22:59 "still grining", after revisiting the video a couple of times i get the feeling that the fiend allowed itself to be decapitated, that's it's only goal was to force the kalguur into using the virtue gems (thus being able to manipulate them or influence them somehow? i get the feeling that it plays a part in controlling the gemling shamblers). It kills the squire and smile at Olroth -> Olroth dispairs and infuses the gem into his sword-> Olroth chases after the fiend alone-> When Olroth confronts the fiend it's still grinning// I take that as the fiend recognicing that Olroth is using a gem and thus smiling after having achieved it's goal, corrupting Olroth. After being decapitated it's head was placed on a pike in the middle of town, this i believe the monster could have predicted, since in the expedition zones, we find the most powerful monsters were heads on pikes lie,(perhaps they already did this when they killed powerful shamblers to display their achievements and boost morale), why would it want that tho? 24:50 to get inside the flame's circle and disrupt the druid's work, cutting an essential source of divination and information from the kalguur, making their wisest be unable to server their purpose and also spy, to see the unrest creep into the kalguur and wait for the perfect moment to create confusion. I believe that it, like the elder, serves a more powerful entity, and much like the elder it cannot be killed. What would this entity be? I would presume it to be chaos, the creature enjoys the screams of it's victims like the elder but this new creature seems to make a show of it (facing the kalguur in battle instead of chasing children in their dreams, making a mockery of the squire's death to provoke Olroth into chasing it, leaving the knights of the black sun without a leader in that particular fight) to instill fear on the people thus making them more susceptible to paranoia, the kalguur have faced it before in battle so it likely has some control or is friendly with the vaal shamblers and instead of simply feeding and corrupting the land it prefers to corrupt it's enemies with power. Expedition lore is truly vage and i love it all the more for it
I bet the current Kalguur King is an Enemy in PoE2, under the Empty-Eye's sway just like Olroth and it was an Avatar of the Empty-Eye's that took that last ship to go and take over Kalguur.
Also I think the Failed Rebellion was when the first signs of change were realized by some group that Gwennen was a part of and she in reality came to the Expedition to find the Triskelion Flame so that they could try and cure the current King and/or to find the source of the Kings malady.
@@lvh5981 I disagree that the mysterious leader of the monsters is the Elder. It doesn't look like the Elder at all, from the description given. It also doesn't act like the Elder, who was never one to lead armies (the only creatures the Elder 'leads' are the Madness Propagators who spawn from his portals, never any Wraeclastian or even Atlas monsters). And, as noted in the video, the Elder can't be harmed physically. Rather I think that entity is a hint to future lore. Both Uthred and Sirus talk about the 'Beyond', but the Elder isn't the only entity to come from there. The Maven does too. And the Envoy reveals that there's many more such beings, and they're on their way. It's worth noting that 3.17 is revamping the Atlas, likely replacing the Maven (or maybe Sirus). While it's still in development, the lore for 3.17 is likely already settled. So they might be sprinkling hints of said lore in the leagues leading up to it. So we may just discover more about this arm-toothed entity in 3.17.
Thanks for summarizing. I love the lore but would rather play the game than wait minutes listening to the NPCs. Edit: I also appreciate how this expansion was character and story-focused, how the NPCs try to hide stuff from you rather than just being there as a mission robot.
I have finished all your videos so far on lore. I can’t thank you enough for the time and effort you have put into this. You have allowed me to enjoy my favorite game even more. If anyone asks me I will tell them you are an angel!
Seeing the Elder as a commander of oriath's monsters strikes me as odd, i always thought of it as a powered up eldritch boogeyman, powerful but acting alone, never comanding any forces outside the things that pop out of the flesh portals. Seeing how the kalgur ended up fearing the stars, the reference to a great mirror and a misterious commander the first enemy to come to mind is the harbinger's boss, but so many questions remains unanswered so this is quite the leap
I mean, since the harbingers can summon common oriath enemies, the beachead final encounter contains a massive portal that when unused seems to be a window to the stars.. also harbingers cant be hurt by attacking them directly, tho the description of the Monster that the kalgur decapitated doesnt seem to match a harbingers, unless its the "elite harbingers" whose character model seems to have a hole instead of a face on it's head
It could write and the kalgur priest understood the message.. could the harbinger's runes be the runes that the kalgur use? Perhaps the messenger was allowed to go back unharmed because he could understand or was somehow able to communicate with the enemy commander
The whole situation is confusing. The Empty-Eyed Fiend is described ~a lot~ like Elder, but gets its head cut off. So that's obviously an issue. And after its head is cut off, a leader appears-- and Medved has "suspicions" about the leader's identity, which are "confirmed" by something written on parchment. The leader has to be something they know of, someone or something they've seen, and that is capable of writing or at least communicating to the messenger to write a message that the Kalguur can understand. It couldn't be island men, the Azmeri, or Vaal because they didn't share a "common language" with the Kalguur. We know the Kalguur knew where the mirror was, as they had heard about it. So the leader could have come from the mirror. The leader could definitely have been Olroth, but then how did the armies continue when Olroth was stabbed and put in glass? I think all we can say is: Medved knew who the leader was, the mirror trapped and/or corrupted Uhtred when he stayed there, and Olroth was definitely trying to sabotage the Kalguur after he'd been stabbed, and maybe before. But it's a huge uncertainty as to who/what that leader actually was. It could be Harbingers, as they're probably from the cosmos, but the leader being a Harbinger doesn't jive with Medved's "suspicions confirmed."
My guess is that the pyked head itself was the leader of said armies. Maybe I understood something wrong, but seems fitting that the eyes of an eldritch immortal being impaled in the middle of your settlement, could by some mean inform an army what is happening on regard to your organization
Can't wait til the Scourge Lore Video, where Noodle talks about how we the exiles, are actually all Niko's Offspring, being raised by Einhar, since we're all just little beasts.
