An alternative to going to Ambisonics is to virtually route Cubase (or any DAW or DAPS) 7.1.4 or 9.1.6 output from the Atmos renderer into a binauraliser plugin that includes headtracking. Sparta Binauralizer works well with OSC headtrackers. Sparta Binauralizer allows you to create each speaker input so just take the azimuth and elevations of a 7.1.4 and create it.
That is certainly a possibility. But the main purpose of this video was to prepare for the case of driving native Cubase head tracking with the WavesNX tracker. And for that Ambisonics is necessary.
Thanks a lot for this video ! I've been following your channel since quiet some time now and I'm happy to see that my bottle to the sea on Steinberg's forum ended up featuring on one of your videos. It's a good thing that you started with the covering of the Supperware device, many thanks to Ben who digged and figured out how to communicate with Steinberg's native head tracking 🙏 It's a great achievement ! I can't wait to watch your next week's video on how to make this method available to all head trackers that are able to send OSC messages. I tinkered a little with the /head_pose messages on the 7000 port, but I'm still stuck (I guess it's because I didn't figured out to what "unused fields to pad out" Ben is refering in his documentation). I'll probably post your next video on the thread to end up the invegations and help other people looking for the same thing 🔍
Super helpful. Just a heads up (And probably why you've gotten questions) Is that on the Steinberg website, it actually says "To open the Head Tracking window, select Project > Head Tracking." Which is wrong, because it's not in that menu, but rather in (As you've shown) Studio > Headtracking so. Thank you so much!
Interesting, thanks for the tip. It is possible that they moved this menu item and did not update the documents on their website. I vaguely remember that they moved things around a bit.
The reason you might think the panning seems unintuitive is that for the effect to work, the panning must go in the opposite direction of your head. Therefore, turning your head left makes the ambisonics bus pan right.
I think it is more a matter of getting used to te visualization. In pretty much all other head-tracking apps it is the head that is moving. If Cubase/Nuendo is the only one you use you should get used to this representation pretty quickly.
Thank you for this video. I have a question, in order to monitor atmos or surround in binaural, as far as i know you could youse the binaural downmix preset in the atmos plugin, am I right? why would you use the ambidecoder immerse plugin? is there an advantage? wich one would tranlsate better to a multichannel setup?
This is a fairly old video. If you use the external Dolby Atmos renderer you have integrated head tracking now. So there are other options available now.
I'm getting good results with head tracking in Cubase on a Pimax VR headset and SteamVR, but when I export to third-order ambisonics and play the file in the Virtual Home Theater VR app (which supports up to third-order ambisonics), the sounds aren't nearly as localized. Am I doing something wrong, or is this to be expected?
This is great! Again! A clarification: the head tracking appears to persist when you switch out to 3DX... but I don't see anything in the 3DX interface (in contrast to the Cubase panner interface) that acknowledges/enables head tracking. So is there some nook or cranny (other than the head tracking menu item in Studio drop down) that we should look at? Thanks again.
That is why I tend to be confused about how Cubase visulizes that. Where that panner is in the chain, there is actually no head tracking going on. 3DX visualizes it correctly.
i'm interested in how you get on with the air pods. i haven't been able to monitor atmos with airpods because the asio driver won't allow you to set the buffer size to 512, it only allows up to 384.
Works quite well, actually. With the Airpods you can't go through the Asio driver because the audio needs to be played through a device that can receive the tracking info.
