Situations like this makes me glad I'm more of a wooden meeples and cubes euro style gamer. Seems like it's predominantly the big, expensive, mini heavy, tons of stretch goal and ks exclusives games that end up in financial trouble...
Thank you for talking about this. Hope you put out more on these topics. I think most people have had some level of bad experience with a project if they have backed 10 to 20 so far. It is kind of enevtitable and while it sucks to go through it there is much to learn from it. Even when it is out of your control as long as you know your limits and when to walk away it will be okay. Knowing this many have contributed to Mythic because they feel committed already and believe they will be getting a game that they will enjoy. While i disagree with how much they are asking I am hard pressed to think of another game that can scratch the itch the same. That kind of fomo makes me want to throw good money after bad every time and no ammount of experience shakes that feeling. I am sure people felt just like that with Darkest Dungeon. Best to be preventative. Get base game only, $1 back, late pledge or even just wait for the 2nd crowd funding project. The fomo from missed exclusives and missed early birds never hurts as bad as the fomo you create for yourself.
Hi Chris! For the 1€ pledge is a strategy I will take more often, absolutely. But for this case the PM closed around March last year. Clearly the money went for other projects. A strategy which I'm using for mitigating the risk of crowdfunding, is not having multiple pledges undelivered with the same publisher. And if a publisher has too many outstanding projects, i need to reaccess the risk. I'm an awaken realms fan boy, and even with them I stick with my "one project at the time" rule.
I always do $1 pledge when available because it allows you to postpone the final decision as long as possible and have the most information before committing your funds. In the case of 6 Siege though, pledging $1 wouldn't have gotten you out of the current situation, because Mythic didn't announce the additional contribution until they closed the pledge manager. Mythic didn't ask for more money until many months after they closed the pledge manager.
I actually didn't back during the campaign; I late backed the project. But that didn't help at all in this case, since the issues that Mythic faced only surfaced well after the 6 Siege PM closed. 😕
Same here , I late pledge. Again the problems always arise later in the project, which means nobody were really thinking they would be doing that. Pay for shipping again? I may have pay it, like for Darkest Dungeon, but here it's not even produce! One thing I learn, until most of my KS are delivered, I will not even for 1 dollar pledge. Sorry this Mythic debacle will affect many other company.
"Fool me once, shame on you. Fool me twice, shame on me". I'll write this off to experience, and back far, far fewer KS projects in future. And none at all from Mythic Games or the key people behind it.
"If you're not sold on it, I don't care what anyone says" stand out quote. I've backed Marvel United at a dollar but left it, lots of minis but I don't play with what I have already, Zombicide White Death, love it but will it get played, unlikely. FOMO gnaws at my mind but I know not backing it, is the right decision, but pretty so pretty it is, my precious.... . I'm finding games are fulfilling and I'm not getting them to the table. They look great but they're just not being played. Great discussion by the way.
The big deal here is that their MOQ is 1000 copies for a print run. As of this morning they were sitting at about 1200 English backers that paid extra, and a total of about 300 between all the other languages, which French being the most at around 180. Looks like the games will be printed in English only, which is yet another gut punch to those who paid for another language. Supposedly they are going to provide the already translated rules in PDF form, but again that's more money Mythic wasted on translating something they aren't even going to make now.
Thanks for making these kinds of videos. I am looking forward to your video on Steeped games since I was unfortunately a backer of that game for me and my wife to play. I am though one of the lucky ones that has never backed a project from Mythic since they usually didn't appeal to me much as a euro gamer and I've known of their other issues with their previous projects. Keep up the good work
The quantum is likely understated because the amount actually asked is multiples of what was declared in their email. They add $$ fir each item you select over and above your pledge level and ask for 100% of shipping again. For example, I backed at the lowest pledge level at $69 but they have asked for more than $39. They have actually asked fir $106, because I added a few maps and dice etc, and they included shipping in full again.
No allegedly in the shipping.. it was added on in their back-office system. As was the component breakdown contributions. So add ons also got contribution added on when completing the ransom submission
For people of lower income like me it's usually better to pledge during campaign, pay shipping a few months later, and then usually have a year or so to get ready for taxes. Being able to separate the expenses helps. But I try to only back reprints, or games from companies that have delivered multiple projects. Safer that way. I think people are too tough on board gane developers, it's a small hobby, these companies aren't huge money movers. Obviously Mythic is never to be trusted again, but other more responsible companies need to crowdfund, this hobby is very niche.
Thanks Chris, one of the more honest takes on this debacle. Mythic have £300 of mine but wont get a penny more. They wont even refund my Solomon Kane preorder which will clearly never happen. Just blamed it on the transfer of IP, which was months ago. Monolith will not honor pre order so wtf 😢.
On Discord Marco said they had enough people for ENG version (which was 1200 at that point) In total roughly 2k people made the contribution. From 10k backers, that's about 20% which will be a bit lower with late backers. Pretty sure they also didn't base the contribution on a full print run, so apparently it was only a 1k print run. So people are paying too much regardless of the claim that it was carefully calculated so people don't pay more than needed. Looks like Mythic will be in some profit the more people do the contribution!
It's actually about 1500 people total that have contributed as of 5/9/23. Marco also said they only had about 9200 people complete their pledge manager, which is interesting.
@@PRC533 I see, yeah that's strange. Also, someone on their discord said that Marco clarified they didn't need 30% of backers but 30% of the contribution total, so depending on pledge level it might be less backers. Also, there were 1.5k of the 10.8k at 1$ pledge. So not a lot of people converting then, and basically no late pledges? Weird.
I have worked retail for years. The margins for profit and the margins for failure are both soooo small. Every project could be your last. If you are not making at least 30% profit, it's probably not worth it. And you don't keep profit. It goes back into the company to make the next thing. Also, if you don't have enough cash to pay all your employees for 6 months with no income, you do not realistically have enough money to stay afloat.
Thx Mr Liege, great video. I have been very lucky in crowdfunding never backing any Mythic stuff. Though my thoughts on crowdfunding have changed since I been waiting for coming on 4 years for Arkeis. After imo seeing this poor run campaign backers we’re finally told the games were on the boat. I had a sigh of relief maybe we will get the game after actually just writing it off as a loss. Anyway I’m just rambling now. In short my wallet has tightened up significantly on crowdfunding projects. I’m will to wait for retail. If it doesn’t make it to retail, oh well plenty great games that do. Fomo was such a real thing for me I really had to change my mindset. Again thx Liege great channel
Just to confirm, yes the invoice I received for the core box was $72 - which is more than the original pledge! All-in premium backers have invoices of $245. Unbelievable
We had to pay shipping again. So for me it was just the base game: $39 contribution and $33 extra shipping. My total amount is now on $170 for just the base game.
