The Divinity and Humanity of the Book of Mormon - A Conversation with Jared Halverson
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 27 มิ.ย. 2024
- This week we’re sharing a conversation that we had a lot of fun with, along with an exciting announcement about the work we’re doing at Faith Matters.
Our guest was our friend Jared Halverson. Few people we know exude as much enthusiasm for scripture-the Latter-day Saint canon in particular-as Jared does. He’s someone who clearly loves and cherishes these holy texts, and has taken the best they have to offer to heart. He’s as genuine, loving, and big-hearted as they come.
So we felt Jared would be the perfect person to talk to to kick off this year’s study of The Book of Mormon, the book Joseph Smith called “the keystone of our religion.” In our discussion with Jared, we talked about how we might be able to gain something from engaging with the Book, regardless of where our faith is at; how scriptures are the means, not the end, and how they’re not frozen in time-they’re part of an ongoing conversation that we’re a part of.
With all that said, we could not be more excited to tell you that Faith Matters is formally teaming up with Jared to bring his podcast, Unshaken, one of the most widely engaged scripture study podcasts out there, into the Faith Matters network of podcast and TH-cam shows. We’ll have more to share about that in the future as that network expands and grows. For now, it means that Jared will continue to bring his signature blend of scholarly rigor and devotional reflection to his discussions of scripture that move with the Come Follow Me curriculum. But whereas in the past, Jared’s podcast episodes have been deep dives of 3-5 hours per episode, the new Unshaken format will shoot for an hour or so to make them a bit more digestible.
Unshaken will continue to operate on its own TH-cam and Podcast channels, while the Faith Matters podcast will continue to operate on this one. If you’re interested in Jared and his work based on what you hear today, we’d highly recommend you head over to Apple Podcasts, Spotify, or TH-cam to subscribe.
For those unfamiliar with Jared, he’s an associate professor of Ancient Scripture at Brigham Young University, and has taught religion courses at the high school and college level since 1998. He studied history and religious education at BYU and earned a PhD in American religious history at Vanderbilt University.
Jared, I am an old Unshaken partaker from the beginning and I have smiled at those who said your lessons were too long, I just need to tell you that I have thanked The Lord for you. And while I understand reasons behind the changes, I will miss spending longer weekly visits with you and will continue to devour every thought and word. You cause me to go places in the meanings and signs behind the words and between the lines. My heart is open to what The Spirit has for me.
Thank you for your past and future sacrifices on my behalf.
Brother Halverston, thank you for all that you do. You have helped me so much in my studies. I am 68 years old and been a convert for a year. ❤️
Brother Halverson, I want to add that I'm grateful for whatever time you can spare to teach us the scriptures. So very grateful!!
I'm actually pretty disappointed Jared Halverson's podcast length is getting cut. I get that his podcast length is way too long for most people, but it's actually an appeal to a lot of his audience. The fact he goes into such well-thought-out and detailed depth and analysis is a huge reason why I think he's got by far the best Come Follow Me podcast. There are a ton of other Come Follow me podcast, but no other podcast goes into that level of well-thought-out depth, detail, and analysis. If he's cutting down the length I worry that'll cut out a lot of what makes his podcast so uniquely insightful
@danielstark8356 I totally feel you. I had those thoughts pass through as well. Brother Jared’s the best! He’s been pretty superhuman for being able to put so much time into the podcast on top of all his other responsibilities.
Luckily, we’re on the 2nd loop now- and his previous years line by line run through will be linked to the current ones. So in reality they’re even longer now!
Brother Jared has proven to be one of the Lord’s special servants… we can rest assured that he will still be the conduit of much revelation for us.
We see a few hours each week- but it has to take him many more hours to produce it. Now he gets to spend more time with the Lord instead. He deserves that!
I’m excited for this new year of revelations & spiritual momentum ❤
Thanks for keepin on keepin on Brother Jared 🙏
@@sisterstarseed He never actually did his verse by verse commentary for The Book of Mormon though
I'm feeling a lot of mixed feelings too. I really loved the longer podcasts, but I have small kids at home. Consequently, I rarely got through the longer podcasts anyway even though I loved them. 😂
@@danielstark8356 I guess that maybe isn’t as necessary for the BoM, if you think about it. The Bible has been translated many times & different words can have different meanings- making it super insightful to go line by line . With the BoM… it was interpreted & not translated, so being hung up on the wording can be a bit of a stumblingblock. I kinda think having the flexibility to discuss whatever the Spirit wants us to hear for this time is perfect. I do hear you though. I insist that the Lord is most often making lemonade if it seems lemony
I agree with u. I’ve relayed to Jared that it’s short shrift for us if he mitigates his talent that way . He is very gifted lit by his never ending enthusiasm (Enthusio, meaning God w/in)!
