The NES: Getting the Best Video it Can Offer
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 3 ต.ค. 2024
- Hope you enjoy the video! This isn't an easy mod or an inexpensive one, but as you can see, the upgrade in video is significant. I didn't show S-Video here, but it looks great as well, albeit with more noise in the line than RGB. To use SCART RGB cables, you'd need an XRGB-mini upscaler, or some similar upscaler capable of converting the signal to HDMI, and they aren't cheap, so most people would probably want to stick with S-video.
As of this video, this is where the various products you'd need to use this can be found:
NESRGB kit from US distributor (shop page says v1.2, but I received the newer v1.4):
etim.net.au/sho...
Blinking light win 72-pin connector replacement:
www.arcadework...
3D printed multi-out plug:
assemblergames....
...and wiring diagram for plug: i.imgur.com/M5...
retro_console_accessories CSYNC RGB Scart cable (often out of stock. Usually replenished in the morning. Check Monday mornings). You MUST add both the cable itself and the coaxial upgrade to your cart before checkout to get the coaxial cables shown in this video. You will want the upgrade to prevent noise in the line as NES is notorious for noisy signals:
Cable: www.ebay.com/it...
Coaxial upgrade: www.ebay.com/it...
Purple S-Video and Component Monster cables:
Check eBay. The S-Video cables are great, but they've shot up quite a bit in price in recent years and look like they sell for $75-100 now... Sorry. You don't need monster cables to capitalize on S-video, though. There might be some good alternatives out there if you do a little hunting.
USB Blaster:
Check eBay for a Rev. c blaster. They're very cheap. Just make sure it comes with a USB cable and ribbon cable.
FirebrandX's Color Palette project (in progress as of now):
www.firebrandx....
HD Retrovision mainpage (unrelated to this video, but a great source for newly-developed classic stuff):
www.hdretrovisi...
JTAG adapter to be used with USB blaster, to update color profiles. I think you have to register to order it:
www.oshpark.co...
Pins for JTAG adapter:
www.digikey.com...
Plug for JTAG adapter:
www.digikey.com...
Game footage was upscaled using an XRGB-mini, recorded using an Elgato Game Capture HD60 Pro + OBS Studio, and edited in Vegas Pro.
I think that's everything! Any questions? Ask in the comments. - เกม
I'm interested in doing this as well. Is it possible to modify it so i can get an HDMI connection instead of a multi out? If im going to go through all that trouble, might as well do it with HDMI.
There is actually an HDMI solution called Hi-Def NES that produces slightly sharper video, since it pulls true digital from the NES board, but I don't know how accurate the color palettes are and I think you have to pay someone to install it for you vs. installing it yourself. FirebrandX just released his updated color palettes about a week ago, so I'll be installing those now. More on Hi-Def NES here: retrorgb.com/hidefnes.html ...and the color palette link is in the video description. Analog RGB works best for me since my video distribution system is geared off of SCART RGB. Some might wonder why you'd want to mod an NES for HDMI when the NES Classic came out recently. Well... The NES Classic has noise in the video (intended, to prevent seizures), replaces flashes with weird effects (also to prevent seizures), has problems with audio lag sometimes, colors are not true to original NES colors, and it's essentially an emulator, so it won't always execute games as original hardware would. With a mod like this one or the Hi-Def NES, you know games will play as intended.
Do the RGB conversion. RGB can be adapted to HDMI easily and RGB is the superior option for the correct displays (CRT).
Research RGB SCART.
That pill of Dr. Mario is the BEST comparison point for the before/after test
Wow this was amazingly concise and educational, thank you SO MUCH! Even if you're only just looking for comprehensive info about cable types, the first 6 minutes are brilliant.
Thanks for the kinds words! Made my day :)
The 72-pin connector doesn't get "loose". The original ones were "loose" when brand new. They get dirty/oxidized. Any original connector will work perfectly when it's clean (the game cartridge pins have to be clean too, of course). I've cleaned ones that were so well-used that some of the plastic ribs between the pins had long since broken off, and they worked perfectly when clean too. My NES with its original "loose" connector boots the first time, every time, and I've yet to see a "death grip" aftermarket connector do that.