Latest numbers are over 1500 people an they have hit enough numbers to get a one an done production run done in English, will it be here for october, i doubt it even as someone who paid the ransom, i believe it will arrive in january-march next year
I also believe this project will actually deliver. Hence, why I'm acutely going to pay the contribution. I do however have my doubts about hel and Anastyr though - ESPECIALLY Anastyr.
@@TheRealSwiggy yeah I'd have doubts about those also if I'd have backed them, I didn't myself, but I'd worry about bigger fees to be paid, especially hel as I believe it's still under playtesting an rules writing. 6 siege an darkest dungeon 2nd wave should be more than fine though
First kickstarter I backed was Peterson games Hyperspace 😅 hahaha what a baptism into kickstarter, anyone else went into that blackhole? Do people still Barbour hope there? In all fairness they seem to be handling crisis better than Mythic did…
Mythic Games opened a reprint of Solomon Kane last November. They promised to have the game this April 7th. I asked them since last month. And after almost a month of "bothering" them for my order they told me that IP was sold to Monolith and the order will be covered by Monolith. I asked Amanda Gilles from Mythic Games for a name from Monolith to check the order. She started to ghosting me. I emailed directly Monolith. They confirmed that the IP was sold to them but the orders need to be covered by Mythic Games. I went back to Mythic Games and no answer since. I hope my bad experience works as an example for others to avoid this turbulence of this company during this time
Is not like Monolith is that much better. Over 2 years waiting on Mythic Battles Ragnarok and their communication isn't great. They obtained the rights to Solomon Kane from Mythic, but they are coy about the pre-order that Mythic was running and have not clearly addressed the issue. The Orc Quest was an easy thing for them to run. Everything was done. I don't think Monolith is the savior company some are making them out to be.
Chai Tea for Two. Funding goal was 20k and they funded at 200k. How do they botch that? They probably underestimated the cost for the Deluxe version of regular Chai which did deliver. Including that one, Mythic Battles Ragnorak, Village Attacks and Monumental, I am out of about $1k. Pretty much done with risking it now.
i actually recalibrated after watching one of your videos on FOMO...it is a good thing to take a moment and reassess. I backed 6 Siege and made the decision to pay the ransom...mainly because it was cheap compared to what things are now and is par compared to recent campaigns so from a value perspective i'm fine with that. I am not fine with a ransom and wont be backing a Mythic game again anytime soon. I think they will deliver. they have said all the addons and expansions/extra stuff is all one wave so i think we will get everything we shoul dget PROVIDING they reach the money goal they need to manufacture. While they are clearly horribly mismanaged and ultimately will likely fail I believe (aka hope) they will deliver this before folding. It is a pyramid scheme but not really a scheme because I dont think it was intentional but absolutely they are using money from other things to fund the current one so any subsequent campaign is very likely not deliverable no matter what the ransom is unless it is literally full price.
Personally I can't magine they can survive long enough to get the rest of the crowdfunded games to backers. The cash is spent, and they've been financing previous campaigns with current campaigns. That's why they have to launch a million campaigns for games not delivered to just move forward at all. I can't pinpoint the reason but the french dude rubbed me the wrong way the first time I saw him. Somehow they found it correct for every Kickstarter campaign to have him fly over to the US for a sponsored prime time DT video.
How the hell are people still throwing money at them? Do people realise they are actually running away with money from regular purchases from their online store, not just crowdfunding? I preordered Solomon Kane on their website, 1 year and 2 months ago… I’m assuming there’s a whole year’s worth of other orders they’ve taken money from with no refund, no product, no response from emails.
I really wanted Anastyr and Village Attacks: Grim Dynasty. Both games had such great looking minis. Right now Mythic is failing, extorting its customers and Grimlord games is dead, dissolved and having its assets sold out. I don't feel that good that I didn't lose my money as I feel sad the materials I previewed are very likely never going to come out.
So I backed base Anastyr right from Kickstarter. The art and minis look AMAZING. But my wife caught eye of some miniatures that she disapproved of, between her own dislike and the fact that we have kids not wanting to expose them to some of those miniatures I begrudgingly emailed mythic and got my money back quite fast. Like this was weeks into the pledge manager. Before ANYBODY knew that this was going to happen…. I should thank my wife…
I almost backed it but like your wife I found some things I didn't really like. I'm not a fan of scantily clad women and men in my board games. I have no problem with attractive characters but not when its really sexual. I don't play board games to be horny.
1 print run because its a private, external IP with a contractual termination date. They dont get the rights to print it forever. Its just like any other IP-based game that are now out of print. I doubt MG will have any trust from IPs for a long time if they are still around in the future. Also, you've made some false narratives as well as are gas lighting on some points. For the $1 or base pledge. That wouldnt have saved ANY backers of Mythic Games' games. What is happening now wasnt known at the time of the KS nor Late Pledge. So, that spaghetti-on-the-wall response didnt stick. Also, MG doesnt need every backer to pay the contribution. They need around 30%. This is from King Of Average's video where he spoke with Leo from MG. I'm not sure why your reasons struck a negative chord with me. Many points are valid, but maybe it is the misinformation and alternate narrative of the historic facts that really bothered me. Hope you have a great day!
Boardgamewire asked Mythic for 2021 and 2022 figures for company revenue, profitability, debt level and cash flow, as well as a current balance sheet with assets and liabilities, but Leonidas replied, “Our best response will not be to give out balance sheets but to show that we are delivering the games when these exceptional contributions are requested. We did it with Darkest Dungeon, and we will do it again with 6: Siege.” This is a joke. And they announced that they received enough money to start the production of Siege, BUT, that they let the contribution opened until May 24?? To expect that this announcement of production that NOBODY can verify the veracity will decide the last backers to give their money? this is really incredible..
that is "kickstarter: the legaliced scam" and there will be no consequences whatsoever again. thank you to all the good companies that delivered the product.
I've stopped backing any and all kick-starters over the last year. Retail is where it's at nowadays. Retail is usually cheaper, fixed, and 100% real. As a Darkest Dungeon backer, I hope everyone pays Mythic' s ransom so they can use some of that money to finish the Darkest Dungeon pledges/add-ons.
Yeah thankfully mythics history with rulebooks kept me away I very easily could have backed this. I think I may stick with some of the safer companies for a bit while the dust settles with so many companies going under
The first game I backed in crowdfunding failed (the Jurassic world miniature game), I’ve been doing the $1 pledge since. Speaking of, Monster Hunter Iceborne is coming out soon. I don’t have any boss battlers and the genre looks interesting. Any thoughts on that genre as a whole? Recommendations?
