Surprised to see the bosch pro being listed as the 'cheap tool'. Bosch blue get some stick around, but l-boxx is a nice system and the blue tools dish out very good quality for a keen price. Arguably Festool are over priced against the competition? I can't speak for quality as I've never owned a Festool, but they do dominate the track saw market. My blue tools never fail to surprise for size and power. We have a good selection of 12v and 18v and corded 230v and are very happy with price and performance
+Alex Bennett I think I might be cutting & pasting this reply a bit 😂 It's only 'cheap' (i.e. 1/4 - 1/3 of the price) in comparison to the Festool. I was amazed that I could get a Bosch pro sander for that kind of price. All my general 10.8v stuff is Bosch, I've had many Bosch blue tools and been very happy with them. Call them 'less expensive' if you like - but it won't fit in the thumbnail. 😂
Good to see all the bosch pro getting praise. What would be an interesting comparison would be a Black and Decker mouse. Absolutely amazing for £20 with loads of accessories
I've got a Bosch circular saw that's 35 years old, still on the same motor. It just won't die. Granted it was replaced some years ago and hasn't seen much action for several years but it still works. Really don't know what to do with it! Can't beat Bosch, all good kit.
I have the little Bosch and found it to be great sander . 25 years of Restoring i have been restoring things for now and Im very happy with the little bosch , I have been using it about 1 year now
All my tools are Bosch, and not one of them has ever let me down, the 36v sds is a brilliant bit of kit and it's well used. The warrenty is very good too.
Bosch has gone way downhill. It's no longer German anything. It just your average run of the mill mediocrity wrapped up im a pretty box with a familiar name.
@@link6397 in your opinion, all my tools have been bosch for the past 8 years and all are used daily, and not one has ever let me down. And their warrenty is excellent, with a great customer service.
I've recently got the RO150, and I've got to say, it tops all other sanders I've used. One of the biggest benefits is the dust extraction, it makes the sanding disks last so much longer. That smaller sander looks like it would come in handy for smaller patches, and corners - the round disks can't get into corners.
I just now bought the Festool for the useless reason that, in South Africa, Bosch only offers the “hobby” sander and not the nice Professional one. Very happy with everything else from Festool so it was a no brainer for me. Thanks for the video Peter! God bless and take care!
Owned and used a Festool RTS 400 for a couple of years, only for diy projects. Repaired 3 times within warranty, and 3 times out of warranty. My best guess is that it broke down every 15 hours of use or so. After breaking down the 7th time I tossed it. I cannot say I am impressed by the quality nor the service.
I think I have four of these, if you include the RS and DS versions, the oldest is ~2003, and they’ve all been used relentlessly. They’ve never missed a beat, and all are in their original brushes. Just for balance. 👍
I'm curious what were the multiple warranty issues that you experienced? I had a rts 400 eq from 2012 go out recently. After disassembly and putting a meter to the armature and the field windings I determined the armature went bad. I opted to replace the sander and ordered a new rts because replacing parts on a pretty old tool can become habit forming. My old rts was used for professional duty and seen a lot of action and held up well imo. When replacing it I did have a short list of alternative options like the Mirka, or the Surfprep. But out of the considerations the RTS came in the most budget friendly and I already have consumables for it. I can say a few years ago I sent a ETS 150 in for repair. The sander had what felt like a wobble or shimmy in the head and having a couple other ETS 150's I knew it wasn't right. So I sent it in and they didn't call me prior like they should have. Instead I just received my sander back with a note in it saying I needed to replace the pad. I was a bit miffed as there are no local stores here so it's something I order online, and had they called me I would have asked them to do it and I'd pay for the pad. Also to be clear it wasn't the pad as a new pad didn't change anything, and if they would of put a new pad on they would of determined there was no change with the tool. I believe it's some kind of counter balance thing but I never sent it back in and that sander doesn't really get used except for some rough work. If that would had been my first sander, or my first interaction with the company I'd of probably never bought another thing from them as I feel they dropped the ball on their customer service that time, but overall I feel like it was a fluke.
I've watched this video several times, thank you! Still on the fence between the DTS400 or the Bosch GSS 160-1 A MULTI. I had a cheap Bosch sander and hated it, got my first Festool sander (ETS125REQ) and it is a dream to use. Now have the Rotex 150 and Rotex 90. All my Festool sanders are spot on. Still not sure about the Bosch.
I got one of those Festool sanders, bought it from a 2nd hand shop (25€), I don't know if mine is broken in some way or if I use it incorrectly but when I use it I almost always get swirl marks. I use festool paper with it and got a new pad. I get a better finish result from my blue bosch random orbital sander.
+1873Winchester Sounds like it's damaged in some way. Seem to remember reading about one that had been dropped and the counter-balance weights shifting, might be worth having it checked out. Uncomfortable thought: there may be a reason it was in a second hand store for €25... Just sayin' 👍
Having both the 90 and 150 in the RO line, before the holidays, they came out with a super deal on the PRO 5. $99 (US) for an actual tool from Festool is far too good to pass up. It is similar to the ETS, but it has the 125mm round pad. Unlike the Rotex line, the PRO 5 is light as a feather. I love how long the paper lasts on the Festool sanders.
+Ira Kopilow Thanks. The Pro 5 is a US-only line I believe, but great value and very similar to the ETS 125. I carry two sanders with me in my 'go everywhere' stack, an ETS 125 and the RTS 400 from this video; I can cover a lot of ground with those two 👍
I have long had reservations about those enclosed rocker type switches. You have to ensure you have switched them of properly. It's easy to leave them on the rock, as it were. Despite being aware of this, it was only a couple of weeks ago, when at my lunch, my wife informed me there was "something buzzing around on the workshop floor!". What could the implications of that have been if I had shut up for the night?
Try out 3M pneumatic random orbital sanders You'll love them. I use them at work and they can't be beat. They are like butter and leave a silky smooth finish with no swirl marks. Avalable in 5/16", 3/16", and 3/32 orbit size. Jitterbug and round styles available. Nobody in production work uses festool for sanding applications. But if you are restricted by electric tool's only, then you might have a case. But personally I would retrofit my shop just so I could use a 3M sander. Once you use one, you will never want to use a substandard electric one ever agian, even if it's a festool. Im getting wet just thinking about those ergonomically seductive lines of the 3M in my hand, with the touch of my fingertip it awakens the most stimulating vibrations I've ever felt come from any tool. As I caress the tool in my palm, the cold steel sends shivers up my arms. Followed by a rush of warm intense pleasure shooting down to my nether regions. I gently apply the slightest pressure to the trigger, and the sander erupts with the power 1000 mustangs yet while simultaneously the incredible control of an Italian cafe' racer. I can't even begin to describe the feeling I get when I give a big, thick, long, hard piece of Dark Walnut the attention it deserves, while still letting it know who's in charge. The sensory overload I get from the constant, unrelenting vibrations from the sandpaper aggressively, yet uniformly tearing the fibers of the wood into submission. Its... absolutely sublime.
I did not notice the pad size before. That's insane. Why not have the 1/4 sheet pad alone? Doesn't that cause waste in paper, cutting your own from sheets? Amazing.
