Liquid Cooled Peltier (TEC) Refrigerator - Part 1
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 4 ก.ย. 2024
- In this video series, I will build upon experience gained with my previous attempt at a peltier fridge. This time I am using liquid to transfer the cold more efficiently. This first video shows the cpu cooling systems and the peltier and how they go together, how they are wired, and some basic testing to make sure the idea works.
so i bought a tec mini fridge from a pawn shop and just added a water loop to the hot side and it works so much better. currently use it as an office fridge for drinks. the mini fridge was sold at $3 because it didn't work, once getting it home and testing the only thing wrong with it was the power supply was dead. so my setup has 2 tec1-12706 with aluminium heatsinks on the cold side and a waterloop on the hot side. the water loop is a single waterloop with two cpu water blocks in line with each other and 2 aquarium pumps. i've got a 120mm rad with a powerful fan and potentiometer for fan control.
can't wait to see the next step
Thank you for taking the time to make and post this great set of videos.
Cheers m8
cri8tor You are welcome. Thanks for watching them!
LDSreliance great Idea using the H60s
the reasons I believe you are not getting very low temperatures
is because the cold plate is outside the box exposed to the hot air
I am surprised you got the box that cold
imagine how cold it would get if you figured a way to get the cold plate inside the box
or leave it outside but insulate it from the hot end
I know the hot and cold end are very close but there should be a way to do it
you probably could get good results using the cheap 5 amp TEC
Nice video!!! Next part please!!!
Zellox Thanks! I am working on it. Lots of thunder storms right now in Texas so I can't work in the garage right now. It is coming soon.
LDSreliance ok
Thanks for your ideas on using cpu coolers, awesome. I bought a 10 amp TEC on amazon, and I can't quite get me temperatures down as low as I would like using the cpu coolers, and was wondering where you got your TEC at? I know most come from china, and many are cheap, but not sure if they are good quality or not. thanks
Replied to your other comment. I got all mine from cheap sources so I had the same challenges you did. But I did run across a better company in my research. I just never pulled the trigger.
Good video again sir keep them coming :)
killerzamf Thanks! Appreciate it.
Run larger waterblocks and use multiple TECs
Interesting, I have the H100i dual 240mm radiator for my desktop. Pretty cool stuff.
Desert Rebel Right on. I don't overclock my computer so I don't need hydro cooling but they are fun to play with in other applications.
I build custom computers on the side, lots of fun. Take care.
I used to do that. Still do for family and friends. Great hobby. Later
According to TH-cam video titled: DIY Solar DC Direct without vattery !!! The 3 common methods. / TH-cam video channel name: Solarduino, a direct current 12V fan motor can be powered directly connected to a solar panel without the risk of an amp overload to the motor as long as: (1) The amp output of the solar panel is less than the amp input limit of the fan motor and, (2) Each fan has its own solar panel array that does not power any other fans or other devices. However, perhaps it would be okay to use a solar panel array with the same amp output as the amp input limit of the fan motor? Perhaps it would be okay to use a solar panel array that is one or two amps more than the amp input limit of the fan motor if an amp regulator / controller module or a PWM motor speed controller (potentiometer) and an amp / watt meter is connected between the solar panel array and the fan? However, I do not know if a peltier frig could be powered this way; unlike a fan motor, a peltier device is a sensitive solid-state electronic device. Please share your thoughts about this. Thank you.
thanks
"I don't have any real good screan capture Software" There is a program called OBS and it is free. Works wonders.
Amazing video LDSreliance, i wounder when is the ( part two) coming out, im looking for a very quite mini fridge to make out of it, and if you would tell us if we would hook the electricity from the wall instead of battery ,hows the wiring would be , it would be great, sorry for my bad grammar
THEOOJOKER Yes, I can show some of that in the series. I am already shooting part 2 of the series and it should be out sometime next week. Stay tuned!
Did you use water pump ?
I am designing a test chamber for an item my company is creating, and I want to be able to control the temperature of a test chamber fairly reliably. I want to keep it close to freezing. I had in mind a system similar to what you created, and thank you for your posting about your system. I also want to thank you for posting about your failures, since those are as informative as success stores, but are often not documented.
For your design, I am wondering how much benefit there is to the 2nd water-cooled radiator. Perhaps just an air-cooled system for the hot side would be about as efficient. Did you make your choice based on some data about the liquid coolers, indicating that that is much more efficient?
For my system, to get the temperature drop I need, around 35 deg, I imagine I will need to stack some TECs. I have read that the one on the hot side must be around 4x larger than the one on the cool side, just to dump the extra heat generated by its inefficiency. This will certainly increase the power draw a lot.
So, I am re-evaluating the use of a TEC for my own project. A small table-top ice maker only costs around 180. So, I might just use that and circulate water through the ice holder, and into my test chamber. The water will never go below freezing, so I will have a very stable temperature.