A lot of people might be thinking, "I've already tried cleaning the connector and it didn't work." If it didn't work that means that whatever method you used to clean the pins, didn't actually clean them. For example, people commonly try to clean the pins with isopropyl alcohol, which isn't very effective. Alcohol is a solvent, which means it will remove oils (and the dirt that the oils have trapped), but it does little to nothing against oxidation, and oxidation is usually the problem. You need something like a good contact cleaner, or vinegar (acetic acid), or what I use, Bar Keepers Friend powder mixed with water and a toothbrush (oxalic acid is the active ingredient). Of course, you need to take the NES apart and remove the 72-pin connector so that you can give it a good scrubbing.
This is a wonderful video man! It was both entertaining and informative. Also, your craftsmanship and attention to detail is really impressive.
Great video! I usually watch a lot of nes tutorial videos and I would say as far as quality and content you are up there with the top. I think you liken to a mixture of gametechusa and the gaming historian. You should make more tutorials like this. Send links of this video to mod creators or distributors and maybe they will donate parts for you to do videos on
I never realized how nice these are until your comparison. It literally makes it 16 bit clear like you said!
Thanks a lot for a perfect video. No shaky cam, no improvisation, no stupid music, just clear and informative content.
I wouldn't do that mod because to me shitty image is part of my NES nostalgia, but I do appreciate your work.
What a clear way to explain!! Thanks for this great exposition.
I have no clue why this showed up on my feed now but it's a good video
That's some really nice work! I love the clean flush look.
This is still the best but composite isn't that bad, he must have been using bad cables. Crt with composite (maybe with a filter mod), S-video or rgb are the absolute indisputable best option period. Hdmi mod has lag, not much but it's there, not to mention the litney of other issues that comes with playing a system and it's games that were made/developed exclusively for use on crt monitors.
back in the day, going single wire was not optimal, through those times we kept saying, MORE WIRES MORE WIRES!!! MORE WIRES TO BREAK UP THE SIGNALS FOR BETTER QUALITY!!!! then in 2002 after HDMI comes out
i just got a hi def nes. it is by far the best picture quality on o.g hardware nes.
I'm not against modding consoles to output a sharper video signal BUT you have to remember that those games were designed with all the RF and Composite artifacts and limitations in mind. Things like giving the ilusion of a larger color palette and fake transparency effects by using color bleeding in their favor and mitigating the blocky nature of pixels with the blurriness of those signals were part of the developer's intentions when developing for this old consoles and CRT sets.
For most games, I'd say things just look sharper/better, but one good example that outlines what you're talking about would be the waterfalls in Sonic the Hedgehog on the Sega Genesis. When they're dead sharp via an RGB connection they just don't look quite right.
The NES was only designed to be viewed on a CRT TV. The resolution is only so good. The NES put out video that looked right at home on a CRT. It's only when you use a HD TV that the image quality of the NES becomes an issue. The zapper gun only works with a CRT as well. I keep a old CRT around for playing my NES.
Great video dude!
subbed. This is great! I've found a little community here in Miami and want to create some nintoasters with rgb output but was on the fence for a while because I hadn't seen any between OG graphics and rgb output. questions: 1.) were you playing on a crt or a modern hd tv? 2.) Is there a notice in quality difference between the two after the mod? 3.) Can you show some comparison of the output with and without the color correction mod? Thank you! great video!
I'm super-busy nowadays (and sorry for the very long delay on this response), but to answer your questions... 1) I play on a 1080P Vizio LED TV (some models have extremely low latency, which is why I got it), although the video footage you're seeing is direct-capture using a capture card, not me filming a screen with a camera. 2) Yes, there is a profound difference in quality. You can see the comparisons in the youtube video itself. 3) The color correction mod was definitely worth it. Colors look exactly as they should - beautiful and balanced. I won't be making a dedicated video, but there's pre-mod footage of Battletoads in this video, and my "Dying Through Battletoads with Commentary" video on this channel is post-mod, so that'll give you a good idea of what the difference looks like if you want to compare. Thanks!