Have been a long time fan of Bosch blue but when my Bosch sander finally gave up the ghost I thought I would take a chance on cheap alternatives from the B&Q in house range. Big mistake! The orbital sander died within a week and I took it back for a refund. I still have the delta version but it vibrates so badly it’s been relegated to a cupboard never to be used again. To replace it I went for a Marks Deros and haven’t regretted it for a moment. It produces fantastic results and on full width surfaces is almost entirely dust free. Give one a go if you get the chance. John Nock
Mirka make fantastic sanders, but unfortunately I couldn't get along with the 'flappy paddle' on/off, which is a shame as it was very well-balanced and a really low profile 👍
Peter Millard Apologies for my iPad autocorrect changing the Mirka name. I usually check but must have forgotten. It went for Miriam this time round! John
Perhaps "inexpensive" or "less expensive" would be a better word than cheap. An example of cheap tools are those that come from the knock-off shops in China. One well-known national chain-store here currently offers a 1/4 sheet palm sander for only $13.99 U.S. It might last for a week or a month or five years, no telling. And it won't perform as well as a known brand such as DeWalt, Bosch, Porter-Cable. Of course if it quits on you, you can take it back and they'll exchange it for a new one. If you calculate your lost time and gasoline money for the trip, you probably afford a Bosch. Ya pays your money, and ya takes your chances. :D
+Richard Freeze Yeah, it's been mentioned (see other comments below) 😂 All I'll say (again) is that the 'Cheap tool' tag isn't dismissive or derogatory in any way, it simply alliterates well and fits easily on the thumbnail. I've made my criteria for the 'cheap tool' pretty clear; it needs to be as close as possible to the Festool in form (size, weight, power, handling) as well as function. It also needs to be at least 1/3 of the price, preferable 1/4 (or less). There are only a few orbital sanders of this particular (80x130mm) pad/abrasive size: Festool's RTS 400 (£245 street, basic), Rupes LE71t (£160 street), Bosch GSS160 (£75 street) and Mirka deos £412 (street) So the only candidate for the 'cheap tool' (cheaper tool, less expensive tool, whatever) using this criteria is the Bosch - and nobody was more surprised than I was to see a Blue Bosch Pro in that role. (curiously, Bosch don't make a green orbital sander in this size...) I also think it's a relevant comparison - why is the Festool so much more expensive than the Bosch Pro, given that the specs are so similar? These videos simply aimed to show that: I think they did it pretty well - what do you think? I'll throw this out there again; if you or anyone else knows of an orbital sander (~2mm stroke, ~1.2Kg, ~200w) that meets these criteria and is cheaper than the Bosch (
id buy the bosch any day of the week, no ones mentioned the bosch warranty on pro tools, when you register you get full 3years, and from my experience its no quibble, i had a delta sander that was nearly 3years old, was instructed to send just sander back for warranty, and to my surprise i was sent a brand new full kit back to me case and all attachments.
Yep, I had referred to the warranty in the script, but ended up editing it out. Festool’s 3-year warranty was special, once, but not any more, and the Bosch sander was the equal of the Festool, right up to the dust collection tests. I’ll be testing that again soon with abranet, to see if that makes a difference, but absolutely, I’d be happy to buy the Bosch - wait, I already did... 😆👍
I have to admit I bought a cheap small sander that looked good. It was not, If you use it in the morning your arm was still vibrating come tea time. Not to mention the noise. Great video.
Happened to buy a makita sander recently.... The machine runs perfectly fine, the dust extraction is horrible though. The machine rips through material but the sandpaper gets clogged in half a minute, even with a festool extractor hooked up to it.
The price different may have something to do with were the tools are made and assembled. Guess that comes down to what you would expect to be paid if you were a tool factory slave.
I’d hope that wherever Bosch tools are made those building them are paid adequately for wherever they live and are treated decently. I only own a very modest collection of power tools, but the truth is that if they all cost what Festool charges I’d be lucky to be able to afford two. Even Bosch blue tools are sometimes too much. And I really don’t want to buy the bottom of the barrel unknown brand tools.
I would love to see a comparison between the RO150 and the the Bosch BOSCH-GET75-6N. Im curious to see if its just that particular bosh sander that has worse dust collection or if festool beats them across the board. I saw another review and performance wise the bosch did just as well as the festool but he wasnt as thorough as your dust collection testing.
I just watched another video on the GET75 and it said the bosch had just as good if not better dust collection as the festool (:o) If you confirm it might knock Festool off their high horse.
I'm not sure I'd consider anything Bosch Pro to be a cheap tool but then again, I understand the point of the video series is vs Festool and as you say, roughly half the price is cheap in comparison. I'd like to know how the really cheap Titan random orbital performs, I've been looking at that in Screwfix for a while and wondering... it's such a low price in comparison to every other brand.
Must have misheard, I can't say my budget ever stretches to festool so don't know prices! I think the Titan would probably be best compared to other equivalent (on paper) spec sanders from more established brands. Of course, wouldn't really fit into the whole Festool vs series but a video comparing a £40 Titan Sander vs a £120 Bosch/DeWalt/Makita might be interesting.
Exactly! There may be tools that perform as well but the ability to be able to call them, send the tool in for free without a receipt and have it back good as new quickly is worth a little extra money
you should try the bosch GSS18v-10 peter, i use it everyday for work on site, its an amazing bit of kit, i get 2.5-3hrs continuous use from a 4amp hr battery pack. and for price its spot on comparing it to the festool equivalent. although the festool site radio is unbeatable, size of unit is great, and power it puts out is unbelievable. great video's keep it up
That's a fantastic price for a bare tool! Shame I don't have any 18v Bosch any more, lol! Looks like a cracking unit though, thanks for pointing it out - maybe there's a cordless sander review in the making... 🤔😆👍
Titan are cheap and cheerful. I have 3 powertools by them from Screwfix, 1 is replacing a Bosch drill in and for the same price I paid for that the Titan is so much better. Their tool cases are also very manly too ;) Especially the Angle Grinder one.
There’s a guy near me who had his van emptied one day and the took the lot including a lot of handtools. makita, dewalt, festool in the main. He went out with his credit card and replaced a lot of gear for £1200 it was all Titan and erbauer to get him through until he got his pay out from the insurance. Interestingly though some things have changed the cordless drills are all Makita again but track Saw and a lot of other gear is still the Titan and erbauer
Never owned a Festool brand tool, but know by research, they're very high in cost. Not sure they're worth all that. I have a Milwaukee 6014 that did cost me almost 200 bucks back 12 years ago. Great sander. It just recently had problems, had to rebuild the pad setup with a new bearing as well. So I checked out new sanders and found a bosch half sheet on ebay new, for 175 bucks,, then saw they cost around 325 new elsewhere. I got lucky. But compared to a Festool, half sheet for 450, or thereabouts,, some difference in price for similar quality. I mean come on. Plastic body, motor etc and pad and a cord. Guess they get whatever we'll pay. The Bosch is a beast. Well built. Super pad and clamping system. Great power and variable speed with really low and high settings. Good ergonomics too. The festool is like my Milwaukee, to the point, no fluff, made for work and tuff.
I like how good you mister explain the differences between this tools and how polite you answer the whole rude comments...sometimes the community how no Clou how to chose their word wise :) in any case I wish you mister a merry Christmas 🎁 and a happy new year 🎊 I leave my subscribe here :)
Well done. The video was very informative. Not sure why so many people are so twisty. Comparing Bosch prices to the likes of Makita and DeWalt they are often the cheapest from the 'professional' brands.
I’d recommend using abranet tbh - much better dust collection simply by switching abrasive. I buy mine locally, but pretty sure you can buy through eBay or amazon 👍
The reason that the manufacturer tries to save pennies is this. Imagine the bosh blue costs 20 euro's to produce. They sell it for €25. €5 profit for the manufacturing plant. It then gets bought by the wholesaler. Customs and shipping have to be payed and also there has to be some margin for the wholesaler/importer. The wholesaler also has to account for refunds or replacements. The price gets doubled to €50. Then it gets sold to the shop. Shopmargins vary wildly, but x2 is not uncommon. You now have a sander of 100 euro's. But wait. +-20% taxes means you pay €120 for your little sander that cost €20 to produce. Every cent/penny they save makes a real difference on the consumer price!
+Zas Huysmans OTOH the margins on abrasives (compared to the tool) are huge. Manufacturers want us to buy their abrasives (obviously) so why not supply a selection with the tool? First taste's free, and all that??
