I’ll pin this comment because there might be people who don’t understand methaphors. Amanda Overton specifically tells us the context of the fight scene and how we would understand the deleted scene through it. When I say that Jinx basically slapped Ekko on the bridge, I obviously mean it in a methaphorical sense, because she didn’t, she simply gave up while Ekko probably wanted to talk to her. I also do not think her taking out the grenade was out of malice(you can obviously look at her face and tell that). That is the connection to what Amanda Overton tells us about the deleted scene. There are other things to be mentioned about the fight scene in terms of interpretation, but for the context given I believe this makes sense.
I think this would've fit perfectly if it went: Cold open where Vi and Cait argue in their cell before getting separated > Ekko reveals himself to Vi > Opening credits > _The deleted scene with young Ekko and young Jinx_ > Seamless transition back to a hardened, present day Ekko confronting Vi Don't get me wrong, the episode we got was already fantastically written and paced, and I instantly understood the dynamic between Jinx and Ekko that they were attempting to convey. Very subtle and efficient storytelling. But I really do agree that their bridge battle would've hit _even harder_ if we got to see those flashback scenes firsthand.
Maybe I over-interpreted the bridge scene back then, but I always thought Jinx was actually heartbroken by the fact that Ekko really tried to kill her. Like you said maybe Jinx told him she didn't want to be rescued but in her weird way she liked that Ekko still cared for her. I also assume she missed the fourth shot on purpose and never had the intent to kill Ekko
2:04 Honestly i think it would have set up their fight at the end perfectly (the one we got is still good tho). Nobody was thinking ''oh so ekko wanted to save powder but she didn't wanna get saved'' when they showed the memories of Ekko and Powder playing a game. We would know that they were good friends before everything but not about Ekko wanting to save Powder because he thought SIlco was keeping her as a prisoner. So i don't know what she is on about.
@@passiontech1254also it would have alluded to their feelings towards each other. Not the uncertain “is she flirting with him?” That happened during that fight. Also the season 2 set up of timebomb. It seems like they simultaneously over and underestimated the audience with this show. There’s Far too much that they didn’t outline but felt people would figure out and vise versa. There’s people arguing things literally stated in the show didn’t happen or that the characters are “wrong” when they explain their own motivations. It’s actually insane
I think if they had put that scene in the episode, it would have built a stronger relationship between Ekko and Jinx. And we would understand more about what happened in the past and why Jinx called him "The boy savior". Amanda basically saying that that scene would have made the bridge scene hit less, I disagree, I think it would have made it stronger, because now you have a better understanding of what happened between them.
@@Smokey348romantic relationship. It’s also come up that he always had romantic feelings for her and we never knew if she felt the same…. Until the art book explained she did in fact have romantic feelings for him. So the flashback was extremely needed as it would have cleared up a lot of unnecessary speculation.
@@vikkidonn that memory just showed us that they were good friends years before. In episode 7 s2 it showed that they were in a relationship which cemented that in the main timeline they did have feelings for it eachother
@ no It doesn’t. It would have showed the true dynamics between them through the images as well as their actual dialogue in such a flashback. Most of the audience was able to glean that Ekko had romantic feelings for powder/jinx. This is just based on their interactions in season 1. The only question was what jinx felt for him in return. Adding a flashback showing he’d attempted to take her away from silco would have fully cemented this plot point as being romantic in nature. Claiming they were “good friends” is blatantly false given full context in the show as well as the writer statements ect. You can maybe argue they were “just” friends as children however the flash’s while they were fighting and their interactions always contradicted this assessment. Because again at the very least it was clear Ekko had romantic feelings for her. I say this because as we speak there are sections calling season 2 trash and claiming several things including timebomb was completely last minute based on fan service. Because they claim there was nothing in season 1 to indicate a romance nor how they got together. This isn’t true but it’s it’s because the writers left too many loose threads instead of just adding more concrete scenes like this one. It would have confirmed the nature of their relationship because Ekko and jinx would have made some off hand comment about their true feelings for each other. Ekko lost the girl he was in love with he would have had some kind of reaction to her refusal to go with him. It wouldn’t have just been a silent staring contest. And even if it was that’s not what good friends do.
Jinx pulling out the grenade wasn't an act of defiance. It was an act of resignation and helplessness. Ekko, inciting the game they used to play by pulling out the pocket watch, snapped Jinx back into powder. When Ekko won, he froze not because he couldn’t kill Jinx, his past childhood friend. When he looked into her eyes he knew it was Powder staring back at him. Powder then gave a half smile and a slight blink of her eyes, as if to say “I know, and I’m sorry”. She then pulled out the grenade knowing that Echo would have enough time to get away, but that it would take her life. She did know that Echo was going to try to talk her out of continuing down the path of jinx. But she felt that there was no way out for her. Even if she could somehow get past everything she had done, Jinx was still a deep part of her by then. And even more importantly, where would she go? What would she do? Silco was like a father figure to her, and she couldn't just leave him. Even if she did what would happen to her? Would he hunt her down? Would he capture her and convince her back into being Jinx? In her eyes, she wanted to stay in that moment and stay Powder, but she knew that she couldn't. so she gave her nod of apology and slight smile of gratitude and pulled the pin.