Hey, serious question: how does the 1$ pledge help in the regard of for example what happened with Mythic games. That only protects you in the timespan until the pledge manager opens and if the problems occur later ist lost anyways. Also I would not recommend you Iceborn. Take a look at Aeons Trespass Odyssee which is going into second printing soon. Iceborn will be from Steam forged games which had lots of problems in the past and even on the monster hunter kickstarter had very much cards misprinted. but thats just my opinion
@@RiftOutMainly, the $1 pledge keeps me from getting FOMO as hard. If I only have a few days to make a decision I’m more likely to spend money, but if I have a few extra weeks or months to think about it, I’m far less likely to spend it. Thanks for the input about iceborn, I’m still pretty new to board gaming, I don’t really know that companies yet.
wow before i watched the video i though they somehow got their hands on the right to the fallout ip and are going to run a kickstarter in this situation xD
To be fair, we are always missing out with over 1000 new games every year no one can have them all. Good advice to not FOMO and just get what is right for you. In the end are you going to play it or is it just going to sit on the self?
Totally agree. Been one of the vocal opponents in the 6:Siege comments, and there are a lot of backers who aren't paying more. It is a ridiculous amount with an obvious charge to keep mythic afloat. I am not "contributing", when in reality their "contribution" is really ransom. You pay or don't get your game. I hope mythic fails because of this.
One Bucket cuz too often throughout history has that been the demise of many. Skyrim, pffft; for me I still don’t see the longevity allure of a board game version over video game format which is more encompassing and engaging. $1 pledge and Late Pledge, same here
I feel as if the entire Mythic situation is the result of three faults: Mythic is at fault for overextending themselves and poorly managing their finances. Stretch goals and daily unlocks are great, but when it gets to the point where it hinders progress, it's problematic. Just considering how behind Hel has been, the fact that they continued to launch new campaigns afterward was always a red flag to me. Kickstarter is a fault for the system of allowing big companies like Mythic to continue to run new campaigns when multiple ones are unfinished. Honestly, after the 6: Siege campaign, they should not have been able to launch MonPoc or Anastyr until after Hel delivered. It's a case where I feel KS really should be held more accountable. Just standing by and taking their cut, is not enough anymore. I always wondered if when companies decided to run a new campaign when a previous one is still in the works, they even check to how the most recent campaign is progressing or if the funds have been managed. Finally, and this might not be the favorite opinion, I think backers are slightly at fault too. I remember back during the Hel campaign, when there were a number of people in comments who highly recommend avoiding the game or at least waiting until the game hit retail, considering how Mythic Games responded to some of the flaws of the previous products. Even after the Hel campaign, and during the 6: siege campaign, I still remember others' expressions in the comments that backers should wait given their failure to deliver previous campaigns others simply didn't care. I feel it's a good case where backer diligence comes into play because anyone who looked at their previous campaigns would have seen that their track records were continuing to diminish.
bit late to this video but i just wanted to mention that i think this game did not finance other mythic titles but probably the other way around. its an IP game with massive skus, starting with way above average preproduction for mythic games standards (and almost done exclusively by european teams paid with european wages) and a noticable underpriced core pledge. and it only made a meager 1,5mil...
I really wish I hadn't backed Monpoc so deeply. I have put in for a refund a couple months ago, but I doubt I'll see that money, and I certainly don't expect them to actually make the game. Heck, if 6 Siege actually gets made to any quality standard I'll be shocked. My KS record has been good overall. Just MonPoc, my last bit of PG stuff, and my very first KS ever for a CoH successor have gone poorly. But, one should be careful, and this is why my KS stuff has dropped like a rock.
Hy Chris, i sent a PM to your mail, my previous message here has been deleted. You will find a reference to a French channel and a video where Leonidas attend the discussion and how he is already in difficulties and had a hard time to explain the delay of his games. It was in Sept 29 2019, before Covid and Ukraine.
Board game hobby is in a weird state right now - consolidated companies are all going through kickstarter now in order to get better margins and an interest free loan by consumers who will happily oblige and pour money at inflated prices. You can easily find amazing games at retail in the $40-$60 range, or major productions at $100, instead people are throwing $200+ all in pledges on untested games at kickstarter which have the real risk of not even delivering. Sooner or later this Mythic situation was bound to happen, and I'm pretty sure it won't be the last time with the heavy incentive the consumers are giving to companies to prey on them.
I think the lesson here is to never give money to mythic games ever again no matter how good the game may look I think their repetition is permanently Burnt
I think you're late to the game on this one. KOA and mythic released a FAQ.. They said 0% went to other projects that they blew the entire funds on this project. 2nd. They said they only need 35% of the backers to pay contribution to do a minimal print run.
That "interview" was bs and didn't say anything really new that their FAQ didn't. They spared the nitty gritty that people actually want to see because they actually have a duty to show where the money was spent
The word there using for more money is a voluntary "CONTRIBUTION", You may not see any product and they owe you nothing because you contributed. better to contribute to a food bank or homeless shelter: at least its going to someone who needs it.
Mythic is the poster child for the fragility of the crowdfunding model... Late pledge is no guarantee either... Look at LSG and Stormsunder... They announced closing of late pledge back in February because they "needed to get a count for production"... Closed the pledge manager in March/April. Then announced a week ago that all the production samples are done but they haven't finished the game testing and are looking for a release date of 2025... The campaign started in what? 2020? I don't think the money can last that long. Confidence level of delivery 2/10 even for base.
2 questions, where is all the HEL money? Eg my $400+ Aussie dollars? Are they making any money on Darkest Dungeon on Steam. Yes it's there. Is it theirs? When will we even get a reply regarding HEL. Please tell me more about HEL and less about 6 siege whatever 😢
@@darrenwoodman6656 It's the other way around. Mythic bought the boardgame part of the IP. The Steam game is the actual IP, the developers have no part in Mythic's fuck up.
That’s very good advice about just backing at a $1 pledge for future projects. The challenge is that some companies are going away from allowing that and still being able to get the exclusives or lower pricing from the campaign.
I backed 6S and a few more - Lots of upset folks , angry folks - threatening this and that - To me getting angry is a waste of time - you have to 24th of May to make a decision - I feel sorry for some who saved hard to back - but for the rest like me with disposable income - I find it interesting - I would like to think those screaming murder are young and inexperienced at life. I've KS a lot of games - if they arrive great if not - they don't . I spent 10 years plus traveling - I assumed all my stuff would be stolen off the bus, from my hotel, in the street etc - actually had very little stolen. - I met tourist came out of airport in said country - got into a "taxi' that took them to a run down neighbourhood and stole - everything - this is when you had hard cash or travellers cheques - some went home - some said I hate this country , these people - 2 weeks later they are happily backpacking around again with traveller cheques replaced and or new money sent . Doubt cause stress - will I get my game? Gulag Archipelago by Aleksandr Solzhenitsyn - will they torture me , destroy my body , kill my family ? will I give them power over me. I ran a business - Covid comes along - how will it go? - see the future it will go bad - Oh well that sucks - next week happy relaxed self When I was 19 someone suggested I buy $1000 of shares in some new merchant bank - was completely like South Park - yep all gone - Didn't realise what tossers 80s merchant banks were - assisting asset stripping , pension fund stealing - I had completely forgotten about that money - but the reactions on the KS and BGG page made me remember - I just shrugged - TBF - this was in the no doubt stage - so no stress. I don't hate MG - I think they are poor businessmen - They could of handled this much better - They could have used another company that was trusted to oversee the contributions and maybe a 2nd KS More chance those that pay the extra get theri game than everyone gets a refund. MG should make a statement on 20th if they definitely intend to print -- then those with indecision have a little more info - IF MG fails here it's over - ie do not print and do not refund the extra contributions.