Bingo! It's only 'cheap' (i.e. 1/4 - 1/3 of the price) in comparison to the Festool (and Mirka - see below). I was amazed that I could get a Bosch pro sander for that kind of price. All my general 10.8v stuff is Bosch, I've had many Bosch blue tools and been very happy with them. Call them 'less expensive' if you like - but it won't fit in the thumbnail. All I'll say (again) is that I've made my criteria for the 'cheap tool' pretty clear; it needs to be as close as possible to the Festool in form (size, weight, power, handling) as well as function. It also needs to be at least 1/3 of the price, preferable 1/4 (or less). There are only a few orbital sanders of this particular (80x130mm) pad/abrasive size: Mirka Deos £412 (street) Festool RTS 400 (£245 street, basic) Rupes LE71t (£160 street) Bosch GSS160 (£75 street) So the only candidate for the 'cheap tool' (cheaper tool, less expensive tool, whatever) using this criteria is the Bosch - and nobody was more surprised than I was to see a Blue Bosch Pro in that role. (curiously, Bosch don't make a green orbital sander in this size...) I also think it's a relevant comparison - why is the Festool so much more expensive than the Bosch Pro, given that the specs are so similar? These videos simply aimed to show that: I think they did it pretty well - what do you think? I'll throw this out there again; if you or anyone else knows of an orbital sander that meets these criteria (~2mm stroke, ~1.2Kg, ~200w) and is cheaper than the Bosch (
I don’t think you’re quite getting the point here. I've made my criteria for the 'cheap tool' pretty clear; it needs to be as close as possible to the Festool in form (size, weight, power, handling) as well as function. It also needs to be at least 1/3 of the price, preferably 1/4 (or less). There are only a few orbital sanders of this particular (80x130mm) pad/abrasive size: Mirka deos £412 (street) Festool RTS 400 (£245 street, basic) Rupes LE71t (£160 street) Bosch GSS160 (£75 street) So the only candidate for the 'cheap tool' (cheaper tool, less expensive tool, whatever) using this criteria is the Bosch - and nobody was more surprised than I was to see a blue Bosch Pro in that role. All my general 10.8v stuff is Bosch, I've had many Bosch blue tools and been very happy with them. Call them 'less expensive' if you like - but it won't fit in the thumbnail. 😂 Curiously, Bosch don't make a green orbital sander in this size... I also think it's a relevant comparison - why is the Festool so much more expensive than the Bosch Pro, given that the specs are so similar? These videos simply aimed to show that: I think they did it pretty well - what do you think? I'll throw this out there again; if you or anyone else knows of an orbital sander (~2mm stroke, ~1.2Kg, ~200w) that meets these criteria and is cheaper than the Bosch (
The Ryobi ESS280RV 1/3 Sheet Sander with Variable Speed, 280 W is available on amazon.co.uk for und 50 bucks (20 was estimated). 2mm stroke, slightly bigger disc-size, 280W, slightly heavier (1.7kg). I am neither a ryobi fan nor a bosch or festool. But bosch blue for me is "premium" and festool, hilti or mafell are one step above but none of these three brands is superioror in every class. festool (as well as Mafell) is really an institution when it comes to circular saws, but for a small sander I would go to Bosch green, Black&Decker or a step lower (Worx, Ryobi, Einhell).
+Londar Kalan Bosch is good value and good quality but is not better than the festool. You could use the festool constantly and not feel like your arm is about to fall of. That is not the same with the Bosch though as good value as it is. It does not have the same comfortable grip or variable speed that you need when using it with dust extraction but you probably did not know that.
Festool AMAZING totally worth getting everything festool even got the festool cooler when you walk in with your boxes stacked on your cart its worth it .. it makes you appear more professional and when using sander with festool dust extractor no dust at all better than them home depot loud sanders and vacs that wake up the neighborhood
I have had the Bosch sander and I must say it has very poor quality. I couldn´t even finish one small room with draywall sanding with it. Bosch has repaired it twice times but the sander was dead. I´m finished with Bosch blue.
Bosch blue line is not cheap, Festool is too expensive. I have a cheap sander, which in the expensive Norway, I paid equivalent of USD 15.00 I wish to know if there is a difference in the quality of work between cheap and higher priced sanders.
"Cheapskate, penny-pinching" ... boy, you got that right! Greedy, inconsiderate S.O.B.s. My reaction is to avoid those companies especially since I live in a little prairie town in Wyoming where the only router bits are 1/4" and the nearest Festool dealer is 100 miles each way. I hate to admit, though, that I'm eyeing the Domino 700, the deluxe kit with the parts otherwise left out.
Yes, they are orbital sanders and they do have a circular motion. www.festool.co.uk/products/sanding-and-brushing/direct-drive-orbital-sanders-for-fine-sanding/201225---rts-400-req-gb-240v 👍
I’ve never understood why Bosch tools have been so expensive for their quality. Every Bosch power tool I’ve used except hammer drills appear to have much weaker motors opposed to cheaper priced dewalt tools
What do you mean by weak? I just recently watched reviews of circular saws. Bosch sliced through hard wood easily, as did the equivalent Dewalt. Main difference was that the Dewalt looked and felt a bit less robust when I handled them. Each model had their pros and cons. Dewalt’s not cheaper where I am either.
Again? Really? OK. It's only 'cheap' (i.e. 1/4 - 1/3 of the price) in comparison to the Festool. I was amazed that I could get a Bosch pro sander for that kind of price. I've made my criteria for the 'cheap tool' pretty clear; it needs to be as close as possible to the Festool in form (size, weight, power, handling) as well as function. It also needs to be at least 1/3 of the price, preferable 1/4 (or less). There are only a few orbital sanders of this particular (80x130mm) pad/abrasive size: Mirka deos £412 (street) Festool RTS 400 (£245 street, basic) Rupes LE71t (£160 street) Bosch GSS160 (£75 street) So the only candidate for the 'cheap tool' (cheaper tool, less expensive tool, whatever) using this criteria is the Bosch - and nobody was more surprised than I was to see a blue Bosch Pro in that role. All my general 10.8v stuff is Bosch, I've had many Bosch blue tools and been very happy with them. Call them 'less expensive' if you like - but it won't fit in the thumbnail. 😂 Curiously, Bosch don't make a green orbital sander in this size... I also think it's a relevant comparison - why is the Festool so much more expensive than the Bosch Pro, given that the specs are so similar? These videos simply aimed to show that: I think they did it pretty well - what do you think? I'll throw this out there again; if you or anyone else knows of an orbital sander (~2mm stroke, ~1.2Kg, ~200w) that meets these criteria and is cheaper than the Bosch (
Thanks for watching and taking the time to comment. It's only 'cheap' (i.e. 1/4 - 1/3 of the price) in comparison to the Festool (and Mirka - see below). I was amazed that I could get a Bosch pro sander for that kind of price. All my general 10.8v stuff is Bosch, I've had many Bosch blue tools and been very happy with them. Call them 'less expensive' if you like - but it won't fit in the thumbnail. All I'll say (again) is that I've made my criteria for the 'cheap tool' pretty clear; it needs to be as close as possible to the Festool in form (size, weight, power, handling) as well as function. It also needs to be at least 1/3 of the price, preferable 1/4 (or less). There are only a few orbital sanders of this particular (80x130mm) pad/abrasive size: Mirka Deos £412 (street) Festool RTS 400 (£245 street, basic) Rupes LE71t (£160 street) Bosch GSS160 (£75 street) So the only candidate for the 'cheap tool' (cheaper tool, less expensive tool, whatever) using this criteria is the Bosch - and nobody was more surprised than I was to see a Blue Bosch Pro in that role. (curiously, Bosch don't make a green orbital sander in this size...) I also think it's a relevant comparison - why is the Festool so much more expensive than the Bosch Pro, given that the specs are so similar? These videos simply aimed to show that: I think they did it pretty well - what do you think? I'll throw this out there again; if you or anyone else knows of an orbital sander that meets these criteria (~2mm stroke, ~1.2Kg, ~200w) and is cheaper than the Bosch (
I disagree, Blue Bosch is usually the cheapest of all pro brands for most tools - for example drills. They are excellent value for money, I only buy Bosch and Festool.
Festool..... paying 20x more than the average tool --- go to a pawn shop and get 5 sanders for 50 bucks -- my dewalt has a plastic punch - who buys punched sand paper? lol i would never pay 10x more for special sized pre punched sand paper
Thanks. I've made my criteria for the 'cheap tool' pretty clear; it needs to be as close as possible to the Festool in form (size, weight, power, handling) as well as function. It also needs to be at least 1/3 of the price, preferable 1/4 (or less). There are only a few orbital sanders of this particular (80x130mm) pad/abrasive size: Mirka deos £412 (street) Festool RTS 400 (£245 street, basic) Rupes LE71t (£160 street) Bosch GSS160 (£75 street) So the only candidate for the 'cheap tool' (cheaper tool, less expensive tool, whatever) using this criteria is the Bosch - and nobody was more surprised than I was to see a blue Bosch Pro in that role. All my general 10.8v stuff is Bosch, I've had many Bosch blue tools and been very happy with them. Call them 'less expensive' if you like - but it won't fit in the thumbnail. 😂 Curiously, Bosch don't make a green orbital sander in this size... But if you know of a Skil or B&D or anything else that fits, then let me know and I’ll throw it into the mix 👍
Saw a video of the the internal design of a Black & Decker tool. A lot of thought went into making the tool as tough and durable as possible while keeping the cost down. They offer a 2 year warranty as well.
I haven't really checked, but I wouldn't be surprised to see a $500 Festool hole puncher to punch your own dust collection holes. :D That being said, I wouldn't mind trying one of these tools some day to see what the fuss is all about. Thanks for the video.
Well, one can never really know how something works through a video alone. There's a local expo coming up next Friday, they're going to have a Festool display as well as some discounts. Thanks for the reply though.