This then sets up in season 2 Ekkoo coming to save her, and telling her that no matter what we've done in the past it's never too late to start something new.
@@passiontech1254 I understand that, it’s methaphorically speaking, Ekko most likely would’ve tried to save her or talk to her but she doesn’t want that, she gives up. That is a methaphorical slap in Ekko’s face, and not one out of malice.
I figured you likely knew and chose to not put it all in your video. The metaphorical slap makes sense. Its one of my favorite scenes and I wanted to give others the chance to understand it fully. Great video. I hope you keep making them!
@@passiontech1254 yeah, I didn’t add that part because I think most people understand these interpretations of the fight scene(I could be wrong) so I discussed only through the context given by Amanda Overton
@@DefaultDanielSGaming I think it depends on how obsessed someone is with the show. Anyone watching this channel is probably a big fan at a minimum, but I didn't make that connection fully until the third time that I watched it. It might seem obvious to you, but keep in mind you're a content creator, and may not give yourself credit for the depth and complexity of things you think through, even compared to others who are big fans. I think that people would not shy away from going deep into nuanced understandings. Makes for good content. Just my opinions.
What!? I knew they had deleted that scene but I caused it... I thought it was for the same reason as the second scene: the duration... they could have put the scene after their fight on the bridge and then show Jinx's body next to Ekko's watch.
Am agree with you at 100% like it is obvious for me but maybe we are wrong. In 7 years I see Ekko and Jinx fight a multiple time and Ekko just give up fight after fight and the moment when Jinx kill the girl with pink hair ( i dont remember her name but she look like Vi and she play with Ekko and jinx in the trailer) Ekko just goes wild. Idk if writer forgive them but not me lol. And for me it is a mistake to not put him in the dimensions with Powder.
We needed that flashback scene. All we get from the bridge fight flashes is that Ekko and Powder used to spar, not that he tried specifically to save her, and she slapped him. In fact, the existence of the flashback is almost contradicted by Ekko's insistence that "Powder is gone. It's just Jinx now", because he doesn't even struggle with that assumption till the bridge fight. Knowing Ekko saved everyone but Powder recontextualizes everyone he's saved since then. He's happy to help, but one of the people he wanted to help most rejected him, and is killing off everyone he saves who fights alongside Ekko. And it changes how we view Jinx, because she refused to leave Silco (and her Jinx persona) for Ekko, but she considers it for Vi.
Actually, I feel differently. When Ekko tells Vi that Powder was gone and can't be saved, I took it as him speaking from experience since he said it so confidently. Like "No, trust me. I tried! It's not possible." I would have still enjoyed the deleted scene, but I definitely got the implication that he had tried to get her back.
@@bunsbuns9072 That makes sense. Still, knowing and seeing are very different experiences. Since they worked on S1 and 2 simultaneously, I'm surprised they knew Timebomb would be relevant and STILL didn't keep the scene.
I think they could have added one line that would make it clearer. Ehen Ekko tells Vi she can't save powder, he could have said "you can't, I tried" instead of just "you can't"
@@alexanderschimke5503 Vi can see it in his reaction, prior to that he mentions that Powder is gone and only Jinx is left who belongs to Silco, I think it’s better that way
I gotta say, Amanda is objectively wrong here. Like half the audience missed that that was even a significant relationship between the two even after the bridge fight.
omg ... are you kidding?! I had almost exactly that scene in my head over and over again and now it turns out they really had it like that, whaaat I'm in shock 😭😂 I am already writing on a fanfic and now I have some solid inspiration here... even more than before also like the thought that Ekko might tried to save her several times and while Jinx is refusing it, she still notices that someone cares for her - nice point! I had some ideas in mind for this chapter like Ekko may attacks a shimmer fabric and then meets Powder/Jinx again for the first time? first they are happy to see each other but then it ends in a fight... still not sure about it, but something like this is playing in my mind ;)
@@Anna-c9v1o I think Jinx wouldn’t show Ekko those emotions of being happy to see eachother because that would motivate him even more to save her, however we know he gave up on her
@@Anna-c9v1o I think she has to do some super insane stuff for Ekko to give up, maybe she reflects on things in her solitude but Silco is in her life ready to keep those thoughts away.
They couldn’t, because it would’ve confirmed Ekko’s statement. Swayed the audience to agree. Without that scene it allows room for doubt/ or doesn’t make Ekko look childish and bitter, since we know what Jinx is capable of. Him giving up, given his perception of Silco, would appear low effort.