I am very hungry to learn the words of God. Your lessons are my sanctuary.
I wouldn’t call him long winded, but very detailed. I have learned so much and comforted during my cancer journey. I have rewatched many of the Unshaken shows and learned new things. Do what you want, Jared, it is your knowledge and time. Thanks.
As an Unshaken fan, I thank you! I wish you well in having more time for doing other things the Lord has in store. By the way, I have noticed some of your posting has occurred very early in the morning. I hope you get the sleep you deserve.
True Jared, mormon and moroni did not have an active audience but their audience did not have to be an imagined audience because they saw our time in vision so they were writing directly to us
Wow, I'm glad I found this channel. Great interview! I'm an LDS investigator and it's refreshing to see that there's a wider mature perspective out there that is Christ-centered, as the Church is intended.
Love your heart and mind Jared. Looking forward to studying the Book of Mormon this year
I also love the longer lessons…all the insights and backgrounds that are shared makes me feel he is having a conversation with me.
I've come to know my savior and his gospel due to long winded trait of Jared. I needed the extra info.
I'm very disappointed Jared's discussions will be shorter. His deep dive into each verse is the very thing that set him apart from all the others. Anyone can do an overview but not many have the knowledge he has to take that deep dive into the background of the scriptures. Many of us enjoyed that about his work.
I began watching this podcast and my son who has been absent from the church joined me and his laughter about some of your conversation warmed my heart. I know your words entered his heart. So thank you! It's a happy New Year!!
You are, to me, like the new endowment presentation is to temple patrons. Simply beautiful and beautifully simple. Thank you…
Wasn't aware of this channel until now. Glad I found it as companion to "Unshaken". Greatest scripture study in all the years since my conversion for me has been watching and learning from Jared's discussions on the scriptures. 😊
Welcome, @sherryware ! 😊
I love unshaken pod cast videos . I like that explains so well . I feel I am learning so much like be in a classroom . I don’t mind the length of the studies. We learn more ! Thank you ! ❤
I agree with Daniel Stark.I like that brother Halverson is so thorough and detailed. No other broadcast goes into the detail that he goes into and I really love it!
He is long-winded, but I have learned so much from him. Brother jared the way you have communicated from the heart is engraved in my heart. Happy New Year, my friend Love from Indy
22:49
23:46 ❤
I do not have anyone that i can talk scriptures with. i teach in primary so i do not get to be in the Sunday school discussion. i am so thankful for every ounce of instructions i get though this and other broadcast .thank you so much.
I have spent so many hours with Jared on his channel that I feel like we are friends. I could see us just sitting down for hours talking about scriptures. As a child I could not read well. It was really hard for me, I Hated reading. Especially getting called in school or church to read in front of everyone, I would hear their comments about how dumb I was or their laughing when I read something wrong... Well one day I came to the conclusion with God that if I promised to read the Book of Mormon (because it was the hardest book I knew of to read) every day for the rest of my life, would he teach me to read. God said yes. I have kept my promise for 30+ years and this book changed my life. Yes I can read now, out loud, in two fluent languages, but what he has done with my spirit is the true miracle. I love the scriptures, the writers, I feel like I am friends with them also, I have spent hundreds of hours with them... But I know it is true because I asked God, and he said yes! So the reading was great, but it all boils down to that moment when you for sure know God is talking to me, and he said yes!
I love Bro. Halverson and I can tell you from my 40+ year radio experience that less is more. Thank you. I really appreciate Faith Matters Mission.
I LOVE the long ones!! I put my headphones on while I do housework and yard work!! In my car while driving!! I listen and save and re-listen!! Why are they getting shorter?😢
I wish the pod cast were still the longer ones, i just wish he had help with editing etc, because I appreciate how difficult it was for him and his family.
The phrase brittle belief vs flexible faith is spot on. I have known and known of so many people that gave up faith in Christ because they had some questions about things in scripture with no logical connection to Jesus.
It's great to see brother Halverson on this channel which sometimes goes astray. He's a rockstar. This channel sometimes rents a room in the great and spacious building.
I agree.
