NASCAR has been and continues to be run by people who don't like racing and just want to make money from what they want racing to be. Racing to them is boring. That's why everything has to have an NFL equivalent, even down to terms they use. And they just have no respect for the owners anymore on top of that.
Depends on which set of NASCAR leaders you're referring to.... The current crop (Brian France before his departure, Lisa France Kennedy and Company, Elton Sawyer, Rick Hendrick, etc.) could give two ----- about the actual on-track product; they're more worried about the entertainment side of the sport. On the other hand, the late Big Bill (Bill France, Sr.) and Bill Jr. (Bill France, Jr.) actually both cared about the on-track product and cared about motor racing in general; I mean, Big Bill at one point or another had a hand in both IMSA and Trans-Am at their respective beginnings in the late 60's/early 70's and, by and large, didn't mind seeing some of their top stars head up to Indy to race in the 500 (unlike Hendrick's fit over Kyle Larson going this year). Those two (Sr. & Jr.) would have coronaries over the state of NASCAR nowadays....
@@MatthewLittle I wouldn't put Hendrick in the group with the higher ups in Nascar, he does like racing and is very much behind Larson for the 500. It's Nascar management that's the issue.
I'm baffled why in fuck's name NASCAR is aiming to beat NFL for ratings and everything, instead of Indy, sportscars, F1, Trans-Am for anything racing related. It's as sensible as if BTCC (British Touring Car Championship) was trying to beat British Premier League in ratings or everything. It made no freakin' sense.
@@MatthewLittle Big Bill also created Daytona International Speedway, initially for the NASCAR’s Daytona 500 race, he also let sportscar events ran there (including its Crown Jewel, the Daytona 24 Hours, previously run in 3Hr/2000Km format, also run in 6 Hour format during the oil crisis days in the early 70s) as well as motorbike races/testing . He even let USAC IndyCar roadsters raced the oval once in ‘59. Not only that, Big Bill inadvertently had a hand on the creation of Japan’s Fuji Speedway. A little more than 3 decades before Bill Jr. did expo NASCAR races in both Suzuka and Motegi in Japan, the Japan NASCAR Corporation was formed to hold a NASCAR-style stock car race in Japan, setting on creating a NASCAR-style oval with the Mt. Fuji as a backdrop (just above the town of Gotemba in Shizuoka Prefecture) after securing an exclusive contract for hosting stock car races. Initially Fuji Speedway was supposed to be a 2.5. Mile-long tri-oval like Daytona with big banks, chutes and a long straight. But, lack of funds (and Sir Stirling Moss’ doubts about the plausibility of the layout on the hilly terrain when visiting the course site) eventually made the contractors decided to turn the whole circuit into a road course circuit, forcing them to cancel the NASCAR contract. The resulting circuit at the time it was finished around ‘65-’66 is still a fearsomely blistering fast track , and the Daiichi banking section was notoriously dangerous especially when run in normal/clockwise direction, causing a bevy of fatal or near fatal crashes. The banked Daiichi corner was put out of commission after a heavy crash that killed 2 local star drivers in a Fuji GC race back in 1974. The circuit continues to host (mostly national level) races until today through several track alterations, chief of these being the great renovation in ‘03-’05 for F1’s return to Fuji in 2007-08.
I'm rooting for Reddick and 23XI to win it. I think it would be hilarious for nascar to hand MJ and the team the trophies while their in court. Other than that, I think Logano winning would unite all the fans against this playoff format. Not that nascar will listen.
I think Byron winning the title after getting away with the OEM cheating would be a better way to do that than Logano. Seems weird to say that, but it might be true.
@SpectralUmbreon197 I can at least respect Logano for knowing what he needed to do and move on. He did just enough in each round to move on. But I don't want to see a Chevy win it. To have an entire OEM coordinate teams is beyond unfair.
I don't get why you hate the format, just do what FIA doing and give them penalties like many other Motorsports, and I see Nascar getting real strict with penalties in 2025.
BEWARE of the NASCAR phantom caution. They like to do that when someone they don't like is winning. It shuffles the field so who was leading before the caution gets rotated deeper in the field. I've seen NASCAR pull this a TON over the years.
Wait a second..... there's some dude out there posting what a REAL nascar championship standings could/should be??? Much respect to that guy! Hated "the chase" since day 1, and havent watched since.
That’s pointless though. Teams race based on the points system. Under a different system teams and drivers would make different decisions, race differently, etc. it’s a fool’s errand to show how it’d be under a different system.
@@arwysskinda think the same thang too. Different system = different methods/points/ways/mindsets needed to tackle the championship. But let's face it, the full-season points format was the way to go for motorsports series, especially NASCAR. People just want to show what would've been if NASCAR kept the full-season points championship format instead of chase/playoffs.
I was one of those "ride or die" fans and now i just cant be bothered with it. That sport is just a shell of it's former self and it's heartbreaking to see the cup series and some of the lower series turn into such a shit show of a joke.
My "hate watch" reason for watching the NBC coverage used to be that if Earnhardt got excited and his voice went up an octave, you couldn't tell him and Burton apart.
None of the current drivers even know how to race without stage cautions, they proved that last year when NASCAR stopped throwing stage cautions at road courses...btw
@@bryonkidder6199 Yeah, it's weird to know that the new drivers like Elliot, Bowman, Reddick, Byron, Bell, etc. haven't raced much at all without stage races. I never thought of it that way.
I used to be a NASCAR lover and have been involved in various forms of motorsports my whole life. Our family used to spend Sundays in front of the tv watching the races. If we were racing on Sunday, we'd have MRN on the radio listening at the track. Ever since NASCAR went to the COT cars and the chase format, the racing has gone downhill. The basically turned NASCAR into a soap opera and created a bunch of fake drama. As a racing purist, I'd rather see the driver who is most consistent all year win the championship. I don't even watch the races anymore. Most of the time they just play follow the leader for 400 miles, and then they just start running over each other. It's shit racing. I really don't want to waste my life watching that. I now have a FloRacing subscription and really enjoy watching the dirt races. Those are the real drivers these days. Not a bunch of rich kids who had deep pockets to get to NASCAR. I hope MJ exposes NASCAR for what they have done to the sport. They've robbed the teams to enrich themselves for way too long. I don't blame him for taking them to court!
News alert. NASCAR hasn't been a real sport since its inception. It's always been run by PT Barnum types. It's a bunch of carnival barkers, hypesters and con men. Always has been...
The playoffs are garbage. The yellow flags during the race is also a stupid idea. You don’t get a car that will lap the field so there is no reason for that stupidity there must be big money in it.
Playoffs and stages are trash but yellow flags is a safety thing and has ALWAYS been a part of motor racing 😂 You need yellow flags. Imagine someone crashing and being stuck in the car for the rest of the race while people fly by you at 200mph. Think first then speak…
I've stopped watching NASCAR just recently. The Xfinity finish at the Roval was the straw that broke the camel's back. I'm done putting up with the terrible officiating, stupid playoffs, I unnecessary overtimes, and bullying sanctioning body.
One thing that really makes it difficult to watch...a lot of cars had a consistent sponsor / paint scheme. .now it is hard to find your favorite driver because the sponsor/ colors change so often.
Which is also a symptom of nascar’s decline. Cost to sponsor is going up, and no mainstream brands are willing to pay so much for continual limiting exposure. So, we get more one and done sponsors, more scam sponsors, you name it
I think that is one thing that will definitely hurt with casual fans and even more hardcore fans like me. Jaime Larson fan so it's actually very easy for me since he pretty much runs one paint scheme which is pretty rare nowadays. There are certain races where you will have absolutely no idea who is in which car One driver may run 10 completed cars in a season. That's bad for brand. Now, I don't know what the people running NASCAR can do about that
You're complaining about capitalism here. The reason Tide, Mello Yellow, Budweiser, and every other brand sponsor would spend 30million dollars to sponsor a car for the whole year. Was because fans could afford to go out of thier way to buy a specific brand name product just because they liked a guy who drove a car. Trickle down economics hadn't yet crushed them like it finally has today. These companies have more money than they've ever had. But when both your employees & customers can barely afford their mortgage, they stop going out of thier way jist because they like a guy who drives a car. It's also why you don't even really know what half the sponsors even do, the only place there's "disposable income" to spend now is in other businesss.
@@joshuapowers4623 I guess you've never heard of talk to text. Believe it or not, it'll change words. "I'm a" may end up turning into a word like Jaime.
Excellent video. Yes I understand that in 2003 Matt Kenseth won the championship with one win. Then the playoff started in 2004 and I hated it from day 1 . Sometimes the championship does not come down to the final race. The playoff has gotten worse and worse each year.
I don't even get why it's a bad thing that Kenseth did that. It could be the case that a driver doesn't even win one race an gets the championship. Leo Fornarolli did exactly that in F3 this year. I really don't get what's wring with it. Kenseth was very consistent, Newman retired a lot and lost the championship. Btw the playoffs don't guarantee of 2003 not happening again. Hemric won the Xfinity championship by only winning in Phoenix a couple years ago. If they wish yo make winning matter more, they could just as easily tweak the points system to reward winning more, like in F1.
That's what these crybaby NASCAR only "fans" won't get through their thick heads, if a driver wraps up the championship early it's because he earned it.
@@nickklavdianos5136 because the fans that refuse to watch other forms of racing don't like domination of a season and think that winning should be the only thing that matters in racing, instead of being incredibly consistent... I hope this court case goes to discovery. It will kill the sport. Then indycar can finally go to more tracks
As a comparison, I've been watching F1 since 1997 ... and out of the 27 seasons I've watched, the championship only went to the final race in 10 of them. and if you don't count years with long shots (03, 05 and 2012), then it's only 7 out of 27 with a realistic fight........ YET, I've been glued to F1's drama and the ups and downs fairly consistently every season. despite not having nail-biters every year, there's always storylines worth following - the small team punching above it's weight, the new rookie doing well, the old vet hanging on for one more season, the comeback kid, driver moves that didn't pan out ... there's always something! 1990s NASCAR was fantastic at creating season-long hype and keeping you invested all summer. It's so infuriating that they are blind to all this now.
I've been a NASCAR fan since I was 7 years old and I have given the sport so many chances, even though I disliked the format early on, but this season as a whole, and especially this Martinsville saga, was absolutely the final straw. The sport and even its drivers have no integrity or respect for themselves or the fans, and after 17 years of watching, I think Martinsville was my final NASCAR race I will likely ever watch. Its not the sport that 7 year old me once loved and adored anymore. Also, its funny how NASCAR's shitshows have only grown bigger and bigger since 23XI and Front Row decided to sue the sport. You'd think that NASCAR would be on their best behavior given that they're being sued, but I guess they'd rather die the death by a thousand cuts over their pack of lies than admit they were wrong.
I started watching Nascar casually this year, and I see Larson dominating in Nascar terms, winning the most races and somehow he is not able to win the championship? JOKE OF A FORMAT!
I didn't see him dominating. Few races? Bell and others did the same. Winning the most races is not what made the champion. In Winston Cup era when the field became more comptetitve it was usual that driver with the most wins was not the champion. Logano basically won 5 races. Larson just 6. Where is the difference?