Tim Hall Sure, I'd encourage everyone considering a purchase to try and get hands-on with them, if possible; expo's and shows are great for that. Festool have a 14-day (30 day in the US) no quibble return policy, which can really help with those important (expensive!) purchases. Let us know how you get on 👍
+photonashville Thanks for watching and take the time to comment. The format for this series is a roughly 10 minute introduction video explaining why these two particular items, how they relate, and how they differ to other, similar products. I cover 'what's in the box', pricing, how they handle and how they feel. Then roughly 20 minutes of tests, split over 2 videos. And maybe a short follow-on, to cover any additional points raised. If that's too much, then I'm afraid you're in the minority - others have asked for more parts to the series, some for a single 45-minute video. My analytics show that around 10 minutes is the sweet spot for most people, but you know, these vids take as long as they take, to cover the points I think are important and relevant to the comparison. Cheers, Peter
14K views for video 1, 6.5K views for video 2, and 5K views for video 3. I think those analytics say that almost 30 mins talking about two sanders is too much. I have watched your work before, but find I have to scrub through yours more than many other videos because there just isn't enough going on (unless your viewers have zero woodworking/tool experience). Perhaps I am not your audience, which is certainly fine.
+photonashville Fair point re the viewing figures - first vid in any series of mine always have way higher views than the subsequent ones. And yes, I am aiming my videos at relative novices - folks with limited knowledge and experience, hence the talk. 👍
Here in commie-california no one sells the paper for bosch but all the pant stores and high end lumber yards only have festool. bosch has been such a pain In my ass out west ever since the economic collapse in 2007 bosch be slipping and letting every other tool manufacturer kick them to the curb here in the USA
I say they are garbage because they have no true purpose in the production cycle that I can see. They dont remove enough material to be labour saving like a random orbital, nor do they produce a consistent and accurate finish you might get in later stages of sanding which can only be done by hand. I have used various types in the workshop over the years and quickly put them down as they dont sand any faster than a sanding block and yet you still need to hand sand afterwards anyway before finishing to remove the marks they leave. I really dont see the point of a sander that isnt quicker than sanding by hand and still requires final sanding by hand - the only potential advantage over an orbital is that the pad is square, but then again the pressure is rarely even across the pad that they sand right into the corners while producing a flat surface. Each to his own but to me its a tool with no clear benefit and in a workshop rammed to the rafters with tools I cant make room for one when other tools have it covered much more efficiently.
Bosch is one of the better sheet and orbital sanders. Festool is way overpriced crap. Nothing special about any of their tools. Maybe good dust collectors 🤣 but collecting dust isn't quite enough homey
Wow, even trolls on sander video's. I'd have said completely unbiased, and if you read the title it says 1 of 3. Watch the rest for a comprehensive test. I've made a purchase based on these videos.
There are only a few orbital sanders of this particular (80x130mm) pad/abrasive size: Mirka deos £412 (street) Festool RTS 400 (£245 street, basic) Rupes LE71t (£160 street) Bosch GSS160 (£75 street) So the Festool isn't the most expensive, and the only candidate for the 'cheap tool' (cheaper tool, less expensive tool, whatever) using my criteria (close as possible to the Festool in form - size, weight, power, handling - as well as function, and at least 1/3 of the price, preferable 1/4 or less) is the Bosch. I also think it's a relevant comparison - why is the Festool so much more expensive than the Bosch Pro, given that the specs are so similar? These videos simply aimed to show that: I think they did it pretty well - what do you think? I'll throw this out there again; if you or anyone else knows of an orbital sander (~2mm stroke, ~1.2Kg, ~200w) that meets these criteria and is cheaper than the Bosch (
You might want to watch all 3 parts - there are real differences in the dust collection. But use whatever suits you - that’s what these videos are about, to explore the differences and see if they’re relevant to you. 👍
+Tz Tz It's a cheap tool *compared to what Festool charge for a very similarly specced sander*. In this series the 'Cheap tool' is anything that costs 1/3 to 1/4 (or less) of the Festool. I was surprised a Blue Bosch Pro sander fitted into this category, but it did so its worth comparing. I would happily compare a cheaper sander to the Festool provided it was similarly specced; to the best of my knowledge Festool and Bosch are the only companies making these oddball 80 x130mm sanders. If you know of another, do share and I'll happily add it to the mix 👍
+dimmaz88 Thanks! You know this popped up in my twitter feed a week or so back from a painter/decorater I know, and I'd completely forgotten about it! It's a bit lighter than the RTS, too, but only single speed, I think. Street price of £160 keeps it out of the 'cheap tool' series, but a lot less than the Festoo. Good catch, thanksl 👍
festool are overpriced no way is 3 times better then the Bosch cost 3 time more ,a bet the commercial are more expensive and somehow they must pay for the marketing videos like this
+Point made This isn’t a ‘marketing’ video - I pay for my tools myself, just like any punter would - and this isn’t to diss Bosch - I have plenty of blue Bosch tools myself. Is the Festool worth 3 time’s the price?? Why not check out the sanding & dust collection comparison and decide for yourself? 👍
Surprised to see the bosch pro being listed as the 'cheap tool'. Bosch blue get some stick around, but l-boxx is a nice system and the blue tools dish out very good quality for a keen price. Arguably Festool are over priced against the competition? I can't speak for quality as I've never owned a Festool, but they do dominate the track saw market. My blue tools never fail to surprise for size and power. We have a good selection of 12v and 18v and corded 230v and are very happy with price and performance
+Alex Bennett I think I might be cutting & pasting this reply a bit 😂 It's only 'cheap' (i.e. 1/4 - 1/3 of the price) in comparison to the Festool. I was amazed that I could get a Bosch pro sander for that kind of price. All my general 10.8v stuff is Bosch, I've had many Bosch blue tools and been very happy with them. Call them 'less expensive' if you like - but it won't fit in the thumbnail. 😂
Good to see all the bosch pro getting praise. What would be an interesting comparison would be a Black and Decker mouse. Absolutely amazing for £20 with loads of accessories
+nasser d Well, that's what this series aims to find out. Keep watching... 👍
+Alex Bennett Cheap tool vs really cheap tool - could be a whole new series 👍😂
I've got a Bosch circular saw that's 35 years old, still on the same motor. It just won't die. Granted it was replaced some years ago and hasn't seen much action for several years but it still works. Really don't know what to do with it! Can't beat Bosch, all good kit.
I have the little Bosch and found it to be great sander . 25 years of Restoring i have been restoring things for now and Im very happy with the little bosch , I have been using it about 1 year now
Yep, great little sander for the money. 👍
All my tools are Bosch, and not one of them has ever let me down, the 36v sds is a brilliant bit of kit and it's well used. The warrenty is very good too.
Bosch has gone way downhill. It's no longer German anything. It just your average run of the mill mediocrity wrapped up im a pretty box with a familiar name.
@@link6397 in your opinion, all my tools have been bosch for the past 8 years and all are used daily, and not one has ever let me down. And their warrenty is excellent, with a great customer service.
@@link6397 That is simply not true. Their products remain competitive in the market.
Where products are made is not relevant.
I agree with you on the lack of sandpaper. It's like a biscuit machine that comes without biscuits.
+LostWhits 👍
I've recently got the RO150, and I've got to say, it tops all other sanders I've used. One of the biggest benefits is the dust extraction, it makes the sanding disks last so much longer. That smaller sander looks like it would come in handy for smaller patches, and corners - the round disks can't get into corners.
+Joseph Rowley Yep. Dust extraction tests to follow...
I just now bought the Festool for the useless reason that, in South Africa, Bosch only offers the “hobby” sander and not the nice Professional one. Very happy with everything else from Festool so it was a no brainer for me.
Thanks for the video Peter! God bless and take care!
Owned and used a Festool RTS 400 for a couple of years, only for diy projects.
Repaired 3 times within warranty, and 3 times out of warranty. My best guess is that it broke down every 15 hours of use or so.
After breaking down the 7th time I tossed it. I cannot say I am impressed by the quality nor the service.
I think I have four of these, if you include the RS and DS versions, the oldest is ~2003, and they’ve all been used relentlessly. They’ve never missed a beat, and all are in their original brushes. Just for balance. 👍
I'm curious what were the multiple warranty issues that you experienced? I had a rts 400 eq from 2012 go out recently. After disassembly and putting a meter to the armature and the field windings I determined the armature went bad. I opted to replace the sander and ordered a new rts because replacing parts on a pretty old tool can become habit forming. My old rts was used for professional duty and seen a lot of action and held up well imo.