I think it's noteworthy that multiple of the big, important conversations between the faction leaders happen in front of the empty-eyed fiend's head. I don't know what significance that might have, but it definitely feels important. It's also worth noting the the remembrancer writing these texts may have had his own agenda and chose to omit important details; all four of the Kalguurans we meet decide to bring a slightly sanitised version of the truth home, so there's no guarantee the ancient remembrancers wouldn't do the same, regardless of what their duties are *supposed* to be: perhaps they knew who fled on a boat, or who Medved suspected of leading the undead and simply chose not to write those parts down. At the end of the day that doesn't really help answer any questions, but it might help explain why there are so many unanswered questions in the first place. Or it could just be that discovering history is always imperfect, who knows? In any case, great job on the video! The expedition lore is really interesting and engaging and it's good to have it all laid out like this.
It may be a bit of a stretch, but that pattern on the floor in the mirror temple makes me think of Clayshaper and a golem, but also gives me a feeling that I've seen something similar elsewhere.
In regards to the ancient site of power; there's a good change that its of the Primevals of which Aul was their king The Primevals aren't described as human; as they predate the Vaal and the first Vaal was also the first human (in Vaal mythology at least) Also the site that Uhtred is found in has Primeval architecture found in Primeval cities in Delve. It's also possible that GGG was just reusing assets though.
Hey super great video as always ! I've read all the texts too to get a good view on this league lore which is amazing in my opinion i had the same idea about the "empty eyed fiend" beind elder at first but the fact that he got decapitated made me abandon this theory but now that you say it it could make actually a lot of sense. Uthred obviously seen the cosmic horrors through the mirror that's what made him this way but if the timings is right there may be a good corelation between every actors of the nightmare. Since the kalguur obviously went into wraeclast just after the wake doryani did with the red sun and destruction of the vaal and the elder being alive at that time and he being the one that twist the life in the continent to destroy all kind of civilisation maybe the elder was the one through the beast that called doryani to do what he did. Sin say after all his beast has no real intent and he made in not a bad way so maybe the beast corruption just served as a kind of beacon to the horror from beyond the stars to get an hold on wraeclast and the elder was the first to answer using the beast to call people like doryani and then olroth to do their deeds
Been waiting for this for weeks, but I'm away on holiday so I can't watch right now. Need to comment though, so I can find it super easy when I get back!
Great one. This league got a lot of lore, and cool one, as most of what we see is related to Malachai cataclysm, not vaal. The idea of mirrors relates so much with the idea of the double, the ilusion of reality that change the reality. It is posible that the mirror gave a vision of the night sky, but a perverted one, one corrupted by the Beast or another entity from the void that bread the Elder and the Maeven. But no hint in the story relates to that, so it is speculation based on the symbolic sense mirrors tend to represent.
Coming back here after the video for 3.17, I think it's safe to say this likely wasn't The Elder, but a different cosmic entity. One who seems to draw power from people using the Gems. Each entity seems to have their own ways to "interact" with those they encounter. The Tangle and Eater of Worlds consume flesh, The Exarch absorbs knowledge and burns, The Elder absorbs and manipulates "essence" (for lack of a better term). It would stand to reason one of them has dominion over whatever the heck the Kalguur were fighting. People are speculating a relation with Tangmazu (delirium man). Given the likelihood Sin and Innocence are related to the cosmic entities, it stands to reason other living Gods could be as well. Especially if that entity feeds off discord and anguish the way Tangmazu seems to. The shadowy thematics of some of the Kalguur bosses do seem reminiscent of that. So I expect a future entity to be shadow/darkness based. Maybe we'll even get to hear more about that from ol' Niko.
Regarding the Mirror, anytime you hear that in PoE, you naturally gravitate to the Mirror of Kalandra. I think reflecting the night sky in the mirror is an awesome touch. Since it is reflected (on this side, theoretically), the light is not going through the mirror. Which would mean that the stars and the night sky are not in the other side of the mirror... Where Uhtred comes from. So they can hide. If the mirror is of Kalandra, recall the duality often associated with her. If one side of the mirror is showing the night sky, perhaps the other side shows the day? Here is a wild theory: Wraeclast is a dark mirror world for a more normal world, and Uhtred and the survivors of the Expedition tried to flee to this normal world. That would be a power worthy of a mirror this powerful, even perhaps the Mirror of Kalandra.
In my opinion: - Mirror of Kalandra is related with Kalguur - Big mirror in Uthred boss room is negative version of Mirror of Kalandra because it disintegrates instead of duplicating (missing gems, black) - Conquerors of the Atlas are another beings like Uthred, Vorana, Medved and Olroth which entered Atlas, fighted Elder and lost sanity - Whole story from Kalguur is hidden information about Zana Caeserius (circle of time) - she will become probably another kind of queen of sacrifice. When we encounter shaper with Zana, he say: "You've chosed to side with Chaos.". Second phase with Zana: "The horror must be stopped, obstacles destroyed!" and third: "To save the future, the past must be sacrificed". It is weird but I noticed these clues just after this league. Her power is very similar to atziri's and cards named "The Queen", "Beauty Through Death" makes me even more confident about it. We do not know who is mother of Zana. When we finish fighting Shaper, he say to Zana "You are my greatest creation..". Maybe she is not even a human but some kind of shape? Maybe she is daughter of Chaos? Or maybe she is simply incarnation of Atziri in another circle of time? There is map on atlas called Labolatory where there are humanoid shapes, exactly same as Valdo was working around and what are being summoned with his influence on maps. If Zana is his "greatest creation" then we can not be sure she is real human. Maybe she is some kind of core of the atlas? I hope we will see answers in 3.17. There is so many questions.