Brother Halverson’s podcasts were perfect length notwithstanding. I will miss his unrestrained (by time ) style and patience with giving us all the light and understanding we could hold. But perhaps we who love him so are not respectful enough of his time….😢
Oh, my goodness, I love this wonderful channel and all 3 of you. You touched my heart so deeply❣️
He did do the Book of Mormon in detail the first year he did this. I’m sad to hear less from him but know that the Lord can teach us very well through our own reading as well. I’m thankful for the 600+ hours we’ve been through but agree it’s time to give us more time with the Lord and the Book of Mormon.
I'm not a scriptorium, but am learning from you wonderful, spiritual words and testimony of our Savior. Thanks!
“I think we’ve gone from dogmatism-in-favor and overswung to dogmatism-against and missed the wrestle somewhere in between.”
- Jared Halverson • 12:49
Thank you for all you do and all you are! 🙏💖🫶
This was so good. I'm very excited that Brother Halverson will have time to do things like this. We probably all have someone we love that is struggling with their faith, and this is so helpful. ❤️
Gratitude for all your spirits of searching in joy for life here-and life eternal andtrue & honest hearts. Good feelings. Thank you for your sacrifice of time.
I thought about this quote from Brigham Young as you talked about The Book of Mormon that I think is profound and we should always keep in mind; "Should the Lord Almighty send an angel to re-write the Bible, it would in many places be very different from what it now is. And I will even venture to say that if the Book of Mormon were now to be re-written, in many instances it would materially differ from the present translation. According as people are willing to receive the things of God, so the heavens send forth their blessings."
Bro Halverson. I am a faithful listener and love all your lessons.
I agree 4 hours a week is sometimes hard to get through but to me it is always worth it.
My only concern is whether scripture passages will now be skipped in order to cut down length. I hope not because that is part of the reason why I chose your podcast. I want pure and full coverage. That’s your genius.
Thanks and happy new year
I loved this podcast! Thank you for all you do Brother Halverson and Faith Matters.
Do you believe that the condemnation placed on the church for not taking The Book of Mormon seriously enough in Doctrine and Covenants section 84, mentioned again by President Benson and explained by Elder Oaks in 1982 in his speech called Another Testament of Christ, has yet been lifted?
Maybe it's an individual application. "The Church" is made of millions of individual members. Salvation and Exaltation are individually and family based, not communally dependent...at least not until we arrive at the state or condition of Zion. But maybe THAT'S the point....
This is the American gift at nice work. We do need you people to continue. Forward as One
Absolutely wonderful I’m so grateful! Thank you Jerad for your insights. Thank you for the spirit that exists among us.
We love to listen to Jarod we learn a lot
Great podcast! This message inspires me with desire to learn more about our faith which I love. Positive guests like Jared Halvetson bring His word closer to our hearts. Some prior podcasts add doubt to my faith! This is awesome!
This episode was wonderful! I’ve set the intention as I study the BOM again this year, to look for teachings about the transformation and growth that comes from believing in Jesus Christ. Jared did such a beautiful job of addressing this very thing! I’m so grateful for Aubrey and Tim and Jared for being so willing to give of their time simply because they love God and they love us! Thank you so much! ❤️
A great interview. I would hope anyone with a Faith Crisis would listen in just to see if they can find themselves within the context.
Yahoo Brother Jared.
Finally you invited him as a guest
He’s been on before teaching about “proving contraries.” If you haven’t seen that episode, I highly recommend it! 😊
Also sad to see these going down to 1hr but excited to see how this new format works out. Appreciate all the work that goes into this and for this great resource.
Thank you Brother Halverson for all your podcasts. I think it is great that you are having shorter podcasts because myarried children say they will listen to them since they are not so long. I enjoyed the long ones.
Yes ~ Yes ! Thank You 🙏🏼🗝
I am starting to wonder whether there is something wrong with me. I'm not at all skeptical of the Book of Mormon. Its power runs through my veins and has changed me to my core. Do I need some skepticism? Is mine a blind faith? So many people are skeptical. I'm just wondering about me. Thoughts?
I don't think you need to worry. Bring mental rigor to a study of it, sure: it rewards that richly. But it sounds like you have a gift to be grateful for.