@@kg0173One had about 8 more top 5 finishes 33 top 10 to 18 and over 1000 laps lead compared to Joey. I'm very very new to this one only because my cousin was with us so I watched, but I won't be doing that again it was such a joke. Wasn't it 7 wins for Larson and 4 for Logano who got most in the end when he should have been out in any common sense structure. They made this sport an NBA a season or MLB just to get by after ALMOST a meaningless season which racing doesn't feel like it should be that way. Which is why even those sports have gotten terrible and they much easier can justify it
@Brandon-Wit Logano beat Larson at key races. Larson made mistakes under pressure. At the end Logano was the best driver, won comfortably the final championship race. Everyone has the same rules and they knew them before the season. Whats more impressive that Logano did it without having the best/fastest car. Everybody knew that you should have the 100% performance at the final races, everybody knew that you have to win towards the seasons end, points would not do it.
Legal gamblinig on fixed races should be investigated. NASCAR is entertainment, not a sport. It is the show. I no longer go to races, sold my RV and uy merch from F1 and Indy Car. I voted with my money Of course I am not their target audience any more. It is like WWE about the show not the platform that supports the show (wrestling or racing).
I rather watch family feud or wipeout. Gameshows have more integrity than Nascar. I'd be pissed if I drove my arse off and instead of being a profeshional driver, I become a deuteragonist in an over budget soap opera like Nascar.
I'm totally done with the phony playoffs. I've been fed up with this system for awhile now. The manipulation at Martinsville should be the last straw for this system but we know it won't be due to "entertainment's" sake.
9:44 the man had a largely unmatched fitness regimen in stock car racing, possibly only matched by Carl Edwards. Half-assing anything doesn't win you seven championships.
I really hope logano wins it, and I'm far from a Penske fan. I really want the biggest amount of chaos and shitfuckery possible. This shitty system should be scrapped once and for all. Not once in my life I've been so disillusioned with this sport.
Only in death can this sport be saved. I’m a lifelong Joey fan I’ll be the first to say if he wins this Championship there’s no room for debate that the championship is undeserved. Honestly only better outcome would be if somehow Harrison Burton won the Championship.
I think peak shitfuckery would be Byron winning followed by Reddick. Would be funny if the NASCAR championship team was the one suing Nascar and losing their charter
@nikhook9430 thank you for admitting the fact that logano would be an undeserved champion. You are 1 of 1 when it comes to Logano fans in admitting that
@@RaleighRyan there only 3 deserving champions in there respective years in the playoff format that are not debatable. Martin Truex Jr 2017, Kyle Busch 2019, Kyle Larson 2021. Every other play off championship is debatable minus 2015 and 2018 where ironically enough those championships should be swapped. 2023 was near the edge of undeserving but if Logano wins it this year it’s truly as undeserving as Kyle Busch 2015 one is.
You're 100% correct. I used to go with a group every year (for 12 years) to Michigan and Indy. Nobody wanted to go the year after the stage racing began. Playoff format is a turnoff, also. Now, I just watch the highlights on TH-cam. The coverage is awful.
I already have apathy towards Nascar. I used to watch it regularly since when I was a kid, and a huge Bill Elliot fan back in the early 80's. I stopped watching regularly around when they introduced the "car of tomorrow". I've checked out a few races since then and have been completely bored to tears. To me, the stage thing and the playoff format really took any credibility the series had away. At this point I don't see any reason to pay any more attention to that shit show.
Say what you want about IndyCar, but it offers a hell of a better product than NASCAR these days. At least the IndyCar sanctioning body isn’t falling into the same traps that NASCAR did almost 20 years ago. At least IndyCar isn’t manipulating individual races with phantom debris cautions and green-checkered flags every 50 laps. At least IndyCar doesn’t have a goofy and convoluted “playoff” championship system which has sucked the life out of a once-proud racing series. Let’s say that in 10 years, IndyCar manages to gain ground on NASCAR. Don’t be surprised if that happens.
I hope it does, NASCAR puts out a poor product and doesn't deserve to be the most popular motorsport, IndyCar isn't perfect but I've never watched IndyCar and wished I hadn't, but countless NASCAR races I felt that way about.
Indycar has it's problems too. Charters, series owner also being a team owner and getting caught cheating, baffling decisions about venues, etc. I agree it's nowhere near as bad as Nascar but let's not pretend everything is rosy over there.
@@wingracer1614 Given Penske has ops in both NASCAR and IndyCar it wasn't all too surprising if he implements a NASCAR-style charter system on IndyCar racing. Penske is indeed the best team owner in the history of the US racing scene, but it seems that he wants the US racing scene in his chokehold. And it's not just in US, he also has ops outside US, like the Porsche Penske team in WEC and IMSA, as well as partial ownership of Dick Johnson Racing (DJR-Penske) in Supercars.
@@wingracer1614 I agree. Every racing series has it’s drama (F1 with Tyregate, Spygate and Crashgate; IndyCar with management and marketing). Ultimately they leave the racing untouched. That’s what makes them a more authentic product than NASCAR (who have done everything and anything to put their fingers on the scale) imo.
@@813sports5but F1 ran sprints though. I don't know about you, but I think sprint races just doesn't sit right with a world class racing series like F1. The only good thing was it serves as a warmup run for the race proper.
I think this wave started at Richmond with Austin Dillon and got louder after Daytona. (It did for me). Since those two events the playoffs have been in a really bad light and Martinsville broke the dam as Slapshoes would say. I think was is so frustrating to fans this year vs other years is NASCAR continues to ignore the glaring issues of this sport. They want to act like everything is fine when it’s clearly not. Much like the NFL every week it isn’t about the play on the field every year nascar racing is more about moments and less about competition.
The main reason I can’t watch the races is it feels like nascars goal throughout the race is to jumble up the running order throughout the race as often as they can. Just never feels like a legitimate race playing out
Get rid of the playoffs!. And the only way they will even consider getting rid of or tweaking it hard is if we have another Jimmie Johnson run and rips off 5 of these championships in a row because one thing NASCAR has made clear is they hate dominance. This format doesn’t reward consistency over the course of a whole season like a lot of playoff defenders like to say it does. Kevin Harvick proved it in 2020.
You can run like shit all regular season, win a random ass race, then win 3 races in the playoffs and come away the champion, it rewards being good at specific moments not the entire season.
@@Tylnorton exactly, a playoffs champion isn't a legit champion 99% of the time, Kyle Larson in 2021 was, other than that, Truex 2017, there's not been any legit champions since playoffs were implemented.
@@PaperBanjo64 Kyle's 2019 also has the case too. But yeah you're right. What sucks is those 3 drivers could have lost it all in one race too and thankfully they didn't. Still sucks others got screwed
I only got into NASCAR because of SVG, I'm sure a lot of folks here in Oceania are the same. We are confused about a lot of things and don't understand why things like stage cautions and the playoffs exist. And the more I watch the past few months the more it feels like "Racing Entertainment" a bit like WWE with "Sports Entertainment." It's even to the point I just have it as background noise too unless I hear something to do with SVG
I have a real hard time taking NASCAR seriously lol. Formula 1 and Indy car have their drama, but it's still all about the racing and strategy in the end. I will say the drama with the FIA over swearing is pretty damned funny lol.
The swearing drama was literally a lolfest tbh. It's not a cocksucking Japanese high school ffs, it's a motorsport paddock. They were all over 18, they know when or where not to cuss, and if they cuss on interviews, censorship (or apology from the announcers) should just suffice. But even then I doubt everyone wants the media to censor cusswords.
If Logano or Byron wins, fans riot against nascar If Blaney wins, fans delude themselves into nothing is wrong If Reddick wins, we have the most hilarious outcome of a championship in the history of motorsports
Exactly. Part of me does want Blaney to win because that is the closest thing to a legitimate outcome but at this point, give me a Byron or Reddick win instead because I just want to see the whole thing burn down.
Imagine telling fans in 2003 fans now want more consistancy out of their champion. It was fans complaining in 2003, Matt Kenseth, won the championship with one race win that brought about The Chase. No system is perfect, someone is going to complain.
As somebody who has been watching NASCAR since 1996 at the age of five, I can tell you that it feels more like a reality TV show today than it ever has. This really upsets me and I'm so concerned for the future. I really hope they settle out of court
NASCAR could make 3 relatively easy changes that would make everyone happy and keep the show going. 1, let teams build parts in house. It won't happen overnight but will help the teams over time. 2, share more of the TV revenues and 3, abolish the playoffs. That's LITERALLY all they need to do.
The more pressing issue is that Nascar's horrible decisions are rippling into other racing series. The Australian Supercars Championship is going to try out their own spin on Nascar Playoffs/Turismo Carretera Copa de Oro. The championship in Supercars will still stay sort of legitimate, as there's no ovals to fluke out wins, but still it's a horrible move. Not a single fan likes that idea, still Supercars pretend fans have been asking for just that.
Really baffling why Supercars and Turismo Carretera wanted to try such a brainrotten idea of doing some playoffs type of shit. Why any other race series are willing to copy NASCAR when they should've just learn from illegal street racing? The simpler permutations, the badassery, anything? The "first over the line wins" rule? This is why some people hates the word "Professional".
The key things about the Supercars format, in my opinion, are that: 1) The win-and-you're-in system, as far as I'm aware, won't be used as a qualifying mechanism for the Finals Series. It'll be the top 10 in the championship after the Bathurst 1000 regardless of the number of wins, so there's no equivalent of Burton making the Playoffs this season in NASCAR. There will be automatic spots for the winners of the 'Sprint Cup' (the first eight rounds, so it'll simply be the overall championship leader at that point) and the Enduro Cup (who will likely be a driver who's already in the top 10 anyway barring some chaos. To be fair, it's a pair of Enduros, chaos can happen, particularly at Bathurst). Win-and-you're-in will however be used at the Gold Coast and Sandown, the 'Round of 10 and the 'Round of 7' so to speak. 2) There are multiple races in a weekend in Supercars (barring the two Enduros which are just one race), so Surfers Paradise has two races, Sandown has two races and in the final round in Adelaide the title contenders will fight it out over three races rather than just one. So a driver who has a poor race relative to his rivals actually has a chance to respond, it's not purely a winner-takes-all like the Championship race in NASCAR. Although a poor race will still likely be very damaging to his championship prospects. I don't like that Supercars have decided to use a NASCAR-style format, but I'm willing to give it a shot. I reckon there could be some NASCAR-style chicanery though.
I'm a British F1 viewer who has very little knowledge of NASCAR outside the fact J-P Montoya and Kimi Raikkonen raced in it, and there was a female driver who became a meme. That was really interesting to watch without context as it sounds a mess, with the sort of manufactured nonsense you see in 'reality' TV shows. And of course, Formula 1 has it's own anti trust issues since Liberty Media run that sport. Andretti has taken them to court, and the concert ticket side has been taken to court as well.
My personal opinion there is to much racing every weekend. From February to November let's cut it 30 races more people would watch. It gets a little old every weekend and boring, some of the older driver may stay around a little longer. Just my opinion thank you David for the information God Bless
My nascar wishlist top 5 1. Up the horsepower 2. Split the road course and oval packages into two entirely different setups (For Example: with Ovals get rid of the diffuser) 3. Get rid of stage cautions 4. Get rid of the current points system 5. Rework the driving standard rule book.
I'm 77 years old. Been an avid Nascar fan since 1978. I stopped watching completely this year because I found myself not having anyone to root for but so many to root against. I don't like that in myself so I stopped watching it all together.