I don't think they're ever going to reveal the lore (if there even is any) behind the Mirror of Kalandra. It's been in the game for a decade or so, and they've never clarified what it is, or who Kalandra is. Even if this new lore is clarified (maybe in 3.17), I doubt the answer will reveal much about the Mirror of Kalandra.
With regards to the "moon and stars" in the mirror, in the footage at around 41:40, I think that's just the light coming from the PC and Uhtred and other light sources in the arena and being reflected on the mirror and its pieces.
maybe I'm just stupid, but I'm pretty sure that the 'moon' reflected in the mirror, at least in the clip you showed, was actually just your (very bright and glowy white) character being reflected in it, as it seems to move in relation to your characters' actions.
How about the delirium guy? In the Ulthred fight, the color, the atmostphere, the mirror and Ulthred’s ability remind me so much of delirium, maybe Ulthred had become delirious in the end.
I think the thing with the mirror reflecting the nightsky still makes sense, because Uhtred was hiding BEHIND it while it REFLECTED the nightsky, so he was safe from it. What exactly the mirror is though is still an open question i'd say. EDIT: In the "The Price of Prescience" div card you've shown at the end you can see Aul facing what looks to be Tangmazu, who as we know makes us enter the Delirium through broken mirrors. Though not really enough to explain the true nature of Uhtred's mirror itself, Tangmazu having some kind of connection to the whole thing could maybe explain why some of the Kalguur suddenly went against their core philosophies and seemingly went insane, if your elder theory turns out to be false i think the next entity we should suspect would be Tangmazu.
The issue with div cards is they can be planned by players, so sometimes you have to take things with a grain of salt there. However, you're very right that Tangmazu has mirrors, and his motivations are often to turn people against each other. Tangmazu existed after Aul, since he was around during Azmeri vs. Vaal conflicts. So after death, or in this mirror maybe, he could be manipulating Aul? I do feel like Tangmazu is someone who "haunts" people, so it's hard to know if his creatures and deliriums are real or just perceived by who he is affecting. So could he be a leader of armies that were real? Dunno. Seems a lot of people are leaning towards this so I'll maybe do more digging to see more connections!
My thought on the empty-eyed fiend is that it may be some sort of Vaal construct, like the Oversoul and the Omnitect. Something about the "arm teeth" feels mechanical to me, and we know that the Kalguur were playing around in ruins.
The only mirror that trully describes that behavior seems to be Delirium mirror. A Mirror that drives people into madness, but grants power and is MUCH older than the vaal. Is kinda from the stars, and it's owner leads monsters. Essentially, Tangmazu is working for the Elder, wich would fit his behavior in the entire timeline. He forced the conflict between lunaris and solaris so the nightmare had to be made, and once it was slain, started to stalk the godslayer in order to increase his madness, wich is fundamental to weaken him if he was going to face the elder in the atlas. This is pretty evident because Tangmazu only gets serious once we kill Kitava, he was sure we were going to die, and Kitava was going to end Sin and Inocennce. That didn't happend, and he begans to unleash on us his heavy duty while mapping. Tangmazu was counting on a no-gods no-exile Wraeclast, so the Elder woulded been unopposed once freed. This seems to be the only plausible reason, since, given that Kitava was going to swallow everything, he woulded tried to help us... but he has very specific remarks about our encounter with Kitava.
I think that Olroth was possessed by the Elder (the Empty-eyed Fiend) when Olroth 'killed' him, similar to Sirus' interaction. I think Olroth secluded himself before the fight for benign reasons, and this was coopted afterward by the Elder as a good cover to lead his forces. I think the Fiend head was able to give perception to Olroth/the Elder even on the pike. Also recall the glass casket was meant to interfere with granting souls to gems, but why would it stop the influence of the Elder? Finally, I think the ship sent was to get someone back to Kalguur to convince them of the need for this expedition. I think the Flame was seen by the Elder as a way to amplify it's power, and the current king was sufficiently 'encouraged' to try to reclaim the Flame. (Yes, I see a lot of parallels to the Downfall of Numenor from Tolkien here.)
Maybe? But they get sent home after the Fiend is killed. Definitely Annest was at least, since she managed to have kids on Kalguur that resulted in Tujen and Gwennen existing. Honestly there's a lot of stuff that's uncertain!
@@KittenCatNoodle Yeah, I guess my theory was that they didn't make it home on their first voyage, but that Medved put Annest on the last boat home after the Triskelion Flame was lost. That's why he went out to meet the monsters' leader without showing anyone what he'd read on the parchment - because he knew he was willing to do whatever it would take to try and get his daughter to safety.
Bloody hell I love the lore of this game I can't wait to see if they keep expedition in the game and continue adding to its meaning in the main game as Cannon. I also wonder if the eyeless being is one of the other beings like the Elder and like maven who's to say that the person that they talk to wasn't the envoy as kind of like an emissary just like we meet in maps
This is incredible! thanks for this video. It is difficult to track the story in the game due to the logbox drop rate. I still have a lot of questions, but I guess we'll have to wait to find out.
What would a better way even be? It's literally narrated to you, if you stop to stay awhile and listen. As for it being unclear and fragmentary, that's almost certainly intentional. You're meant to be piece together the lore of PoE, not have it spelled out for you.
