Fallout 1 and 2 Box Covers
ฝัง
- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 2 เม.ย. 2024
- I talk about the history of the creation of the box covers for the first two Fallout games.
Videos to watch for more context:
Why I Left Fallout 2: • Why I Left Fallout 2
A Chat With Leonard Boyarsky: • A Chat With Leonard Bo...
A Chat With Leonard Boyarsky, Part 2: • A Chat With Leonard Bo... - เกม
Tim getting gaslit into believing he has no eye for a good cover
That's not gaslighting, stop using the word wrong. It's the most incorrectly overused concept in recent times.
bro calm down, it's not that deep. He's not making an essay lmao.@@Meton2526
@@Meton2526 sure sounds like it, though. If you know that ain't the right word, can you tell us what would be more appropriate?
@@Meton2526 See the Merriam-Webster entry:
"the act or practice of grossly misleading someone especially for one's own advantage"
Tim has obviously been told many times that his opinion on artwork or aesthetics is somehow less important, and yet he's been hugely influential in the aesthetics of pretty much every game he's worked on, and for good reason. He may be a "color-blind programmer", but I would argue he has quite the dialed in idea of aesthetics, especially what he likes, and for the two games where that was probably most on display, Fallout and Outer Worlds, I would argue that's part of why they were successful and visually iconic. Being told you're not good at something when you actually are is a perfect example of gaslighting.
@@JDSByrne If that is indeed what it says, then Mirriam-Webster is wrong.
Gaslighting is to deliberately lie to someone else about the nature of objective reality in an attempt to make the target believe that they are undergoing psychosis, that their perception of reality is wrong.
It has NOTHING to do with subjective analysis of creative works, or trivial disagreements about speculation about future performance of different choices.
The tribal box art is probably my favorite piece of art that was ever produced for Fallout.
It’s incredible how it can explain what kind of a world Fallout is set in and hint at the fate of the BoS with nothing more than a tribal in an old helmet.
Plus the beautiful aesthetic!
Same, that pic was one of the reasons I persisted in trying to get to know these games
I never thought about the symbolism of the Brotherhood's future from that piece of art. I'm a huge fan of the Enclave art but this fact really makes me give the tribal art more credit.
Yes, it is a very good art and very fitting loading screen but is bad for a cover.
Yeah I love the Enclave, but the barbarian helmet pic just captures the whole vibe of the series perfectly.
The Tribal box art would have been cool as a sort of inversion of the art for Fallout 1. Seeing the Brotherhood's armor be incorporated into a "primitive" tribe several decades into the future is such a powerful image. But at the same time, I really like the art we got. It, too, is a bit of an inversion. The Brotherhood helps you save the day in Fallout 1 and are featured prominently on the cover, whereas now it's the Enclave who are the villains. Both are so powerful to me, and I remember seeing Fallout 2's box art in stores as a kid and thinking "what the hell is that?" in the best way possible.
The tribal box art would have been better since it follows the Mad Max principal. Instead of the nuclear apocalypse "knocking humanity back" into a primitive state on a model of civilizational stages, it's showing how culture would randomly mutate to become less and less like the pre-war as time goes on. In other words, instead of humanity "recovering" and eventually returning to their presumably "normal" modern state, it would be the immediate post-war which would most resemble the pre-war, and it would only get stranger and stranger from there.
Well said mate. I was also in awe of the f2 box art back in the day.
but the bad thing about the inverse of the enclave box art is you have to have knowledge of the lore and world to know what that is. i do also like the cover, but i think the primal serves as a much better inverse for the mass populous who is just walking by and seeing the cover. i’m glad we inevitably got to see both either way.
@@cjbford2063Well then by that logic, the Fallout 1 box art is also bad "because you have to have knowledge of the world and lore to know what [The Brotherhood of Steel & T-51b Power Armor] is."
Fallout 2's cover also set the trend for showing off the Cool New Armor(tm) without any context. The tribal cover would have shown an evolution of that world.