And while I do think flashbacks are necessary, pinning the cause on Silco’s existence feels incorrect. Silco wasn’t the main influence for Jinx’s behavior, it’s Vi. What she sees in Silco is a kindred spirit. In her diary she’s sees him as similar to her, broken. The innate issue is Ekko would be treating her like a damsel in destress, the exact opposite of who powder / Jinx wants to be. She wants to be useful. It would be better for them to highlight that he approached her as a knight in shining armor instead of approaching with a purpose. This will be his only difference between the previous attempt, episode nine, and how everyone has failed prior. Ekko after multiple tries to get to the point in telling her there’s purpose and potential in moving forward. No Vi in 8 doesn’t count because Caitlyn ruined that. “No amount of good deeds can erase our crimes… “ then Vi tells Jinx we can change your story if she does good right after. Ekko didn’t ask anything of her, he couldn’t know about the war yet, so he doesn’t have anything to convince her to do, other than making something new. IE there’s always a need for her (ironically, the same thing Viktor tried to do for her).
@@757reaper As the writers mentioned, without Silco telling her what to do, she can finally make her own decisions Here is the interview where Christian Linke the co-creator mentions that, so Silco absolutely had major influence on her life. screenrant.com/arcane-season-2-christian-linke-interview/
@ Not can, has to and Yes, that is a big difference. She could always make her own decisions, which we watch she disobeyed Silco at every moment. She made her own decisions, that is the point of what Ekko was saying in the first place. She doesn’t have to be Silco’s Goon, she chose it. But what you’re saying is not incorrect, but we are not talking about the same thing, and the thing you’re talking about proves my point. The nature of Powder to be entirely devoted to the people who are most important in her life, which is the point of ep7 to display her dependency to assisting other people’s needs and wants. Also she literally says it was VI’s voice that made her this way. She’s killing enforcers indiscriminately because Vi hated them. Silco just gave here the thing she needs, purpose. One that aligns with the old VI’s wants.
@@757reaper Silco still manipulated her throughout her life, and having a scene where Ekko tries to save her doesn't take anything away from the moment with Ekko and Vi, that moment on it's own confirms that Ekko tried saving her, the audience doesn't have to guess, Vi also knows that when she sees his reaction.
@ manipulated her through out her life? How are you defining manipulation here? Would you say the same about Vander when he, in the conversation to Vi, used powder and her adoptive brothers as an emotional tools to prevent her from doing what she thought was the right choice? Fighting back against their oppressors? In that case, all parents manipulate their children, because all parents are trying to guide their children to what they think is best. This doesn’t change whether they’re right or wrong. This is the nature of perspective. She was not Silco’s puppet; they were was an unhealthily attached child and parent who, as here guardian, was poorly equipped to deal with the trauma powder had. He tried to resolve her trauma through acceptance instead of properly processing it because he hadn’t either. She needed help he couldn’t provide. It’s not about whether Ekko tried to “Save her,” or not, it’s about the effort. We cannot judge his effort because we cannot see it. What we know is who Jinx is, we watched her end a minimum of 3 firelights, one point blank. Him saying she can’t be saved already makes since in that context, and with our the extra scene allows ppl to believe Vi can reach her because ppl don’t know why he believes it’s impossible. It could be because she has killed many of them, but he also could’ve failed because Ekko’s effort was minimal, or his method failed. Showing the scene either kills the belief that Vi is capable because she literally tries to do the same thing (by not accepting who she is now, and trying to force her to be that useless little girl who killed her family from Jinx’s perspective), or makes Ekko look like he didn’t try all that hard and is bitter little boy for being rejected (so that the audience can believe Vi could do what Ekko could not). By not showing it the audience can make their own inferences.
I feel like a generation of audiences have been ruined by the Snyder cut. Everyone feels entitled to these "deleted scenes" and personally agrieved at their exclusion. This isn't how art works...you get the final product, take it or leave it. Personally, I wish the creators wouldn't even talk about this stuff and avoid fueling the fire, but I suppose somehow they're defending their art in their minds. The fact we're now going back to gripe about season one stuff, the season I thought we all agreed was perfect, just proves how out of control fandoms can get. Idk, just a thought I had, y'all do y'all I guess.
@@kyu2o337 I can guarantee you that creators of entertainment were talking about deleted ideas long before that movie. Arcane is over, some don’t even care about the next show so for the next few years these are going to be some of the talking points. I believe you’re blowing things out of proportion
@DefaultDanielSGaming Dawg, I've probably watched more content dissecting Arcane than Arcane itself... I get being obsessed with something you love. That isn't what I'm talking about. Analyzing every frame of a show is one thing, complaining about what you DIDN'T get is another.
@@kyu2o337 I didn't complain, and talking about what we could've gotten and we could still get in a different form doesn't mean complaining, it simply means you loved the show so you want to see more People who talked about Ambessa's past, and how they wanted to know more about her in season 1, do you think those people complained and that's why the creators are going to release a book about her?
@DefaultDanielSGaming I'm not necessarily talking about you specifically, more a trend I've seen. Speculating about what might be in season two is obviously not the same as complaining about "missing" scenes from a completed piece of art. Again, not saying that's what you're doing, just speaking broadly.
