The modern car seems to make up all its time in the fast corners. The old car was a bit faster on the straight and lighter on its feet in the slow corners. Interesting how far aero has come.
Ikr. Montoya was ahead upto the near half of the video. Don't get me wrong. Both are just as impressive. But to think how the older f1 cars handled as if taming wild beasts, I think it's a little bit more impressive
@@ipo7596 Montoya went in front at the start of the video because he cut the kerb at the first Variante. Kimi couldn't cut as much because of the sausage kerbs
@@chrissss696 I see. I was hoping the cars would be the only variable when comparing laptimes. But that is virtually impossible as conditions, track changes, etc are all factors that also change. Still an accurate comparison though
@@oscarcamargop the drivers are hungrier than ever, but f1 is no longer about the racing but for research and development for future automobile tech. It sucks but thats the only excuse to keep the sport around, hence the v6 hybrids and halos.
Kimi had already made the ground up on the previous bends... 2018 has far superior braking and cornering but the 2004s were insane on the straights! We need more hp! Lol
People really need to look up what underrated means. Everyone who knows F1 from this era even a little agrees he was an absolute beast who deserved at least one title, if not more. He deserves to win more, but is definitely not underrated.
Vectro666 hahaha...I was gonna say the same thing. V6 sounds like a sick puppy. I don’t know which direction F1 is taking but I am no longer a fan. Used to go down to Melbourne for F1 but now only for Motogp.
@@black7987echo Wtf you were an "F1 fan" just because of the sound... that's not a real fan man, you don't see F1 as a sport you just like to hear a noisy sound and have an eargasm. Get outta here dude
Williams were good for top speed at that time .Because BMW engine almost reach 19.000 rpm . If MSC was not demoted ten places penalty because of an engine change, they could not win for sure.
@@oaz8 Way less downforce and grooved tires. They did have traction control, but that makes a very minimal difference. The older cars overall had a lot less mechanical grip than today's cars.
The 2018 cars weighed a little over 100 KG more and with about 100 or so less horsepower. You can see on the straights that the 2004 car was faster but the 2018 cars are much faster in the corners and thats where Kimi made up all the time on Montoya. Both cars had advantages and disadvantages in different areas. Sure, you can compare them if you like but they are completely different cars.
Slicks bring a massive difference on grip compared to 2004, but they are actually limiting the aero quite a bit in 2021 rules. Just so they can minimize the turbulent air problem F1 has been having for a while now. Major problem for overtaking. The peak power is actually pretty much identical to 2004 cars. 2018 Merc and Ferrari engines with ERS generate anything between 950-1000hp, while 2004 cars peak power was around 950hp. Though, that peak power is available for only 30 seconds a lap in 2018 cars. 2004 engines also had to last only for a race and that wont be coming back to F1.
Amazing how difficult the 2004 car war to drive vs the current cars. I guarantee you Kimi remembers how difficult those cars were to drive. He looks like he is on a Sunday drive in the modern car. Amzing the aero on these modern cars. Montoya's hands are fighting a wild beast. Just Raw V10 power. Talk about how brave these guys were then. No DRS, No full slicks, no ugly but highly effective aero.
Montoya did this without slicks and drs Edit: Now that I have some knowledege I feeling that this comparasion was a little stupid. Both cars have pros and cons, but overall I think that Kimi had an advantage at parabolica
I'm from EE as well but I'm also a automotive nerd so I keep ideas about vast field of automotive (both heavy and light vehicles). So as aerospace and marine
The Reason Montoya Got That Time is Because He Was Cutting The Corner And Putting Half A Car While Powering Through The Straight is Was Consistent And Efficient Montoya Doing That Even At The Last Lap He Put Half A Car in The Turn Video At 1:31 Raikkonen is A Better Driver Clean Driver He Drives Like Me But I Learn Something To Day if You Want To Go To Next Level Like Montoya That's Like Crushing Candy Like When Putin Of Russia Took Crimea
I Think Montoya Will Beat Raikkonen If He Was in The Same Car I Am Aggressive I Am Also Aggressive Like Him Something You Can't Teach Or Learn From Some Are Just Born With That I Beat You With Volkswagon Beetle Greetings From Mexican American th-cam.com/video/sm1CWR6PbA4/w-d-xo.html Russian military helicopter in Crimea [Red Alert 2 remix]
Compared to Raikkonen, Montoya was faster and aggressive but very inconsistent nonetheless. I really miss those days of the V10 & V8 engines. And BMW in F1.
@@peoplecallmesugar5564 You mean the Hybrid V6 ia more powerful than the V10, cuz NA V6 vs NA V10.... there's no contest. In reality the V6 is not more powerful, it's just that the instant torque of the electric system helps get out of the corners quicker than the peaky NA F1 engines.
modern cars? yeah, they are fast in corners, but they have slicks. Montoyas car is much faster, with slick tyres, the 04 generation would be quicker than the current f1.
TBF Montoya could cut the first 2 chicanes because of the lack of kerbs. He went over them, Kimi had to go around. That's worth a lot more time than the difference in Parabolica and I reckon the record would have likely been broken years ago if they were still using the 2004 kerbs
You are so funny 😂 Parabolica exit maybe gives 0,3-0,5 secenod advantage. Send Kimi with the same Ferrari but with cut slicks and no drs and he will be 2-3 seconds slower 😂
The "battling with steering wheel" is a misconception. That shows he can go over the cars limit, beyond it's max grip because the cars traction control allows it. He can then balance that grip by correcting the steering. Kimi did not have that luxury (traction control is banned today) so he has to keep it on the limit and can't correct the same way. If he did that he would be off in the first corner. It's much more difficult keeping it at the limit rather than being able to go over it and just saw away with the steering wheel and have traction control to keep the car in check.
@@aspiknf no one liked F1 back then. F1 viewership had its biggest drop ever back then, everyone complained about how boring it was. F1 was awesome before those years and became awesome again after. But the 2000s was some of the worst racing with so few battles and artificial almost computer controlled cars.