Hadn't thought of it like that.
Tribal in the front, Enclave on the back would've been good
Yeah, as much as I like the Enclave picture, the Tribal cover is superior. For exactly the reasons you said.
@@NakAlienEd Vegas is the only one that comes to mind where it's clear that there's a person in the armor. How many people look at the other covers and go "Cool Robot"?
it's too busy and very hokey - makes no sense to have that helmet with a 'bare chest' - and a bunch of other issues
02:51 "Marketing didnt like this"
and thus begun the systematic war of destruction between those who can make and those who think they can sell it..
War. War never changes...
The know nothing, creative defunct corpos won in the end.
HR & Marketing departments run our societies.
Shit man, this is what ruin games today. Shareholders are the big guys now. Big kaka heads
There's an adage that I've recently been introduced to, which says something to the effect of "Whenever capital and creativity come together, capital will inevitably kill creativity."
@@DevinParker This is true. Creativity can win out for a time, but in the end capital is always victorious when the two are near each other.
I have been a designer for the past 10 years and this video features one of the most apt descriptions of what development can be like: "I'm going to have lots of stupid arguments with people who had nothing to do with creating this stuff but suddenly want to be a big part of it."
Applies to music as well, people swear they would've done a better job but still try to eat off your plate haha
Clearly the cover for fallout 2 should have been Myron, he has a face!
And what a face! 😅
I’d put Master from Fallout 1 there. That would certainly catch people’s attention.
MYRON BABY MYRON
@@Haken00 Their ATTENTION! Attention. Ah-ten-tion?
Why does everyone hate on Myron? I think he is one of the most interesting companions in F2. Will Hunting meets breaking bad kind of person, but he is still kinda redeamable.
As a guy who has worked in marketing... I can see why they wanted the high contrast purple box we got. But Leonards art is amazing and much more thematically resonant with Fo2.
Same argument could be made for the enclave armor i suppose. But im glad you went to bat for your team. Stay awesome Tim
Yes. I think the Leonard Boyarsky art is excellent and it's very evocative of the themes in the game. And, it's meaningful that it subverts the Fallout 1 box art AND is showing a character who is essentially physically powerless vs. the final box which shows a character who is extremely powerful and menacing. It feels like a value judgement.
The Enclave power armor helmet design is badass though. It subtly oozes US military in a retrofuturistic, disbelief-suspending kind of way. It's downright evil and I love it. Tim, do you know who designed it and what else did they work on?
That box art was one of the reasons I bought it back in the day. 20 something years ago 15 year old me saw it and thought "That's a cool looking robot... I want it!" and thus began my love of the series.
Yep.
Me too
You are a real one for fighting for your team's ideas. Only if all middle management cared about the people bellow them.
I always thought that loading screen with the Tribal in the power armor should have been the box cover for Fallout 2. Turns out it was supposed to be :D
The original Fallout 2 box cover has always lived rent free in my head as the true one and always will.
Fallout 2 has my favorite box art, the original art does look totally sick though.
It also tells way more about the game. Seeing Fallout 2 on store shelves as a kid, I thought it was an outer space game.
Now i wanna see the original in vertical format!
The Enclave's helmet does look alien, with those yellow bug eyes, which is why I like it. Also the fact that you thought it was a space game. I think both of these reasons make a lot of sense with what Fallout 2 is about.
I've always loved the barbarian image, it's been a stand out to me as one of the coolest looking pieces of art to come from the series. Learning it could have been the cover of Fallout 2 itself is simultaneously heartbreaking but also really awesome lol, had no idea it was intended as anything but a loading screen! I'm glad we still got it in the game, sheesh... I know so many things probably get left behind on the cutting room floor in game design, thankfully that piece of art wasn't one of them!
I was just about to comment the same thing couldn’t agree more
People in suits who don’t play video games making decisions is beyond me
Fallout 2’s tribal cover always felt the so metal to me. I wonder if the 2 power armor covers, in a row, led to bethesda’s decision to keep the helmet covers going until present day.