When replacing it I did have a short list of alternative options like the Mirka, or the Surfprep. But out of the considerations the RTS came in the most budget friendly and I already have consumables for it.
I can say a few years ago I sent a ETS 150 in for repair. The sander had what felt like a wobble or shimmy in the head and having a couple other ETS 150's I knew it wasn't right. So I sent it in and they didn't call me prior like they should have. Instead I just received my sander back with a note in it saying I needed to replace the pad. I was a bit miffed as there are no local stores here so it's something I order online, and had they called me I would have asked them to do it and I'd pay for the pad. Also to be clear it wasn't the pad as a new pad didn't change anything, and if they would of put a new pad on they would of determined there was no change with the tool. I believe it's some kind of counter balance thing but I never sent it back in and that sander doesn't really get used except for some rough work.
If that would had been my first sander, or my first interaction with the company I'd of probably never bought another thing from them as I feel they dropped the ball on their customer service that time, but overall I feel like it was a fluke.
I've watched this video several times, thank you! Still on the fence between the DTS400 or the Bosch GSS 160-1 A MULTI. I had a cheap Bosch sander and hated it, got my first Festool sander (ETS125REQ) and it is a dream to use. Now have the Rotex 150 and Rotex 90. All my Festool sanders are spot on. Still not sure about the Bosch.
Buy the Festool. Seriously. 👍
I got one of those Festool sanders, bought it from a 2nd hand shop (25€), I don't know if mine is broken in some way or if I use it incorrectly but when I use it I almost always get swirl marks. I use festool paper with it and got a new pad. I get a better finish result from my blue bosch random orbital sander.
+1873Winchester Sounds like it's damaged in some way. Seem to remember reading about one that had been dropped and the counter-balance weights shifting, might be worth having it checked out. Uncomfortable thought: there may be a reason it was in a second hand store for €25... Just sayin' 👍
I'll check it out, if it's repairable then great, if not at least it was only 25.
+1873Winchester 👍
+1873Winchester 👍
Having both the 90 and 150 in the RO line, before the holidays, they came out with a super deal on the PRO 5. $99 (US) for an actual tool from Festool is far too good to pass up. It is similar to the ETS, but it has the 125mm round pad. Unlike the Rotex line, the PRO 5 is light as a feather.
I love how long the paper lasts on the Festool sanders.
+Ira Kopilow Thanks. The Pro 5 is a US-only line I believe, but great value and very similar to the ETS 125. I carry two sanders with me in my 'go everywhere' stack, an ETS 125 and the RTS 400 from this video; I can cover a lot of ground with those two 👍
Peter Millard If only they released those internationally.
I have long had reservations about those enclosed rocker type switches. You have to ensure you have switched them of properly. It's easy to leave them on the rock, as it were. Despite being aware of this, it was only a couple of weeks ago, when at my lunch, my wife informed me there was "something buzzing around on the workshop floor!". What could the implications of that have been if I had shut up for the night?
Try out 3M pneumatic random orbital sanders You'll love them. I use them at work and they can't be beat. They are like butter and leave a silky smooth finish with no swirl marks. Avalable in 5/16", 3/16", and 3/32 orbit size. Jitterbug and round styles available. Nobody in production work uses festool for sanding applications. But if you are restricted by electric tool's only, then you might have a case. But personally I would retrofit my shop just so I could use a 3M sander. Once you use one, you will never want to use a substandard electric one ever agian, even if it's a festool. Im getting wet just thinking about those ergonomically seductive lines of the 3M in my hand, with the touch of my fingertip it awakens the most stimulating vibrations I've ever felt come from any tool. As I caress the tool in my palm, the cold steel sends shivers up my arms. Followed by a rush of warm intense pleasure shooting down to my nether regions. I gently apply the slightest pressure to the trigger, and the sander erupts with the power 1000 mustangs yet while simultaneously the incredible control of an Italian cafe' racer. I can't even begin to describe the feeling I get when I give a big, thick, long, hard piece of Dark Walnut the attention it deserves, while still letting it know who's in charge. The sensory overload I get from the constant, unrelenting vibrations from the sandpaper aggressively, yet uniformly tearing the fibers of the wood into submission. Its... absolutely sublime.
Thx for review, will get the bosch, my main is rotex 150 just need something for corners every so often
HITOKIRIpl Bosch is a nice sander - using Abranet (videos 157 & 159) makes a big difference to the dust collection.
I did not notice the pad size before. That's insane. Why not have the 1/4 sheet pad alone? Doesn't that cause waste in paper, cutting your own from sheets? Amazing.
I often find that second hand Festool is so much more expensive than new Bosch or Makita machines I never end up purchasing Festool :)
could the sander be used when using a spray dispenser to wet the surface to be sanded?
Yes, but not with an extractor connected. 👍
Have been a long time fan of Bosch blue but when my Bosch sander finally gave up the ghost I thought I would take a chance on cheap alternatives from the B&Q in house range. Big mistake! The orbital sander died within a week and I took it back for a refund. I still have the delta version but it vibrates so badly it’s been relegated to a cupboard never to be used again.
To replace it I went for a Marks Deros and haven’t regretted it for a moment. It produces fantastic results and on full width surfaces is almost entirely dust free. Give one a go if you get the chance.
John Nock
Mirka make fantastic sanders, but unfortunately I couldn't get along with the 'flappy paddle' on/off, which is a shame as it was very well-balanced and a really low profile 👍
Peter Millard Apologies for my iPad autocorrect changing the Mirka name. I usually check but must have forgotten. It went for Miriam this time round!
John
Have to be honest, I hadn't even noticed, lol! Maybe I'm so used to it I auto-correct the auto-cprrect without thinking!
how is the dust collection on the bosch?
Perhaps "inexpensive" or "less expensive" would be a better word than cheap. An example of cheap tools are those that come from the knock-off shops in China. One well-known national chain-store here currently offers a 1/4 sheet palm sander for only $13.99 U.S. It might last for a week or a month or five years, no telling. And it won't perform as well as a known brand such as DeWalt, Bosch, Porter-Cable. Of course if it quits on you, you can take it back and they'll exchange it for a new one. If you calculate your lost time and gasoline money for the trip, you probably afford a Bosch. Ya pays your money, and ya takes your chances. :D
+Richard Freeze Yeah, it's been mentioned (see other comments below) 😂 All I'll say (again) is that the 'Cheap tool' tag isn't dismissive or derogatory in any way, it simply alliterates well and fits easily on the thumbnail. I've made my criteria for the 'cheap tool' pretty clear; it needs to be as close as possible to the Festool in form (size, weight, power, handling) as well as function. It also needs to be at least 1/3 of the price, preferable 1/4 (or less). There are only a few orbital sanders of this particular (80x130mm) pad/abrasive size: Festool's RTS 400 (£245 street, basic), Rupes LE71t (£160 street), Bosch GSS160 (£75 street) and Mirka deos £412 (street)
So the only candidate for the 'cheap tool' (cheaper tool, less expensive tool, whatever) using this criteria is the Bosch - and nobody was more surprised than I was to see a Blue Bosch Pro in that role. (curiously, Bosch don't make a green orbital sander in this size...)
I also think it's a relevant comparison - why is the Festool so much more expensive than the Bosch Pro, given that the specs are so similar? These videos simply aimed to show that: I think they did it pretty well - what do you think?
I'll throw this out there again; if you or anyone else knows of an orbital sander (~2mm stroke, ~1.2Kg, ~200w) that meets these criteria and is cheaper than the Bosch (
id buy the bosch any day of the week, no ones mentioned the bosch warranty on pro tools, when you register you get full 3years, and from my experience its no quibble, i had a delta sander that was nearly 3years old, was instructed to send just sander back for warranty, and to my surprise i was sent a brand new full kit back to me case and all attachments.
Yep, I had referred to the warranty in the script, but ended up editing it out. Festool’s 3-year warranty was special, once, but not any more, and the Bosch sander was the equal of the Festool, right up to the dust collection tests. I’ll be testing that again soon with abranet, to see if that makes a difference, but absolutely, I’d be happy to buy the Bosch - wait, I already did... 😆👍
I have to admit I bought a cheap small sander that looked good. It was not, If you use it in the morning your arm was still vibrating come tea time. Not to mention the noise. Great video.
There are 3 versions of Festool. The BASIC, the PLUS and the SET ho has also a deltapad.
Happened to buy a makita sander recently.... The machine runs perfectly fine, the dust extraction is horrible though. The machine rips through material but the sandpaper gets clogged in half a minute, even with a festool extractor hooked up to it.