I'd like to quote on of the great thinkers😵💫 of our time: "There's an old saying in Tennessee-I know it's in Texas, probably in Tennessee-that says, 'Fool me once, shame on... shame on you. Fool me-you can't get fooled again. '" - former President of the United States George W. Bush; Nashville, Tennessee; September 17, 2002.
Hopefully one thing we take away from Mythic's failure is a little less hype from the youtube hypesters. I did appreciate Alex from Boardgameco basically apologizing for Siege 6 since he loved it so much and told so many people to back it.
picture liking something and telling you they like it and then the company screws both of you. Do you blame them? Alex apologizes because it feels bad but he can't predict the future and he's also genuine in his opinion. It's not hype, you like it or you dont.
Most of those channels were paid to hype it as well, so it's not really an issue of fault. Consumers need to be more critical of obviously sponsored content.
Alex apologised specifically as he does a "should you back" on grounds of holding value. If u don't get the game, there is no value and obviously quite the opposite! That's why the apology. Tbf I do think a lot of games are over hyped as the hype sells the industry as a whole
How many games that a year or so ago were "game of the year" only to be revisited now as "yeah was a bit grindy" or "yeah was a bit long i wont need all those expansions" or "yeah needed errata" - looking at you - Tainted Grail, Etherfields, 7th Continent, Solomon Kane, ISS, Nemesis, Sleeping Gods, Middara etc. Whilst ppl recognise these as star games then, now would only get 6 maybe 7/10
I tend to be in line with your views, but here there are some issues that I do not agree. The actual situation was hidden from the backers. Mythic Games failed to deliver, starting with Darkest Dungeon. At that point they should have stopped creating new projects and redo what they did with Super Fanatasy Brawl. Take Solomon Kane, an excellent game they never reoffer it. They event send the errata for free. Other companies ask you more money plus shipping. It is wrong to discourage people from paying the ransom. They (Leo) mentioned that the extra money will be returned if they do not get enough money to generate an appropriate money. If noone pays for the ransom, companies goes down, no other game will be deliver, everybody will loose. So point 3, will happen definitely if noone through any money. For other companies, oathsworn, sheol, people even provided more funds for people that had no money or were assholes to pay anything. Has MG f$%#^up. definitely. Excluding 1 game, maybe 2 depending on who you are, has delivered great to excellent games, with almost good rulesbook.
You talk as if this was the end of the world. You can lose $200 dollars easily in a police ticket . The kickstarter is NOT A STORE. Is a place that you can collaborate with developers ,to help them make a real project. So talk as if Mythic Games haven't had problems in the past with projects that became more expensive because of the cost of shipping but they delivered them in the end without extra cost for people as they did for Solomon Kane. You talk as if there are guarantees in kickstart , but you admit that this is the reasons you never give more than $1 dollar to any project , or jut limit to the core game only. You live in a fantasy world dude , get out of that horse. Life is about taking risk and those that don't take risk never achieve anything in life. MYthing Games is not guilty as you claim for its problems.. A company that worked for them , went bankrupt and you want them to sacrifice their lives , just that people like you cannot lose a single dollar from their investment. How arrogant is this? Instead of becoming part of the solution , you choose to become part of the problem , by promoting the boycott of an amazing company that already have released 10 games high quality games.. more than what the majority of those mediocre game companies you support and have in your home ever produced. What you are really doing is quite SAD and Pathetic ,specially because during the pandemic Mythic Gamess iss not the only company that have suffered of of 1000% prices increase in shipping. Like i said ,KICKSTART is not a RETAIL GAME STORE , and it is in big letter warned that some projects could get delays , increase in prices and or never be released at all , because is a mutually shared project , that everyone collaborate to make it into the production. Mythic Games is asking more help and so many others developers have done the same too.. I bet that even a clown like you , if one day are short of money , will ask others help too. IS a normal thing,. there is nothing evil with this. People that the entire world depends of $150 to $200 dollars as you seem to be ,shouldn't be buying or playing board games at all. What i see instead in all this , is that in moment of difficulties , only the most sad and pathetic people , use their free time , to trash companies that there are many families work , that are doing their best , to keep their business going and deliver what they all intended to create.. Mythic track record is there , they delivered 10 games already and has to spend on their own money in the past . So is not the evil company you try to make it they are.
I agree that contributing €1 is a bit cowardly and leaving the risk of the project coming to fruition in the hands of other sponsors. But Mythic Games has no name, it seems (since it does not provide information on its financial accounts) that it has spent all the money raised on Kickstarter and, the late promises and shipping costs charged by Gamefound solely on the development of the game. I have helped the creators of other projects, where they requested coherent contributions. MG has not asked for help, he has demanded the contribution by blackmailing with either you pay me or I don't give you anything.
Situations like this makes me glad I'm more of a wooden meeples and cubes euro style gamer. Seems like it's predominantly the big, expensive, mini heavy, tons of stretch goal and ks exclusives games that end up in financial trouble...
Thank you for talking about this. Hope you put out more on these topics.
I think most people have had some level of bad experience with a project if they have backed 10 to 20 so far. It is kind of enevtitable and while it sucks to go through it there is much to learn from it. Even when it is out of your control as long as you know your limits and when to walk away it will be okay.
Knowing this many have contributed to Mythic because they feel committed already and believe they will be getting a game that they will enjoy. While i disagree with how much they are asking I am hard pressed to think of another game that can scratch the itch the same. That kind of fomo makes me want to throw good money after bad every time and no ammount of experience shakes that feeling. I am sure people felt just like that with Darkest Dungeon.
Best to be preventative. Get base game only, $1 back, late pledge or even just wait for the 2nd crowd funding project. The fomo from missed exclusives and missed early birds never hurts as bad as the fomo you create for yourself.