I remember when Kimi and Juan Pablo were teammates at mclaren .. The best couple of teammates in f1 history that I know of.. They used to trade fastest laps and they would always push each other.. Both so evenly matched. There was no team orders.. Two perfectly matched racers.. No team has ever made a better pairing since then.. It's only fitting that Kimi beat montoya.. Im sure he'd be proud..
I will still contend that the 2004 cars are still fastest for two reasons. The new cars have DRS, which gives you a massive boost on the straights and the grooved tires in 2004 were meant to reduce cornering speed. If Montoya had DRS and super soft slicks, his record would be even faster
The lap time is all about rules and regulation, nothing more. They could make the F1 2018 cars faster if they wanted to, just as well the F1 2004 cars could have been faster. To put this in perspective, the unrestricted Porsche 919 LMP1 car would trash also this lap record, if Porsche made the effort. That beast currently holds the Spa and Nordschleife lap records.
The new cars are also 100kg's heavier than the 2004 cars. If you gave Montoya's car DRS and slicks, you would have to make Kimi's car 100kg lighter and give him traction control. The 2018 car would still win and it would win by an even bigger margin.
With the rules of 2004, today's car will be 10 seconds for lap faster. It's not like in 2004 constructors knew some special magic that they forgot later. Those were the rules, those were the times.
Actually, this would be an insanely good thing for FOM to develop. Augmented reality is already a thing, and we already can make cameras that show AR objects in space... Remember Australia 2017, in at least one of the practice sessions with the new graphics, they were showing the mini-sectors for the laps, but they took it away after seeing people pay too much attention to that over the actual cars. An actual ghost on the track would fully solve that problem, for sure. You could see every little detail as to why one lap was different from another as the lap progressed. Surely the degree of telemetry to support such a system is already in place, since this is F1.
Then sadly that car would be slower than the current ones because the hybrid v6s are more powerful than the old v10s and with current aero,the v10s would simply not have enough power to push the car with today's aero as much as the v6 hybrids😥
28 StAB woUnDS??? They’re in the same area horsepower-wise as the older V10s. Hybridized and modernized engine design would put the V10s farther ahead, and that’s without the weight of a turbo kit. Williams made around 950 hp in 2005 with their 3.0L BMW V10
While it's late, some data for Kimi Speed trap at the end of start/finish straight - 342.7 km/h End of the first sector - 326.5 km/h End of the second sector - 340.2 km/h Start/finish line - 318.8 km/h Sector times: 1. 26.519 2. 26.594 (53.113) 3. 26.006 (1.19.119)
o o engines are not the problem blame rules . A v6 playing to the v10s fuel flow limit and having to last only 1 race like in 2004 not 7 like they have to do today would blow the v10s out of the water .
A lot of people seem to forget the current cars are heavier then ever. 2018 cars are around 730kg without race fuel! 2004 cars without race fuel around 600kg. That's a massive 130kg difference! Also the kerbs are higher since 2009. That's also negative for the laptime. The positives from the current cars are the big slick tires for better grip, modern engines for better acceleration out of the corners and the aerodynamic improvement.
@@markhenley3097 offcourse it are regulations. But most people don't do research about the current spec's of the cars. Weight plays a big factor of the current cars.
Because most people have no clue about weight influence on cars. They think it's just a number while it's basically the most important factor next to power of the car
O Montoya quase cortou caminho nas duas primeiras chicanes por que não tinha a zebra salsicha, ainda mais com um carro mais leve com menos pressão aerodinâmica.
Compared to the pirelli slicks those old Michelin tires were on a different level. They had grooves but the compound was better, and so was the construction (lighter AND more durable) It's just plain wrong to assume the current pirelli eraser tyres are superior the tyre war Michelins.
the current pirelli slicks are a joke compared to the old grooved tires meant to put on a show. The Michelins back then were made to compete at the highest level, not the pirellis which made them worse to get better and more entertaining races
Y hay q tener en cuenta los neumáticos de esta época a la de aquella, y aparte que antes no había DRS y ahora sí , creo q sin DRS no se romperia ese récord todavía
I'd say Montoya constantly on the edge of spinning out, his ballsy entries on the chicanes yet having a beautiful line through it all. Kimi is a great driver but he was noticeably behind, even in a newer car, he only really gained the lead after the second chicane, a very impressive move from kimi, entering the second chicane much faster than Montoya, that exit speed was flying. Both really great drives but I love my boy Montoya.
@@gabri_111 oigan a este? Si raikkonen lleva el ERS (sistema de recuperación de energía), que proporciona 163 HP extras duranteEn 2011 la Fórmula 1 introdujo el alerón trasero móvil conocido como DRS (del inglés Drag Reduction System). Es un sistema que se utiliza para reducir las cargar de aerodinámicas del monoplaza y así aume tar la velocidad de adelantamientos, fuera de eso las llantas lisas le dan mayor adherencia al pavime to no hable bobadas, tecnología la que lleva raikkonen
It's awesome how Montoya was faster all the way up to Ascari, and at the same time how Raikkonen's virtuoso driving through Ascari and Parabolica made the difference, awesome
Williams FanBoy talking: I so wish Juan had stayed at Williams! Along with BMW. Juan definitely should’ve been world champ in 2003 I think it was. He’s like Mario Andretti but better
And DRS and todays aero package. Not to mention a natural progression of performance from a 3 litre V10. Pound for pound the cars of the V10 era outperform todays car by a good margin.
@@gabri_111 and lower the kerbs on the chicanes like they were in 2004, easily over half a second lost there for the 2018 lap. And let them run engines with unlimited fuel flow that basically self destruct on every race instead on only having 3 a year
Downforce has evolved over the years, that’s the main reason why Kimi set the record. You can tell in 2004 F1’s where lighter and slightly faster on straights maybe because they weren’t carrying as much drag, but today’s clever use of flaps, wings, floor etc is far more advanced and it shows, see how Kimi’s just flying through fast corners as if the car was on rails. Same happened with the 919 EVO, downforce is everything.
No. The 2004 car had traction control. That alone makes it easier to drive, most likely. You can’t be fooled by watching hand movements. Kimi utterly destroyed Montoya when they were teammates in 2005.