Got your festool sander with granat paper now, lets see how it does!
Going to be buying one of these sanders so it is perfect timing for the video
+dandive Youngs Timing is everything 😂 👍
Sandpaper hasn't changed since it was invented by Wilson Kepple and Betty.
The price different may have something to do with were the tools are made and assembled. Guess that comes down to what you would expect to be paid if you were a tool factory slave.
+Chris Munro 👍
I’d hope that wherever Bosch tools are made those building them are paid adequately for wherever they live and are treated decently. I only own a very modest collection of power tools, but the truth is that if they all cost what Festool charges I’d be lucky to be able to afford two. Even Bosch blue tools are sometimes too much. And I really don’t want to buy the bottom of the barrel unknown brand tools.
Given the comments maybe your video title should have been Overpriced tool vs. Bosch. But you knew what you were doing when you titled it.
+wstar72 👍
+wstar72
High end sander with varible speed is going to cost about £300 to £500.
That is just a reality.
I would love to see a comparison between the RO150 and the the Bosch BOSCH-GET75-6N. Im curious to see if its just that particular bosh sander that has worse dust collection or if festool beats them across the board. I saw another review and performance wise the bosch did just as well as the festool but he wasnt as thorough as your dust collection testing.
I just watched another video on the GET75 and it said the bosch had just as good if not better dust collection as the festool (:o) If you confirm it might knock Festool off their high horse.
This is a cool series. Thanks for taking the time.
Thanks for watching! More to come... 👍
I'm not sure I'd consider anything Bosch Pro to be a cheap tool but then again, I understand the point of the video series is vs Festool and as you say, roughly half the price is cheap in comparison.
I'd like to know how the really cheap Titan random orbital performs, I've been looking at that in Screwfix for a while and wondering... it's such a low price in comparison to every other brand.
+eggypickle the Bosch is way less than half the price of the Festool. But yeah, good shout on the Titan - what would you compare it to?
I have the TITAN TTB289SDR (screwfix) 40 quid, it replaced a black & decker one , and the Titan is great
Must have misheard, I can't say my budget ever stretches to festool so don't know prices!
I think the Titan would probably be best compared to other equivalent (on paper) spec sanders from more established brands. Of course, wouldn't really fit into the whole Festool vs series but a video comparing a £40 Titan Sander vs a £120 Bosch/DeWalt/Makita might be interesting.
I really enjoy and appreciate your reviews. Thank you
Pleasure, thanks for watching 👍
No complaints with the Bosch. Used the festool for a good few years.
Festool aren't that special inside you pay for the service.
Exactly! There may be tools that perform as well but the ability to be able to call them, send the tool in for free without a receipt and have it back good as new quickly is worth a little extra money
For the cost of Festool I could buy several of each tool from another brand. If one broke I could use another while it gets repaired.
you should try the bosch GSS18v-10 peter, i use it everyday for work on site, its an amazing bit of kit, i get 2.5-3hrs continuous use from a 4amp hr battery pack. and for price its spot on comparing it to the festool equivalent. although the festool site radio is unbeatable, size of unit is great, and power it puts out is unbelievable. great video's keep it up
That's a fantastic price for a bare tool! Shame I don't have any 18v Bosch any more, lol! Looks like a cracking unit though, thanks for pointing it out - maybe there's a cordless sander review in the making... 🤔😆👍
I love my RTS 400 :)
I have a TITAN TTB289SDR 125MM RANDOM ORBIT SANDER from screwfix for 40 quid, has variable speed too
+Mart Ashton 👍
Titan are cheap and cheerful. I have 3 powertools by them from Screwfix, 1 is replacing a Bosch drill in and for the same price I paid for that the Titan is so much better. Their tool cases are also very manly too ;) Especially the Angle Grinder one.
There’s a guy near me who had his van emptied one day and the took the lot including a lot of handtools. makita, dewalt, festool in the main. He went out with his credit card and replaced a lot of gear for £1200 it was all Titan and erbauer to get him through until he got his pay out from the insurance. Interestingly though some things have changed the cordless drills are all Makita again but track Saw and a lot of other gear is still the Titan and erbauer
Just in the market for a new one Peter so this video was rather handy, thanks! Bought the middle model of the Bosch range for £69 from Ebay. ;-)
Bargain 😆 The Festool’s really good, but if you’re not bothered about what it does well, then the Bosch is fantastic for the money 👍
Never owned a Festool brand tool, but know by research, they're very high in cost. Not sure they're worth all that. I have a Milwaukee 6014 that did cost me almost 200 bucks back 12 years ago. Great sander. It just recently had problems, had to rebuild the pad setup with a new bearing as well. So I checked out new sanders and found a bosch half sheet on ebay new, for 175 bucks,, then saw they cost around 325 new elsewhere. I got lucky. But compared to a Festool, half sheet for 450, or thereabouts,, some difference in price for similar quality. I mean come on. Plastic body, motor etc and pad and a cord. Guess they get whatever we'll pay.
The Bosch is a beast. Well built. Super pad and clamping system. Great power and variable speed with really low and high settings. Good ergonomics too. The festool is like my Milwaukee, to the point, no fluff, made for work and tuff.
Peter Ford totally worth it got most of the sanders cordless ones are great
I like how good you mister explain the differences between this tools and how polite you answer the whole rude comments...sometimes the community how no Clou how to chose their word wise :) in any case I wish you mister a merry Christmas 🎁 and a happy new year 🎊 I leave my subscribe here :)
Thank you, and very best wishes to you, too! 👍
Well done. The video was very informative. Not sure why so many people are so twisty. Comparing Bosch prices to the likes of Makita and DeWalt they are often the cheapest from the 'professional' brands.
Thanks! 👍
I also found the entry level Makita stuff was not great. Their really expensive models generally are though.
Think I'll stick to the 4x4 wooden block and cut Knuckles
Peter where can you buy the sand paper for the Bosch? Im only finding festool equivalents
I’d recommend using abranet tbh - much better dust collection simply by switching abrasive. I buy mine locally, but pretty sure you can buy through eBay or amazon 👍
Peter Millard thanks do they last long?
Abranet? Yes, very good. 👍
The reason that the manufacturer tries to save pennies is this.
Imagine the bosh blue costs 20 euro's to produce. They sell it for €25. €5 profit for the manufacturing plant. It then gets bought by the wholesaler. Customs and shipping have to be payed and also there has to be some margin for the wholesaler/importer. The wholesaler also has to account for refunds or replacements. The price gets doubled to €50. Then it gets sold to the shop. Shopmargins vary wildly, but x2 is not uncommon. You now have a sander of 100 euro's. But wait. +-20% taxes means you pay €120 for your little sander that cost €20 to produce. Every cent/penny they save makes a real difference on the consumer price!
+Zas Huysmans OTOH the margins on abrasives (compared to the tool) are huge. Manufacturers want us to buy their abrasives (obviously) so why not supply a selection with the tool? First taste's free, and all that??
Bosch cheap?! harbor freight is a cheap tool. But then again every tool is cheaper in price comared to the festool brand
Bingo! It's only 'cheap' (i.e. 1/4 - 1/3 of the price) in comparison to the Festool (and Mirka - see below). I was amazed that I could get a Bosch pro sander for that kind of price. All my general 10.8v stuff is Bosch, I've had many Bosch blue tools and been very happy with them. Call them 'less expensive' if you like - but it won't fit in the thumbnail.
All I'll say (again) is that I've made my criteria for the 'cheap tool' pretty clear; it needs to be as close as possible to the Festool in form (size, weight, power, handling) as well as function. It also needs to be at least 1/3 of the price, preferable 1/4 (or less). There are only a few orbital sanders of this particular (80x130mm) pad/abrasive size:
Mirka Deos £412 (street)
Festool RTS 400 (£245 street, basic)
Rupes LE71t (£160 street)
Bosch GSS160 (£75 street)
So the only candidate for the 'cheap tool' (cheaper tool, less expensive tool, whatever) using this criteria is the Bosch - and nobody was more surprised than I was to see a Blue Bosch Pro in that role. (curiously, Bosch don't make a green orbital sander in this size...)
I also think it's a relevant comparison - why is the Festool so much more expensive than the Bosch Pro, given that the specs are so similar? These videos simply aimed to show that: I think they did it pretty well - what do you think?
I'll throw this out there again; if you or anyone else knows of an orbital sander that meets these criteria (~2mm stroke, ~1.2Kg, ~200w) and is cheaper than the Bosch (
Great video and very well presented.