@alisabown8175: I promise you nothing is wrong with you. The Lord is His own way that was meant for me answered my prayer about the truthfulness of the BoM...and I can tell you I still have questions and things I can't answer about it...but all the questions and skepticism is a part of our "natural man" that is an enemy to God. However what I always keep in mind WHO answered my prayer...God Himself. And so I press forward in faith knowing that all the questions and mysteries I can't answer now WILL be answered one day. Until then like you I trust....have faith....read....study...and pray. As the Lord would have us to do to the best of our ability. There are many questions I cannot answer and questions I have but I cannot and will not ever deny the fact the it is true. The Book of Mormon is true. It brings me closer to the Savior. It helps me to change and desire to be more Christ-like. Most skeptical people today are in search of disproving and destroying truth because Satan is raging in the hearts of men just as the Savior said he would do in the last days....and so I just always remind myself where MY answer came from...and it wasn't man..🤗
I am of the same nature and testimony. I am no scholar but I love leaning from those who are. What a gift Brother Halverson has but
😊
You have a great talent of spituallity tygd
I can’t find the great lecture with Jared Halverson. He had a power point talking about orthodoxy and not contention, he quoted Nibley, Oaks and many many others. He was a keynote speaker. How can I find that again?
My relationship with faith matters has been up and down. I have found some of the episodes to be more interested in the question that seems to disrupt in place of instruct in a building way. The discussion here about race and the book of Mormon was a good example. Aubrey, not sure on spelling, seems to be more interested finding the problem and Jared is so gracious in his response and his explanation of the change found in the book from separation to togetherness. A deeper dive and view reveals the books sincerity. I hope the union of these two groups, if you will, can build and not just question.
How do we build if we are not able to ask the difficult questions? I, for one, welcome the messy questions, they make everything feel a whole lot more real.
@tsmithson1 A few thoughts. Messy isn't a problem. To question or to have a question is not an issue. It's the intent behind the question or statement that is the rub. Not all questions are equal in their asking.
The perfect example was the discussion had on this very video. Aubrey wants to frame the Book of mormon as problematic on the topic of race and asks or states her opinion about it. Jared takes a larger view and asks/ questions about the other instances where the book highlights the equality of all people.
So my thought is that you can ask the questions but sometimes it feels like the old joke.... when did you stop beating your wife? Its fine to tout the messy question but in the end of the question is are they building our bombing. I would like more building.
I have a question....
Why was the atonement of and by Jesus Christ required to be a physical, mental, emotional, and spiritual act of redemption? Could Heavenly Father have not simply erased the sins, etc for which we repent without requiring the suffering of Jesus .... much like a teacher erases a blackboard of writing! ( Our sins...)
The only thing that comes to my mind is summarized in one word. BALANCE.
The universe teaches us that there's opposites to virtually everything including opposition in all things. And then there 's the concept of contraries that also points towards "balance."
It seems like for every action there needs to be an equal and opposite reaction. Or in this case, for every sin, there must be an equal opposite undoing of the consequences of sin through an atonement.
Is BALANCE a correct perception?
This core doctrine of Christianity, we call "The Atonement", for me, supposes a kind of made-up problem. It's like God created his children flawed and error prone and then suggests we are the problem, for which, he then requires the suffering of the innocent to mend some metaphysical rift in the cosmos. Our concept of Atonement is completely tethered to the doctrine of original sin, which we reject, but then blindly inherit all of its associated language. I simply don't understand how a loving God must be placated. This idea suggests that what Jesus accomplished in the garden and on the cross was a way to change God's mind about mankind, that seems so backwards.
I don’t see interpreting the BoM as a nineteenth century writing as being necessarily anti-Mormon. I converted because I liked the book’s content and the way it helped people be better followers of Christ, not because I thought or think it is an actual ancient record. Having majored in history, I can tell you that the case for a full blown Christian Church before Jesus was born is not good. You can accept it on religious grounds but not on the usual methods and standards of historical research. “Joseph wasn’t educated enough to write such a book” is not an historical argument. Finding examples of Reformed Egyptian, treasure caves in NY, or an actual city of Zarahemla would be.
Except . . . the Book of Mormon's purpose is to act as a 2nd Witness of Christ. Although the people mentioned within it are historical, the translation was not intended as a history or an archeology book. So if Joseph Smith (not a trained historian) writes something like "Laban's sword was of fine steel," it's really not that big of deal if the definition we have of "steel" doesn't match exactly with metals that would have been used in 600 BCE. It's irrelevant to the book's actual purpose to quibble over this. Not sure what your definition of "full-blown Christian Church" would be, but there definitely have been Messianic organizations and beliefs throughout history. That's how the Wisemen knew to visit the baby, right?