@@sirpatrickspence6171 Iirc, they said a long time ago they're against cinematics as they cost a lot of money while adding little to the game. The textual implementation is much easier on the budget. Also iirc, the players mostly agreed with them choosing to prioritize the game over cinematics. Even the current story elements are oft skipped, so why invest even more into it? The lore doesn't fit in short cinematics anyway, as it involves half a dozen different civilizations, hundreds of characters and thousands of years. You'd only be getting a very small taste of it. Indeed this is true even of Blizzard games, which are famous for their cinematics and yet still have a lot of lore tucked away. The main story is told to you pretty straight up anyway, by NPCs who stick by you thru it. Plus cinematics typically tend to be a lot less tantalizing than just sound or text. It's a lot better at showcasing spectacle than hinting at the unknown, or the unreliable. Although Noodle's vids do this, PoE's lore was never meant to be explained, but rather pieced together as you explore.
hasn't it always been the case that belief is the real power in poe? all gods became gods because others believed them to be gods, we become unstoppable because everyone thinks of us as such and calling us godslayer turns us into the godslayer. virtue gems grant power cause we've been taught they do. since dannig was instead taught that starlight does it he gets the power elsewhere. "belief is the strongest metal of them all"
I don't think Gwennen lied. She probably did fought in or against some sort of rebellion, but even mentioning the idea of people rebelling against the Kalguur king could get them into trouble, so she walked it back after she realized she spoke too much
What if the Empty-Eyed fiend isn't the Elder, but a former Guardian of the Elder? Thereby making it have the same desires and motivations as The Elder, but as something that can be slain. Then after it was decaptiated, the true Elder took notice that his guardian was dead, got angry at the Kalguur for killing his guardians, so he decided to attack the Kalguur. But he thought that exterminating them was too boring, so he turned them against each other and destroyed their ships.
I think medved is the leader. Maybe because the future is reflected in the past according to the druids of the circle, the corruption broke the circle now having two versions of medved at the same time.Because of this they could no longer see the future because it existed at the same time. After recognizing himself in the message he got back he went into the dark to stop himself and through stopping himself he became his future version that now fought for the beasts. Of course super unlikely but in my opinion there just has to be more of a reason as to why they could no longer see the future and why medved went out alone into the dark
That was a lot of work wow! Though I think Kalguuran lore is less exciting, maybe because it's mostly new stuff not really related too much to anything on Wraeclast. Also, is it just me or Envoy's lore has been laregly expanded into a whole audiobook? Will you be making another video about him?
I started to listen Dannig but the amount of lore made me skip the last ones. So, I start the fight with Olroth and suddenly, so many questions pop up in my head. Why the mirror? Why he resurrects? Why Dannig ask me at the end to not reveal that Olroth was the real traitor, not Uthred? Thanks to this video, I will never skip pieces of lore in future leagues.
Yeah! I'm assuming he's talking about the gems, which come from the beast living in the mountain. His use of the gems maybe brought on this "curse," and that's supported by him sleepwalking at night which is something we've seen from nightmare/beast influenced people. I actually cut the line from my script because I couldn't replicate it in my encounters with him but it supports Olroths corruption by nightmare
Was the method of obtaining the vanity divcard changed between when footage at th-cam.com/video/U-E5RfS1btY/w-d-xo.html (10:49) and now? According to the wiki it only drops from vaal vessels.
i hope ggg rewards you in some way. i am about to launch poe ( i was done with the league) to grind out some expedition and experience the very interesting but hidden lore. maybe ill make a new character and rp a bit. thank you for these videos.
I swear there is a dude in GGG HQ sitting there giggling madly as we scratch our heads over this stuff.
I feel like they said, "not enough lore in Ultimatum for you? Oh just you wait. Mwahaha!!"
Never clicked faster, expedition's lore seems to have a lot of potential
Time to catch up on the lore before 3.25!
22:59 "still grining", after revisiting the video a couple of times i get the feeling that the fiend allowed itself to be decapitated, that's it's only goal was to force the kalguur into using the virtue gems (thus being able to manipulate them or influence them somehow? i get the feeling that it plays a part in controlling the gemling shamblers). It kills the squire and smile at Olroth -> Olroth dispairs and infuses the gem into his sword-> Olroth chases after the fiend alone-> When Olroth confronts the fiend it's still grinning// I take that as the fiend recognicing that Olroth is using a gem and thus smiling after having achieved it's goal, corrupting Olroth. After being decapitated it's head was placed on a pike in the middle of town, this i believe the monster could have predicted, since in the expedition zones, we find the most powerful monsters were heads on pikes lie,(perhaps they already did this when they killed powerful shamblers to display their achievements and boost morale), why would it want that tho? 24:50 to get inside the flame's circle and disrupt the druid's work, cutting an essential source of divination and information from the kalguur, making their wisest be unable to server their purpose and also spy, to see the unrest creep into the kalguur and wait for the perfect moment to create confusion. I believe that it, like the elder, serves a more powerful entity, and much like the elder it cannot be killed. What would this entity be? I would presume it to be chaos, the creature enjoys the screams of it's victims like the elder but this new creature seems to make a show of it (facing the kalguur in battle instead of chasing children in their dreams, making a mockery of the squire's death to provoke Olroth into chasing it, leaving the knights of the black sun without a leader in that particular fight) to instill fear on the people thus making them more susceptible to paranoia, the kalguur have faced it before in battle so it likely has some control or is friendly with the vaal shamblers and instead of simply feeding and corrupting the land it prefers to corrupt it's enemies with power. Expedition lore is truly vage and i love it all the more for it
That's also what I get from this story, you summed it up well :)
Thank you for the recap in the middle of the story, that was truly needed
Rewatching two weeks before Settlers of Kalguur to theorize about how we are having expedition 2.0 plus Heist insights on everything.
I bet the current Kalguur King is an Enemy in PoE2, under the Empty-Eye's sway just like Olroth and it was an Avatar of the Empty-Eye's that took that last ship to go and take over Kalguur.
Also I think the Failed Rebellion was when the first signs of change were realized by some group that Gwennen was a part of and she in reality came to the Expedition to find the Triskelion Flame so that they could try and cure the current King and/or to find the source of the Kings malady.