For your own project, I am wondering how efficient a battery connected to an inverter that runs a 120v refrigerator. A small compressor operated refrigerator only costs around $85. Note to those who want to cool air using a refrigerator, the system is really designed to work at refrigerator temperatures, not with the cold coil at room temperature. So, there will be issues if you try to run it with the door off, and a fan blowing on the coil.
+a. There were a few educated guesses that led me to believe and still believe that liquid cooling in this type of system is superior. I don't have carefully measured, controlled data to confirm. But one reason is to keep the hot radiator away from the device or air you are wanting to keep cool. I had quite a few people commenting on my first fridge which was air to air cooling where I sandwiched cpu coolers on either side of a peltier and mounted it in the back wall of the fridge. They claimed that I was seeing heat creep back to the cold heat sink since the hot and cold heat sinks were only separated by less than an inch with some foam insulation and wood in between. So with the liquid CPU cooler, the pump quickly pumps away the liquid carrying the heat 10-12 inches away to the hot radiator. No chance for heat creep.
The other thing is that my air to air hot side radiator would get warm (slightly warmer than body temperature) to the touch but the liquid cooled hot side radiator never changed temperature at all. It was always room temperature. I could feel some very slight warmth through the tubes carrying the liquid but the radiator was way over-capable for my application even at 15 amps.
Do I think you will gain a lot of efficiency? No. But it also allows easier mounting options and allows you tenfold increase in heat shedding abilities over air to air even with copper pipes and loud fans.
As for using a cheap mini-fridge, that would probably be the easiest solution. We know it works and it will easily get you to 40 or lower degrees F. However, be aware that you will need a really large inverter for the job. I don't know if you watched my "Will It Solar?" series but in the episode where I tried to run a mini fridge off a battery and inverter I ended up shooting 4 episodes trying different tricks, including a capacitor, to get the stupid thing to start. In the end I had to use a 2000 watt inverter to handle the huge current spike to get the motor running on the fridge. You will also need a big enough battery to provide that kind of juice for a short period of time. A small SLA battery just won't do it.
use a tatto power supply, Works perfect for controlling the temp output
David Cantrell
I guess that is just a variable output power supply?
I'm doing the same thing, just with liquid cooling on the hot side and a small heatsink on the cold, inside of my mini fridge.
That should work just fine!
If you reverse air flow on cold side force air into coil it should get colder
I bought the Evga 500W power supply the only wire that I'm confused about is the yellow with stripe
From what I have read, the yellow wire with a black stripe is on a different 12v rail called the +12v2 rail. This rail provides 12 volt power to certain processors. You can look at your specs for your psu (usually on a sticker on the side of the psu) and find the +12v2 rail and see how many amps max it produces. It might only be a small amount.
Hi! First off thank you for posting your work. I am in the process of designing one for personal use. I am wondering if you could increase your efficiency by using a radiator on the cold side. it would increase your surface area. you could design one, or possibly repurchase a small one from an oddball appliance. recycling centers may be a good place to look. again thanks, and your hot side is exactly how I will make mine, I am just going to tinker with my cold side.
+Bob Hanker Thanks for watching, Bob. I am confused, though, as I did use a radiator exactly the same as the hot side on the cold side in this video. What else did you have in mind?
+LDSreliance I was thinking of making the inside box out of sheet metal, using 1/2" copper as a manifold, then running multiple 1/4" or smaller lines all around the outside of the metal box. the copper lines would have to get soldered on somehow. behind that I am going to put 2"foam board (double layered) and then use plywood on the outside. Increases surface area, reduces the needed amount of fans. I haven't tried this yet, but if you can get low 40 degree water, I am pretty confident it will work.
+LDSreliance I was thinking of making the inside box out of sheet metal, using 1/2" copper as a manifold, then running multiple 1/4" or smaller lines all around the outside of the metal box. the copper lines would have to get soldered on somehow. behind that I am going to put 2"foam board (double layered) and then use plywood on the outside. Increases surface area, reduces the needed amount of fans. I haven't tried this yet, but if you can get low 40 degree water, I am pretty confident it will work.
Bob Hanker
That should work but it sounds expensive and labor intensive. I know that is how a lot of refrigerators work is cooled piping in the sides of the fridge. One concern I would have is that sounds like a ton of surface area, which is a good thing, but you may find that you need quite a bit of peltier power to get that much surface area cold. And that much peltier power will produce a LOT of heat and consume a lot of energy.
You are so exiting to listen to. Residentsleeper
No, but the video is great
Thanks, I appreciate it! I know I get monotone sometimes. Oh well.
Im doing the exact same thing but with a small cpu heatsink and 2 fans one the cold side (Blows out cold air. a.k.a ac unit).