You can sort of see the evolution of that between the original team's ideas and the more corporate side of things. The original had the BoS T51, but management changed the second cover to not have the clever inversion of the original's but rather the Enclave's armor. Bethesda has kept it going with the games they made since (monochrome power armor). But with Obsidian, they chose the NCR ranger instead of power armor. Just something I thought would be cool to point out.
1st Fallout cover is so iconic, I remember looking at that as a kid and being confused by what I was looking at, with all the dials and tubes coming from it, it looked so alien and futuristic. I really liked the Fallout 2 cover we got also.
I like the lesson about leadership. When I started in the banking industry my managers often let me hanging and it ended up in me leaving or a project breaking down in some shape or form. Now that I am in a more senior position I think this is a lesson everyone needs to understand. Not always its about your fight, sometimes its the fight for an employee. You will not always win the fight but at least you prob earn credibility and respect which, down the line, is often super important.
We are so lucky to have one of the industry legends being this open about his thoughts.
Im a zoomer and I just started fallout 1, it was a little bit of a struggle to figure out what I was doing, but now appreciate and understand the complexity a lot better. I have tons of hours in 3, NV, and 4 and have been really enjoying my time in the first game. Will report later on fallout 2
I really admire your sticking up for your team, and your sticking to your guns. I can easily understand why several of them joined you on your exodus from that company. Leadership level 10.
These two covers are like a distillation of my childhood. I've always wanted a proper poster of them!
They're both good choices for different reasons, I think. The tribal one builds on the imagery of the first, showing the old world being overridden and incorporated into the new; the Enclave cover riffs on the original, functioning as a twist on expectations because the Brotherhood was a largely benign/friendly faction while the Enclave is the villain, a bit like the way you expected Schwarzenegger to be the villain again in Terminator 2. All things being equal I'd want the tribal one to be the box art, just because that's what the team wanted. Well, also because the imagery is more eyecatching, which is a good quality to have on a store shelf
This seems similar to Toby Gard's experience with the marketing decisions made for Tomb Raider, and him not having any say in them after crunching day and night to make the game. He also quit, not interested in making a sequel. An interesting pattern, happening at the same time.
It also reminds me of my personal experiences as a game designer and project lead when other opportunists got the power in the end and started calling the shots, partially because of the success of the thing I went through so much crunch for.
That Fallout 1 Box made me turn around, get inside of the PC Game store, the the box in my hands and...well, my Fallout fascination started right there. That Power Armor Helmet is just perfect.
I truly look forward to starting my mornings with these videos! Thank you for all you do!
Its really awesome watching your channel grow, absolutely loving how much passion youve had in your career and how much more you seem to have. Love your creativity, thanks for being such a huge inspiration for us ☺️✌️
As much as I love the tribal art and think it’s one of the most unique pieces of fallout history, I REALLY love the enclave box art with the purple dark metallic vibe. I love the fallout 2 logo to match it, I just think it’s perfect.
I am also really, really glad you fought for the Fallout 1 box cover art. While I would’ve been perfectly okay with the tribal box cover art for the second game, I can’t imagine fallout 1’s art being different than the red background power armor one it is today. Truly perfect art
Funny thing about "the cover has to have a face on it" is that I can't recall a single game I bought in the 90's who's box had a face on it. Civilization 2 and 3? Nope. Diablo? Nope. Starcraft had that weird Protoss "face", but the Power Armor helmet is more face-ish.
Maybe Command&Conquer? I don't recall the box for that one
Warcraft 1 & 2 has the cool Orc vs Human faces. Certainly ID games Wolf3D, Doom has the main characters and enemies but you have Quake with just a nail. Duke 3D has the main guy kicking ass on the cover. C&C has some random dude with a ski google with military stuff being reflected, honestly they should have just used Kane on the box xD
StarCraft and Brood War sit next to Fallout 1 and 2, Oni, Recoil, and Total Annihilation in my wall of games from the late 90s and 00s. All have faces Except TA and Mechwarrior 2.