Thank you for making this video! I feel like I am closer than ever to actually monitoring confidently using head tracking. I just have one hiccup that I'd like to figure out. Maybe somebody on here will be able to help me out. I am looking to mix music in Dolby Atmos for Apple Music but have found myself needing to travel regularly. I have an Atmos set up at home but I would like to monitor using headphones while traveling. I have the Supperware head tracker, Nuendo 12, and am successfully monitoring the music I am working on with head tracking. An issue I am having is that when I convert to Ambisonics to use the head tracking, Nuendo sees the vertical panning information in a sphere. Things that are panned all the way down are now below me and I have to look down to hear them at full volume. When I am using my speakers, it just brings it down to ear level which is where I intend on keeping many elements. This isn't a very good representation of what actual Atmos sounds like in a room and I am hoping somebody can clear it up for me. To my ear, nothing on Apple music seems to have information below the listener so I'm lead to believe this is just a deficiency in the encoder? I bought SpaceController by Sound Particles and I much prefer it's sound over the native encoder in Nuendo but it still ends up doing the same thing. Any input would be greatly appreciated. 🙏
Atmos does not have information below ear level by design. This is actually one of the main issues many people have with Atmos. If you convert channel based audio into ambisonics for head tracking you should not get below ear level though. If this is an issue for you either avoid panning while you are in ambisonics or compensate for the difference in ear level. Hope that helps.
Instead of converting to Ambisonics you could also use the Virtuoso plugin I talked about this week. It can take in any channel based Dolby layout and render it in binaural while tracking with supperware. You would not need to go via Ambisonics which should solve your issues.
I really like your video but so far nobody actually can tell me after doing all that mixed in Dolby Atmos music under what type of format if I want to burn it sir. Because I used to do Dts music, like DVD audio and I have both encoders Dolby included , please can you tell me how because it's over two years since no one comes with an answer yet.
When I producing Atmos with NX+Ambisonic in Nuendo, the head tracking is achieved, but the low frequency is missing. Is there something I didn't do right?
In an Ambisonics signal, assuming that you have the low end in mono, almost all of the low end info should be in the very first channel. You could try to raise the gain of that channel a bit.
Depends on the DAW. In Reaper you can simply do that with some smart routing. If you are on something like Cubase, you could use ToneBooster’s Equalizer 4, for example.
Great Information you are giving us, thank you so much! But honestly I was soo happy, that steinberg finally implemented the dolby atmos binaural part, so I could FINALLY hear exactly, what the consumer will listen to on headphones in the end. With this setup I would loose the sound differences of all the atmos binaural object settings (near, mid, far) and adding the own ambisonics sound to it, that no one else will hear. Just thinking about the fact, that a high high 90percent number of consumers use headphones and just a really small number got a 7.1.4 speaker setup at home.
You shouldn't be encouraging amateurs to make shitty Atmos mixes in headphones or even shitty $5k monitor rigs. Atmos is MASTERING. Even more so than stereo music, the audience of Atmos has a very large percentage listening on great audiophile systems. You dont want the audience hearing shit that "engineer" didnt hear when they were mastering. That matters to me for the same reason it matters to Dolby. When people hear shitty mixes, they blame Atmos. That makes them less enthusiastic about Atmos, which they then tell others about, if they spread the word at all. Thay shit slows the growth of Atmos in the consumer market, which reduces demand for artists wanting Atmos masters, which costs me money. Costs you money too, seeing as how marketing Atmos-related products is clearly your bread & butter.
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Great video very interesting :-) very much looking forward to the waves tracking within CUBASE/NUENDO
Coming soon!
An alternative to going to Ambisonics is to virtually route Cubase (or any DAW or DAPS) 7.1.4 or 9.1.6 output from the Atmos renderer into a binauraliser plugin that includes headtracking. Sparta Binauralizer works well with OSC headtrackers. Sparta Binauralizer allows you to create each speaker input so just take the azimuth and elevations of a 7.1.4 and create it.
That is certainly a possibility. But the main purpose of this video was to prepare for the case of driving native Cubase head tracking with the WavesNX tracker. And for that Ambisonics is necessary.
Thanks again for this video which clearly and exhaustively describes the use of this new tracking device. Good job
Glad it was helpful!
Saludos desde México, Profe.
Thanks!