Incredible how much more composed the cars are. Montoya had to fight every corner with massive amounts of alterations. Milk had it seemless throughout the whole lap. Beautiful really
Not to mention when Kimi was driving he had another car in the distance that was clearing his air, they also helped him get more speed. As did the driver in front of him. They were all getting faster track times cause of the car in front. Montoyas lap for me was more impressive .
Remember a legend who kept his record around 20 years? He would easily destroy nowadays drivers with his BMW with no drs, turbo and slicks. His legendary line: They pay me to win, not to be behind Schumacher. ❤😁
@@m598lmr his car is 150kg lighter his front tires are wider no real wing could cut way more curb had a fresher engine and TC was banned in 2008 😘 get your facts right buddy
@@jorge_781 no. The Pirellis are intentionally designed to grip less and wear at a certain rate. Pirelli could make a much better tyre if they were allowed.
The lack of down force and weight really helps the top end, shame about the grooved tyres making braking and cornering slower, on slicks I bet that 2004 car would be fast enough to be faster. And let's not forget the size of these new cars, much longer and wider, huge stability gains there.
Rosso Tifosi kimi had a wider run off than Montoya so I would say that this comparison isn’t too far because as we know if he was on the grass he would of lost it
Jorge I never said I agreed with the kerbing either, the point I was making was simply the over use of run off areas now. If Montoya went near the grass he would of spiralled off, making it more interesting as they can’t rely on it as a run off area. The kerbing we could argue either way on if it makes the racing better or not(the cars go quicker through the corners / the cars ability to turn in tight succession is impressive) but I will summarise that yes kimi was faster in the corners that Montoya didn’t cut, however kimi’s car is 9 inches wider (lowers gravity) slick tyres and better aero dynamics... whereas Montoya, grooved tyres, narrower and limited aerodynamics so slowing right down for each corner yes the cars would have a much wider margin however I’m just wondering if you have Montoya slicks how close would it be? I’ve also seen how you’ve commented on other people’s posts and to refer to them as “retards” is quite appalling considering they just have a difference in opinion.
That's no fair JPM was hanging on to that FW-26 like it was an F1-11 fighter jet. Kimi's Hybrid Ferrari looked like it was on its way to the store for groceries!
Engies here say that that 2004 was easier to drive bc of TC... Then You look at the cameras and see one guy bouncing one side to the other, turning his head furiously and eating those corners holding that steering wheel like a wild horse on crack and notice that a Lot of stupid people just have internet. Kimi's lap is like watching Karen go grocery shopping
@@vlasov18 sawing at the steering wheel doesn't mean it's more difficult. Why does people think that? Montoya has the luxury of traction control, that means he doesn't need to worry about going over the limit, so he can just correct as much as he wants to without having to worry about spinning. Kimi does not have that luxury and has to keep it on the limit.
The modern car seems to make up all its time in the fast corners. The old car was a bit faster on the straight and lighter on its feet in the slow corners. Interesting how far aero has come.
Ikr. Montoya was ahead upto the near half of the video. Don't get me wrong. Both are just as impressive. But to think how the older f1 cars handled as if taming wild beasts, I think it's a little bit more impressive
way faster on the straights
Before Ascari Montoya had been always in front, after Ascari Kimi was clearly in front. Aero developments indeed
@@ipo7596 Montoya went in front at the start of the video because he cut the kerb at the first Variante. Kimi couldn't cut as much because of the sausage kerbs
@@chrissss696 I see. I was hoping the cars would be the only variable when comparing laptimes. But that is virtually impossible as conditions, track changes, etc are all factors that also change. Still an accurate comparison though
The amount of speed the modern cars can carry through Ascari is insane
Watching it at the Autodromo is something else, it's breathtaking, you ain't got the time to blink your eyes
Tom because these modern cars have so much more downforce and are so much lighter with the carbon fibre chassis. Just ridicoulous
They are not lighther, they are heavier...but super sticky slick tyres and tons of downforce make these cars the fastest cornering machines ever....
@@mcree2goodforu471 today's cars are MUCH heavier
Why did kimi lift off at the end of his lap!?
There's something raw, organic, real, gritty, scarier about the Montoya drive.
He had no fear
All old pilots had no fear. Racing once was a war, now is a pussy show....
@@oscarcamargop how?
@@oscarcamargop the drivers are hungrier than ever, but f1 is no longer about the racing but for research and development for future automobile tech. It sucks but thats the only excuse to keep the sport around, hence the v6 hybrids and halos.
@@abdbcdgbja5733 cause now you got Vettel and Hamilton complaining about everything, the only real Pilot is Max Verstappen
Easy when he gets his gloves and steering wheel.
ThallesFmusic and enough fuel
give me the steering wheel! HEY!
make this meme great XD
Plot twist, they screw with his strategy tomorrow. Oh wait...
And his drink
Its rather amazing how far ahead montoya was for abotu 2/3 of the lap.
I wonder how much Kimi gained getting to put half is car outside of the track limits through parabolica.
Kimi had already made the ground up on the previous bends... 2018 has far superior braking and cornering but the 2004s were insane on the straights!
We need more hp! Lol
@@WeirdBrick We have more power than the V10 era, we just have so much downforce lol
Brem that's a slower line, what are you on about? All the time Kimi made up was through Ascari and being able to brake later than JPM
Car can go off limits as long as both tyres aren't past the track limit
Montoya is underrated as hell
was
Montoya is an absolute legend!
Definitely. Montoya fkt with prime schumacher!
One of, if not the best overall drivers of all time. He gets in any car and wins.
People really need to look up what underrated means. Everyone who knows F1 from this era even a little agrees he was an absolute beast who deserved at least one title, if not more. He deserves to win more, but is definitely not underrated.
I love the fact how the V10 is muted down otherwise you can hear nothing of the V6... 😂
Vectro666 hahaha...I was gonna say the same thing. V6 sounds like a sick puppy. I don’t know which direction F1 is taking but I am no longer a fan. Used to go down to Melbourne for F1 but now only for Motogp.
@@black7987echo imagine being a fan of something purely for a sound of an engine, couldn't be me
@@black7987echo Wtf you were an "F1 fan" just because of the sound... that's not a real fan man, you don't see F1 as a sport you just like to hear a noisy sound and have an eargasm. Get outta here dude
@@black7987echo thank god you're no longer a fan
@@black7987echo we don't need "fans" like you.