Hi Chris! For the 1€ pledge is a strategy I will take more often, absolutely. But for this case the PM closed around March last year. Clearly the money went for other projects. A strategy which I'm using for mitigating the risk of crowdfunding, is not having multiple pledges undelivered with the same publisher. And if a publisher has too many outstanding projects, i need to reaccess the risk. I'm an awaken realms fan boy, and even with them I stick with my "one project at the time" rule.
Sunk cost fallacy. Best just to write off your game and don’t give them more. Chris, glad you put out this video and asked the hard questions.
I always do $1 pledge when available because it allows you to postpone the final decision as long as possible and have the most information before committing your funds. In the case of 6 Siege though, pledging $1 wouldn't have gotten you out of the current situation, because Mythic didn't announce the additional contribution until they closed the pledge manager. Mythic didn't ask for more money until many months after they closed the pledge manager.
I actually didn't back during the campaign; I late backed the project. But that didn't help at all in this case, since the issues that Mythic faced only surfaced well after the 6 Siege PM closed. 😕
Same here , I late pledge. Again the problems always arise later in the project, which means nobody were really thinking they would be doing that. Pay for shipping again? I may have pay it, like for Darkest Dungeon, but here it's not even produce! One thing I learn, until most of my KS are delivered, I will not even for 1 dollar pledge. Sorry this Mythic debacle will affect many other company.
They have completely mismanaged your money so far. It would be brave to give them more.
There is a very fine line between bravery and idiocy.
"Fool me once, shame on you. Fool me twice, shame on me". I'll write this off to experience, and back far, far fewer KS projects in future. And none at all from Mythic Games or the key people behind it.
"If you're not sold on it, I don't care what anyone says" stand out quote. I've backed Marvel United at a dollar but left it, lots of minis but I don't play with what I have already, Zombicide White Death, love it but will it get played, unlikely. FOMO gnaws at my mind but I know not backing it, is the right decision, but pretty so pretty it is, my precious.... . I'm finding games are fulfilling and I'm not getting them to the table. They look great but they're just not being played. Great discussion by the way.
The big deal here is that their MOQ is 1000 copies for a print run. As of this morning they were sitting at about 1200 English backers that paid extra, and a total of about 300 between all the other languages, which French being the most at around 180. Looks like the games will be printed in English only, which is yet another gut punch to those who paid for another language. Supposedly they are going to provide the already translated rules in PDF form, but again that's more money Mythic wasted on translating something they aren't even going to make now.
Thanks for making these kinds of videos. I am looking forward to your video on Steeped games since I was unfortunately a backer of that game for me and my wife to play. I am though one of the lucky ones that has never backed a project from Mythic since they usually didn't appeal to me much as a euro gamer and I've known of their other issues with their previous projects. Keep up the good work
The quantum is likely understated because the amount actually asked is multiples of what was declared in their email. They add $$ fir each item you select over and above your pledge level and ask for 100% of shipping again. For example, I backed at the lowest pledge level at $69 but they have asked for more than $39. They have actually asked fir $106, because I added a few maps and dice etc, and they included shipping in full again.
This was a great explanation of the sheer magnitude of their problem.
No allegedly in the shipping.. it was added on in their back-office system. As was the component breakdown contributions. So add ons also got contribution added on when completing the ransom submission
For people of lower income like me it's usually better to pledge during campaign, pay shipping a few months later, and then usually have a year or so to get ready for taxes. Being able to separate the expenses helps. But I try to only back reprints, or games from companies that have delivered multiple projects. Safer that way.
I think people are too tough on board gane developers, it's a small hobby, these companies aren't huge money movers. Obviously Mythic is never to be trusted again, but other more responsible companies need to crowdfund, this hobby is very niche.
Thanks Chris, one of the more honest takes on this debacle. Mythic have £300 of mine but wont get a penny more. They wont even refund my Solomon Kane preorder which will clearly never happen. Just blamed it on the transfer of IP, which was months ago. Monolith will not honor pre order so wtf 😢.
On Discord Marco said they had enough people for ENG version (which was 1200 at that point) In total roughly 2k people made the contribution. From 10k backers, that's about 20% which will be a bit lower with late backers. Pretty sure they also didn't base the contribution on a full print run, so apparently it was only a 1k print run. So people are paying too much regardless of the claim that it was carefully calculated so people don't pay more than needed. Looks like Mythic will be in some profit the more people do the contribution!
It's actually about 1500 people total that have contributed as of 5/9/23. Marco also said they only had about 9200 people complete their pledge manager, which is interesting.
@@PRC533 I see, yeah that's strange. Also, someone on their discord said that Marco clarified they didn't need 30% of backers but 30% of the contribution total, so depending on pledge level it might be less backers. Also, there were 1.5k of the 10.8k at 1$ pledge. So not a lot of people converting then, and basically no late pledges? Weird.
I have worked retail for years. The margins for profit and the margins for failure are both soooo small. Every project could be your last. If you are not making at least 30% profit, it's probably not worth it. And you don't keep profit. It goes back into the company to make the next thing. Also, if you don't have enough cash to pay all your employees for 6 months with no income, you do not realistically have enough money to stay afloat.
Thx Mr Liege, great video. I have been very lucky in crowdfunding never backing any Mythic stuff. Though my thoughts on crowdfunding have changed since I been waiting for coming on 4 years for Arkeis. After imo seeing this poor run campaign backers we’re finally told the games were on the boat. I had a sigh of relief maybe we will get the game after actually just writing it off as a loss. Anyway I’m just rambling now. In short my wallet has tightened up significantly on crowdfunding projects. I’m will to wait for retail. If it doesn’t make it to retail, oh well plenty great games that do. Fomo was such a real thing for me I really had to change my mindset. Again thx Liege great channel
Just to confirm, yes the invoice I received for the core box was $72 - which is more than the original pledge! All-in premium backers have invoices of $245. Unbelievable
I'm so glad I didn't back these Mythic games. I'm so careful now - if and when I back games.
Thank you for doing these videos.
I missed out on 6 siege and Monsterpocalypse due to other KS that I could play with the family. Completely agree with it being ok to miss out.
We had to pay shipping again. So for me it was just the base game: $39 contribution and $33 extra shipping. My total amount is now on $170 for just the base game.
The Mint Tim line was strong and the latest KS, they vanished without a word
Latest numbers are over 1500 people an they have hit enough numbers to get a one an done production run done in English, will it be here for october, i doubt it even as someone who paid the ransom, i believe it will arrive in january-march next year
You still believe a word Mythic Games tell you?
@@ViscountCharles well they wouldn't still be around an talking if they wouldn't, they'd have already beggered off
I also believe this project will actually deliver. Hence, why I'm acutely going to pay the contribution. I do however have my doubts about hel and Anastyr though - ESPECIALLY Anastyr.