Awesome. I will be doing another peltier experiment soon and trying to make an air conditioner. I know many people have attempted it with limited success or outright failure. I am determined to find a way.
LDSreliance making an ac too. I'm thinking of using a liquid cooler on the hot side and a small cpu heatsink on the cold side (blows out cold air). I have 70w 154w 230w and 400w peltiers.
LDSreliance i have think a way to make Peltier airconditioner with large module
Hello. I am building a similar project, and I would like to know if you could please help me with the pump header. I know that the wire at the left is the negative. But which one is the positive: the wire in the middle or the wire at the right? Thanks.
The positive wire is always the wire right next to the negative.
Thanks a lot.
You are welcome!
Hey, just wondering, will the temperature on the cold side get cooler if you put the fan on the 5v rail?
PC TechTips Good question. I am pretty sure it won't because the TEC is only 5 amps and the +12v rail provides 25 amps. So the fan and the TEC can both get plenty of current. Also, the fan is 12v so I don't know if it will work on 5v.
This might be my next step in trying to do the chocolate case. Thanks!
Roy Greenhalgh It should be a lot more efficient than the air cooled one. Here's hoping!
LDSreliance lol only wish I tried that FIRST. I got like $300 on parts and 3 message boards trying to get me down to the 60-75F range with the Air cool setup. I'll let ya know if it works ;)
Sounds good! In the meantime, I will continue working on this project.
What does the radiator on the hot sides temperature get to? I was wondering because Im trying to do a comparison with the same peltier unit. On my large, bulky aluminum heatsink, Im getting about 85-87 degrees in a 80 degree ambient running off of 9-12 volts. Does the radiator that you are using get a lower temperature difference?
TCircuitry HD I bet it is about the same as yours. It is warm to the touch but not hot at all. Definitely lower than body temperature. I would guess 85 degrees. Unfortunately, I don't have a device to measure surface temperature. I need to get a good infrared thermometer.
Thanks for the info! If you can possibly get one and test it for me in a future video, that would be highly appreciated because i'm considering whether or not to buy one of those corsair coolers. Also, one more suggestion I thought of is that I believe that the H60 uses a 120mm fan that only blows about 65 CFM. Maybe you could also look into a fan that size that blows over 100 CFM for maximum cooling performance which I would probably consider doing if I didn't get the results that I needed. Thanks for any help! :)
I will consider getting an infrared thermometer for sure.
On these 5 amps units, however, I am pretty sure the fans are doing nothing and all of the heating/cooling is being done by the radiator. I ran a test once on a peltier with just a heat sink and it was about the same temperature. But with 10 or 15 or more amps I think we may start to see the fans come into play. If that is the case then I will definitely try a better 120mm fan as they are cheap and easy to replace. Good idea!
could i theoretically liquid cool the hot side with a computer radiator and use the cold side for cabinet air cooling?
Yes you could. They don't work as well cooling air but it will work if you have a strong enough peltier and good insulation.
i have a sprinter converted into a camper and am looking for someway to make and air conditioner do you think something this unit could cool 300+ cubic ft.and perhaps drop the temp 20 degrees F
John Hix Yes but it would take an awful lot of power. The beauty of a peltier fridge or air conditioner is portability, flexibility, lightweight, and small size. In this video series I am able to cool ~1 cubic foot about 20 degrees below ambient with 10 amps of power. So if you scaled that up to 300 cubic feet you would need 3000 amps of power or 36,000 watts! I think that is about double what it takes to cool down my whole house.
So I don't want to discourage you from the way you are thinking, but we need to change things a bit. Maybe you can make a small portable air conditioner/fan unit that blows cool air on you kind of like a space heater does in the winter.
+LDSreliance The amount of cooling needed is not so much related to the square feet, but the surface area, the heat loss through the walls, the heat sources inside, and finally the air infiltration. If the camper is not well sealed, the air infiltration will overwhelm you system very fast. The heat from an occupant is around 250 BTU/hr. So, you can see why a Peltier cooler is not a good choice for cooling people.
When I was planning an extended drive, and needed to conserve money, I decided to just sleep in my car. In my case, I needed heat, not cooling. A trucker friend said that just running my car overnight would not burn that much gas. I saw data for a Honda Civic, idling with A/C running at 0.35 Gal/Hr. For reference, idling without A/C and no fan on is around 0.2 Gal/Hr.
a.
True, but for simple guesstimation at least knowing the square footage or cubic footage of the space will help.
I didn't know that about idling a vehicle. Very interesting.
cool!
Jerónimo Barraco Mármol Thanks for watching!
LDSreliance those projects are actually interesting, keep it up. too bad is too expensive to ttry it on my country.
I am sorry it is expensive for you. I will definitely keep making interesting videos for you to watch, at least.