When Williams Was Williams .
williams wasn't that good in 2004. they only won the last race of the season.
@@sultanabran1 At least they won a race. Look at them now. Its just sad.
Williams were good for top speed at that time .Because BMW engine almost reach 19.000 rpm . If MSC was not demoted ten places penalty because of an engine change, they could not win for sure.
When Williams was Williams BMW
We really need BMW back in F1!!!
💯 Montoya 🔥
No Slicks
No Turbo
No DRS
👏🏾👏🏾👏🏾
V10 screaming !!!
@@oaz8 Way less downforce and grooved tires. They did have traction control, but that makes a very minimal difference. The older cars overall had a lot less mechanical grip than today's cars.
No fuel flow restriction
no ERS also
The 2018 cars weighed a little over 100 KG more and with about 100 or so less horsepower. You can see on the straights that the 2004 car was faster but the 2018 cars are much faster in the corners and thats where Kimi made up all the time on Montoya. Both cars had advantages and disadvantages in different areas. Sure, you can compare them if you like but they are completely different cars.
We will laugh about the camera quality in 2018 one day.
Probably looking around in HD VR from whatever car you want or some sorts.
@@bartterp88 but we already have the technology for that... You're not looking far enough ahead!
I already laugh, 2004 camera is much better than this shit
nightvvisher you meant 2024
I'm not too creative for that. :o
2018: Massive corner grip and exit speeds.
2004: Straight line speed and raw power.
Can we combine both? FIA? Fans want it anyway.
2004 cars with DRS and slicks, simple mate
I would agree about 2018 but I'd also the 2004 car was better under breaking not raw power. Better under breaking due to being a lot lighter
Slicks bring a massive difference on grip compared to 2004, but they are actually limiting the aero quite a bit in 2021 rules. Just so they can minimize the turbulent air problem F1 has been having for a while now. Major problem for overtaking.
The peak power is actually pretty much identical to 2004 cars. 2018 Merc and Ferrari engines with ERS generate anything between 950-1000hp, while 2004 cars peak power was around 950hp. Though, that peak power is available for only 30 seconds a lap in 2018 cars. 2004 engines also had to last only for a race and that wont be coming back to F1.
Don't forget traction control and ABS
What ABS? In 2004?
Amazing how difficult the 2004 car war to drive vs the current cars. I guarantee you Kimi remembers how difficult those cars were to drive. He looks like he is on a Sunday drive in the modern car. Amzing the aero on these modern cars. Montoya's hands are fighting a wild beast. Just Raw V10 power. Talk about how brave these guys were then. No DRS, No full slicks, no ugly but highly effective aero.
TRACTION CONTROL an more cheap fun to drive .
Montoya did this without slicks and drs
Edit: Now that I have some knowledege I feeling that this comparasion was a little stupid.
Both cars have pros and cons, but overall I think that Kimi had an advantage at parabolica
He had lighter car and not so worn engine tho
narrower car, less power, no electric energy also.
V10 engines for days, incredibly light fuel load, less weight and the most powerful engine in the grid
but we can only use 3 engines per season this time around
But Montoya more power wiht V10 while Kimi have V6.
And the last record of V10 is beaten :(
Now Imagine a v10 in that ferrari :D
ill never forget the v10's that made me a car lover :(
The FW2003 Williams and F2004 Ferrari will never ever be forgotten ever
@@xMofly8 it would be slower, modern engines have over 1000hp, while the v10 has just over 900. And also the v6 has much more torque.
why was the fw 2003 so legendary?
A lot of "Engineers" here in the comment section I see
I AM an engineer and know near to nothing about those cars and professional racing. Don't worry, I'm not going to annoy any one with my expertise.
I AM an engineer. But I’m an electrical engineer so I don’t know about this stuff.
I'm from EE as well but I'm also a automotive nerd so I keep ideas about vast field of automotive (both heavy and light vehicles). So as aerospace and marine
@Bilal Khalid you?
'welcome to technical development'
Who said Kimi expired in 2008? He's still got the speed!
Slipstream helps. On the GPS he was 4-5mph faster than Vettel at every straight which can only be down to slipstream, not setups.
But he does not have the drink!
@@theicemancometh5492 Vettel is way to far in front to give Kimi slipstream.
The Iceman Cometh The experts debated over if the slipstream even gave him 0.010s of an advantage
Kimi often takes slightly compromised lines through corners to carry more speed through them. Might have something to do with the KPH difference.
In video editing: V10 sound at 10% volume, V6 sound at 110% volume...
The Reason Montoya Got That Time is Because He Was Cutting The Corner And Putting Half A Car While Powering Through The Straight is Was Consistent And Efficient Montoya Doing That Even At The Last Lap He Put Half A Car in The Turn Video At 1:31 Raikkonen is A Better Driver Clean Driver He Drives Like Me But I Learn Something To Day if You Want To Go To Next Level Like Montoya That's Like Crushing Candy Like When Putin Of Russia Took Crimea
I Think Montoya Will Beat Raikkonen If He Was in The Same Car I Am Aggressive I Am Also Aggressive Like Him Something You Can't Teach Or Learn From Some Are Just Born With That I Beat You With Volkswagon Beetle Greetings From Mexican American th-cam.com/video/sm1CWR6PbA4/w-d-xo.html Russian military helicopter in Crimea [Red Alert 2 remix]
@@WagnerExorcistGroup - bruh he wasn't even talking about the lap
@@WagnerExorcistGroup Why Do You Capitalize Every Single Word You Say?
@@crazymonkey60123 OCD, i think
Great Montoya, the "Nigel Mansell" of 2000's years.
Fast idiof
No! Mansell at least won a championship
@@bigvee401 He lost it at least 3 times before 1992, and even announced his retirement in 1990
No
For me it was the modern Gilles Villeneuve: He was not a champion, but he was speed to the limit, he is one of my favorites
Montoya: I have the fastest lap ever in F1
Kimi: Hold my ice cream
Kimi: Ok
Let me finish my sheet.