@@phav1832Book of Mormon Plagiarism of the Bible, that's a fact, Laban Zarahemia never existed
@@phav1832 A full blown Christian Church is one that speaks of Jesus by name (as opposed to various messianic titles), and provides discussion of Christian doctrines in terms unknown to the rest of the world until well after the time of Jesus. By way of analogy, suppose a book claimed to be written in 1066 AD, yet provided detailed information about the American Civil War including mentioning Grant, Lincoln, and Lee by name. Imagine the likelihood of such a claim being accepted by any historian. Such a claim would require overwhelming evidence that it was indeed written 800 years before the Civi War. In like manner, the BoM needs far more than deflecting references to anachronisms such as steel, horses, etc. to make it credible in the world of modern historical method. It needs ancient plates, Zarahemla’s excavation, and examples of “reformed Egyptian” or other similar discoveries.
One of the things I have noticed about LDS apologetics is that it has a knack for trying to explain (with varying degrees of success) peripheral issues such as the aforementioned steel and horses (which I don’t see as a big deal, though such anachronisms do raise an eyebrow or two) instead of confronting the central issue of how likely it is that somebody knows the far future in great detail. (In this respect it is like a lawyer arguing a case instead of a researcher trying to find the most likely explanation for all the data.) When that issue of knowing the future is combined with numerous criticisms and critiques of capable non-LDS scholars and researchers, the case for BoM historicity is not very good. Put another way, there are solid reasons for why the BoM is not taken seriously at any university that isn’t affiliated with the LDS.
There are many (both LDS and non-LDS) who view the issue of historicity as a make or break issue and I see their point and would not normally be inclined to argue the point. I simply do not agree and would hate to see someone who has benefited from being a part of the Church ditch their faith because they cannot bring themselves to buy into the entirety of Joseph Smith’s stories and explanations. I think he was a prophet with a number of excellent insights but this does not mean he was above some dubious, and possibly a few reprehensible, actions. I also think the Psalms of David are some of the most uplifting poetry in the world and he showed considerable faith and courage in many situations. I therefore honor his memory and benefit from his life and work. That does not, however, mean that I am unaware of or deny the fact that he was an adulterer and murderer whose enemies had a way of disappearing. He was a “man after God’s own heart” who could also go toe to toe with any mob boss.
I believe the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints is a great denomination that brings both spiritual and material blessings to millions of people both within and outside its membership. I am therefore concerned when I see issues about its origins leading to a considerable exodus among its American adherents. In my opinion, the Church’s present is far more important than its past. I of course realize the two cannot be entirely separated but I don’t think the connection is quite as tight as might first appear. I also think the easy access to information provided by the internet is going to make it increasingly difficult for the Church to dodge or explain away many of the more difficult aspects of its past. I say this because I spent 14 years researching both the bad and the good with the eye of an historian and am aware of many of those aspects. Nevertheless I decided to join because what I see in the present outweighs the problems of the past.
All of that said, If someone chooses to believe in the historicity of the BoM I’m good with that and accept the fact that this is the opinion of a large portion of the church, and probably the majority opinion. I do, however, note that the church has not made this a necessary requirement for membership and hope things stay that way. Taking a hardline stance on this issue might lead to more controversy than it’s worth and lead to more losses.
I hope this explains my position and perhaps provides you with something to ponder, given that it comes from a convert who took the time to study and work through many of the issues that are proving problematic for many who grew up in the church . If not, that’s ok too. May you have a very happy and blessed 2024.
14:34 apathy is getting a bad wrap. It allows me to put something down that is a weight or a stress. Be honest this is a religion of not enough. But is more that just that it also becomes contentious inside the tribe if you see things differently. I’m not the one that set up the all or nothing paradigm- arguably that was Hinckley. Regardless if there is no room in church Sunday school home CFM lessons blogs or podcasts for a Non Literal BoM - then really apathy is my most healthy mental option.
For example- just listening to this podcast gives me anxiety. And my wife has asked me to listen to talking scriptures BoM intro lesson. But I do it so that I can honestly answer if asked how to I avoid confirmation bias or motivated reasoning.
At the end of the day I have too many years of church telling me the BoM is literal- nephi is a real person- none of that is plausible for me anymore and I simply cannot retool my brain for a belief in a metaphorical BoM.
Anyway let’s see what happens in the next 40 minutes.
Is the BookofMormon 1 word?
what if Nephi misunderstood the mark of Cain. and used this misinterpretation of this curse on the lamanites. th-cam.com/video/DigOhDWycAc/w-d-xo.html
in this podcast the author sites scripture and offers a different interpretation of the scripture on the curse of Cain, that perhaps it was not black skin but something else.
Is it Nephi who misunderstands or is it US?
Why would WE think the "mark" and the "curse" were the same thing?