I was today years old when i discovered that there are _musicians_ out there who have listened to this song _carefully_ and failed to spot that it's in 4/4. Wtf?
Amazing! I've always struggled to understand why the guitar parts and the drums don't align . . . until they do align again. 9/8 v. 4/4 - brilliantly done!
BRAVO! This rhythm has been a puzzle for me for such a long time. And, although still somewhat challending to play, this makes absolute sense. Thanks for sharing!
I appreciate that explanation. It's especially helpful because the sheet music I've seen is even more jacked up. I knew there was a logical explanation out there somewhere.
I literally just looked up "black dog 9/8", before finding this! I just transcribed it a few weeks ago, for a bass-player-friend's band that's trying to get it down... I'm having trouble trying to explain the way it works to him, so I finally just learned how each 4 measures sounds in-and-of-itself to the 3*(9/8)+5/8 riff. I could already play it just fine on guitar over the straight beat. But now when I play it, I can emphasize the down beats so much better, and keep it so much tighter. I just sent him the link, so my friend can get another perspective, to reinforce what I'm saying.
In the rock register, this is one of the trickiest songs to put together as a cover band… would love to see your cover of it, both as a band and as a drummer: this explanation could use a demo, perhaps even one with an “explanatory emphasis” on where/how each musician should count
This makes no sense and even if it did, it does not address getting in and out of the a cappella sections, which is the difficult part of figuring out how to count this song. The part you’re talking about obviously fits over a 4/4 back beat. I’ve always thought it’s just a fermata on beat two before the vocals enter, since it doesn’t seem to be the same each time, and there must have been a visual cue after a second rest fermata at the end of the vocal phrase. When they performed it live, they omitted the fermata (or 5/4 bar, or whatever it is) and just played it in 4/4. The biggest clue I’ve found is that there is a stick click before each reentry after what I still think is a fermata rest (not a 5/4 bar as claimed on Wikipedia). It was probably just too difficult to reliably hear the stick click in a live setting, so they did it without the fermata live.
I always wonder if the 5/4 measure after "hey hey mama" came about because Plant only had Bonham's stick clicks in his headphones, not a count as well, and didn't know where 1 was, and came in a beat early!
I'm happy to call that 4/4 + 5/4, but it also seems like Plant was going by feel even though Bonham was clicking his sticks together (faded out, more or less, in the final mix). But those parts are easy to get, relatively speaking
thanks for that expanation, i am sure you meant at the end the drummer is playing 4/4 over 9/8 not as you said 9/16. i hope thats coreect or i am lost again. i used to be a bassist in a semi pro band covering this song, very tricky to play correctly when you have a drummer playing a different rhythm
Hi John! I should really say that the band is playing groupings of 9 16ths over a 4/4 pulse, and not imply that there's a "separate" time signature or whatever. There are simply weirdly-grouped phrases of 16ths, arranged periodically, which make the listener think that the time signature must have changed. The true masters of the "odd phrasing, disguised as periodicity, but it's really just 4/4" in rock and/or metal are Meshuggah, who make "Black Dog" look like "Hot Cross Buns"
@@julikun724 thanks so much for making the effort to respond. At least i understand it now I can play it but it's hard to concentrate when it strays. Cool thank you
![The Song Led Zeppelin Could Never Recreate Live: Ten Years Gone [Song Breakdown]](/img/n.gif)
This video deserves far more views. he not only explained it like a G, but fully demonstrated it as well.
I was today years old when i discovered that there are _musicians_ out there who have listened to this song _carefully_ and failed to spot that it's in 4/4. Wtf?
who doesn't enjoy a big slice of unbridled enthusiasm - thank you dude!
Amazing! I've always struggled to understand why the guitar parts and the drums don't align . . . until they do align again. 9/8 v. 4/4 - brilliantly done!
JPJ: "Hey Jimmy here's one that will have toobers confused for decades to come!" JP: "Right, let's get Bonzo in here!"
And toobers didn't even exist when this was written. Only tubers.
This has baffled me for years. Thanks.
Thank you for this because no one understands how to explain what I'm hearing
Yeah really, WTF was that? LOL!
As a guitarist I looooove the whole explanation and your last comment 1000x times even more :D Hillarious!
BRAVO! This rhythm has been a puzzle for me for such a long time. And, although still somewhat challending to play, this makes absolute sense. Thanks for sharing!