Sorry? on the contrary, you are making it possible for me to learn and enjoy of your experiments :) (oh and i love to make experiments but the money doesnt allows me to). So thanks :)
You are welcome.
I'm think about doing something similar but on a way smaller scale. Mini a/c built in to a 6inx6x6 box and insulated.
I'm looking to get the H80 model liquid cooler.
Did you do any temp test with only one radiator hooked to the hot side? Results?
Do you think H80 suffice with a tec1-12706
Thanks
Any water cooler will be more than good enough for a 12706. I am confused what you mean by more than one radiator on the hot side. I only had one in this video.
LDSreliance - thanks for the info, good to know.
In your vid you have one water cooler attached to the hot and one to the cold side.
Now I could be totally wrong but it seems like the water cooler on the cold side would actually impead its performance. Since it would take a long time to cool the water down in the radiator.
I was wondering what the cold temps were with only a radiator hooked to the hot side and nothing on the cold side.
Thanks for the reply
Without a cold side heat sink or cold plate it would get extremely cold but not be useful. You can drip a drop of water on the surface of the cold side like that and it will instantly freeze. Pretty cool. But the problem is you have to channel that cold to somewhere for it to be useful. So you have to use a heat sink or cold plate or radiator of some kind.
LDSreliance - much appreciated. I'll let ya know how it turns out
part2part2part2part2part2part2part2.
I WANT PART 2!!!
Zellox Patience, it is coming. If it ever stops raining here in Texas that is.
did you ever try stacking peltiers
Yes. Apparently I did not do it right but I tried:
th-cam.com/video/F6i7y4FV-sU/w-d-xo.html
th-cam.com/video/nflU4tiJjPI/w-d-xo.html
Thought your name was "LSDReliance" Then i double checked it and it said LDS. Lol.
Haha, that would be bad!
could you send me info on how to hack a computer power supply and how to wire the 2 h60 liquid cool fans with pelteir chip together, many thanks.
Here is how to hack the psu: th-cam.com/video/M4TFVhCg6sk/w-d-xo.html
As for wiring everything together, I don't have a video on that per se but I can answer any questions you have. It is pretty simple. The 4 pin connectors on the end of those wires will have a ^ or diamond shape next to the wire that is the negative wire. Just mark that wire and hack off the end of the connector. The wire directly next to the negative wire is the positive wire. The other 2 wires are not needed (they control speed and temperature and stuff that a computer would care about but are not needed for your setup).
thanks, sure do appreciate the help, i'm building a fermentation chiller that's 28" lg x 18" width x 30" tall.
David Allen Cool, sounds like a fun project. I have had a couple other guys email me about similar projects. Let me know if you have any more questions!
water cooler in the cool side is not a good idea! use the cooler you used in our first fridge inside!! believe me, you will get way better results
Ricardo Iarossi Why is it not a good idea? Not saying you are wrong but what makes it not work as well? In my testing it seems to work better.
LDSreliance because there are much more stuff to get cold until the coldness(does this word exists?) reach your fridge! make some tests using the watercooler outside and the normal cooler inside, i'm sure you will get better results.
Also, you can use 2 peltiers instead of one(knowing that you have 2 watercoolers and 2 conventional coolers). Sorry for my bad english
+Ricardo Iarossi Ricardo, couldn't the radiator cool the water that has already been cooled by the peltier even more? I might be completely wrong
im planning to make a peltier air conditioner
Very cool! Good luck
thx its going to be something similar to this but with only one radiator
+LDSreliance could these peltiers use alot of battery cause im planning to use a 8AH battery
Dean Settimi Yes, they use a lot of power. An 8AH battery will not last very long powering one of these.
Will adding another 8ah battery in parallel work
Do you sell the peltier??????
I don't but the the link to the parts should be in the video description.
i want to make large Peltier airconditioner
I started out wanting to do that, too. I gave up, though. I don't think this is a good application for an air conditioner of a large volume of air. It will only work well in small volumes that are well insulated.
Search for the fermentation friges.
Why not just use the nuts first, seems counter-intuitive to use mb standoffs instead of nuts.
Hendo420 You can use nuts if you have them or want to buy them. I just used standoffs because I had them and they were free.
using that type of power supply for this sort of project is very inefficient for a 12volt project
Maybe. But they are dirt cheap. What would you use?
it's pronounced Pel-tee- A
I know but that just sounds pretentious.
LDSreliance Perhaps, but that wasn't my intent. I apologize. I should have said, "This is an interesting video. Thanks for posting it. Just so you know, the TEC device is pronounced Pel-tee-A."
Yep, I mentioned that in one of my first peltier videos that it was pronounced pelteeay but that I was just going to say pelteer. I did get some comments but oh well. Maybe I will just call them TECs.