I think the bad guy in POE 1 is already this. Empty eye seems to be Elder and Sirus seems like he got the same treatment as Olroth
@@lvh5981 I disagree that the mysterious leader of the monsters is the Elder. It doesn't look like the Elder at all, from the description given. It also doesn't act like the Elder, who was never one to lead armies (the only creatures the Elder 'leads' are the Madness Propagators who spawn from his portals, never any Wraeclastian or even Atlas monsters). And, as noted in the video, the Elder can't be harmed physically. Rather I think that entity is a hint to future lore. Both Uthred and Sirus talk about the 'Beyond', but the Elder isn't the only entity to come from there. The Maven does too. And the Envoy reveals that there's many more such beings, and they're on their way. It's worth noting that 3.17 is revamping the Atlas, likely replacing the Maven (or maybe Sirus). While it's still in development, the lore for 3.17 is likely already settled. So they might be sprinkling hints of said lore in the leagues leading up to it. So we may just discover more about this arm-toothed entity in 3.17.
@@kakkaohjus I like this theory!!
Thanks for summarizing. I love the lore but would rather play the game than wait minutes listening to the NPCs.
Edit: I also appreciate how this expansion was character and story-focused, how the NPCs try to hide stuff from you rather than just being there as a mission robot.
I have finished all your videos so far on lore. I can’t thank you enough for the time and effort you have put into this. You have allowed me to enjoy my favorite game even more. If anyone asks me I will tell them you are an angel!
Very existed for upcoming leagues and their lores, I am loving where they are going with this!.
Boat League confirmed !
Seeing the Elder as a commander of oriath's monsters strikes me as odd, i always thought of it as a powered up eldritch boogeyman, powerful but acting alone, never comanding any forces outside the things that pop out of the flesh portals. Seeing how the kalgur ended up fearing the stars, the reference to a great mirror and a misterious commander the first enemy to come to mind is the harbinger's boss, but so many questions remains unanswered so this is quite the leap
I mean, since the harbingers can summon common oriath enemies, the beachead final encounter contains a massive portal that when unused seems to be a window to the stars.. also harbingers cant be hurt by attacking them directly, tho the description of the Monster that the kalgur decapitated doesnt seem to match a harbingers, unless its the "elite harbingers" whose character model seems to have a hole instead of a face on it's head
It could write and the kalgur priest understood the message.. could the harbinger's runes be the runes that the kalgur use? Perhaps the messenger was allowed to go back unharmed because he could understand or was somehow able to communicate with the enemy commander
The whole situation is confusing. The Empty-Eyed Fiend is described ~a lot~ like Elder, but gets its head cut off. So that's obviously an issue. And after its head is cut off, a leader appears-- and Medved has "suspicions" about the leader's identity, which are "confirmed" by something written on parchment. The leader has to be something they know of, someone or something they've seen, and that is capable of writing or at least communicating to the messenger to write a message that the Kalguur can understand. It couldn't be island men, the Azmeri, or Vaal because they didn't share a "common language" with the Kalguur.
We know the Kalguur knew where the mirror was, as they had heard about it. So the leader could have come from the mirror. The leader could definitely have been Olroth, but then how did the armies continue when Olroth was stabbed and put in glass? I think all we can say is: Medved knew who the leader was, the mirror trapped and/or corrupted Uhtred when he stayed there, and Olroth was definitely trying to sabotage the Kalguur after he'd been stabbed, and maybe before. But it's a huge uncertainty as to who/what that leader actually was. It could be Harbingers, as they're probably from the cosmos, but the leader being a Harbinger doesn't jive with Medved's "suspicions confirmed."
@@KittenCatNoodle I see, thanks for the quick clarification! Also, love your vids
My guess is that the pyked head itself was the leader of said armies. Maybe I understood something wrong, but seems fitting that the eyes of an eldritch immortal being impaled in the middle of your settlement, could by some mean inform an army what is happening on regard to your organization
Thanks for the compilation. I've been looking forward to it.
Can't wait til the Scourge Lore Video, where Noodle talks about how we the exiles, are actually all Niko's Offspring, being raised by Einhar, since we're all just little beasts.
I think it's noteworthy that multiple of the big, important conversations between the faction leaders happen in front of the empty-eyed fiend's head. I don't know what significance that might have, but it definitely feels important.
It's also worth noting the the remembrancer writing these texts may have had his own agenda and chose to omit important details; all four of the Kalguurans we meet decide to bring a slightly sanitised version of the truth home, so there's no guarantee the ancient remembrancers wouldn't do the same, regardless of what their duties are *supposed* to be: perhaps they knew who fled on a boat, or who Medved suspected of leading the undead and simply chose not to write those parts down. At the end of the day that doesn't really help answer any questions, but it might help explain why there are so many unanswered questions in the first place. Or it could just be that discovering history is always imperfect, who knows?
In any case, great job on the video! The expedition lore is really interesting and engaging and it's good to have it all laid out like this.
GGG sent me here, i'm not disapointed that they did Great job!
... delirium mirror? I mean really, horror, destruction, insanity, fear, terror and madness...
AH! My much needed dose of poe lore... Many thanks for the video!
It may be a bit of a stretch, but that pattern on the floor in the mirror temple makes me think of Clayshaper and a golem, but also gives me a feeling that I've seen something similar elsewhere.
They are visible in the primeval cities in delve. Maybe that? I also think it's a reference to clay shaper
Omg miss Noodle , I was wandering If you had a video about Expedition , and boom!!!! awesome thx
"Armed-teeth" made me think of Yuguul.
that was way WAY more stuff than I anticipated. Gonna need a rewatch later.