The reason Nascar is mad at the teams for manipulation.... They don't like the competition. Cautions of convenience have been a part of Nascar for the 4 decades I watched it.
I was born the year the Chase/Playoff format was introduced, grew up 10 minutes away from Michigan International, going to my local track Butler every Saturday with RaceDay playing every Sunday morning eating breakfast while my Dad and I would talk about the race that weekend. Nascar was the series that got me into racing and something that I grew up with alongside the Tigers and Red Wings. Since Carl Edwards' sudden retirement I've moved on to other forms of racing like going to the Norwalk Nationals in 2014/15 Belle Isle in 2016/17/18/19 and falling in love with IndyCar, Which soon after was how I found this channel. Me, Dad and my grandfather stopped watching Nascar in 2017 all together and just focused on local and/or Indycar. They've been fans of the sport since birth and seen the Winston and the birth of the Nextel system. Since 2020, I've tried to listen to races. Sometimes hoping in halfway with a group of friends on Discord or just watching channels like SlapShoes, Ericstepp, and RadMan to keep up to date on whats going on. The only race that I watched in the cup series from green flag to finish was the return to the Brickyard (which as a return and feel good anniversary event) was ruined by bad officiating plus thanks to the rules stating that a race must end under green. We could've got a great ending with Brad, Ryan, and Kyle battling it out and both Ford drivers stretching everything they could fuel wise. Yet, Briscoe lost it and couldn't get it going bringing out a caution before the white. I did not watch this year's Daytona 500 which was the first time I've ever done that. The only time I felt good at the end of the season was when Larson won it in 2021 with how much wins and good he was that season. Another example being last season with Ryan winning. I've always been a fan of his due to Dave Blaney being a big dirt track guy, yet I still felt upset cause I knew he wasn't the best that season. The moment I started questioning the system was when "Spin-gate" and Newman bumping Larson in the last turn. These the reasons why I'll never take Nascar seriously ever again. I might start to if they get rid of the format or even have the Nextel era just with stage and points counted but with more points going towards wins. Nascar will never be the same to me and others due to that.
8:20 you hit the nail on the head with me turning off the race in reference to Joseph. He will whine about the same thing he will do, and backing into championship is just too much to handle any longer.
Great video David. It really underscores a lot of thing I've been feeling as a tenetive nascar fan and huge racing fan. I attended this year's Brickyard and had a great time. It left me hyped to see where the season went. However its just been an oddity of a series from an officiating perspective at every race I've seen and from what I can glean from nascar history that's always been an element of the series reputation. Yet I really cant shake the notion that Cup has become a prefabricated show that is beholden to the ROI of the France family. At Indy just seeing the huge freight team shops and knowing the Frances are getting a cut was sickening, especially when at any other race those team shops are fairly grassroots organizations. Great vid as usual. Keep it up
I start to watch. But then get distracted and then don't even care if I go back and watch the rest of the race.My late wife and I went to several races over the years. Now I try to get to local drag strips for no prep racing.
In regards to the points format, I’d prefer to see it go back to a season-long format, but keep the points the same as they are now, because it makes a lot more sense. 1pt per position (with the exception of the 5pts between 1st and 2nd), 1pt for leading a lap, 5pts for leading the most laps. Hell, keep the stages if you want, but stop throwing the cautions, or stop counting the laps run under stage cautions.
Modern Nascar is a hollow imitation of what it once was. I knew it was over when Charlotte sports radio doesn't really cover it anymore and its home to most of the teams.
Indycar and Formula 1 are still interesting to watch with 1 race left to go and the champions decided..(Palou&Verstappen).. go to a points championship and end the stages
Indycar and F1 don't come close to NASCAR for TV ratings in the US. For NASCAR to abandon the playoffs they would have to sell the TV networks on it as well and there's no way a TV executive will want to follow the lead of other series that can't do the same kind of numbers
@@dylansmock4876NASCAR is chasing down NFL in ratings, that's why their ratings tends to be higher than F1 and Indy, even higher than IMSA. But we've seen the downside of that fact in how they run the races.
Either Reddick wins this season and pisses off NASCAR with having to give the team suing them, or Logano wins, and fans all collectively say what's on everyone's mind at this stupid system...or they just stop watching to get it through their minds. 50/50 shot here.
Byron would bring talks of the Martinsville race manipulation to the forefront. Blaney would be best for Nascar's interests, so as much as I like him I hope it's one of the others.
I hit the "apathy" stage several years ago. I had been watching NASCAR since the 70's. But the current format with stages and the playoffs I just don't care for. When they first announced using stages, I thought it might work and be something like heat races. But for me anyway, it didn't do that. This year I bet I have watched less than 10 laps of total NASCAR. Meanwhile, I watch as much F1 (even when it was boring) and IndyCar as I can.
To me, the chase in 2004 was the diagnosis there was a problem with leadership, the COT car was a terminal diagnosis, and the playoff and gen 6 car was the death nail in the coffin for me. And oh god the stage racing… that’s the bitter post mortem
Bell was the champion under the Formula 1 format and Winston format. Those reward consistency. Which is what racing is all about. It’s not about “Game 7’s.” When will they ever learn that. I was a big fan but after my driver Bell has been screwed so many times I’m just about finished.
The biggest thing stopping me from enjoying NASCAR isn’t anywhere on the radar as far as problem: the constant, incessant off track fights and drama and deliberate wrecking of opponents. It’s so trashy lol
You are right on David I am an older guy my first Nascar race was 1967 went to Daytona every race for years and I personally got disgusted with them around 2006 haven't been to a race since I have said that Nascar won't be around in a few years
The last time I watched Nascar regularly was in 2018. After the insult that was the 2019 car, I tuned out and haven't been back since. I'll watch the Daytona 500 and the occasional notable race, but I'm not watching any of the other races.
I'm an open wheel fan first. Indy Car, USAC and winged Sprint cars are what I love to watch. One thing I like about those forms of racing is that there are no guaranteed starting spots in the races. I think the fact that a F1 Champion running for McLaren or that Penske Racing failed to qualify for the Indy 500 makes that race and series so much more intriguing than just handing out starting spots like NASCAR does. I also like that if the race is 500 miles, you turn the laps for 500 miles, not 506 miles. I also think the Champion should be the person that scores the most points throughout the whole season. All the series are so close these days that there will be a close championship and the end of the season. I could go on, but the bottom line is that manufactured excitement through gimmicks like stage racing will never keeps peoples attention in the long run. I really hope Indycar is paying attention because every NASCAR fan lost should be an Indycar fan gained!
Don’t forget that this guaranteed starting-slot crap started with Tony “Dips**t”George and his new IRL back in 1996. Regarding the 1996 Indy 500: “Most of the top teams and drivers in Indy car racing remained with CART, and protested over a perceived lockout because of 1996 model-year chassis not being approved and the introduction of the '25/8 Rule', which guaranteed 25 spots in the field for the best performing IRL entries in previous races.” And IndyCar has just adopted a charter system similar to NASCAR’s: “INDYCAR confirmed today the establishment of a charter system across the NTT INDYCAR SERIES. In total, owners of 10 teams have accepted charters for 25 entries competing in North America’s premier open-wheel racing series, beginning immediately.” - IndyCar News, Sept. 23, 2024
I enjoy being at a NASCAR race,in person, in the moment, because honestly there's not much else like it. But I do not like how much they messed up the race and championship scoring format. "Cautions breed Cautions" that's the problem with stage racing. Good thing the cars are as safe as they are, they could not pull these shenanigans at the turn of the century or prior, but nothing's ever 100%, they're always playing with fire...
Your right. I have watched every lap since being a kid, I'm 30, and just shut it off the last couple weeks because 3 of the best 4 drivers got left out of the final 4. They've made the championship into some bs lucky thing, similar to what the Daytona 500 has become.
Yeah when Wrecky Spinhouse wins a 212 lap Daytona "500" you know the race is a crap shoot, this year's was embarrassing with the half throttle fuel saving! That's NOT racing! I'd rather see a single file line logging laps than packs with no passing and everyone running 20 MPH off the pace.
Excellent video David, and you're spot on. I have been saying this for the last few years; THIS IS NOT the NASCAR I grew up with, and loved back in my day (1990s to early 2000s), this whole sport has been MEMEcar since about 2010. It's partially the sanctions fault for incepting the following: The Chase / Playoff points win and your in, and knockout format, the below the yellow line rule, STAGE RACING, and the 3 Green-White-Checkered attempts, making this type of racing a JOKE. But the main problem I have with this sport: THE DRIVERS: and it's NOT all of them neither, it's more like 95-98% of the drivers across all 4 divisions: ARCA, Trucks, Xfinity, and Cup, that don't use their heads most of the time, drive way over their heads, and do nothing but wreck it up with 2 laps to go coming to the white flag everytime they go to Daytona or Talladega (the 2 tracks that were considered my favorite tracks back in my day) THIS type of racing may or will eventually get someone killed by all their carlessness they show everytime they go to those 2 venues. THAT is absolutey inexcusable that NASCAR keeps this going on. Because you know what? THEY don't care about the fans, and haven't for the last few years now. Sure back in my day we didn't have 25 or more cars finish on the lead lap, sure back in my day we didn't have a close points finish every year, sure we had races that ended under yellow at times, and sure back in that time we had race winners that lapped the field. and you know why? because they let the drivers race the races, they let the drivers race for the championship (even if it meant winning it by 200 or 300 points) and the best part about that racing was ALL WAS FAIR, even if your driver didn't win the race, big deal, there was always next race. And I'm sorry, but today's fans are being spoiled by this type of this so called "NASCAR Racing" and all their manufactured drama they've had for quite some time, and they all call us boring, or hate our type or racing, or fall on deaf ears if we even try to mention how it used to be. I know I haven't watched or cared about NASCAR much since 2014, because of all those reasons I mentioned, but it also doesn't mean I didn't have to let this all out. It's because I wanna see it change for the better (which it hasn't for a long time) and I am concerned about the safety of the drivers (whether I like 'em or not) I don't wanna see 'em hurt or killed because of someone else's stupidity or carless driving on the plate tracks, sure we may not bring the legends back, and I'm aware of that, but this has all gone too far. Sorry for this rant, but I had to get that off my chest
I been watching nascar since 1987,it’s no longer a sport,it’s entertainment.nascar has s sold its soul to the television networks,so they can make as much money as they can.The racing is manipulated every week,it’s just a joke,and don’t get me started on the commercials,third of the race is commercials.Nascar has let the television networks,ruin their sport for cold hard cash.its really that simple
I have watched nascar for 40+ years. I have quit watching it once in a while due to frustration with the games being played by nascar. I have always came back to watch, less every time. I am so disgusted with myself for wasting my time by watching any nascar race these days. I’ve gotten to the point I don’t even want to hear anything about nascar. I want to love NASCAR like I used to, I just can’t anymore. It’s just like politics, no matter what the people(fans) say they want the governing body just doesn’t care.The only way to make them listen is to not participate in what they are doing. The only thing we can do is to not watch NASCAR. After all the opposite of love is not hate, it’s INDIFFERENCE. That’s where I’m at now, don’t even care. If I don’t like someone I just stay away from them, totally. No races, no media of any kind dealing with NASCAR. Really, it’s just a waste of time now.
I'm done with nascar. The politics of nascar are not what I want to see in a sport I loved . I will not be watching next year . Nascar is a monopoly and pin drivers and teams into some really unfair situations. The racing is not great despite media drumming it up .I race and just can't stomach nascar anymore .