@@kyu2o337 people complaining about the season being rushed shouldn't be discredited just because that was the vision of the creators, on the other hand people who attack the creators are freaks I don't think being a creator allows you to be complacent and not care at all about what the audience says, I also don't think the creators should jump up at every stupid thing the community complains about. Take Witcher for example, they deviated from the lore in season 1, the show did great anyways. They didn't listen at all to the lore based complaints and then in season 2 they mega deviated from it which resulted in a bad reception. Did they have to implement everything those people complained about? No, but if they had listened, the 2nd season wouldn't have those massive lore changes.
to say that jinx slapped him with the bomb is insulting to the work, you don't seem to understand what happened despite all the efforts they made to make us understand the tragedy of the situation, she tried to commit suicide while giving ekko enough time to escape hence the slow and delicate gesture when she dropped the bomb next to them, she wanted to end it all, not to troll ekko, it's ridiculous, but hey, people aren't stupid, you're just giving arguments that justify what timebomb fans think, except that you understand the opposite xD
I didn't say she trolled him, it was basically a slap in his face methaphorically speaking because he couldn't save her, that is tied with his previous failure in the scene mentioned by Amanda, otherwise there is no connection to that. Amanda clearly states that through the fight scene we can understand the moment she describes from their childhood. I also added a line saying that there are other interpretations tied to the scene but I mentioned the one which fits the context of the deleted moment.
@@DefaultDanielSGaming there's a gigantic contrast between the past when he was trying to save her and now when he's trying to finish her off, the fact that he hesitated doesn't mean he's gone back to his past resolution of saving her, that was only the case from ep 7 of s2, so your remark, while interesting, is totally out of place given the situation, on the other hand, the fight generally shows the tragic side and the conclusion of what happened between the 2 and of this relationship, which was only revived thanks to AU powder, but well, as you said, it can be interpreted in different ways, and so many scenes have been cut that we'll never get the full picture.
@@ravenjo9145 Ekko stops himself from finishing the job because of their childhood(not that exact scene), it is a pivotal moment for Ekko which is why he remembers it in Season 2 Ep 7. I believe he also remembers it because he probably wanted to do more, but Jinx pulled out the grenade. I totally agree with you here btw, that she pulled it out slowly to give him time to react, but from a methaphorical stand point, it almost felt like a slap in Ekko's face, not one to troll him but one where he realizes that he can't save her in that moment, similar to how he couldn't do it in that deleted scene. That's how I tie it to the scene mentioned by Amanda Overton When it comes to getting the full picture, well, that's why I keep pushing for a novel, maybe one day it will happen
@@DefaultDanielSGaming he was very hostile towards AU powder so no, he had made his decision and she had not changed before AU powder made him change his mind, moreover during the whole thing until episode 7 not once did he care about her or what had become of her, I remind you that jinx killed a lot of his friends and made him suffer, it is unrealistic to imagine anything else coming from him
@@ravenjo9145 I'm specifically talking about that moment, a moment where you can see both of them externalizing all previous events while remembering their past. Don't forget that Amanda Overton specifically mentions that we could get all the story she explained to us of Ekko trying to save Powder through the fight scene, and I believe the way I explained it makes sense. Everything you said makes sense and I agree but that is outside of the context given by Amanda Overton.
Honestly, I'm not a fun of the ship and I think people tend to overinterpret, sometimes forcibly; but at least I believe that among hundreds of videos you propose a calmer reasoning, often avoiding confeming - as others do - based on external elements - like artbook - precisely the relationship, love, between the two. In my opinion, the only thing that could actually exist is one based on a feeling of friendship, at least in the current state of affairs.
I’ll pin this comment because there might be people who don’t understand methaphors.
Amanda Overton specifically tells us the context of the fight scene and how we would understand the deleted scene through it.
When I say that Jinx basically slapped Ekko on the bridge, I obviously mean it in a methaphorical sense, because she didn’t, she simply gave up while Ekko probably wanted to talk to her. I also do not think her taking out the grenade was out of malice(you can obviously look at her face and tell that).
That is the connection to what Amanda Overton tells us about the deleted scene. There are other things to be mentioned about the fight scene in terms of interpretation, but for the context given I believe this makes sense.
Arcane needs to do what old dvds used to do and add a whole section where you can watch the delete scenes
they will probably release a box set version of season 2 or the entire show, maybe that's the opportunity for something like that
I would have preferred to have this deleted scene of Ekko and Jinx, it would have added a lot to the episode 7.
PREACHHH WHOEVER KEEPS DELETING THESE SCENES NEEDS TO SIT DOWNNN
@@samantha_2666In the sit of shame
You can say this for almost every deleted scene we hear about
@@samantha_2666 🤣
@@nobleneed
I agree with you on this, I think the main problem with the second season was the video clip.