In regards to the ancient site of power; there's a good change that its of the Primevals of which Aul was their king
The Primevals aren't described as human; as they predate the Vaal and the first Vaal was also the first human (in Vaal mythology at least)
Also the site that Uhtred is found in has Primeval architecture found in Primeval cities in Delve. It's also possible that GGG was just reusing assets though.
This was my first league! And their lore is so interesting!
Thanks for this wonderful summary!
41:26, The Clayshaper visited the Lake of Khalandra
Hey super great video as always !
I've read all the texts too to get a good view on this league lore which is amazing in my opinion i had the same idea about the "empty eyed fiend" beind elder at first but the fact that he got decapitated made me abandon this theory but now that you say it it could make actually a lot of sense.
Uthred obviously seen the cosmic horrors through the mirror that's what made him this way but if the timings is right there may be a good corelation between every actors of the nightmare.
Since the kalguur obviously went into wraeclast just after the wake doryani did with the red sun and destruction of the vaal and the elder being alive at that time and he being the one that twist the life in the continent to destroy all kind of civilisation maybe the elder was the one through the beast that called doryani to do what he did.
Sin say after all his beast has no real intent and he made in not a bad way so maybe the beast corruption just served as a kind of beacon to the horror from beyond the stars to get an hold on wraeclast and the elder was the first to answer using the beast to call people like doryani and then olroth to do their deeds
Ahh yiss, my most anticipated video of each league!
That was really fun to watch! Thanks and hats off to you :)
Been waiting for this for weeks, but I'm away on holiday so I can't watch right now. Need to comment though, so I can find it super easy when I get back!
Praise! Hail! Long awaited indeed :D
Finally I can know what the lore is about without relying on my luck trying for hope drops of logbooks..
No Cowgirl thumbnail? So here i am: For the Cowgirl!!
Great video as always.
Thanks for this amazing work! You are trully the one and only Lore Master!
That was intense. Good job!
i love expedition man.. i hope they expand on it in poe 2. the boss fights and logbooks are so fun!
Lady, you are an extremely talented story teller and your videos were the thing that made me appreciate the true depth of PoE's Lore
Great one. This league got a lot of lore, and cool one, as most of what we see is related to Malachai cataclysm, not vaal.
The idea of mirrors relates so much with the idea of the double, the ilusion of reality that change the reality. It is posible that the mirror gave a vision of the night sky, but a perverted one, one corrupted by the Beast or another entity from the void that bread the Elder and the Maeven. But no hint in the story relates to that, so it is speculation based on the symbolic sense mirrors tend to represent.
Wow, how mysterious! Hope we learn more about the mirror.
Coming back here after the video for 3.17, I think it's safe to say this likely wasn't The Elder, but a different cosmic entity. One who seems to draw power from people using the Gems. Each entity seems to have their own ways to "interact" with those they encounter. The Tangle and Eater of Worlds consume flesh, The Exarch absorbs knowledge and burns, The Elder absorbs and manipulates "essence" (for lack of a better term). It would stand to reason one of them has dominion over whatever the heck the Kalguur were fighting.
People are speculating a relation with Tangmazu (delirium man). Given the likelihood Sin and Innocence are related to the cosmic entities, it stands to reason other living Gods could be as well. Especially if that entity feeds off discord and anguish the way Tangmazu seems to. The shadowy thematics of some of the Kalguur bosses do seem reminiscent of that. So I expect a future entity to be shadow/darkness based. Maybe we'll even get to hear more about that from ol' Niko.
Oh man, first time watching one of your vids. Amazing stuff! This has all the makings of a great DnD campaign to me. :D
Nice work on the video this is massive!
damn only 27k views, every poe player must watch these videos ! Absolutely love them men
Special thanks to Noodle for being fucking awesome as HECC.
Regarding the Mirror, anytime you hear that in PoE, you naturally gravitate to the Mirror of Kalandra.
I think reflecting the night sky in the mirror is an awesome touch. Since it is reflected (on this side, theoretically), the light is not going through the mirror. Which would mean that the stars and the night sky are not in the other side of the mirror... Where Uhtred comes from. So they can hide.
If the mirror is of Kalandra, recall the duality often associated with her. If one side of the mirror is showing the night sky, perhaps the other side shows the day? Here is a wild theory: Wraeclast is a dark mirror world for a more normal world, and Uhtred and the survivors of the Expedition tried to flee to this normal world. That would be a power worthy of a mirror this powerful, even perhaps the Mirror of Kalandra.
Loved it! So much effort put into it! wow!
In my opinion:
- Mirror of Kalandra is related with Kalguur
- Big mirror in Uthred boss room is negative version of Mirror of Kalandra because it disintegrates instead of duplicating (missing gems, black)
- Conquerors of the Atlas are another beings like Uthred, Vorana, Medved and Olroth which entered Atlas, fighted Elder and lost sanity
- Whole story from Kalguur is hidden information about Zana Caeserius (circle of time) - she will become probably another kind of queen of sacrifice. When we encounter shaper with Zana, he say: "You've chosed to side with Chaos.". Second phase with Zana: "The horror must be stopped, obstacles destroyed!" and third: "To save the future, the past must be sacrificed". It is weird but I noticed these clues just after this league. Her power is very similar to atziri's and cards named "The Queen", "Beauty Through Death" makes me even more confident about it. We do not know who is mother of Zana. When we finish fighting Shaper, he say to Zana "You are my greatest creation..". Maybe she is not even a human but some kind of shape? Maybe she is daughter of Chaos? Or maybe she is simply incarnation of Atziri in another circle of time? There is map on atlas called Labolatory where there are humanoid shapes, exactly same as Valdo was working around and what are being summoned with his influence on maps. If Zana is his "greatest creation" then we can not be sure she is real human. Maybe she is some kind of core of the atlas? I hope we will see answers in 3.17. There is so many questions.
you may be right. I feel same with Zana
agree
+1
I don't think they're ever going to reveal the lore (if there even is any) behind the Mirror of Kalandra. It's been in the game for a decade or so, and they've never clarified what it is, or who Kalandra is. Even if this new lore is clarified (maybe in 3.17), I doubt the answer will reveal much about the Mirror of Kalandra.