I went from a die-hard to a casual over the last 10 years. The Chase, COT, Rockingham, spingate, reduced horsepower/tapered spacers, Next Gen, now this charter agreement, I'm getting damn close to being totally done. I'm glad that Front Row and 23XI are picking up where the original Kentucky Speedway lawsuit left off. That was the last time anyone actually challenged the sanctioning body, and they just got dragged through continuance after continuance until they just settled. The sport reaped tons of rewards on the backs of so many, to not realize that the pool is finite and the well is drying is foolish. This was always the world NASCAR was headed to when the charter system started to gain value. The teams realize there is power and sadly too many balked at the thought of having to actually fight the series to get the right things done. As for the Joey story, he's a talented driver on a hell of a team who plays the format perfectly. It's just people being mad because their driver isn't doing it, and from the sound of his press conference yesterday, the fact he's a massive suck-up doesn't help matters.
NASCAR runs off of controversy and fines. I record 80% of races and only watch the final stage. Races are too long. The playoffs do not reward wins like they should. The whole concept is absurd and needs an overhaul
I agree with the entire playoff comment. I've been against it since the first year in 2004 and witnessed how dumb it was. It hasn't been improved upon, they've only doubled down on it over and over in the name of "entertainment." Racing should not need this inserted into it. They've stripped most of the strategy with the stages. I do hope they figure something out before it gets worse. They do need to realize that this lawsuit that involves someone arguably more famous than they are in Michael Jordan, doesn't look good. I'm just glad I got to witness the hayday in the 80s and 90s, that was a good time for racing.
I refuse to believe the Joey Laggano has just as many championships as Lee Petty, Cale Yarborough, David Pearson, Darrell Waltrip and even Tony Stewart.
Baseball players like to say, I don't care what the umpire's strike zone is as long as it is consistent. NASCAR enforces rules like a constantly changing strike zone. It gives the fans the impression that NASCAR is scripting the race. Like Martinsville, they needed to get a Chevy into the final four.
David, well said, I used to watch Nascar every now and then but now it is never. No other racing series breaks their races up into three sections and allows everyone to catch up. That is absurd. Engineers can work around anything given the challenge and tires is one such challenge. The playoff system is ridiculous and speaks to a constant attempt to stay relevant but it is just confusing and silly and speaks to a desire to use American sports terminology. Just run a championship like every other series. Less races, shorter races, allow contact (the cars are as safe as tanks). Come to think of it even "the big one" at Daytona isn't something you fear, just a bunch of tanks spinning and squealing. David, the one word you carefully didn't use - Nascar is boring.
Im 35 and have been a NASCAR fan since 1997. Its hard to see the sport in its current state, but it's not surprising to me. I agree 100% with what you said. I typically get stuff done around the house then start watching an hour or two after start time and speed past all the commercials and stage breaks and it makes it more entertaining to watch.
With recent statements from NASCAR about playoffs not going anywhere. That means they are not listening. Here's what NASCAR needs to learn, we have options now. This isn't 1984 where they were the only game in town. We have access to dirt racing from across the country. I'd rather watch sprint cars, indy, f1, or any other form of motorsports rather than a sanctioning body that doesn't care about me. I loathe the playoff system, i loathe stage racing.
They don't care what fans think as far as the playoffs They are willing to change the format of the playoffs though. You're not getting it through your little head NASCAR is in the entertainment business
@@johnhaas2523 yeah NASCAR is in the entertainment business, but I will decide where to spend my entertainment dollars, as will others. I'm not sure if you were insulting me with the "get it through my little head" comment or not, though.
*There is one thing you forgot to mention:* The primary reason that people are up in arms over Logano being in the final four is because of the Alex Bowman DQ that Hendrick Motorsports did *not* appeal. For once HMS literally had a case & did not go through with it, because it was Alex Bowman & not Kyle Larson. If this was against Larson (And _maybe_ Byron), that appeal would've been filed that night. Logano got in to the Round of 8 based off that, then won the first race in the round to get a bye into the final four, making fans even more upset at Hendrick/Jeff Gordon for guinea pigging Bowman like they did, as well as Logano by proxy because he was the beneficiary of Hendrick's/Gordon's negligence.
@FlightData101 There was video evidence of something coming out of Bowman's car when he went over the last curb at one point during the roval race. That piece of the car coming off is what made the car "underweight."
I stopped watching NASCAR in the 80’s, because things weren’t natural, endings were determined or at least attempted. It was my biggest fear when IMSA went under their thumb.
That's why NASCAR IS a monopoly, they blocked IndyCar when the series was ready to give them big bucks to race at Homestead they said no, and NASCAR didn't care if PJ1 had negative effects on IndyCar but they weren't gonna ruin the track with it for their own open wheel series, the modifieds.
11:40 With regards to the NWC points account, I was saying last year that this system doesn't make stars. You could have made a star out of Buescher who was sitting 3rd in points and pretty freaking competitive. Does anybody remember how well he drove last year? No, of course not.
the problem isn't the points themselves, it's the playoff, you can argue that the current system does reward winning unlike the latford system, right now you'd have larson with raw speed and elliott with consistency sitting 1-2, and if you look at the rest of the standings you see those different paths play out, of course none of this matter at the end since we'll be stuck with the playoff format until something cataclysmic happens
NASCAR definitely reeks of antitrust violations. They have lost their integrity with true race fans. Selective officiating to create drama. The stage racing format is a joke! I propose NASCAR should have the final race of the season at Talladega or Daytona! Kudos to Joey Logano and Penske on success with playing the game!
I used to love watching Nascar but when they introduced this stupid playoff system I hated it from day one I was ok with the 2004 chase for cup but for the love of god bring back the Winston Cup Era of Nascar
Former die hard fan here. Still watch a lot of races. Nothing feels like it has real stakes or matters anymore. Once football started I haven’t watched a race over it in a few years. Only a couple races a year are worth watching. Daytona, Kansas, Bristol, 600 and I’ll always love the Glen
I stopped watching Nascar around 2010. Right around the CoT going full time. Ive recently tried to get back into it. I enjoy listening to content surrounding Nascar, but cant watch a full race. I feel like teenage me had made the right decision.
Debate the racing, cars, stage racing, over burdensome rule book, points system, playoffs, etc.,. While all true, the number one complaint I have is that the entire broadcast...everything from the pre race show, pit reports, COMMERCIALS, broadcast team, after show EVERYTHING is marketed to woke SJW's. Core NASCAR fans are not only ignored, it's obvious that NASCAR Marketing would be happier if they would just go away.
I agree with most of your points, David. But now Indycar is going down the same path. They are implementing charters. They are restricting the field size to only allow the selected owners to compete. After Prema, I don't think there will ever be a new team entering the sport. Indycar also owns the open wheel development series. If Michael Jordan is successful in court, how long until an Indycar team files an antitrust suit?
I think Indycar will be a different environment. The owners in Indycar wanted the charter system. What they also did was worth with the series to get a system that will work for them. The owners in NASCAR paid lip service to it and then they just dropped it on the table and said "Take it or leave it, you have the rest of today to sign" . Entirely different scenarios
NASCAR wants to control everything but the teams (and fans) literally pay the price for NASCAR’s mistakes. Also, it is very easy to manipulate viewership numbers especially when teams and sponsors are beholden to contracts wherein they agree they can’t sue NASCAR.
NASCAR has been and continues to be run by people who don't like racing and just want to make money from what they want racing to be. Racing to them is boring. That's why everything has to have an NFL equivalent, even down to terms they use. And they just have no respect for the owners anymore on top of that.
Depends on which set of NASCAR leaders you're referring to....
The current crop (Brian France before his departure, Lisa France Kennedy and Company, Elton Sawyer, Rick Hendrick, etc.) could give two ----- about the actual on-track product; they're more worried about the entertainment side of the sport.
On the other hand, the late Big Bill (Bill France, Sr.) and Bill Jr. (Bill France, Jr.) actually both cared about the on-track product and cared about motor racing in general; I mean, Big Bill at one point or another had a hand in both IMSA and Trans-Am at their respective beginnings in the late 60's/early 70's and, by and large, didn't mind seeing some of their top stars head up to Indy to race in the 500 (unlike Hendrick's fit over Kyle Larson going this year). Those two (Sr. & Jr.) would have coronaries over the state of NASCAR nowadays....
@@MatthewLittle I wouldn't put Hendrick in the group with the higher ups in Nascar, he does like racing and is very much behind Larson for the 500. It's Nascar management that's the issue.
I'm baffled why in fuck's name NASCAR is aiming to beat NFL for ratings and everything, instead of Indy, sportscars, F1, Trans-Am for anything racing related. It's as sensible as if BTCC (British Touring Car Championship) was trying to beat British Premier League in ratings or everything. It made no freakin' sense.
@@MatthewLittle Big Bill also created Daytona International Speedway, initially for the NASCAR’s Daytona 500 race, he also let sportscar events ran there (including its Crown Jewel, the Daytona 24 Hours, previously run in 3Hr/2000Km format, also run in 6 Hour format during the oil crisis days in the early 70s) as well as motorbike races/testing . He even let USAC IndyCar roadsters raced the oval once in ‘59.
Not only that, Big Bill inadvertently had a hand on the creation of Japan’s Fuji Speedway. A little more than 3 decades before Bill Jr. did expo NASCAR races in both Suzuka and Motegi in Japan, the Japan NASCAR Corporation was formed to hold a NASCAR-style stock car race in Japan, setting on creating a NASCAR-style oval with the Mt. Fuji as a backdrop (just above the town of Gotemba in Shizuoka Prefecture) after securing an exclusive contract for hosting stock car races. Initially Fuji Speedway was supposed to be a 2.5. Mile-long tri-oval like Daytona with big banks, chutes and a long straight. But, lack of funds (and Sir Stirling Moss’ doubts about the plausibility of the layout on the hilly terrain when visiting the course site) eventually made the contractors decided to turn the whole circuit into a road course circuit, forcing them to cancel the NASCAR contract. The resulting circuit at the time it was finished around ‘65-’66 is still a fearsomely blistering fast track , and the Daiichi banking section was notoriously dangerous especially when run in normal/clockwise direction, causing a bevy of fatal or near fatal crashes. The banked Daiichi corner was put out of commission after a heavy crash that killed 2 local star drivers in a Fuji GC race back in 1974. The circuit continues to host (mostly national level) races until today through several track alterations, chief of these being the great renovation in ‘03-’05 for F1’s return to Fuji in 2007-08.
@@RazorSharp75426 They aren't.
I'm rooting for Reddick and 23XI to win it. I think it would be hilarious for nascar to hand MJ and the team the trophies while their in court. Other than that, I think Logano winning would unite all the fans against this playoff format. Not that nascar will listen.
I think Byron winning the title after getting away with the OEM cheating would be a better way to do that than Logano. Seems weird to say that, but it might be true.
@SpectralUmbreon197 I can at least respect Logano for knowing what he needed to do and move on. He did just enough in each round to move on. But I don't want to see a Chevy win it. To have an entire OEM coordinate teams is beyond unfair.
it would actually make sense from a defense point of view, as it would be a way to show court that they're a "fair organization"
I don't get why you hate the format, just do what FIA doing and give them penalties like many other Motorsports, and I see Nascar getting real strict with penalties in 2025.