@@TheRealSwiggy yeah I'd have doubts about those also if I'd have backed them, I didn't myself, but I'd worry about bigger fees to be paid, especially hel as I believe it's still under playtesting an rules writing.
6 siege an darkest dungeon 2nd wave should be more than fine though
@@TableTopWolf1984 they're scum who just want to graft more money
Retail only for me. I’m not backing anything via crowdfunding anymore.
First kickstarter I backed was Peterson games Hyperspace 😅 hahaha what a baptism into kickstarter, anyone else went into that blackhole? Do people still Barbour hope there? In all fairness they seem to be handling crisis better than Mythic did…
Mythic Games opened a reprint of Solomon Kane last November. They promised to have the game this April 7th. I asked them since last month. And after almost a month of "bothering" them for my order they told me that IP was sold to Monolith and the order will be covered by Monolith. I asked Amanda Gilles from Mythic Games for a name from Monolith to check the order. She started to ghosting me. I emailed directly Monolith. They confirmed that the IP was sold to them but the orders need to be covered by Mythic Games. I went back to Mythic Games and no answer since. I hope my bad experience works as an example for others to avoid this turbulence of this company during this time
If they‘d sell 6 siege to monolith and monolith would do another campaign like they did with orc quest. I‘d go all in.
They can't sell the license to the IP. Monolith would have to get it from ubisoft.
Is not like Monolith is that much better. Over 2 years waiting on Mythic Battles Ragnarok and their communication isn't great. They obtained the rights to Solomon Kane from Mythic, but they are coy about the pre-order that Mythic was running and have not clearly addressed the issue.
The Orc Quest was an easy thing for them to run. Everything was done. I don't think Monolith is the savior company some are making them out to be.
Chai Tea for Two. Funding goal was 20k and they funded at 200k. How do they botch that? They probably underestimated the cost for the Deluxe version of regular Chai which did deliver.
Including that one, Mythic Battles Ragnorak, Village Attacks and Monumental, I am out of about $1k. Pretty much done with risking it now.
i actually recalibrated after watching one of your videos on FOMO...it is a good thing to take a moment and reassess. I backed 6 Siege and made the decision to pay the ransom...mainly because it was cheap compared to what things are now and is par compared to recent campaigns so from a value perspective i'm fine with that. I am not fine with a ransom and wont be backing a Mythic game again anytime soon. I think they will deliver. they have said all the addons and expansions/extra stuff is all one wave so i think we will get everything we shoul dget PROVIDING they reach the money goal they need to manufacture. While they are clearly horribly mismanaged and ultimately will likely fail I believe (aka hope) they will deliver this before folding. It is a pyramid scheme but not really a scheme because I dont think it was intentional but absolutely they are using money from other things to fund the current one so any subsequent campaign is very likely not deliverable no matter what the ransom is unless it is literally full price.
Personally I can't magine they can survive long enough to get the rest of the crowdfunded games to backers. The cash is spent, and they've been financing previous campaigns with current campaigns. That's why they have to launch a million campaigns for games not delivered to just move forward at all. I can't pinpoint the reason but the french dude rubbed me the wrong way the first time I saw him. Somehow they found it correct for every Kickstarter campaign to have him fly over to the US for a sponsored prime time DT video.
You know what really sucks? They are still accepting late pledges on a few of their campaigns from unsuspecting backers.
I believe gamefound just shut that down
How the hell are people still throwing money at them? Do people realise they are actually running away with money from regular purchases from their online store, not just crowdfunding? I preordered Solomon Kane on their website, 1 year and 2 months ago… I’m assuming there’s a whole year’s worth of other orders they’ve taken money from with no refund, no product, no response from emails.
Because of sunk cost fallacy.
@@PRC533 true and sad :/
I really wanted Anastyr and Village Attacks: Grim Dynasty. Both games had such great looking minis.
Right now Mythic is failing, extorting its customers and Grimlord games is dead, dissolved and having its assets sold out.
I don't feel that good that I didn't lose my money as I feel sad the materials I previewed are very likely never going to come out.
I used to be too kern to back. Several times now I have backed some projects when I could have waited to retail and saved lots of cash.
So I backed base Anastyr right from Kickstarter. The art and minis look AMAZING. But my wife caught eye of some miniatures that she disapproved of, between her own dislike and the fact that we have kids not wanting to expose them to some of those miniatures I begrudgingly emailed mythic and got my money back quite fast. Like this was weeks into the pledge manager. Before ANYBODY knew that this was going to happen…. I should thank my wife…
I almost backed it but like your wife I found some things I didn't really like. I'm not a fan of scantily clad women and men in my board games. I have no problem with attractive characters but not when its really sexual. I don't play board games to be horny.
i agree with you with most of the stuff, if you are targetting mythic games, they used to be reputable. BUT things went down and changed it
1 print run because its a private, external IP with a contractual termination date. They dont get the rights to print it forever. Its just like any other IP-based game that are now out of print. I doubt MG will have any trust from IPs for a long time if they are still around in the future.
Also, you've made some false narratives as well as are gas lighting on some points. For the $1 or base pledge. That wouldnt have saved ANY backers of Mythic Games' games. What is happening now wasnt known at the time of the KS nor Late Pledge. So, that spaghetti-on-the-wall response didnt stick.
Also, MG doesnt need every backer to pay the contribution. They need around 30%. This is from King Of Average's video where he spoke with Leo from MG.
I'm not sure why your reasons struck a negative chord with me. Many points are valid, but maybe it is the misinformation and alternate narrative of the historic facts that really bothered me. Hope you have a great day!
Ouch…. So much $ lost. And we wonder why people aren’t backing as much on crowdfunding now. The risk is insane
Boardgamewire asked Mythic for 2021 and 2022 figures for company revenue, profitability, debt level and cash flow, as well as a current balance sheet with assets and liabilities, but Leonidas replied, “Our best response will not be to give out balance sheets but to show that we are delivering the games when these exceptional contributions are requested. We did it with Darkest Dungeon, and we will do it again with 6: Siege.”
This is a joke. And they announced that they received enough money to start the production of Siege, BUT, that they let the contribution opened until May 24?? To expect that this announcement of production that NOBODY can verify the veracity will decide the last backers to give their money? this is really incredible..
Late back is also at risk, did this with Sub Terra II and lost my money.
that is "kickstarter: the legaliced scam" and there will be no consequences whatsoever again. thank you to all the good companies that delivered the product.
I've stopped backing any and all kick-starters over the last year. Retail is where it's at nowadays. Retail is usually cheaper, fixed, and 100% real. As a Darkest Dungeon backer, I hope everyone pays Mythic' s ransom so they can use some of that money to finish the Darkest Dungeon pledges/add-ons.