@@ArawnOfAnnwn I'm pretty confident I know who Kalandra is. Quite a few clues to her identity have been left in the game.
I always wanted to do lore videos myself on PoE
Edit: You earned another sub.
i LOVE your VISION of History POE ^^ good job ^^
thanks for another amazing video and explanation
YESSS I was waiting for this.
With regards to the "moon and stars" in the mirror, in the footage at around 41:40, I think that's just the light coming from the PC and Uhtred and other light sources in the arena and being reflected on the mirror and its pieces.
I think the mirror might have been a precursor map device
Maybe this is foreshadowing a new cosmic endgame (and being) for 3.17?!
maybe I'm just stupid, but I'm pretty sure that the 'moon' reflected in the mirror, at least in the clip you showed, was actually just your (very bright and glowy white) character being reflected in it, as it seems to move in relation to your characters' actions.
Can't believe i watched the entire thing
How about the delirium guy? In the Ulthred fight, the color, the atmostphere, the mirror and Ulthred’s ability remind me so much of delirium, maybe Ulthred had become delirious in the end.
'Delirium guy' is Tangmazu, one of the gods of Wraeclast. He should have been asleep at the time, as the Beast was still alive.
well done!
I think the thing with the mirror reflecting the nightsky still makes sense, because Uhtred was hiding BEHIND it while it REFLECTED the nightsky, so he was safe from it. What exactly the mirror is though is still an open question i'd say.
EDIT: In the "The Price of Prescience" div card you've shown at the end you can see Aul facing what looks to be Tangmazu, who as we know makes us enter the Delirium through broken mirrors. Though not really enough to explain the true nature of Uhtred's mirror itself, Tangmazu having some kind of connection to the whole thing could maybe explain why some of the Kalguur suddenly went against their core philosophies and seemingly went insane, if your elder theory turns out to be false i think the next entity we should suspect would be Tangmazu.
The issue with div cards is they can be planned by players, so sometimes you have to take things with a grain of salt there. However, you're very right that Tangmazu has mirrors, and his motivations are often to turn people against each other. Tangmazu existed after Aul, since he was around during Azmeri vs. Vaal conflicts. So after death, or in this mirror maybe, he could be manipulating Aul? I do feel like Tangmazu is someone who "haunts" people, so it's hard to know if his creatures and deliriums are real or just perceived by who he is affecting. So could he be a leader of armies that were real? Dunno. Seems a lot of people are leaning towards this so I'll maybe do more digging to see more connections!
My thought on the empty-eyed fiend is that it may be some sort of Vaal construct, like the Oversoul and the Omnitect. Something about the "arm teeth" feels mechanical to me, and we know that the Kalguur were playing around in ruins.
The only mirror that trully describes that behavior seems to be Delirium mirror. A Mirror that drives people into madness, but grants power and is MUCH older than the vaal. Is kinda from the stars, and it's owner leads monsters. Essentially, Tangmazu is working for the Elder, wich would fit his behavior in the entire timeline. He forced the conflict between lunaris and solaris so the nightmare had to be made, and once it was slain, started to stalk the godslayer in order to increase his madness, wich is fundamental to weaken him if he was going to face the elder in the atlas. This is pretty evident because Tangmazu only gets serious once we kill Kitava, he was sure we were going to die, and Kitava was going to end Sin and Inocennce. That didn't happend, and he begans to unleash on us his heavy duty while mapping. Tangmazu was counting on a no-gods no-exile Wraeclast, so the Elder woulded been unopposed once freed. This seems to be the only plausible reason, since, given that Kitava was going to swallow everything, he woulded tried to help us... but he has very specific remarks about our encounter with Kitava.
Such a coool story thanks for your work i really enjoyed please add more if u find anything
Looks like noodle found a mirror
Probably the only mirror I'll ever find. Found a shard once so, I've got that going for me, which is nice
I think that Olroth was possessed by the Elder (the Empty-eyed Fiend) when Olroth 'killed' him, similar to Sirus' interaction. I think Olroth secluded himself before the fight for benign reasons, and this was coopted afterward by the Elder as a good cover to lead his forces. I think the Fiend head was able to give perception to Olroth/the Elder even on the pike. Also recall the glass casket was meant to interfere with granting souls to gems, but why would it stop the influence of the Elder?
Finally, I think the ship sent was to get someone back to Kalguur to convince them of the need for this expedition. I think the Flame was seen by the Elder as a way to amplify it's power, and the current king was sufficiently 'encouraged' to try to reclaim the Flame. (Yes, I see a lot of parallels to the Downfall of Numenor from Tolkien here.)
For the cowgirls!
So my take away from this is that it seems Vanity is no longer limited to dropping only from Vaal Vessels. 10:51 Maybe that's a clue to the lore?
I think this mirror have some connection to the mirrors of delirium
Who knew cowgirls had so much lore
Very cool!
The leader of the shamblers was Olroth's son, imo, and Annest took the boat at the end.
Maybe? But they get sent home after the Fiend is killed. Definitely Annest was at least, since she managed to have kids on Kalguur that resulted in Tujen and Gwennen existing. Honestly there's a lot of stuff that's uncertain!
@@KittenCatNoodle Yeah, I guess my theory was that they didn't make it home on their first voyage, but that Medved put Annest on the last boat home after the Triskelion Flame was lost. That's why he went out to meet the monsters' leader without showing anyone what he'd read on the parchment - because he knew he was willing to do whatever it would take to try and get his daughter to safety.