BEWARE of the NASCAR phantom caution. They like to do that when someone they don't like is winning. It shuffles the field so who was leading before the caution gets rotated deeper in the field. I've seen NASCAR pull this a TON over the years.
Wait a second..... there's some dude out there posting what a REAL nascar championship standings could/should be??? Much respect to that guy! Hated "the chase" since day 1, and havent watched since.
The first dude come to mind in that matter was Jarrett, aka The Iceberg.
Yeah, The Iceberg posts weekly Winston Cup point standings on his TH-cam channel community page for the last few years.
Same
That’s pointless though. Teams race based on the points system. Under a different system teams and drivers would make different decisions, race differently, etc. it’s a fool’s errand to show how it’d be under a different system.
@@arwysskinda think the same thang too. Different system = different methods/points/ways/mindsets needed to tackle the championship. But let's face it, the full-season points format was the way to go for motorsports series, especially NASCAR. People just want to show what would've been if NASCAR kept the full-season points championship format instead of chase/playoffs.
I was one of those "ride or die" fans and now i just cant be bothered with it. That sport is just a shell of it's former self and it's heartbreaking to see the cup series and some of the lower series turn into such a shit show of a joke.
Same here man
I gave up when they introduced the Green-White-Wreckers
Yeah, it's becoming the WWE.
My "hate watch" reason for watching the NBC coverage used to be that if Earnhardt got excited and his voice went up an octave, you couldn't tell him and Burton apart.
I like Jeff Burton and Dale Jr but they sound too much alike
I kinda miss the "screaming squirrels" - when you could not tell who was who.
Honestly, stages and the playoff system have ruined the season for me.
None of the current drivers even know how to race without stage cautions, they proved that last year when NASCAR stopped throwing stage cautions at road courses...btw
@@bryonkidder6199
Yeah, it's weird to know that the new drivers like Elliot, Bowman, Reddick, Byron, Bell, etc. haven't raced much at all without stage races. I never thought of it that way.
@@bryonkidder6199 they stopped? That’s at least a step in the right direction.
In typical nascar fashion, they added stage cautions back to road courses after only 1 year lmao
I used to be a NASCAR lover and have been involved in various forms of motorsports my whole life. Our family used to spend Sundays in front of the tv watching the races. If we were racing on Sunday, we'd have MRN on the radio listening at the track. Ever since NASCAR went to the COT cars and the chase format, the racing has gone downhill. The basically turned NASCAR into a soap opera and created a bunch of fake drama. As a racing purist, I'd rather see the driver who is most consistent all year win the championship. I don't even watch the races anymore. Most of the time they just play follow the leader for 400 miles, and then they just start running over each other. It's shit racing. I really don't want to waste my life watching that. I now have a FloRacing subscription and really enjoy watching the dirt races. Those are the real drivers these days. Not a bunch of rich kids who had deep pockets to get to NASCAR. I hope MJ exposes NASCAR for what they have done to the sport. They've robbed the teams to enrich themselves for way too long. I don't blame him for taking them to court!
Really enjoy flo as well. 410 racing is entering into another golden era for sure
NASCAR isn’t a real sport. Hasn’t been in about 20 years.
Your take is spot on.
*23
News alert. NASCAR hasn't been a real sport since its inception. It's always been run by PT Barnum types. It's a bunch of carnival barkers, hypesters and con men. Always has been...
Agree. I just made similar comments.
I’m a Larson fan. After last week, having won 6 races, he is OUT of the chase? It’s ridiculous. The Chase is stupid!
The playoffs are garbage. The yellow flags during the race is also a stupid idea. You don’t get a car that will lap the field so there is no reason for that stupidity there must be big money in it.
Playoffs and stages are trash but yellow flags is a safety thing and has ALWAYS been a part of motor racing 😂
You need yellow flags. Imagine someone crashing and being stuck in the car for the rest of the race while people fly by you at 200mph. Think first then speak…
I've stopped watching NASCAR just recently. The Xfinity finish at the Roval was the straw that broke the camel's back. I'm done putting up with the terrible officiating, stupid playoffs, I unnecessary overtimes, and bullying sanctioning body.
Yet you’re still watching and commenting on NASCAR videos… seems like you’re not REALLY done.
One thing that really makes it difficult to watch...a lot of cars had a consistent sponsor / paint scheme. .now it is hard to find your favorite driver because the sponsor/ colors change so often.
Which is also a symptom of nascar’s decline. Cost to sponsor is going up, and no mainstream brands are willing to pay so much for continual limiting exposure. So, we get more one and done sponsors, more scam sponsors, you name it
I think that is one thing that will definitely hurt with casual fans and even more hardcore fans like me.
Jaime Larson fan so it's actually very easy for me since he pretty much runs one paint scheme which is pretty rare nowadays.
There are certain races where you will have absolutely no idea who is in which car
One driver may run 10 completed cars in a season. That's bad for brand. Now, I don't know what the people running NASCAR can do about that
You're complaining about capitalism here. The reason Tide, Mello Yellow, Budweiser, and every other brand sponsor would spend 30million dollars to sponsor a car for the whole year. Was because fans could afford to go out of thier way to buy a specific brand name product just because they liked a guy who drove a car. Trickle down economics hadn't yet crushed them like it finally has today. These companies have more money than they've ever had. But when both your employees & customers can barely afford their mortgage, they stop going out of thier way jist because they like a guy who drives a car. It's also why you don't even really know what half the sponsors even do, the only place there's "disposable income" to spend now is in other businesss.
@@Ka_Ggcan't be much of a fan, there is no NASCAR driver named Jaime Larson
@@joshuapowers4623 I guess you've never heard of talk to text. Believe it or not, it'll change words. "I'm a" may end up turning into a word like Jaime.
I loved NASCAR until the late 90's. The stages, the competition yellows, and the playoffs have made it a shell of what it once was.
Excellent video. Yes I understand that in 2003 Matt Kenseth won the championship with one win. Then the playoff started in 2004 and I hated it from day 1 . Sometimes the championship does not come down to the final race. The playoff has gotten worse and worse each year.
You think NASCAR has that kind of turn around time? The fuck
I don't even get why it's a bad thing that Kenseth did that.
It could be the case that a driver doesn't even win one race an gets the championship. Leo Fornarolli did exactly that in F3 this year.
I really don't get what's wring with it.
Kenseth was very consistent, Newman retired a lot and lost the championship.
Btw the playoffs don't guarantee of 2003 not happening again. Hemric won the Xfinity championship by only winning in Phoenix a couple years ago.
If they wish yo make winning matter more, they could just as easily tweak the points system to reward winning more, like in F1.
That's what these crybaby NASCAR only "fans" won't get through their thick heads, if a driver wraps up the championship early it's because he earned it.
@@nickklavdianos5136 because the fans that refuse to watch other forms of racing don't like domination of a season and think that winning should be the only thing that matters in racing, instead of being incredibly consistent... I hope this court case goes to discovery. It will kill the sport. Then indycar can finally go to more tracks
As a comparison, I've been watching F1 since 1997 ... and out of the 27 seasons I've watched, the championship only went to the final race in 10 of them. and if you don't count years with long shots (03, 05 and 2012), then it's only 7 out of 27 with a realistic fight........ YET, I've been glued to F1's drama and the ups and downs fairly consistently every season. despite not having nail-biters every year, there's always storylines worth following - the small team punching above it's weight, the new rookie doing well, the old vet hanging on for one more season, the comeback kid, driver moves that didn't pan out ... there's always something!
1990s NASCAR was fantastic at creating season-long hype and keeping you invested all summer. It's so infuriating that they are blind to all this now.
I've been a NASCAR fan since I was 7 years old and I have given the sport so many chances, even though I disliked the format early on, but this season as a whole, and especially this Martinsville saga, was absolutely the final straw. The sport and even its drivers have no integrity or respect for themselves or the fans, and after 17 years of watching, I think Martinsville was my final NASCAR race I will likely ever watch. Its not the sport that 7 year old me once loved and adored anymore. Also, its funny how NASCAR's shitshows have only grown bigger and bigger since 23XI and Front Row decided to sue the sport. You'd think that NASCAR would be on their best behavior given that they're being sued, but I guess they'd rather die the death by a thousand cuts over their pack of lies than admit they were wrong.
“We don’t PLAY racing, there’s no playing going on” lmao that’s a great line
Racing aint sportsball! It is not a kids game!
I liked chase better.
I started watching Nascar casually this year, and I see Larson dominating in Nascar terms, winning the most races and somehow he is not able to win the championship? JOKE OF A FORMAT!
You are a "quick study" and that's a legit compliment. You get it. I welcome you to the sport and I hope you'll stay.
Larson has more points and twice the wins of any driver. Hoping he wins Phoenix and make it his seventh of the season.
I didn't see him dominating. Few races? Bell and others did the same. Winning the most races is not what made the champion. In Winston Cup era when the field became more comptetitve it was usual that driver with the most wins was not the champion. Logano basically won 5 races. Larson just 6. Where is the difference?
@@kg0173One had about 8 more top 5 finishes 33 top 10 to 18 and over 1000 laps lead compared to Joey. I'm very very new to this one only because my cousin was with us so I watched, but I won't be doing that again it was such a joke. Wasn't it 7 wins for Larson and 4 for Logano who got most in the end when he should have been out in any common sense structure. They made this sport an NBA a season or MLB just to get by after ALMOST a meaningless season which racing doesn't feel like it should be that way. Which is why even those sports have gotten terrible and they much easier can justify it
@Brandon-Wit Logano beat Larson at key races. Larson made mistakes under pressure. At the end Logano was the best driver, won comfortably the final championship race. Everyone has the same rules and they knew them before the season. Whats more impressive that Logano did it without having the best/fastest car. Everybody knew that you should have the 100% performance at the final races, everybody knew that you have to win towards the seasons end, points would not do it.
Legal gamblinig on fixed races should be investigated. NASCAR is entertainment, not a sport. It is the show. I no longer go to races, sold my RV and uy merch from F1 and Indy Car. I voted with my money Of course I am not their target audience any more. It is like WWE about the show not the platform that supports the show (wrestling or racing).
I rather watch family feud or wipeout. Gameshows have more integrity than Nascar.
I'd be pissed if I drove my arse off and instead of being a profeshional driver, I become a deuteragonist in an over budget soap opera like Nascar.
NASCAR's been in BIG Trouble for the past 20 years.
Yes
And now it's coming to a head
Amen.
It went on life support after the 2001 Daytona 500 and flatlined when they introduced the Chase in 2004.
2004 is when the downfall officially began
I'm totally done with the phony playoffs. I've been fed up with this system for awhile now. The manipulation at Martinsville should be the last straw for this system but we know it won't be due to "entertainment's" sake.
9:44 the man had a largely unmatched fitness regimen in stock car racing, possibly only matched by Carl Edwards. Half-assing anything doesn't win you seven championships.
I really hope logano wins it, and I'm far from a Penske fan. I really want the biggest amount of chaos and shitfuckery possible. This shitty system should be scrapped once and for all. Not once in my life I've been so disillusioned with this sport.
Only in death can this sport be saved. I’m a lifelong Joey fan I’ll be the first to say if he wins this Championship there’s no room for debate that the championship is undeserved. Honestly only better outcome would be if somehow Harrison Burton won the Championship.