(After Kimi beats his lap) Montoya: Fucking Raikkonnen! What a fucking idiot!
Hold my ice ice cream xD
Without drs bs it was no possible
Really shows how fast Juan was in the BMW with less downforce and less grip. Both are insanely fast though.
Compared to Raikkonen, Montoya was faster and aggressive but very inconsistent nonetheless. I really miss those days of the V10 & V8 engines. And BMW in F1.
2004 cars had traction control and ABS though
Different chicane layout
@@AdamCKA no abs.
i mean, i think kimi proved he was quicker in 2005
wonder how fast the V10 could be on 2018 Hypersoft slick tyres.
Toooo fucking fast for the tires
V6 is faster actually!
@@peoplecallmesugar5564 You mean the Hybrid V6 ia more powerful than the V10, cuz NA V6 vs NA V10.... there's no contest. In reality the V6 is not more powerful, it's just that the instant torque of the electric system helps get out of the corners quicker than the peaky NA F1 engines.
@@cristianr3712 Actually, the V6 turbo hybrid is faster than the V10
It would have to go around rather than over the steeper kerbs just like the 2018 car, so it probably wouldn’t be much faster.
All the time gained at Lesmos, Ascari and Parabolica
At parabolica without the grass it's "easier" 😉
He recovered at the lesmo 1-2 and pulled away at Ascari and parabolica
Uhm not only, he have gained at Lesmo 1, Ascari and Parabolica( last corner)
Giusto, purtroppo è la verità
No. He was already faster after Lesmo. Pause at the bridge and see.
Modern cars are so much faster in turns
kimi88cz corners*
And if you look at the exit of the first chicane the acceleration and mechanical grip is so much better in these modern cars
modern cars? yeah, they are fast in corners, but they have slicks. Montoyas car is much faster, with slick tyres, the 04 generation would be quicker than the current f1.
@@GigaKubica88 exatcly, we've come a long way in terms of downforce since then.
modern cars are also wider. Much better on slow corners with less downforce
Kimi had extra track on Parabolica to go wide while Montoya had a more difficult exit.
Paul Cristian cats are heavier though and wider(?) so probably evens out
Kimi had no traction control.
john wycherley TC makes cars slower not faster.
TBF Montoya could cut the first 2 chicanes because of the lack of kerbs. He went over them, Kimi had to go around. That's worth a lot more time than the difference in Parabolica and I reckon the record would have likely been broken years ago if they were still using the 2004 kerbs
You are so funny 😂 Parabolica exit maybe gives 0,3-0,5 secenod advantage. Send Kimi with the same Ferrari but with cut slicks and no drs and he will be 2-3 seconds slower 😂
00:55 That difference in steering movements 😲
@Zeronality whats driving aids?
@@daffafamous6179 traction control
@@daffafamous6179 it's when computer helps you drive. Traction control is one of them.
@@russotusso1695 Which current F1 cars do not have.
Montoya went over the kerb more on that particular moment
Kimi: Thank you.
We really need BMW back in F1!!
BMW number 1!!!
Is Williams
No. What we really need is NA engine.
@@ninou972 BMW is BMW
@@vladimirstamenkov9374 yep but only engine is by bmw
2 F1 legends driver
Imagine hypersoft slick tires on Montoya's 2004 BMW-Williams :O
BuzzRaceWars imagine the sf71h with the 2004 williams fuel flow limit ...
@@renerodrigues561 and tc
Imagine DRS and full slick tyres on JPMs Williams.
And DRS
The Ferrari is on supersofts not hyper
Montoya is battling with the steering wheel more and looks harder to drive
The "battling with steering wheel" is a misconception. That shows he can go over the cars limit, beyond it's max grip because the cars traction control allows it. He can then balance that grip by correcting the steering.
Kimi did not have that luxury (traction control is banned today) so he has to keep it on the limit and can't correct the same way. If he did that he would be off in the first corner.
It's much more difficult keeping it at the limit rather than being able to go over it and just saw away with the steering wheel and have traction control to keep the car in check.
@@Rottensteam by your logic, last year's Mercedes was being driven over it's limit 🤦🏻♂️
@Victor Nag No
@@Rottensteam You keep hating on us old timers and liking the new F1
@@aspiknf no one liked F1 back then. F1 viewership had its biggest drop ever back then, everyone complained about how boring it was. F1 was awesome before those years and became awesome again after. But the 2000s was some of the worst racing with so few battles and artificial almost computer controlled cars.
Love how they lowered the 2004 clip's volume to the minimun so the 2018 one could be listened lmao
I remember when Kimi and Juan Pablo were teammates at mclaren .. The best couple of teammates in f1 history that I know of.. They used to trade fastest laps and they would always push each other.. Both so evenly matched. There was no team orders.. Two perfectly matched racers.. No team has ever made a better pairing since then.. It's only fitting that Kimi beat montoya.. Im sure he'd be proud..
I dot think they can compare to Prost & Senna at mclaren.
@@steveetienne Kimi can. Prime Kimi at McLaren during the tyre war was terrifyingly quick. Montoya Kimi was not close at all, Raikkonen destroyed him.
Qui Gonn you know Kimi won with second best car
La tecnología acompañó a kimy. El carro de jpm se ve más nervioso, más difícil de controlar, el de kimy se ve más suave, pero que grande fue jpm.
Claro es como comparar el auto de Ayrton Senna con el Jp Montoya, que grande fue Senna.
Kimi*
Vamos colombia saludos desde bogota
Kimi fué mucho mas regular que Juan Pablo en su carrera, dos grandes pilotos. Me hubiera gustado que el colombiano gane un mundial
@@federicogomez3356 Juan pablo no gano la formula uno por culpa de el mismo. Se retiro muy rapido de la F1.
I will still contend that the 2004 cars are still fastest for two reasons. The new cars have DRS, which gives you a massive boost on the straights and the grooved tires in 2004 were meant to reduce cornering speed. If Montoya had DRS and super soft slicks, his record would be even faster
The lap time is all about rules and regulation, nothing more. They could make the F1 2018 cars faster if they wanted to, just as well the F1 2004 cars could have been faster. To put this in perspective, the unrestricted Porsche 919 LMP1 car would trash also this lap record, if Porsche made the effort. That beast currently holds the Spa and Nordschleife lap records.