The blinking light win product is great but I've had success simply taking the NES apart and bending the pins on the existing cart connector to make it tighter. It work very well.. almost too well! Carts are nice and tight now :)
That can definitely work, but it'll one day leave you with loose pins again, unfortunately. The blinking light win virtually eliminates that eventuality since it uses a better design.
Great clean professional work!!! I would’ve thought this was a video from Voltar or Gametech-US. I can’t stand hot glue guys and their hack jobs.
Anything worth doing is worth doing well. My projects take waaay longer than they could, but I try to end up with something to be proud of. Thanks for the high praise!
I enjoyed the journey. Thanks for the video! I have a hi def nes kit install on my top loader, but after get hd retrovision cable for my n64 and snes jr I am thinking of this mod for my front loader nes. Do the original nes ports (composite/RF) still work after the mod? Can you get composite or svideo from the new multiport or just rgb?
The multi-out on mine carries rgb, s-video, and composite video generated from the nesrgb board which is apparently better than native composite. Additionally, I wired up the three-position switch so that two positions use two different color profiles via the nesrgb, while the third position bypasses the nesrgb so that native composite and rf can be used. I wanted to only add rather than sacrifice one for another. So yes, it is possible to have it all!
Informationator thanks, looks like I have work to do.
@@snesinfoguy I want to do exactly this: "Additionally, I wired up the three-position switch so that two positions use two different color profiles via the nesrgb, while the third position bypasses the nesrgb so that native composite and rf can be used." Mind telling/showing me how you wired that? Thanks a ton!
I'm leaning towards the better-to-leave-it-original side, but you did a good job by the looks of it.
I'm doing that myself because I would SEVERELY fuck up my NES trying to do something as complex as this since my soldering skills aren't exactly the best. Games are still fun though so to me that makes up for the rather lacking video quality.
FYI if you can find the audio processor in NES most games were created in stereo. Then modify the output.
You can create "pseudo-stereo" by connecting each of the two CPU pins to left and right outputs, but it was never intended to be heard that way. It can sound more interesting, but no game was designed to be played in "steteo". Maybe some homebrew *might* have been designed to take advantage of that, but certainly no commercial software.
Great video. You've inspired me to try this mod myself. If I end up recording and uploading to YT I will defiantly be crediting you and your channel as well as the people who engineered all of these custom parts. I think I'll order a new NES in case of any major fuck ups. Also, I'd like to keep my original NES as is. Pip pip cheerios.
The NES generates an excellent composite video signal; the best I've ever seen from any video device. Output it to a real TV (15 kHz CRT) like it was designed for, preferably a newer one (they pretty much stopped making CRTs in general by 2008) or a high-end one of any vintage, with a good comb filter, and the picture is beautiful. For example, this is a picture of my NES displaying on my TV:
i.imgur.com/8GKRdWi.jpg
The NES's composite video only looks bad if you try to display it on something it was never designed for, like one of those glorified calculator screens that passes for a "TV" these days.
Excellent write up (video up?), subbed.
Composite can look acceptable if you have a CRT with a good 3-line or better comb filter.
Great video though.
Would love to do this mod but, that sodder skill is way more than I can do..
Will the original Composite and RF connections still work?
Yes, but they do need proper wiring.
Nowadays people are into the NTSC and other artifacts because game artists used them to create graphics that looked better than the system could produce
any way to purchase an nes already mod defined this fashion?
Hey there algorithm. Here's a great video for you to promote.
You forgot about component cables.
Very informative and entertaining.
Awesome video would this work on a regular crt?
With all the soldering with wires why not just use molex connecters
Any idea where I might hire someone to do this to my NES??
Very good video.
Is it possible to put multi out and HDMI on the same console? I wanna do that so bad!
I respect the Nintendo entertainment system
Professional work ! :))))) are AV and RF still working after the mod :) ?