The fact Ekko tried to save Jinx REALLY gives so much more weight to their interactions. And completely contextualize her calling him Boy Savior.
I really think they could have just put that scene after their fight and before seeing jinx's unconscious body.
😯
I think this would've fit perfectly if it went:
Cold open where Vi and Cait argue in their cell before getting separated > Ekko reveals himself to Vi > Opening credits > _The deleted scene with young Ekko and young Jinx_ > Seamless transition back to a hardened, present day Ekko confronting Vi
Don't get me wrong, the episode we got was already fantastically written and paced, and I instantly understood the dynamic between Jinx and Ekko that they were attempting to convey. Very subtle and efficient storytelling. But I really do agree that their bridge battle would've hit _even harder_ if we got to see those flashback scenes firsthand.
Pure TimeBomb channel
nah, I'm not a shipper or however it's called
@ That may be the case, however you are one the ship’s strongest soldiers. Keep up the good work!
@@DefaultDanielSGaming the ship is strong within you
@@DefaultDanielSGaming keep shipping the good ship!
Maybe I over-interpreted the bridge scene back then, but I always thought Jinx was actually heartbroken by the fact that Ekko really tried to kill her.
Like you said maybe Jinx told him she didn't want to be rescued but in her weird way she liked that Ekko still cared for her.
I also assume she missed the fourth shot on purpose and never had the intent to kill Ekko
yeah, I think there are multiple ways to interpret that, I based that interpretation on the context given by Amanda Overton
2:04 Honestly i think it would have set up their fight at the end perfectly (the one we got is still good tho).
Nobody was thinking ''oh so ekko wanted to save powder but she didn't wanna get saved'' when they showed the memories of Ekko and Powder playing a game.
We would know that they were good friends before everything but not about Ekko wanting to save Powder because he thought SIlco was keeping her as a prisoner.
So i don't know what she is on about.
I agree. I don't think anyone alluded that Echo had previously tried to save powder and it didn't work specifically.
@@passiontech1254also it would have alluded to their feelings towards each other. Not the uncertain “is she flirting with him?” That happened during that fight. Also the season 2 set up of timebomb.
It seems like they simultaneously over and underestimated the audience with this show. There’s Far too much that they didn’t outline but felt people would figure out and vise versa. There’s people arguing things literally stated in the show didn’t happen or that the characters are “wrong” when they explain their own motivations. It’s actually insane
I think if they had put that scene in the episode, it would have built a stronger relationship between Ekko and Jinx. And we would understand more about what happened in the past and why Jinx called him "The boy savior". Amanda basically saying that that scene would have made the bridge scene hit less, I disagree, I think it would have made it stronger, because now you have a better understanding of what happened between them.
Yeah i don't know what she was on about.
It would have set up the fight quite perfectly (and their friendship)
The scene she was describing didn't seem to up much time too if that was another concern.
@@Smokey348romantic relationship. It’s also come up that he always had romantic feelings for her and we never knew if she felt the same…. Until the art book explained she did in fact have romantic feelings for him.
So the flashback was extremely needed as it would have cleared up a lot of unnecessary speculation.
@@vikkidonn that memory just showed us that they were good friends years before.
In episode 7 s2 it showed that they were in a relationship which cemented that in the main timeline they did have feelings for it eachother
@ no It doesn’t. It would have showed the true dynamics between them through the images as well as their actual dialogue in such a flashback. Most of the audience was able to glean that Ekko had romantic feelings for powder/jinx. This is just based on their interactions in season 1. The only question was what jinx felt for him in return. Adding a flashback showing he’d attempted to take her away from silco would have fully cemented this plot point as being romantic in nature. Claiming they were “good friends” is blatantly false given full context in the show as well as the writer statements ect. You can maybe argue they were “just” friends as children however the flash’s while they were fighting and their interactions always contradicted this assessment. Because again at the very least it was clear Ekko had romantic feelings for her.
I say this because as we speak there are sections calling season 2 trash and claiming several things including timebomb was completely last minute based on fan service. Because they claim there was nothing in season 1 to indicate a romance nor how they got together. This isn’t true but it’s it’s because the writers left too many loose threads instead of just adding more concrete scenes like this one. It would have confirmed the nature of their relationship because Ekko and jinx would have made some off hand comment about their true feelings for each other. Ekko lost the girl he was in love with he would have had some kind of reaction to her refusal to go with him. It wouldn’t have just been a silent staring contest. And even if it was that’s not what good friends do.
Jinx pulling out the grenade wasn't an act of defiance. It was an act of resignation and helplessness. Ekko, inciting the game they used to play by pulling out the pocket watch, snapped Jinx back into powder. When Ekko won, he froze not because he couldn’t kill Jinx, his past childhood friend. When he looked into her eyes he knew it was Powder staring back at him. Powder then gave a half smile and a slight blink of her eyes, as if to say “I know, and I’m sorry”. She then pulled out the grenade knowing that Echo would have enough time to get away, but that it would take her life.