+Ty Smith Thanks! 👍
Inexpensive rather than cheap? Great video Peter! Cheers.
+Gordon Warlow 👍 'Inexpensive' doesn't fit on the thumbnail though ... 😂
The difference is pretty simple. Festool wants to make serious money with a average product.
Love my little DeWalt orbital!! Just as good
This is More or less expensive vs overprized Tool. I understand people buying a kapex. But with mini- Sanders! You can also buy RYOBI for 20 bucks
I don’t think you’re quite getting the point here. I've made my criteria for the 'cheap tool' pretty clear; it needs to be as close as possible to the Festool in form (size, weight, power, handling) as well as function. It also needs to be at least 1/3 of the price, preferably 1/4 (or less).
There are only a few orbital sanders of this particular (80x130mm) pad/abrasive size:
Mirka deos £412 (street)
Festool RTS 400 (£245 street, basic)
Rupes LE71t (£160 street)
Bosch GSS160 (£75 street)
So the only candidate for the 'cheap tool' (cheaper tool, less expensive tool, whatever) using this criteria is the Bosch - and nobody was more surprised than I was to see a blue Bosch Pro in that role. All my general 10.8v stuff is Bosch, I've had many Bosch blue tools and been very happy with them. Call them 'less expensive' if you like - but it won't fit in the thumbnail. 😂 Curiously, Bosch don't make a green orbital sander in this size...
I also think it's a relevant comparison - why is the Festool so much more expensive than the Bosch Pro, given that the specs are so similar? These videos simply aimed to show that: I think they did it pretty well - what do you think?
I'll throw this out there again; if you or anyone else knows of an orbital sander (~2mm stroke, ~1.2Kg, ~200w) that meets these criteria and is cheaper than the Bosch (
The Ryobi ESS280RV 1/3 Sheet Sander with Variable Speed, 280 W is available on amazon.co.uk for und 50 bucks (20 was estimated). 2mm stroke, slightly bigger disc-size, 280W, slightly heavier (1.7kg). I am neither a ryobi fan nor a bosch or festool. But bosch blue for me is "premium" and festool, hilti or mafell are one step above but none of these three brands is superioror in every class. festool (as well as Mafell) is really an institution when it comes to circular saws, but for a small sander I would go to Bosch green, Black&Decker or a step lower (Worx, Ryobi, Einhell).
As I said earlier, I don’t think you’re quite getting the point here. But thanks for watching, and taking the time to comment. 👍
Fest tool - expensive not worth it
Bosch - good price good quality
+Londar Kalan
Bosch is good value and good quality but is not better than the festool.
You could use the festool constantly and not feel like your arm is about to fall of. That is not the same with the Bosch though as good value as it is.
It does not have the same comfortable grip or variable speed that you need when using it with dust extraction but you probably did not know that.
Festool AMAZING totally worth getting everything festool even got the festool cooler when you walk in with your boxes stacked on your cart its worth it .. it makes you appear more professional and when using sander with festool dust extractor no dust at all better than them home depot loud sanders and vacs that wake up the neighborhood
Can't wait to see the followup.
+Muru Roa Noon tomorrow 👍
I have had the Bosch sander and I must say it has very poor quality. I couldn´t even finish one small room with draywall sanding with it. Bosch has repaired it twice times but the sander was dead. I´m finished with Bosch blue.
Festool is Rols&Royce among cars and the other hand tools are just tools comparing to festool.
lol bluebosh is now 'cheap' with all the money spent on festool, and festool looked cheap when I bought mafell saw hahah
Bosch blue line is not cheap, Festool is too expensive. I have a cheap sander, which in the expensive Norway, I paid equivalent of USD 15.00
I wish to know if there is a difference in the quality of work between cheap and higher priced sanders.
The Bosch is prt of the pro lane the green Bosch is the diy lane the blood lane is the pro lane
👍
"Cheapskate, penny-pinching" ... boy, you got that right! Greedy, inconsiderate S.O.B.s. My reaction is to avoid those companies especially since I live in a little prairie town in Wyoming where the only router bits are 1/4" and the nearest Festool dealer is 100 miles each way. I hate to admit, though, that I'm eyeing the Domino 700, the deluxe kit with the parts otherwise left out.
I had change out of twenty quid with my orbital sander, not that was a cheap tool
+Yes CJ 👍
those arent orbital sanders they are vibration sanders no orbital circular motion...
Yes, they are orbital sanders and they do have a circular motion. www.festool.co.uk/products/sanding-and-brushing/direct-drive-orbital-sanders-for-fine-sanding/201225---rts-400-req-gb-240v 👍
Yep, Peter's right. It's only a 3/16 orbit, so does seem to just vibrate. But it does orbit.
I’ve never understood why Bosch tools have been so expensive for their quality. Every Bosch power tool I’ve used except hammer drills appear to have much weaker motors opposed to cheaper priced dewalt tools
What do you mean by weak? I just recently watched reviews of circular saws. Bosch sliced through hard wood easily, as did the equivalent Dewalt. Main difference was that the Dewalt looked and felt a bit less robust when I handled them. Each model had their pros and cons. Dewalt’s not cheaper where I am either.
I always mumble the same thing, those cheapskates could have included few lousy sheets of sand papers at least !! Lol
+geoffnepo 👍
Blue Bosch cheap? This guy wants diamonds on his tools?
Again? Really? OK. It's only 'cheap' (i.e. 1/4 - 1/3 of the price) in comparison to the Festool. I was amazed that I could get a Bosch pro sander for that kind of price.
I've made my criteria for the 'cheap tool' pretty clear; it needs to be as close as possible to the Festool in form (size, weight, power, handling) as well as function. It also needs to be at least 1/3 of the price, preferable 1/4 (or less). There are only a few orbital sanders of this particular (80x130mm) pad/abrasive size:
Mirka deos £412 (street)
Festool RTS 400 (£245 street, basic)
Rupes LE71t (£160 street)
Bosch GSS160 (£75 street)
So the only candidate for the 'cheap tool' (cheaper tool, less expensive tool, whatever) using this criteria is the Bosch - and nobody was more surprised than I was to see a blue Bosch Pro in that role. All my general 10.8v stuff is Bosch, I've had many Bosch blue tools and been very happy with them. Call them 'less expensive' if you like - but it won't fit in the thumbnail. 😂 Curiously, Bosch don't make a green orbital sander in this size...
I also think it's a relevant comparison - why is the Festool so much more expensive than the Bosch Pro, given that the specs are so similar? These videos simply aimed to show that: I think they did it pretty well - what do you think?
I'll throw this out there again; if you or anyone else knows of an orbital sander (~2mm stroke, ~1.2Kg, ~200w) that meets these criteria and is cheaper than the Bosch (
blue bosch isnt cheap festool snob this guy is
Thanks for watching and taking the time to comment. It's only 'cheap' (i.e. 1/4 - 1/3 of the price) in comparison to the Festool (and Mirka - see below). I was amazed that I could get a Bosch pro sander for that kind of price. All my general 10.8v stuff is Bosch, I've had many Bosch blue tools and been very happy with them. Call them 'less expensive' if you like - but it won't fit in the thumbnail.
All I'll say (again) is that I've made my criteria for the 'cheap tool' pretty clear; it needs to be as close as possible to the Festool in form (size, weight, power, handling) as well as function. It also needs to be at least 1/3 of the price, preferable 1/4 (or less). There are only a few orbital sanders of this particular (80x130mm) pad/abrasive size:
Mirka Deos £412 (street)
Festool RTS 400 (£245 street, basic)
Rupes LE71t (£160 street)
Bosch GSS160 (£75 street)
So the only candidate for the 'cheap tool' (cheaper tool, less expensive tool, whatever) using this criteria is the Bosch - and nobody was more surprised than I was to see a Blue Bosch Pro in that role. (curiously, Bosch don't make a green orbital sander in this size...)
I also think it's a relevant comparison - why is the Festool so much more expensive than the Bosch Pro, given that the specs are so similar? These videos simply aimed to show that: I think they did it pretty well - what do you think?
I'll throw this out there again; if you or anyone else knows of an orbital sander that meets these criteria (~2mm stroke, ~1.2Kg, ~200w) and is cheaper than the Bosch (
well bosch blue ist not cheap - festool ist just expensive and overpriced :)
I disagree, Blue Bosch is usually the cheapest of all pro brands for most tools - for example drills. They are excellent value for money, I only buy Bosch and Festool.