Thanks! Yep, original AV still works, but that's because I wired my toggle switch to allow for that. You can choose to have an "Off" setting as one of your three options with the color palette switch (sacrificing a potential 3rd color pallete) and I did this because I'm kind of a purist and I like the idea that I've done nothing but add to the machine without removing any original functionality :) If you do the mod, but don't wire one of the toggle positions as "Off", then you'll not be able to use original outputs.
Young adults? We're almost 40 ffs.
Does giving rgb to any game console always require the graphics ic? What if I instead used something like microcontrollers or plug n plays that feature games it in?
Everything looks great, Video looks sharp, but aspect ratio looks like you're playing a mobile phone :P
Where can I purchase the multi port connector?
I don't care if you can mod it to output HDMI. I have played the OG and HDMI and there is no noticeable difference. The system and games where designed for a/v and not HDMI. It's not worth hacking up a nostalgic system for a better picture when you can buy a retron for less than 100 dollars.
Why won't a composite video to s video adapter work for the og nes?
Not sure but guessing if you’re feeding a bad signal into an adapter, there’s not much it can do to make the signal any cleaner. This mod goes right to the source of the signal... (Garbage in, garbage out, etc.)
You didn't install the ppu pin connectors correctly. I guess it doesn't matter if it works, but you made it more difficult on yourself.
Throw a stereo audio and expansion audio mods in there while you have your NES cracked open!
Stereo mod is pointless and worse than mono. All NES games were made mono. Stereo mod ruins the experience and makes things like gun shots come out of the left and explosions come out of the right. It's not correct.
is this kosmic
Hello
I have a modded nes i bought off ebay it has rgb
The carts are hard to physically push in
But my bigger problem is my nes. I have two one stock one rgb. But my monitor which is an rgb ikegami isnt displaying the video correctly
Anyway i love the monitor. I had it working with a sega genesis. But wondered if you had any thoughts on what could be wrong?
When i first plugged it in it worked but i think the colors were off? But it gave me a taste of rgb and id love to play nintendo on it
Does it have a blinking light win installed? The initial version had a very tight connector that made it hard to insert and remove games, but it was tweaked shortly after launch to fix that problem.
What do the colors look like? Are they completely wrong, like maybe the color signal wires got installed wrong? Or are the colors brighter than what you expected? It could be a simple as the wrong palette was wired as default.
You're looking at this all wrong. The artifacts from signal degradation are part of the anticipated experience when the games were released. "Cleaning them up" is taking you away from the experience. I also take my movies unaltered, black & white, with film grain in tact where possible for the same reason.
cool video man, except for those struts you made out of wood lol......should have used some good looking plastic or something other than wood.......
Hey I am about to buy one of these NES RGB boards with a multi out output that I salvaged from a GameCube motherboard but I can't find the plan for wiring the multi out ... How / where did you find out where to solder which pin ?
Hey man, I had to do a little digging, but I found the pinout diagram that buffalo wing and helder made for their 3D printed multi-out connector (which is what I used to wire mine). You could use the same wiring for the one you salvaged. Hope that helps! Link: i.imgur.com/z0GYm7s.png
See the 3rd link in the description for more info on buying a custom multi-out connector.
Informationator thank you :D
I have two av famicoms with this mod due to my soldering incompetence.
Which sync did you use on the AV Multi out? CS# or V?
I used CSYNC off of pin 3 of the multiout connector. I've added an imgur link to the pinout diagram in the video description, and details on how to purchase the custom SCART cable I use are also in there.
Is the composite out still active when using rgb out? So can i use the composite out to a capture card and the scart to a tv simultaneously?
Im pretty sure the RGB board from Tim Worthington disables the composite out. I know it did on mine. I have an RGB NES and the AV outs give me a white screen. However, if your mod included a multi out for the RGB you can use SNES AV multiout and it will be better anyway being transcoded from the RGB.
@@pungisotu It all depends on how you wire up the three-position switch on the bottom of the console. There is an option to have three color palettes, but you can also have only two color palettes and have one position of the switch bypass the NESRGB board and use the original outputs. Since I only wanted two color palettes and like the idea of original functionality, I went with the second option. To answer HePPS's question, it IS possible to use the original composite output, but it is NOT possible to use the original composite output and RGB output simultaneously.