She did know that Echo was going to try to talk her out of continuing down the path of jinx. But she felt that there was no way out for her. Even if she could somehow get past everything she had done, Jinx was still a deep part of her by then. And even more importantly, where would she go? What would she do? Silco was like a father figure to her, and she couldn't just leave him. Even if she did what would happen to her? Would he hunt her down? Would he capture her and convince her back into being Jinx?
In her eyes, she wanted to stay in that moment and stay Powder, but she knew that she couldn't. so she gave her nod of apology and slight smile of gratitude and pulled the pin.
This then sets up in season 2 Ekkoo coming to save her, and telling her that no matter what we've done in the past it's never too late to start something new.
@@passiontech1254 I understand that, it’s methaphorically speaking, Ekko most likely would’ve tried to save her or talk to her but she doesn’t want that, she gives up. That is a methaphorical slap in Ekko’s face, and not one out of malice.
I figured you likely knew and chose to not put it all in your video. The metaphorical slap makes sense. Its one of my favorite scenes and I wanted to give others the chance to understand it fully. Great video. I hope you keep making them!
@@passiontech1254 yeah, I didn’t add that part because I think most people understand these interpretations of the fight scene(I could be wrong) so I discussed only through the context given by Amanda Overton
@@DefaultDanielSGaming I think it depends on how obsessed someone is with the show. Anyone watching this channel is probably a big fan at a minimum, but I didn't make that connection fully until the third time that I watched it. It might seem obvious to you, but keep in mind you're a content creator, and may not give yourself credit for the depth and complexity of things you think through, even compared to others who are big fans. I think that people would not shy away from going deep into nuanced understandings. Makes for good content. Just my opinions.
What!? I knew they had deleted that scene but I caused it... I thought it was for the same reason as the second scene: the duration... they could have put the scene after their fight on the bridge and then show Jinx's body next to Ekko's watch.
I think it was for duration and this is just some hindsight justification, cause it barely makes any sense lol
Am agree with you at 100% like it is obvious for me but maybe we are wrong. In 7 years I see Ekko and Jinx fight a multiple time and Ekko just give up fight after fight and the moment when Jinx kill the girl with pink hair ( i dont remember her name but she look like Vi and she play with Ekko and jinx in the trailer) Ekko just goes wild. Idk if writer forgive them but not me lol. And for me it is a mistake to not put him in the dimensions with Powder.
We needed that flashback scene. All we get from the bridge fight flashes is that Ekko and Powder used to spar, not that he tried specifically to save her, and she slapped him. In fact, the existence of the flashback is almost contradicted by Ekko's insistence that "Powder is gone. It's just Jinx now", because he doesn't even struggle with that assumption till the bridge fight.
Knowing Ekko saved everyone but Powder recontextualizes everyone he's saved since then. He's happy to help, but one of the people he wanted to help most rejected him, and is killing off everyone he saves who fights alongside Ekko.
And it changes how we view Jinx, because she refused to leave Silco (and her Jinx persona) for Ekko, but she considers it for Vi.
Actually, I feel differently. When Ekko tells Vi that Powder was gone and can't be saved, I took it as him speaking from experience since he said it so confidently. Like "No, trust me. I tried! It's not possible." I would have still enjoyed the deleted scene, but I definitely got the implication that he had tried to get her back.
@@bunsbuns9072 That makes sense. Still, knowing and seeing are very different experiences. Since they worked on S1 and 2 simultaneously, I'm surprised they knew Timebomb would be relevant and STILL didn't keep the scene.
I think they could have added one line that would make it clearer. Ehen Ekko tells Vi she can't save powder, he could have said "you can't, I tried" instead of just "you can't"
@@alexanderschimke5503 Vi can see it in his reaction, prior to that he mentions that Powder is gone and only Jinx is left who belongs to Silco, I think it’s better that way
I hope they end up using that scene in the next series Jinx is in if she meters ekko again
I gotta say, Amanda is objectively wrong here. Like half the audience missed that that was even a significant relationship between the two even after the bridge fight.
omg ... are you kidding?! I had almost exactly that scene in my head over and over again and now it turns out they really had it like that, whaaat I'm in shock 😭😂 I am already writing on a fanfic and now I have some solid inspiration here... even more than before
also like the thought that Ekko might tried to save her several times and while Jinx is refusing it, she still notices that someone cares for her - nice point! I had some ideas in mind for this chapter like Ekko may attacks a shimmer fabric and then meets Powder/Jinx again for the first time? first they are happy to see each other but then it ends in a fight... still not sure about it, but something like this is playing in my mind ;)
@@Anna-c9v1o I think Jinx wouldn’t show Ekko those emotions of being happy to see eachother because that would motivate him even more to save her, however we know he gave up on her
@@DefaultDanielSGaming yes true, I meant it more like Ekko is happy and Jinx at first is surprised, at least not super angry from the beginning
@@Anna-c9v1o I think she has to do some super insane stuff for Ekko to give up, maybe she reflects on things in her solitude but Silco is in her life ready to keep those thoughts away.