Yeah thankfully mythics history with rulebooks kept me away I very easily could have backed this. I think I may stick with some of the safer companies for a bit while the dust settles with so many companies going under
The first game I backed in crowdfunding failed (the Jurassic world miniature game), I’ve been doing the $1 pledge since.
Speaking of, Monster Hunter Iceborne is coming out soon. I don’t have any boss battlers and the genre looks interesting. Any thoughts on that genre as a whole? Recommendations?
Hey, serious question: how does the 1$ pledge help in the regard of for example what happened with Mythic games. That only protects you in the timespan until the pledge manager opens and if the problems occur later ist lost anyways.
Also I would not recommend you Iceborn. Take a look at Aeons Trespass Odyssee which is going into second printing soon. Iceborn will be from Steam forged games which had lots of problems in the past and even on the monster hunter kickstarter had very much cards misprinted. but thats just my opinion
@@RiftOutMainly, the $1 pledge keeps me from getting FOMO as hard. If I only have a few days to make a decision I’m more likely to spend money, but if I have a few extra weeks or months to think about it, I’m far less likely to spend it.
Thanks for the input about iceborn, I’m still pretty new to board gaming, I don’t really know that companies yet.
wow before i watched the video i though they somehow got their hands on the right to the fallout ip and are going to run a kickstarter in this situation xD
To be fair, we are always missing out with over 1000 new games every year no one can have them all. Good advice to not FOMO and just get what is right for you. In the end are you going to play it or is it just going to sit on the self?
Totally agree. Been one of the vocal opponents in the 6:Siege comments, and there are a lot of backers who aren't paying more. It is a ridiculous amount with an obvious charge to keep mythic afloat. I am not "contributing", when in reality their "contribution" is really ransom. You pay or don't get your game. I hope mythic fails because of this.
One Bucket cuz too often throughout history has that been the demise of many.
Skyrim, pffft; for me I still don’t see the longevity allure of a board game version over video game format which is more encompassing and engaging.
$1 pledge and Late Pledge, same here
I feel as if the entire Mythic situation is the result of three faults:
Mythic is at fault for overextending themselves and poorly managing their finances. Stretch goals and daily unlocks are great, but when it gets to the point where it hinders progress, it's problematic. Just considering how behind Hel has been, the fact that they continued to launch new campaigns afterward was always a red flag to me.
Kickstarter is a fault for the system of allowing big companies like Mythic to continue to run new campaigns when multiple ones are unfinished. Honestly, after the 6: Siege campaign, they should not have been able to launch MonPoc or Anastyr until after Hel delivered. It's a case where I feel KS really should be held more accountable. Just standing by and taking their cut, is not enough anymore. I always wondered if when companies decided to run a new campaign when a previous one is still in the works, they even check to how the most recent campaign is progressing or if the funds have been managed.
Finally, and this might not be the favorite opinion, I think backers are slightly at fault too. I remember back during the Hel campaign, when there were a number of people in comments who highly recommend avoiding the game or at least waiting until the game hit retail, considering how Mythic Games responded to some of the flaws of the previous products. Even after the Hel campaign, and during the 6: siege campaign, I still remember others' expressions in the comments that backers should wait given their failure to deliver previous campaigns others simply didn't care. I feel it's a good case where backer diligence comes into play because anyone who looked at their previous campaigns would have seen that their track records were continuing to diminish.
bit late to this video but i just wanted to mention that i think this game did not finance other mythic titles but probably the other way around. its an IP game with massive skus, starting with way above average preproduction for mythic games standards (and almost done exclusively by european teams paid with european wages) and a noticable underpriced core pledge. and it only made a meager 1,5mil...
I really wish I hadn't backed Monpoc so deeply. I have put in for a refund a couple months ago, but I doubt I'll see that money, and I certainly don't expect them to actually make the game. Heck, if 6 Siege actually gets made to any quality standard I'll be shocked.
My KS record has been good overall. Just MonPoc, my last bit of PG stuff, and my very first KS ever for a CoH successor have gone poorly. But, one should be careful, and this is why my KS stuff has dropped like a rock.
Hy Chris, i sent a PM to your mail, my previous message here has been deleted. You will find a reference to a French channel and a video where Leonidas attend the discussion and how he is already in difficulties and had a hard time to explain the delay of his games. It was in Sept 29 2019, before Covid and Ukraine.
According to Mythic English release has been confirmed hitting minimum
FOMC - Fear of Missing Clicks. 😱
Board game hobby is in a weird state right now - consolidated companies are all going through kickstarter now in order to get better margins and an interest free loan by consumers who will happily oblige and pour money at inflated prices. You can easily find amazing games at retail in the $40-$60 range, or major productions at $100, instead people are throwing $200+ all in pledges on untested games at kickstarter which have the real risk of not even delivering. Sooner or later this Mythic situation was bound to happen, and I'm pretty sure it won't be the last time with the heavy incentive the consumers are giving to companies to prey on them.
Good luck finding a game like Kingdom Death Monster or Aeon Trespess in retail. There is no massive games that goes to retail.
I think the lesson here is to never give money to mythic games ever again no matter how good the game may look I think their repetition is permanently Burnt
I think you're late to the game on this one. KOA and mythic released a FAQ.. They said 0% went to other projects that they blew the entire funds on this project. 2nd. They said they only need 35% of the backers to pay contribution to do a minimal print run.
That "interview" was bs and didn't say anything really new that their FAQ didn't. They spared the nitty gritty that people actually want to see because they actually have a duty to show where the money was spent
And I don't believe a word out of their vomit holes
The word there using for more money is a voluntary "CONTRIBUTION", You may not see any product and they owe you nothing because you contributed. better to contribute to
a food bank or homeless shelter: at least its going to someone who needs it.
Mythic is the poster child for the fragility of the crowdfunding model... Late pledge is no guarantee either... Look at LSG and Stormsunder... They announced closing of late pledge back in February because they "needed to get a count for production"... Closed the pledge manager in March/April. Then announced a week ago that all the production samples are done but they haven't finished the game testing and are looking for a release date of 2025... The campaign started in what? 2020? I don't think the money can last that long. Confidence level of delivery 2/10 even for base.
2 questions, where is all the HEL money? Eg my $400+ Aussie dollars? Are they making any money on Darkest Dungeon on Steam. Yes it's there. Is it theirs? When will we even get a reply regarding HEL. Please tell me more about HEL and less about 6 siege whatever 😢
Ok my bad, it's desktop dungeons. Soz
Still thanks. Great video
No it's not. Darkest Dungeon is on steam. Now available, I shit you not. Red Hook Studios. Is this affiliated with Mythic Games?
@@darrenwoodman6656 It's the other way around. Mythic bought the boardgame part of the IP. The Steam game is the actual IP, the developers have no part in Mythic's fuck up.