I think peak shitfuckery would be Byron winning followed by Reddick. Would be funny if the NASCAR championship team was the one suing Nascar and losing their charter
@nikhook9430 thank you for admitting the fact that logano would be an undeserved champion. You are 1 of 1 when it comes to Logano fans in admitting that
@@RaleighRyan there only 3 deserving champions in there respective years in the playoff format that are not debatable. Martin Truex Jr 2017, Kyle Busch 2019, Kyle Larson 2021. Every other play off championship is debatable minus 2015 and 2018 where ironically enough those championships should be swapped. 2023 was near the edge of undeserving but if Logano wins it this year it’s truly as undeserving as Kyle Busch 2015 one is.
You're 100% correct. I used to go with a group every year (for 12 years) to Michigan and Indy. Nobody wanted to go the year after the stage racing began. Playoff format is a turnoff, also. Now, I just watch the highlights on TH-cam. The coverage is awful.
I already have apathy towards Nascar. I used to watch it regularly since when I was a kid, and a huge Bill Elliot fan back in the early 80's. I stopped watching regularly around when they introduced the "car of tomorrow". I've checked out a few races since then and have been completely bored to tears. To me, the stage thing and the playoff format really took any credibility the series had away. At this point I don't see any reason to pay any more attention to that shit show.
Car Of Tomorrow is not even that bad compared to Gen 7...it's not even a "stock car" but a road racing sports car.
Say what you want about IndyCar, but it offers a hell of a better product than NASCAR these days. At least the IndyCar sanctioning body isn’t falling into the same traps that NASCAR did almost 20 years ago. At least IndyCar isn’t manipulating individual races with phantom debris cautions and green-checkered flags every 50 laps. At least IndyCar doesn’t have a goofy and convoluted “playoff” championship system which has sucked the life out of a once-proud racing series. Let’s say that in 10 years, IndyCar manages to gain ground on NASCAR. Don’t be surprised if that happens.
I hope it does, NASCAR puts out a poor product and doesn't deserve to be the most popular motorsport, IndyCar isn't perfect but I've never watched IndyCar and wished I hadn't, but countless NASCAR races I felt that way about.
Indycar has it's problems too. Charters, series owner also being a team owner and getting caught cheating, baffling decisions about venues, etc. I agree it's nowhere near as bad as Nascar but let's not pretend everything is rosy over there.
@@wingracer1614 Given Penske has ops in both NASCAR and IndyCar it wasn't all too surprising if he implements a NASCAR-style charter system on IndyCar racing. Penske is indeed the best team owner in the history of the US racing scene, but it seems that he wants the US racing scene in his chokehold. And it's not just in US, he also has ops outside US, like the Porsche Penske team in WEC and IMSA, as well as partial ownership of Dick Johnson Racing (DJR-Penske) in Supercars.
@@wingracer1614 I agree. Every racing series has it’s drama (F1 with Tyregate, Spygate and Crashgate; IndyCar with management and marketing). Ultimately they leave the racing untouched. That’s what makes them a more authentic product than NASCAR (who have done everything and anything to put their fingers on the scale) imo.
@@813sports5but F1 ran sprints though. I don't know about you, but I think sprint races just doesn't sit right with a world class racing series like F1. The only good thing was it serves as a warmup run for the race proper.
Playoffs suck. I just don't care.
I went from a lifelong NASCAR fan to never watching another lap at the end of the 2016 season.
Last 2 years I've slowly lost interest, barely watch now after being a loyal viewer every weekend.
Stages and playoffs are the worst formats nascar could have implemented and is the main reasons why I rarely watch it anymore.
Bring Indycar back to Pocono!!
To see who Yakima Sato wrecks and gets killed or paralyzes this time?
That will fill no seats. Unlike NASCAR
@@eduardclark incorrect
@@bryonkidder6199Sato had nothing to do with Wickens.
@@bryonkidder6199 Indy is more dangerous than Pocono
I think this wave started at Richmond with Austin Dillon and got louder after Daytona. (It did for me). Since those two events the playoffs have been in a really bad light and Martinsville broke the dam as Slapshoes would say. I think was is so frustrating to fans this year vs other years is NASCAR continues to ignore the glaring issues of this sport. They want to act like everything is fine when it’s clearly not. Much like the NFL every week it isn’t about the play on the field every year nascar racing is more about moments and less about competition.
S1apsh0es: The house wins
David Land: 52 pickup
The main reason I can’t watch the races is it feels like nascars goal throughout the race is to jumble up the running order throughout the race as often as they can. Just never feels like a legitimate race playing out
Of course that's the goal Because restarts make better entertainment
Get rid of the playoffs!. And the only way they will even consider getting rid of or tweaking it hard is if we have another Jimmie Johnson run and rips off 5 of these championships in a row because one thing NASCAR has made clear is they hate dominance. This format doesn’t reward consistency over the course of a whole season like a lot of playoff defenders like to say it does. Kevin Harvick proved it in 2020.
You can run like shit all regular season, win a random ass race, then win 3 races in the playoffs and come away the champion, it rewards being good at specific moments not the entire season.
@@PaperBanjo64 That's what's wrong with the sport. This is motorsport. We don't want gimmicks that rewards fluke wins and mediocrity.
@@Tylnorton exactly, a playoffs champion isn't a legit champion 99% of the time, Kyle Larson in 2021 was, other than that, Truex 2017, there's not been any legit champions since playoffs were implemented.
@@PaperBanjo64 Kyle's 2019 also has the case too. But yeah you're right. What sucks is those 3 drivers could have lost it all in one race too and thankfully they didn't. Still sucks others got screwed
@@Tylnorton I was thinking that one too
I only got into NASCAR because of SVG, I'm sure a lot of folks here in Oceania are the same. We are confused about a lot of things and don't understand why things like stage cautions and the playoffs exist. And the more I watch the past few months the more it feels like "Racing Entertainment" a bit like WWE with "Sports Entertainment." It's even to the point I just have it as background noise too unless I hear something to do with SVG
Stages and playoffs are just moronic. Artificially keeping the racing close.
Supercars have Playoffs too bro...
I have a real hard time taking NASCAR seriously lol. Formula 1 and Indy car have their drama, but it's still all about the racing and strategy in the end. I will say the drama with the FIA over swearing is pretty damned funny lol.
The swearing drama was literally a lolfest tbh. It's not a cocksucking Japanese high school ffs, it's a motorsport paddock. They were all over 18, they know when or where not to cuss, and if they cuss on interviews, censorship (or apology from the announcers) should just suffice.
But even then I doubt everyone wants the media to censor cusswords.
F1 is in the same place NASCAR was in 2004. It’s only a matter of time before they have their own playoffs
@@nikhook9430 sprint races was the first hint that some massive "money over integrity" BS is coming soon
@@GreatCdn59 actually the V6 Turbo Hybrid was the first hint, then Liberty Media took over, then Sprint races.
@@RazorSharp75426 yeaaaaa can't argue with that. lol. gotta agree
The driver who scores the most points by the end of the last race of the season, gets the hardware. That's how it should be
If Logano or Byron wins, fans riot against nascar
If Blaney wins, fans delude themselves into nothing is wrong
If Reddick wins, we have the most hilarious outcome of a championship in the history of motorsports
Exactly. Part of me does want Blaney to win because that is the closest thing to a legitimate outcome but at this point, give me a Byron or Reddick win instead because I just want to see the whole thing burn down.
Imagine telling fans in 2003 fans now want more consistancy out of their champion. It was fans complaining in 2003, Matt Kenseth, won the championship with one race win that brought about The Chase. No system is perfect, someone is going to complain.
As somebody who has been watching NASCAR since 1996 at the age of five, I can tell you that it feels more like a reality TV show today than it ever has.
This really upsets me and I'm so concerned for the future. I really hope they settle out of court
NASCAR could make 3 relatively easy changes that would make everyone happy and keep the show going. 1, let teams build parts in house. It won't happen overnight but will help the teams over time. 2, share more of the TV revenues and 3, abolish the playoffs. That's LITERALLY all they need to do.
The more pressing issue is that Nascar's horrible decisions are rippling into other racing series.
The Australian Supercars Championship is going to try out their own spin on Nascar Playoffs/Turismo Carretera Copa de Oro.
The championship in Supercars will still stay sort of legitimate, as there's no ovals to fluke out wins, but still it's a horrible move. Not a single fan likes that idea, still Supercars pretend fans have been asking for just that.
Yeah, the NASCAR cancer needs to stop spreading...you already see NASCAR fans cry over IndyCar races ending under yellow...
Really baffling why Supercars and Turismo Carretera wanted to try such a brainrotten idea of doing some playoffs type of shit.
Why any other race series are willing to copy NASCAR when they should've just learn from illegal street racing? The simpler permutations, the badassery, anything? The "first over the line wins" rule?
This is why some people hates the word "Professional".
@@PaperBanjo64Indy has charter, ain't they?
@RazorSharp75426 IndyCar will next year but it won't count for the 500
The key things about the Supercars format, in my opinion, are that:
1) The win-and-you're-in system, as far as I'm aware, won't be used as a qualifying mechanism for the Finals Series. It'll be the top 10 in the championship after the Bathurst 1000 regardless of the number of wins, so there's no equivalent of Burton making the Playoffs this season in NASCAR. There will be automatic spots for the winners of the 'Sprint Cup' (the first eight rounds, so it'll simply be the overall championship leader at that point) and the Enduro Cup (who will likely be a driver who's already in the top 10 anyway barring some chaos. To be fair, it's a pair of Enduros, chaos can happen, particularly at Bathurst). Win-and-you're-in will however be used at the Gold Coast and Sandown, the 'Round of 10 and the 'Round of 7' so to speak.
2) There are multiple races in a weekend in Supercars (barring the two Enduros which are just one race), so Surfers Paradise has two races, Sandown has two races and in the final round in Adelaide the title contenders will fight it out over three races rather than just one. So a driver who has a poor race relative to his rivals actually has a chance to respond, it's not purely a winner-takes-all like the Championship race in NASCAR. Although a poor race will still likely be very damaging to his championship prospects.
I don't like that Supercars have decided to use a NASCAR-style format, but I'm willing to give it a shot. I reckon there could be some NASCAR-style chicanery though.
I hate calling it playoffs too. It's like NASCAR calling it's fans stupid
Its boarder meaning that well stupid fans don't get. Things tend to play out.... I don't see a problem here, but I liked the chase better.
I'm a British F1 viewer who has very little knowledge of NASCAR outside the fact J-P Montoya and Kimi Raikkonen raced in it, and there was a female driver who became a meme.
That was really interesting to watch without context as it sounds a mess, with the sort of manufactured nonsense you see in 'reality' TV shows.
And of course, Formula 1 has it's own anti trust issues since Liberty Media run that sport. Andretti has taken them to court, and the concert ticket side has been taken to court as well.
My personal opinion there is to much racing every weekend. From February to November let's cut it 30 races more people would watch. It gets a little old every weekend and boring, some of the older driver may stay around a little longer. Just my opinion thank you David for the information God Bless
Technology, cookie cutter cars, teams working together to influence the playoffs and no standard penalties. Why would that be bad
My nascar wishlist top 5
1. Up the horsepower
2. Split the road course and oval packages into two entirely different setups (For Example: with Ovals get rid of the diffuser)
3. Get rid of stage cautions
4. Get rid of the current points system
5. Rework the driving standard rule book.
I'm 77 years old. Been an avid Nascar fan since 1978. I stopped watching completely this year because I found myself not having anyone to root for but so many to root against. I don't like that in myself so I stopped watching it all together.