@@DefaultDanielSGaming yeah I totally agree... hehe you're feeding my arcane-cracked brain with new ideas
They couldn’t, because it would’ve confirmed Ekko’s statement. Swayed the audience to agree. Without that scene it allows room for doubt/ or doesn’t make Ekko look childish and bitter, since we know what Jinx is capable of.
Him giving up, given his perception of Silco, would appear low effort.
And while I do think flashbacks are necessary, pinning the cause on Silco’s existence feels incorrect. Silco wasn’t the main influence for Jinx’s behavior, it’s Vi. What she sees in Silco is a kindred spirit. In her diary she’s sees him as similar to her, broken.
The innate issue is Ekko would be treating her like a damsel in destress, the exact opposite of who powder / Jinx wants to be. She wants to be useful.
It would be better for them to highlight that he approached her as a knight in shining armor instead of approaching with a purpose.
This will be his only difference between the previous attempt, episode nine, and how everyone has failed prior. Ekko after multiple tries to get to the point in telling her there’s purpose and potential in moving forward.
No Vi in 8 doesn’t count because Caitlyn ruined that. “No amount of good deeds can erase our crimes… “ then Vi tells Jinx we can change your story if she does good right after. Ekko didn’t ask anything of her, he couldn’t know about the war yet, so he doesn’t have anything to convince her to do, other than making something new. IE there’s always a need for her (ironically, the same thing Viktor tried to do for her).
@@757reaper As the writers mentioned, without Silco telling her what to do, she can finally make her own decisions
Here is the interview where Christian Linke the co-creator mentions that, so Silco absolutely had major influence on her life.
screenrant.com/arcane-season-2-christian-linke-interview/
@ Not can, has to and Yes, that is a big difference.
She could always make her own decisions, which we watch she disobeyed Silco at every moment. She made her own decisions, that is the point of what Ekko was saying in the first place. She doesn’t have to be Silco’s Goon, she chose it.
But what you’re saying is not incorrect, but we are not talking about the same thing, and the thing you’re talking about proves my point. The nature of Powder to be entirely devoted to the people who are most important in her life, which is the point of ep7 to display her dependency to assisting other people’s needs and wants.
Also she literally says it was VI’s voice that made her this way. She’s killing enforcers indiscriminately because Vi hated them. Silco just gave here the thing she needs, purpose. One that aligns with the old VI’s wants.
@@757reaper Silco still manipulated her throughout her life, and having a scene where Ekko tries to save her doesn't take anything away from the moment with Ekko and Vi, that moment on it's own confirms that Ekko tried saving her, the audience doesn't have to guess, Vi also knows that when she sees his reaction.
@ manipulated her through out her life? How are you defining manipulation here? Would you say the same about Vander when he, in the conversation to Vi, used powder and her adoptive brothers as an emotional tools to prevent her from doing what she thought was the right choice? Fighting back against their oppressors? In that case, all parents manipulate their children, because all parents are trying to guide their children to what they think is best. This doesn’t change whether they’re right or wrong. This is the nature of perspective. She was not Silco’s puppet; they were was an unhealthily attached child and parent who, as here guardian, was poorly equipped to deal with the trauma powder had. He tried to resolve her trauma through acceptance instead of properly processing it because he hadn’t either. She needed help he couldn’t provide.
It’s not about whether Ekko tried to “Save her,” or not, it’s about the effort. We cannot judge his effort because we cannot see it. What we know is who Jinx is, we watched her end a minimum of 3 firelights, one point blank. Him saying she can’t be saved already makes since in that context, and with our the extra scene allows ppl to believe Vi can reach her because ppl don’t know why he believes it’s impossible. It could be because she has killed many of them, but he also could’ve failed because Ekko’s effort was minimal, or his method failed. Showing the scene either kills the belief that Vi is capable because she literally tries to do the same thing (by not accepting who she is now, and trying to force her to be that useless little girl who killed her family from Jinx’s perspective), or makes Ekko look like he didn’t try all that hard and is bitter little boy for being rejected (so that the audience can believe Vi could do what Ekko could not).
By not showing it the audience can make their own inferences.
I feel like a generation of audiences have been ruined by the Snyder cut. Everyone feels entitled to these "deleted scenes" and personally agrieved at their exclusion. This isn't how art works...you get the final product, take it or leave it. Personally, I wish the creators wouldn't even talk about this stuff and avoid fueling the fire, but I suppose somehow they're defending their art in their minds.
The fact we're now going back to gripe about season one stuff, the season I thought we all agreed was perfect, just proves how out of control fandoms can get.
Idk, just a thought I had, y'all do y'all I guess.
@@kyu2o337 I can guarantee you that creators of entertainment were talking about deleted ideas long before that movie. Arcane is over, some don’t even care about the next show so for the next few years these are going to be some of the talking points.