-Calls mini-din 9 a proprietary-
Wha-
But can you use the Zapper through that? These videos keep ignoring that question. You're better off using an emulator to play on HDMI because the zapper won't work either way, and at least on the emulator you'll get better colors. But can we use the zapper on a CRT through these YPbPr mods?
I'm no expert on Zappers, but from what I've read, whether or not it works is dependent on the screen's delay time, and modern TVs are too slow, so light guns like Zappers, Super Scopes, and Justifiers only work on CRTs. This mod lets you use the original RCA jacks to output composite if you want, but you can also use the multi out to output higher quality composite, s-video, or RGB, and I see no reason why any of those four video options would not work on a CRT, unless the video was fed through an video processing device that adds too much delay to the signal. By the way, RGB is not YPbPr. You cannot just plug it into your TV using multi-out-to-component cables like the ones HD Retrovision made. RGB either has to either be processed and converted into HDMI first, using something like an XRGB-mini, or fed into a CRT that can handle RGB directly, such as via a SCART connector, or BNC connectors some professional reference monitors use.
The question boils down to the response time of the ICs involved. Right? So, can we use the zapper on a CRT through these mods? If you put it through HDMI first, it won't work. The conversion from HDMI to anything a CRT can handle will not share the sync from the NES. I can convert from RGB to YPbPr with no delay. I may mod my CRTs to take RGB directly, though.
@@officermeowmeowfuzzyface4408 I'm sorry, but I'm not an electrical engineer or an expert on light gun tech, so I can't confirm or deny that. What I've said above is my best understanding; I think light guns would work fine via the multi out, but can't say for sure. The Zapper should almost certainly work fine via the original RCA jacks, since using them bypasses the new hardware, so long as you're using a CRT. I might do some testing sometime to confirm, but am swamped with other things right now.
@@snesinfoguy I'd love to see you review the zapper with that mod. The zapper is pretty much the only reason I'm refurbishing my NES.
@@officermeowmeowfuzzyface4408 Zapper should technically work through an NESRGB modded system, provided you use it on a plain old CRT. It shouldn't ever work on an LCD panel, regardless of any mods performed.
However, you can take a look at the NESLCDMOD project, one of which has had specifically rewritten Zapper game code in games like Duck Hunt & Hogan's Alley so that 3rd Party Zappers can work on your LCD. I have a video up on my channel if you want to know a bit more.
the good idea for modding is to use the french NES it has the same multi output, so you can just use it :) croggesserver.se/Images/221020081571.jpg
intel386DX it's not the same multi out port it's different ( I have one ) and the cables for it are ridiculously hard to find so if you already have one with the cable then why not but don't consider buying another cable for it
ok, but the hole is already, there so you just put your multout and do not have to drill other holes :)
intel386DX well ... Not really ... You cant fit the port because of the av box behind :/
you can desolder and remove the original port so it will free up space for the new one :)
2.bp.blogspot.com/_kGAOBLrWIr4/SyKJ1_viwjI/AAAAAAAAAYE/iY-75qG0Z-0/s1600-h/14+unit+lift+up.JPG
1.bp.blogspot.com/_kGAOBLrWIr4/SyKJ85JxNoI/AAAAAAAAAYM/hYpskn7mR08/s1600-h/15+unit+lift+up+2.JPG
intel386DX yes you're right but it seems rather difficult
Mike tysons punchout it my favorite game of all time
Do you happen to know if HDRetrovision cables would work on an RGB-modded NES like this?
lapinbeau I own these cables since I'm a big SNES collector, but never could find a compatible TV. All the ones I tested on failed, so I can't say. I doubt they'd work on an NES, but you could run it by Ste Kulov; I bet he'd know. If you do this mod, the S-video is a pretty nice second option :)
yes, in fact that's how my current setup works. you just need to wire the correct nesrgb pads to the correct pins on the multi out port.
It works