Festool..... paying 20x more than the average tool --- go to a pawn shop and get 5 sanders for 50 bucks -- my dewalt has a plastic punch - who buys punched sand paper? lol i would never pay 10x more for special sized pre punched sand paper
+Nicholas Brown 5 sanders for 50 bucks. They'll be every bit the $10 sander, lol! 😂
My Bosch had a punch plate too but do you think I can find the bloody thing.
Lol , even blue Bosch is cheap compared to Festool , good vid. though :)
Should have used a cheaper tool than Bosch... Bosch is a good product compared to Skil or Black and Decker
Thanks. I've made my criteria for the 'cheap tool' pretty clear; it needs to be as close as possible to the Festool in form (size, weight, power, handling) as well as function. It also needs to be at least 1/3 of the price, preferable 1/4 (or less). There are only a few orbital sanders of this particular (80x130mm) pad/abrasive size:
Mirka deos £412 (street)
Festool RTS 400 (£245 street, basic)
Rupes LE71t (£160 street)
Bosch GSS160 (£75 street)
So the only candidate for the 'cheap tool' (cheaper tool, less expensive tool, whatever) using this criteria is the Bosch - and nobody was more surprised than I was to see a blue Bosch Pro in that role. All my general 10.8v stuff is Bosch, I've had many Bosch blue tools and been very happy with them. Call them 'less expensive' if you like - but it won't fit in the thumbnail. 😂 Curiously, Bosch don't make a green orbital sander in this size...
But if you know of a Skil or B&D or anything else that fits, then let me know and I’ll throw it into the mix 👍
Saw a video of the the internal design of a Black & Decker tool. A lot of thought went into making the tool as tough and durable as possible while keeping the cost down. They offer a 2 year warranty as well.
Tag Heuer vs Rolex mate...
I haven't really checked, but I wouldn't be surprised to see a $500 Festool hole puncher to punch your own dust collection holes. :D That being said, I wouldn't mind trying one of these tools some day to see what the fuss is all about. Thanks for the video.
+Tim Hall Damn, that's my "Festool: What's All Fuss?" video out of the bag 😂👍
..and of course the hole puncher would come with its own dust collection and matching systainer!
Well, one can never really know how something works through a video alone. There's a local expo coming up next Friday, they're going to have a Festool display as well as some discounts. Thanks for the reply though.
Tim Hall Sure, I'd encourage everyone considering a purchase to try and get hands-on with them, if possible; expo's and shows are great for that. Festool have a 14-day (30 day in the US) no quibble return policy, which can really help with those important (expensive!) purchases. Let us know how you get on 👍
Shorter videos please. 3 video series at a half hour is too much.
+photonashville Thanks for watching and take the time to comment. The format for this series is a roughly 10 minute introduction video explaining why these two particular items, how they relate, and how they differ to other, similar products. I cover 'what's in the box', pricing, how they handle and how they feel. Then roughly 20 minutes of tests, split over 2 videos. And maybe a short follow-on, to cover any additional points raised.
If that's too much, then I'm afraid you're in the minority - others have asked for more parts to the series, some for a single 45-minute video. My analytics show that around 10 minutes is the sweet spot for most people, but you know, these vids take as long as they take, to cover the points I think are important and relevant to the comparison. Cheers, Peter
14K views for video 1, 6.5K views for video 2, and 5K views for video 3. I think those analytics say that almost 30 mins talking about two sanders is too much. I have watched your work before, but find I have to scrub through yours more than many other videos because there just isn't enough going on (unless your viewers have zero woodworking/tool experience). Perhaps I am not your audience, which is certainly fine.
+photonashville Fair point re the viewing figures - first vid in any series of mine always have way higher views than the subsequent ones. And yes, I am aiming my videos at relative novices - folks with limited knowledge and experience, hence the talk. 👍
Here in commie-california no one sells the paper for bosch but all the pant stores and high end lumber yards only have festool. bosch has been such a pain In my ass out west ever since the economic collapse in 2007 bosch be slipping and letting every other tool manufacturer kick them to the curb here in the USA
the only way that is worth 500€ is if they pay european workers above the averge...
It's an older vid, but even today, post-brexit etc.. here in 'treasure island' as the manufacturers call it, we pay £259 inc VAT, or about €300. 🤷♂️
All sheet sanders are garbage IMHO - give me an random orbital anyday, if I need a sheet sand I'd rather do it by hand
Sweeping statements aside - unless you’ve tried them *all* of course - I find they have a place in my woodworking. But whatever works for you, works 👍
I say they are garbage because they have no true purpose in the production cycle that I can see. They dont remove enough material to be labour saving like a random orbital, nor do they produce a consistent and accurate finish you might get in later stages of sanding which can only be done by hand. I have used various types in the workshop over the years and quickly put them down as they dont sand any faster than a sanding block and yet you still need to hand sand afterwards anyway before finishing to remove the marks they leave. I really dont see the point of a sander that isnt quicker than sanding by hand and still requires final sanding by hand - the only potential advantage over an orbital is that the pad is square, but then again the pressure is rarely even across the pad that they sand right into the corners while producing a flat surface. Each to his own but to me its a tool with no clear benefit and in a workshop rammed to the rafters with tools I cant make room for one when other tools have it covered much more efficiently.
Bosch is one of the better sheet and orbital sanders. Festool is way overpriced crap. Nothing special about any of their tools. Maybe good dust collectors 🤣 but collecting dust isn't quite enough homey
That was a long video just to say your biased opinion
Wow, even trolls on sander video's. I'd have said completely unbiased, and if you read the title it says 1 of 3. Watch the rest for a comprehensive test. I've made a purchase based on these videos.
+Affendog What bias? Seriously, where?
+Graham Orm 👍
This bosch version is ....simply garbage. Lot of noise , no speed control, bad quality pads . The dust bag it s a joke. Dont buy !
Haha cheap ? You mean overpriced rip off tool vs normal price
There are only a few orbital sanders of this particular (80x130mm) pad/abrasive size:
Mirka deos £412 (street)
Festool RTS 400 (£245 street, basic)
Rupes LE71t (£160 street)
Bosch GSS160 (£75 street)
So the Festool isn't the most expensive, and the only candidate for the 'cheap tool' (cheaper tool, less expensive tool, whatever) using my criteria (close as possible to the Festool in form - size, weight, power, handling - as well as function, and at least 1/3 of the price, preferable 1/4 or less) is the Bosch.
I also think it's a relevant comparison - why is the Festool so much more expensive than the Bosch Pro, given that the specs are so similar? These videos simply aimed to show that: I think they did it pretty well - what do you think?
I'll throw this out there again; if you or anyone else knows of an orbital sander (~2mm stroke, ~1.2Kg, ~200w) that meets these criteria and is cheaper than the Bosch (
Festool overpriced and not amy better than Makita,Dewalt, Milwaukee and Bosch
You might want to watch all 3 parts - there are real differences in the dust collection. But use whatever suits you - that’s what these videos are about, to explore the differences and see if they’re relevant to you. 👍
The blue Bosch is not a cheap tool. Cheap tool would be something < £40.. Click-baity title, kind of puts a damper on the whole thing.
+Tz Tz It's a cheap tool *compared to what Festool charge for a very similarly specced sander*. In this series the 'Cheap tool' is anything that costs 1/3 to 1/4 (or less) of the Festool. I was surprised a Blue Bosch Pro sander fitted into this category, but it did so its worth comparing. I would happily compare a cheaper sander to the Festool provided it was similarly specced; to the best of my knowledge Festool and Bosch are the only companies making these oddball 80 x130mm sanders. If you know of another, do share and I'll happily add it to the mix 👍
Rupes make them that look identical in shape to the Festool, fair bit cheaper too. www.powertoolsalesuk.com/le-71t-rupes-mini-orbital-sander.html
+dimmaz88 Thanks! You know this popped up in my twitter feed a week or so back from a painter/decorater I know, and I'd completely forgotten about it! It's a bit lighter than the RTS, too, but only single speed, I think. Street price of £160 keeps it out of the 'cheap tool' series, but a lot less than the Festoo. Good catch, thanksl 👍
festool are overpriced no way is 3 times better then the Bosch cost 3 time more ,a bet the commercial are more expensive and somehow they must pay for the marketing videos like this
+Point made This isn’t a ‘marketing’ video - I pay for my tools myself, just like any punter would - and this isn’t to diss Bosch - I have plenty of blue Bosch tools myself. Is the Festool worth 3 time’s the price?? Why not check out the sanding & dust collection comparison and decide for yourself? 👍
Point made h
Gave you a try but you take so long to get to the point. Good games a fast game bud.