Bloody hell I love the lore of this game I can't wait to see if they keep expedition in the game and continue adding to its meaning in the main game as Cannon. I also wonder if the eyeless being is one of the other beings like the Elder and like maven who's to say that the person that they talk to wasn't the envoy as kind of like an emissary just like we meet in maps
Amazing video, thank you very much!
This is incredible! thanks for this video. It is difficult to track the story in the game due to the logbox drop rate. I still have a lot of questions, but I guess we'll have to wait to find out.
If he miss and the head came off, maybe it was an illusion. and the head on pike was like Trojan horse made to gather information.
I've been looking forward to this
Am I alone to see similarities in Uthred's room and Aul's region in Delve?
i just wish this story was presented in the game in a better way D:. awesome work
What would a better way even be? It's literally narrated to you, if you stop to stay awhile and listen. As for it being unclear and fragmentary, that's almost certainly intentional. You're meant to be piece together the lore of PoE, not have it spelled out for you.
The word you're looking for here is 'cinematics'. The lore is really, really good especially when explained, but I'd rather enjoy it visually.
@@sirpatrickspence6171 Iirc, they said a long time ago they're against cinematics as they cost a lot of money while adding little to the game. The textual implementation is much easier on the budget. Also iirc, the players mostly agreed with them choosing to prioritize the game over cinematics. Even the current story elements are oft skipped, so why invest even more into it?
The lore doesn't fit in short cinematics anyway, as it involves half a dozen different civilizations, hundreds of characters and thousands of years. You'd only be getting a very small taste of it. Indeed this is true even of Blizzard games, which are famous for their cinematics and yet still have a lot of lore tucked away. The main story is told to you pretty straight up anyway, by NPCs who stick by you thru it.
Plus cinematics typically tend to be a lot less tantalizing than just sound or text. It's a lot better at showcasing spectacle than hinting at the unknown, or the unreliable. Although Noodle's vids do this, PoE's lore was never meant to be explained, but rather pieced together as you explore.
0:35 Considering they are inspired by Vikings, "aesclast" is obviously taken from "aesir" (Thor's pals)
Dannig is confident bordering on delusional, going as far as calling himself loremaster.
What I want to know is where are the cowgirls we are promised?
I would guess this is giant tease for Path of Exile 2. Just like the cut storyline from Heist proved to be.
Any chance that mirror is a mirror of delirium, he literaly stared at medness for decades and gonne completly mad in the process
hasn't it always been the case that belief is the real power in poe? all gods became gods because others believed them to be gods, we become unstoppable because everyone thinks of us as such and calling us godslayer turns us into the godslayer. virtue gems grant power cause we've been taught they do. since dannig was instead taught that starlight does it he gets the power elsewhere.
"belief is the strongest metal of them all"
I don't think Gwennen lied. She probably did fought in or against some sort of rebellion, but even mentioning the idea of people rebelling against the Kalguur king could get them into trouble, so she walked it back after she realized she spoke too much
Did 40/40 didn't read any Npc text. Learning everything by watching this instead
It's sad that there are a lot of unanswered questions
What if "Beyond" is an actual being that The Elder serves? heh
I have seeeeen Beyond!
What if the Empty-Eyed fiend isn't the Elder, but a former Guardian of the Elder? Thereby making it have the same desires and motivations as The Elder, but as something that can be slain.
Then after it was decaptiated, the true Elder took notice that his guardian was dead, got angry at the Kalguur for killing his guardians, so he decided to attack the Kalguur. But he thought that exterminating them was too boring, so he turned them against each other and destroyed their ships.
I think medved is the leader. Maybe because the future is reflected in the past according to the druids of the circle, the corruption broke the circle now having two versions of medved at the same time.Because of this they could no longer see the future because it existed at the same time. After recognizing himself in the message he got back he went into the dark to stop himself and through stopping himself he became his future version that now fought for the beasts.
Of course super unlikely but in my opinion there just has to be more of a reason as to why they could no longer see the future and why medved went out alone into the dark
Cow girl hype!!
The moment they started speaking cockney british the magic was turned to dust.
That was a lot of work wow! Though I think Kalguuran lore is less exciting, maybe because it's mostly new stuff not really related too much to anything on Wraeclast.
Also, is it just me or Envoy's lore has been laregly expanded into a whole audiobook? Will you be making another video about him?
This is awesome 😎
thank you noodle :)
I started to listen Dannig but the amount of lore made me skip the last ones. So, I start the fight with Olroth and suddenly, so many questions pop up in my head. Why the mirror? Why he resurrects? Why Dannig ask me at the end to not reveal that Olroth was the real traitor, not Uthred?
Thanks to this video, I will never skip pieces of lore in future leagues.
I don't understand what this voice line from Olroth means : "The curse... sprung from the mountain..." Could you explain please?
Yeah! I'm assuming he's talking about the gems, which come from the beast living in the mountain. His use of the gems maybe brought on this "curse," and that's supported by him sleepwalking at night which is something we've seen from nightmare/beast influenced people. I actually cut the line from my script because I couldn't replicate it in my encounters with him but it supports Olroths corruption by nightmare
Mirror mirror on the wall, who's the smartest of them all...
Was the method of obtaining the vanity divcard changed between when footage at th-cam.com/video/U-E5RfS1btY/w-d-xo.html (10:49) and now? According to the wiki it only drops from vaal vessels.
For the Cow Girl!
i hope ggg rewards you in some way. i am about to launch poe ( i was done with the league) to grind out some expedition and experience the very interesting but hidden lore. maybe ill make a new character and rp a bit. thank you for these videos.