The new cars are also 100kg's heavier than the 2004 cars. If you gave Montoya's car DRS and slicks, you would have to make Kimi's car 100kg lighter and give him traction control. The 2018 car would still win and it would win by an even bigger margin.
@@mrbdzz doesn't hold the spa one any more...
Kimi broke that in free practice!
With the rules of 2004, today's car will be 10 seconds for lap faster. It's not like in 2004 constructors knew some special magic that they forgot later. Those were the rules, those were the times.
Agreed.
They need to do the ghost car thing, would be cool to see
Actually, this would be an insanely good thing for FOM to develop. Augmented reality is already a thing, and we already can make cameras that show AR objects in space... Remember Australia 2017, in at least one of the practice sessions with the new graphics, they were showing the mini-sectors for the laps, but they took it away after seeing people pay too much attention to that over the actual cars. An actual ghost on the track would fully solve that problem, for sure. You could see every little detail as to why one lap was different from another as the lap progressed. Surely the degree of telemetry to support such a system is already in place, since this is F1.
Great write up Fred. And o forgot that yes they Did do this!
Fred931v2 they have GPS, which would make it possible for sure
Montoya after seeing this :
F*****G RAIKKONEN !!!
again*
"Fucking fucking Raikkonen What a fucking idiot"
You say Raikkonen bad?😠😠😠😤🔪🔫
@@chanchaniceman Raikkonen is best and you are gay
@@Petri_Pennala th-cam.com/video/stb0sqtwAZA/w-d-xo.html
oh man, I know everyone knows that, but I still want the v10 back
That sound!!! 😪 V10 in my heart!!
But your icon is of a turbo?????
you also want 4 - 5 seconds slower cars.
@@JakobusVdL was about to point that out
@@adnanadi9898 well u dont know and never know how powerful v10 hybrid engine will be, so u cant say v10 is slower than ur beloved v6 hybrid
I say V10 with modern aerodynamics. That's F1 Gold!
No pilot can handle it, i believe!!!
Then sadly that car would be slower than the current ones because the hybrid v6s are more powerful than the old v10s and with current aero,the v10s would simply not have enough power to push the car with today's aero as much as the v6 hybrids😥
And use turbo and ERS, because that way it will be useless, current V6 will be faster, if not
28 StAB woUnDS??? They’re in the same area horsepower-wise as the older V10s. Hybridized and modernized engine design would put the V10s farther ahead, and that’s without the weight of a turbo kit. Williams made around 950 hp in 2005 with their 3.0L BMW V10
V10 800 HP, V6 Turbo 1000 HP Qualifying....
While it's late, some data for Kimi
Speed trap at the end of start/finish straight - 342.7 km/h
End of the first sector - 326.5 km/h
End of the second sector - 340.2 km/h
Start/finish line - 318.8 km/h
Sector times:
1. 26.519
2. 26.594 (53.113)
3. 26.006 (1.19.119)
David Coulthard 364.8 km/h basically 365 km/h in 2004
@@Smzxe Data from 2018 Kimi lap were from official F1 statistics :)
Took 14 years to go slightly faster... need more PAWAH
Alex Thompson 14 years to allow them to go faster
We're already have more power. It just the car rn had so much downforce
Because after they changed from V10 to V8 they became slower. And even in V6 Turbo Hybrid era, they were slower until last year in 2017.
o o engines are not the problem blame rules . A v6 playing to the v10s fuel flow limit and having to last only 1 race like in 2004 not 7 like they have to do today would blow the v10s out of the water .
Kono powah!
The first half, Montoya was quicker
2004 was faster on the straights so he gains loads in sector 1. vast majority of raikonen's time is through ascari
Saint and the Ferrari Goes quicker through the corners
montaya uses a lot of kerb turn 1 and 2
Kimi gained in the lezmo corners, particularly the first one & extended his advantage in Ascari chicane
Don't forget that in sector 2, even when Kimi was behind, he was already faster, catching up...
Non-slick tyres, no DRS, no turbo. Took fourteen years to be beaten - only just. Bring back the V10's, please!
And 4 more cylinders...
But they had Traction control and ABS
No one inside formula 1 wants then back, why cant u just stop crying, cars are better and faster now, just move on
@Jurassic Mindset what?
@@arturchop4749 V14?!?!?!
This sound is bwoahtastic =))
A lot of people seem to forget the current cars are heavier then ever. 2018 cars are around 730kg without race fuel! 2004 cars without race fuel around 600kg. That's a massive 130kg difference! Also the kerbs are higher since 2009. That's also negative for the laptime.
The positives from the current cars are the big slick tires for better grip, modern engines for better acceleration out of the corners and the aerodynamic improvement.
Knoalster205 Cti It's FIA regulations.
@@markhenley3097 offcourse it are regulations. But most people don't do research about the current spec's of the cars. Weight plays a big factor of the current cars.
Because most people have no clue about weight influence on cars. They think it's just a number while it's basically the most important factor next to power of the car
@@Dany_Fox1 so true! Every additional 10kg of weight on an F1 car is worth on average 3/10ths of a second per lap.
Kimi also had to dodge massive sausage kerbs on the Apex.
Área de escape do Montoya era quase todas de brita e a F1 evoluiu com áreas de escapes mais seguras. Bela volta do colombiano.
O Montoya quase cortou caminho nas duas primeiras chicanes por que não tinha a zebra salsicha, ainda mais com um carro mais leve com menos pressão aerodinâmica.
Montoya will be always in our hearts 🇨🇴
Juan Pablo forever....fuckin Raikkonen...Fuckin idiot....:D
Montoya is fucking arrogant, he thinks he's better than anyone, that's why he's no longer in F1, cry baby
JEAN PAUL HIGUERA RAMIREZ Raikonnen is better
@@juniorjota3342 we need such character in f1 unlike max CRASH.
@@olivermccall3898 Kimi is better and not won Indy 500
"fucking Raikkonen"
Damn, I had forgotten that 😄
"What a fucking idiot"
LMFAO
katsching HAHAHA! Completely forgot about that team radio!!!