Thanks a lot for this video ! I've been following your channel since quiet some time now and I'm happy to see that my bottle to the sea on Steinberg's forum ended up featuring on one of your videos. It's a good thing that you started with the covering of the Supperware device, many thanks to Ben who digged and figured out how to communicate with Steinberg's native head tracking 🙏 It's a great achievement !
I can't wait to watch your next week's video on how to make this method available to all head trackers that are able to send OSC messages. I tinkered a little with the /head_pose messages on the 7000 port, but I'm still stuck (I guess it's because I didn't figured out to what "unused fields to pad out" Ben is refering in his documentation). I'll probably post your next video on the thread to end up the invegations and help other people looking for the same thing 🔍
There was one trick I needed to do to finally make it work. I forgot what it was exactly but you will see the working conversion script next week.
Super helpful. Just a heads up (And probably why you've gotten questions) Is that on the Steinberg website, it actually says "To open the Head Tracking window, select Project > Head Tracking." Which is wrong, because it's not in that menu, but rather in (As you've shown) Studio > Headtracking so. Thank you so much!
Interesting, thanks for the tip. It is possible that they moved this menu item and did not update the documents on their website. I vaguely remember that they moved things around a bit.
A tip for the viewers with headphones - make sure you switch your L/R when you listen to the results with the tracker on in the video.
Excellent tip
The reason you might think the panning seems unintuitive is that for the effect to work, the panning must go in the opposite direction of your head. Therefore, turning your head left makes the ambisonics bus pan right.
I think it is more a matter of getting used to te visualization. In pretty much all other head-tracking apps it is the head that is moving. If Cubase/Nuendo is the only one you use you should get used to this representation pretty quickly.
Thank you for this video. I have a question, in order to monitor atmos or surround in binaural, as far as i know you could youse the binaural downmix preset in the atmos plugin, am I right? why would you use the ambidecoder immerse plugin? is there an advantage? wich one would tranlsate better to a multichannel setup?
This is a fairly old video. If you use the external Dolby Atmos renderer you have integrated head tracking now. So there are other options available now.
I'm getting good results with head tracking in Cubase on a Pimax VR headset and SteamVR, but when I export to third-order ambisonics and play the file in the Virtual Home Theater VR app (which supports up to third-order ambisonics), the sounds aren't nearly as localized. Am I doing something wrong, or is this to be expected?
This is great! Again! A clarification: the head tracking appears to persist when you switch out to 3DX... but I don't see anything in the 3DX interface (in contrast to the Cubase panner interface) that acknowledges/enables head tracking. So is there some nook or cranny (other than the head tracking menu item in Studio drop down) that we should look at? Thanks again.
That is why I tend to be confused about how Cubase visulizes that. Where that panner is in the chain, there is actually no head tracking going on. 3DX visualizes it correctly.
@@michaelgwagner There we go! It's both a Nook *and* a Crany, Steinberg style. Some day it will all just work!
i'm interested in how you get on with the air pods. i haven't been able to monitor atmos with airpods because the asio driver won't allow you to set the buffer size to 512, it only allows up to 384.
Works quite well, actually. With the Airpods you can't go through the Asio driver because the audio needs to be played through a device that can receive the tracking info.
@@michaelgwagner OK cool! i look forward to seeing how this is done. :-)
Thank you for making this video! I feel like I am closer than ever to actually monitoring confidently using head tracking. I just have one hiccup that I'd like to figure out. Maybe somebody on here will be able to help me out.
I am looking to mix music in Dolby Atmos for Apple Music but have found myself needing to travel regularly. I have an Atmos set up at home but I would like to monitor using headphones while traveling. I have the Supperware head tracker, Nuendo 12, and am successfully monitoring the music I am working on with head tracking.