But I got into every last one of those based on Demos (except TA and MW2.) Nowadays, I only get a game based on reviews, honestly.
As a person who's not even in a game developing environment I really learn from your stories(btw keep telling your stories, it's much better than flat out telling those points you want to make). Even as a person who works in a group setting these videos really teach me lessons. Some of them I got burned to learn by myself (which then came into me after moments of self reflection) or some of them I am now facing in workplace. I think interpersonal dynamics are much more close to the mentality(how one sees the work or what they want to achieve) and how you carry the work forward than the popular belief. It lays out a blueprint for how the work goes forward. Thank you Tim for your videos.
Almost at 100k subs! Congrats man i watch just about every new upload
This is my new favorite channel. I’m using this as a crash course to learn how to develop a game. Thanks Tim! 😀
I just got a really rare original 1997 promo poster for fallout 1 box cover. It’s such an aesthetically pleasing piece to look at and I think the T-51 power armor absolutely nails the 50s retro futurism.
I'm glad you managed to get the cover for the first Fallout. It was so striking, seeing it on the shelves at Waldenbooks (or whichever mall computer store it was) and feeling like it was such a strange, threatening, and weirdly clunky helmet. It stood out from the other games on the shelves, and remained fixed in my mind enough after I left that I eventually came back and bought it once I had the money for it. That and the instruction manual inside-with its spiral bound notebook style and the quirky yet subtly disturbing 50s-style Vault Boy illustrations-made me fascinated by it. Unfortunately I never managed to get very far beyond the Vault 13 cave (I loved CRPGs but was never very good at combat and easily discouraged by difficulty), but the strange flavor of it worked on me from start to finish.
Is it just me or does someone else have a strange desire to see Tim make a playtrougth of Fallout, Fallout 2 and new Vegas…. I would be delighted to see those gameplay… hello Tim, good video btw
Great idea. Live directors commentary!
Really cool to hear this. Shows how passionate you were and still are about the game.
Being a teen, and going in again & again into the store and interacting with the Fallout 1 box, was a big part of it's intrigue.
It really was unique and a big selling point.
I'm curious Tim if you were consulted at all with the making of Fallout Tactics? It was worked on by a company here in in Canberra, Australia my hometown, and one of the guys who worked on it is my child's friends dad. (But i dont get to talk to him much, dang kids not inviting certain friends over more)
I still have a lot of fodness for the artwork that was used in the finished product. The Enclave Advance Power Armor is still one of the most striking and intimidating things I've seen in Fallout that still makes me excited whenever I look at it. While it doesn't set-up the tribal aspect of the player character, I still think it compliments the game in general. especially if you're coming off of the first game. When you start the second game out as a spear wielding tribal instead of gun wielding vault dweller, suddenly the idea of confronting enemies wearing these new suits makes the world way more dangerous. This armor is out there and it's not being worn by friendlies. For those who played the original game, this Power Armor is all about the mystery of who could make something more elegant than the T-51 from the first game?
Another thing that bugs me about the initial tribal artwork is that it makes the decision that the preferred depiction of the Player Character is male. I always believe that cover artwork for RPGs that involve creating the lead character should leave what the PC character looks like. The original artwork for Fallout 1 works great because anyone could be in that Power Armor, as does the current artwork for most of Fallout games.
My Star Wars VHS tapes had the Stormtrooper helmet on one and Darth Vader on another.
Those movies probably would have gotten pretty popular if they had just shown their faces on the box!
Truly an excellent candid lesson about leadership and fighting for your people.
I love it
The tribal one would’ve been so good, especially since 1 and 2 are so connected and came out so close to each other, would have been the perfect compliment!
Been having a good time listening to the history of fallout on his channel! I played fallout 3 first and than I played 1, 1 and 3 became some of my favorite games ever, would like to hear how tim felt the first time he saw his visions brought into 3D must have been inspiring!