😂😂😂😂 amazing
Imagine the old V10 F1 with the slick tyres instead of that fluting shit they had.
Compared to the pirelli slicks those old Michelin tires were on a different level. They had grooves but the compound was better, and so was the construction (lighter AND more durable)
It's just plain wrong to assume the current pirelli eraser tyres are superior the tyre war Michelins.
the current pirelli slicks are a joke compared to the old grooved tires meant to put on a show. The Michelins back then were made to compete at the highest level, not the pirellis which made them worse to get better and more entertaining races
The last 2004 record has been broken after 14 years
Pole record, the Monza lap record is still from 2004 so we'll have to see if they beat that tomorrow
Lap record still belongs to Barrichello, on lap 41 1:21.046
Yeah the race lap, but the quali lap is broken
Of course, I just reinforced that there is still the race lap record to beat, which may or may not be broken on Sunday
It wont be broken, the hybrid cars deploy all their energy over one qualy lap, they can't do that during the race.
El auto de kimi es más veloz en línea recta impresionante como Montoya pudo mantener ese récord por tanto tiempo.
Y hay q tener en cuenta los neumáticos de esta época a la de aquella, y aparte que antes no había DRS y ahora sí , creo q sin DRS no se romperia ese récord todavía
Drs 😒
No es más veloz, de hecho es mucho más lento aún con DRS
Solo tiene mayor aceleración en velocidades bajas
En el sector de lesmo creo que se llama le recortó y sumó toda la ventaja
Kimi va paseando y Montoya batallando. Es impresionante la diferencia de épocas.
Montoya was a real Racing Beast! 👍🏽
Ingenieur: Kimi you stand of Pole And The roundrecord
Kimi: ok
Giuliano Di Staulo 😂😂 Sry, my englisch is Not so Good 🇩🇪
The Williams was ahead in the first Sector and most of the second sector. Damm BMW Power Babe!
Its because montoya’s line at some of the turns are a shorter route before,nowadays there are sausage kerbs to prevent that from happening
Bwoah so fast
I'd say Montoya constantly on the edge of spinning out, his ballsy entries on the chicanes yet having a beautiful line through it all. Kimi is a great driver but he was noticeably behind, even in a newer car, he only really gained the lead after the second chicane, a very impressive move from kimi, entering the second chicane much faster than Montoya, that exit speed was flying. Both really great drives but I love my boy Montoya.
Montoya mucho más agresivo el sonido de ese V10 sin tanta tecnología que piloto viva Colombia 🇨🇴
Una epoca dorada de la F1 que grandísimos pilotos habían.
@@rafamartos6079 Montoya tiene control de tracción y el Ferrari no, no sé qué dices menos tecnología
Montoya siempre siendo un loco y todo un sabio al volante, magnífico manejo
Yes
@@gabri_111 oigan a este? Si raikkonen lleva el ERS (sistema de recuperación de energía), que proporciona 163 HP extras duranteEn 2011 la Fórmula 1 introdujo el alerón trasero móvil conocido como DRS (del inglés Drag Reduction System). Es un sistema que se utiliza para reducir las cargar de aerodinámicas del monoplaza y así aume tar la velocidad de adelantamientos, fuera de eso las llantas lisas le dan mayor adherencia al pavime to no hable bobadas, tecnología la que lleva raikkonen
It's awesome how Montoya was faster all the way up to Ascari, and at the same time how Raikkonen's virtuoso driving through Ascari and Parabolica made the difference, awesome
So in 14 years we have made 1 tenth of a second progress... Nice
? The regulations are totally different.
Changes in 2005, 2009 and 2014 all slowed the cars down considerably.
Montoya had a v10 and kimi a v6
And the camera got better
Now the cars can do 21 races with 3 engines, Montoya, 1 engine per race
And more pixels and more fps...
Montoya tirou no limite.
O raikkonen tem um carro moderno, balanceado e com DRS, aí é mais fácil.
2004 the cars were singing
Williams FanBoy talking: I so wish Juan had stayed at Williams! Along with BMW. Juan definitely should’ve been world champ in 2003 I think it was. He’s like Mario Andretti but better
put slick tires on the BMW ;)
And DRS and todays aero package. Not to mention a natural progression of performance from a 3 litre V10.
Pound for pound the cars of the V10 era outperform todays car by a good margin.
-100kg for the Ferrari then
@@gabri_111 and lower the kerbs on the chicanes like they were in 2004, easily over half a second lost there for the 2018 lap. And let them run engines with unlimited fuel flow that basically self destruct on every race instead on only having 3 a year
Put v10 engine on the ferrari
the 2018 car would still be faster
Montoya car sound was amazing😍
Downforce has evolved over the years, that’s the main reason why Kimi set the record. You can tell in 2004 F1’s where lighter and slightly faster on straights maybe because they weren’t carrying as much drag, but today’s clever use of flaps, wings, floor etc is far more advanced and it shows, see how Kimi’s just flying through fast corners as if the car was on rails. Same happened with the 919 EVO, downforce is everything.
Both of them are F1 legend. Last corner side lane changed the racing line in 2018, and i think its give Raikkonen more corner speed
Old Parabolica was better.
*Hope they will put the grass on the outside for next year...*
Chuyew, 69 ‘likes’
New chicane was better.
That V10 sound❤️
Bring v10 back
_"You killed my father. Now prepare to d..."_
Oh wait, wrong Montoya.
@@cjhowell7515 hahahahaha you got it mate!
Oh dear
Montoya was... STILL is amazing! 🇨🇴
Montoya one of the greatest drivers of the era
santiago linares #69 Among Raikkonen and Alonso. Wish he competed for a while longer, would've made the seasons more interesting.
Look how much work Montoya has to put in compared to Kimi
No. The 2004 car had traction control. That alone makes it easier to drive, most likely. You can’t be fooled by watching hand movements. Kimi utterly destroyed Montoya when they were teammates in 2005.
Amazing, how reliability and fuel consumption have been improved since then, without substantial losses in performance.