An issue I am having is that when I convert to Ambisonics to use the head tracking, Nuendo sees the vertical panning information in a sphere. Things that are panned all the way down are now below me and I have to look down to hear them at full volume. When I am using my speakers, it just brings it down to ear level which is where I intend on keeping many elements. This isn't a very good representation of what actual Atmos sounds like in a room and I am hoping somebody can clear it up for me. To my ear, nothing on Apple music seems to have information below the listener so I'm lead to believe this is just a deficiency in the encoder? I bought SpaceController by Sound Particles and I much prefer it's sound over the native encoder in Nuendo but it still ends up doing the same thing.
Any input would be greatly appreciated. 🙏
Atmos does not have information below ear level by design. This is actually one of the main issues many people have with Atmos. If you convert channel based audio into ambisonics for head tracking you should not get below ear level though. If this is an issue for you either avoid panning while you are in ambisonics or compensate for the difference in ear level. Hope that helps.
Instead of converting to Ambisonics you could also use the Virtuoso plugin I talked about this week. It can take in any channel based Dolby layout and render it in binaural while tracking with supperware. You would not need to go via Ambisonics which should solve your issues.
Also, quick question: Does the Supperware headtracker work in Wwise?
I don't see why not, but I'm not sure. Have not tested that yet. Great idea for a video, btw.
I really like your video but so far nobody actually can tell me after doing all that mixed in Dolby Atmos music under what type of format if I want to burn it sir. Because I used to do Dts music, like DVD audio and I have both encoders Dolby included , please can you tell me how because it's over two years since no one comes with an answer yet.
Dolby Atmos music is pretty much exclusively used for streaming.
When I producing Atmos with NX+Ambisonic in Nuendo, the head tracking is achieved, but the low frequency is missing. Is there something I didn't do right?
You mean the LFE? Or low frequency in general?
@@michaelgwagner The low frequency in general
In an Ambisonics signal, assuming that you have the low end in mono, almost all of the low end info should be in the very first channel. You could try to raise the gain of that channel a bit.
@@michaelgwagner Thanks！ Do you mean the very first channel of Ambisonics Bus? but how to gain that one channel?
Depends on the DAW. In Reaper you can simply do that with some smart routing. If you are on something like Cubase, you could use ToneBooster’s Equalizer 4, for example.
What about the head tracker from waves, it doesn't worked
You can use Nxosc to convert the signals from the Waves headtracker into OSC messages. But that only works on MacOS.
Great Information you are giving us, thank you so much!
But honestly I was soo happy, that steinberg finally implemented the dolby atmos binaural part, so I could FINALLY hear exactly, what the consumer will listen to on headphones in the end.
With this setup I would loose the sound differences of all the atmos binaural object settings (near, mid, far) and adding the own ambisonics sound to it, that no one else will hear.
Just thinking about the fact, that a high high 90percent number of consumers use headphones and just a really small number got a 7.1.4 speaker setup at home.
You can monitor both. 😉
@@michaelgwagner yes, but i hoped for a headtracking with the dolby binaural renderer, maybe just the YAW. That would already be fine for me.
You can do that in Logic with Airpods. In Cubase you would have to throw in your own binaural renderer.
@@michaelgwagner windows over here and not a fan of in ear for mixing, or the auto eq stuff of the airrpods.
You could use the Airpods Max as well.
You shouldn't be encouraging amateurs to make shitty Atmos mixes in headphones or even shitty $5k monitor rigs. Atmos is MASTERING. Even more so than stereo music, the audience of Atmos has a very large percentage listening on great audiophile systems. You dont want the audience hearing shit that "engineer" didnt hear when they were mastering.
That matters to me for the same reason it matters to Dolby. When people hear shitty mixes, they blame Atmos. That makes them less enthusiastic about Atmos, which they then tell others about, if they spread the word at all. Thay shit slows the growth of Atmos in the consumer market, which reduces demand for artists wanting Atmos masters, which costs me money. Costs you money too, seeing as how marketing Atmos-related products is clearly your bread & butter.
no very clear your process
It’s boring it’s always Cubase etc
Cubase videos tend to do best on this channel.