I believe you’re blowing things out of proportion
@DefaultDanielSGaming Dawg, I've probably watched more content dissecting Arcane than Arcane itself... I get being obsessed with something you love. That isn't what I'm talking about. Analyzing every frame of a show is one thing, complaining about what you DIDN'T get is another.
@@kyu2o337 I didn't complain, and talking about what we could've gotten and we could still get in a different form doesn't mean complaining, it simply means you loved the show so you want to see more
People who talked about Ambessa's past, and how they wanted to know more about her in season 1, do you think those people complained and that's why the creators are going to release a book about her?
@DefaultDanielSGaming I'm not necessarily talking about you specifically, more a trend I've seen.
Speculating about what might be in season two is obviously not the same as complaining about "missing" scenes from a completed piece of art. Again, not saying that's what you're doing, just speaking broadly.
@@kyu2o337 people complaining about the season being rushed shouldn't be discredited just because that was the vision of the creators, on the other hand people who attack the creators are freaks
I don't think being a creator allows you to be complacent and not care at all about what the audience says, I also don't think the creators should jump up at every stupid thing the community complains about.
Take Witcher for example, they deviated from the lore in season 1, the show did great anyways. They didn't listen at all to the lore based complaints and then in season 2 they mega deviated from it which resulted in a bad reception. Did they have to implement everything those people complained about? No, but if they had listened, the 2nd season wouldn't have those massive lore changes.
You are eight. The flashback would have only benefited the episode. My guess is that they had to cut for time, and rationalized cutting the flashback.
to say that jinx slapped him with the bomb is insulting to the work, you don't seem to understand what happened despite all the efforts they made to make us understand the tragedy of the situation, she tried to commit suicide while giving ekko enough time to escape hence the slow and delicate gesture when she dropped the bomb next to them, she wanted to end it all, not to troll ekko, it's ridiculous, but hey, people aren't stupid, you're just giving arguments that justify what timebomb fans think, except that you understand the opposite xD
I didn't say she trolled him, it was basically a slap in his face methaphorically speaking because he couldn't save her, that is tied with his previous failure in the scene mentioned by Amanda, otherwise there is no connection to that. Amanda clearly states that through the fight scene we can understand the moment she describes from their childhood. I also added a line saying that there are other interpretations tied to the scene but I mentioned the one which fits the context of the deleted moment.
@@DefaultDanielSGaming there's a gigantic contrast between the past when he was trying to save her and now when he's trying to finish her off, the fact that he hesitated doesn't mean he's gone back to his past resolution of saving her, that was only the case from ep 7 of s2, so your remark, while interesting, is totally out of place given the situation, on the other hand, the fight generally shows the tragic side and the conclusion of what happened between the 2 and of this relationship, which was only revived thanks to AU powder, but well, as you said, it can be interpreted in different ways, and so many scenes have been cut that we'll never get the full picture.
@@ravenjo9145
Ekko stops himself from finishing the job because of their childhood(not that exact scene), it is a pivotal moment for Ekko which is why he remembers it in Season 2 Ep 7. I believe he also remembers it because he probably wanted to do more, but Jinx pulled out the grenade. I totally agree with you here btw, that she pulled it out slowly to give him time to react, but from a methaphorical stand point, it almost felt like a slap in Ekko's face, not one to troll him but one where he realizes that he can't save her in that moment, similar to how he couldn't do it in that deleted scene. That's how I tie it to the scene mentioned by Amanda Overton
When it comes to getting the full picture, well, that's why I keep pushing for a novel, maybe one day it will happen
@@DefaultDanielSGaming he was very hostile towards AU powder so no, he had made his decision and she had not changed before AU powder made him change his mind, moreover during the whole thing until episode 7 not once did he care about her or what had become of her, I remind you that jinx killed a lot of his friends and made him suffer, it is unrealistic to imagine anything else coming from him
@@ravenjo9145 I'm specifically talking about that moment, a moment where you can see both of them externalizing all previous events while remembering their past. Don't forget that Amanda Overton specifically mentions that we could get all the story she explained to us of Ekko trying to save Powder through the fight scene, and I believe the way I explained it makes sense. Everything you said makes sense and I agree but that is outside of the context given by Amanda Overton.
Oh so they were making dumb choices since s1?!
Wow s1 really was accidental lightning in a bottle
@@my2randomcents they could’ve kept this a secret and you would never know about the existence of that scene
Interesting
6:29 i know where you lived so rebuke what you said
haha
Honestly, I'm not a fun of the ship and I think people tend to overinterpret, sometimes forcibly; but at least I believe that among hundreds of videos you propose a calmer reasoning, often avoiding confeming - as others do - based on external elements - like artbook - precisely the relationship, love, between the two. In my opinion, the only thing that could actually exist is one based on a feeling of friendship, at least in the current state of affairs.
yeah, I don't know what other people do but I know that there is an audience who likes to have their beliefs confirmed, I just post what I believe