Incredible how much more composed the cars are. Montoya had to fight every corner with massive amounts of alterations. Milk had it seemless throughout the whole lap. Beautiful really
Sector times, speed and other graphic would be appreciated.. 😉
Ahhh, just how good that Williams looked like... It brings back memories.
Not to mention when Kimi was driving he had another car in the distance that was clearing his air, they also helped him get more speed. As did the driver in front of him. They were all getting faster track times cause of the car in front. Montoyas lap for me was more impressive .
Montoya was such an animal when he was on it. I remember feeling sad as a kid when he left f1. He had way more years in him
They basically evolved the entry of high speed corners
that bmw williams is my favourite car ever in f1 and williams will rise once again!!!
That car was what it was because of Monthy
Remember a legend who kept his record around 20 years? He would easily destroy nowadays drivers with his BMW with no drs, turbo and slicks.
His legendary line: They pay me to win, not to be behind Schumacher.
❤😁
Aaaa V10 BMW 2004 😍
Pure music!!!
good old days
Add radio message of both drivers
That should be more epic. Both are my favorite driver. Legends they are.
I wanted to do this comparison. gladded you did it already .
0:04 Kimi got a marble in his cockpit just thought id highlight that
haha :D.
Montoya had no run-off to use at Parabolica to get a wider turn.
But he had shitloads of kerbs he could cut
He did have ABS and traction control though
@@AdamCKA Only TC.
He had also narrower and grooved tyres, narrower front and rear wings and no DRS to use, also NO TC, get your facts
@@m598lmr his car is 150kg lighter his front tires are wider no real wing could cut way more curb had a fresher engine and TC was banned in 2008 😘 get your facts right buddy
Montoya ! No slicks , no drs and no electric reserve boost button to press ! So much for F1 evolution.
love the way people assume the 2018 slick tyres which is a control tyre is more grippy than the grooved Michelin in the middle of a tyre war.
So you are completely sure than the 2004 grooved had more grip than the 2018 slick tyre Kimi was running, interesting.
Based on logic. Narrow and grooved tyres, let alone years of structural development by the newer Pirelli.
@@jorge_781 no. The Pirellis are intentionally designed to grip less and wear at a certain rate. Pirelli could make a much better tyre if they were allowed.
@@Rottensteam Grooves. Just compare the patch contact area.
@@jorge_781 no. Compare the rubber compund.
Única coisa que consigo reparar é como Montoya briga com seu carro, o quanto o carro vibra e quao estavel e suave é o carro do Kimi
Si se nota mas suave y manejable el auto de kimi.
Mas não tem controle de tração, se você ver a volta do Hulkemberg vera um carro extremamente instável e difícil de controlar.
Montoya é piloto raiz
Montoya was running on grooved slicks which reduced the grip available and Parabolica had a run off area for Raikkonen to exploit.
The lack of down force and weight really helps the top end, shame about the grooved tyres making braking and cornering slower, on slicks I bet that 2004 car would be fast enough to be faster.
And let's not forget the size of these new cars, much longer and wider, huge stability gains there.
2004 with slicks?... most likely Montoya would still have the record.
1:14 in 2004 Kimis lap is over ;)
except it wasn't 2004 and they go over the runoff area because it's faster
0:12 in 2018 Montoya's lap as well
It's incredible how far ahead Montoya still was at the first Lesmo, but by the time they arrived at Ascari it was all Kimi.
Imagine Montoya had a tow towards the back straight 😮
*Please just reput the grass on the outside of Parabolica for next year !!*
They all go too wide there
Tbh no.
You can see more experienced drivers like Kimi gain more time there then rookies.
Like this it rewards knowledge
Rosso Tifosi kimi had a wider run off than Montoya so I would say that this comparison isn’t too far because as we know if he was on the grass he would of lost it
@@jackharvey9808 then what about Montoya cutting all the chicanes by running over the almost nonexistent kerbs?
Jorge I never said I agreed with the kerbing either, the point I was making was simply the over use of run off areas now. If Montoya went near the grass he would of spiralled off, making it more interesting as they can’t rely on it as a run off area. The kerbing we could argue either way on if it makes the racing better or not(the cars go quicker through the corners / the cars ability to turn in tight succession is impressive) but I will summarise that yes kimi was faster in the corners that Montoya didn’t cut, however kimi’s car is 9 inches wider (lowers gravity) slick tyres and better aero dynamics... whereas Montoya, grooved tyres, narrower and limited aerodynamics so slowing right down for each corner yes the cars would have a much wider margin however I’m just wondering if you have Montoya slicks how close would it be?
I’ve also seen how you’ve commented on other people’s posts and to refer to them as “retards” is quite appalling considering they just have a difference in opinion.
Who cares? That’s how the turn is now, I like it when it’s faster anyways
Awesome video!!
Is it only me or the v6 and the v10 together sounded so cool?
Nah just u
Only you
Yeah they harmonize each other, so fucking cool
no the V6 ruins it
@@julientoury3355 someone thinks like me :D
And you even got more likes than everyone else who commented (ﾉ◕ヮ◕)ﾉ
Juan: I did the fastest lap ever in monza
Kimi: Bwoah hold my ice cream and give my steering wheel
Montoya is shaking way more, dealing with a lot.
Gloves and steering wheel
Hold the ice cream for only 14 years.
I like how at some points, the engine notes from both cars harmonize.
That's no fair JPM was hanging on to that FW-26 like it was an F1-11 fighter jet. Kimi's Hybrid Ferrari looked like it was on its way to the store for groceries!
Engies here say that that 2004 was easier to drive bc of TC... Then You look at the cameras and see one guy bouncing one side to the other, turning his head furiously and eating those corners holding that steering wheel like a wild horse on crack and notice that a Lot of stupid people just have internet. Kimi's lap is like watching Karen go grocery shopping
@@vlasov18 sawing at the steering wheel doesn't mean it's more difficult. Why does people think that?
Montoya has the luxury of traction control, that means he doesn't need to worry about going over the limit, so he can just correct as much as he wants to without having to worry about spinning. Kimi does not have that luxury and has to keep it on the limit.
Legendary Montoya with BMW Power!! Goood Times