Crazy that someone tried to convince you the cover needed a face on it when the fact that there isn't one makes it some of the most iconic pieces of game art I've ever seen! It's also funny that they totally flipped when it came to Fallout 2.
I love how you pushed against the backlash of the disapproval of the Fallout 1 box cover art, and now I believe Fallout's cover has become one of, if not the most iconic game cover I've ever seen.
To Bethesda's credit - F3 and F4 covers were pretty damn great and very close to F1 cover.
Thx for the video Tim!
I'm glad you pushed back and you stood your ground and fought.
I love how they were all "You have to see the face, it has to be recognizable" and now the Power Armor helmet has been the cover for nearly every game lmao, Leonard got it right the first time, but man the original concept for 2's Box Cover was so much better than the final one.
You’re the most important figure in gaming for me. Thank you for what you’ve accomplished and to all that you will accomplish. 💙💛
The whole 'box art needs a face' seems like that whole design philosophy is based on music album and to another extent the home video market.
What I'm getting at is that people in marketing would often argue that a significant number of people will buy media based on how cool/sexy the box art is. A blind purchase as they judge a piece of media by its cover. I feel this was more true in the video rental scene in the 80s and 90s but less true elsewhere. Most of the people buying music are somewhat informed about the product. Very few were willing to drop $15 $20 on a gamble because the cover art was cool.
What I'm ultimately getting at is box art for games generally didn't matter then, nor does it matter now. Gamers typically are pretty well informed even back in the 90s if it's a game they'll want to play. What helped sell games was previews, positive reviews, and strong word of mouth. Good box art is nice, but if word of mouth is the game sucks it won't matter. Good box art might look nice on the shelf, but it does little for the contents of the box.
That being said, the box art for 1 and the concept for 2 is really nice. It conveys the concept (especially FO2) nicely.
Man. You created a absolute masterpiece of universe. There is no denying that fact. Thank you for that. I love what you have created. I was about 9 years old kid when first played classic Fallouts, and they had many absolutely insanely well made aspects compared to Bethesda's versions, but also I see that path that Bethesda has created has brought us so many enjoyable stories, moments and more lore that never could have been imagined lore going so far. Still gotta thank you for creating this lore. This lore is what I grew with, and it's still best stories ever told in modern RPG history. Love you man and your brain even more.
Hey Tim, another excellent video. Thanks for posting!
Question related to some of the side-notes you mentioned in regards to decisions being made outside of your authority:
Throughout your years of game development, there have evidently been many instances where decisions have been made you do not agree with, with a spectrum of those ranging from things you don't consider important to a game's development, through to those that you feel are vital for it's success.
What are some of your methods for deciding whether or not a decision is objectively worth fighting for (versus those that you just feel personally attached to), and when something outside of your control wears on your conscious, how do you manage your own personal feelings and anxieties to ensure you don't make a bad situation worse, either for yourself or the team as a whole?
Insight like this is a such a blessing for the fans.
I think I might have commented this before on an older video when you spoke about the original Fallout 2 cover, but anyway, I'm nearly certain that Tribal power armor art was used for the hero art on Fallout's Steam page (maybe the Fallout Collection that included Tactics?) and it was that art specifically that made me so interested in playing the original games as someone who was born in 1997 and was introduced to the series with Fallout 3.
So funny/baffling to hear these stories now that this art was rejected yet it was what sold me on the games.
I remember seeing that loading screen in Fallout 2 back in the day and thinking to myself "Huh, this would have looked great as the box art given how thematically similar they are. I wonder why they went with the Enclave power armour helmet design?" And now I'm grateful to know the reason was because of marketing bullhonkey. Thank you for the story Tim!
The cover that Tim wanted was miles better than what we got. I thought that ever since I saw the loading screen and it was my desktop background for a while.
did you watch the video?