That’s very good advice about just backing at a $1 pledge for future projects. The challenge is that some companies are going away from allowing that and still being able to get the exclusives or lower pricing from the campaign.
I backed 6S and a few more - Lots of upset folks , angry folks - threatening this and that - To me getting angry is a waste of time - you have to 24th of May to make a decision - I feel sorry for some who saved hard to back - but for the rest like me with disposable income - I find it interesting - I would like to think those screaming murder are young and inexperienced at life.
I've KS a lot of games - if they arrive great if not - they don't . I spent 10 years plus traveling - I assumed all my stuff would be stolen off the bus, from my hotel, in the street etc - actually had very little stolen. - I met tourist came out of airport in said country - got into a "taxi' that took them to a run down neighbourhood and stole - everything - this is when you had hard cash or travellers cheques - some went home - some said I hate this country , these people - 2 weeks later they are happily backpacking around again with traveller cheques replaced and or new money sent .
Doubt cause stress - will I get my game?
Gulag Archipelago by Aleksandr Solzhenitsyn - will they torture me , destroy my body , kill my family ? will I give them power over me.
I ran a business - Covid comes along - how will it go? - see the future it will go bad - Oh well that sucks - next week happy relaxed self
When I was 19 someone suggested I buy $1000 of shares in some new merchant bank - was completely like South Park - yep all gone - Didn't realise what tossers 80s merchant banks were - assisting asset stripping , pension fund stealing - I had completely forgotten about that money - but the reactions on the KS and BGG page made me remember - I just shrugged - TBF - this was in the no doubt stage - so no stress.
I don't hate MG - I think they are poor businessmen - They could of handled this much better - They could have used another company that was trusted to oversee the contributions and maybe a 2nd KS
More chance those that pay the extra get theri game than everyone gets a refund.
MG should make a statement on 20th if they definitely intend to print -- then those with indecision have a little more info - IF MG fails here it's over - ie do not print and do not refund the extra contributions.
Hope the backers take legal actions
I'd like to quote on of the great thinkers😵💫 of our time:
"There's an old saying in Tennessee-I know it's in Texas, probably in Tennessee-that says, 'Fool me once, shame on... shame on you. Fool me-you can't get fooled again. '" - former President of the United States George W. Bush; Nashville, Tennessee; September 17, 2002.
Oefff
Hopefully one thing we take away from Mythic's failure is a little less hype from the youtube hypesters. I did appreciate Alex from Boardgameco basically apologizing for Siege 6 since he loved it so much and told so many people to back it.
picture liking something and telling you they like it and then the company screws both of you. Do you blame them?
Alex apologizes because it feels bad but he can't predict the future and he's also genuine in his opinion. It's not hype, you like it or you dont.
@@jhowd78 that’s very true too
Most of those channels were paid to hype it as well, so it's not really an issue of fault. Consumers need to be more critical of obviously sponsored content.
Alex apologised specifically as he does a "should you back" on grounds of holding value. If u don't get the game, there is no value and obviously quite the opposite! That's why the apology. Tbf I do think a lot of games are over hyped as the hype sells the industry as a whole
How many games that a year or so ago were "game of the year" only to be revisited now as "yeah was a bit grindy" or "yeah was a bit long i wont need all those expansions" or "yeah needed errata" - looking at you - Tainted Grail, Etherfields, 7th Continent, Solomon Kane, ISS, Nemesis, Sleeping Gods, Middara etc. Whilst ppl recognise these as star games then, now would only get 6 maybe 7/10
I tend to be in line with your views, but here there are some issues that I do not agree.
The actual situation was hidden from the backers.
Mythic Games failed to deliver, starting with Darkest Dungeon. At that point they should have stopped creating new projects and redo what they did with Super Fanatasy Brawl. Take Solomon Kane, an excellent game they never reoffer it. They event send the errata for free. Other companies ask you more money plus shipping.
It is wrong to discourage people from paying the ransom. They (Leo) mentioned that the extra money will be returned if they do not get enough money to generate an appropriate money.
If noone pays for the ransom, companies goes down, no other game will be deliver, everybody will loose.
So point 3, will happen definitely if noone through any money.
For other companies, oathsworn, sheol, people even provided more funds for people that had no money or were assholes to pay anything.
Has MG f$%#^up. definitely.
Excluding 1 game, maybe 2 depending on who you are, has delivered great to excellent games, with almost good rulesbook.
All should refund the game :D
You cannot receive a refund if the bank is empty.
You talk as if this was the end of the world. You can lose $200 dollars easily in a police ticket . The kickstarter is NOT A STORE. Is a place that you can collaborate with developers ,to help them make a real project. So talk as if Mythic Games haven't had problems in the past with projects that became more expensive because of the cost of shipping but they delivered them in the end without extra cost for people as they did for Solomon Kane. You talk as if there are guarantees in kickstart , but you admit that this is the reasons you never give more than $1 dollar to any project , or jut limit to the core game only.
You live in a fantasy world dude , get out of that horse. Life is about taking risk and those that don't take risk never achieve anything in life. MYthing Games is not guilty as you claim for its problems.. A company that worked for them , went bankrupt and you want them to sacrifice their lives , just that people like you cannot lose a single dollar from their investment. How arrogant is this? Instead of becoming part of the solution , you choose to become part of the problem , by promoting the boycott of an amazing company that already have released 10 games high quality games.. more than what the majority of those mediocre game companies you support and have in your home ever produced. What you are really doing is quite SAD and Pathetic ,specially because during the pandemic Mythic Gamess iss not the only company that have suffered of of 1000% prices increase in shipping. Like i said ,KICKSTART is not a RETAIL GAME STORE , and it is in big letter warned that some projects could get delays , increase in prices and or never be released at all , because is a mutually shared project , that everyone collaborate to make it into the production. Mythic Games is asking more help and so many others developers have done the same too.. I bet that even a clown like you , if one day are short of money , will ask others help too. IS a normal thing,. there is nothing evil with this. People that the entire world depends of $150 to $200 dollars as you seem to be ,shouldn't be buying or playing board games at all. What i see instead in all this , is that in moment of difficulties , only the most sad and pathetic people , use their free time , to trash companies that there are many families work , that are doing their best , to keep their business going and deliver what they all intended to create.. Mythic track record is there , they delivered 10 games already and has to spend on their own money in the past . So is not the evil company you try to make it they are.
I agree that contributing €1 is a bit cowardly and leaving the risk of the project coming to fruition in the hands of other sponsors.
But Mythic Games has no name, it seems (since it does not provide information on its financial accounts) that it has spent all the money raised on Kickstarter and, the late promises and shipping costs charged by Gamefound solely on the development of the game.
I have helped the creators of other projects, where they requested coherent contributions. MG has not asked for help, he has demanded the contribution by blackmailing with either you pay me or I don't give you anything.