” because that’s so true. Pretty good theory
I always like to imagine that we as an audience, if we are ever depicted in ant media, we'd be be shown as this endless void filled with eyes, forever watching, learning, and allowing the creation of these "Kevin's" to exist or die.
1:40 - Firing anyone for anything without evidence is just risky in general and shouldn't have happened.
In the comics we actually have to very different versions of Eternity. So you have the Universal Eternity which would be unique to each universe but you also have the Multiversal Eternity which is just a step below The Living Tribunal who is basically the right hand of The One Above All (who also has a "Hulk" form called the One Below All, basically the devil).
Look dc God 🖐
Or dc entities
Funny enough Matpat didn’t go over the living tribunal who is visible on screen for a second when Doctor and America Chavez are going through the different universes in multiverse of madness
6:58 the fact that his real name is Herbert never fails to make me laugh.
not in terms of the MCU yet, but in the comics, I think I'd like to nominate mephisto as a true god
doctor strange once destroyed his entire universe by accident, but mephisto and his nether world remained completely unharmed. He was just annoyed that there weren't more souls to be fed into the nether.
one above all ????
Mephisto has also been defeated by strange and others in his own realm… hes still a god but there’s levels to it in the comics
And that’s only bc of how marvels universes are stacked and parallel. Mephisto a realm is outside of a base universe
I am writing a long running series myself, and this video was a good reminder to run my own story through the grinder and decide what is and what isn't technically a god. Who calls themselves a god but is at the end of the day just a very strong mortal? And who IS in fact an immortal god who can't be beaten by anything.
A god doesn't have to be immoral and can be beaten
Love the theory great work but Minerva the Roman goddess is very different from Athena the Roman's adapted Greek characters in some ways but Minerva is much different than her Greek counterpart I also wouldn't put to much thought into it because they probably didn't plan that out regardless I completely agree with almost everything in this theory
Great theory and all but I was expecting a actual answer but thank you for the great theory!
Honestly that's a pretty good answer. Also MatPat can you talk about how Adam the Warlock has a yellow stone embedded in his head and is completely gold, like how vision has a red stone and is completely red? Or how does Drax know how to speak the language of the children the High Evolutionary made??
I don’t think the high evolutionary made the children, I think he took them and was experimenting/using them to make the “perfect” species. Maybe I misunderstood though.
So I think they just speak a language that they probably spoke on drax’s planet or something like that
Vision had a yellow stone, The Mind Stone, in his head.
The mind stone was yellow.
* yellow stone as well. Mb
9:45 correction very very small ants
Relatively big
That last line where Matt said “stories we remember, but don’t tell anymore” was…. Oddly moving
One of the statues in Eternity's chamber looked suspiciously like the Watcher.
Ain’t NO WAY matpat just dragged this video out to 14:39 just to tell us that Kevin Feige and the audience are the most powerful in Marvel
Except he didnt use frickin’ 3:18
9:46
The big twist:The big ants are Gods.
Have you heard the stone carver? Good story and it basically is about how there is no top. A stone can stop a strong wind that will blow a human to oblivion, but a human (with the right tools) can destroy the same stone. There is no food chain, but in fact a food net. Rock paper scissors lizard Spock... It all depends on who they are going against.
I don't wanna be that person but my greek mythology hyperfixation is taking the reigns on this one. Minerva, while yes technically the roman version of Athena, is different in that Minerva is not a war goddess. The romans had a plethera of war gods and so didn't need Athena to be one when they romanized her. So, technically, the two could exist separately as they are not so similar as to be interchangeable
Portfolios aren't a one-to-one function, even in D&D; plus, in the ancient world, there was a lot of 'localization' when it came to deities' names, specially across trade routes (cf. how Thoth became 'Hermes'). So yeah, 'Minerva' is just another name for 'Athena', really.
Dude.
I just felt awful by Lylla's and her friend's death.
And apart from tte cideo.
Sadly my theory is that she didn't survided nor was she revived.
But that at least she went to heaven along with the others in the afterlife.
I wish she had had more chances to appear on screen, and alive, on the future.
Yet, what the movie gave us was such an emotional conclusion.