@@user-ih5jr8rt5q wat
I remember seeing the cover for Fallout at my local pc repair store and being mesmerized by it.
They had it behind the register alongside their business license and their degrees, I remember staring at it every time we went in. Eventually I asked them if it was for sale (having no idea what it was) and the technician told me that it was priceless.
Yknow I always did appreciate how striking and stylistic the Descent box cover was
it's a great cover.
Always did wondered why the box arts were so different, thank you for your content and all the work you do man.
You and the team on fallout 1 really are legends, and everything that you have said in this video could not have been more true.
The state of the industry today sickens me. Honestly miss how it used to be when I was a kid back in the 90's, it really was a whole different playing field than what we are stuck with now.
Everything is about money and nothing is about the art or what goes into a good piece of media. I remember looking at each games box art and picking one then reading the players manual and imagining what you'll find inside was half of the fun on the ride home from the games store.
Sorry for the rant man 😅 but you guys are truly the best IMO, if anyone cares to listen.
The cover art on both Fallout 1 and 2 are great the tribal armor that was supposed to be the cover art looks great also.
Thanks. Answers a lot question. Glad to see when the dust settle, you were still standing. there no where to be found. 😀
Hi Tim. It’s me, everyone.
I had no idea that the tribal helmet art was the original box cover, but that makes so much sense. It was always my favorite art from 2, and learning that it was supposed to be the cover really makes me sad that it wasn’t.
The tribal power armor is one of my favorite pieces of art from the series. Its so interesting to look at.
i personally love 2's boxart, though i cannot deny how good the tribal one is. The Enclave soldier just provoked curiosity in my brain, seemed alien and unaturral as a kid. The Big Daddy on the cover of Bioshock did the very same.
something I've noticed about the Fallout series as a whole is the frequency of characters with Multiple Identities, FO1 has the Master 2 & NV has the Nightkin and FO4 has the player character I'm not entirely sure about 3 & 76 as I haven't played enough of them so I might have just missed any examples but it's occurred more times to be sheer coincidence.
6:25
I love this design so much and wish it was used as the box art. Just like the Fallout 1 box art it somewhat forshadows where you need to go without spoiling the game
back when we had box covers
I actually liked the story of Fallout 1&2 box covers very much, thank you!
I always find box art decisions interesting to me, they're so specific sometimes it makes you question why they even care about certain details, i distinctly remember an old image of the box art for one of the Serious Sam games where the publisher's guy scribbled a bunch of "notes" of things to change on it, then the final box art had literally no changes made from the notes.
the tribal power armor dude looks amazing!
This is interesting. I always loved both Fallout and Fallout 2 title screens, but I also really loved the tribal in power armor helmet one and I was wondering how this would look like in the game as a player character or NPC.
Tim, I absolutely *loved* the Fallout box. At some point, I tossed out all my old giant '90s game boxes except for that one specifically. And I still have it. But, I'm sorry to hear about the Fallout 2 box art-- it would have been grand with the original idea. I wonder if subconsciously if your manager identified with the Enclave and therefore wanted them on the box. 😆
Hi Tim! I’m really enjoying these videos and I have a question for you.
You mentioned in the past the inspiration you have got from TTRPGs over various projects. Have you ever considered creating or publishing your own TTRPG?
Thanks!
My friends and I were so eager for Fallout to release that I can still remember running into my local CompUSA and picking up Fallout 1 and seeing that box art. I just love these videos and getting all this inside info.
All these years later, I honestly think that the cover art for Wasteland blows the pants off the box art for any Fallout game. That cover art is some of my favorite box art ever though.
That said, I think Fallout is a better game than Wasteland. 😄
I really liked the box cover for Fallout 1 but I also really liked it for Fallout 2 as well. To me, at the time as a young gamer, it showed me what was next for the power armor. It ultimately became a trend of showcasing the best looking armor of the games, objectively speaking of course. That all said I think you should have been included in on the discussion. They really did ya dirty with that one.