Yeah these younger drivers aren't all that likeable for the most part.
The reason Nascar is mad at the teams for manipulation.... They don't like the competition. Cautions of convenience have been a part of Nascar for the 4 decades I watched it.
I was born the year the Chase/Playoff format was introduced, grew up 10 minutes away from Michigan International, going to my local track Butler every Saturday with RaceDay playing every Sunday morning eating breakfast while my Dad and I would talk about the race that weekend.
Nascar was the series that got me into racing and something that I grew up with alongside the Tigers and Red Wings.
Since Carl Edwards' sudden retirement I've moved on to other forms of racing like going to the Norwalk Nationals in 2014/15 Belle Isle in 2016/17/18/19 and falling in love with IndyCar, Which soon after was how I found this channel.
Me, Dad and my grandfather stopped watching Nascar in 2017 all together and just focused on local and/or Indycar. They've been fans of the sport since birth and seen the Winston and the birth of the Nextel system.
Since 2020, I've tried to listen to races. Sometimes hoping in halfway with a group of friends on Discord or just watching channels like SlapShoes, Ericstepp, and RadMan to keep up to date on whats going on.
The only race that I watched in the cup series from green flag to finish was the return to the Brickyard (which as a return and feel good anniversary event) was ruined by bad officiating plus thanks to the rules stating that a race must end under green. We could've got a great ending with Brad, Ryan, and Kyle battling it out and both Ford drivers stretching everything they could fuel wise. Yet, Briscoe lost it and couldn't get it going bringing out a caution before the white.
I did not watch this year's Daytona 500 which was the first time I've ever done that.
The only time I felt good at the end of the season was when Larson won it in 2021 with how much wins and good he was that season.
Another example being last season with Ryan winning. I've always been a fan of his due to Dave Blaney being a big dirt track guy, yet I still felt upset cause I knew he wasn't the best that season.
The moment I started questioning the system was when "Spin-gate" and Newman bumping Larson in the last turn.
These the reasons why I'll never take Nascar seriously ever again. I might start to if they get rid of the format or even have the Nextel era just with stage and points counted but with more points going towards wins.
Nascar will never be the same to me and others due to that.
I lost most of my interest in NASCAR and their questionable officiating and format changes. I'll only tune in to highlights now.
8:20 you hit the nail on the head with me turning off the race in reference to Joseph.
He will whine about the same thing he will do, and backing into championship is just too much to handle any longer.
Great video David. It really underscores a lot of thing I've been feeling as a tenetive nascar fan and huge racing fan. I attended this year's Brickyard and had a great time. It left me hyped to see where the season went. However its just been an oddity of a series from an officiating perspective at every race I've seen and from what I can glean from nascar history that's always been an element of the series reputation. Yet I really cant shake the notion that Cup has become a prefabricated show that is beholden to the ROI of the France family. At Indy just seeing the huge freight team shops and knowing the Frances are getting a cut was sickening, especially when at any other race those team shops are fairly grassroots organizations.
Great vid as usual. Keep it up
I start to watch. But then get distracted and then don't even care if I go back and watch the rest of the race.My late wife and I went to several races over the years. Now I try to get to local drag strips for no prep racing.
In regards to the points format, I’d prefer to see it go back to a season-long format, but keep the points the same as they are now, because it makes a lot more sense. 1pt per position (with the exception of the 5pts between 1st and 2nd), 1pt for leading a lap, 5pts for leading the most laps. Hell, keep the stages if you want, but stop throwing the cautions, or stop counting the laps run under stage cautions.
Modern Nascar is a hollow imitation of what it once was. I knew it was over when Charlotte sports radio doesn't really cover it anymore and its home to most of the teams.
Indycar and Formula 1 are still interesting to watch with 1 race left to go and the champions decided..(Palou&Verstappen).. go to a points championship and end the stages
Indycar and F1 don't come close to NASCAR for TV ratings in the US. For NASCAR to abandon the playoffs they would have to sell the TV networks on it as well and there's no way a TV executive will want to follow the lead of other series that can't do the same kind of numbers
@@dylansmock4876 F1 is a global sport. Completely different beast.
@@dylansmock4876NASCAR is chasing down NFL in ratings, that's why their ratings tends to be higher than F1 and Indy, even higher than IMSA. But we've seen the downside of that fact in how they run the races.
@@dylansmock4876but NASCAR is chasing down NFL in ratings, that's why their ratings tends to be higher than Indy and F1.
Either Reddick wins this season and pisses off NASCAR with having to give the team suing them, or Logano wins, and fans all collectively say what's on everyone's mind at this stupid system...or they just stop watching to get it through their minds.
50/50 shot here.
Or boring Blaney/Byron. Both boring.
Byron would bring talks of the Martinsville race manipulation to the forefront. Blaney would be best for Nascar's interests, so as much as I like him I hope it's one of the others.
I hit the "apathy" stage several years ago. I had been watching NASCAR since the 70's. But the current format with stages and the playoffs I just don't care for. When they first announced using stages, I thought it might work and be something like heat races. But for me anyway, it didn't do that. This year I bet I have watched less than 10 laps of total NASCAR. Meanwhile, I watch as much F1 (even when it was boring) and IndyCar as I can.
To me, the chase in 2004 was the diagnosis there was a problem with leadership, the COT car was a terminal diagnosis, and the playoff and gen 6 car was the death nail in the coffin for me. And oh god the stage racing… that’s the bitter post mortem
You can talk all the shit you want about the COT but that was a necessary step forward.
The opposite of love isn't hate, it's apathy.
Well said David now I know why your Nascar coverage has been lacking and thanks for shouting out slapshoes
Bell was the champion under the Formula 1 format and Winston format. Those reward consistency. Which is what racing is all about. It’s not about “Game 7’s.” When will they ever learn that. I was a big fan but after my driver Bell has been screwed so many times I’m just about finished.
To me racing is about winning. The idea of championship was to determine who is the best driver of the season.
The biggest thing stopping me from enjoying NASCAR isn’t anywhere on the radar as far as problem: the constant, incessant off track fights and drama and deliberate wrecking of opponents. It’s so trashy lol
You just describe some of the manufacturer influence issues
You are right on David I am an older guy my first Nascar race was 1967 went to Daytona every race for years and I personally got disgusted with them around 2006 haven't been to a race since I have said that Nascar won't be around in a few years
The last time I watched Nascar regularly was in 2018. After the insult that was the 2019 car, I tuned out and haven't been back since. I'll watch the Daytona 500 and the occasional notable race, but I'm not watching any of the other races.
Sou you didn't see Live last few laps at Homestead? Missing that kind of racing because of the stupidest reasons seems quite dumb to me.
I'm an open wheel fan first. Indy Car, USAC and winged Sprint cars are what I love to watch. One thing I like about those forms of racing is that there are no guaranteed starting spots in the races. I think the fact that a F1 Champion running for McLaren or that Penske Racing failed to qualify for the Indy 500 makes that race and series so much more intriguing than just handing out starting spots like NASCAR does. I also like that if the race is 500 miles, you turn the laps for 500 miles, not 506 miles. I also think the Champion should be the person that scores the most points throughout the whole season. All the series are so close these days that there will be a close championship and the end of the season. I could go on, but the bottom line is that manufactured excitement through gimmicks like stage racing will never keeps peoples attention in the long run. I really hope Indycar is paying attention because every NASCAR fan lost should be an Indycar fan gained!
Don’t forget that this guaranteed starting-slot crap started with Tony “Dips**t”George and his new IRL back in 1996.
Regarding the 1996 Indy 500:
“Most of the top teams and drivers in Indy car racing remained with CART, and protested over a perceived lockout because of 1996 model-year chassis not being approved and the introduction of the '25/8 Rule', which guaranteed 25 spots in the field for the best performing IRL entries in previous races.”
And IndyCar has just adopted a charter system similar to NASCAR’s:
“INDYCAR confirmed today the establishment of a charter system across the NTT INDYCAR SERIES. In total, owners of 10 teams have accepted charters for 25 entries competing in North America’s premier open-wheel racing series, beginning immediately.” - IndyCar News, Sept. 23, 2024
David called it. Logano won! 😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂
I enjoy being at a NASCAR race,in person, in the moment, because honestly there's not much else like it. But I do not like how much they messed up the race and championship scoring format. "Cautions breed Cautions" that's the problem with stage racing. Good thing the cars are as safe as they are, they could not pull these shenanigans at the turn of the century or prior, but nothing's ever 100%, they're always playing with fire...
Your right. I have watched every lap since being a kid, I'm 30, and just shut it off the last couple weeks because 3 of the best 4 drivers got left out of the final 4. They've made the championship into some bs lucky thing, similar to what the Daytona 500 has become.
Yeah when Wrecky Spinhouse wins a 212 lap Daytona "500" you know the race is a crap shoot, this year's was embarrassing with the half throttle fuel saving! That's NOT racing! I'd rather see a single file line logging laps than packs with no passing and everyone running 20 MPH off the pace.
Excellent video David, and you're spot on. I have been saying this for the last few years; THIS IS NOT the NASCAR I grew up with, and loved back in my day (1990s to early 2000s), this whole sport has been MEMEcar since about 2010.
It's partially the sanctions fault for incepting the following: The Chase / Playoff points win and your in, and knockout format, the below the yellow line rule, STAGE RACING, and the 3 Green-White-Checkered attempts, making this type of racing a JOKE.
But the main problem I have with this sport: THE DRIVERS: and it's NOT all of them neither, it's more like 95-98% of the drivers across all 4 divisions: ARCA, Trucks, Xfinity, and Cup, that don't use their heads most of the time, drive way over their heads, and do nothing but wreck it up with 2 laps to go coming to the white flag everytime they go to Daytona or Talladega (the 2 tracks that were considered my favorite tracks back in my day) THIS type of racing may or will eventually get someone killed by all their carlessness they show everytime they go to those 2 venues. THAT is absolutey inexcusable that NASCAR keeps this going on. Because you know what? THEY don't care about the fans, and haven't for the last few years now.
Sure back in my day we didn't have 25 or more cars finish on the lead lap, sure back in my day we didn't have a close points finish every year, sure we had races that ended under yellow at times, and sure back in that time we had race winners that lapped the field. and you know why? because they let the drivers race the races, they let the drivers race for the championship (even if it meant winning it by 200 or 300 points) and the best part about that racing was ALL WAS FAIR, even if your driver didn't win the race, big deal, there was always next race.
And I'm sorry, but today's fans are being spoiled by this type of this so called "NASCAR Racing" and all their manufactured drama they've had for quite some time, and they all call us boring, or hate our type or racing, or fall on deaf ears if we even try to mention how it used to be.