I appreciate that explanation. It's especially helpful because the sheet music I've seen is even more jacked up. I knew there was a logical explanation out there somewhere.
this was literally a 50 year mystery for me
Fantastico!
Can we all appreciate that it took nearly 50 years to figure this out? Meanwhile... Page and Jones are watching. "Yeah... like duh."
I literally just looked up "black dog 9/8", before finding this! I just transcribed it a few weeks ago, for a bass-player-friend's band that's trying to get it down... I'm having trouble trying to explain the way it works to him, so I finally just learned how each 4 measures sounds in-and-of-itself to the 3*(9/8)+5/8 riff. I could already play it just fine on guitar over the straight beat. But now when I play it, I can emphasize the down beats so much better, and keep it so much tighter. I just sent him the link, so my friend can get another perspective, to reinforce what I'm saying.
Well explained, this cleared up the confusion the other videos on Black Dog brought up hahaha
In the rock register, this is one of the trickiest songs to put together as a cover band… would love to see your cover of it, both as a band and as a drummer: this explanation could use a demo, perhaps even one with an “explanatory emphasis” on where/how each musician should count
I keep watching this, but goddamn that song is still mystical!
So let’s see if I have this right ( I’m a guitarist btw )
it’s nine ba na nas over fore drum skins 😮😮
Thank you for this.
Great explanation sir!
Man if understood what you were saying I could probably play the song
Thank you 🥁😎
Demystified it still sounds badass
1:33 Cool Down please !!! 😂🤣😂🤣
...but i still don't understand that darn song !! 😫😫😫😭😭😭
The most interesting about it is, that I don't know how much bananas i have to count before ;-)
It's bananas all the way down
This makes no sense and even if it did, it does not address getting in and out of the a cappella sections, which is the difficult part of figuring out how to count this song. The part you’re talking about obviously fits over a 4/4 back beat. I’ve always thought it’s just a fermata on beat two before the vocals enter, since it doesn’t seem to be the same each time, and there must have been a visual cue after a second rest fermata at the end of the vocal phrase. When they performed it live, they omitted the fermata (or 5/4 bar, or whatever it is) and just played it in 4/4. The biggest clue I’ve found is that there is a stick click before each reentry after what I still think is a fermata rest (not a 5/4 bar as claimed on Wikipedia). It was probably just too difficult to reliably hear the stick click in a live setting, so they did it without the fermata live.
I always wonder if the 5/4 measure after "hey hey mama" came about because Plant only had Bonham's stick clicks in his headphones, not a count as well, and didn't know where 1 was, and came in a beat early!
Riff itself the easy part, but how to count when the riff comes in?
OK… so now that the drummer’s got it right, let’s try and explain it to the rest of the band 😂😂😂
Will you explain the outro timing, please?
But what's the count of the rests, ie, the verse vocal sections? I have never quite been able to nail that down.
I'm happy to call that 4/4 + 5/4, but it also seems like Plant was going by feel even though Bonham was clicking his sticks together (faded out, more or less, in the final mix). But those parts are easy to get, relatively speaking
All I know is it sounds so backwards but in a good way.
thanks for that expanation, i am sure you meant at the end the drummer is playing 4/4 over 9/8 not as you said 9/16. i hope thats coreect or i am lost again. i used to be a bassist in a semi pro band covering this song, very tricky to play correctly when you have a drummer playing a different rhythm
Hi John! I should really say that the band is playing groupings of 9 16ths over a 4/4 pulse, and not imply that there's a "separate" time signature or whatever. There are simply weirdly-grouped phrases of 16ths, arranged periodically, which make the listener think that the time signature must have changed. The true masters of the "odd phrasing, disguised as periodicity, but it's really just 4/4" in rock and/or metal are Meshuggah, who make "Black Dog" look like "Hot Cross Buns"
@@julikun724 thanks so much for making the effort to respond. At least i understand it now
I can play it but it's hard to concentrate when it strays. Cool thank you
Oh that’s fun!
Explained only the way a drummer could
Only a drummer would know
Rumer has it that it was done to make it harder to cover the song.
True
Math
Info you need only to win a Jeopardy question. It still hits the ears wrong now matter how you explain it... Thanks though.
This makes no sense whatsoever.