Tim you should do a playthrough of the entire fallout series and give your opinions on changes, things you liked as you go along and maybe talk about things ingame that were made by or decided by you.
The "gotta have a face" thing is a thing I heard about a lot of games made during the aughts. It's why so many games looked so similar I had no interest in any of them, so lol.
That art from Fallout 2 with tribal guy wearing power armor's helmet is amazing. I saw that for the first time when I was 10 or 12 it made permanent change in my mind, it changed me. It will be one of the most important piece of art in my life to the end.
uhhhh, get more culture of depth and meaning
I really like the tribal with a BoS helmet art. It's fantastic. But I can see why they wanted the Fallout 2 box cover to look the way it does. After 1, the cover for 2 both feels instantly recognizable as a Fallout game, and also shows you that it's a new Fallout game.
Not saying I agree with the "there should be a visible face" guy for Fallout 1's box cover, but I bet he had marketing research that told him new games sell more copies when there's a picture of the main character on them. So that's probably where he was coming from. But after Leonard's art became the box for 1, it makes sense to do it again in the sequel.
I saw the original box and picked it out of what felt like 50-100 other game boxes in a store as a kid, that's the game I got with me home that year. Love the art and the box and also the art on 2nd Fallout but at that point I was already sold!
I wish I still had my original copy of Fallout. That huge box, and all of the packaging, was so good. I guess I never imagined that within 5 years games would just come in tiny boxes with nothing but a disc inside.
@LGR touched upon the box art in his retrospective of the original Fallout and how iconic the artwork of the first box art is! I think the Fallout 1 design is something to be very proud of.
Hi Tim, I work at marketing in games. I think person who argued you need face on cover didn’t exactly understood those rules. Actually character in cool armor is perfect choice, unless you have some famous actor or your protagonist face is recognizable, which in fallout isn’t the case. What makes it better than a face is super original armor look, less forgettable than any face. Probably they realized that later. But I have to admit I like F2 cover art chosen by marketing team more, but I may be biased by nostalgia. My reasoning would be F1 had cool armor you could get in game, and F2 artwork had cool new armor you could get in the game too, but its new one. You can interpret it as „expect new things and become that guy”. Your proposition had 2 disadvantages, it’s looks too similar, like remake of F1 art, and you can’t look like this in the game. But I understand your position on this. And I respect your opinion. Tribal power armor makes sense in terms of story and world building. Honestly I don’t think choice between those two artworks would make any difference in sales. Love your videos. Im a huge fan.
The OG cover impressed me a lot when I first saw it. I still want to draw it but, I lack the skills atm.
Enclave Power Armor as a cover looked very menacing but, the tribal broken power armor shocked and scared me when I first saw it in the loading screen. It would've made an amazing cover such as iconic as Fallout's. One single image made me wonder "what happened to the hardened power armor?", "who or what can be stronger and more powerful than the BoS?", "is the wasteland even more dangerous?", etc. etc.
Thanks for sharing this in detail. I'm doing a documentary on the development of the whole Fallout series and I just released the episode which talks about this, what a story!
You’re going to love Friday’s video!
@@CainOnGames Yup, I'm really looking forward to the chronology one! It might have the power to depress me though if I got something wrong on the already released episodes, haha.
gee, you should not do things that you don't know about and wait to find out before just spewing out content@@JuegosAlDetalle
@@user-ih5jr8rt5q I've been investigating and working on it for over a year and did my best with 67 documented sources. Perhaps you should not judge without knowing the details.
I've been investigating and working on this for over a year, going over 67 documented sources and writing 42 script pages. So, perhaps, you shouldn't be so quick to judge without knowing the details ;) @@user-ih5jr8rt5q
I love the 3D renders of Fallout 1 & 2
I completely understand your stance on the cover as the producer and team lead, and I do think it fits with the narrative of fallout 2 more. That being said, I can understand why they went with the other cover. It's eye-catching for people who played the 1st game as a new type of power armor, but also isn't too off-putting for people who don't know anything about the first game. As art, the original concept works better. As a product, I think the one with they went with makes more sense.