I know I haven't watched or cared about NASCAR much since 2014, because of all those reasons I mentioned, but it also doesn't mean I didn't have to let this all out. It's because I wanna see it change for the better (which it hasn't for a long time) and I am concerned about the safety of the drivers (whether I like 'em or not) I don't wanna see 'em hurt or killed because of someone else's stupidity or carless driving on the plate tracks, sure we may not bring the legends back, and I'm aware of that, but this has all gone too far. Sorry for this rant, but I had to get that off my chest
I been watching nascar since 1987,it’s no longer a sport,it’s entertainment.nascar has s sold its soul to the television networks,so they can make as much money as they can.The racing is manipulated every week,it’s just a joke,and don’t get me started on the commercials,third of the race is commercials.Nascar has let the television networks,ruin their sport for cold hard cash.its really that simple
Why don’t we call it the “raceoffs” instead of the playoffs
Because you might have to do more work explaining it to sponsors
Can we get Kyle Larson in indycar pay him whatever it takes. CBell too, indycar needs American drivers that draw
"Pay him what ever it takes?" Indycar doesn't have the money. Other than the Indy 500, it doesn't pay.
@GrandpaShark do you know how much Roger Penske is worth
@@bigdaddymak1439 Oh, he's rich. But I bet he pays Blaney & Logano more to race Nascar than he pays Power & McLaughlin in Indycar.
Fred Alonso didn’t draw ?
I have watched nascar for 40+ years. I have quit watching it once in a while due to frustration with the games being played by nascar. I have always came back to watch, less every time. I am so disgusted with myself for wasting my time by watching any nascar race these days. I’ve gotten to the point I don’t even want to hear anything about nascar. I want to love NASCAR like I used to, I just can’t anymore. It’s just like politics, no matter what the people(fans) say they want the governing body just doesn’t care.The only way to make them listen is to not participate in what they are doing. The only thing we can do is to not watch NASCAR. After all the opposite of love is not hate, it’s INDIFFERENCE. That’s where I’m at now, don’t even care. If I don’t like someone I just stay away from them, totally. No races, no media of any kind dealing with NASCAR. Really, it’s just a waste of time now.
I'm done with nascar. The politics of nascar are not what I want to see in a sport I loved . I will not be watching next year . Nascar is a monopoly and pin drivers and teams into some really unfair situations. The racing is not great despite media drumming it up .I race and just can't stomach nascar anymore .
I went from a die-hard to a casual over the last 10 years. The Chase, COT, Rockingham, spingate, reduced horsepower/tapered spacers, Next Gen, now this charter agreement, I'm getting damn close to being totally done. I'm glad that Front Row and 23XI are picking up where the original Kentucky Speedway lawsuit left off. That was the last time anyone actually challenged the sanctioning body, and they just got dragged through continuance after continuance until they just settled. The sport reaped tons of rewards on the backs of so many, to not realize that the pool is finite and the well is drying is foolish.
This was always the world NASCAR was headed to when the charter system started to gain value. The teams realize there is power and sadly too many balked at the thought of having to actually fight the series to get the right things done.
As for the Joey story, he's a talented driver on a hell of a team who plays the format perfectly. It's just people being mad because their driver isn't doing it, and from the sound of his press conference yesterday, the fact he's a massive suck-up doesn't help matters.
NASCAR runs off of controversy and fines. I record 80% of races and only watch the final stage. Races are too long. The playoffs do not reward wins like they should. The whole concept is absurd and needs an overhaul
I agree with the entire playoff comment. I've been against it since the first year in 2004 and witnessed how dumb it was. It hasn't been improved upon, they've only doubled down on it over and over in the name of "entertainment." Racing should not need this inserted into it. They've stripped most of the strategy with the stages. I do hope they figure something out before it gets worse. They do need to realize that this lawsuit that involves someone arguably more famous than they are in Michael Jordan, doesn't look good. I'm just glad I got to witness the hayday in the 80s and 90s, that was a good time for racing.
13:15 also Kevin Harvick wrecking half the field at Talladega in 2015
On a restart
That was the last straw for me . When they let that slide; I knew that more stupid was about to come
I refuse to believe the Joey Laggano has just as many championships as Lee Petty, Cale Yarborough, David Pearson, Darrell Waltrip and even Tony Stewart.
At least Tony Stewart wins 2005 regardless of the points system, so he's definitely a 2 time champ
Just like Schumacher, Vettel, Hamilton, Verstappen have more wins than Ayrton Senna. I can believe that Prost has more, but not these.
@@PaperBanjo64 Well that 2011 Homestead race was one of the best ever and people forget. AJ Foyt said he drove the race of his life.
8:40 ”...Jimmie never started the wrecks"
lol
Jimmie Johnson had a sizable streak of starting super speedway accidents.
Baseball players like to say, I don't care what the umpire's strike zone is as long as it is consistent. NASCAR enforces rules like a constantly changing strike zone. It gives the fans the impression that NASCAR is scripting the race. Like Martinsville, they needed to get a Chevy into the final four.
It's pretty hard to script a NASCAR race though. Pfft
@@runrafarunthebestintheworld See book: The Fix is In.
I WONDER HOW NASCAR WILL REACT WHEN THE COURTS FORCE THEM TO JOIN THE 21st CENTURY !!!!!!!!!!
2004 was the beginning of the warning signs of what we have today. Just nobody had the foresight to see what it would devolve into.
David, well said, I used to watch Nascar every now and then but now it is never. No other racing series breaks their races up into three sections and allows everyone to catch up. That is absurd. Engineers can work around anything given the challenge and tires is one such challenge. The playoff system is ridiculous and speaks to a constant attempt to stay relevant but it is just confusing and silly and speaks to a desire to use American sports terminology. Just run a championship like every other series.
Less races, shorter races, allow contact (the cars are as safe as tanks). Come to think of it even "the big one" at Daytona isn't something you fear, just a bunch of tanks spinning and squealing.
David, the one word you carefully didn't use - Nascar is boring.
Im 35 and have been a NASCAR fan since 1997. Its hard to see the sport in its current state, but it's not surprising to me. I agree 100% with what you said. I typically get stuff done around the house then start watching an hour or two after start time and speed past all the commercials and stage breaks and it makes it more entertaining to watch.
With recent statements from NASCAR about playoffs not going anywhere. That means they are not listening. Here's what NASCAR needs to learn, we have options now. This isn't 1984 where they were the only game in town. We have access to dirt racing from across the country. I'd rather watch sprint cars, indy, f1, or any other form of motorsports rather than a sanctioning body that doesn't care about me.
I loathe the playoff system, i loathe stage racing.
They don't care what fans think as far as the playoffs They are willing to change the format of the playoffs though. You're not getting it through your little head NASCAR is in the entertainment business
@@johnhaas2523 yeah NASCAR is in the entertainment business, but I will decide where to spend my entertainment dollars, as will others. I'm not sure if you were insulting me with the "get it through my little head" comment or not, though.
@@johnhaas2523Do you really think that this BS is entertaining?
@@joelbrooks3198 to be fair, Saturday was phenomenal if you're a Justin fan. However your point stands.
@joelbrooks3198 It is 100% entertaining the playoffs You're just not educated
*There is one thing you forgot to mention:* The primary reason that people are up in arms over Logano being in the final four is because of the Alex Bowman DQ that Hendrick Motorsports did *not* appeal.
For once HMS literally had a case & did not go through with it, because it was Alex Bowman & not Kyle Larson. If this was against Larson (And _maybe_ Byron), that appeal would've been filed that night.
Logano got in to the Round of 8 based off that, then won the first race in the round to get a bye into the final four, making fans even more upset at Hendrick/Jeff Gordon for guinea pigging Bowman like they did, as well as Logano by proxy because he was the beneficiary of Hendrick's/Gordon's negligence.
What evidence did HMS have that would allow them to avoid an underweight car penalty? That rule is very black and white. You pass or you fail. Simple.
@FlightData101 There was video evidence of something coming out of Bowman's car when he went over the last curb at one point during the roval race. That piece of the car coming off is what made the car "underweight."
@@Ultimate23DragonThat probably is not enough of the weight or Just thought it wasn't secured right and HMS didn't want to admit
@@Ultimate23Dragon Yes there was but guess what? Losing ballast is also illegal. Hendrick had no case.
@wingracer1614 Even when the curbing was the cause, making it unintentional?
I stopped watching NASCAR in the 80’s, because things weren’t natural, endings were determined or at least attempted.
It was my biggest fear when IMSA went under their thumb.
That's why NASCAR IS a monopoly, they blocked IndyCar when the series was ready to give them big bucks to race at Homestead they said no, and NASCAR didn't care if PJ1 had negative effects on IndyCar but they weren't gonna ruin the track with it for their own open wheel series, the modifieds.
Thank you, I hate calling it the “playoffs.” It’s beyond cringe.
NASCAR has been in big trouble for the past 2 administrations
Ratings have been up since 2017
@ I’m referring to behind the scenes. Ratings have been stabilized since like 2019 or the turn of this decade
11:40 With regards to the NWC points account, I was saying last year that this system doesn't make stars. You could have made a star out of Buescher who was sitting 3rd in points and pretty freaking competitive. Does anybody remember how well he drove last year? No, of course not.
the problem isn't the points themselves, it's the playoff, you can argue that the current system does reward winning unlike the latford system, right now you'd have larson with raw speed and elliott with consistency sitting 1-2, and if you look at the rest of the standings you see those different paths play out, of course none of this matter at the end since we'll be stuck with the playoff format until something cataclysmic happens
NASCAR definitely reeks of antitrust violations. They have lost their integrity with true race fans. Selective officiating to create drama. The stage racing format is a joke! I propose NASCAR should have the final race of the season at Talladega or Daytona! Kudos to Joey Logano and Penske on success with playing the game!
Hahaha
I used to love watching Nascar but when they introduced this stupid playoff system I hated it from day one I was ok with the 2004 chase for cup but for the love of god bring back the Winston Cup Era of Nascar
Former die hard fan here. Still watch a lot of races. Nothing feels like it has real stakes or matters anymore. Once football started I haven’t watched a race over it in a few years. Only a couple races a year are worth watching. Daytona, Kansas, Bristol, 600 and I’ll always love the Glen
On top of that the cars look slow and easy to drive
@@jesseliggitt1142yeah next gen sucks!
I stopped watching Nascar around 2010. Right around the CoT going full time. Ive recently tried to get back into it. I enjoy listening to content surrounding Nascar, but cant watch a full race. I feel like teenage me had made the right decision.
You did, modern NASCAR is terrible!
Debate the racing, cars, stage racing, over burdensome rule book, points system, playoffs, etc.,. While all true, the number one complaint I have is that the entire broadcast...everything from the pre race show, pit reports, COMMERCIALS, broadcast team, after show EVERYTHING is marketed to woke SJW's. Core NASCAR fans are not only ignored, it's obvious that NASCAR Marketing would be happier if they would just go away.
I agree with most of your points, David. But now Indycar is going down the same path. They are implementing charters. They are restricting the field size to only allow the selected owners to compete. After Prema, I don't think there will ever be a new team entering the sport. Indycar also owns the open wheel development series. If Michael Jordan is successful in court, how long until an Indycar team files an antitrust suit?
I think Indycar will be a different environment. The owners in Indycar wanted the charter system. What they also did was worth with the series to get a system that will work for them. The owners in NASCAR paid lip service to it and then they just dropped it on the table and said "Take it or leave it, you have the rest of today to sign" . Entirely different scenarios
NASCAR wants to control everything but the teams (and fans) literally pay the price for NASCAR’s mistakes. Also, it is very easy to manipulate viewership numbers especially when teams and sponsors are beholden to contracts wherein they agree they can’t sue NASCAR.
I quit watching nascar about 4 years ago. Rather watch imsa and F1 all day every day.