I know it's unlikely for a million reasons... but I wish Fallout would go back to you.
Second? Love you, Tim. Fallout, Arcanum, Bloodlines, all helped me be the man I am today. Thanks!
Great video ❤
Loved the first box. Still have it somewhere.
lol, I don't think I'd *ever* before heard of Leonard Boyarksy being referred to as "Leon"
not only an iconic cover, but it OPENED to reveal more!
the actual Fallout2 cover is much better than the 'triblal' one - remember, you get a lot of fanbois who like to lick your buutthole
Yeah it's pretty telling that you could see exactly where Interplay was gonna go judging by their upper management in 1998. The same upper management that would cancel Van Buren and greenlight Fallout: Brotherhood of Steel lmao.
A great team only exists for as long upper management enables that team to exist, and once that upper management changes and/or starts overexerting their power? Then the great members of that team start leaving, problems are ignored, pointless arguments occur with the passionate and great workers, and dumb decisions are greenlit.
Leonard had such great art for Fallout, it really captured the whole spirit of serious, parody, campy, rough and vintage aspect of it all. And the fun thing about the tribal art, is that it's almost as if Fallout 1 got Falloutized.
The power armor is already a retro-futuristic tech, that combines all the old world symbols vs apocalypse americana, which is brought from the past as the apex of technology in a world that devoured itself for more wealth hoarding.
Now, you make that become rough, old, makeshift and reused, but still marked by being a symbol and the best of what this downtrodden world can muster. It's awesome for a sequel, no doubt.
Besides, Enclave on the box art is a bit Empire Strikes Back, cuz they are the villains in this. Not that BoS were the good guys, but you could be part of them, that could've the PC. Or simply a piece of military ad (as it is in the intro). Now, Enclave? It's a bit of a strange choice.
Ah, the marketing weasels - I just accepted that they would ignore my input even if they bothered to seek it out (not once). Even though I had a degree in art and they didn’t. I had enough to deal with without going to war with them - though I did tell them that they were going to distribute Star Trek 25th Anniversary jackets to the creative team, since they had already so generously given themselves a copy. Weasels (I shall not name names, though I think I know who you are referring to).
On the other hand, in a collaborative effort, sometimes things are out of your control, and others are given authority to make decisions you may disagree with. I’d usually push, push some more, but at a certain point, would have to let go, though I’d often try to find an end-around that at least satisfied me to some degree. I had to do that at various times with Electronic Arts, especially when one EA bean counter of a producer decided he understood game design (he didn’t, and I’ll submit Fountain of Dreams as proof) and insisted on a change to a game that wouldn’t really fix the problem he saw, but I implemented his proposed fix, and then simply put in one that actually worked and never bothered to tell him. Yes, Mr. Get That Duck Outta There Himself! ;-)
Oh, and this artist picks: Leonard’s cover. For a variety of reasons. I think it was more about the ego of the marketing weasel than anything else that they wouldn’t even bother to listen to you.
Would love to own a book of your notes. You could release a series of books with each one focusing on a different project or era. Even with minimal curation it'd be a fantastic resource and insight. Though 'now tim' curating it would be brilliant!
The Fallout box cover is iconic and frankly I think its kind of telling that Bethesda chose to evoke its style when creating Fallout 3, Fallout 4, and Fallout 76's box covers. Part of that may be the choice of power armour (the use of the T-51, T-45, and T-60 power armour helmets). The look of the X-01 on the Fallout 2 cover doesnt feel like "retro-dystopia" in my opinion. Like others have commented, I think the "Barbarian in a Helmet" would have been a better cover, to showcase the world that is Fallout 2 better.
Seriously, that marketing guy's comment is made more comedic when you consider the fact that almost every box cover for the franchise that would come from that game would feature a character whose face is not visible.
That Enclave armor is so cool though I like it better than the tribal version.